Jump to content

Can I get into legal troubles if someone gets hurt doing my challenge.

Coldgears

By Coldgears
in General geocaching topics

Followers 2

Recommended Posts

Coldgears

+Coldgears

Posted
Posted

I think it would be funny to set up a whole bunch of ridiculous and dangerous challenges. I want to do one where you have to act like you are selling drugs in the most dangerous street corner in the city. I also want to do another where you have jump over a moving car.

 

I think these could be fun challenges for many people. It's going to be a series like the Physco Urban Caches, except its going to be Physco Urban Challenges. I plan on making one every day for a month, or until I run out of ideas.

 

However, many of my ideas I am coming up with are quite dangerous, while still technically being legal. (The drugs won't be real, and I will state the car must be a friend, and the coordinates will take you to a back alley where your stunt will not harm any one.) can possibly kill you.

 

Could I be charged legally for suggesting that people do these things?

 

Thanks!

Link to comment
roundnround we go

+roundnround we go

Posted
Posted

get real. how would it be funny to see someone get hurt or possibly arrested doing one of those challenges. and how do those challenges fall into the family friendly aspect of caching. I just don't get why so many are set on trying to ruin this new feature without even giving them a chance. Seems like I have seen so many people on here telling others that just because they don't like a certain type of cache to just over look it and continue on with the types they do enjoy. but now some of those same people are the ones trying to ruin these new challenges for those that would like to at least give them a chance.

Link to comment
Pup Patrol

Pup Patrol

Posted
Posted (edited)

Coldgears is like 17 or 18 years old.

 

Aren't these the same sort of stunts that would be "Jackass" material?

 

It's a good thing he posts this stuff in the forums first, before going out and doing them. At least, I hope he hasn't gone ahead and posted those as Challenges.

 

And a note: I think you only get so many time-outs before Groundspeak goes ahead and bans you.

 

Start thinking things through and save yourself some trouble.

Edited by Pup Patrol
Link to comment
Coldgears

+Coldgears

Posted
  • Author
Posted

but now some of those same people are the ones trying to ruin these new challenges for those that would like to at least give them a chance.

I gave them a chance. And people from Belgium, the U.K., Scotsland, and get to flag and downvote my challenge into oblivion.

 

No, but seriously. These *are* meant to be a joke. But, I wouldn't doubt it if someone took them seriously. Which is why I wanted to make sure I couldn't be legally charged.

 

I guess I won't do it then.

 

See, the thing is, geocaching isn't family friendly, you can have caches in Nuclear Reactors, in the middle of crime ridden parts of the city, up mountain sides, up trees, in sewage dumps. All is permitted.

 

The difference is, with a challenge you are telling someone to do something. With a geocache, you are telling them there is something there, and it is UP TO THEM to figure out how to get to it.

 

I don't see why I would be banned, I thought the whole point of challenges was to put the people in charge of moderating them in the hands of the community, not Groundspeak.

 

I have a huge fear of getting permanently banned... I have put so much time and effort into my geocaching account, with pictures, logs and everything. I already have two Temp bans from the forums, so a Perm ban really worries me.

 

I will hold off on these challenges until I have confirmation that Groundspeak won't ban you for something that the community *was* supposed to moderate.

Link to comment
SeekerOfTheWay

+SeekerOfTheWay

Posted
Posted

I think it would be funny to set up a whole bunch of ridiculous and dangerous challenges. I want to do one where you have to act like you are selling drugs in the most dangerous street corner in the city. I also want to do another where you have jump over a moving car.

 

I think these could be fun challenges for many people. It's going to be a series like the Physco Urban Caches, except its going to be Physco Urban Challenges. I plan on making one every day for a month, or until I run out of ideas.

 

However, many of my ideas I am coming up with are quite dangerous, while still technically being legal. (The drugs won't be real, and I will state the car must be a friend, and the coordinates will take you to a back alley where your stunt will not harm any one.) can possibly kill you.

 

Could I be charged legally for suggesting that people do these things?

 

Thanks!

 

Those are lame challenges. Don't create them.

Link to comment
UBC Geograd

+UBC Geograd

Posted
Posted

A few cents from the lurking lawyer here...

 

Yes, absolutely, this would pose a risk of liability to you if a mishap were to occur. The disclaimer protects Groundspeak from being liable for any injury/damages that could occur, but it wouldn't necessarily protect you. In short, if you were to create a challenge with a knowingly dangerous aspect, you could be sued if someone gets injured doing it.

 

There would be an even greater risk if the injured person is not a Geocaching member (someone who has not accepted the terms of service). For example, a friend who is accompanying a cacher along for a challenge.

 

Whether or not any Criminal charges could arise would depend on the jurisdiction. In some jurisdictions it may not be technically illegal, but there are enough differences and nuances in the Criminal laws of different states/countries that the best recommendation is to simply use common sense and not intentionally lead anyone into harm's way.

 

Hope this helps everyone, the original poster included, make good choices when planting caches/creating challenges.

Link to comment
Manville Possum

+Manville Possum

Posted
Posted

but now some of those same people are the ones trying to ruin these new challenges for those that would like to at least give them a chance.

I gave them a chance. And people from Belgium, the U.K., Scotsland, and get to flag and downvote my challenge into oblivion.

 

No, but seriously. These *are* meant to be a joke. But, I wouldn't doubt it if someone took them seriously. Which is why I wanted to make sure I couldn't be legally charged.

 

I guess I won't do it then.

 

See, the thing is, geocaching isn't family friendly, you can have caches in Nuclear Reactors, in the middle of crime ridden parts of the city, up mountain sides, up trees, in sewage dumps. All is permitted.

 

The difference is, with a challenge you are telling someone to do something. With a geocache, you are telling them there is something there, and it is UP TO THEM to figure out how to get to it.

 

I don't see why I would be banned, I thought the whole point of challenges was to put the people in charge of moderating them in the hands of the community, not Groundspeak.

 

I have a huge fear of getting permanently banned... I have put so much time and effort into my geocaching account, with pictures, logs and everything. I already have two Temp bans from the forums, so a Perm ban really worries me.

 

I will hold off on these challenges until I have confirmation that Groundspeak won't ban you for something that the community *was* supposed to moderate.

I'm quite sure that you have attracted the wrong kind of attention to yourself from TPTB at Groundspeak. They put alot of work and money into these new challanges, and here you are in the forums talking about how you are going to try and wreck the system. I would be worried too about getting banned. Can you not just ignore the challanges and just keep geocaching? I enjoy the new challanges. We maintian over 100 active geocaches that are for people to enjoy, and challanges have gave me something to work with.

Link to comment
GeoBain

+GeoBain

Posted
Posted

Well, isn't the idea of Challenges is that you can either accept or not?

 

Who would be holding a gun to your head, forcing you to do stupid, dangerous things? No one.

 

Choice...it's yours.

 

I think I will make a challenge to hold a gun to someone's head and make them do ColdGear challenges.

Link to comment
AZcachemeister

AZcachemeister

Posted
Posted

A few cents from the lurking lawyer here...

 

Yes, absolutely, this would pose a risk of liability to you if a mishap were to occur. The disclaimer protects Groundspeak from being liable for any injury/damages that could occur, but it wouldn't necessarily protect you. In short, if you were to create a challenge with a knowingly dangerous aspect, you could be sued if someone gets injured doing it.

 

There would be an even greater risk if the injured person is not a Geocaching member (someone who has not accepted the terms of service). For example, a friend who is accompanying a cacher along for a challenge.

 

Whether or not any Criminal charges could arise would depend on the jurisdiction. In some jurisdictions it may not be technically illegal, but there are enough differences and nuances in the Criminal laws of different states/countries that the best recommendation is to simply use common sense and not intentionally lead anyone into harm's way.

 

Hope this helps everyone, the original poster included, make good choices when planting caches/creating challenges.

 

Regardless of whether it's legal or not, all someone has to do is convince 12 jurors that what you did was negligent, and you could owe them far more money than you'll ever earn.

 

But, once someone accepts Coldgears' challenge, he doesn't own it. I'm not sure there is any way to connect him to it.

 

If I tell someone to 'jump in the creek', and he does it, and breaks his neck...can his family sue me for wrongful death or whatever? I think not. The fool jumped in the creek and broke his neck, nobody forced him to do anything.

 

That being said, I hope the community would (quickly) flag-out (new terminology here!) the sort of thing that the OP suggested.

Link to comment
GOF and Bacall

GOF and Bacall

Posted
Posted

I think it would be funny to set up a whole bunch of ridiculous and dangerous challenges. I want to do one where you have to act like you are selling drugs in the most dangerous street corner in the city. I also want to do another where you have jump over a moving car.

 

I think these could be fun challenges for many people. It's going to be a series like the Physco Urban Caches, except its going to be Physco Urban Challenges. I plan on making one every day for a month, or until I run out of ideas.

 

However, many of my ideas I am coming up with are quite dangerous, while still technically being legal. (The drugs won't be real, and I will state the car must be a friend, and the coordinates will take you to a back alley where your stunt will not harm any one.) can possibly kill you.

 

Could I be charged legally for suggesting that people do these things?

 

Thanks!

 

You are fast loosing my support for allowing kids to post in the forums.

Link to comment
AZcachemeister

AZcachemeister

Posted
Posted

A few cents from the lurking lawyer here...

 

Yes, absolutely, this would pose a risk of liability to you if a mishap were to occur. The disclaimer protects Groundspeak from being liable for any injury/damages that could occur, but it wouldn't necessarily protect you. In short, if you were to create a challenge with a knowingly dangerous aspect, you could be sued if someone gets injured doing it.

 

There would be an even greater risk if the injured person is not a Geocaching member (someone who has not accepted the terms of service). For example, a friend who is accompanying a cacher along for a challenge.

 

Whether or not any Criminal charges could arise would depend on the jurisdiction. In some jurisdictions it may not be technically illegal, but there are enough differences and nuances in the Criminal laws of different states/countries that the best recommendation is to simply use common sense and not intentionally lead anyone into harm's way.

 

Hope this helps everyone, the original poster included, make good choices when planting caches/creating challenges.

 

P.S. By far the majority of caches could be construed to 'be leading the seeker into a dangerous situation'.

By your logic, any cache with a terrain above a 2 or so shouldn't exist.

Link to comment
Fianccetto

+Fianccetto

Posted
Posted

 

I gave them a chance. And people from Belgium, the U.K., Scotsland, and get to flag and downvote my challenge into oblivion.

 

 

How do you know who flagged your challenge? (Can you see?) Lots of people here got angsty about challenges, and burger chains in particular, so try publishing another one I'm sure it will be popular.

 

I didn't flag the Philly burger one. (I hope you didn't think my comment about it was negative.)

 

I did flag some locationless ones, so if yours was one of those, nothing personal, it just broke the one rule and all of the 'hug your kitten' ones were cranking up the angst for some people.

 

OK, *on my knees* on behalf of the UK and Scotsland (I went there a few times and my sister used to live there) I beg your forgiveness and ask you might reconsider the dangerous virtual challenges and think up something better instead.

Link to comment
2oldfarts (the rockhounders)

2oldfarts (the rockhounders)

Posted
Posted

The question is NOT can I be held responsible if someone get hurts! The real question is "will I get sued for making the challenge?". The answer to that is absolutely!! Will they win that suit, is anybody's guess, but it will cost a fortune in lawyer fees to defend against it. If you are sued and they get a sympathetic jury you will most likely end up paying a small fortune to them.

 

What do you think the smart choice is?

 

John

Link to comment
Huntleigh

+Huntleigh

Posted
Posted

A few cents from the lurking lawyer here...

 

Yes, absolutely, this would pose a risk of liability to you if a mishap were to occur. The disclaimer protects Groundspeak from being liable for any injury/damages that could occur, but it wouldn't necessarily protect you. In short, if you were to create a challenge with a knowingly dangerous aspect, you could be sued if someone gets injured doing it.

...snip..

 

...knowingly or recklessly...

Link to comment
GOF and Bacall

GOF and Bacall

Posted
Posted

The only challenge in my area is telling people to deface city property. There are 'adults' saying they will do it. Well, at least the DA will have an easy case.

 

I sure hope you flagged it.

Can't figure out how to do that.

 

Go to the challenge page. On the to right is a box that has three possible actions. Thumbs up. Thumbs down. Flag challenge. Just click the appropriate link.

Link to comment
GOF and Bacall

GOF and Bacall

Posted
Posted

The only challenge in my area is telling people to deface city property. There are 'adults' saying they will do it. Well, at least the DA will have an easy case.

 

I sure hope you flagged it.

Got the url so we all can flag that idiotic one?

 

Took a bit of work to get it...

 

HERE

 

I'll keep an eye on this one. If the city says it is ok to paint this structure then I'm good with it. However, I'd like to see explicit permission. The CC (challenge creator) needs to contact the city directly.

Link to comment
yawppy

+yawppy

Posted
Posted

REALLY? ******************************* :(:mad::ph34r:

 

I just did a challenge today... and have to say... enjoyed it...called Show the Ecosystems...a worldwide one.

 

It required one to snap a pic with you and a flora type plant, and find the weird scientific name, well my Mom and GM who are not geocachers, loved this one, and actually I found it quite cool.

 

If done properly.. and if folks give them a chance, stop with the id..... challenges, these can work great.

 

I have another one I have accepted the CITO one sounds good to.

 

My challenge I hope to see, is a pic of folks atop of the tall summits of mountains, or perhaps a wild life snapshot challenge, now those would be cool.

Link to comment
tozainamboku

+tozainamboku

Posted
Posted

The only challenge in my area is telling people to deface city property. There are 'adults' saying they will do it. Well, at least the DA will have an easy case.

 

I sure hope you flagged it.

Got the url so we all can flag that idiotic one?

 

Took a bit of work to get it...

 

HERE

 

I'll keep an eye on this one. If the city says it is ok to paint this structure then I'm good with it. However, I'd like to see explicit permission. The CC (challenge creator) needs to contact the city directly.

That thing must get repainted a lot. Its got something different on it in every frame of Google street view.

Link to comment
LukeTrocity

+LukeTrocity

Posted
Posted

but now some of those same people are the ones trying to ruin these new challenges for those that would like to at least give them a chance.

I gave them a chance. And people from Belgium, the U.K., Scotsland, and get to flag and downvote my challenge into oblivion.

 

No, but seriously. These *are* meant to be a joke. But, I wouldn't doubt it if someone took them seriously. Which is why I wanted to make sure I couldn't be legally charged.

 

I guess I won't do it then.

 

See, the thing is, geocaching isn't family friendly, you can have caches in Nuclear Reactors, in the middle of crime ridden parts of the city, up mountain sides, up trees, in sewage dumps. All is permitted.

 

The difference is, with a challenge you are telling someone to do something. With a geocache, you are telling them there is something there, and it is UP TO THEM to figure out how to get to it.

 

I don't see why I would be banned, I thought the whole point of challenges was to put the people in charge of moderating them in the hands of the community, not Groundspeak.

 

I have a huge fear of getting permanently banned... I have put so much time and effort into my geocaching account, with pictures, logs and everything. I already have two Temp bans from the forums, so a Perm ban really worries me.

 

I will hold off on these challenges until I have confirmation that Groundspeak won't ban you for something that the community *was* supposed to moderate.

New challenge creation:

Frame coldgears into a super ban.... Just kidding.

 

The ideas aren't terrible, or I at least see the comedy in them. With that being said they were also relatively immature, and a good portion of cachers are older with a higher maturity level. I think a "grand theft auto" themed challenge could be fun but you would really have to give it a family friendly spin. Remember ultimately this is a family friendly game.

Link to comment
dphickey

+dphickey

Posted
Posted (edited)

I have a huge fear of getting permanently banned... I have put so much time and effort into my geocaching account, with pictures, logs and everything. I already have two Temp bans from the forums, so a Perm ban really worries me.

 

I will hold off on these challenges until I have confirmation that Groundspeak won't ban you for something that the community *was* supposed to moderate.

 

If you are truly worried as you say, you should think twice, then again maybe four times before posting your 'funny' ideas.

Edited by dphickey
Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Followers 2
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...