Batteries

[+Redfist]

I have a Garmin Oregon 450 so I'm going to AA batteries like crazy. I don't mind the battery life on this device, it's far better than some of the horror stories I've seen on this forum in the past. I just want to reduce costs and ideally increase battery-life between changing.

 

What I've done 99% so far is just use regular AA batteries (my wife bought a HUGE package at Costco). These work pretty well and well within expectations. While driving around on a vacation recently, I had to stop in a convenience store for batteries & drinks. The only AA they had there were MUCH better than the normal ones I get. They were Energizer "advanced lithium" batteries. Lighter (weight) and longer battery life.

 

So, now that I'm back from vacation and finally starting to run low in that costco package, I'm considering what I'll do next. I can either bulk purchase these new batteries **OR** go with rechargable. If the latter, I know very little about them.

 

Thoughts/opinions?

[+jgc3]

I use NiMH batteries and although more expensive, I picked up 8 with chargers for about $40 and they've lasted well in my devices including GPS and sometime video game controllers etc.. and can be easily topped up via a cig lighter adapter really cheap on the go.. good luck

 

I have a Garmin Oregon 450 so I'm going to AA batteries like crazy. I don't mind the battery life on this device, it's far better than some of the horror stories I've seen on this forum in the past. I just want to reduce costs and ideally increase battery-life between changing.

 

What I've done 99% so far is just use regular AA batteries (my wife bought a HUGE package at Costco). These work pretty well and well within expectations. While driving around on a vacation recently, I had to stop in a convenience store for batteries & drinks. The only AA they had there were MUCH better than the normal ones I get. They were Energizer "advanced lithium" batteries. Lighter (weight) and longer battery life.

 

So, now that I'm back from vacation and finally starting to run low in that costco package, I'm considering what I'll do next. I can either bulk purchase these new batteries **OR** go with rechargable. If the latter, I know very little about them.

 

Thoughts/opinions?

[jholly]

If you cache frequently the NiMH batteries are the only way to go. Recharge them over and over again. The low discharge don't have the capacity of regular NiMH but have the advantage of holding the charge longer. The Li batteries are nice, but expensive.

[+eusty]

Not sure on the 450, but on other Garmin models you need to set the battery type in the settings

[+DonB]

I have a Garmin Oregon 450 so I'm going to AA batteries like crazy. I don't mind the battery life on this device, it's far better than some of the horror stories I've seen on this forum in the past. I just want to reduce costs and ideally increase battery-life between changing.

 

What I've done 99% so far is just use regular AA batteries (my wife bought a HUGE package at Costco). These work pretty well and well within expectations. While driving around on a vacation recently, I had to stop in a convenience store for batteries & drinks. The only AA they had there were MUCH better than the normal ones I get. They were Energizer "advanced lithium" batteries. Lighter (weight) and longer battery life.

 

So, now that I'm back from vacation and finally starting to run low in that costco package, I'm considering what I'll do next. I can either bulk purchase these new batteries **OR** go with rechargable. If the latter, I know very little about them.

 

Thoughts/opinions?

My vote would be with Sanyo Eneloops and a Maha charger. I have the MH-C801D which is an eight position charger. It's a bit of an investment to begin with, but in time I think a person comes out ahead. With the Sanyos being hybrids I also use them in flashlights and other things that take batteries and require a battery that gives shelf life. I run the Sanyos in my 76CSx and get the advertised run time for that GPS. There are other good hybrids available, but I prefer the Sanyos

[+dfx]

Definitely NiMHs, either high-capacity ones or low-self-discharge ones.

[Colorado Bear]

I use NiMH rechargeable batteries, the Maha 2700 mAh, and a Maha MH-C401FS charger. I use these in my GPS's, and my radio scanners. My last set lasted 4 years before it became obvious they were not holding a charge any more. Yes; the upfront cost can be steep but in the long run, I have saved on batteries, and we all win since I am not filling up the dump with batteries. As a safety consideration I do carry a 4 pack of alkaline batteries while I am backpacking as a backup.

I have always found great deals at Thomas Distributing.

 

As you change battery type, it is a good habit to change the baqttery type in the setup menu, it helps make the battery meter more accurate.

Happy hunting

 

Jay of GOT BearSoup

Edited August 1, 2011 by GOT BearSoup

[JustMyName]

+1 on Sanyo Eneloops for low-self-discharge(LSD) NiMH and Maha Powerex for high capacity cells. You can get the Eneloops are Costco.

 

Do research here if you'd like: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?9-Flashlight-Electronics-Batteries-Included

 

I use Lithium for backup when hiking and car flashlights (won't leak, works in extreme cold and hot temperatures, high capacity, long shelf life, etc)

 

For your low power devices (TV remotes, clocks, whatever) never buy zinc-* (general purpose / heavy duty ) batteries. Use Alkaline or cheap low capacity NiMH (since they have lower discharge rates and won't leak).

[+DanOCan]

I've been very happy with the Eneloops I purchased a couple years back. I have no problems getting through an entire day's caching on a single set with my Dakota 20. I'd buy them again in a heartbeat.

[+northernpenguin]

I've been very happy with the Eneloops I purchased a couple years back. I have no problems getting through an entire day's caching on a single set with my Dakota 20. I'd buy them again in a heartbeat.

 

If you are in Canada, check the Loblaw companies - Real Canadian Superstore, Zehrs, Fortino's, Loblaws, etc.

The store brand, white low discharge "President's Choice" batteries are rebranded Eneloops. Identical specs, even the charger they sell has "SANYO" on it.

[+BStheTech]

I just picked up 8 AA's, 12 AAA's and a 1 hour charger for like $50.

 

Cheap batts

 

I'll let you all know how they turn out after they show up.

 

B.

[+luvvinbird]

I'm presently using Duracell rechargeable NiMH batteries in my Oregon 450 and my three other Garmins, as well. As mentioned, I think the Sanyo Eneloop rechargeable batteries are the best you can get as they apparently don't have a "memory" charging effect like a lot of the rechargeables do and they will still have 85% of their charge after a year when not in use. However, I think I'm getting reasonably good use out of the Duracells. What's important is to always have a fresh pair ready to go.

[Suscrofa]

Get good NiMH but above all get a GOOD charger. As a rule BAN chargers that charge in pair, ONLY independent channels charging can charge evenly the batteries. In pair, one will be overcharged before termination and that will kill the battery real quick.

LaCrosse and Maha are good one.

[+DonB]

Get good NiMH but above all get a GOOD charger. As a rule BAN chargers that charge in pair, ONLY independent channels charging can charge evenly the batteries. In pair, one will be overcharged before termination and that will kill the battery real quick.

LaCrosse and Maha are good one.

From what I've been told the chargers that only charge in pairs will shut off as soon as one of the pair is charged and the other battery may not be fully charged. I'm not claiming this to be true, just what I've heard.

[+luvvinbird]

I'm a little confused about chargers, too. Even the Eneloop batteries come with a charger that charges four batteries at a time. I was pricing them at our local Black's Camera store here in Canada. I'm presently charging my Duracells two at a time and, to be honest, I've not experienced premature battery failure at any time. So, am I to understand that I should buy the Eneloops and toss the charger? Then buy a Maha charger and charge them one at a time? That's too much work for this casual geocacher.

[+michaelnel]

I have been pleased with the Maha Imedion batteries (similar to Eneloop, but 2400mAh capacity), with a Maha MH-C401FS smart charger:

 

http://www.mahaenergy.com/store/viewItem.asp?idProduct=426

http://www.mahaenergy.com/store/item.asp?idproduct=178

[GCEnthusiast]

I use cheapest nimh rechargeables. It's so sad when expensive ones becoming defunct, being untrained for a long time.

[+Viajero Perdido]

Another vote for a smart charger with independent channels. Those units will monitor each battery separately, and stop charging each one at the right time. You can also mix and match AA with AAA and it won't get flustered. I use the Maha C9000 and can recommend it. It also has a mode for refreshing tired old batteries.

 

Not cheap, but you only need to buy it once, ever.

 

I used to use a "stupid" charger that insisted on charging batteries in pairs. Either 2 or 4. Not 1, not 3. Well, LED headlamps usually have 3 batteries. How are you supposed to charge an odd number of batteries when the stupid charger won't even touch the single battery left over?

[+dfx]

I'm a little confused about chargers, too. Even the Eneloop batteries come with a charger that charges four batteries at a time.

 

It's not about how many batteries you can charge at the same time in a charger, it's about how the charger works internally. A "good" charger that takes 4 batteries will monitor each battery individually, put separate charge current on each battery and will shut off the charge for each battery individually once it gets full. A "bad" charger on the other hand is wired in such a way that it treats either 2 batteries or all 4 of them as a unit. In other words, internally it's not actually a charger for 4 batteries with 1.2 volts each, but rather a charger for 2 batteries with 2.4 volts each, or even just a single charger for one 4.8 volt battery.

 

A simple way to tell is usually by the number of LEDs on the charger. A good charger will have one LED per battery indicating its charge, and each LED is controlled separately. A charger that charges batteries in pairs will usually have only one LED for each two batteries. Or, as VP says, just pay attention to whether it's actually possible to just charge a single battery in it. With a charger that charges in pairs, it will only ever charge if two batteries are inserted.

Edited August 3, 2011 by dfx

[+luvvinbird]

I'm a little confused about chargers, too. Even the Eneloop batteries come with a charger that charges four batteries at a time.

 

It's not about how many batteries you can charge at the same time in a charger, it's about how the charger works internally. A "good" charger that takes 4 batteries will monitor each battery individually, put separate charge current on each battery and will shut off the charge for each battery individually once it gets full. A "bad" charger on the other hand is wired in such a way that it treats either 2 batteries or all 4 of them as a unit. In other words, internally it's not actually a charger for 4 batteries with 1.2 volts each, but rather a charger for 2 batteries with 2.4 volts each, or even just a single charger for one 4.8 volt battery.

 

A simple way to tell is usually by the number of LEDs on the charger. A good charger will have one LED per battery indicating its charge, and each LED is controlled separately. A charger that charges batteries in pairs will usually have only one LED for each two batteries. Or, as VP says, just pay attention to whether it's actually possible to just charge a single battery in it. With a charger that charges in pairs, it will only ever charge if two batteries are inserted.

Okay. Good explanation. Now I understand. michaelnel's post #16 has a link to the Maha charger and I can clearly see an LED for each of the four batteries. You both offer good advice, I think I'll take it and look for a Maha charger.

[+michaelnel]

Thomas Distributing is a great place for Maha batteries and chargers. I have been buying from them for years, they are very reliable and prices are good.

[+slukster]

I use the Energizer Lithium batteries. You can get a 10 pack at BJ's for around $16. They last a long time and when they run low in the GPSr or camera, I then put them in my remote control and they keep on working for a while longer. Expensive, yes but for the amount of caching I do it is easier for me to just use them rather than have to worry about keeping batteries charged.

[+northernpenguin]

I use the Energizer Lithium batteries. You can get a 10 pack at BJ's for around $16. They last a long time and when they run low in the GPSr or camera, I then put them in my remote control and they keep on working for a while longer. Expensive, yes but for the amount of caching I do it is easier for me to just use them rather than have to worry about keeping batteries charged.

 

With the amount of caching I do I'd have to sell my car to use lithium batteries

[+BAMBOOZLE]

I use NiMH rechargeable batteries, the Maha 2700 mAh, and a Maha MH-C401FS charger. I use these in my GPS's, and my radio scanners. My last set lasted 4 years before it became obvious they were not holding a charge any more. Yes; the upfront cost can be steep but in the long run, I have saved on batteries, and we all win since I am not filling up the dump with batteries. As a safety consideration I do carry a 4 pack of alkaline batteries while I am backpacking as a backup.

I have always found great deals at Thomas Distributing.

 

As you change battery type, it is a good habit to change the baqttery type in the setup menu, it helps make the battery meter more accurate.

Happy hunting

 

Jay of GOT BearSoup

 

100% exactly

[gitarmac]

Thomas Distributing is a great place for Maha batteries and chargers. I have been buying from them for years, they are very reliable and prices are good.

 

I got there for all my battery needs as well. I have an 8 battery maha charger and 2 4 battery lacrosse chargers. I like the lacrosse ones the best (that's why I got another). It starts off on low amperage chargeing, which is what I mostly use. The maha overcharges AAA's, even on soft charge. The lacrosse shows the voltage left on the battery when i put it in, which I like as well.

 

I have used hicap sanyo 2700's and other batteries but some of my devices don't like them. My camera will not like a freshly charged 2700 but will last a long time on an eneloop. It doesn't make sense. I wonder if it's thinking it's a differant type of battery, I can't select battery type on my camera.

 

My garmin venture only likes eneloops as well. From now on I am only using eneloops. I can still use my non-eneloops in my headlamps and stuff.

 

Get a good charger, dont' ruin nice expensive rechargables with a crappy charger.

[gitarmac]

I use the Energizer Lithium batteries. You can get a 10 pack at BJ's for around $16. They last a long time and when they run low in the GPSr or camera, I then put them in my remote control and they keep on working for a while longer. Expensive, yes but for the amount of caching I do it is easier for me to just use them rather than have to worry about keeping batteries charged.

 

 

That's exactly why you want to keep batteries charged! It's really not that worrysome, thompsons has all these little battery holders you get free with every order. I have a lot of devices with me, it would be even easier to plan for only one device. I always have 8 fresh eneloops with me.

[pjs224]

Sanyo Eneloops are all I ever use!

 

-PJ

Edited September 1, 2011 by pjs224

[+elgecko]

Took a very quick look through the posts and see what I defiantly recommend; Sanyo Eneloops. I use them in everything.

[+elkein]

The energizer ultimate lithium are the only way to go for extended needs such as no access to more batteries for a week, they are light and much more powerful(Sams sells big packs of them, 12 for $20.) For day trips standard energizers are fine.

For anything less than a day trip I use rechargeable Nimh, they are the heaviest of these batteries, the power capacity varies by the individual battery, so it's best to try and make pairs of them, they are rechargeable and superior to largely extinct "nicad." My 550t came with a set of Nimh and a charger.

 

I finish batteries in my computer mice after they have expired in higher drain devices, they can often provide 20 more hours in that role. When all disposable have been expired it's back to Nimh for the mice too.

[+Avernar]

I to understand that I should buy the Eneloops and toss the charger? Then buy a Maha charger and charge them one at a time? That's too much work for this casual geocacher.

No. Check the charger that came with the Eneloops first. If it has one LED then it's probably a four channel charger and can charge them independently. If it has two LEDs then it's a dual channel only and can only charge them in pairs.

[+ArcherACT]

Sanyo Eneloops get rebranded as a few different cell types throughout the world. It is quite possible that any energiser Low Self Discharge (LSD) cells are rebadged Eneloops.

Sanyo sell a few Eneloop branded chargers. The generic slow charge dual cell one is okay, It just charges for 16 hours and won't cook the cells.

Sanyo has a page which explains all their chargers. Well worth reading. http://www.eneloop.info/products/chargers.html

 

I have several chargers and my current favourite for AA's and AAA's is the Maha Powerex C9000 which has already been mentioned.

http://www.eastgear.com/maha-mh-c9000-w-4-aa2700-batteries-wizardone-charger-1.html

 

For some reason, my swallow charger, (which has now been replaced by a different model) won't quite peak the eneloops. So it was the excuse I needed to buy the maha. Yes, the maha is awesome. I've even tried to explode old batteries in it by doing naughty charge rates, but the thermister shuts it off.

 

The swallow charges just about everything else I have and both can run from the car with no problems at all.

 

I will only ever use LSD batteries from now on and the three distinct brands are the Imedions (by powerex) Eneloops and Enerkeeps. The Eneloops consistantly measure between 1850 to 1920 milliamps in the powerex and will power my GPS62s for quite long caching sessions and with at least eight more i n the geocaching bag, power my GPS and torch until way past the time that I should be in bed anyway.

 

With a pack of four Duracell or energiser AA's costing 1/4 the cost of Eneloops or Imedions, I only have to charge them four times to be equal on battery costs. Each time I charge 4 eneloops after that, I'm saving 4 dollars. With all the devices around my house that use AA batteries, I will pay off the Maha charger AND batteries in equivalent savings within charging 100 batteries.

 

PS. Ignore the "cell memory" theory. It's never been able to be reproduced, even in laboratories.

 

On ebay it is possible to buy single solar cells which will supply either 6 or 5 volts reasonably cheaply. Some of them even come with a USB female port which can be wired and glued to the bottom of the panel. With a decent USB AA charger like an Eneloop one, you can quickly assemble a light weight solar powered portable AA charger which you can use while on the go.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

Thanks to those recommending the Sanyo......I ordered 8 Sanyo XX Eneloop 2500 batteries and can honestly say I've never seen performance anywhere close. My Oregon 450 can go 12 hours of constant use and my Meridian probably 2 days plus ( used it for 12 hours and had plenty left )

I've been using Maha PowerX but these are simply much better.....the Maha 2400 Eneloop were only half the price of the Sanyo but I wanted the extra 100 mah.

They work fine with my MH C800S and MH C401FS Maha chargers.

 

http://www.thomasdistributing.com/AA-Low-Discharge-Batteries_c_677.html

 

This is one of the reasons I like these forums

[+baloo&bd]

Thanks to those recommending the Sanyo......I ordered 8 Sanyo XX Eneloop 2500 batteries and can honestly say I've never seen performance anywhere close. My Oregon 450 can go 12 hours of constant use and my Meridian probably 2 days plus ( used it for 12 hours and had plenty left )

I've been using Maha PowerX but these are simply much better.....the Maha 2400 Eneloop were only half the price of the Sanyo but I wanted the extra 100 mah.

They work fine with my MH C800S and MH C401FS Maha chargers.

 

http://www.thomasdistributing.com/AA-Low-Discharge-Batteries_c_677.html

 

This is one of the reasons I like these forums

 

Other than keeping an eye on the memory issue, a real problem that has been repeatedly reproduced, you want to charge your batteries like you do good BBQ, low and slow. Heat is the biggest enemy batteries have under normal use. I tend to also try to match cells, meaning the capacity and discharge rates match, as much as possible but don't lose too much sleep over them, just try to get them close.

[+dandrzejewski1]

Thanks to those recommending the Sanyo......I ordered 8 Sanyo XX Eneloop 2500 batteries and can honestly say I've never seen performance anywhere close. My Oregon 450 can go 12 hours of constant use and my Meridian probably 2 days plus ( used it for 12 hours and had plenty left )

I've been using Maha PowerX but these are simply much better.....the Maha 2400 Eneloop were only half the price of the Sanyo but I wanted the extra 100 mah.

They work fine with my MH C800S and MH C401FS Maha chargers.

 

http://www.thomasdistributing.com/AA-Low-Discharge-Batteries_c_677.html

 

This is one of the reasons I like these forums

 

It seems like they only offer 25% more capacity while costing twice as much... How do you compare these to the standard 2000mah eneloops?

[+ecanderson]

Apart from the fact that a person can be totally lazy about charging (dump 'em in a drawer and pull 'em out two months later), what's the big deal with the lesser-capacity Eneloops? I run my batches through the morning before a big run, and get more mAh for less $. I guess if you can't remember to do it...

[+dandrzejewski1]

Apart from the fact that a person can be totally lazy about charging (dump 'em in a drawer and pull 'em out two months later), what's the big deal with the lesser-capacity Eneloops? I run my batches through the morning before a big run, and get more mAh for less $. I guess if you can't remember to do it...

 

I suppose that's true. I'm always looking for decent cells that have good capacity, but the only really good ones I know of are Eneloops (and, of course, the Duracell-rebranded Eneloops), and those are 2000mah. But the price on those XX's seems a bit steep!

[+BAMBOOZLE]

Apart from the fact that a person can be totally lazy about charging (dump 'em in a drawer and pull 'em out two months later), what's the big deal with the lesser-capacity Eneloops? I run my batches through the morning before a big run, and get more mAh for less $. I guess if you can't remember to do it...

 

I really don't care how long they last in the drawer.....like you I always start with fresh. Never having used Eneloops, I was astounded how long they lasted in my Oregon 450 ( almost 12 hours ) and in my Platinum ( 12 hrs and still read half ). I had been using Maha POWERX 2700's and with a fresh start got no where near that. Its nice the Eneloops hold a charge but I rarely cache more than 8-10 hours at a time so now I won't have to change them in the field ( or calibrate the compass )

Using high end MAHA NIMH batteries the 450's compass was WAY off after ever change...with the new Eneloops its been dead on after the last two changes......interesting.

The Platinum's compass over the years has been dead on more often than not with the regular MAHA batteries ( last two changes it has been dead on with the Eneloops.)

[+dandrzejewski1]

That's interesting about the compass. Didn't realize batteries could have such an effect.

[+ecanderson]

That's interesting about the compass. Didn't realize batteries could have such an effect.

Although we have one dissenter here somewhere, I think you'll find that the voltage does have a big impact on the compass. The voltage of the cells when the compass is calibrated creates a bit of a 'reference'. Voltages that are very much higher or lower than that will cause some erratic readings. My recommendation is to use the same type of cells on a consistent basis, calibrate your unit after using a freshly charged pair for a few minutes of operation, and as soon as you see the compass start to misbehave (and the battery 'gas gauge' start to drop), swap out the current pair for another freshly charged pair. If the new pair is 'hot off the charger', you may notice a brief period after changing of erratic behavior but that will go away quickly as the new cells settle in to a normal voltage. By doing this, you should have minimal issues with the compass 'needle' bearing to caches and waypoints.

[+dfx]

... and as soon as you see the compass start to misbehave (and the battery 'gas gauge' start to drop), swap out the current pair for another freshly charged pair.

 

With all of the NiMHs I've been using so far, I don't even need to do that. The compass is good all the way down to "red".

[+ecanderson]

... and as soon as you see the compass start to misbehave (and the battery 'gas gauge' start to drop), swap out the current pair for another freshly charged pair.

 

With all of the NiMHs I've been using so far, I don't even need to do that. The compass is good all the way down to "red".

All depends on how 'hot' they come off the charger (varies with both cell and charger algorithm), and when the calibration is performed. If a particular charger/cell combination comes off the charger at a particularly high voltage, and retains that long enough for the user to load them and perform a compass calibration, moving into the 'red' will have shifted the voltage enough to start to upset the compass. With all cell chemistries, it's a matter of how flat the discharge curve is from the time the cell is loaded (and a calibration done) to cell depletion. If cells are charged and allowed to sit a while before any calibration is done, that can help to avoid the accidental calibration against an abnormally high cell voltage. If you measure some NiMH cell/charger combinations right off the charger, they can show a surprising 1.42V, 1.35V the day after, and a bit less, perhaps 1.25V, after initial use. The cell/charger pair, the nature of the cells, and the timing of the user all factor into whether it becomes an issue.

[+dfx]

Yup, I do have compass issues with very freshly charged cells (at least on the higher capacity ones), but only for a couple of minutes or so. It quickly goes back to normal, and I'll take that over having to swap them early. I've found that calibrating the compass on fresh cells after 15+ minutes of use or so gives satisfactory results and eliminates the need for recalibration in the future.

[+ecanderson]

I've found that calibrating the compass on fresh cells after 15+ minutes of use or so gives satisfactory results and eliminates the need for recalibration in the future.

Good plan. What you are seeing is the cell voltage stabilizing a bit, hence the recommendation in the earlier post "calibrate your unit after using a freshly charged pair for a few minutes of operation".

 

Cells with the widest variation in voltage from a fresh charge to depletion create the most problems for these units. Alkaline cells are some of the most problematic in this regard .... if you plotted the slope of the voltage with use, it would be almost linear from top to bottom.

[+hankpixie]

I use a garmin 450 along with the Energizer Ultimate Lithium AA's.....I cache everyday and use a smartphone as well. Probably turn on the Garmin anywhere from 1-3 hours per day and have to change the AA's in it about every three weeks or so. Seems to depend on whether I'm in an urban setting using the phone or rural with the Garmin or in an area with a lot of skip where I need to compare both devices. Put it this way, I've been caching with the Garmin since late July and I've gone through 12 AA batteries total. Just purchased 16 off of amazon for $28 w/free shipping. Pricegrabber.com or Bizrate.com are great sites to compare online pricing for any item you are looking for....hope this helps.

[+Redwoods Mtn Biker]

I bought a set of Eneloops with their charger years ago. All are still going strong.