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Bitten by a dog


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Hmm... perhaps by adopting an aggressive stance already (due to fear/past experience) the dog was picking up on that... but like I say I don't want to create an excuse for the owner. At the end of the day I think you've handled it best you could and I agree completely the dog should be muzzled - especially an alsation! People don't realise that different breeds don't just have physical genetic features, they also have psychological genetic features - they were originally bred for specific tasks.

 

I personally think all dog owners should have to take out a license and insurance... in the UK at least where too many irresponsible people are allowed to own dogs - for the safety of people and also for the health of the dogs themselves who are often mistreated or deprived of proper training.

 

So it wasn't on a lead at all then?

 

I'm not adopting an aggressive stance. I'm merely shifting my weight mostly onto one leg, so that my other leg is freed up for a kick, if I need to defend myself against an attacking dog. And I'm not afraid of dogs; I'm a bigger, more dangerous animal than a dog, and I'm wearing boots.

 

The one that bit me wasn't on a lead. The one that rushed barking at me yesterday but whose owner immediately called the dog under control, wasn't on a lead either.

 

My personal feeling is that I don't think that dogs should be required to be on a lead when walking along footpaths (unless they're going through fields with farm animals or for some other particular reason). I've often seen the joy with which a dog bounds around, sniffing at things, when let off a lead. But I do expect that dogs should be under control. If the owner can control their dog with a word or a whistle, I'm fine with that. If they can't, then they have to find some other way, such as a leash.

 

I don't see how a dog licence will help at all; it just raises revenue for the government, and there will be no enforcement of proper dog training. And I also think that insurance should be optional; if a dog bites me and I decide to seek compenstaion (apparently, the police often sue for compensation), I'm not bothered whether it's paid by an insurance company or the individual. Indeed, I'd be concerned that a bad dog owner might be more careless if they thought they didn't have to pay for the damage their dog did.

 

Did you know there's a web site that specialises in dog bite compensation claims?

 

http://www.dogbitecompensation.co.uk

 

I suspect they just refer the case to a firm of solicitors local to you, but I don't know, and I haven't tried using their services.

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Hmm... perhaps by adopting an aggressive stance already (due to fear/past experience) the dog was picking up on that... but like I say I don't want to create an excuse for the owner. At the end of the day I think you've handled it best you could and I agree completely the dog should be muzzled - especially an alsation! People don't realise that different breeds don't just have physical genetic features, they also have psychological genetic features - they were originally bred for specific tasks.

 

I personally think all dog owners should have to take out a license and insurance... in the UK at least where too many irresponsible people are allowed to own dogs - for the safety of people and also for the health of the dogs themselves who are often mistreated or deprived of proper training.

 

So it wasn't on a lead at all then?

 

I'm not adopting an aggressive stance. I'm merely shifting my weight mostly onto one leg, so that my other leg is freed up for a kick, if I need to defend myself against an attacking dog. And I'm not afraid of dogs; I'm a bigger, more dangerous animal than a dog, and I'm wearing boots.

 

The one that bit me wasn't on a lead. The one that rushed barking at me yesterday but whose owner immediately called the dog under control, wasn't on a lead either.

 

My personal feeling is that I don't think that dogs should be required to be on a lead when walking along footpaths (unless they're going through fields with farm animals or for some other particular reason). I've often seen the joy with which a dog bounds around, sniffing at things, when let off a lead. But I do expect that dogs should be under control. If the owner can control their dog with a word or a whistle, I'm fine with that. If they can't, then they have to find some other way, such as a leash.

 

I don't see how a dog licence will help at all; it just raises revenue for the government, and there will be no enforcement of proper dog training. And I also think that insurance should be optional; if a dog bites me and I decide to seek compenstaion (apparently, the police often sue for compensation), I'm not bothered whether it's paid by an insurance company or the individual. Indeed, I'd be concerned that a bad dog owner might be more careless if they thought they didn't have to pay for the damage their dog did.

 

Did you know there's a web site that specialises in dog bite compensation claims?

 

http://www.dogbitecompensation.co.uk

 

I suspect they just refer the case to a firm of solicitors local to you, but I don't know, and I haven't tried using their services.

it's ambulance chasers ltd

 

and yes... for the time being they get you a local lawyer on no win no fee terms

Edited by NattyBooshka
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OK it's clear I assumed too much... of course dogs need to be let off the leash (however maybe for some dogs it's better if the owner has a big yard).

 

However my point about a dog license is it would serve 2 purposes:

 

1) Ensuring that those who own dogs are committed to the responsibility (i.e. willing to pay for the privelege of owning)

2) I have heard talk of DNA matching to dog licenses - this would have many beneficial uses, not only to match a dog bite to the dog, but to match dog poop and fine owners who don't clean up.

 

I have lost count of the number of times I've stood in poop now whilst geocaching - autumn is the worst with all the leaves on the ground.

 

and just to remind people, I was brought up with dogs, I like dogs and may possibly own one again one day (but I will make sure it's trained and has a nice big yard to play in).

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2) I have heard talk of DNA matching to dog licenses - this would have many beneficial uses, not only to match a dog bite to the dog, but to match dog poop and fine owners who don't clean up.

 

A nasty dog bite that causes a life changing injury maybe, but DNA from poo not at all likely....

 

It's over £300 a pop to submit DNA for comparison (police DNA budgets and submissions are part of my job). We rarely send off the human stuff as the chances of getting DNA from poo are so low. As for dog poo - can't see that happening in a million years.

 

rather than send off a 101 poos to get a handful of hits, it would be more cost effective spend the money on someone to go pick it up and bin it.

Edited by *mouse*
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2) I have heard talk of DNA matching to dog licenses - this would have many beneficial uses, not only to match a dog bite to the dog, but to match dog poop and fine owners who don't clean up.

 

A nasty dog bite that causes a life changing injury maybe, but DNA from poo not at all likely....

 

It's over £300 a pop to submit DNA for comparison (police DNA budgets and submissions are part of my job). We rarely send off the human stuff as the chances of getting DNA from poo are so low. As for dog poo - can't see that happening in a million years.

 

rather than send off a 101 poos to get a handful of hits, it would be more cost effective spend the money on someone to go pick it up and bin it.

Agreed.

Dog licencing wouldnt work either IMHO. How would you police it? Would we have to have an army of dog licence enforcement officers, stopping people in the street to ask to see their dog licence? I reckon, the only way the purchasing of a licence could be enforced, would be when you were buying your pet from an 'official' dog selling personage and I suspect that most dogs arent bought this way anyway.

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Agreed.

Dog licencing wouldnt work either IMHO. How would you police it? Would we have to have an army of dog licence enforcement officers, stopping people in the street to ask to see their dog licence? I reckon, the only way the purchasing of a licence could be enforced, would be when you were buying your pet from an 'official' dog selling personage and I suspect that most dogs arent bought this way anyway.

 

Not that I'm for or against it, but....

How did they enforce it in the past? I seem to recall they haven't actually been scrapped for too long...and I'd imagine even if you didn't get your dog from a breeder, you're still likely to take it to the vet occasionally. Perhaps they could check - and flag it if they're asked to treat unlicensed dogs?

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In Germany all dogs have to be registered with the local government (Rathaus). Tax has to be paid anually and a tax disc (has to be carried on the dog collar) is issued. If the police see a dog without a disc the owned is then fined. As from 01.07.2011, in some of the German states you have a dog licence (Hundeführschein) this includes a written test and also includes having the dog chipped and a liability insurance for the dog.

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In Germany all dogs have to be registered with the local government (Rathaus). Tax has to be paid anually and a tax disc (has to be carried on the dog collar) is issued. If the police see a dog without a disc the owned is then fined. As from 01.07.2011, in some of the German states you have a dog licence (Hundeführschein) this includes a written test and also includes having the dog chipped and a liability insurance for the dog.

Once again the Germans prove that they are better than us. Sadly we don't follow them.

 

The license should return... And I like the tax disc idea... Not got a dog at the moment, but will in the next few years.

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The license should return... And I like the tax disc idea... Not got a dog at the moment, but will in the next few years.

 

And number plates, front and rear!

Hmmm... Rear one could get a bit messy.

We won't know what dog's what if they've all got number two on their rear plates :laughing:

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The license should return... And I like the tax disc idea... Not got a dog at the moment, but will in the next few years.

 

And number plates, front and rear!

Hmmm... Rear one could get a bit messy.

We won't know what dog's what if they've all got number two on their rear plates :laughing:

 

OK - how about painting the registration number on the sides, like they do with sheep?

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The license should return... And I like the tax disc idea... Not got a dog at the moment, but will in the next few years.

 

And number plates, front and rear!

Hmmm... Rear one could get a bit messy.

We won't know what dog's what if they've all got number two on their rear plates :laughing:

 

OK - how about painting the registration number on the sides, like they do with sheep?

 

...and greyhounds could have racing stripes and sponsor's logos :)

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The license should return... And I like the tax disc idea... Not got a dog at the moment, but will in the next few years.

 

And number plates, front and rear!

Hmmm... Rear one could get a bit messy.

We won't know what dog's what if they've all got number two on their rear plates :laughing:

 

OK - how about painting the registration number on the sides, like they do with sheep?

Racing sheep?

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I do not like dogs and admit to being afraid of being attacked by an out of control dog. I do not understand why people want to keep a dagerous animal. Also when you go into a dog owners home have you noticed you can always smell that dog smell? Anyway........

A license does not stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet.

A microchip does not stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet.

Paying a tax every year to own an animal does not stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet.

It is already illegal for a dog to bite someone so adding another law, tax or opening another council department to waste public money is not going to stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet.

The only way is to address the problem directly. My favourite is the use of my trusty 5 foot long hiking staff (a real wooden one not one of the new fangled lightweight alloy ones) which I now always use on rough ground due to an old rugby injury.

When a dog runs towards me I hold the stick up above my head and shout to the owner to "Control your dog". If the dog still runs in for the bite or muddy paw prints on the trousers bring the stick down sharply onto the back or ribs of the dog and the problem just goes away (usually at high speed and with high pitched squealing). Do try not to hit the head as this may harm the dog. I was once attacked by two large dogs that came running at me barking fiercely and really looking as if they meant business and in the heat of the moment with great fear for my wellbeing I misjudged the force used and misaimed and clouted one dog on the head. This time instead of a yelping noise it made a strange snorting noise one of its eyes bulged out and it seemed to acquire a strange walking impediment where it sort of moved diagonally backwards and fell into the canal, swam to the other side and just clung on making a strange sound. Luckily the second dog then also jumped into the canal and swam around the first barking at it, Problem solved. The owner was trying to call the dogs to him and mumbled to me, through tears and bubbles of snot, "I didnt need to do that to him he doesn`t bite"(the usual excuse) I just reminded him that if he had kept his animals under control everyone would still be happy and continued my way along the towpath. Why should we live in fear? everyone should own a good sturdy hiking pole and dog attacks on people would decrease.

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I would report you to the cops for using excessive force bordering on animal abuse. I have a fear of dogs too, slightly irrational. I would never try to kill one the way you did and do.

 

I agree, dogs should not be pets. But thy are. It's not the dogs fault, it is the part for not being more vigilant.

Edited by SeekerOfTheWay
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I would report you to the cops for using excessive force bordering on animal abuse. I have a fear of dogs too, slightly irrational. I would never try to kill one the way you did and do.

 

I agree, dogs should not be pets. But thy are. It's not the dogs fault, it is the part for not being more vigilant.

 

As a wise man once told me "If you were not so stupid I would be able to explain to you how stupid your argument is". as I said I resolve the problem at the time. All the clues are there. If the dogs were kept under control neither dog nor human would come to any harm. Please do not embelish my story beyond the facts of what happened ie out of control dogs outnumbered me, attacked, I defended myself. Result .... Problem sorted. Please do not imagine that I go around beating well behaved dogs but if I am attacked I will defend myself and save myself from a trip to hospital.

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Thanks for calling me stupid. That's classy.

 

I didn't exaggerate your story. I'm going by what you posted. Do you think the dog could have caused you as much damage as you did to it?

 

Seems to me you could have used less force. I've had dogs charge at me, I'm very afraid of them. I've never hurt one as you did.

Edited by SeekerOfTheWay
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Thanks for calling me stupid. That's classy.

 

I didn't exaggerate your story. I'm going by what you posted. Do you think the dog could have caused you as much damage as you did to it?

 

Seems to me you could have used less force. I've had dogs charge at me, I'm very afraid of them. I've never hurt one as you did.

If I was not attacked I would not have defended myself, but I was attacked and only about one and a half seconds to decide what to do. With the luxury of time I could think about what to do for longer but as I rank humans way higher than dogs I was not going to let the dog bite me so I defended myself. And whilst you like seeking and finding, seek through my original text and find that I said due to being 2 dogs, the speed and agression of the attack I misjudged the force and placement of the defensive strike but all ended well and no humans were harmed. Thinking on it now perhaps the police should be involved and they can organise the death of these dangerous attacking dogs. I`ll leave that to you seeing that you want everything done right.

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We probably won't come to an agreement. I don't rank humans way higher than dogs. I see us as equals, and since it is people who choose to keep animals as pets, I hold people responsible more than poepl to protect and care for their pets.

 

I'm glad you and the dogs weren't harmed.

 

Have a good one

Edited by SeekerOfTheWay
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We probably won't come to an agreement. I don't rank humans way higher than dogs. I see us as equals, and since it is people who choose to keep animals as pets, I hold people responsible more than poepl to protect and care for their pets.

 

I'm glad you and the dogs weren't harmed.

 

Have a good one

We don`t need to come to an agreement but I don`t know what I could have done better. If I had not defended myself I would have been bitten then several months down the line during the court case the judge would have agreed that I should not have been bitten and that the attacking dogs should now die. Result... The pain of the bite, time off work for court case, 2 dead dogs an even more upset owner (complete with more bubbles of snot and tears). All I ask is that owners of dogs should, as the law says, keep them under control so that no one gets hurt.

 

So as you say we probably won`t come to an agreement but can you at least agree with the law that dog owners should keep their animals under control for the safety of the public?

 

Yes have a good one yourself.

 

"You may disagree with what I think but that does not mean you should stop thinking" Dr. Gregory House.

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Im sorry but i have to agree with Eclectic, i believe if your put in that situation then you should use what ever force is needed! Im a dog lover myself i thik there cute and all that but one thing that annoys me the most is when i take my little boy to one of our local parks and see the pitbulls and allis running around with no lead on (bearing in mind that my little lad, just like other 3 year olds love to run about on the open fields)

 

Anyhoo one day we were minding our own business and Aaron was running merrily and then all of a sudden from the corner of my eye i see a black and brown BIG DOG bounding over towards Aaron (turned out to be a Rottie, With NO mussel i may add) I dont think ive ever run soo fast in my life, i guess i kinda saw red as my main concern was this dog would rip my child to pieces if it had the chance.......So i manage to pick Aaron up and get him on my shoulders, the dog growled, barked and jumped up several times before i had to kick the dog away (just to add the dog actually ripped my brand new walking coat which i was trying out for the first time)

The look in that dogs eyes was soo scary that i seriously believe that it saw my child as its next meal, so i think its bull that people think that dogs are equal to humans!!!! The owner ran over and instead of disiplining the dog he started having a massive shouting match with me, telling me he was going to the police to get me sued for animal cruelty! If i had to do it again i would, i didnt care about the force of the kick (i wish id of kicked harder tbh) He said his dog didnt need to be on a lead because it has as much right to be walking about free as THAT KID does (thats what he called my baby :o )

 

Its ruined my like for taking my boy to see the ducks n to play football on these bigger parks as maybe one day i might not be quick enough....Does anyone (dog lover or not) really want to witness a little boy/girl getting ripped to shreads because they were happily running about on a public park (i dont think so)

 

This was after the incident with Drsolly so thanks to him im now always aware of dogs off leads whilst caching with my little un.....An now im thinkin of investing in a wooden walking stick, Id have no problem beating the dog if it saved me or my child from getting bitten!!!

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..... I don't rank humans way higher than dogs. I see us as equals .....

Woah!!!! Come on now, think what you are saying. Equals?! You value the life and well being of a dog the same as a human child?!

 

Anyway I have a dog and think the world of him. He is a companion as well as a pet. He runs free when the occasion permits and is kept on a leash when he might cause inconvenience. He is normally totally harmless and trustworthy and loves playing with children. BUT I always keep a very close eye on him in such circumstances. And when we are with people, many of whom do not like dogs I keep him on a close leash. I don't have the right to impose my love of dogs on others.

 

I have never been attacked by a dog but believe me, dog lover or not, if I was in danger I would take EVERY measure to protect myself, my wife or, yes, my own dog. I have nothing but contempt for those who fail to control their dogs and are blinded to the possibility of everyone not loving their pooch as much as they do.

 

Oh yes, I always bag up my dog's mess and carry it with me until I find a suitable bin! ;)

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Thank you jady1987 it`s nice to see some common sense on here. So many people want their rights to let their dog run free but do not want to have the burden of their responsibilities of dog ownership. If they cannot control a dog when it "is just being friendly" or "he just wants to play" how are they going to control it when it is tearing skin and flesh off someones face. (For those who think this would not happen just set your browser settings to "do not filter my search results" and google dog attacks uk and check out what really happens in a severe dog attack. WARNING you will see some disturbing Facial injuries especially where it was large dog v small child.) It is just not good enough when the owners of Fluffy are on the news being interviewed just wringing their hands and tearfully telling the nation that "we never thought Fluffy would do this, he is usually so friendly" while a child lies in hospital waiting for facial skin grafts. For those who are going to argue this does not happen here in the UK just google dog attacks and see how many come up.

 

On the point of investing in a hiking pole I carry a B&Q junior hacksaw on my country walks and use it to harvest a good straight hazel stick about 25 to 30mm diameter from a hedgerow and cut it to shoulder height in length.... perfect, cheap and I am not concerned about damaging it when using it to bash through nettles or brambles on caching trips. It also makes that very satisfying THWACK sound against the back or ribs of an out of control dog.

 

To all those hard of thinking I shall simplyfy things for you to save all the huffing & puffing and posturing that if I ever did that to your dog etc etc

1. I do not advocate beating any dog at random for no reason whatsoever.

2. Violence should only used to defend ones self from attack, and as with any defense the violence should be increased until the problem is overcome.

3. Self defense, as in any attack (human or animal), should never consist of curling up into a ball and crying out "Get him off me". It should, For maximum effect, take place suddenly with enough force to end the threat if possible and without any pity for the assailant that decided to attack you in the first place. My motto in any defense situation is always that if I am going to come second place in a fight I am going to make dadgum sure, through my effort, that it is going to be a close second.

 

WALES the land where it is sunny 365 days every year, it`s just a shame that clouds get in the way most days.

Edited by Eclectic_Penguin
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It also makes that very satisfying THWACK sound against the back or ribs of an out of control dog.

 

 

there's seriously something wrong with you.

 

This post is from a sock puppet account to make it look like Hywel is posting - the name is spelt with a minor difference which is not easily seen.

 

I agree with you that there is something seriously wrong with the person who is imitating Hywel.

 

Lilian

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..... I don't rank humans way higher than dogs. I see us as equals .....

Woah!!!! Come on now, think what you are saying. Equals?! You value the life and well being of a dog the same as a human child?!

 

Anyway I have a dog and think the world of him. He is a companion as well as a pet. He runs free when the occasion permits and is kept on a leash when he might cause inconvenience. He is normally totally harmless and trustworthy and loves playing with children. BUT I always keep a very close eye on him in such circumstances. And when we are with people, many of whom do not like dogs I keep him on a close leash. I don't have the right to impose my love of dogs on others.

 

I have never been attacked by a dog but believe me, dog lover or not, if I was in danger I would take EVERY measure to protect myself, my wife or, yes, my own dog. I have nothing but contempt for those who fail to control their dogs and are blinded to the possibility of everyone not loving their pooch as much as they do.

 

Oh yes, I always bag up my dog's mess and carry it with me until I find a suitable bin! ;)

 

Yes.

 

I don't think animals should be kept as pets for the most part. I disagree with breeding animals. Especially dogs such as pitbulls and other aggressive dogs. They are dangerous animals.

 

But, people do have pets, and thy should mind and care for them. It's not the dogs fault it attacks. That's its instinct. It's the owners fault.

 

Whack the owner, not the dog. Your description of hitting the dog seems to me like you used excessive force. That's my opinion.

Edited by SeekerOfTheWay
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This sock puppet may have history. Don't worry - you don't need to get what's going on - I don't have the full picture myself but the date around this account was created is quite significant to a number of us locally and I've been aware and keeping an eye on this dormant account for quite some time.

 

I really want it to end here - its been dealt with by Groundspeak.

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It also makes that very satisfying THWACK sound against the back or ribs of an out of control dog.

 

 

there's seriously something wrong with you.

I agree. Using a big stick isn't enough. Where I come from most people are packing sidearms when caching in the back country. If however I meet up with a dog in an urban setting that is equal to me then he'd better be more equal or he's gonna get his boney head bashed in.

Equal my sore and tired (you-know-what)! That is just plain stupid. If someone thinks dogs are so equal, next time they're having a conversation with Marmaduke let's see them ask him if he knows how to conjugate a verb.

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It also makes that very satisfying THWACK sound against the back or ribs of an out of control dog.

 

 

there's seriously something wrong with you.

I agree. Using a big stick isn't enough. Where I come from most people are packing sidearms when caching in the back country. If however I meet up with a dog in an urban setting that is equal to me then he'd better be more equal or he's gonna get his boney head bashed in.

Equal my sore and tired (you-know-what)! That is just plain stupid. If someone thinks dogs are so equal, next time they're having a conversation with Marmaduke let's see them ask him if he knows how to conjugate a verb.

You are a real joy to have around here, my friend.

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You are a real joy to have around here, my friend.

Thanks. It really is a fun place to hang isn't it? Have you been on all the threads in the forum for a long time? Couldn't help but notice that you've had a opinion on all things all the time in all places. You remind me of my favorite character Clifford C. Calvin, Jr on the television show, "Cheers"

You've been riding my back since I got on the forum. From now on please don't reply to anything I say. You're way too passive-aggressive for me. I'd rather you go your way and I go mine. If you have a problem with that, feel free to take it up with a mod.

Edited by GC Addicted
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[quote name='SeekerOfTheWay' timestamp='1312294379' post='4795774'

It's not the dogs fault it attacks. That's its instinct. It's the owners fault.

 

Whack the owner, not the dog. Your description of hitting the dog seems to me like you used excessive force. That's my opinion.

 

When a dog is coming at me with teeth bared ready to bite, my instinct is to defend myself. That's my instinct. Whose fault this is, doesn't enter into it, I'm aiming to avoid getting hurt. My instinct isn't to ignore the dog that's threatening to bite me and whack the owner, it's to defend myself against an attacking dog. If my self-defence involves kicking the dog or hitting it with a stick, then that's what my instinct will lead me to do (and, by the way, I'd feel the same if it were any other kind of animal). My instinct is not to let a dog bite me, especially now that I know what it feels like (and my leg isn't yet completely healed, six weeks later). You see - humans have instincts too, and the self-defence instinct is pretty strong.

 

Today, I was walking quietly across a field on a public footpath, and coming towards me was a man with a dog, dog not on lead (even though there were also farm animals in the field).

 

The dog started acting aggressively towards me, showing its teeth and barking. I stood still. Doing nothing, but ready to defend myself if need be, and making sure that the dog didn't get behind me, in the ambush position.

 

The owner called the dog. The dog took no notice. The owner called and called, and the dog carried on barking at me and showing teeth. I'm guessing that this is a common situation with this dog and owner. Eventually, after realising that the dog somlpy would not come when called, the owner resolved the situation (in his mind) by telling me that the dog was harmless (all owners think that their dog is harmless, I've never met an owner that has said to me "You're quite right to be cautious, Fluffy has bitten four people this week alone"). However, the dog didn't carry out its threat of attacking me. And I went over the stile to the next field. I don't know if the dog did the same to the farm animals in the field, and I doubt if the dog would have responded to the owner's calls if it had started worrying the livestock.

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I see your point, and agree that we have instincts too. I always freeze when a dog is near so I'd probably get hurt.

 

Two of my neighbors have big dogs. Two pitbulls and one I don't know the breed but it's huge and used to run at me barking. I finally couldn't take it anymore and I cursed at the owners to control their $?@*## dog. I never curse, ever.

 

They now have a dog fence.

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