Do cache owners have the right to delete logs if they don't like the log comment

10.2k · May 20, 2011

Some people are just not writers. They may have a hard time typing or may not spell well enough to be comfortable with leaving a longer message.

A statement that's been brought up many times, no offense. So where were these non-writer type "TFTC" loggers from 2000-2009? Can you find me a "TFTC" log from say 2005? Oops, sorry, I'm not supposed to be posting here.

May 20, 2011

What exciting things do your add to TFTC on a mindless LP hide?

1.7k · May 20, 2011

Interestingly enough, Keelmann And Cici made an interesting point about being a newbie and just not knowing any better. The logs that came in that got me to post this thread actually came from a newbie cacher who I ultimately sent an email to, welcoming them to the game, giving them some useful links for caching sites in our area, and also gave them a heads up on the shortlog hate which is prominent in our area.

How about placing a new cache with the name "Shortlog Hate" and in the description write a bit about how frustrating it is for COs to have those kind of logs posted to their cache pages.

In other words, use the opportunity of your frustration to educate newbie cachers. I'm sure the oldtime cachers would have a great time finding this new cache and adding their 2 cents about the issue within their log notes.

Just an idea...

May 20, 2011

A statement that's been brought up many times, no offense. So where were these non-writer type "TFTC" loggers from 2000-2009? Can you find me a "TFTC" log from say 2005? Oops, sorry, I'm not supposed to be posting here.

Technically not TFTC, but you have a few terse logs on your caches 2005 or before.

October 3, 2003 by dumas clan jackbear (10 found)
TFTC. Traveling w/ jackbear.

November 2, 2005 by Woody's Roundup (276 found)
Found before. TFTC

November 27, 2005 by fourenty (231 found)
TFTH

December 26, 2005 by CA_raisins (60 found)
Found with Dr. Olds. TFTC!

April 18, 2004 by rockyroad (127 found)
btdit

November 22, 2004 by Mr_Z (587 found)
4th of 6 today. TFTH. SL.

January 13, 2005 by Coloradored (152 found)
Nice Hide. SL

April 2, 2006 by Dano76 (6 found)
good

May 20, 2011

I wonder if this guy complains about TFTC logs?

7.5k · May 20, 2011

Some people are just not writers. They may have a hard time typing or may not spell well enough to be comfortable with leaving a longer message.

From what I've been reading in the forums, new cachers are more "monkey see, monkey do", they assume since they see TFTC a lot that it's the norm and the expected practice. Once they realize COs prefer longer logs, many have said they will change their logging practices. Maybe Groundspeak could help educate by putting a prominent note on the Logging page that says 'please consider leaving a detailed note about your experience while finding this cache' (or something to that effect).

7.5k · May 20, 2011

What exciting things do your add to TFTC on a mindless LP hide?

Why look for mindless LP hides (especially if you can tell from the write-up that it's an LPC)? If I end up at one because I wasn't warned via the cache description or the last few logs, and if I choose to find it once I got to the parking lot, I would definitely write something in the log that explains that I normally filter out micro LPCs but the cache description indicated this was a "small" cache not a micro and didn't indicate it would be in a parking lot LPC. Writing TFTC tells the CO that I appreciated the cache ("Thanks for the Cache"), when in actual fact I'm a little annoyed at driving 5 miles out of my way to end up at a parking lot.

Then again if you do appreciate all cache types, including LPCs then you might want to let the CO know with more then just an TFTC, since TFTC has also come to be regarded as code for 'Your cache had no redeeming value, except for another smiley'.

May 20, 2011

TFTC has also come to be regarded as code for 'Your cache had no redeeming value, except for another smiley'.

What a strange turn of events. If not for this forum, I would never had learned that. I was lead to believe it means Thanks For The Cache.

We need a new thing that does mean that. Like, NRV for No Reedeming Value.

"That guy had the nerve to leave a NRV log!"

May 20, 2011

I had a log deleted for a find (most likely) because of the fact I nade a encrypted comment about having another similar container nearby container. I had to repost the find. :blink:

May 20, 2011

I can understand your frustration, but I think the loggers would be equally frustrated if their logs were deleted after they had legitimately found the cache.

Maybe you could include something in the info about how you reading about their experiences to try to get more stories out of people.

Maybe you could send a message to repeat offenders. 'I see you've found several of my caches, I'd like to hear more about how you enjoyed your day caching. Have fun out there!' I got a message from someone once. It wasn't prodding me to write more, but it was kinda cool that someone took the time to say they were glad I enjoyed getting several of theirs one day.

8.3k · May 20, 2011

What exciting things do your add to TFTC on a mindless LP hide?

This one was quite a quest. While on lunch I decided to do a quick grab. Well this turned out to be quite an epic adventure! Getting to the parking was easy enough but man finding the cache was tough. When I got to the gz, all I saw was a car. I figured "wow what a huge cache container!". As I started to jimmy the lock a police officer came by and asked what I was doing. I said "geocaching duh" as I popped the lock. Inside I found a laptop, but since I couldn't trade up I left it. The cop then tried to arrest me, so I fled the scene. The cache plagued me for days. I couldn't eat nor sleep without signing that log. I finally went back, and a new car was there! Maybe the car wasn't the container at all??! It was then I thought about other possible hiding places. Snow ? The pavement being a giant log I sign with chalk? No that was all wrong. Finally I thought wait, doctors have patients. Patients can either be men or woman. Woman have skirts... And it all made sense. Sure enough I found it! Thanks for the great time!

or

As I drove up I thought "Got this one". Got out of the car to get it and just as I was reaching for it a bright flash of light occured, a sound like a light sabre started up and I smelled an odor of what seemed like a cross between burning flesh and ozone. I remember thinking "This is not Good". At that point I passed out. I vaguely remember someone moaning and screaming. As I started to come around I realized I was the one moaning and screaming. I was on a table in this room with very bright lights and the walls seemed to be some kind of polished steel. I tried to get up but could not move. Was I paralized? No, it was the straps holding me to the table. At this point I knew this was going to be a long afternoon. A little while later this little dude just sort of glides through the walls and shortly another one. They really haven't been in the sun for a long while and had a sickly green color. Short, no hair, and funny dark eyes. They start to talk to me, well not really talking, but making voices appear in my head. But I'm brave, name, find count and user ID is all I give them. After a couple more times of this I'm thinking this is a bad idea, when the little dude says "We have ways of making you talk". And to show me he means business he shows me. oouch. First thing they ask is why do we need to know the size of the indians to solve Le Chuck's Treasure? Who is Doctor Who and who is his sibling? What? I tell them I don't know. The dude says yes you do, your Full of Hot air, tell us! I tried to keep from giving it all away, but it was not to be, they had ways of making me talk that still scares me. After draining me of everything I finally ask, "Why did you do this?" The girl one said "We hate DNF's". At that point I pass out, I'm not sure what happened, but this security dude was tapping on my window. I roll it down and he wanted to know why I was flashing all those lights. Was I trying to crash airlines? I point out to him that airlines don't fly around here, he kind of scratches head and turns around and gets in his rent-a-cop-mobile and drives away. I see I'm holding a micro, so I sign the log, finally remember why I was here and weakly get up and put the micro in the only place that makes sense. I hope I got it back in the right spot.This is one I won't forget soon.

Or if you feel a bit testy

Great parking lot looks like Warm-Mix Asphalt application.

The lines appear to be painted with a Rollmaster Paint Line Striper 4" Wide Line

Model # T9A239823 using Aervoe White Supreme striping paint.

I’ts a shame I didn’t pack a picnic lunch or I would have stayed a bit longer.

Or for a nasty bison hide by a power sub-station

While looking for this one a neighbor came out an asked if I was looking for the dilithium crystal. He said the other night a UFO came down to get some juice from the power grid, made the lights get real dim, and while they were charging up they beamed a crew member out. He rumaged around a bit and came out with something that looked like a 35mm film can. The neighbor said he didn't know the crystals were that small. Anyhow he beamed back in and the ship took off. I'm thinking it wasn't a dilithium crystal after all, but the cache. Bet those aliens were real surprised when they opened it up and only found a piece of paper. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. Didn't find because I think a bunch of aliens stole the darn thing. But on the outside chance they didn't you could give me a hint on which stone it is under, there a whole bunch of them.

3.1k · May 20, 2011

Write the kind of logs you'd like to read and set an example for others.

You could try sending a polite message to TFTCers, but your results will vary (enlightenment, indifference, hate).

10.2k · May 20, 2011

A statement that's been brought up many times, no offense. So where were these non-writer type "TFTC" loggers from 2000-2009? Can you find me a "TFTC" log from say 2005? Oops, sorry, I'm not supposed to be posting here.

Technically not TFTC, but you have a few terse logs on your caches 2005 or before.

October 3, 2003 by dumas clan jackbear (10 found)
TFTC. Traveling w/ jackbear.

November 2, 2005 by Woody's Roundup (276 found)
Found before. TFTC

November 27, 2005 by fourenty (231 found)
TFTH

December 26, 2005 by CA_raisins (60 found)
Found with Dr. Olds. TFTC!

April 18, 2004 by rockyroad (127 found)
btdit

November 22, 2004 by Mr_Z (587 found)
4th of 6 today. TFTH. SL.

January 13, 2005 by Coloradored (152 found)
Nice Hide. SL

April 2, 2006 by Dano76 (6 found)
good

Hey, I'm not supposed to be posting here, you know. Woody's Roundup was the then seperate 14 yr. old kid account of a Geocacher I know. Woody is now in College. Colorado Red, I'm going to have to have a word with. :blink:

May 21, 2011

for me its a get what you give kinda thing..if its a simple nano hanging in a tree like the other 4 i just found, i thing TFTC is fine, if the cache isnt memorable i give a TFTC sig, if it was something i had to look for and the area was nice and i see you tried to make my experience fun i give a log. So if you have too many TFTC sigs..look at your hide maybe

2.6k · May 21, 2011

AAH for the good old days when cachers were cachers and logs were logs

November 30, 2001 by yrium (169 found)

Working at home, Feverishly doing the work of three programmers, I’m often interrupted by pestiferous little timewasters known as email. Each one shows up like a wet puppy on the doorstep, insistently whining for entrance. Like little yips coming from my electronic porch, each one wants a moment of my time. Each one, like a used car salesman – cloaks himself as my true friend. Each one guaranteed to tee me off, and slow my work pace to that of a sloth’s. Emails detailing various scams go directly to my trash. I got a college degree – thank you very much. My credit ratings okay, If I need relief I’ll take Tums. I don’t need your ink jet cartridges Mr BigCatLotto, go away! Mrs Cleo… If your psychic, why don’t you know you’re annoying the heck out of me and I’m never going to call you to find out what my lucky numbers are. And for all those people sending me virus warnings because their daughter, who is away at college, just heard about a virus on yesterday’s six-oclock news… I’m way ahead of you sister, keep your virus warning to yourself.

Oh happy moment when the last email appeared. It’s a geocaching notification referencing new caches in the area. Aha! Vagabond has placed another. I look eagerly forward to quitting time. I’ve been wanting something to take my mind off of current events, this looks made to order. When’s Superfly getting home from school? Gromit and I are ready to go. We leave the house a bit before five. I hold a hope of light traffic ahead as we drive the Southbound 15 from Escondido. We are slowed thru Miramar and crossing under the 805 but make pretty good time. Sun has gone down but there seems to be enough light to see by. We pull into the nearest Marian Bear Park entrance and start our walk. I think we’ll find the cache before the light is fully gone, We hurry down the trail. As Beeque foretold, Gromit is tugging at his leash as we walk. Superfly, being cold has decided to jog ahead to generate some body heat. I carry an enormous quantity of BTU’s under my capacious epidermis, no lack of warmth here!

continued in note...

View Log

November 30, 2001 by yrium (169 found)

Just a few hundred feet to go and we have a problem. Its gotten dark quick and we have to traverse an area filled with dark green leaves as seen under the fading light. Superfly asks tremulously “Is that Poison Oak?”. He’s remembering Vagabond’s warning in the cache description. No botanist me, my reply is “Does it have 5 points”, I don’t know where that came from. He answered “No, it has three… What does that mean?”. Heck if I know, try not to touch it I say as I push confidently by. I’m wearing long pants, he’s just wearing shorts. I can’t figure out why he was cold earlier. We find a little stream bed and due to the recent rains there is just enough water flowing by that we have to pick our steps carefully to get thru okay. I just recently got some new white tennis shoes and I’m hoping to get back home with their surfaces unblemished. Gromit crosses as he does when ever there is water about, he finds the widest possible place to ford, then tranverses the wet obstacle at a slant, maximizing the time his paws are in the water. Needless to say he returned home in the cargo area of the Pathfinder. I wouldn’t want to face the wrath of Whistlestick if I’d allowed Gromit to track mud on the back seats.

We are close now, unfortunately its too dark to see anything. Superfly is moaning about spiderwebs and poison oak so he’s not much help as I search for Vagabond’s cache. My GPS is telling me lies… There’s no cache here, I start to widen my search area poking likely looking piles of leaves with my walking stick. Oh there’s a metallic noise! I’ve found it! I bend over and dig a bit in the mulch… NOPE, I’ve just uncovered an old bottle, I resume my search. I’m walking along side an old tree log that is about 30 feet long peering under it when I just start to crack up. Gromit is shadowing my steps, but instead of walking thru the weedy ground, he’s daintily walking along the top of the log. I’m pretty impressed with his Wallenda like abilities. If I’d only known I could have sold him to a circus when he was young and made a pretty penny. It’s too bad I’m just a bit too attached to the furry critter to part with him now.

Okay, this is getting ridiculous, we can’t find the cache anywhere and now its really really dark. A full moon later tonight is no help now as me and the Superfly are quickly wearing out our squint muscles. I have a dinky double A sized Mag flashlight that we are using, but it looks like we are going to have to record a not found. Oh, there it is! Whew that was close. Holding the flashlight with my chin I look thru the log. 10:30am? BeeQue done found it 8 hours before us. And Mr UU was here while I was still planning my lunch. Superfly, Gromit and I take the Bronze. We dropped off a traveling Pumba warthog traveler and a georged dollar bill and take a stuffed Pixel creature that must be COMPUSA’s failed mascot as I don’t recall ever seeing him before. Entering our travails in the log we head back to the car in the dark. As we brush aside foliage I’m again struck by my utter lack of knowledge of what poison oak looks like. We keep our eyes open as we hike back and I can’t truthfully say if we walked thru it or not. I can say that we didn’t cross paths with any carnivorous rutabagas though.

Thanks for the Cache Vagabond, We loved it!

--- yrium ---

7.7k · May 21, 2011

On the other hand, I don't think there's any rules or guidelines against you going out to the cache and using an eraser or correction fluid to remove the signature from the logsheet...

3.3k · May 21, 2011

I get some very nice logs and I get a few TFTC logs. One time I had an entertaining exchange with a then new cacher who posted a TFTC log on one my more challenging and popular hides. After a few days of discussion we parted ways and the then new cacher still posts TFTC on most finds. After that experience I decided to appreciate the good logs and gloss over the others. I was a bit disappointed this past week to receive my first blank log for a found it. But I got over it pretty quickly.

My choice these days is to attempt to lead by example. I don't think I write great logs but each one is unique and thanks the CO for the fun. I don't get unhappy when I receive what I consider to be substandard logs and I don't chase after the cacher who posts one. They will do what they believe is ok for their purposes and I am ok with that. At least they are out caching and being a part of the game I enjoy.

If I only hid caches in anticipation of receiving unlimited adulation from all seekers I wouldn't even try to hide caches anymore.

To the OP: I would never delete what I thought was a substandard (didn't meet my expectations) log. A pure spoiler? Maybe. Haven't done it yet.

May 21, 2011

Hey, I'm not supposed to be posting here, you know. Woody's Roundup was the then seperate 14 yr. old kid account of a Geocacher I know. Woody is now in College. Colorado Red, I'm going to have to have a word with.

How about rockyroad? What in the heck does btdit mean?

May 21, 2011

On the other hand, I don't think there's any rules or guidelines against you going out to the cache and using an eraser or correction fluid to remove the signature from the logsheet...

There's also no rule again going out and removing the cache if someone decided to use said correction fluid on the logbook.

Well, there probably is a rule against it, but no way of proving who did it. :anibad:

19k · May 21, 2011

Some people are just not writers. They may have a hard time typing or may not spell well enough to be comfortable with leaving a longer message.

That is indeed a very good point. But it is the rare exception. For the most part, if they can navigate around these pages and load cache pages and all, they can probably type something.

10.2k · May 21, 2011

Hey, I'm not supposed to be posting here, you know. Woody's Roundup was the then seperate 14 yr. old kid account of a Geocacher I know. Woody is now in College. Colorado Red, I'm going to have to have a word with.

How about rockyroad? What in the heck does btdit mean?

C'mon, you keep make me posting!! :lol: RockyRoad is a retired senior citizen who always logged in conjunction with his wife. He was in fact questioned by several locals (through a prominent local cacher who got them started) about that. It stood for Been there, done it. Posting before I checked to see if he's found any caches lately, or still does that.

EDIT: apparently no Rockyroad logs have been posted since 2007. See his wife's logs on the same day for actual information about the cache hunt.

Edited May 21, 2011 by Mr.Yuck

7.9k · May 21, 2011

Of course, if there is no legible log in the logbook that can be attributed to the blank/TFTC/objectionable logger...then (and only then) you may delete away.

Do you think Groundspeak is going to demand copies of the log as proof?

Really, it's just a game.

If this phenomenon was really bugging me that much, I would just archive all my urban caches.

The most important thing to consider is that the odd lame log amongst the other logs describing a fun time speak more about the logger than the cache in question.

May 21, 2011

Or if you feel a bit testy

Great parking lot looks like Warm-Mix Asphalt application.

The lines appear to be painted with a Rollmaster Paint Line Striper 4" Wide Line

Model # T9A239823 using Aervoe White Supreme striping paint.

I’ts a shame I didn’t pack a picnic lunch or I would have stayed a bit longer.

Thanks for the post!

(No, really, thanks, I laughed and now I want to hide a cache in your vicinity.)

3.7k · May 21, 2011

Or if you feel a bit testy

Great parking lot looks like Warm-Mix Asphalt application.

The lines appear to be painted with a Rollmaster Paint Line Striper 4" Wide Line

Model # T9A239823 using Aervoe White Supreme striping paint.

I’ts a shame I didn’t pack a picnic lunch or I would have stayed a bit longer.

Thanks for the post!

+1. Good one, Jim!

8.3k · May 21, 2011

Or if you feel a bit testy

Great parking lot looks like Warm-Mix Asphalt application.

The lines appear to be painted with a Rollmaster Paint Line Striper 4" Wide Line

Model # T9A239823 using Aervoe White Supreme striping paint.

I’ts a shame I didn’t pack a picnic lunch or I would have stayed a bit longer.

Thanks for the post!

+1. Good one, Jim!

Now that I have been caught, I must admit I shamelessly stole that one from Funnynose. The others are mine.

38.2k · May 21, 2011

If what you want is people to give you great feedback on your caches, then I suggest placing caches that will get you great feedback.

That used to be the rule. I have a cache that I think is a good quality cache. It used to garner longer logs and it's been favorited a number of times.

The last three logs? "TFTC" " " (totally blank) and ".". The last one has me totally confused. He took the time to actually type a period.

May 21, 2011

I have a been deleted when I think it was unfair so let me run this by everyone.

My friend and I found a cache and signed it one day. A week or so later the cache owner wrote and ask where we found the cache. I tried to remember which cache this was and I think I told him where we found it. But we did because our names are on the log!

He came back and said that wasn't his cache, his had been taken and someone else placed a container for him. He didn't like how easy the container was placed and was going to get back to the state to replace it his way. So in the mean time, he wouldn't except our logs!

He moved out of state and comes back every couple months.

Is it right for him to delete our logs when it wasn't our fault that it wasn't his container we found? I fought back and forth with him for a few emails and then dropped it. I will NOT get another one of his caches again tho. I believe that was not fair, but it was only one smiley and a jerk so I let it go.

What do you all think?

1.5k · May 21, 2011

That's been discussed a few times and opinions vary.

He has the right to delete it. Should he though? Good question. I'd probably be ticked at the deletion as well unless it was a four star hide replaced by a film canister.

Edited May 22, 2011 by Ecylram

3.1k · May 21, 2011

He came back and said that wasn't his cache, his had been taken and someone else placed a container for him....

What do you all think?

If you didn't sign his cache's log book, then he is allowed to delete your "Found it" log. Whether he should or not depends.

If the replacement cache was reasonably comparable, then I don't think he should delete logs. But if the replacement didn't provide the same geocaching experience he had intended, then I can understand his actions. If his cache was extremely well hidden and the replacement was very easy to find, for example, then allowing your smiley takes something away from the specialness of the legitimate smileys.

Suppose his cache wasn't missing at all and a frustrated DNFer tossed out a replacement? Would you still think you're entitled to claim a "Found it" for finding his cache?

All that said, I think the cache owner should have disabled his cache when he learned it had gone missing, so bad feelings could have been avoided.

May 21, 2011

He came back and said that wasn't his cache, his had been taken and someone else placed a container for him....

What do you all think?

All that said, I think the cache owner should have disabled his cache when he learned it had gone missing, so bad feelings could have been avoided.

We also thought he should have disabled his cache since he was from out of state. Alot of people had signed the logsheet so we are not the only ones to make the mistake. How are we to know if nothing is said on the cache page.

When I move out of town or state and I can't keep good track of my caches, I adopt them out or archive them.

2k · May 21, 2011

we had a person delete logs recently if he felt the person did not solve the puzzle. Sure we could appeal to Groundspeak and make a stink but we felt it was not worth logging his caches because he put such inflamatory comments in notes as well.

The nerve to delete logs for simply having folks who were in the same car as the person who solved the puzzle deleted because they did not "solve" it.

7.7k · May 21, 2011

... and ".". The last one has me totally confused. He took the time to actually type a period.

That's the whole point.

Get it? Period = point. Oh, never mind....

May 21, 2011

On the other hand, I don't think there's any rules or guidelines against you going out to the cache and using an eraser or correction fluid to remove the signature from the logsheet...

I've wondered if anyone has done that. Or admit if they had.

Edited May 21, 2011 by jd-mitchell

10.1k · May 21, 2011

On the other hand, I don't think there's any rules or guidelines against you going out to the cache and using an eraser or correction fluid to remove the signature from the logsheet...

I've wondered if anyone has done that. Or admit if they had.

I had a CO tear out the page with my signature. Yes. It does happen.

May 22, 2011

Somehow that seems kinda :signalviolin:

2.3k · May 22, 2011

On the other hand, I don't think there's any rules or guidelines against you going out to the cache and using an eraser or correction fluid to remove the signature from the logsheet...

I've wondered if anyone has done that. Or admit if they had.

I had a CO tear out the page with my signature. Yes. It does happen.

When people start taking things to that level it's time to step back from the hobby and re-evaluate ones priorities in life.

This is supposed to be fun. Not some mine field toes to step and egos to bruise.

May 22, 2011

But as the owner of the cache, do I not get a say in whether or not those types of logs are acceptable?

I think if the cache listing is technically "owned" by the cache owner, then should I not be able to delete a log if I see it is not within what I want to have in my listing?

I'm just throwing it out there for feedback

You own the cache, yes, but you do not own the site on which all of us submit our online logs. If they do not violate terms of use, they are not yours to do with as you please. It's not up to you how others log their finds.

Interestingly enough, Keelmann And Cici made an interesting point about being a newbie and just not knowing any better. The logs that came in that got me to post this thread actually came from a newbie cacher who I ultimately sent an email to, welcoming them to the game, giving them some useful links for caching sites in our area, and also gave them a heads up on the shortlog hate which is prominent in our area.

This area has a very active caching community and it's unfortunate that yes, the mobile phone usage has increased and thusly short logs are becoming more common. I find it incredibly disrespectful to just TFTC for a cache, but most of you are right in that there really isn't much I can do about it.

If I thought that deleting someone's logs would actually change the situation,

There's a huge difference between contacting a single cacher with kind intentions and admitting you'd like to start deleting log after log because they don't meet your standards.

Smartphones don't create short logs, cachers that use them do. I'm a smartphone cacher and I enjoy telling of my experiences in most of my logs, so don't blame the device. I'm sure there are plenty who write short logs on their computers. Smartphones being used to cache are here to stay, doesn't do any good complaining about it...although I know it won't stop.

What do you think it'd change by deleting logs? More than likely all you'd succeed in doing is angering a lot of cachers. You think cachers should log the way YOU want them to, so you're willing to delete the ones that don't meet your standards. Well maybe some cachers don't like a particular container you use. Maybe they should throw it away because you're not using something THEY prefer.

You don't have a problem with copy/pasted logs. Short logs are disrespectful in your eyes, but writing a few sentences then copy/pasting them to dozens of your caches a single cacher finds in a day is ok with you. I'm sorry, but if one is bad, so is the other.

Not everyone reads the forums and most newbies get their information on what is OK from other logs.

I'm glad more newcomers DON'T read these forums. The negativity towards newbies and/or smartphone users is a big problem here and it runs the risk of chasing people away. I don't know, maybe that's what some people want. I suppose some cachers will never be satisfied unless everyone does things their way.

Geocaching has obviously changed in recent years & it seems some aren't happy with it. I read all the time that in the past, cachers wrote long physical logs at the caches themselves. Well I often read through the larger logbooks and for years now, people have written just the date & username. Long before smartphones were added to the mix and it's done by long time cachers as well, so you can't blame newbies & smartphones for it. Newbies, short loggers & smartphone users are constantly being blamed for hurting the game, but do you honestly believe all the finger pointing & negativity is helping? I think it puts long time cachers in a negative light.

May 22, 2011

I can understand the frustration, but if I found my log was removed because of a simple message left from my smart phone I would most certainly report it. Who are you as the placer to require what I say? Especially when I am out in the field reporting in with my cell... I haven't placed any caches of my own yet, but I am planning a few and I would much rather a 'TFTC' than a negative comment or nothing at all. 'TFTC' may not sound sincere, but it still means something.

2.3k · May 22, 2011

I was reading a profile of a cacher yesterday and had to laugh. He demanded long logs just tftc. Was not the most personable person. Insulting comes to mind. Then I read more and found he didn't want logs that spoke negative of the cache or experience.

Don't know his caches. I'm sure they are great. But if you don't want short logs people should be prepared for honest logs. So basically what I got from him is he wants long logs that may just be lies.

7.4k · May 22, 2011

Short logs aren't the travesty some people make them out to be. If long, descriptive logs are important to you, hide caches that are conducive to that.

This is a game. If you're hell-bent on controlling everybody else, you're really missing the point.

May 22, 2011

I can understand the frustration, but if I found my log was removed because of a simple message left from my smart phone I would most certainly report it. Who are you as the placer to require what I say?

Or how you say it? :cool:

May 22, 2011

I find that really annoying as well. Someone did 4 of my caches yesterday and the log was all the same - it said "-wolfpack" yeah ok, so did you like the caches? Were they too boring for you? Did you take or leave anything? Anything? Hello? Not even TFTC. Whatever. I went to see other caches he did and he signed those logs the same way so I guess I shouldn't take it personally. There are some jackasses out there.

May 22, 2011

we had a person delete logs recently if he felt the person did not solve the puzzle. Sure we could appeal to Groundspeak and make a stink but we felt it was not worth logging his caches because he put such inflamatory comments in notes as well.

The nerve to delete logs for simply having folks who were in the same car as the person who solved the puzzle deleted because they did not "solve" it.

Your post is fairly afield of the topic at hand, but since I'm relatively sure you're referring to my cache, I'll correct your exaggeration and omission of information: I did not "delete logs." I deleted one log - the first I can remember deleting in over 6 years of hiding caches. And, the log I deleted invited me to do so; I simply took its author up on that snide offer.

I'll be a minority voice here: I see a lot of opinion being offered as fact/official policy. And maybe these people are right, that you can successfully appeal a log deletion if you can demonstrate that you signed the physical log. However, I am the owner of the cache. It's never happened to me and so only theoretical, but if Groundspeak or any other listing service were ever to preclude/reverse my deletion of a log on a difficult puzzle because the finder clearly didn't solve that puzzle (but used the opportunity to leave a snide comment), the listing service would lose my free content. Maybe that sounds petty, but frankly, the satisfaction of coming up with a difficult puzzle is severely undermined if the listing service mandates that I allow a parade of non-solving tag-alongs to log the "find." I'm glad it hasn't come to that.

May 22, 2011

What exciting things do your add to TFTC on a mindless LP hide?

Well, you could say "quick and easy grab" or something like that, plus TFTC. I don't expect a story, but a few words are nice. When I do lame P&G's I will write more if it was difficult to get due to muggles or just something acknowledging the cache. It is nice to have feedback on my caches and when they don't say anything except TFTC I assume they don't like to write, have done too many caches to write more than one word, or are just in it for numbers. I am in it for the adventures and will leave more than one word, no matter how lame. But that's just me :rolleyes:

May 22, 2011

What exciting things do your add to TFTC on a mindless LP hide?

Well, you could say "quick and easy grab" or something like that, plus TFTC. I don't expect a story, but a few words are nice. When I do lame P&G's I will write more if it was difficult to get due to muggles or just something acknowledging the cache. It is nice to have feedback on my caches and when they don't say anything except TFTC I assume they don't like to write, have done too many caches to write more than one word, or are just in it for numbers. I am in it for the adventures and will leave more than one word, no matter how lame. But that's just me

I almost always write more than the one word - it is after all a 4 letter word. sometimes it's hard to be creative. :blink:

7.7k · May 22, 2011

This is a game. If you're hell-bent on controlling everybody else, you're really missing the point.

I agree. Maybe the Rapture has happened after all

As an amusing side note, I looked up Wikipedia for a less angsty alternative to "control freak". Among the list in "See also..." there's micromanagement and, to my amusement, "narcissism"

1.3k · May 22, 2011

The guidelines make no mention of it, at least that I could find, regarding the deletion of logs containing foul language, slurs, material of an adult nature, verbal abuse or any non-family friendly text. May a CO delete a log for this reason and expect it to be upheld by GS?

8.3k · May 22, 2011

The guidelines make no mention of it, at least that I could find, regarding the deletion of logs containing foul language, slurs, material of an adult nature, verbal abuse or any non-family friendly text. May a CO delete a log for this reason and expect it to be upheld by GS?

Yes. And logs that contain spoilers, especially for the higher difficulty caches. It probably is also a good idea to send the offending cacher a PM (via website, not direct mail) a note inviting them to relog but without the offending content.

From the log deletion knowledge books ...

Obscene and threatening language is a violation of our Terms of Use. The log can be deleted immediately. It may be better not to respond the log owner directly. If you wish, let Groundspeak know by submitting a request for assistance or emailing contact@geocaching.com.

Edited May 22, 2011 by jholly

May 22, 2011

If I get a blank log or TFTC, I usually write the person a nice email explaining that this is typically taboo. None of the people have ever fixed their logs or changed their behavior. A man can dream though!

7.4k · May 23, 2011

If I get a blank log or TFTC, I usually write the person a nice email explaining that this is typically taboo. None of the people have ever fixed their logs or changed their behavior. A man can dream though!

This kind of email is invasive and unnecessary, and far more egregious than a short log. Writing to people to chide them for violating your personal preferences is not "nice," regardless of how you word the missive.

Do cache owners have the right to delete logs if they don't like the log comment

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