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Garmin Montana

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NordicMan

NordicMan

Posted
Posted

Wow this is going to be confusing.. I thought this thread was about the Nuvi 295W, which according to WiFi ID, is also a Montana :huh:

 

I see no belt carry or lanyard carry attach points.

The thing is clearly designed to be handheld & for outdoor use, so most likely a lanyard & belt clip will be added to the accessories.

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eaparks

eaparks

Posted
Posted (edited)

Will be interesting to see how the screen's visibility is in the same lighting condition that is not favorable to the Oregons. Will have to be somewhat better due to the reduction in resolution, how much, yet to be determined.

Edited by eaparks
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yogazoo

yogazoo

Posted
Posted

At first blush I was thrown into a panic to unload my cadre of GPS units (450, 550, and 62) to pay for this baby. After calming down a bit I am a bit more reserved in doing so.

 

1) Bulky, the size and weight may not be the best option for backcountry wayfarers.

 

2) The street name audible is nice but you have to purchase the cradle for another $50. Given the already high pricepoint, this seems maybe a bit out of my gadget budget.

 

3) Probably would be a bit too heavy and mounting may be challenging on a bike handlebar.

 

For the first time in a long time, this is one early adopter who is going to wait for a few user reviews before considering a purchase. It may be the price, it may be the fact that sometimes the early productions from Garmin have minor flaws, or it could be that I already have a sufficient GPS lineup and this model doesn't really add anything for me except the bigger screen and a few menu navigation perks.

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northernpenguin

+northernpenguin

Posted
Posted

2) The street name audible is nice but you have to purchase the cradle for another $50. Given the already high pricepoint, this seems maybe a bit out of my gadget budget.

Doesn't the GPS have it's own 3.5mm headphone jack? <_<

 

From the Garmin Site:

 

If you are on foot, simply plug headphones into Montana’s 3.5mm audio jack to hear the spoken prompts.

 

So yeah plug in your own headphones or plug the AUX cable to your car stereo, or toss a $5 iPod speaker on the dash beside it.

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northernpenguin

+northernpenguin

Posted
Posted
... or plug the AUX cable to your car stereo ...

If I put mp3s on the SD card, will it play music when it isn't telling me where to go? :laughing:

 

Doubt it. At least, I have not seen that on the feature set.

Not sure I'd even want that given Garmin's track record on the "do everything" GPS units since the Colorado. When these things get (CPU) stressed they tend to stop worrying about an accurate position report. Hopefully the Montana is different in that regard.

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G & C

+G & C

Posted
Posted

. . . this is one early adopter who is going to wait for a few user reviews before considering a purchase.

 

No rush: it will take Garmin at least a year to get most of the bugs out of the firmware.

 

This is my line of thinking as well. Which works out well, because another year and a half or so, and I should be ready for a new GPS. We'll see how this one turns out, but I am awful pleased with my Oregon 550.

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yogazoo

yogazoo

Posted
Posted

On the YouTube video it looks extremely bulky. That or Franz has small hands.

 

Is this thing worth the price of 10 smartphones? I think Garmin has way overpriced this thing considering the features inside. For almost $700 ($300 more than an Orgeon 550 I think it's too much to warrant an upgrade. Especially in this crappy economy.

 

They could have added that menu thingy to the various screens on the Oregons years ago. Why didn't they? Because they left it to be desired on future units like this one. Kind of makes me mad but,oh well, I'm the sucker who keeps buying. Not this time.

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Red90

+Red90

Posted
Posted

On the YouTube video it looks extremely bulky. That or Franz has small hands.

 

Is this thing worth the price of 10 smartphones? I think Garmin has way overpriced this thing considering the features inside. For almost $700 ($300 more than an Orgeon 550 I think it's too much to warrant an upgrade.

 

550t MSRP = $600

650t MSRP = $700

 

You need to do better with your math.....

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yogazoo

yogazoo

Posted
Posted

On the YouTube video it looks extremely bulky. That or Franz has small hands.

 

Is this thing worth the price of 10 smartphones? I think Garmin has way overpriced this thing considering the features inside. For almost $700 ($300 more than an Orgeon 550 I think it's too much to warrant an upgrade.

 

550t MSRP = $600

650t MSRP = $700

 

You need to do better with your math.....

 

MSRP means nothing, it's arbitrary. What I can actually purchase something for however does.

You can get a 550 for $400 LINK:550T

 

You can pre-order a Montana 650 from Garmin for $630. (Or Amazon for $697 ???). I was looking at the Amazon price as a reference in my previous post. Sorry I offended your mathematical senseabilities. Either way it's alot more for most people deciding between an Oregon or a Montana.

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eaparks

eaparks

Posted
Posted (edited)

I was curious about screen resolution as compared to other Garmins and in case anyone else is interested in the comparisons I did, here is the information.

 

Montana: Screen Size 2" x 3.5"; Screen pixel size 480 x 272; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 18,651

Oregon: Screen Size 1.53" x 2.55"; Screen pixel size 240 x 400; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 24,615

Dakota: Screen Size 1.43" x 2.15"; Screen pixel size 160 x 240; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 12,508

62s: Screen Size 1.6" x 2.2"; Screen pixel size 160 x 240; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 10,909

Nuvi 500: Screen Size 2.8" x 2.1"; Screen pixel size 320 x 240; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 13,061

Nuvi 265W: Screen Size 3.81" x 2.25"; Screen pixel size 480 x 272; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 15,235

 

60CSx: Screen Size 1.5" x 2.2"; Screen pixel size 160 x 240; Pixels/Sq. in. (Pixel Density) 11,636

 

You would think Garmin would determine what pixel density is optimum for most all ease of viewing conditions and try to stay in the ballpark of those numbers. Plus it really has an affect with custom POI icons and custom waypoint symbols if you use the same pixel dimensions on a 60csx and Oregon. A symbol 24 x 24 pixels is not to large on the Oregon but on the 60CSx it covers up to much of the map, especially if you have several not to far apart.

 

edit: numbers were rounded in calculations

Edited by eaparks
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Red90

+Red90

Posted
Posted

MSRP means nothing, it's arbitrary.

 

It is a the only point of comparison before it is on sale. New units always retail high, so the MSRP is a better percentage comparison. You need to wait six months for the prices to settle to compare retail pricing.

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northernpenguin

+northernpenguin

Posted
Posted

Bulky I can live with. But I want that thing to run for the 16 promised hours without:

 

- Crashing

- Freezing

- White Screening

- Sending my tracklog out by 200 metres for 3 kilometers of hiking

 

- Whatever weird glitches /this/ unit creates for Garmin fans. I find it sad I can't rely on my Colorado 400t to give me a consistent tracklog on a 20km hike, sure as heck am not planning to spend more money than an unlocked iPhone 4 (which, oddly enough /can/ keep a consistent tracklog without above issues, just not for 16 hours).

 

Will hang onto my Colorado until this has been out for a year and then grab the Montana. It /does/ appeal to me the way the eXplorist XL did when it came out. Sometimes that bigger screen is worth it. Now if they /really/ want to get my attention, give this thing traffic as well.

 

At the MSRP I can run out get an older Oregon and a Nuvi and pay less overall.

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user13371

+user13371

Posted
Posted (edited)

Garmin says...

... one-of-a-kind dual battery system. You’ll have the option of using the rechargeable lithium-ion pack or traditional AA...

Really? One of a kind? DeLorme PN-series has had that option for a few years. So did Magellan with the eXplorist 400/500/600 series.

 

I also note that this thing is big and heavy -- at least compared to competing units. It should be possible to put a big, bright high-res screen into a small and rugged package. Even with an OtterBox and an extended battery, an iPhone would come in smaller and lighter than this.

Edited by Portland Cyclist
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Bullygoat29

+Bullygoat29

Posted
Posted (edited)

Garmin says...

... one-of-a-kind dual battery system. You'll have the option of using the rechargeable lithium-ion pack or traditional AA...

Really? One of a kind? DeLorme PN-series has had that option for a few years. So did Magellan with the eXplorist 400/500/600 series.

 

I also note that this thing is big and heavy -- at least compared to competing units. It should be possible to put a big, bright high-res screen into a small and rugged package. Even with an OtterBox and an extended battery, an iPhone would come in smaller and lighter than this.

 

I'm not going to argue the battrery point. However I will disagree with the big screen in a small package.

 

Oregon 550

Unit dimensions, WxHxD:2.3" x 4.5" x 1.4" (5.8 x 11.4 x 3.5 cm)

Display size, WxH:1.53"W x 2.55"H (3.8 x 6.3 cm); 3" diag (7.6 cm)

Montana 650

Unit dimensions, WxHxD:2.9" x 5.7" x 1.4" (7.48 x 14.42 x 3.64 cm)

Display size, WxH:2"W x 3.5"H (5.06 x 8.93 cm); 4" diag (10.2 cm)

As you can see from Garmin's site, the Montana is only .6" wider, 1.2" longer and the same thickness. The display width of the Montana is almost as wide as the Oregon case.

What I like most about the Montana is it's basically an Oregon with a larger screen and a Nuvi built in. Granted it's going to sell for list price for the first couple of months but you compare the Oregon list price and a decent Nuvi and you're over the cost of the Montana. Just wait a few months and I can see it being a very popular item.

Edited by bullygoat29
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user13371

+user13371

Posted
Posted (edited)
However I will disagree with the big screen in a small package.

Go look at iPhone 4 specs: 3.5" diagonal screen with 960*640 pixels; 2.31", 4.5", 0.37" - 4.8 ounces

 

As soon as I say "iPhone" I can hear someone arguing "Oh, but the Garmin is a REAL gps" -- but I'm pointing to this purely as proof of what can be done in a small package. Roughly the same size screen diagonally but MUCH higher resolution, arguably a lot more computing power overall, and only about 1/3 as thick and less than 1/2 the weight as the Montana. There might be lack of incentive to do it, but from the technical side I'm pretty sure Garmin (or DeLorme, or Magellan, or Lowrance, etc...) could build something smaller. Even doubling or tripling the size of an iPhone battery and adding a millimeter of plastic all around for waterproofing and ruggedness would not add up to the bulk of the Oregons and Montanas.

 

On the other hand -- I'd like to see the innards of the Montana and see what kind of antenna it has, and/or if there's a lot of empty space for floatation.

Edited by Portland Cyclist
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MtnHermit

MtnHermit

Posted
Posted
As soon as I say "iPhone" I can hear someone arguing "Oh, but the Garmin is a REAL gps" -- but I'm pointing to this purely as proof of what can be done in a small package. Roughly the same size screen diagonally but MUCH higher resolution, arguably a lot more computing power overall, and only about 1/3 as thick and less than 1/2 the weight as the Montana. There might be lack of incentive to do it, but from the technical side I'm pretty sure Garmin (or DeLorme, or Magellan, or Lowrance, etc...) could build something smaller. Even doubling or tripling the size of an iPhone battery and adding a millimeter of plastic all around for waterproofing and ruggedness would not add up to the bulk of the Oregons and Montanas.
Garmin ( well Asus) already has, the Nuvifone met all your criteria. I have a Nuvi 295W, Nuvifone w/o cell, and I have to agree it is indeed a delightful form factor.

 

Perhaps the lack of phone company subsidy is what is holding back smaller GPS units. My take on the Montana is way too big and expensive. But I've concluded that I'm not the typical buyer, so time will tell.

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Bullygoat29

+Bullygoat29

Posted
Posted
However I will disagree with the big screen in a small package.

Go look at iPhone 4 specs: 3.5" diagonal screen with 960*640 pixels; 2.31", 4.5", 0.37" - 4.8 ounces

 

As soon as I say "iPhone" I can hear someone arguing "Oh, but the Garmin is a REAL gps" -- but I'm pointing to this purely as proof of what can be done in a small package. Roughly the same size screen diagonally but MUCH higher resolution, arguably a lot more computing power overall, and only about 1/3 as thick and less than 1/2 the weight as the Montana. There might be lack of incentive to do it, but from the technical side I'm pretty sure Garmin (or DeLorme, or Magellan, or Lowrance, etc...) could build something smaller. Even doubling or tripling the size of an iPhone battery and adding a millimeter of plastic all around for waterproofing and ruggedness would not add up to the bulk of the Oregons and Montanas.

 

On the other hand -- I'd like to see the innards of the Montana and see what kind of antenna it has, and/or if there's a lot of empty space for floatation.

 

You're absolutely right. You can get a larger screen in a small package. But you don't get the battery life and ruggedness in a package the size of the iPhone 4. 1 mm of plastics isn't going to give any impact resistance. You need an air gap between the housing and electronics for the housing to deflect and not damage anything internally. You also can't get good battery life from a thin package. For an iPhone type device, you'd need it atleast twice as thick to get the kind of battery life you get from a dedicated unit, it may even need to be three times as thick. You also can't get a good sunlight readable display as thin as an iPhone display. The second sunlight hits my iPhone display, it washes it out. Even in bright ambient sunlight, it can be difficult to read.

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Chrysalides

+Chrysalides

Posted
Posted (edited)
What I like most about the Montana is it's basically an Oregon with a larger screen and a Nuvi built in. Granted it's going to sell for list price for the first couple of months but you compare the Oregon list price and a decent Nuvi and you're over the cost of the Montana. Just wait a few months and I can see it being a very popular item.

You forgot to add the cost of City Navigator to the Montana.

 

Edit : I hate it when some font tags is not closed properly, and it messes up every post after that. Can you (or a mod) edit your post to fix that?

 

Edit2 : Sorry, don't think it is your fault. I think it is the sigline of GOT GPS that did it.

Edited by Chrysalides
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dfx

+dfx

Posted
Posted
You're absolutely right. You can get a larger screen in a small package. But you don't get the battery life and ruggedness in a package the size of the iPhone 4. 1 mm of plastics isn't going to give any impact resistance. You need an air gap between the housing and electronics for the housing to deflect and not damage anything internally. You also can't get good battery life from a thin package. For an iPhone type device, you'd need it atleast twice as thick to get the kind of battery life you get from a dedicated unit, it may even need to be three times as thick. You also can't get a good sunlight readable display as thin as an iPhone display. The second sunlight hits my iPhone display, it washes it out. Even in bright ambient sunlight, it can be difficult to read.

 

And that doesn't even mention the biggest difference, which is entirely size dependent: bigger and better antenna!

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dfx

+dfx

Posted
Posted
Edit : I hate it when some font tags is not closed properly, and it messes up every post after that. Can you (or a mod) edit your post to fix that?

 

Actually, it's "GOT GPS?"'s signature that's causing this.

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FCStech

+FCStech

Posted
Posted

I am a bit confused. Or is it just how they are marketing this new product. It is suppossed to be an all around gps. Hiking, geocaching and car. To do all that you must add city navigator maps and a special cradle. Adding an extra $150-250 to an alredy expensive toy. Is this just an expensive way to add sound and screen size to an Oregon or is there more I am missing? :lostsignal:

 

Does this mean that next month I can pick up an Oregon 450 for $200?

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Grasscatcher

Grasscatcher

Posted
Posted

To help put things in perspective....with all the empty "complaints" about size and weight....

 

60--2.4 X 6.1 X 1.3--7.5 oz

 

Mont--2.9 X 5.7 X 1.4-- 10.2oz LI vs 11.7oz AA

 

The Montana is still shorter than the prohibitive "Past Favorite" 60 series, 1/2" wider and 1/10" thicker and as far as weight for carrying while hiking.....you could lose 10X the weight differential in the area immediately behind your belt buckle and be way ahead net weight wise.

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user13371

+user13371

Posted
Posted (edited)
...doesn't even mention the biggest difference, which is entirely size dependent: bigger and better antenna!

Actually, I did allude to that in an earlier post. If this thing has a similar coil as the 62 and similar models, that would be a good use of the size. But big patch antenna should not add ounces and inches to the size.

Edited by Portland Cyclist
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ecanderson

+ecanderson

Posted
Posted (edited)

Actually, I did allude to that in an earlier post. If this thing has a similar coil as the 62 and similar models, that would be a good use of the size. A big patch antenna though should not add ounces and inches to the size though.

FWIW, there's not empty space inside for 'floatation'. If you believe the Garmin specs, this one won't float. Edited by ecanderson
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user13371

+user13371

Posted
Posted (edited)
... 1 mm of plastics isn't going to give any impact resistance. You need an air gap between the housing and electronics for the housing to deflect and not damage anything internally.

I'm gonna disgree with that blanket statement. I can point to examples of iPhones surviving being run over by 18-wheelers and dropped out of airplanes. It is possible to build a small and rugged device without a crush zone.

 

For an iPhone type device, you'd need it at least twice as thick to get the kind of battery life you get from a dedicated unit, it may even need to be three times as thick.

These assertions are also suspect. Turning off every feature that I *can* turn off, I can still get 10 hours of tracking time out of my iPhone 4 -- and there's a lot of stuff that I can't turn off that still draws power. A dedicated GPS without the rest of the iPhone's computing features should be less power hungry. And there are already on the market bumper style cases that more than double the iPhone 4's battery, with far less than extra bulk than you're suggesting.

 

You also can't get a good sunlight readable display as thin as an iPhone display.
I'm not sure why you're equating thinness to screen readability, but...
The second sunlight hits my iPhone display, it washes it out. Even in bright ambient sunlight, it can be difficult to read.
...I don't have that problem with mine; but this is very subjective. I'd hate to use my iPhone OR any Garmin touchscreen I've seen on a fixed mount (as on my bike), but handheld where you're always able to adjust the viewing angle this becomes a non-issue. That said, I haven't handled the Montana yet -- I wouldn't be able to express an opinion on its screen until I see one. Edited by Portland Cyclist
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