Is Geocaching going too mainstream for you?

[+sword fern]

Sorry, I forgot to explain for those who don't speak the language.

 

I'M afraid it will bring too much cut N paste logging.

 

that's a language?...i thought you fell asleep and hit your head on the keyboard

 

What he did is put the first letter of every word into a "word".

[+spdrbob]

Please stop the iPhone , smart phone bashing. There will crappy gps cachers and crappy smart phone cachers. It not about the mechanism you use to cache it about the cacher they are. The new smart phones are just as acurate as a gps.

[+sword fern]

Please stop the iPhone , smart phone bashing. There will crappy gps cachers and crappy smart phone cachers. It not about the mechanism you use to cache it about the cacher they are. The new smart phones are just as acurate as a gps.

 

Crappy? is that how some cachers are called?

[+spdrbob]

Ah not by me but yes. There's definite bias that is seen by reading the forums, among cachers and different users of various gps devices.

[+sword fern]

Ah not by me but yes. There's definite bias that is seen by reading the forums, among cachers and different users of various gps devices.

 

Am I crappy?

[+Stoka]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

[+sword fern]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

 

Edit

Edited May 7, 2011 by sword fern

[+BlueDeuce]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

 

Many of us consider geocaching as a community sport. Placing a cache is to share in the experience. If we didn't, why would we bother? Granted not everyone wants to share their experience and that's okay, but when it becomes a finders market the placers are going to ask these questions.

 

Got an answer as to why we should hide these caches?

[+BlueDeuce]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

 

Typing excercises the fingers....

 

However that's a good question. I'm not pointing fingers but I know a handful of people who have WAy mpre forum posts thatn geocache finds under a certain number. I will join the clan one day.

 

And that makes you a better cacher than me?

[+sword fern]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

 

Typing excercises the fingers....

 

However that's a good question. I'm not pointing fingers but I know a handful of people who have WAy mpre forum posts thatn geocache finds under a certain number. I will join the clan one day.

 

And that makes you a better cacher than me?

 

What?!? No! I never said that!

Edited May 7, 2011 by sword fern

[+spdrbob]

Ah not by me but yes. There's definite bias that is seen by reading the forums, among cachers and different users of various gps devices.

 

I don't judge , are you ?

 

Am I crappy?

[+Snoogans]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

 

GOSH I love irony!

[+Panther&Pine]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

 

GOSH I love irony!

I can type during work (I work in dbs design and management) but caching doesn't really work. And year round caching in the mountains of Colorado is a bit difficult.

[Mr.Yuck]

Please stop the iPhone , smart phone bashing. There will crappy gps cachers and crappy smart phone cachers. It not about the mechanism you use to cache it about the cacher they are. The new smart phones are just as acurate as a gps.

 

Correct. A wise man once said (I think it was Sol Seaker) it's not Geocaching with smartphones, it's logging with them.

 

By the way, the Iphone sucks. Just in general, nothing to do with Geocaching.

[+Snoogans]

By the way, the Iphone sucks. Just in general, nothing to do with Geocaching.

 

I have the bottom of the line Iphone. The only thing it's good for when it comes to caching is paperless caching. My usual error is about 200 to 300 feet. Useless for finding caches, but good for looking at recent logs, and hints..

Edited May 8, 2011 by Snoogans

[+StarBrand]

Who gives one? Why are you people spending your time typing rather than caching, I thought that's what we are here for?

Because I have had a serious leg infection that limits my outdoors time and activity. So I help in the forums as best as I can.

[knowschad]

Holy cow!! Would you just look at those tracks!!

 

[+Snoogans]

Holy cow!! Would you just look at those tracks!!

 

 

Rather than just pointing a problem out... How 'bout you help get it back on the tracks.

 

You never responded to this:

 

A verrry valid point. I expect those that can't roll with the changes will be left behind.

I'm not sure that "left behind" is quite the right phrase, however. "will turn away" may be more like it.

I guess to the person who is so wrapped up in their personal aesthetic of what geocaching is supposed to be, it would seem like that.

 

It reminds me of freshman romance. Two freshman knock about and find mutual feelings for one another... But the more mature counterpart (usually the female) seeks out company more on their level of maturity and spends less and less time with the less mature suitor. The suitor "will turn away" in a face saving response. (Or turn into a weirdo stalker.)

 

Geocaching, plain and simple, is hide and seek. Hide and seek is a primal game. It was most likely the very first game ever played. It prepared stone age chinlren for a life of hunting and gathering. We are just playing the space age version of it.

 

Many of us connect to geocaching at that fundamental primal level. It's evident on these forums. Look at the first few pages of top posters and see when they joined. There has to be a reason that they didn't burn out.

 

SO, if one boils down the activity to hide and seek, and accepts it at face value, and also accepts the consequences of the choices they make in regards to how they spend their free time, it becomes very hard to be left behind as the game evolves. Caches are choices regardless of all the gloom and doom over bad caches, abandoned caches, etc. Choices are good. Give me MORE. I'm not the OC type that has to find them all and takes offense when I let myself be lead to a cache/location that doesn't exactly blow my skirt over my head. It was still MY choice.

 

If you're not havin' fun with your choice of activity in your most valuable free time... You're doin' it wrong.

[knowschad]

Holy cow!! Would you just look at those tracks!!

 

 

Rather than just pointing a problem out... How 'bout you help get it back on the tracks.

 

You never responded to this:

 

A verrry valid point. I expect those that can't roll with the changes will be left behind.

I'm not sure that "left behind" is quite the right phrase, however. "will turn away" may be more like it.

I guess to the person who is so wrapped up in their personal aesthetic of what geocaching is supposed to be, it would seem like that.

 

It reminds me of freshman romance. Two freshman knock about and find mutual feelings for one another... But the more mature counterpart (usually the female) seeks out company more on their level of maturity and spends less and less time with the less mature suitor. The suitor "will turn away" in a face saving response. (Or turn into a weirdo stalker.)

 

Geocaching, plain and simple, is hide and seek. Hide and seek is a primal game. It was most likely the very first game ever played. It prepared stone age chinlren for a life of hunting and gathering. We are just playing the space age version of it.

 

Many of us connect to geocaching at that fundamental primal level. It's evident on these forums. Look at the first few pages of top posters and see when they joined. There has to be a reason that they didn't burn out.

 

SO, if one boils down the activity to hide and seek, and accepts it at face value, and also accepts the consequences of the choices they make in regards to how they spend their free time, it becomes very hard to be left behind as the game evolves. Caches are choices regardless of all the gloom and doom over bad caches, abandoned caches, etc. Choices are good. Give me MORE. I'm not the OC type that has to find them all and takes offense when I let myself be lead to a cache/location that doesn't exactly blow my skirt over my head. It was still MY choice.

 

If you're not havin' fun with your choice of activity in your most valuable free time... You're doin' it wrong.

I've got no response for that, which is why I didn't respond. I spoke my piece earlier and have nothing more to add to that.

[+Snoogans]

Holy cow!! Would you just look at those tracks!!

 

 

Rather than just pointing a problem out... How 'bout you help get it back on the tracks.

 

You never responded to this:

 

A verrry valid point. I expect those that can't roll with the changes will be left behind.

I'm not sure that "left behind" is quite the right phrase, however. "will turn away" may be more like it.

I guess to the person who is so wrapped up in their personal aesthetic of what geocaching is supposed to be, it would seem like that.

 

It reminds me of freshman romance. Two freshman knock about and find mutual feelings for one another... But the more mature counterpart (usually the female) seeks out company more on their level of maturity and spends less and less time with the less mature suitor. The suitor "will turn away" in a face saving response. (Or turn into a weirdo stalker.)

 

Geocaching, plain and simple, is hide and seek. Hide and seek is a primal game. It was most likely the very first game ever played. It prepared stone age chinlren for a life of hunting and gathering. We are just playing the space age version of it.

 

Many of us connect to geocaching at that fundamental primal level. It's evident on these forums. Look at the first few pages of top posters and see when they joined. There has to be a reason that they didn't burn out.

 

SO, if one boils down the activity to hide and seek, and accepts it at face value, and also accepts the consequences of the choices they make in regards to how they spend their free time, it becomes very hard to be left behind as the game evolves. Caches are choices regardless of all the gloom and doom over bad caches, abandoned caches, etc. Choices are good. Give me MORE. I'm not the OC type that has to find them all and takes offense when I let myself be lead to a cache/location that doesn't exactly blow my skirt over my head. It was still MY choice.

 

If you're not havin' fun with your choice of activity in your most valuable free time... You're doin' it wrong.

I've got no response for that, which is why I didn't respond. I spoke my piece earlier and have nothing more to add to that.

 

ooooOOOooohhh,

[+TL&MinBHIL]

Correct. A wise man once said (I think it was Sol Seaker) it's not Geocaching with smartphones, it's logging with them.

 

By the way, the Iphone sucks. Just in general, nothing to do with Geocaching.

But what's wrong with logging with them? Other than the fact that smartphone users take the heat for short or blank logs, but that's not the phone's fault, it's the cacher's. In defense of smartphone logs, my logs would be the same whether I did it from my phone or computer. And I'll have to respectfully disagree with you about the "iPhone sucks" comment.

 

I have the bottom of the line Iphone. The only thing it's good for when it comes to caching is paperless caching. My usual error is about 200 to 300 feet. Useless for finding caches, but good for looking at recent logs, and hints..

I use the iPhone 4. That's all I have to cache with. It's accuracy is much MUCH better than 200-300 feet, so maybe it's just the older iPhone that's at fault. Most of the time it can get me within 10 feet or less, 20 on a bad day and maybe a little more in heavily wooded areas.

[+BCandMsKitty]

Do you think the fact that Geocaching is moving into mainstream culture is good or bad for the hobby? What are your thoughts?

 

yes

[+dirt_empire]

Consider it like one considers the recent history of comics. Sure, about a decade ago people knew about comics and sometimes they'd see a movie based on Batman or Superman. You'd watch Saturday morning cartoons and see the JLA or whoever on their latest adventure. Then, within the past 5 years, there was an "explosion" of interest in comics; movies, games, mainstream tie-ins. Now everybody knows about comics to a larger degree and they're "huge fans", they even have a Wolverine tshirt from Hot Topic! Regardless, they don't put in the effort to read the weekly serials, check up the news in their local shop, or really put forth any effort like a huge, praticing fan would. It's a cool thing to do on occasion, and yeah they've got a few trade paper comic collection, but they won't do it forever and will eventually forget about it, fading into the next fad.

 

That's geocaching to the mainstream. Yeah, maybe there will be an influx of bad caches and one-hit-wonder cachers, but realistically there will be no damage. Some TB's and Gc's will go missing along with their associated caches, and we, the community, will get pissed off at the newbies in our midst. It is the hazard of having a hobby that isn't too far from the mainstream anyways. Geocaching isn't anonymous, isn't hard to do, and isn't as secret as we'd like to think it is. Plenty of people know about it, they just don't know it's proper name ("Hey, what's the guy who had really sharp claws and constantly fought with Hugh Jackman in Wolverine? Oh yeah, he was Bobcat! That's his name for sure.") It catches on every so often and will get mentioned in the media, happening more so in local news and papers than nationally.

 

As for an honest judgement of good or bad, there really isn't one. Like I said, stuff will go missing and the community as a whole will get miffed. We'll move on, place new caches, and hopefully gain a few true-blue converts out of the whole experience. It all balances out, though if you want to really do something to combat the influx of "bad cachers" you should take it as an exercise to do better hides and find better containers.

 

Hope this helped somewhat.

[+nittanycopa]

Correct. A wise man once said (I think it was Sol Seaker) it's not Geocaching with smartphones, it's logging with them.

 

By the way, the Iphone sucks. Just in general, nothing to do with Geocaching.

But what's wrong with logging with them? Other than the fact that smartphone users take the heat for short or blank logs, but that's not the phone's fault, it's the cacher's. In defense of smartphone logs, my logs would be the same whether I did it from my phone or computer. And I'll have to respectfully disagree with you about the "iPhone sucks" comment.

 

I have the bottom of the line Iphone. The only thing it's good for when it comes to caching is paperless caching. My usual error is about 200 to 300 feet. Useless for finding caches, but good for looking at recent logs, and hints..

I use the iPhone 4. That's all I have to cache with. It's accuracy is much MUCH better than 200-300 feet, so maybe it's just the older iPhone that's at fault. Most of the time it can get me within 10 feet or less, 20 on a bad day and maybe a little more in heavily wooded areas.

 

Know what, it's people in the forums that have a proverbial stick up their you know what about iPhones. Cache with it, enjoy it, hide with it - you'll get feedback if your coordinates aren't correct. I guess it's the same as finding caches with an iPhone, if it's so terrible, how can one rack up several hundred finds with one? Oh, the horror. Ah, but wait I also have an eTrex HC (that I use infrequently), so that makes me okay.

 

Anyway...

 

I'm a new cacher but will say I've tried to learn etiquette and have caught on quickly that just because an area is cache-less doesn't mean it needs to have a quick cache placed. I have one cache placed in a calm office park overlooking a pond (usually filled with ducks, nice lunch time walk), one placed on an outdoor handball wall in a park that sees very few visits, and another on a bridge that was simply thrown down in the middle of a field that doesn't lead anywhere. I like peculiar things like that that make you say - hmm, wonder what the purpose was? My first hides were pretty simple, but as I grow in the hobby, I am coming up with considerably more creative or difficult ideas. I think the whole hobby is a learning curve. There are new cachers that stay with the hobby, grow, and learn (like myself) and there's others that just fizzle out.

 

As for an influx of new people - my boyfriend and I have taken a handful of our non-caching friends caching and none of them have caught onto the hobby. I think one of our friends thought it was boring and the others were indifferent. So I'm not sure about that "influx" thing. I have noticed a lot of new cachers in my area are family teams - many found it as a means of something to do as a family. Me, personally, I think that's pretty awesome.

[+Snoogans]

I have the bottom of the line Iphone. The only thing it's good for when it comes to caching is paperless caching. My usual error is about 200 to 300 feet. Useless for finding caches, but good for looking at recent logs, and hints..

I use the iPhone 4. That's all I have to cache with. It's accuracy is much MUCH better than 200-300 feet, so maybe it's just the older iPhone that's at fault. Most of the time it can get me within 10 feet or less, 20 on a bad day and maybe a little more in heavily wooded areas.

 

I'm upgrading in October. That's good to know. I like the GC iPhone app., but I rely more on geomate and when I have time to plan a cachin' outing I rely on my 60CSX.

 

However, most of my cachin' activity of late has been spur of the moment to kill time on the way too or from somewhere or while I'm on a business trip. A more accurate iPhone will greatly enhance my convenience factor for caching.

Edited May 9, 2011 by Snoogans

[+Scubasonic]

I have the bottom of the line Iphone. The only thing it's good for when it comes to caching is paperless caching. My usual error is about 200 to 300 feet. Useless for finding caches, but good for looking at recent logs, and hints..

I use the iPhone 4. That's all I have to cache with. It's accuracy is much MUCH better than 200-300 feet, so maybe it's just the older iPhone that's at fault. Most of the time it can get me within 10 feet or less, 20 on a bad day and maybe a little more in heavily wooded areas.

 

I'm upgrading in October. That's good to know. I like the GC iPhone app., but I rely more on geomate and when I have time to plan a cachin' outing I rely on my 60CSX.

 

However, most of my cachin' activity of late has been spur of the moment to kill time on the way too or from somewhere or while I'm on a business trip. A more accurate iPhone will greatly enhance my convenience factor for caching.

 

I have the iPhone 4 and iPad and find them to be very accurate, however that being said I still use the Handheld Garmin for serious day caching.

 

Scubasonic

[+NYPaddleCacher]

Consider it like one considers the recent history of comics. Sure, about a decade ago people knew about comics and sometimes they'd see a movie based on Batman or Superman. You'd watch Saturday morning cartoons and see the JLA or whoever on their latest adventure. Then, within the past 5 years, there was an "explosion" of interest in comics; movies, games, mainstream tie-ins. Now everybody knows about comics to a larger degree and they're "huge fans", they even have a Wolverine tshirt from Hot Topic! Regardless, they don't put in the effort to read the weekly serials, check up the news in their local shop, or really put forth any effort like a huge, praticing fan would. It's a cool thing to do on occasion, and yeah they've got a few trade paper comic collection, but they won't do it forever and will eventually forget about it, fading into the next fad.

 

I'm not seeing what the problem is here. How is the explosion of interest by casual fans (rather than huge, practicing fans) negatively impacting the hobby. It's sounds a bit elitist to me, as if those "huge practicing fans" are thumbing their noses at those that only have a casual interest as if they're "not real fans".

 

I see mainstreaming in geocaching more like how flyfishing became mainstream. For many years, flyfishing was fairly uncommon but also had it's share of "huge, practicing fans". There were a few clubs around and pockets of areas where flyfishing was more commonplace where one could learn from others, but for the most part many flyfishers were self taught in how to cast, learning about read streams, about etymology, how to tie flies, etc. Then "the movie" came out (A River Runs Through It) and it began to get more popular. That popularity created a opportunity for commercialism. Now many of those rivers and streams that were considered flyfishing meccas (Montana, Catskills, etc) are overrun with guides for hire, which, for a price, someone can buy the knowledge that the old diehards spent years acquiring. It used to be that one could find a potential trout stream on a map, knock on the door of the property owner to ask permission to fish it (and drop off a few trout for dinner on the way out), and you'd have some prime fishing streams all to yourself. Now, many of those areas are shoulder to shoulder in public access areas, and if you want to fish a less crowded stream you've got to spend hundreds of dollars to access a "flyfishing camp". That commercialization has driven up the cost of flyfishing, and access to good trout streams beyond the budget of many a die hard flyfisherman.

 

Some will just say geocaching is changing, but, IMHO, not all change is good. I've seen "change" in other hobbies/sports in which I've participated to see how it can negatively impact the enjoyment for those that were in it before it became mainstream.

[+Team GPSaxophone]

I'm indifferent. There is a fundamental appeal, to me, for caching. I have been a cacher for 40 years. Geocaching was a logical choice for a fun activity, for me.

 

How is it possible that you've been a cacher for 40 years?

Dog years.

[+Snoogans]

I'm indifferent. There is a fundamental appeal, to me, for caching. I have been a cacher for 40 years. Geocaching was a logical choice for a fun activity, for me.

 

How is it possible that you've been a cacher for 40 years?

Dog years.

 

That would make me 308yo.

[+JL_HSTRE]

iPhones are catching up on accuracy (they have proper GPS recievers now) so as the older models go out of use the old serious inaccuracy issues will go away, though how long it takes to purge the stigma from the geocaching community may be another matter. But really that's the topic of an iPhone thread.

 

Regarding the main topic of geocaching going mainstream...

 

To some extent, geocaching being more mainstream is good. Getting permission is easier, friends/family/cops understanding what you're doing is easier, etc. The awareness is mostly a positive thing.

 

While I think the popularity and especially the awareness of the hobby will grow over time, the nature of the hobby will prevent it from every truly going mainstream. I think it just doesn't have much appeal and especially not much lasting appeal to the average person.

 

I'm a recent geocacher (Jan 2010) and I didn't get into geocaching because of any thoughts on its mainstream nor obscure/nitch/whatever nature. It has an appeal to me because of what it is. I've learned what kinds of caches and locations generally appeal to me so I can fairly effectively filter out the ones that don't. I know there are many other cachers out there who like the same kinds of caches I do and thus place what I want to find where I want to find it. At this point, I don't see why those things would change.

Edited May 9, 2011 by Joshism

[knowschad]

I see mainstreaming in geocaching more like how flyfishing became mainstream. For many years, flyfishing was fairly uncommon but also had it's share of "huge, practicing fans". There were a few clubs around and pockets of areas where flyfishing was more commonplace where one could learn from others, but for the most part many flyfishers were self taught in how to cast, learning about read streams, about etymology, how to tie flies, etc. Then "the movie" came out (A River Runs Through It) and it began to get more popular. That popularity created a opportunity for commercialism. Now many of those rivers and streams that were considered flyfishing meccas (Montana, Catskills, etc) are overrun with guides for hire, which, for a price, someone can buy the knowledge that the old diehards spent years acquiring. It used to be that one could find a potential trout stream on a map, knock on the door of the property owner to ask permission to fish it (and drop off a few trout for dinner on the way out), and you'd have some prime fishing streams all to yourself. Now, many of those areas are shoulder to shoulder in public access areas, and if you want to fish a less crowded stream you've got to spend hundreds of dollars to access a "flyfishing camp". That commercialization has driven up the cost of flyfishing, and access to good trout streams beyond the budget of many a die hard flyfisherman.

 

Some will just say geocaching is changing, but, IMHO, not all change is good. I've seen "change" in other hobbies/sports in which I've participated to see how it can negatively impact the enjoyment for those that were in it before it became mainstream.

 

As a flyfisherman that is still waiting for that stream of popularity to go down before going back into the water, I can 100% relate to your use of flyfishing as an example!

[+dirt_empire]

Consider it like one considers the recent history of comics. Sure, about a decade ago people knew about comics and sometimes they'd see a movie based on Batman or Superman. You'd watch Saturday morning cartoons and see the JLA or whoever on their latest adventure. Then, within the past 5 years, there was an "explosion" of interest in comics; movies, games, mainstream tie-ins. Now everybody knows about comics to a larger degree and they're "huge fans", they even have a Wolverine tshirt from Hot Topic! Regardless, they don't put in the effort to read the weekly serials, check up the news in their local shop, or really put forth any effort like a huge, praticing fan would. It's a cool thing to do on occasion, and yeah they've got a few trade paper comic collection, but they won't do it forever and will eventually forget about it, fading into the next fad.

 

I'm not seeing what the problem is here. How is the explosion of interest by casual fans (rather than huge, practicing fans) negatively impacting the hobby. It's sounds a bit elitist to me, as if those "huge practicing fans" are thumbing their noses at those that only have a casual interest as if they're "not real fans".

 

I see mainstreaming in geocaching more like how flyfishing became mainstream. For many years, flyfishing was fairly uncommon but also had it's share of "huge, practicing fans". There were a few clubs around and pockets of areas where flyfishing was more commonplace where one could learn from others, but for the most part many flyfishers were self taught in how to cast, learning about read streams, about etymology, how to tie flies, etc. Then "the movie" came out (A River Runs Through It) and it began to get more popular. That popularity created a opportunity for commercialism. Now many of those rivers and streams that were considered flyfishing meccas (Montana, Catskills, etc) are overrun with guides for hire, which, for a price, someone can buy the knowledge that the old diehards spent years acquiring. It used to be that one could find a potential trout stream on a map, knock on the door of the property owner to ask permission to fish it (and drop off a few trout for dinner on the way out), and you'd have some prime fishing streams all to yourself. Now, many of those areas are shoulder to shoulder in public access areas, and if you want to fish a less crowded stream you've got to spend hundreds of dollars to access a "flyfishing camp". That commercialization has driven up the cost of flyfishing, and access to good trout streams beyond the budget of many a die hard flyfisherman.

 

Some will just say geocaching is changing, but, IMHO, not all change is good. I've seen "change" in other hobbies/sports in which I've participated to see how it can negatively impact the enjoyment for those that were in it before it became mainstream.

 

I don't see my comment as elitist at all. Casual fans have their place as well, but I was just making a point. (If anything you seem to be elitist in your flyfishing hobby. So once hidden spots are overrun with casual fishers, move on and find the next great spot.) Fans are fans, and you have die-hard or casual. Casual fans will not follow as close to the rules as a die-hard (no food, be sneaky, don't "collect" TB/GC's, etc.). More so, I was just trying to give my view of what would happen if Geocaching became "mainstream." It'll suck and it'll be good. People will enjoy and lament other new players. Geocaching is a microcosm (like most things formed on the internet) of a society's inherent want to be exclusive. Geocachers want to be hidden and sneaky, to know that there is treasure 5 feet from a major foot-traffic area. We'll get over it. We'll find new and better hides. We will cull the weak from the sport, leaving it better in the wake.

 

TLDR: Get over it. It's not a pay service so lots of people play it. Not all of those people are what YOU would consider good or are playing the game you want them to. We are an oddity in the ways of outdoor hobbies. People are curious about us.

[+Snoogans]

I see mainstreaming in geocaching more like how flyfishing became mainstream. For many years, flyfishing was fairly uncommon but also had it's share of "huge, practicing fans". There were a few clubs around and pockets of areas where flyfishing was more commonplace where one could learn from others, but for the most part many flyfishers were self taught in how to cast, learning about read streams, about etymology, how to tie flies, etc. Then "the movie" came out (A River Runs Through It) and it began to get more popular. That popularity created a opportunity for commercialism. Now many of those rivers and streams that were considered flyfishing meccas (Montana, Catskills, etc) are overrun with guides for hire, which, for a price, someone can buy the knowledge that the old diehards spent years acquiring. It used to be that one could find a potential trout stream on a map, knock on the door of the property owner to ask permission to fish it (and drop off a few trout for dinner on the way out), and you'd have some prime fishing streams all to yourself. Now, many of those areas are shoulder to shoulder in public access areas, and if you want to fish a less crowded stream you've got to spend hundreds of dollars to access a "flyfishing camp". That commercialization has driven up the cost of flyfishing, and access to good trout streams beyond the budget of many a die hard flyfisherman.

 

Some will just say geocaching is changing, but, IMHO, not all change is good. I've seen "change" in other hobbies/sports in which I've participated to see how it can negatively impact the enjoyment for those that were in it before it became mainstream.

 

As a flyfisherman that is still waiting for that stream of popularity to go down before going back into the water, I can 100% relate to your use of flyfishing as an example!

 

For about an hour I watched a couple guys flyfish the San Joaquin, above Rainbow Falls, in Devil's Postpile N.M., in 1989, and said to myself "I GOTTA TRY THAT."

 

I've been flyfishing since 1990. That's PRE- Craig Sheffer, Brad Pitt, and Tom Skerritt influence. It cost me over $300 to get set up decently at the time. What does it cost today?

 

My perspective: You guys are fishing on the wrong coast or you're not putting the effort in to find a spot within your comfort zones. Flyfishermen are still few and far between in the Sierras. Of course, I don't go to the places tourists go for the most part so your mileage may vary. I also don't flyfish much. Mayyyyybe once every 3 or 4 years, but I tend to gravitate to running water anyway even when I'm not fishing.

 

Geocaching as with flyfishing is what you make of it. It just takes a little MORE effort to find your comfort zone. I can't think of a better sport to compare right now.

Edited May 10, 2011 by Snoogans

[knowschad]

I see mainstreaming in geocaching more like how flyfishing became mainstream. For many years, flyfishing was fairly uncommon but also had it's share of "huge, practicing fans". There were a few clubs around and pockets of areas where flyfishing was more commonplace where one could learn from others, but for the most part many flyfishers were self taught in how to cast, learning about read streams, about etymology, how to tie flies, etc. Then "the movie" came out (A River Runs Through It) and it began to get more popular. That popularity created a opportunity for commercialism. Now many of those rivers and streams that were considered flyfishing meccas (Montana, Catskills, etc) are overrun with guides for hire, which, for a price, someone can buy the knowledge that the old diehards spent years acquiring. It used to be that one could find a potential trout stream on a map, knock on the door of the property owner to ask permission to fish it (and drop off a few trout for dinner on the way out), and you'd have some prime fishing streams all to yourself. Now, many of those areas are shoulder to shoulder in public access areas, and if you want to fish a less crowded stream you've got to spend hundreds of dollars to access a "flyfishing camp". That commercialization has driven up the cost of flyfishing, and access to good trout streams beyond the budget of many a die hard flyfisherman.

 

Some will just say geocaching is changing, but, IMHO, not all change is good. I've seen "change" in other hobbies/sports in which I've participated to see how it can negatively impact the enjoyment for those that were in it before it became mainstream.

 

As a flyfisherman that is still waiting for that stream of popularity to go down before going back into the water, I can 100% relate to your use of flyfishing as an example!

 

For about an hour I watched a couple guys flyfish the the San Joaquin, above Rainbow Falls, in Devil's Postpile N.M., in 1989, and said to myself "I GOTTA TRY THAT."

 

I've been flyfishing since 1990. That's PRE- Craig Sheffer, Brad Pitt, and Tom Skerritt influence. It cost me over $300 to get set up decently at the time. What does it cost today?

 

My perspective: You guys are fishing on the wrong coast or you're not putting the effort in to find a spot within your comfort zones. Flyfishermen are still few and far between in the Sierras. Of course, I don't go to the places tourists go for the most part so your mileage may vary. I also don't flyfish much. Mayyyyybe once every 3 or 4 years, but I tend to gravitate to running watter anyway even when I'm not fishing.

 

Geocaching as with flyfishing is what you make of it. It just takes a little MORE effort to find your comfort zone. I can't think of a better sport to compare right now.

Hahaha! You said "years"! That's OK... I know that you really meant once every 3 or 4 weeks.

 

When I was flyfishing, it was every weekend, often more. I'm that way when I get into something. I do go extreme. Around here, I have two rivers within about an hour drive and a couple more if I want to drive farther. Since flyfishing hit mainstream, it can be impossible to get a place to park sometimes. When you can, you know that several other fisherman have already hit the water, possibly waded into the better pools only minutes before you got there. Solitude was one of the things that I got out of flyfishing. Yes, there are places that you can still find solitude, but they are rare. It is not just what you make of it. There are external influences.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I see mainstreaming in geocaching more like how flyfishing became mainstream. For many years, flyfishing was fairly uncommon but also had it's share of "huge, practicing fans". There were a few clubs around and pockets of areas where flyfishing was more commonplace where one could learn from others, but for the most part many flyfishers were self taught in how to cast, learning about read streams, about etymology, how to tie flies, etc. Then "the movie" came out (A River Runs Through It) and it began to get more popular. That popularity created a opportunity for commercialism. Now many of those rivers and streams that were considered flyfishing meccas (Montana, Catskills, etc) are overrun with guides for hire, which, for a price, someone can buy the knowledge that the old diehards spent years acquiring. It used to be that one could find a potential trout stream on a map, knock on the door of the property owner to ask permission to fish it (and drop off a few trout for dinner on the way out), and you'd have some prime fishing streams all to yourself. Now, many of those areas are shoulder to shoulder in public access areas, and if you want to fish a less crowded stream you've got to spend hundreds of dollars to access a "flyfishing camp". That commercialization has driven up the cost of flyfishing, and access to good trout streams beyond the budget of many a die hard flyfisherman.

 

Some will just say geocaching is changing, but, IMHO, not all change is good. I've seen "change" in other hobbies/sports in which I've participated to see how it can negatively impact the enjoyment for those that were in it before it became mainstream.

 

As a flyfisherman that is still waiting for that stream of popularity to go down before going back into the water, I can 100% relate to your use of flyfishing as an example!

 

For about an hour I watched a couple guys flyfish the the San Joaquin, above Rainbow Falls, in Devil's Postpile N.M., in 1989, and said to myself "I GOTTA TRY THAT."

 

 

I've flyfished the headwaters of the San Joaquin, but below Rainbow Falls in Devils Postpile in the early 1980's. It's a beautiful spot.

 

 

I've been flyfishing since 1990. That's PRE- Craig Sheffer, Brad Pitt, and Tom Skerritt influence. It cost me over $300 to get set up decently at the time. What does it cost today?

 

 

It's been awhile since I bought a new flyrod/reel but my "everyday" rod is a 5 weight Redington that sold new for $110 equiped with a $70 or so reel. I bought it about 18 years ago though. I also have a Sage RPL 490, that sold for over $400 new but I bought it used for $200. I've also got 3 split bamboo rods that I rarely use and a handful of other fairly inexpensive rods (a 3 weight and 9 weight, a four piece backpacking rod, etc).

 

 

My perspective: You guys are fishing on the wrong coast or you're not putting the effort in to find a spot within your comfort zones. Flyfishermen are still few and far between in the Sierras. Of course, I don't go to the places tourists go for the most part so your mileage may vary. I also don't flyfish much. Mayyyyybe once every 3 or 4 years, but I tend to gravitate to running watter anyway even when I'm not fishing.

 

Geocaching as with flyfishing is what you make of it. It just takes a little MORE effort to find your comfort zone. I can't think of a better sport to compare right now.

 

I cut my teeth flyfishing the Sierra Nevada streams both on the western and eastern slopes and was born in a west coast town that still has an active fishing port.

 

Yes, it doesn't take more effort to find ones comfort zone in geocaching, and either one has to suck it up and put in that effort or find another hobby. Even if I choose the former that doesn't mean I have to like it, and if I don't I'm going to express my feelings about it.

[+stinger503]

Geocaching Hipsters are coming: " You've probably never heard of it, but I was into Geocaching back in '01, those were the best ones, Groundspeak really sold out since then."

[+Doctroid]

Yeah, I'd have to say the majority of usernames you see logging Geocaches eventually disappear, and only those who truly love it stick around for the long term. How often do you see new obvious smartphone users who actually go out and hide a cache of their own? Not very often.

 

Last night? A new cache posted; CO has 2 finds, owns 2 caches. Of course it's not obvious they're a smartphone user like me.

 

I have no hides, yet. I probably will, at some point — when I've found a great spot, or thought up a good puzzle, or something like that. At just 115 finds I'm still learning what makes a good hide. I'm not about to rush out and plant a typical LPC just so I'll have a hide to my name.

[+bflentje]

I guess the upside is that all the new people will have to hide more LPC caches or film cans in the ivy for us to find. The downside is the month or two after they hide them the newbies will lose interest and the caches will start the downward spiral and we will be left posting all the NA logs and cleaning up the geolitter.

 

Six new caches tonight in my neck of the woods. Named Park and Grab #1 - #6. Same cache page for each one:

 

A quick park and grab.

Nothing too exciting here. I am pretty much just filling in a big blank area on the map.

 

I like big blank areas on the map. Those are spots where I might be able to hide something good someday.

 

I was sympathetic until this post. There's no way Knowschad would have hidden something in these spots. So what's thwe whining about?

[+Team Van Dyk]

I'm relatively new to geocaching, use an iPhone (for now), and do it as a family activity. I sign every log, thoughtfully compose my log entries on the site, take pictures, actually move TBs in their intended direction, CITO, note maintenance issues, replace baggies, and am in the planning stages of hiding our first cache. In other words, I doubt very highly that anyone would accuse me of cheapening or damaging the activity in any way. In fact, I would imagine just the opposite. Point is, this is exactly right (except for that last part):

 

Please stop the iPhone , smart phone bashing. There will crappy gps cachers and crappy smart phone cachers. It not about the mechanism you use to cache it about the cacher they are. The new smart phones are just as acurate as a gps.

 

Correct. A wise man once said (I think it was Sol Seaker) it's not Geocaching with smartphones, it's logging with them.

 

By the way, the Iphone sucks. Just in general, nothing to do with Geocaching.

 

But, having lived through the above-discussed fly fishing bonanza of about a decade ago (and the mountain biking bonanza before that), I can certainly see the concern. And, I find this to be both funny as hell and 100% accurate:

 

Geocaching Hipsters are coming: " You've probably never heard of it, but I was into Geocaching back in '01, those were the best ones, Groundspeak really sold out since then."

 

--Matt

Edited May 10, 2011 by mattvandyk

[+crazysnowbdr]

I am probably what you would call a new cacher, I have known about Geocaching since 09 as you can see when I first registered my account I would come read here forums and things like that but I never had the money to buy a GPSr and when I got a droid well life got in the way. I have just recently had the ability to start finding caches I enjoy it a lot I have 15 finds no hides. Should I give up on geocaching because I am a newbie and some of you hardcore cachers people that are too cool for the room as I see them want to keep it your little secret.

 

I was around when snowboarding became mainstream I was one of those snowboarders that had to travel farther because snowboarding was not allowed at my local mountain, when snowboarding exploded I didn't tell people to stop being posers and fake I became a snowboard instructor, and anybody that has ever been an instructor knows that is not selling out because snowboard instructors make nothing as far as money goes. Now I don't see geocaching blowing up like snowboarding did but come on guys you need to lighten up this is hobby if there are too many people out there caching for you find something else to do. Nobody here needs you coming on the forums and complaining about how geocaching was better back on this date all you are is a jerk who wants to show off how long they have known about this super secret call geocaching. When it comes down to it geocaching is hiking, and hiking has been around for a LONG time.

[sdarken]

When it comes down to it geocaching is hiking, and hiking has been around for a LONG time.

 

If you spend a little more time around the forums you will find that for many people geocaching has nothing at all to do with hiking. While many of the earlier geocachers were also hikers, that's much less common these days. In urban areas I'd guess that 75% of new geocachers never walk further than to the other side of their neighborhood parks to find a cache.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

I was watching the news today and the were talking about summer activities for the kids. I was blown away they actually said "Geocaching." They didn't go into detail about what Geocaching was but the fact that it was on the news shocked me.

 

Do you think the fact that Geocaching is moving into mainstream culture is good or bad for the hobby? On one hand I think it is good because it is bringing a ton more people and families into it which can only make it bigger. The downside is that the more people that join will bring some bad caches and may turn some people off. What are your thoughts?

You are way too late to worry about our game going 'mainstream'. Sign up with a news search engine like http://www.icurrent.com/ and create a search for "geocaching". It will scour the media every day for that word and send you an email daily with links to all published articles containing the word geocaching.

 

You will discover that geocaching is the focus of news articles all across the country every day - usually multiple articles. This cat is well and truly out of the bag!

 

Is that a good thing? Yes!

Edited May 10, 2011 by TheAlabamaRambler

[Pineapple Dan]

Yes its going too mainstream, and this breeds premium member elitism. Before there was never such an emphasis on being a premium member, the whole thing is making me disinterested tbh. Although part of me just wants to create a whole string of non premium member caches just because free things are good.

 

Smartphones have dumbed things down considerably, but smartphones have a dumbing down effect on society in general I think.

Edited May 25, 2011 by Dankoozy

[+barraseaclaid]

Ah Dan come off your high horse you wernt allowed to find one PM cache in cork and your ranting. Its a small investment in a great pasttime

 

and as far as elitism is concerned its the first time ever anyone has coined that phrase id say...its not like gc has established a caste (cashte!!! :lol: ) system

Edited May 25, 2011 by barraseaclaid

[+Krejaton's Krew]

Wow, boatloads of elitism going on here.

 

Full disclosure: I am a noob (5 months in), a smartphone cacher, found 40 caches and placed one. So I guess I am the ultimate pariah. After reading this thread, I am even beginning to despise myself at this point.

 

Then again, though noobs obviously aren't as skilled or seasoned, we have an interest and an eagerness that might be better serve with encouragement rather than rejection and belittling. I have tried to be a positive member of the geocaching community, fixing broken caches when I could, giving better than I got, taking time to search for an interesting place to hide my first cache, talking to others to make sure I am not breeching etiquette, etc.

 

But if it makes some feel better whip out the holier-than-thou 'tude, and be the cool kids, so be it. I don't need your approval to play or enjoy caching...thankfully. No doubt some incoming noobs will be a drag on the community, but perhaps this condescending outlook of some might be the greater problem in the community. I would rather play with someone excited to learn and enjoy the hunt then some jaded player who looks down on me because I have yet to spend $350 on the latest and greatest GPS device and my finds have not yet reached into the thousands.

 

But, then again, I am just a noob with a Smartphone.

[+barraseaclaid]

Wow, boatloads of elitism going on here.

 

Full disclosure: I am a noob (5 months in), a smartphone cacher, found 40 caches and placed one. So I guess I am the ultimate pariah. After reading this thread, I am even beginning to despise myself at this point.

 

Then again, though noobs obviously aren't as skilled or seasoned, we have an interest and an eagerness that might be better serve with encouragement rather than rejection and belittling. I have tried to be a positive member of the geocaching community, fixing broken caches when I could, giving better than I got, taking time to search for an interesting place to hide my first cache, talking to others to make sure I am not breeching etiquette, etc.

 

But if it makes some feel better whip out the holier-than-thou 'tude, and be the cool kids, so be it. I don't need your approval to play or enjoy caching...thankfully. No doubt some incoming noobs will be a drag on the community, but perhaps this condescending outlook of some might be the greater problem in the community. I would rather play with someone excited to learn and enjoy the hunt then some jaded player who looks down on me because I have yet to spend $350 on the latest and greatest GPS device and my finds have not yet reached into the thousands.

 

But, then again, I am just a noob with a Smartphone.

 

I still consider myself a relatively new cacher and yeah I have a gps but most of the time I use my smartphone and only the gpsr when placing caches or going somewhere that the phone is likely to get wrecked....TO be honest I was specifically refering to Dankoozys post because the guy sent an email to a cacher I met at one or two events and hes a teenager so may take it to heart getting abuse over having his cache PM only....

This thread is sort of converging with another along the same lines but the bottom line is a smartphone lacks the accuracy of a proper gpsr.

[+rufus 430]

Boy are some of you going to hate me!

 

I'm VERY new, with very few finds & no hides, I use a smart phone & I'm unlikely to go for a cache where 'there & back' is more than about 4 miles or too hard to find, as I have my 4 yr old in tow!

 

(waits for the rotton eggs )

 

surely in with all the 'rubbish' caches being placed by these pesky noobs, there are also a higher number of good quality cashes - not proportionally maybe, but in physical numbers. (30% of good caches out of 10000 gives a higher physical number of good caches than 80% of 1000 - (random figures to illustrate the point).

 

My admittedly limited experience also suggests its possible to take a good guess at whether a cache is of interest to you or not - for instance our local cycle trail or a woodland path - perfect for my daughter & me, high likelyhood of a nice environment to walk/cycle in & probably decent size containers that my daughter has a chance of finding & that may have nice swaps for her; however, neither of us is going to get alot out of nano's on town benches - so we won't go to those ones - simple - horses for courses, if remote/mountain/cleverly disguised/underwater is your bag, its possible to select those - ignore the 1,000,000 naff lampposts.

 

As I said i'm very new to all this, but it does T me off a bit that all the woes of the game seem to be placed at the feet of newbies. We really aren't all bad & you were one once - possibly many moons ago - but you were. Yes you'll get some who can't be bothered to find out how its supposed to work & a very few will turn out to be coin thieves etc - but please don't tar us all with the same brush!

 

No, I can't promise I'll stick with this long term; who of us knows what we'll be doing this time next year, but while I'm here, I want to try & do it right.

 

The 2nd cache I found was soaking wet; I emptied it out, dried it & as much of the swag as I could. Signed the log, put the dry stuff back, took out the rusty stuff & a soggy lace hanky away (it's in the wash at the moment & I hope to put it in another cache if it comes up well enough), let my daughter choose 1 item & she put one back (OK I guess I could have topped up to replace the rusty stuff, so black mark there). We picked up some rubbish on the way back to the car & logged both a proper 'find' log with a description of out walk & also a 'needs maintenance' log when we got home. (that was the right thing to do, yes?)

 

Yes, I want to place a cache, but once I get my head around the process, its not going in a car park! It will - if approved - go in the location that popped into my head as perfect as soon as i first found out about this fantastic hobby!

 

Yes, I use a smart phone. I happened to have it already so I didn't have to spend out straight away on a new hobby & on all occasions so far its got me within a few yards of the cache. I know this could cause a problem hiding a cache; I understand I will need to take a series of about 10 readings from the same point to find the reliable one - is that right? If it looks like its going to cause an problem, I'll have to either bite the bullet & buy a GPS or try to persuade a friendly local cacher (I'm sure there are some) to help me out.

 

I haven't found any travellers so far, but I herby promise that if I do I will move them on! - even if I give up caching I think i can manage to get off my a**s for long enough to drop someone elses pride & joy into a local cache!

 

Umm, I think I've had my 2 bits worth - awaits further rotten veg

[+Krejaton's Krew]

the bottom line is a smartphone lacks the accuracy of a proper gpsr.

 

My seven found, in the last hour, say you are wrong.

 

Signed,

 

An Improper GPS'r

Edited May 26, 2011 by krejaton

[+barraseaclaid]

the bottom line is a smartphone lacks the accuracy of a proper gpsr.

 

My seven found, in the last hour, say you are wrong.

 

Signed,

 

An Improper GPS'r

:lol: well done!

[+NYPaddleCacher]

the bottom line is a smartphone lacks the accuracy of a proper gpsr.

 

My seven found, in the last hour, say you are wrong.

 

Signed,

 

An Improper GPS'r

 

First of all, I'm not anti-smartphone. That's what I used to "find" a handful of virtuals in Washington DC a week or so ago.

 

However, your response doesn't disprove what barreseaclaid wrote.

 

There are clearly a lot of caches out there that can be found without an accurate GPS receiver. I have found a lot of caches where I was pretty certain where the container was hidden before I even left my vehicle. There are also a lot of cache that are not found often (i.e. Shelter III in Indianapolis with 216 DNFs and only 4 finds) that have been sought by many seasoned cachers with expensive consumer handheld GPS receivers. Finding seven caches in an hour is more of an indication of the difficulty of the hide and proximity to each other.