My thoughts after a week

[Greg_L]

I just started geocaching just over a week ago and I wanted to share my initial impressions.

The good:

I enjoy the more challenging caches, puzzles, and multi caches. I really like it when a cache takes me to a neat place in my city that I didn't know was there before. I also enjoy hiking and seeing wild life, I've seen more deer in the past week than I have in the past five years combined.It has also revealed some really great fishing spots, I now bring a pole and bait when I head out. The game has also taught me how to use a GPS and it's many features, I would feel comfortable walking into the wilderness and finding my way out again no problem. This game is really great for kids, when I have kids they will definitely be geocachers, today's kids are just not self sufficient and most would be lost a block from home. Environmental awareness is important to me and I always try to pick up trash along the way while I'm out, I like the idea of "cache in trash out" I like the sense of kinship with people who have gone through what I have gone through to sign the log.

 

The Bad:

Right away, before my first cache I noticed a plethora of problems. First of all, this is not a real game, yes the site does keep track of things like how many caches you've visited, which states, and FTF's, but why would I gauge my experience I'm having by numbers? The first thing I noticed while browsing the logs of some caches I was planning to try to find was that some people could and were armchair logging, what is the point of that? Even if you do have 10,000 legitimate finds, the game can't be fun any more there is just no way. I noticed a trend of micros being hidden about 2.5 years ago. After I said "oh cool" to my first parking light lamp post hide, I quickly realize that that could get old.It's cool to think that all these years I've gone to that store and there was a geocache right there the whole time and I never knew it, but my area has been saturated! I started to pass by quite a lot of caches after I realized people were making things challenging in an annoying sort of way. I'm sorry but I won't be parking on an interstate off ramp to go looking for a geocache, something as pointless as that is not worth risking my life for, If you can't come up with something somewhat original then why bother? It does sound fun to hide a cache, but why do i see people with well over 100 hides? I know they can't possibly maintain all of these, most of the micros I find have at least a wet log if not worse. Which brings me to my next annoyance, premium membership. I really appreciate the free features of the site, It's great that I don't have to pay to find most geocaches and I can use google maps to search for geocaches in a specific area. I also appreciate that they send out officials to monitor and support events. The thing that really bugs me about premium memberships is that without one you can't use BASIC search filters, like if I want to look for something a little more challenging without having to just randomly click around until I find something. The site can't cost that much to run, if they have 5,000,000 members and lets say 1,000,000 (20%) are premium paying members that's $30,000000 a year in membership fees alone! That's not including any of their other pricey items that they also sell on the side! I"m pretty sure I wont be getting a premium membership.

 

Suggestions:

pemium membership should be just that PREMIUM! why can't basic users have at least some more search features? It kind of reminds me of farmville or frontierville or many other online games that now want people to pay real money to buy in game items that are fairly basic to make the game any fun at all. It wouldn't bother me so much if Groundspeak was a non profit organization.

Why aren't there user ratings for caches? ever go to a cache all excited and you get there only to be disappointed? why can't a fully user created environment have user based ratings? This would challenge people to create interesting caches instead of worthless park and grabs.

 

I know I'm going to get input here whether I like it or not, I have read through the forums a little and know that these are all issues many people have feelings about.

[+the4dirtydogs]

We have a blast playing this game and don't mind the fee. Seems to me that you have more bad than good to say, so that would tell me to stick with fishing and thank geocaching for teaching you how to play with your GPS. You don't have to pay to play this game. The members that do help pay the BILLS. Thanks for playing.

[+StarBrand]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

[Greg_L]

We have a blast playing this game and don't mind the fee. Seems to me that you have more bad than good to say, so that would tell me to stick with fishing and thank geocaching for teaching you how to play with your GPS. You don't have to pay to play this game. The members that do help pay the BILLS. Thanks for playing.

I will continue to support the cachers, the caches, and the game, I really enjoy it. I would also like to see people have fun and find new and exciting ways to develop the game. I have seen many online forums that once supported the fun of a thing that no longer support new ideas and growth, sadly many of these disappear, and along with them the many possibilities.

[+uxorious]

First of all, this is not a real game

 

If it is not a real game, what the heck is it? You start out with this negative and go downhill from there.

 

You sound like someone who feels anyone not playing your way isn't playing at all. My advice is to lighten up, decide how you like to play and go for it.

 

Go on line sometime and look up the rules for some games. Any thing from Mexican Train to Rummy, and you will find different sites have different rules for the same game. About all you can do is figure out which rules you like and stick to that.

[Greg_L]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

Please check my profile, my first find was a week ago. I did create an account 2 years ago when I heard about geocaching, I wanted to see how many caches were in my area, unfortunately the person I was with at the time stated that it was a stupid idea and did not want to try it. Recently I met some people who do geocache and I decided to finally try it out. Until now I didn't own a GPS. I read through the forum a bit after I had a lot of questions about issues people face, like what happens when the police show up (hasn't happened yet). So I kind of get the idea of what has happened and what the main issues are. I wanted to point out some very basic issues that I noticed almost immediately.

[Greg_L]

First of all, this is not a real game

 

If it is not a real game, what the heck is it? You start out with this negative and go downhill from there.

 

You sound like someone who feels anyone not playing your way isn't playing at all. My advice is to lighten up, decide how you like to play and go for it.

 

Go on line sometime and look up the rules for some games. Any thing from Mexican Train to Rummy, and you will find different sites have different rules for the same game. About all you can do is figure out which rules you like and stick to that.

Game: a physical or mental competition conducted according to rules with the participants in direct opposition to each other

Who are we competing with? unless for sheer numbers, merits, or FTF's but I don't take it that seriously because I want to use it to relax go outside and explore, henceforth, not a real game (at least to me).

[+KBfamily]

I am positive that many will offer their thoughts on your topic...mine are simple...this "game" is what YOU make it. If the highway off ramp caches are a problem for you, don't do them. If LPC's are boring to you, don't do them. If you like challenges and puzzles, then go for it. I don't like either of those things - so I avoid them.

This "game" has helped me lose many unwanted pounds. It has taken me places that I never would have gone. It has put smiles on the faces of every one of my family members. This game has helped me get off the couch and do something with my life and it has given me many new friends....some I have never met because they live in Germany...It has given me a common hobby with my brother which has opened so many avenues of communication for us. This game, as I choose to play it, has given me great pleasure and makes me smile when I read the log notes that folks have written after they find one of my silly cache containers. I can't answer puzzle caches so I will never put one out....I hope that means that you think that I am still a good cache owner/placer (I go for the shock and surprise factor - not intense difficulty or mind bending brain teasers)....I will never place a LPC but I still go find them. You just never know what wonderful park, old war monument, historic cemetery in the center of the city, or store parking lot they may be placed in.

I choose to have Premium Membership to be able to take advantage of every aspect of Geocaching....I do not think that $30/year is too much money considering how much other hobbies/sports can cost. I think it is great to offer a free basic membership so casual cachers or newbies may still participate without paying the fee.

Try not to fault others for their 10,000 real or arm-chair caches. This isn't a competition...it is supposed to be fun (otherwise, why do it?). Find what you like and make this "game" what you want it to be and ignore the rest. Happy caching and if you are ever in AZ, stop by a KBfamily cache and see if it makes you smile.

[+the4dirtydogs]

We have a blast playing this game and don't mind the fee. Seems to me that you have more bad than good to say, so that would tell me to stick with fishing and thank geocaching for teaching you how to play with your GPS. You don't have to pay to play this game. The members that do help pay the BILLS. Thanks for playing.

I will continue to support the cachers, the caches, and the game, I really enjoy it. I would also like to see people have fun and find new and exciting ways to develop the game. I have seen many online forums that once supported the fun of a thing that no longer support new ideas and growth, sadly many of these disappear, and along with them the many possibilities.

How much more do you have to develop...........................hide something right here, mark the coords, go home and list your cache and wait for someone to find it. Oh by the way the GAME is finding a cache at a fixed coordinate. When you do the game is over. Now off to the next one. Every cache is a game and each one is different. Search and find. That's it. Enjoy the time in between. The SCORE doesn't matter because you don't win anything.

The only growth I see is probably more servers, more office space, more bills, and a few more nice people to work at HQ.

 

Edit to say: Which us premium members pay for. Your welcome.

Edited April 5, 2011 by the4dirtydogs

[knowschad]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

• armchair logging
• I noticed a trend of micros being hidden about 2.5 years ago
• I said "oh cool" to my first parking light lamp post hide but...
• I started to pass by quite a lot of caches after I realized people were making things challenging in an annoying sort of way
• I won't be parking on an interstate off ramp

I noticed the same thing. I'm not calling you on the number of finds that you have logged, but on the amount of knowledge that you seem to have about the activity for someone with only about 30 finds. At the very least, you have been following the forums for some time. How many other cachers with 30-40 finds even know of the term, "armchair logging"? How did you learn so quickly that there are a lot of caches hidden in lamp skirts when you have so few finds? I'm not calling you a troll, but I have to be honest with you... some things are simply not adding up for me.

 

The thing that really bugs me about premium memberships is that without one you can't use BASIC search filters

Without paying, you have access to exactly as many search features as you had before this site was created.

[+the4dirtydogs]

First of all, this is not a real game

 

If it is not a real game, what the heck is it? You start out with this negative and go downhill from there.

 

You sound like someone who feels anyone not playing your way isn't playing at all. My advice is to lighten up, decide how you like to play and go for it.

 

Go on line sometime and look up the rules for some games. Any thing from Mexican Train to Rummy, and you will find different sites have different rules for the same game. About all you can do is figure out which rules you like and stick to that.

Game: a physical or mental competition conducted according to rules with the participants in direct opposition to each other

Who are we competing with? unless for sheer numbers, merits, or FTF's but I don't take it that seriously because I want to use it to relax go outside and explore, henceforth, not a real game (at least to me).

The game is between the Cache Owner and the Cacher. If you find the cache you win, If you don't you lose. Now it's a game. You have the mental and physical all in one.

[+hukilaulau]

I think your 30 million a year estimate might be a little off

 

Otherwise it seems like you put a lot of effort into an essay about the most common complaints that come up every week.

I'm guessing either 1) troll just to see what reaction you get or 2) school writing project. If I'm wrong and you're for real then I apologize and suggest you stick to fishing and farmville.

[Greg_L]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

• armchair logging
• I noticed a trend of micros being hidden about 2.5 years ago
• I said "oh cool" to my first parking light lamp post hide but...
• I started to pass by quite a lot of caches after I realized people were making things challenging in an annoying sort of way
• I won't be parking on an interstate off ramp

I noticed the same thing. I'm not calling you on the number of finds that you have logged, but on the amount of knowledge that you seem to have about the activity for someone with only about 30 finds. At the very least, you have been following the forums for some time. How many other cachers with 30-40 finds even know of the term, "armchair logging"? How did you learn so quickly that there are a lot of caches hidden in lamp skirts when you have so few finds? I'm not calling you a troll, but I have to be honest with you... some things are simply not adding up for me.

 

The thing that really bugs me about premium memberships is that without one you can't use BASIC search filters

Without paying, you have access to exactly as many search features as you had before this site was created.

 

I used google and filtered through the search results and read through peoples tales the other night (firday?) and some tonight I noticed a few people with every cache in my area logged in one day online, so I started checking physical logs and realized that some people were doing this, so I searched google (logging fake geocache finds) and noticed the term "armchair logging" I also noticed posts as recent as today about people logging finds at MOGA for volunteering. This aspect doesn't bother me as much as confuse me especially if you brag about your number of finds. I'm used to being able to filter results, I hate doing it manually. I've been following one cache hiders caches in particular in my area, because he has a tendency to have the kind I like. However one of his caches in a series went missing and he has stated he will replace it soon, it's the only one I need for a last set of coordinates for a final but I keep seeing him logging FTF's at 5:45 in the morning

[jholly]

Many times people have posted about the large sums of money that Groundspeak rakes in on membership fees. The bottom line is there probably only a handful at best that really know and they aren't talking.

 

This site does not cost much to run? It is in a professional data center and would not hazard a guess at what it costs, but I would hazard a guess it is not cheap. Far more than the $1.99 a year Go-Daddy charges for a domain name.

 

Bottom line of your post, you want the premium member features and benefits with out paying the membership fee.

[Greg_L]

Many times people have posted about the large sums of money that Groundspeak rakes in on membership fees. The bottom line is there probably only a handful at best that really know and they aren't talking.

 

This site does not cost much to run? It is in a professional data center and would not hazard a guess at what it costs, but I would hazard a guess it is not cheap. Far more than the $1.99 a year Go-Daddy charges for a domain name.

 

Bottom line of your post, you want the premium member features and benefits with out paying the membership fee.

 

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

[+KBfamily]

 

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

[TheCacheSeeker]

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

+1!

[+the4dirtydogs]

I think the OP wants a.... and a premium membership for free

[Greg_L]

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

+1!

 

I was toying with the idea of getting a premium membership after my first few exciting days of geocaching, but before I rushed into it I decided I would do more geocaching, thinking I'll do maybe 100 finds over the next month or two and see if I really need the service. I even thought maybe when I hide my first cache I'll give the first non premium member to find it a free gift membership. The more I cached the more I realized I just wanted to filter search results due to the large number of less than exciting caches out there, I don't see a use for pocket queries or a special forum distinction. For a long time I thought wow, geocaching must be ran by some pretty cool people who genuinely care about promoting this hobby and environmentalism and they need the money to run and support the community, but the more I read the more I realize some people just realized how to turn something totally cool into their own personal cash cow.

[+KBfamily]

This just can't just be about $30. Seriously...no way....??

[+KBfamily]

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

+1!

 

I was toying with the idea of getting a premium membership after my first few exciting days of geocaching, but before I rushed into it I decided I would do more geocaching, thinking I'll do maybe 100 finds over the next month or two and see if I really need the service. I even thought maybe when I hide my first cache I'll give the first non premium member to find it a free gift membership. The more I cached the more I realized I just wanted to filter search results due to the large number of less than exciting caches out there, I don't see a use for pocket queries or a special forum distinction. For a long time I thought wow, geocaching must be ran by some pretty cool people who genuinely care about promoting this hobby and environmentalism and they need the money to run and support the community, but the more I read the more I realize some people just realized how to turn something totally cool into their own personal cash cow.

 

Maybe you wish you had thought it up first?

 

I didn't use queries for months after I started caching but then I made a road trip to Mount Rushmore and found queries to really be helpful.

 

"First few exciting days"....you won't be around long if you only had a few exciting days....that feeling would need to last longer than that...maybe you will find about 39 caches and never be heard from again...don't pick up any TB's...

[+BlueDeuce]

My thoughts after 2 minutes. National feed the troll week.

[Greg_L]

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

+1!

 

I was toying with the idea of getting a premium membership after my first few exciting days of geocaching, but before I rushed into it I decided I would do more geocaching, thinking I'll do maybe 100 finds over the next month or two and see if I really need the service. I even thought maybe when I hide my first cache I'll give the first non premium member to find it a free gift membership. The more I cached the more I realized I just wanted to filter search results due to the large number of less than exciting caches out there, I don't see a use for pocket queries or a special forum distinction. For a long time I thought wow, geocaching must be ran by some pretty cool people who genuinely care about promoting this hobby and environmentalism and they need the money to run and support the community, but the more I read the more I realize some people just realized how to turn something totally cool into their own personal cash cow.

 

Maybe you wish you had thought it up first?

 

I didn't use queries for months after I started caching but then I made a road trip to Mount Rushmore and found queries to really be helpful.

 

"First few exciting days"....you won't be around long if you only had a few exciting days....that feeling would need to last longer than that...maybe you will find about 39 caches and never be heard from again...don't pick up any TB's...

 

I wouldn't mind $50 or even $100 if they really needed it to keep the site running or they offered a lot more features with a premium membership, but I'm sure I'll get along just fine without it, and who knows, maybe in the future I will see the need to get a premium membership. I will probably never be nearly as hardcore as 99% of the cachers on this forum, I'll just have to look around the map to find the good caches.

[+rav_bunneh]

People like and do things for different reasons.

 

As for paying $30 for a year of premium access; I don't mind paying and I hope plenty of people have jobs and support their families from my hobby. As for the so called over priced shop? Not really. I was actually stunned that my last order had a shipping cost of $1.90 to Hawaii when 99% of companies will milk me for $15.

[+Shop99er]

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

+1!

 

I was toying with the idea of getting a premium membership after my first few exciting days of geocaching, but before I rushed into it I decided I would do more geocaching, thinking I'll do maybe 100 finds over the next month or two and see if I really need the service. I even thought maybe when I hide my first cache I'll give the first non premium member to find it a free gift membership. The more I cached the more I realized I just wanted to filter search results due to the large number of less than exciting caches out there, I don't see a use for pocket queries or a special forum distinction. For a long time I thought wow, geocaching must be ran by some pretty cool people who genuinely care about promoting this hobby and environmentalism and they need the money to run and support the community, but the more I read the more I realize some people just realized how to turn something totally cool into their own personal cash cow.

 

While I don't subscribe to your notion that Jeremy and Co. are raking in the dollars by the truckload, I also am quite sure that they aren't going broke.

 

But your claim that they are just using this as a cash cow is over the line.

 

Every one of the owners (I believe), and the majority of the Lackeys, if not all, are also players. So, it is also in their own best interest to keep promoting the game, and the environmental aspects of the game.

 

If you are so sure that this is nothing more than a way for someone to make $$, and if that offends you, then please go away. I'm sure Terracaching could use a new member.

[Greg_L]

My thoughts after 2 minutes. National feed the troll week.

Isn't leaving erroneous off topic posts considered trolling?

[+BlueDeuce]

My thoughts after 2 minutes. National feed the troll week.

Isn't leaving erroneous off topic posts considered trolling?

 

Only a sock puppet would know that.

[Greg_L]

My thoughts after 2 minutes. National feed the troll week.

Isn't leaving erroneous off topic posts considered trolling?

 

Only a sock puppet would know that.

 

only someone with 18888 forum posts would know what a sock puppet is (and yes I just had to look it up)

[+BlueDeuce]

18888 is a cool number.

[+CanadianRockies]

I enjoy the more challenging caches, puzzles, and multi caches.

Number of multi-cache finds: 0.

[Greg_L]

I enjoy the more challenging caches, puzzles, and multi caches.

Number of multi-cache finds: 0.

attempted one yesterday,GC2DDHM, when I found the first there was supposed to be a clue in it, but there didn't seem to be one all it said on the piece of paper was "don't forget to sign the log on the way out" I have found several that require you to find several other caches with co-ordinates before you find a mystery cache, sorry I have a life and other obligations, I think 30 in a week is a lot although many were in the same park which I go running in all the time. I'm working on (GC2H0BE) for tomorrow.

 

Edit: also on my first day out I tried to look for GC2MDNE but couldn't make sense of it and GC2H0BK but I wasn't sure how to add distance in a direction to coordinates with just the GPS so I will have to go back for them both at some point.

Edited April 5, 2011 by Greg_L

[+Don_J]

* armchair logging

* I noticed a trend of micros being hidden about 2.5 years ago

* I said "oh cool" to my first parking light lamp post hide but...

* I started to pass by quite a lot of caches after I realized people were making things challenging in an annoying sort of way

* I won't be parking on an interstate off ramp

 

I noticed the same thing. I'm not calling you on the number of finds that you have logged, but on the amount of knowledge that you seem to have about the activity for someone with only about 30 finds. At the very least, you have been following the forums for some time. How many other cachers with 30-40 finds even know of the term, "armchair logging"? How did you learn so quickly that there are a lot of caches hidden in lamp skirts when you have so few finds? I'm not calling you a troll, but I have to be honest with you... some things are simply not adding up for me.

 

Plus, he managed to bring up the five biggest hot button issues on this forum, all in one big paragraph. Uber-troll?

[+BlueDeuce]

* armchair logging

* I noticed a trend of micros being hidden about 2.5 years ago

* I said "oh cool" to my first parking light lamp post hide but...

* I started to pass by quite a lot of caches after I realized people were making things challenging in an annoying sort of way

* I won't be parking on an interstate off ramp

 

I noticed the same thing. I'm not calling you on the number of finds that you have logged, but on the amount of knowledge that you seem to have about the activity for someone with only about 30 finds. At the very least, you have been following the forums for some time. How many other cachers with 30-40 finds even know of the term, "armchair logging"? How did you learn so quickly that there are a lot of caches hidden in lamp skirts when you have so few finds? I'm not calling you a troll, but I have to be honest with you... some things are simply not adding up for me.

 

Plus, he managed to bring up the five biggest hot button issues on this forum, all in one big paragraph. Uber-troll?

 

Or just really cranky, I'm not sure which.

[+lamoracke]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

 

not sure I would use the word trolling, but seems the most literate cacher I have ever heard after only a week. After my first week? I may have seen a lamp post but certainly did not know they were everywhere. CITO? The pros and cons of premium membership? Freeway off ramps? I barely knew what was cool and not cool back then, much less knew what was common practice and what was not, and certainly was not aware of what cachers with 10,000 finds feel like or even knew any of them. Yeah, I would agree that a week does not seem likely here. Sock puppet? Thats Geocaching 501.

Edited April 5, 2011 by lamoracke

[Greg_L]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

 

not sure I would use the word trolling, but seems the most literate cacher I have ever heard after only a week. After my first week? I may have seen a lamp post but certainly did not know they were everywhere. CITO? The pros and cons of premium membership? Freeway off ramps? I barely knew what was cool and not cool back then, much less knew what was common practice and what was not, and certainly was not aware of what cachers with 10,000 finds feel like or even knew any of them. Yeah, I would agree that a week does not seem likely here. Sock puppet? Thats Geocaching 501.

 

there is one cacher in our area with 10,000 finds and 1,000 hides (mostly garbage hides) and even has multiple geocaching tatoos in their profile pic. a lot of the micros in our area were hidden in summer of 2008 for some reason. and you guys really don't see how transparrent and basic this all is? I really did pick up on all of this from just reading about 10 forum posts and from actually going out there and finding caches.

Edited April 5, 2011 by Greg_L

[+lamoracke]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

 

not sure I would use the word trolling, but seems the most literate cacher I have ever heard after only a week. After my first week? I may have seen a lamp post but certainly did not know they were everywhere. CITO? The pros and cons of premium membership? Freeway off ramps? I barely knew what was cool and not cool back then, much less knew what was common practice and what was not, and certainly was not aware of what cachers with 10,000 finds feel like or even knew any of them. Yeah, I would agree that a week does not seem likely here. Sock puppet? Thats Geocaching 501.

 

there is one cacher in our area with 10,000 finds and 1,000 hides (mostly garbage hides) and even has multiple geocaching tatoos in their profile pic. a lot of the micros in our area were hidden in summer of 2008 for some reason. and you guys really don't see how transparrent and basic this all is? I really did pick up on all of this from just reading about 10 forum posts and from actually going out there and finding caches.

 

I know some cachers who do try to maintain over 100 hides and do it well and I know some who do a terrible job of maintaining 10 of them. I would not say there is any hard rule. If a cache needs to be archived, submit an NA log. You could always send cacher XX an email asking him (if it could be done politely) why he lists so many if they are as you say, mostly junk. Might be more illuminating his response than ours, because you are asking the horse's mouth. If he is mad at you, well, at least he knows your view. Yes, am sure there are some cachers who put out too many caches and are terrible at maintaining them, but I do not think you can put a number on it or lump anyone with XX number as just putting out junk. Minus knowledge the ET and other power trail routes, I do not know any cachers up here with those kind of numbers, so I can imagine it would be annoying to be near someone with 1000 hides and most of them being say a piece of paper in a badly smelling Tupperware. Personally I cant imagine maintaining say 500 caches, but that's me. Someone could under different circumstances, friends, money, travel time, and work status.

Edited April 5, 2011 by lamoracke

[Greg_L]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

 

not sure I would use the word trolling, but seems the most literate cacher I have ever heard after only a week. After my first week? I may have seen a lamp post but certainly did not know they were everywhere. CITO? The pros and cons of premium membership? Freeway off ramps? I barely knew what was cool and not cool back then, much less knew what was common practice and what was not, and certainly was not aware of what cachers with 10,000 finds feel like or even knew any of them. Yeah, I would agree that a week does not seem likely here. Sock puppet? Thats Geocaching 501.

 

there is one cacher in our area with 10,000 finds and 1,000 hides (mostly garbage hides) and even has multiple geocaching tatoos in their profile pic. a lot of the micros in our area were hidden in summer of 2008 for some reason. and you guys really don't see how transparrent and basic this all is? I really did pick up on all of this from just reading about 10 forum posts and from actually going out there and finding caches.

 

I know some cachers who do try to maintain over 100 hides and do it well and I know some who do a terrible job of maintaining 10 of them. I would not say there is any hard rule. If a cache needs to be archived, submit an NA log. You could always send cacher XX an email asking him (if it could be done politely) why he lists so many if they are as you say, mostly junk. Might be more illuminating his response than ours, because you are asking the horse's mouth. If he is mad at you, well, at least he knows your view. Yes, am sure there are some cachers who put out too many caches and are terrible at maintaining them, but I do not think you can put a number on it or lump anyone with XX number as just putting out junk. Minus knowledge the ET and other power trail routes, I do not know any cachers up here with those kind of numbers, so I can imagine it would be annoying to be near someone with 1000 hides and most of them being say a piece of paper in a badly smelling Tupperware. Personally I cant imagine maintaining say 500 caches, but that's me. Someone could under different circumstances, friends, money, travel time, and work status.

 

I'm not saying all of their hides are all bad, I have even found a few, but I tend to see that username a lot and also tend to avoid those caches. I don't necessarily want to do a poker run of my entire county line or 5 others for that matter.

[+BlueDeuce]

You signed up 2 years ago but have been caching for a week???

 

You use terminology that most forum regulars don't even use.

 

I call the topic nothing more than trolling.

 

not sure I would use the word trolling, but seems the most literate cacher I have ever heard after only a week. After my first week? I may have seen a lamp post but certainly did not know they were everywhere. CITO? The pros and cons of premium membership? Freeway off ramps? I barely knew what was cool and not cool back then, much less knew what was common practice and what was not, and certainly was not aware of what cachers with 10,000 finds feel like or even knew any of them. Yeah, I would agree that a week does not seem likely here. Sock puppet? Thats Geocaching 501.

 

Nor would you have addressed gc.com for charging a fee for a premium membership. It's trolling.

[+CanadianRockies]

I enjoy the more challenging caches, puzzles, and multi caches.

Number of multi-cache finds: 0.

attempted one yesterday,GC2DDHM, when I found the first there was supposed to be a clue in it, but there didn't seem to be one all it said on the piece of paper was "don't forget to sign the log on the way out" I have found several that require you to find several other caches with co-ordinates before you find a mystery cache, sorry I have a life and other obligations, I think 30 in a week is a lot although many were in the same park which I go running in all the time. I'm working on (GC2H0BE) for tomorrow.

 

Edit: also on my first day out I tried to look for GC2MDNE but couldn't make sense of it and GC2H0BK but I wasn't sure how to add distance in a direction to coordinates with just the GPS so I will have to go back for them both at some point.

You seem to have encountered some bad luck at the three multi-caches you mentioned, so I'm a little surprised you're enjoying them so much. I noticed "sycodan" did all three of those within a day of your visits.

[+CanadianRockies]

there is one cacher in our area with 10,000 finds and 1,000 hides (mostly garbage hides) and even has multiple geocaching tatoos in their profile pic. a lot of the micros in our area were hidden in summer of 2008 for some reason. and you guys really don't see how transparrent and basic this all is? I really did pick up on all of this from just reading about 10 forum posts and from actually going out there and finding caches.

Most of his 1,000 hides are garbage hides.

 

A lot of the micros in your area were hidden in the summer of 2008.

 

And you know this from reading 10 forum posts and finding 33 caches during the past week? Color me suspicious.

[+ace862]

Many times people have posted about the large sums of money that Groundspeak rakes in on membership fees. The bottom line is there probably only a handful at best that really know and they aren't talking.

 

This site does not cost much to run? It is in a professional data center and would not hazard a guess at what it costs, but I would hazard a guess it is not cheap. Far more than the $1.99 a year Go-Daddy charges for a domain name.

 

Bottom line of your post, you want the premium member features and benefits with out paying the membership fee.

 

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

 

It has always baffled me that for some reason, some people can't wrap their head around the fact that Groundspeak is a business. They are not a non-profit organization, nor have they ever claimed to be. And they are also a private company. They don't have to share their financial statements. What they do with the money they bring in is entirely within their discretion. Do you ask your local department store what they do with the money you spend there? Groundspeak sells Premium memberships and with that you get access to certain features that are not included with a basic free membership. I think some people mistakenly believe that premium memberships are actually shares in Groundspeak and therefor they should have a say in how Groundspeak runs their business.

You are correct in one thing in that the activity of geocaching is community driven. The community hides the caches, and the community finds them. The main focus of Groundspeak's business is listing those geocaches. You are more than welcome to go out and hide a geocache without listing on GC.com. But, I'd be willing to bet that almost next to no one will visit your cache.

I have no problems with the Groundspeak's business. Hell, I wish I'd thought of it first. But I didn't, so I'll just have to settle for playing the game.

 

One of the best things about geocaching, and some will say that it is also the worst thing, is that there is something for everyone. Some like the numbers, or the FTFs, or the LPCs, or the puzzles, or the long hikes, or the urban caches, etc, etc, etc. You get the picture.

 

From the amount of negativity you have brought with your first thread started, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that this is just a passing fancy for you. So have some fun while you're here and enjoy the new places you'll discover. But I'm betting in six months or less, you'll be gone.

 

Cheers!

[Greg_L]

I enjoy the more challenging caches, puzzles, and multi caches.

Number of multi-cache finds: 0.

attempted one yesterday,GC2DDHM, when I found the first there was supposed to be a clue in it, but there didn't seem to be one all it said on the piece of paper was "don't forget to sign the log on the way out" I have found several that require you to find several other caches with co-ordinates before you find a mystery cache, sorry I have a life and other obligations, I think 30 in a week is a lot although many were in the same park which I go running in all the time. I'm working on (GC2H0BE) for tomorrow.

 

Edit: also on my first day out I tried to look for GC2MDNE but couldn't make sense of it and GC2H0BK but I wasn't sure how to add distance in a direction to coordinates with just the GPS so I will have to go back for them both at some point.

You seem to have encountered some bad luck at the three multi-caches you mentioned, so I'm a little surprised you're enjoying them so much. I noticed "sycodan" did all three of those within a day of your visits.

It was my first day out after all, I just wanted to find one of the 20 caches in that park, actually the first cache I technically found was GC10WK5.

[+niraD]

First of all, this is not a real game, yes the site does keep track of things like how many caches you've visited, which states, and FTF's, but why would I gauge my experience I'm having by numbers?

Why is it this a problem? I find some of the statistics interesting. The ones I don't find interesting, I ignore. Can't you just ignore the statistics that you don't find interesting? Groundspeak recently expanded the personal statistics they track in response to user feedback.

 

And for the record, the site doesn't keep track of FTFs. Geocachers who care about FTFs do that on their own.

 

It does sound fun to hide a cache, but why do i see people with well over 100 hides? I know they can't possibly maintain all of these, most of the micros I find have at least a wet log if not worse.

I learned a lot from trying to maintain my first cache. As a result, my current caches require very little maintenance. I can see how someone could properly maintain dozens of caches if they chose good containers and good locations for them all.

 

And the damp (or even waterlogged) caches I've found have usually been placed by less experienced cache owners, not by cache owners with dozens of hides.

 

I also appreciate that they send out officials to monitor and support events.

You must go to different events than I do. But I digress...

 

The thing that really bugs me about premium memberships is that without one you can't use BASIC search filters, like if I want to look for something a little more challenging without having to just randomly click around until I find something.

Maybe it's just me, but I think of basic search features as the kinds of thing you can search for on the "Hide and Seek a Cache" page: location (in several different formats), cache name, GC code, or username (for either finders or owners). Basic members can also search for nearby caches of a particular type, by using the "nearby caches of this type" links on cache pages.

 

But searching for caches with specific characteristics that you think you're more likely to enjoy is no longer a basic search, IMHO.

 

The site can't cost that much to run, if they have 5,000,000 members and lets say 1,000,000 (20%) are premium paying members that's $30,000000 a year in membership fees alone!

FWIW, the last time Jeremy posted statistics, the median number of finds per active account was 34. You've already found more than that. Furthermore, those statistics excluded accounts that hadn't posted a log in the past 3 months, so the fraction of that 5 million members who are still active and who have found more caches than you is even smaller.

 

I think Groundspeak would be ecstatic to have 1 million premium members.

 

Why aren't there user ratings for caches?

Groundspeak recently added a Favorites feature. Only premium members can vote for their favorites, but everyone can see how many favorites votes a cache has.

[+G & C]

Not much I can add here that hasn't already been said, so I'll just say that the $30 I pay a year for a premium membership is worth it. I have my issues with GS, I'm sure most do in one way or another, but it's a small price to pay for all of the extras that come with it.

 

And in all honesty, I don't really care where that $30 goes.

[+E_ZIG_A]

I became a Premium Member after a very short while in the geocaching game, as I wanted to see what extra that offered me, including the chance to nab Premium Caches, which the non Premium members can't see. I also joined to access the ability to use Pocket Queries, especially along routes, as I am very keen to do paperless caching and mobile phone reception is miserable Down Under. I also like to cache when travelling and this feature is gold! So for a very low $30 outlay (given the AUD is on parity with the USD, no big deal!) I reckon it's well worth it! I enjoy the little conveniences that the membership gives me and for such a low yearly outlay, I'm happy. I'm paying for a convenience to to enhance the ability to do paperless geocaching; I suppose I could toss it onto the Dishlickers or the One Armed Bandits, but instead I choose Premium Membership....

 

As for the whole argument about is it or is not a game As a newbie who is heading to the 250 find mark and with several (well maintained thankyou!) caches under my belt and a heap of trackables (love em!) I am learning that everyone plays the GAME differently and quite frankly I like it. I'm not one to be 'told what to do' so being able to enjoy playing this game how I like it and learning to relax and accept how others play the game makes this a fine pursuit!

 

As they say about our country's flag: "If you don't love it; leave", so too can one say that about Geocaching!

[+A & J Tooling]

Some people have such miserable lives they have to make everyone else feel bad too, to feel like they matter. Come on kid. If you don't like it here, go someplace else. Why take it out on us? Other then making me chuckle at your temper tantrum? Need a hug?

[+Ike 13]

So after a week you read the forums and instead of responding to individual threads you decided to combine a lot of the most commonly complained about things into one massive topic of angst.

 

I love this game, hobby, sport whatever you want to call it. I am happy to contribute $30. I've payed more for less before and I feel I get a great value with PQs, CAR, ignore list, and all the other goodies. This hobby has taken me to places I would never have seen, it has familiarized myself with my state, gotten me back into the woods, it has given me new friends, and has just made life more enjoyable.

 

* armchair logging wrong, but I'm not going to let this ruin my day

 

* I noticed a trend of micros being hidden about 2.5 years ago not all micros are bad

 

* I said "oh cool" to my first parking light lamp post hide but... they are lame? I would agree they are not creative and not exciting but they do have a purpose.

 

* parking on the interstate does not happen around here, but I've heard it is an issue in some parts. I agree this is not my idea of

 

*CO not maintaining their 'junk' hides Yes this is annoying, become a PM use the ignore feature and they disappear. or just log a NM and then a NA if the issue is not taken care of

[+nittanycopa]

For all the technology that has to be maintained to run this site, $30 is a VERY small price to pay.

 

You may also want to consider deleting the log you posted on the Dizzy / Daffy / Goofe puzzle cache. It gives out a pretty blatant hint on how to solve the puzzle right in your log. Generally that's not a good idea to post. Leave puzzle hints to the CO to distribute.

[Mr.Yuck]

 

Well Groundspeak only has 40 employees, I'm sure that they don't post their yearly financial statements for obvious reasons, I'm sure that they host outside of their Seattle office hopefully at multiple locations for safe data backup, as they use youtube for video hosting, and another third party program for these forums, You are right that I want the premium member features and benefits without paying the fee, but I don't think you can call search filters "premium". The main thing that bothers me about it is that this is a members run community, members create the caches without the help of Groundspeak, members moderate this forum for free, members audit the caches before they go out without getting paid by Groundspeak, all Groundspeak does is charge membership fees, sell "official geocache" items, hosts the site, and moderates events organized by individuals and volunteers.

You sure know a lot for only caching for a week...sorry...maybe I am wrong...but a first week cacher is more excited about their next find and how to use a GPS and not how many employees Groundspeak has....I didn't even know what Groundspeak was for a long time after I began caching...and even long to know what was in Seattle....what is it that you really want? Come on...be honest.

 

Fixed quotes (I think I did). Hey, I thought it was closer to 50 Employees.

 

Well, you know, there are 4 other Geocaching websites in the U.S. alone whose main selling point is being free. I should know, I just hid a cache on one of them 2 days ago. And I'd dare say they have 95% of the features of a Premimum membership here, all for the price of nuttin'. And no, it's not owned by a major GPS manufacturer.

 

As far as this website and Premium memberships, no big deal I suppose. The "enhanced features for paying members" model is used all over the internets. And long before this website came along too. I think it started the week after Al Gore invented it.

[+KBfamily]

I enjoy the more challenging caches, puzzles, and multi caches.

Number of multi-cache finds: 0.

attempted one yesterday,GC2DDHM, when I found the first there was supposed to be a clue in it, but there didn't seem to be one all it said on the piece of paper was "don't forget to sign the log on the way out" I have found several that require you to find several other caches with co-ordinates before you find a mystery cache, sorry I have a life and other obligations, I think 30 in a week is a lot although many were in the same park which I go running in all the time. I'm working on (GC2H0BE) for tomorrow.

 

Edit: also on my first day out I tried to look for GC2MDNE but couldn't make sense of it and GC2H0BK but I wasn't sure how to add distance in a direction to coordinates with just the GPS so I will have to go back for them both at some point.

 

Um...so you didn't follow the clue and find the cache? They told you where the log was..."don't forget to sign the log on the way out".....did you look for the cache inside of a nearby log? Did you turn over stumps or sticks to look for the cache? You had a puzzle to figure out and you didn't follow the clue that was given to you....you need to go back and finish the multi....they gave you the answer....doh......