Privacy - Which is more invasive?

6.1k · March 3, 2011

There seems to be some cachers who do not view PMO caches because their username will appear on the cache owner's audit log indicating the first time of visit, and the amount of times they viewed the page.

Other cachers do not like people tracking where they have cached by looking at their find history.

Personally, I don't mind if my username appears on an audit log of a PMO cache, or how many times. However I am bothered by cachers who may use the find history to peruse where you have been, at what times, and picking apart the log textual content. Other people seem to be the opposite. PMO caches are fairly rare, and cache logs from the profile have always been viewable. I suppose that could be the reason. A log on the cache page is one thing, but going through someones logs from their profile is another.

I recently made several of my caches PMO as a temporary experiment. Several do not have any views, while others have a long list of cachers, some from other countries. I think its pretty cool. If they allow someone to go through your profile, then why can't the profiles have audit logs to see who has viewed it, and how many times?

Thoughts?

Edited March 3, 2011 by 4wheelin_fool

18.9k · March 3, 2011

I'm not sure I fully understand your concerns here - however......

I couldn't possibly care less who sees what caches I browse and what caches I have logged and how.

Besides the Audit log does not track those who view the cache via Pocket Queries so is only a sampling of visitors.

March 3, 2011

There seems to be some cachers who do not view PMO caches because their username will appear on the cache owner's audit log indicating the first time of visit, and the amount of times they viewed the page.

Other cachers do not like people tracking where they have cached by looking at their find history.

Personally, I don't mind if my username appears on a PMO cache, or how many times. However I am bothered by cachers who may use the find history to peruse where you have been, at what times, and picking apart the log textual content. Other people seem to be the opposite. PMO caches are fairly rare, and cache logs from the profile have always been viewable. I suppose that could be the reason. A log on the cache page is one thing, but going through someones logs from their profile is another.

I recently made several of my caches PMO as a temporary experiment. Several do not have any views, while others have a long list of cachers, some from other countries. I think its pretty cool. If they allow someone to go through your profile, then why can't the profiles have audit logs to see who has viewed it, and how many times?

Thoughts?

Personally, I don't care either way. We have a few PMO caches, and after the first few times of looking at the audit logs, it gets rather boring. In fact, I haven't looked at any of them in a couple months. Doesn't bother me who's looking at our caches, or how many times. And I could care less if someone that does have a PMO cache knows I've looked at it once, or 3,412 times in the past week. If it bothers them that bad, maybe they need a life. I've never had anyone quiz me on it, although I've heard vague rumors to the contrary at some point in the past here on the forums.

The profile log history? Don't care either. There's no personally identifiable information there, nobody knows that DadOf6Furrballs' real name is "Elmo Q. Pivnik the III", nor do they know where my palatial estate is somewhere in Rapid City, SD. So in that regard, privacy is moot. Sure, a few of our close geocaching friends know who we are IRL, but do I care if anyone knows I went to a certain cache 14 days ago, or 6 months ago in Wyoming? No. And if someone is without a life (maybe the same person in the previous example above) to such an extent they have to pick apart our logs, grammatically, spelling, or whatever, they seriously need help. Not much I can do for them.

But that's just me. Others may have their own concerns in some varying degrees. Which is fine.

11.2k · March 3, 2011

I think I would prefer to not know who has checked out my profile. I think your question about profile audit logs is a good one, though. You have made some good points.

18.9k · March 3, 2011

....also, I find it likely that such a log (data table) already exists - we just can't view it.

6.1k · March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly. If a PM wants to question them about why they viewed their page a number of times, that is even more silly.

The tracking user finds is a bit more of a concern. I don't look at anyone's logs from their profile, and I dont know why anyone would. I look at the cache page and read the logs based on the cache, not from a link on a profile.

6.1k · March 3, 2011

I think I would prefer to not know who has checked out my profile. I think your question about profile audit logs is a good one, though. You have made some good points.

Yes, if someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, perhaps you should know about it.

38.2k · March 3, 2011

Neither are concerns to me. I don't care that someone knows I looked at their cache page. Actually, the few times I submitted PMO caches I was very surprised at the number of people who viewed them and how far away a lot of them were.

As far as my find history, what do I care if someone knows I found a cache in a certain place a day, a month or 6 years ago?

Edited March 3, 2011 by briansnat

1.3k · March 3, 2011

I'm not sure I fully understand your concerns here - however......

I couldn't possibly care less who sees what caches I browse and what caches I have logged and how.

Besides the Audit log does not track those who view the cache via Pocket Queries so is only a sampling of visitors.

+1 - don't care, never will.

18.9k · March 3, 2011

... I don't look at anyone's logs from their profile, and I dont know why anyone would. I look at the cache page and read the logs based on the cache, not from a link on a profile.

I do - just to see what other area caches they have recently visited. Maybe to see where they are from - just out of couriosity. No other reason.

March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly. If a PM wants to question them about why they viewed their page a number of times, that is even more silly.

The tracking user finds is a bit more of a concern. I don't look at anyone's logs from their profile, and I dont know why anyone would. I look at the cache page and read the logs based on the cache, not from a link on a profile.

I can tell you one example of why I've gone to someone's profile in the past and looked... I got a DNF on a cache (a blinkie) from someone whose find count on the cache log indicated they only had a couple dozen finds, at most. Don't remember the exact number. But going to their profile, and doing a brief scan of the caches they had found so far in the area, I discovered they had never seen or found a nano. I sent them a small hint describing what they should be looking for. Amazingly, a couple days later they went back and found it. And thanked me for the hint. Never once did I think I was invading their privacy, nor did it cross my mind that they would think the same.

6.8k · March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly.

No, it is not silly. There are many cachers who wrongly accuse people who have looked at the cache page, but have not logged a found it for the cache in case the cache gets lost.

Moreover, the log history of a cacher does not provide data on the exact time the logs have been written in a systematic way (even not in the case that the logs are edited so that an edit time is displayed). Of course, these data will be available in some log files at Groundspeak, but not to individual cachers which makes an essential difference.

If I do not want that someone knows that I have been to city X on day Y, then I will not log a cache there. I do not have a problem with this information displayed. The information about the exact time at which someone is viewing whichever page of gc.com is nothing that should be availalble to individual geocachers.

Cezanne

Edited March 3, 2011 by cezanne

6.1k · March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly.

No, it is not silly. There are many cachers who wrongly accuse people who have looked at the cache page in case the cache gets lost.

Cezanne

So, they won't look at the page because they are afraid of being accused of theft, as there is a small chance that the cache might go missing in the future, and the owner will blame everyone that looked at the page? I'm sorry, but I find that being overly paranoid.

Edited March 3, 2011 by 4wheelin_fool

March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly.

No, it is not silly. There are many cachers who wrongly accuse people who have looked at the cache page, but have not logged a found it for the cache in case the cache gets lost.

Cezanne

Although I have no evidence to the contrary, I think the number of times that's actually happened is extremely small.

6.1k · March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly. If a PM wants to question them about why they viewed their page a number of times, that is even more silly.

The tracking user finds is a bit more of a concern. I don't look at anyone's logs from their profile, and I dont know why anyone would. I look at the cache page and read the logs based on the cache, not from a link on a profile.

I can tell you one example of why I've gone to someone's profile in the past and looked... I got a DNF on a cache (a blinkie) from someone whose find count on the cache log indicated they only had a couple dozen finds, at most. Don't remember the exact number. But going to their profile, and doing a brief scan of the caches they had found so far in the area, I discovered they had never seen or found a nano. I sent them a small hint describing what they should be looking for. Amazingly, a couple days later they went back and found it. And thanked me for the hint. Never once did I think I was invading their privacy, nor did it cross my mind that they would think the same.

That's a good reason that I did not think of.

March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly.

No, it is not silly. There are many cachers who wrongly accuse people who have looked at the cache page in case the cache gets lost.

Cezanne

So, they won't look at the page because they are afraid of being accused of theft, as there is a small chance that the cache might go missing in the future, and the owner will blame everyone that looked at the page? I'm sorry, but I find that being overly paranoid.

Wait until you have received threatening emails from a PMO CO because you dared to look at their cache page. You might not find it to be paranoid then.

6.1k · March 3, 2011

Im going to be away from the computer for awhile. If you want to put your username on the audit log of this unsolved puzzle, go ahead. Just don't be afraid of the audit log.

Edited March 3, 2011 by 4wheelin_fool

March 3, 2011

Im going to be away from the computer for awhile. If you want to put your username on the audit log of this unsolved puzzle, go ahead. Just don't be afraid of the audit log.

OK, you should see user "MomOf6Furrballs" on the audit log now. Nice puzzle, btw, I've bookmarked it and will try to work on it a bit later after the painkillers have stopped numbing my brain.

3.9k · March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly.
No, it is not silly. There are many cachers who wrongly accuse people who have looked at the cache page in case the cache gets lost.

Cezanne

So, they won't look at the page because they are afraid of being accused of theft, as there is a small chance that the cache might go missing in the future, and the owner will blame everyone that looked at the page? I'm sorry, but I find that being overly paranoid.
Wait until you have received threatening emails from a PMO CO because you dared to look at their cache page. You might not find it to be paranoid then.

I'm calling BS on this. I doubt anyone has EVER sent a threatening letter to someone that looked at a PMO cache page.

If anything, I'm betting that it was either 1) and overly sensitive cacher that got a friendly email, or 2) a cache owner that tried to send a friendly email but doesn't write well. But in either case I doubt any threats were made because someone just viewed a page.

The scenario most likely went like this

Cache owner hides cache and looks the audit log regularly just out of curiosity and because of the novelty of being able to do so. He sees someone's name he doesn't recognize and looks up their profile to see if they're new or whatever. He sees that they're from somewhere really far away. "Neat!", he thinks to himself, "that's cool that someone across the country is looking at my cache, I wonder if they found it by chance, or if someone told them about it, or if maybe they did a search for something else and this was on the list returned?"

So the cache owner's curiosity gets the best of him and he decides to ask and find out. So his email says, "Hey there. I noticed you were recently looking at GC123XYZ which is a new cache I just published. What made you think the look at it from way across the country?"

But the cacher reading the email sees it as if the email said, "Hey chump. What the hell are you doing looking at my new cache? You're way across the country and have no business looking at it."

March 3, 2011

Even if one is not concerned about or believe that there are privacy concerns surrounding PMO caches or any of their other data that is stored and displayed on this site, privacy IS a big concern these days. Those who express concern about their privacy or the lack of control over who has visibility to various data on their profiles have every right to be concerned. I don't believe anyone should be criticized for those concern even if you believe them to be trivial. In all of the various forum threads dealing with privacy issues and/or access to personal data, it amazes me how many people are actually opposed to users having some control over access.

Everyday we are bombarded in the media about online privacy issues and we are all being constantly warned and reminded about how even seemingly trivial information about yourself can be dangerous in the wrong hands. It's only natural for people to be concerned even in situations where it may not be a problem. "Better safe than sorry" is an approach that more and more people are taking. I suspect that it is only a matter of time before stronger privacy laws are enacted that require sites like this to provide users with more extensive control over their personal data, whether it is warranted or not.

On a more practical note, if you truly are concerned about your visit to a PMO cache page being logged and visible to the cache owner then there is a really simple solution. I view all of my cache pages offline in GSAK. I almost never access an actual Groundspeak cache page. Viewing cache pages offline in whatever program you use to manage your PQ's will never result in a log entry on the PMO cache page. Given the number of people who do paperless caching and use GSAK or smartphone apps, I wonder about the usefulness of the logs collected on PMO caches.

March 3, 2011

I did not know that PMO owners could see who was viewing their profile or their caches. I think I would like to see "number of views" on my caches, but even though it would be interesting to see who was looking at my caches, I do think it is somewhat of an invasion of privacy. I'm not really sure how I feel about it yet, but I do understand people's concerns about it.

It's not going to keep me from looking at PMO caches, but I might not look at them over and over. LOL!

5.7k · March 3, 2011

I think I would prefer to not know who has checked out my profile. I think your question about profile audit logs is a good one, though. You have made some good points.

Another site that I use for geocaching has this feature to see who has viewed your profile.

2.7k · March 3, 2011

Wait until you have received threatening emails from a PMO CO because you dared to look at their cache page. You might not find it to be paranoid then.

There's a process for that.

2.2k · March 3, 2011

Yes, if someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, perhaps you should know about it.

Why? Why do I care? Everything on my profile is there because I put it there. Feel free to look -- once, twice, hundred times.

I find the concerns over privacy to be quite interesting. Here is a shocking fact for people -- my full name, address and phone number is published in a book that gets distributed to hundreds of thousands of homes! **shock** **horror** Not only that, but sometimes this book is even left sitting on street corners where just ANYONE could look at it.

March 3, 2011

Here is a shocking fact for people -- my full name, address and phone number is published in a book that gets distributed to hundreds of thousands of homes! **shock** **horror** Not only that, but sometimes this book is even left sitting on street corners where just ANYONE could look at it.

Thats why all books should be burned.

March 3, 2011

I'm not concerned about people being able to see which caches I've logged or which cache pages I've visited. I don't think my logs reveal anything about me except that I have a habit of being out of the house on the weekend, which most people do anyway. I also don't mind if a PMO cache owner can see me viewing their page, though I didn't know that that feature existed until now.

As for seeing how many people view my profile...I don't really care either way. If the feature was there I would probably check it out but I'm not too curious and I don't imagine that I have many people viewing my profile on a regular basis. I occasionally look at other people's profiles to see where they're from or what they've been doing recently, if they're a friend of mine. I don't think that's a problem or an invasion of privacy. I can see how people might be concerned about that type of thing but I don't see much harm in it.

10.2k · March 3, 2011

There have been a few people who have voiced opinions about the audit log of a PMO being an invasion of their privacy, so they wont look at the page. I think that is silly.

No, it is not silly. There are many cachers who wrongly accuse people who have looked at the cache page in case the cache gets lost.

Cezanne

So, they won't look at the page because they are afraid of being accused of theft, as there is a small chance that the cache might go missing in the future, and the owner will blame everyone that looked at the page? I'm sorry, but I find that being overly paranoid.

Wait until you have received threatening emails from a PMO CO because you dared to look at their cache page. You might not find it to be paranoid then.

I will address only the Audit Log on PMO caches. It's early in the thread, but there usually seems to be many more people who consider it an invasion of web-surfing privacy. Well, I'll go ahead and be the first one to drink the Kool-Aid.

Of course it makes it easy for people to accuse people who have looked at the cache page of stealing it, and there have been many examples posted here in the forums over the years. Me, it's just plain old invasion of privacy. None of your business if I looked at your cache page!! And for the people who "just like seeing who looked at the page", quit being so nosey. :lol:

Oh, can't believe I almost forgot. I was once surfing Geocaching.com Google Maps on the California Coast for no particular reason (I live in Western NY), and I clicked on a random cache that just happened to be a PMO cache (you can't tell with the maps). Wouldn't you know, the nosey cache owner contacts me through the website saying they are "just curious" why I looked at their cache page. This was of course after they investigated my profile to see where I was from, because they specifically asked how it came to my attention over there in New York. This might not bother all people, but I found the whole thing absolutely infuriating.

And yes, I'm one of those whacko's who goes out of my way to view the cache pages and obtain the coordinates through alternate means, and often use the backdoor method of logging these caches. Especially after that incident. Because that's just how I roll. Geez, I hope that wasn't like Toz long there. :unsure:

March 4, 2011

I'm one of those that don't care about my profile/cache hunts being public. I suppose if I did care, I'd not spend any time on the net. As to a cache owner getting testy about me viewing their profile or caches, it's public information at this point so it doesn't matter what they think. I'm a premium member so I can look at PMO caches without fear of repercussions as well. I guess if enough folks do care what can be seen and voice their opinions, TPTB might change things...

7.4k · March 4, 2011

I find it distasteful when people in a forum argument get in a huff and pick through someone's profile/finds. I also find it bizarre - the last thing I want to do with my evening is read about someone I find disagreeable. I only go to someone's profile if I need to contact them about a cache situation, or because we're friends.

But I find it far more annoying and intrusive when somebody contacts me privately to carry on a forum argument. If your point isn't interesting or relevant enough to share in the forum, why would I want to read it? Go away.

7.9k · March 4, 2011

Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.

3.2k · March 4, 2011

I know you're kidding, but this is not about paranoia. There have been repeated instances of abuse of the audit logs. Yes, they can be ignored and in most case since it is not common, even filtered out of email. Why should the recipient have to do this?

Some will disagree and come up with illogical reason, however there is just no valid reason beyond curiosity on the part of the CO to have audit logs. If curiosity is enough of a justification in and of itself, then put an audit log option on all caches.

Better yet, since PMO's really have no value, just solve the problem altogether and do away with them. But that's another thread.

1k · March 4, 2011

Im going to be away from the computer for awhile. If you want to put your username on the audit log of this unsolved puzzle, go ahead. Just don't be afraid of the audit log.

HA!

I looked at your cache page. It is in NJ.

Then I looked at your profile.

Then I looked at one of your other caches.

And I bet you have a vehicle with four wheels.

You are probably not really a fool.

Beyond that, I don't know anything bout you.

I admit to looking at the profiles of people here. Not because I agree or disagree with them, but because I find them interesting in some way. I like to see what kind of experiences others have. I haven't tried to figure out the real identities of many of them.

As far as reading other peoples logs? Absolutely. If I see someone logged one of my favorites, I often look to see if they sound any other of my faves and what they thought of them, or if they liked one I liked, I look to see what others they liked, hoping that I would like those also.

Am I worried about my privacy? Sure, as much as the next guy. I don't have my full name on my profile (though you can probably guess part of it), my email here is just used for caching. I am careful about what pictures I post. I'm not losing sleep over it.

3k · March 4, 2011

I don't see anything about my caching profile, logs, or other geo-info that makes me concerned about my privacy, except maybe the "Nearest Cache To Home Coordinates" being hidden from other users so it's not too obvious where I live.

1.8k · March 4, 2011

I find it distasteful when people in a forum argument get in a huff and pick through someone's profile/finds.

It is kinda weird to see that brought into the arguments sometimes.

13.7k · March 4, 2011

I find it distasteful when people in a forum argument get in a huff and pick through someone's profile/finds.

It is kinda weird to see that brought into the arguments sometimes.

A few months ago there was a forum poster upset over a reply I made, went into a tirade and then started another thread on something they got off my profile.

Luckily whackjobs like that are few are far. Since most are relatively harmless (they hide behind their keyboards at home), they're usually taken with a grain o salt.

It could go the other way though if a person was heated (or crazy) enough.

6.1k · March 4, 2011

Privacy issues do not affect most cachers, but there are instances where it can.

Cacher X-man gets upset when a clever hide goes missing. He has incorrectly assumed nobody could find it. So he looks at the last find log posted and sees that cacher Yon has found it. X-man checks her profile and sees that she finds plenty of caches per day, she also leaves very short, blunt logs and notices she was last to find on a few other hides. He gets upset and think that she is being careless so he tells other cachers that she doesnt repace hides that well. Cacher Zel is 15 years old and believes him, as one of his hides went missing also. Neverminding the fact that the caches are in public places with plenty of muggles, or just a few feet off of a trail. Zel goes and removes Yon's hides in anger.
Yon has previously dated cacher Anst, but they break up. Anst is however obsessed with her. Anst jealously checks her profile 100 times a day to see what she is up to. After a bit he gets upset and decides to do something. He knows that he cannot do anything direct as he would be blamed, so he goes to the same caches she does the day after, and leaves them out in the open or fills them with water. She takes a day off from work to enjoy the outdoors. Anst notices this, and sends an anonymous e-mail to her boss with the picture that she posted of herself and the log content.
Cacher Sammy is a coin thief. He hears about the dispute and watches Anst, and waits until he caches in an remote area and then takes all of the coins from all surrounding caches and leaves no logs. From a computer vantage point, it appears that Anst is taking them. Anst notices this and blames Yon.
Cacher Bimmy goes on trips every weekend to faraway places and writes detailed logs about his travels. Sammy notices a pattern and sees that Bimmy has a cache in his front yard..
OCD nutcase cacher Erlich somehow comes to the conclusion that cacher Hector is a shapeshifter member of the Illuminati. Erlich meets him at an event, and then sticks a tracking device to the bottom of his car soon after. He opens several accounts to find Hectors caches, but then dumps them out. So Hector changes all of his caches to premium and Erlich tells everyone that Hector thinks he is better than everyone. He follows him to other forums and activities, and does nasty things to make it look like Hector is behind it. Hector is later found at the bottom of a cliff on a remote hiking trail and the death is ruled accidental.

...and so on. Some things just are not anyone's business.

Edited March 4, 2011 by 4wheelin_fool

2.3k · March 4, 2011

I find the concerns over privacy to be quite interesting. Here is a shocking fact for people -- my full name, address and phone number is published in a book that gets distributed to hundreds of thousands of homes! **shock** **horror** Not only that, but sometimes this book is even left sitting on street corners where just ANYONE could look at it.

I can do you one better: Not only are my address and phone number listed in a freely-available, fine-print book that anyone can get their hands on (and whose contents are also available on the Web); anyone who knows my full name, which I'm not in the habit of keeping a secret, can find out anything they want to know about my home, including a recent color photo of the front of my house, simply by visiting the Franklin County, Ohio auditor's Web site. And do I care? Not in the least. I've never quite figured out what evil things anyone could do with any of that information.

--Larry

6.1k · March 4, 2011

I find the concerns over privacy to be quite interesting. Here is a shocking fact for people -- my full name, address and phone number is published in a book that gets distributed to hundreds of thousands of homes! **shock** **horror** Not only that, but sometimes this book is even left sitting on street corners where just ANYONE could look at it.

I can do you one better: Not only are my address and phone number listed in a freely-available, fine-print book that anyone can get their hands on (and whose contents are also available on the Web); anyone who knows my full name, which I'm not in the habit of keeping a secret, can find out anything they want to know about my home, including a recent color photo of the front of my house, simply by visiting the Franklin County, Ohio auditor's Web site. And do I care? Not in the least. I've never quite figured out what evil things anyone could do with any of that information.

--Larry

Just because something has not happened to you YET, doesnt meant that it wont. There are frequent thefts where I live that consist of valuable items taken from unlocked cars - GPS units, computers, couple hundred in cash, ect. If it had occured to the victims that someone would do that, then they obviously would have locked their door. But since nothing has ever happened like that to them, they really don't see it as their problem. The police show up and ask them how they could be so stupid. Well, it didnt seem stupid to them before it happened..

If someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, they have an unhealthy obsession. The next step is for them to become more involved in your life. Anything you do towards them in the slightest, whether its finding their cache or saying hello at an event will be processed in an abnormal fashion, which may trigger them to severely overreact. If there is an audit log on the profiles it would cut down on this, or at least help people identify future problems.

3.8k · March 4, 2011

yawn. If you're worried about privacy, the Internet is not for you.

2.7k · March 4, 2011

Just because something has not happened to you YET, doesnt meant that it wont. There are frequent thefts where I live that consist of valuable items taken from unlocked cars - GPS units, computers, couple hundred in cash, ect. If it had occured to the victims that someone would do that, then they obviously would have locked their door. But since nothing has ever happened like that to them, they really don't see it as their problem. The police show up and ask them how they could be so stupid. Well, it didnt seem stupid to them before it happened..

If someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, they have an unhealthy obsession. The next step is for them to become more involved in your life. Anything you do towards them in the slightest, whether its finding their cache or saying hello at an event will be processed in an abnormal fashion, which may trigger them to severely overreact. If there is an audit log on the profiles it would cut down on this, or at least help people identify future problems.

If you are not including real-world personal information in your profile this isn't an issue. The bad guy isn't going to know where you live unless you have revealed that, or you are using the same account name on enough websites to extrapolate that data. Most geocachers profiles do not include their name, address, phone number, DOB, blood type or IP address. These geocaching identities we have created are borne out of our imaginations and by themselves have no connection to the real world.

As for the crazy stalker person that one formerly knew example, simply hiding your log entries or profile pages is not going to deter them. The solo-terrorist will simply do what other terrorists do, and find another method. Like sitting in a car at the end of your street.

I will defer to the other argument that also states you are not required to log your finds online if you don't want to. You can download your caches to GSAK and mark them as found in that database to go 'zero tracks' without having to log them online. Load your GPS from your GSAK database and carry on happily. You can even load your iPhone from GSAK using Geosphere so no what-about-the-smartphone-users arguments please. Originally, the well written logs were on paper, not keyboard.

Edited March 4, 2011 by northernpenguin

4.2k · March 4, 2011

yawn. If you're worried about privacy, the Internet is not for you.

I second this yawn. If you're worried about what somebody might see on your profile then limit the information on your profile.

I see this on Facebook all the time. Facebook only tells other people what you tell Facebook.

1.8k · March 4, 2011

I second this yawn. If you're worried about what somebody might see on your profile then limit the information on your profile.

I see this on Facebook all the time. Facebook only tells other people what you tell Facebook.

It's sound advice.

I'm coming at it from the angle of someone who would like to share more with cache owners and others, but I usually refrain because of the lack of controls. If the system ever introduces a way to gate our information, I'll post more content... but until then, I'm following your good advice and limiting the information.

3.2k · March 4, 2011

I'd guess there are any number of folks who not only don't mind people checking out their profile pages but actually like it when it's done. I mean............. Have you ever seen the jive written on Snoogan's profile page? OMG! It's obviously meant for folks to check out. The part with the lemurs and aye-ayes is just......... ummmm.......... yeah. It's definitely meant to be seen by others.

6.1k · March 4, 2011

I'd guess there are any number of folks who not only don't mind people checking out their profile pages but actually like it when it's done. I mean............. Have you ever seen the jive written on Snoogan's profile page? OMG! It's obviously meant for folks to check out. The part with the lemurs and aye-ayes is just......... ummmm.......... yeah. It's definitely meant to be seen by others.

I put a page hit counter on mine, and there was a large amount of views. After I reset it, there still was a large amount. I really dont mind casual browsing, its just the obsessive person who has an axe to grind that Im concerned about.

7k · March 4, 2011

I put a page hit counter on mine, and there was a large amount of views. After I reset it, there still was a large amount. I really dont mind casual browsing, its just the obsessive person who has an axe to grind that Im concerned about.

You can also put a reverse tracking image on your profile. That way, you can see who's looking at your profile, when and how many times, without them ever knowing it. How's that for invasion of privacy? :lol:

6.1k · March 4, 2011

Im going to be away from the computer for awhile. If you want to put your username on the audit log of this unsolved puzzle, go ahead. Just don't be afraid of the audit log.

OK, you should see user "MomOf6Furrballs" on the audit log now. Nice puzzle, btw, I've bookmarked it and will try to work on it a bit later after the painkillers have stopped numbing my brain.

Yes it's on there.

What I also just noticed is that the Reviewer who published the cache is NOT.

This could mean a couple of things:

The reviewer did not even look at the page. He just crossed his fingers and hit publish.
He was concerned that if it did go missing, I would accuse him of theft.
He has a reviewer platinum account which has invisible audit logs.

Of course Im kidding, but why is there no audit log for the reviewer if it is not invasive?

Another unpublished test page I have WAS viewed by another reviewer a few times. I named it after him and changed the coords so that it is a few miles from his house, but he STILL has not looked at it again. :huh:

Some dude in Minnesota viewed it over a dozen times. What is up with that?

6.1k · March 4, 2011

I put a page hit counter on mine, and there was a large amount of views. After I reset it, there still was a large amount. I really dont mind casual browsing, its just the obsessive person who has an axe to grind that Im concerned about.

You can also put a reverse tracking image on your profile. That way, you can see who's looking at your profile, when and how many times, without them ever knowing it. How's that for invasion of privacy?

Cool. How can I do it?

19k · March 4, 2011

I can do you one better: Not only are my address and phone number listed in a freely-available, fine-print book that anyone can get their hands on (and whose contents are also available on the Web); anyone who knows my full name, which I'm not in the habit of keeping a secret, can find out anything they want to know about my home, including a recent color photo of the front of my house, simply by visiting the Franklin County, Ohio auditor's Web site. And do I care? Not in the least. I've never quite figured out what evil things anyone could do with any of that information.

--Larry

Just because something has not happened to you YET, doesnt meant that it wont. There are frequent thefts where I live that consist of valuable items taken from unlocked cars - GPS units, computers, couple hundred in cash, ect. If it had occured to the victims that someone would do that, then they obviously would have locked their door. But since nothing has ever happened like that to them, they really don't see it as their problem. The police show up and ask them how they could be so stupid. Well, it didnt seem stupid to them before it happened..

That is about leaving your doors unlocked, not about geocaching profiles. Sorry, but I don't see the connection, and I doubt that I'm alone in that.

If someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, they have an unhealthy obsession. The next step is for them to become more involved in your life. Anything you do towards them in the slightest, whether its finding their cache or saying hello at an event will be processed in an abnormal fashion, which may trigger them to severely overreact. If there is an audit log on the profiles it would cut down on this, or at least help people identify future problems.

Agreed, but I don't think that anybody here seriously intended to imply that they would, or that anyone has done that. That was pure hyperbole that was introduced in an earlier thread and has zero bearing on reality.

Much, much easier, if you want to track me, is to watch the events near me and see if I post a Will Attend. Go there, and ask where Knowschad is, come up and introduce yourself to me. You will soon get my real name and probably what part of town I'm from. Invite me to go caching with you and you will soon know more than enough about me.

6.1k · March 4, 2011

I can do you one better: Not only are my address and phone number listed in a freely-available, fine-print book that anyone can get their hands on (and whose contents are also available on the Web); anyone who knows my full name, which I'm not in the habit of keeping a secret, can find out anything they want to know about my home, including a recent color photo of the front of my house, simply by visiting the Franklin County, Ohio auditor's Web site. And do I care? Not in the least. I've never quite figured out what evil things anyone could do with any of that information.

--Larry

Just because something has not happened to you YET, doesnt meant that it wont. There are frequent thefts where I live that consist of valuable items taken from unlocked cars - GPS units, computers, couple hundred in cash, ect. If it had occured to the victims that someone would do that, then they obviously would have locked their door. But since nothing has ever happened like that to them, they really don't see it as their problem. The police show up and ask them how they could be so stupid. Well, it didnt seem stupid to them before it happened..

That is about leaving your doors unlocked, not about geocaching profiles. Sorry, but I don't see the connection, and I doubt that I'm alone in that.

Read the examples in post #36/ It could happen to anyone. Ive heard about specific instances, but Im not going to reveal details.

If someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, they have an unhealthy obsession. The next step is for them to become more involved in your life. Anything you do towards them in the slightest, whether its finding their cache or saying hello at an event will be processed in an abnormal fashion, which may trigger them to severely overreact. If there is an audit log on the profiles it would cut down on this, or at least help people identify future problems.

Agreed, but I don't think that anybody here seriously intended to imply that they would, or that anyone has done that. That was pure hyperbole that was introduced in an earlier thread and has zero bearing on reality.

People have done that. The details do not need to be shared.

19k · March 4, 2011

I can do you one better: Not only are my address and phone number listed in a freely-available, fine-print book that anyone can get their hands on (and whose contents are also available on the Web); anyone who knows my full name, which I'm not in the habit of keeping a secret, can find out anything they want to know about my home, including a recent color photo of the front of my house, simply by visiting the Franklin County, Ohio auditor's Web site. And do I care? Not in the least. I've never quite figured out what evil things anyone could do with any of that information.

--Larry

Just because something has not happened to you YET, doesnt meant that it wont. There are frequent thefts where I live that consist of valuable items taken from unlocked cars - GPS units, computers, couple hundred in cash, ect. If it had occured to the victims that someone would do that, then they obviously would have locked their door. But since nothing has ever happened like that to them, they really don't see it as their problem. The police show up and ask them how they could be so stupid. Well, it didnt seem stupid to them before it happened..

That is about leaving your doors unlocked, not about geocaching profiles. Sorry, but I don't see the connection, and I doubt that I'm alone in that.

Read the examples in post #36/ It could happen to anyone. Ive heard about specific instances, but Im not going to reveal details.

If someone is viewing your profile 100 times a day, they have an unhealthy obsession. The next step is for them to become more involved in your life. Anything you do towards them in the slightest, whether its finding their cache or saying hello at an event will be processed in an abnormal fashion, which may trigger them to severely overreact. If there is an audit log on the profiles it would cut down on this, or at least help people identify future problems.

Agreed, but I don't think that anybody here seriously intended to imply that they would, or that anyone has done that. That was pure hyperbole that was introduced in an earlier thread and has zero bearing on reality.

People have done that. The details do not need to be shared.

Post #36, as far as I can see, are a bunch of fictional scenarios that you came up with. Are you telling me that they are all real life examples?

People have viewed someone else's profile "100 times a day"? Since there is no audit trail available to us laymen, how do we know that? I can see how that could be dangerous, though... carpal tunnel would be very likely.

Privacy - Which is more invasive?

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