+briansnat Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 This was posted in the Harrimanhike Yahoo group by Jonboy. I'm sure he wouldn't mind my reproducing it here. "Most of you know about the hiking fatality and the other accident. It seems to me that conditions are as dangerous now as I have ever seen them in my thirty years of winter hiking. North and east facing slopes have have classic boiler plate and ice flow conditions. Boiler plate is ice glazed snow with a hard, slippery surface that will not consistently bear a hikers weight, but will cause the walker to break through at unpredictable points, possibly leading to a fall & slide than ends with impact with a rock or tree. Only snowshoes with the most aggressive type of crampons should be used and each step should be carefully placed. Flow ice is even worse and will be found on many trails with bare rock. Snowshoes, stabilizers or micro spikes are not good enough to ascend this type of ice, only crampons and an ice axe will provide a degree of safety to those who are trained in their use, and trying to descend these types of flows is much worse. That is probably why the hikers on Storm King were off trail, they were trying to bypass ice flows. All of us need to think very carefully about where we are going to hike right now and realize how dangerous and unpredictable steep slopes are right now. They are also very hard on your knees and ankles. If there are many more accidents, I wouldn't be surprised to see authorities close off some hiking areas. Please use some common sense and tame down your hiking adventures." Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 Here are the incidents he refers to: http://www.midhudsonnews.com/News/2011/February/10/hiker_resc_fatal-10Feb11.html Quote Link to comment
+Packanack Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 brian b posted similar story in Sunrise Stepoff, the other day and I read his hide log and it sounded like a close call. His quote: Cornfarrell, Waylesswood, and I snowshoed 6 miles on Schunemunk this Sunday. It took us 7 hours, and two of us dadgum near killed ourselves because of the ice. And we hid about 10 new caches for those of you who are brave enough to trudge out in this stuff. Quote Link to comment
+buttaskotch Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 this is a bit frightening, I have a few hikes, xc ski and ice climbing trips coming up in the next 3 weeks. Definite food for thought. I have forwarded to the group organizers. Anyone go up to Fahnestock? Doing the xc skiing this weekend. Quote Link to comment
+geobernd Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 I have hiked in what I would consider almost 1.5 terrain in the summer over the last two weeks with snowshoes and can fully echo Jonboy's warnings... I had two slides where the frozen layer on top of the snow was too frozen to stop the snowshoes but not frozen enough to grip the spikes that are in the snowshoes... Thankfully it was relatively level so besides a 'oh shi....' comment nothing happend... But I won't be going into any more challenging terrain until this mess is gone... Quote Link to comment
+cerberus1 Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 We have to don crampons or fishing korkers just to get from were the cars can get to in the driveway, up to the house / back. 3+ inches of solid ice. - about 200' a couple times a day. Most areas here have enough ice underneath, that even my fat can stays on top. This warm spell we're seeing coming in will actually make it much more dangerous. Couple of years ago I had cuts and bruises all over my shins from punching through it in spots. I wore my old soccer shinguards until the snow became soft again. I now carry a 100cm trekking axe and CJ grabbed my snowscopic. We like the hikes on crust and even some full ice (level when CJ's with me), but punching through (who knows what's underneath) is the thing that scares us. We like to hit the AT near Point Phillip or around Bake Oven Knob in Winter. No one but us around - wonderful. Quote Link to comment
+Packanack Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 http://www.news12.com/articleDetail.jsp?articleId=273426&position=1&news_type=news Quote Link to comment
+Fusilli Jerry Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 i was enjoying the winter hiking until the Great Freeze of 2011. i've wiped out a few times when the crust breaks underfoot. i've had it and can't wait until the thaw and the mud. i broke down and did a parking lot cache yesterday and enjoyed it. lol. my poor Lab of 14 years is so depressed he looks like a hound dog. i had been thinking about Storm King, one of my favorite places, the days before Brian posted the article. looking forward to getting up there this Spring. be careful out there friends. maybe we'll get a good thaw this week. this marks the end of this rant post/ Quote Link to comment
+Walkin' Ed Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I was out on Schunemunk on Friday and found the conditions perfect for my snowshoes. They kept me from falling through the boilerplate and the crampons kept me from sliding (gotta love those old Sherpas). I also carried a pair of instep crampons and a set of ten pointers but didn't need either, but I could have used the ice axe in a few spots. I was really careful to avoid any place where flow ice could form and wouldn't move until I was sure I had a secure footing. Six miles, fourteen caches and five hours later I was back at my car. I don't want to under estimate the danger but with the right preparation you can still enjoy winter. That being said, my calves still ache two days later. Quote Link to comment
+Packanack Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I went to high mtn Wayne , from big rock on Chicopee drive, followed the woods roads where the snow machines had made a trail, very pleasant. Micro spikes and dog . Met 3 hikers. Off trail snow still knee deep, but because the snow machines had tamped it down, it was a nice walk for anyone who wants to get out. Quote Link to comment
+Fusilli Jerry Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 walkin ed and packanack, glad to see you are getting out there. too bad my Costco snow shoes only lasted two outings before breaking. but that's it for my pity party. you guys are inspiring me to get out there this week. nice! Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 (edited) I was out today at Pyramid Mtn. Trails are packed and all I needed was Micro Spikes. A few feet off trail the snow was still deep. I saw people on the trail wearing everything from snowshoes to plain hiking boots. Most people seemed to be wearing Micro Spikes, they are popular for good reason. Snowshoes would have been overkill, but I wouldn't have wanted to be there without the Micro Spikes. I had crampons in the pack just in case. No need for them or snowshoes as long as I stayed on the trail. Edited February 13, 2011 by briansnat Quote Link to comment
+Harry Dolphin Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Okay. So I'm not a winter hiker! Did four cache and dshes on Rte 23 Saturday, to set up for find #3000 today. Oh, and BrianSnat's Gateway to the Pyramid. Couple of hundred feet, offtrail, shuffling across the ice crust (only broke through a few times, and I weigh 200#!) No FITS! So today, Andy Bear and I went for Hop-Skip and a Jump. Lake was frozen over. Great cache. Wouldn't even know there's a lake under the ice and snow. I wanted to continue on to Liffys Island, but Andy Bear does not enjoy cross country ice skating. Oh, well. Quote Link to comment
+macatac1961 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Or just go where the snow ain't. Quote Link to comment
polskikrol Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 walkin ed and packanack, glad to see you are getting out there. too bad my Costco snow shoes only lasted two outings before breaking. but that's it for my pity party. you guys are inspiring me to get out there this week. nice! Looks like my snowshoes lasted only a little better... 80 miles and the tube snapped w/o doing anything too crazy (ie, scraping up rocks). Let me tell you.. it was 'fun' bushwhacking 800 feet of elevation in 0.5 miles to the top of Kaaterskill High Peak in the Catskills w/ broken snowshoes. Anyone that hates winter have any MSR lightning ascents for sale? Quote Link to comment
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