UV light

[+deranja]

Ok, i want to use a UV pen in a multi cache i have planned and i was just curious if you wrote on say a phone booth for example with the pen is it considered graffitti or against the guidlines since the ink would technically be invisable?

[+secretagentbill]

I think I'd consider it graffiti. But I guess it's not as bad as something more visible. But anyway, I was thinking about using UV fluorescing ink in a multi as well. But I was going to write on a paper that is inside a physical container. Ideas for all of the stages haven't come together yet, but I think it's gonna have a secret agent theme. I've got all winter to plan it though

[+mpilchfamily]

I'm pretty sure it would still be considered defacing private property. Besides how long is the ink going to last in the elements. You may have to go out and rewrite the info every week.

[+StarBrand]

It is defacing public property. I too would think it wouldn't hold up to the elements and phone booths are disappearing rapidly everywhere in the country anyway.

[+secondgunman]

I'm working on a similar project and have wondered the same thing. Sure, you're writing on public or private property......but it's invisible ink. If a tree falls in the forest and nobody's there to hear it, and all that.

 

The ink I have is solvent based and not water soluble. I'm certain that I wouldn't have to touch it up every week, or even every month. On top of that, I have a few locations in mind that wouldn't be exposed to the elements enough to bother worrying about. The location and the type of ink combined go a long way toward eliminating my concern over the longevity of the marking. That just leaves worrying about whether or not it would be considered defacing property.

 

If you have ink that is TOTALLY invisible to the naked eye under white light; AND you can write in a location that would not be exposed to the elements; AND the writing is in a place that nobody would see anyway, even it you were to use a regular marker.....then what's the harm??

[+TerraViators]

I'd look for it.

[+StarBrand]

Lets put it this way....

 

If a LEO caught you putting said ink on a public object - how do you think they would feel about it?? How about the person responsible for the object?? How about a member of the public??

[knowschad]

Lets put it this way....

 

If a LEO caught you putting said ink on a public object - how do you think they would feel about it?? How about the person responsible for the object?? How about a member of the public??

Dress and act like a mime and the LEO would probably not have a problem with it.

 

This exact subject came up before. It seems to me that opinions varied widely.

[+mpilchfamily]

Solvent based or not, direct sunlight does allot of damage and could ruin the inks affect under UV light.

 

I say use the ink but put it on a cache container as the first stage.

[+kunarion]

I say use the ink but put it on a cache container as the first stage.

Yes. Use your own container, or a sign (such as a magnetic sheet), or even a fake leaf. You have more control over your objects and maintenance is simpler (drop a new one when the old one fades). I found a UV magnifying light for 99 cents on ebay (free shipping!), and immediately thought about being pretty cruel with numbers on a fire tack .

Edited January 30, 2011 by kunarion

[+johnling]

Ok, i want to use a UV pen in a multi cache i have planned and i was just curious if you wrote on say a phone booth for example with the pen is it considered graffitti or against the guidlines since the ink would technically be invisable?

 

Graffitti asside a phone book is not a fixed object. It gets pages torn out and the whole book is changed at least once a year. That said, it probably would not get approved. Kool idea though.

Edited January 30, 2011 by johnling

[+Chief301]

Lets put it this way....

 

If a LEO caught you putting said ink on a public object - how do you think they would feel about it?? How about the person responsible for the object?? How about a member of the public??

 

Ink? What ink, officer?

[+bafl01]

use a magnetic plate or strip of magnet, write on that in the uv pen, and place that on the cache. you could do some creative stuff with that such as making the magnet look like it is part of the structure (telephone)

[+firemanjim903mfd]

OK not to change the subject . Where do you get the pen at ?

[+Castle Mischief]

It's really up to the cop that catches you and the judge that hears your case.

[+kunarion]

OK not to change the subject . Where do you get the pen at ?

Google for companies that sell permanent ink "UV security ink" pens. They come in various wavelengths and colors that show up best in particular lighting. The "blue" seems best for ordinary UV lights (such as LEDS). It looks especially good on paper or on cloth like “silk plant” leaves. I’m considering ways to protect such leaves in weather.

 

If you draw on a smooth non-porous surface like metal or glass, the ink can reflect in certain lighting conditions, since it is a line of permanent ink chemicals. It will fade outdoors just like other "permanent ink", but may become unreadable sooner. It will affect some surfaces (permanently changing the spot you wrote on). You will need planning, and a special UV light, in order to do maintenance on whatever you've written. And re-tracing the lines later, you risk making them more & more "visible". Is it coords? What's the plan if the coords start to become obvious?

 

Grafitti might be perfect in some very special spot, just like digging a hole through asphalt to hide a cache will work great in maybe one place on earth. But just because adding solvents and other chemicals to property that's not yours might be "invisible", be sure you've thought it over carefully before you do that.

Edited January 31, 2011 by kunarion

[+lachupa]

Maybe but it sounds kind of cool though

[+lachupa]

Maybe but it sounds kind of cool though

[knowschad]

This exact subject came up before. It seems to me that opinions varied widely.

 

Found it!

[+deranja]

Thanks for all the feed back, it was just a question that popped in my head. Thanks for all the sugestions.

[+kunarion]

double post (clicked wrong button again, sorry)

Edited February 1, 2011 by kunarion

[+roziecakes]

I think this would be really a cool thing to do if the UV ink was written on the inside lid of the containers at each stage. Really a fun idea, but I agree that writing on the phone booth would probably be a bad idea, even if it were virtually invisible. It wouldn't bother me personally, but I think it might set the standards for other kinds of graffiti and other bad behaviors. I always think about who I'm going to influence when I put out my caches.

[+BBI Dragon]

I just had a UV light required multi published. I experimented with solvent UV ink on several metal surfaces and after about 5 weeks of winter weather (mostly overcast days) I had about a 35% fading of the ink. One location was facing south (sun side) and it faded the most. It was also on flat black and showed faintly in regular daylight.

 

I ended up using discs of natural wood for the waypoints. Each marker/waypoint had to be covered with a polyurethane coating so that the UV pen ink didn't bleed into the wood. Found out the need for this by trial and error. Then I covered the coordinates in UV pen ink with several more layers of clear coat, one that has a UV light resistance to it to protect it from sunlight. The location is a dense forested area so the sunlight doesn't make it to the ground very much, and I placed the waypoint marks in a manner so that they would always be in the shade.

 

After the cache was published the first several hunters liked the concept very much. It has been suggested that a visit to a pet store as a source for getting an inexpensive UV light (used for spotting pet stains - $6 to $14). Also suggested was taking along a regular light to find the waypoint markers then reading them with the UV light.

 

I have plans for two more UV light required hides. One will involved a laminated map (multiple copies in the first container) that can only be read using a UV light. The container will protect the ink from the sunlight. The other idea I have is a more delicate approach using a rubber stamp to mark a trail for the hunters to follow. I expect it will need maintenance every other month or so even with careful placement of the trail markers. I may cover the prints with the UV resistant clear coat too. I've been also looking at UV protection plastic to protect the UV ink from the sunlight.

[+kunarion]

Each marker/waypoint had to be covered with a polyurethane coating so that the UV pen ink didn't bleed into the wood. Found out the need for this by trial and error. Then I covered the coordinates in UV pen ink with several more layers of clear coat, one that has a UV light resistance to it to protect it from sunlight.

Sounds like a plan. I've considered a similar idea. I wonder how long they hold up, before requiring a fresh application & coating.

Edited February 9, 2011 by kunarion

[+fizzymagic]

The ink I have is solvent based and not water soluble. I'm certain that I wouldn't have to touch it up every week, or even every month.

 

No opinion on the matter of permission, but you are likely wrong here. Experience from other cachers is that this ink degrades pretty quickly when exposed to high levels of UV light (e.g. sunlight).