Guest worldtraveler Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 How may a Travel Bug be assisted on its mission without compromising the "spirit of the game?" Should its travels be left to chance, or may two or more geocachers communicate and coordinate to expedite its journey? Example: Travel Bug "Royal Hong Kong Police" (TB229) wants to get to Hong Kong. Geocacher #1 has it in his possession, but he can't take it to Hong Kong. Geocacher #2 can take it there, but he doesn't have it. Questions: 1. Is it safe to assume that mailing the Travel Bug would be considered a serious breach of etiquette? 2. Is communication between Geocachers #1 & #2 and/or others for the purpose of assisting the travel bug on its journey acceptable? 3. If communication is acceptable, are there limitations? 3A. May Geocacher #1 announce ahead of time when and/or where he plans to place the Travel Bug, or should Geocacher # 2 and other interested parties simply rely on postings after it is placed? 3B. May Geocacher #1 communicate the Travel Bug number to others so that they more easily track its movement? 3C. If the answer to questions 2 and 3B is "yes", may the communication take place by "logging" it on the Travel Bug's page or as a topic in this forum? I'm new to geocaching, so please excuse my ignorance. I've read all of the recent posts that I thought may address this topic, but found nothing applicable. Thanks. ------------------ Worldtraveler Quote Link to comment
Guest jeremy Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 I'm not sure if there has been a rule of etiquette, being that Travel Bugs are only several weeks old, but I think that mailing it is probably the only thing that would make me raise an eyebrow. A friend of mine had one he picked up in New York, then flew back home and placed it in a cache here in the PNW. Maybe as long as its carried by a person through its entire journey, it would be considered ok. Heck, every bug after they were "born" travelled from Tennessee to Seattle, then to the location the person shipped it to. That would be some decent mileage before it ever made it to its first cache! Jeremy Quote Link to comment
Guest Artful Dodger Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 I have a few Bugs out there and I have a few thoughts on the matter. I don't believe that mailing the Bug to other Geocachers during its travels is acceptable. Bugs should be retrieved from caches otherwise it is out of the boundaries of the game. I do believe it is quite acceptable to mail a bug to another geocacher BEFORE a Bug is placed for the first time. In that way, Geocacher #1 mails it to Geocacher #2, who places it for the first time. Thereafter, the Bug travels from cache to cache. Secondly, if you grab a Bug, the system always assumes that it is with you until you place it in another cache. Naturally, you can get someone else (Geocacher #2) to place it somewhere else but it would be up to you to log the new cache. It sort of screws up the logistics of the game.. With regards to 3B, I have asked Jeremy if he would allow a Watch List option for Bugs as I have many friends/family that want to follow my GeoMonkeys. Hopefully this will answer your question too. Just a few thoughts..... [This message has been edited by Artful Dodger (edited 17 October 2001).] Quote Link to comment
Guest worldtraveler Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 Thanks, that confirms my assumptions. Please indulge a further twist on the scenario. Geocachers #1 & #2 are remote from one another. Two questions: 1. May they communicate to identify a cache or general location that both can get to, and coordinate their travel plans so that the release by #1 may result in a capture by #2 (hopefully)? 2. Geocachers #1 & #2 are so remote that they cannot get to a common location. May other geocachers be enlisted via this forum or the specific Travel Bug's page to coordinate successive captures/releases to get the bug to Geocacher #2 or its final destination? ------------------ Worldtraveler Quote Link to comment
Guest Artful Dodger Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 With regards to both your questions (my opinion only ) As long as the transference of the Bug happens from cache to cache, then the correspondence between Geocachers is incidental. As long as the Geocachers involved in the Bug's movement complete the correct steps (Find the Bug, Hide the Bug at geocaches) then any form of correspondence between them is incidental. This forum or private email should be perfectly acceptable to help coordinate the Bug's movement. Quote Link to comment
Guest crusso Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 As I am about to release my first bug I am following this topic w/interest. My thoughts are that the bugs should travel strictly by being removed from caches & placed in other caches by the person who removed them from the previous cache. If this person travels, flies, drives to other sites, that's fine. I don't think the bugs should be handed off for someone else to place or be mailed. If you grab a bug, you should accept the responsibility of placing it in another cache that places it in a direction of travel concurrent with the wishes of the person who released the bug to begin with. The whole idea and the fun of the bugs is to trace thier travel as they go from place to place via caches. Otherwise you might as well just mail them directly to the person they are ultimately designed to get to. It seems to me that communication from geocacher to geocacher about planned placement of bugs is fine but this communication should be carried out on the bug site so that everyone can follow the bugs path. Interested in other replies. imf16@aol.com Quote Link to comment
Guest progun Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 I don't know about anyone else, and being new to Geocaching and Travel Bugs, I would rather see them move on their own. I am planning on releasing a couple just as soon as they get here, and I really wouldn't want to have geocachers get together and plan out a strategy on how to get it where I want it to go. I want it to take it's own course, and let it go where it may. I think part of this is that not all Travel Bugs will make it where we want them to, and part of the thrill will be when they do. If I wanted to make sure it got to the state or country I intended, I would just find a geocacher there and mail it to them, what would be the fun in that? I could also find a fellow geocacher here in my area that is going that way and make sure that they have it, but I also fail to see what fun that would be. I say let them go on their own, they will either make it, or they won't. Quote Link to comment
Guest Artful Dodger Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 Both Crusso and Progun have valid points. As long as the Travel Bug is picked up at a cache and left behind at a cache BY THE SAME GEOCACHER, the process is complete. I agree that the Travel Bugs should travel along merrily where they go. Some of the Bugs do have some specific goals. One of my Bugs wants to visit Australia, it would help if he made it to California first as it would be easier to catch a geocacher going to Oz. If a geocacher posted a message here saying that he is going to California and could pick up the TB if it was placed in a certain geographical area, it might give someone else the idea to pick up the TB from its current cache and place it in the area where it can be picked up for its trip to California. Same scenario for another Bug that wants to visit Canada. Going North with the help of geocachers is the idea. I can see where correspondence might help. ...naturally the above scenario is for Travel Bugs with certain mission parameters ( ) instead of roaming around with no fixed goal. [This message has been edited by Artful Dodger (edited 17 October 2001).] Quote Link to comment
Guest jeremy Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 Just so you know, I'll be adding the ability shortly where you can actually track your own physical progress (non geocache) in the logs as well. That way if you pass it on to someone you meet you can indicate via geolocation where you met and that can be logged as well. Person-to-person logs may happen. I'll set it up for that contingency. And in my opinion, as long as you either indirectly (through geocaches) or directly (through handoff) transfer a Bug from one person to another, I have no problems with it. Shipping by any method other than perhaps by helium balloon or corked bottle just seems unfair. I do agree if you ship a bug before you launch it, there's no issue. And throw it all out the window if a geocacher decides that s/he wants to ship it as part of the mission parameters (Thanks Artful Dodger). These are just guidelines, anyway. Just FYI, I just added the watch list to the web site. Jeremy Quote Link to comment
Guest Artful Dodger Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 quote:Originally posted by jeremy:Just FYI, I just added the watch list to the web site. Jeremy Very cool! Thanks a bunch!! Quote Link to comment
Guest worldtraveler Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 l topic and in light of the variety of opinions and no pre-existing etiquette, perhaps it would be best to establish one of asking the bug's owner if he/she has a preference how it travels. Or better yet, let the owner designate what level of "assistance" is permissable for the bug when its mission is established. During WWII some Allied pilots who had been shot down behind enemy lines managed to get back home by traveling "solo"; others had the help of a network of resistance fighters. Similar, though MUCH less serious scenario here. I'm sure the owners' desires will be followed IF they are known. ------------------ Worldtraveler [This message has been edited by worldtraveler (edited 17 October 2001).] Quote Link to comment
Guest Ttepee Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 Ok since this has been brought up let me toss this out here and see what you all think. I have a travel bug which I have not released yet http://www.geocaching.com/track/track_detail.asp?ID=59 His only travel destination expectation is to return to our annual Memorial Day camping trip yearly. It is a 7 family annual get together that we've had going for 7 years now. I'd love to be able to share with all the families the progress that Gilbert makes. I don't want to limit his travel potential though so I have written it up so that if he is too far away to legimately retrieve from the current location my hope is that someone will let me know so that I can send them postage... but then would also mail Gilbert back to them after the camping weekend so that he can pick up where he left off. I didn't think there would be a problem with it but if it's unethical then maybe I need to remove that option. Any opinions on this one? Thanks Tina Quote Link to comment
Guest DenaliNW Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 I think Jeremy may have answered my question in his last post, but I will throw out my scenario for your thoughts. Shortly before the Travel Bugs were introduced to the game, I created a cache The Dam Cache with a hitchhiker in it (Buzz Lightyear). He had made some limited progress around the Portland metro area when I thought it would be nice to rewrite Buzz's intructions, and make them a little more permanent by laminating them. Seeing that he had just been picked up by an individual, I emailed him, and asked if he would hold onto the guy while I put together some newer, clearer instructions. He agreed, and included some other great suggestions, one of which was attaching a Travel Bug to Buzz. Our plan was for me to mail him these things as I completed them. I'm currently waiting for the bug to arrive, but would it be inappropriate to mail it in this situation? This also raises some other questions that may have been discussed elsewhere. 1) How do I release the bug, when the other person would be the first to physically place it in a cache (I think Jeremy is addressing this issue, if I read him correctly, i.e. I could log that it was transferred into the hands of another person)? I want to be the owner and the tracker of the Buzz bug. 2) Is there a way to take the logs I have made of Buzz's travels to date and include them under the travel bug description, or would that not be a true reflection of the bug's travel? [This message has been edited by DenaliNW (edited 17 October 2001).] [This message has been edited by DenaliNW (edited 17 October 2001).] Quote Link to comment
Guest jeremy Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 In some cases (Like Buzz Lightyear), I very much would like to recreate his travels through the Travel Bugs. I did this with an alien from New York, and will be doing it for Moun10bike's stash hopper. If I know the usernames and the caches, I can recreate the travels for you. Just email me at contact at geocaching dot com. Jeremy Quote Link to comment
Guest Markwell Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 Wow! I never thought of that Jeremy! I wish I had actually done something for Shaggy and Scooby (3420) while they were still in the area, then. Oh well. Last reports they were headed your way anyway. Quote Link to comment
Guest DenaliNW Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 quote:Originally posted by jeremy:In some cases (Like Buzz Lightyear), I very much would like to recreate his travels through the Travel Bugs. I did this with an alien from New York, and will be doing it for Moun10bike's stash hopper. If I know the usernames and the caches, I can recreate the travels for you. Just email me at contact at geocaching dot com. Jeremy The time you put into this is amazing. Thank you. I will email you with the appropriate info all is ready. Hope it's in the mail today. Quote Link to comment
Guest gnbrotz Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 quote:Originally posted by jeremy:I do agree if you ship a bug before you launch it, there's no issue. My first hitchiker is going to be a run-away. I plan to mail it to the West Coast to be launched and then have it come back home to one of my caches. ------------------ Greg N39°54.705' W077°33.137' My geocaching page Quote Link to comment
Guest AlienPuppy Posted October 17, 2001 Share Posted October 17, 2001 Regarding bug transportation... I plan to put the travel rules on the bug page itself. I was thinking that I would state the bug is "afraid to fly", so air travel would be out. So, I think if you have a specific way you'd like the bug to travel, specify it on the bug's page. /AlienPuppy Quote Link to comment
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