Angry Cacher

[+Sporknuts]

I'm not one to read or use forums all that much, therefore I didn't know where to post this. In my area I am finding it to be common place to place a cache and not maintain it. This is not only irreponsible but it takes the fun out of geocaching. Geocaching is a high tech game meant to get people out of the house and see new and wonderful things. However, finding moldy logs, ruined coords on multi's, and other such garbage can seriously ruin the game for others. Also, while i'm on this "responsibilty" kick, please if you decide not to cache anymore at least maintain your own caches or remove them. I'm tired of running across caches where the owner has just walked away and not logged on to geocaching.com in over a year. Remember Geocachers, if you leave a cache out there and then ignore it, it become litters and defeats the purpose of CITO. Happy caching everybody

[+captnemo]

I'm not one to read or use forums all that much, therefore I didn't know where to post this. In my area I am finding it to be common place to place a cache and not maintain it. This is not only irreponsible but it takes the fun out of geocaching. Geocaching is a high tech game meant to get people out of the house and see new and wonderful things. However, finding moldy logs, ruined coords on multi's, and other such garbage can seriously ruin the game for others. Also, while i'm on this "responsibilty" kick, please if you decide not to cache anymore at least maintain your own caches or remove them. I'm tired of running across caches where the owner has just walked away and not logged on to geocaching.com in over a year. Remember Geocachers, if you leave a cache out there and then ignore it, it become litters and defeats the purpose of CITO. Happy caching everybody

Agreed but I don't let anyone ruin my experence I'll enjoy a good cache find regardless of the condition of the cache.

 

If you find a cache report it as needing maintenance and say so in your log.

Edited October 20, 2010 by captnemo

[+kunarion]

finding moldy logs, ruined coords on multi's, and other such garbage can seriously ruin the game for others.

You can do a "Found It" log, then follow that with a "Needs Maintenance" log. I don't do that on all the soaked logs I find, but that's only because I'd feel like a one-man wrecking ball. But it's an option.

[+TerraViators]

It's a huge problem. About 1/3 of the caches I find need some kind of maintenace, are owned by phantom cachers, have an ALR or bad coords.

[+Sporknuts]

I'm not one to read or use forums all that much, therefore I didn't know where to post this. In my area I am finding it to be common place to place a cache and not maintain it. This is not only irreponsible but it takes the fun out of geocaching. Geocaching is a high tech game meant to get people out of the house and see new and wonderful things. However, finding moldy logs, ruined coords on multi's, and other such garbage can seriously ruin the game for others. Also, while i'm on this "responsibilty" kick, please if you decide not to cache anymore at least maintain your own caches or remove them. I'm tired of running across caches where the owner has just walked away and not logged on to geocaching.com in over a year. Remember Geocachers, if you leave a cache out there and then ignore it, it become litters and defeats the purpose of CITO. Happy caching everybody

Agreed but I don't let anyone ruin my experence I'll enjoy a good cache find regardless of the condition of the cache.

 

If you find a cache report it as needing maintenance and say so in your log.

I always state so on my log. Really the problem lies with those cachers that place and cache and then decide not to geocache anymore.

[Andronicus]

My rule of thumb for absent owners that need maint. is a NA log. The exeption is for "exeptional" caches (very old, or otherwise irreplaceble)

[+Sporknuts]

My rule of thumb for absent owners that need maint. is a NA log. The exeption is for "exeptional" caches (very old, or otherwise irreplaceble)

My purpose for this topic was to raise concern and ask people be a little more conciderate. A little concideration goes a long. I'm not looking for anybody to lose the spot. I just want them to take care of it for future visitors or adopt it out or something.

[+GrateBear]

I have to question the value of any posting in the forums that lectures geocachers on how to maintain their caches. Chances are somewhere between slim and none, and slim just left town, that those who don't maintain caches don't read the forums, and even if they did, would not do anything about it. l

Also, why let it upset you? It took years for the number of caches to reach 1,000,000, which was not that long ago. And now, the number is closing in on 1,250,000. It's just going to get worse, as a lot of people will think this is a great hobby/game/whatever, then grow tired of it a few months later and bail. Look at how many new cachers want to place a cache within weeks of signing on--chances are they will be weak hides and many will be abandoned within months.

Life is too short to stress out about things like this that don't really amount to all that much.

[+Sporknuts]

I have to question the value of any posting in the forums that lectures geocachers on how to maintain their caches. Chances are somewhere between slim and none, and slim just left town, that those who don't maintain caches don't read the forums, and even if they did, would not do anything about it. l

Also, why let it upset you? It took years for the number of caches to reach 1,000,000, which was not that long ago. And now, the number is closing in on 1,250,000. It's just going to get worse, as a lot of people will think this is a great hobby/game/whatever, then grow tired of it a few months later and bail. Look at how many new cachers want to place a cache within weeks of signing on--chances are they will be weak hides and many will be abandoned within months.

Life is too short to stress out about things like this that don't really amount to all that much.

I suppose you're right. However, a geocacher of 2wks should be just as curtious as a geocacher of 10 yrs. If a caches is placed is should be maintained or removed. It's right there in the geocaching rules.

[+Harry Dolphin]

My rule of thumb for absent owners that need maint. is a NA log. The exeption is for "exeptional" caches (very old, or otherwise irreplaceble)

My purpose for this topic was to raise concern and ask people be a little more conciderate. A little concideration goes a long. I'm not looking for anybody to lose the spot. I just want them to take care of it for future visitors or adopt it out or something.

 

In my humble opinion, the majority of caches needing maintenance for any period of time were put out by cachers who hid their caches, then stopped geocaching, for whatever reason. Unfortunately, these are not people who are going to perform maintenance, or remove caches that require maintenance. 'Consideration' is lost on them. They left, and slammed the door behind themselves. NA.

Unfortunately, I do know of a few cachers who never seem to perform maintenance chores. Some archive them whenever a problem arises (without removing the cache). Others just ignore them. Those get archived when someone posts the NA. But, again in my humble opionion, those are a very small minority of cachers.

[mtbikernate]

I've seen this problem in my area a lot recently. It doesn't bother me per se, except that there are caches that have had a NM attribute on them for several months to a year. In one case, a cacher has two caches in a city park that are "temporarily disabled" for several months, stating that he/she has removed them due to the difficulty of maintaining caches in the particular park.

 

I'd be happy to see a lot of these caches get archived to open the area up some and clear clutter off of my searches.

[+ventura_kids]

Around our area, we all replace messed up logsheets, and post better coordinates if they are bad.

No one takes offense to this type of help.

[+BlueDeuce]

I have to question the value of any posting in the forums that lectures geocachers on how to maintain their caches. Chances are somewhere between slim and none, and slim just left town, that those who don't maintain caches don't read the forums, and even if they did, would not do anything about it.

 

True, that's why it's best to post a Needs Maintenance. I find that reviewers want a contact history documented on the cache page so that they know the owner has been notified and has had plenty of time to address the issue, before considering archiving the cache.

 

Also, why let it upset you? It took years for the number of caches to reach 1,000,000, which was not that long ago. And now, the number is closing in on 1,250,000. It's just going to get worse, as a lot of people will think this is a great hobby/game/whatever, then grow tired of it a few months later and bail. Look at how many new cachers want to place a cache within weeks of signing on--chances are they will be weak hides and many will be abandoned within months.

Life is too short to stress out about things like this that don't really amount to all that much.

 

I don't have a million caches to search for, just a bunch in my area. I don't see anything wrong with expecting they be properly maintained.

[+SwineFlew]

I hit NA if they are local cacher that put hundreds of new one out but dont maintenance them. Some cachers got too many for their own good.

[+Mr. Wilson & a Mt. Goat]

Some cachers got too many for their own good.

A cacher in my area got started hiding about 30 caches Apr09. He was new at the sport and hid a lot of them using some crummy iphone coords and cheap containers. Finally, today, he decided to archive about 15 of them that had been missing for many many months. Free's up a lot of space!

He's also the kind of guy who hid about 5 nanos in bushes and under rocks. All those are still there of course.

I was soooooo happy to get all those notifications on my phone today!

Edited October 20, 2010 by Mr. Wilson & a Mt. Goat

[sdarken]

Also, while i'm on this "responsibilty" kick, please if you decide not to cache anymore at least maintain your own caches or remove them. I'm tired of running across caches where the owner has just walked away and not logged on to geocaching.com in over a year. Remember Geocachers, if you leave a cache out there and then ignore it, it become litters and defeats the purpose of CITO. Happy caching everybody

 

Cachers that play the game for a while, toss out one or two crappy hides and leave the game are one of my pet peeves too. I think you've got lots of good feedback in this thread. If you don't like what you find, do your bit to help the problem. Fix minor problems (like adding a new log sheet). Post a NM log if the cache really does need lots of maintenance (like a damaged container) and, in the event of really bad problems, use a NA log (sparingly).

[+Chokecherry]

Where I am vacation caches remain a problem. Cachers who live 200 miles away tossing a bad container into the woods and then can't get back to maintain it.

 

Then there's the cachers who have been around forever, continue to log into the site and even make some finds who have a ton of bad containers out that they just don't feel like they should maintain.

 

And finally it's the cachers who left the game shortly after they started.

 

I don't have time to maintain a bunch of caches. I plan on putting out about 2 once I secure the containers. But that's realistically all I can take care of at this point in my life.

 

I put up some NM logs this weekend. Two of them resulted in the owner archiving the caches which were hopelessly wet. I've put an NA up on one nano that one wasn't maintained and two was in a park that was being remodeled rendering the cache location not accessible unless you want to damage the remodel. That, a few months later, is still sitting there waiting for cachers to destroy the area.

 

But I've put NM up on other caches only to see them never get maintained as evidenced by later logs indicating the same problems. I'm always surprised about how many will note in a found log that the cache is falling apart or wet beyond words but won't put a NM up on it.

[+Sporknuts]

Thanks everybody for the great replies. Many of the suggestions I regularly follow and some of the suggestion I never really thought about and will take to heart. Geocaching is a great sport so lets get out there, have fun, and remember to CITO.

[Skippermark]

My purpose for this topic was to raise concern and ask people be a little more conciderate. A little concideration goes a long. I'm not looking for anybody to lose the spot. I just want them to take care of it for future visitors or adopt it out or something.

The problem is that non-active cachers or those not maintaining their caches, so they probably won't see this thread.

 

If a cache has issues, there's a few ways to handle it. If it's someone local and they are active, you might just drop them an email letting them know the cache has problems.

 

Or, you can post a Needs Maintenance log. Some owners, especially those with a lot of hides, filter on that and can quickly see if a cache that has issues.

 

After a few weeks if the the cache hasn't been fixed, it's totally appropriate to post a Needs Archived log if the cache is "beyond hope." If the cache needs a new log or something, many finders will just drop a new one into the container when they're in the area.

 

When you post a NA log, the reviewer will not archive it right away and will give the owner some time to fix it up first.

[Skippermark]

I wanted to add that it's surprising how many cachers are reluctant to say anything in their logs.

 

We recently found a cache that had a completely full log book, and there was nowhere to sign. The last legible signature was from August, but the cache page had at least a dozen found it logs since then, and not one of them mentioned the full logbook.

 

Cache owners appreciate hearing things about their caches. I'm always happy when someone says, "Log is getting full. Looks like enough room for 5 or 6 more signatures..." and things like that. That way, when if I'm going to be in the area, I can make sure I bring a new logbook out.

[Andronicus]

My rule of thumb for absent owners that need maint. is a NA log. The exeption is for "exeptional" caches (very old, or otherwise irreplaceble)

My purpose for this topic was to raise concern and ask people be a little more conciderate. A little concideration goes a long. I'm not looking for anybody to lose the spot. I just want them to take care of it for future visitors or adopt it out or something.

 

In my humble opinion, the majority of caches needing maintenance for any period of time were put out by cachers who hid their caches, then stopped geocaching, for whatever reason. Unfortunately, these are not people who are going to perform maintenance, or remove caches that require maintenance. 'Consideration' is lost on them. They left, and slammed the door behind themselves. NA.

Unfortunately, I do know of a few cachers who never seem to perform maintenance chores. Some archive them whenever a problem arises (without removing the cache). Others just ignore them. Those get archived when someone posts the NA. But, again in my humble opionion, those are a very small minority of cachers.

Further to my first post, when I post a NA log for a delapitaded cache who's owner is not active, I volunteer to do CITO on the Geotrash. Then I post a note for the CO that if they want the trash back to contact me.

[+addisonbr]

Cache owners appreciate hearing things about their caches. I'm always happy when someone says, "Log is getting full. Looks like enough room for 5 or 6 more signatures..." and things like that. That way, when if I'm going to be in the area, I can make sure I bring a new logbook out.

Agreed. I also thirst for DNFs. It's the best way I can tell if there is a problem.

[+dakboy]

The people who need to see this thread never will.

 

If you see a cache in bad shape, post NM or NA. If it's NA, and it gets archived without a peep from the owner, CITO it yourself.

 

Don't feel bad about someone "losing their spot" - if the spot mattered to them, they'd maintain their cache (yeah, I can be a little blunt).

[Andronicus]

Double post. I even checked to make sure it haden't been posted befor re-posting. Arggg....

Edited October 21, 2010 by Andronicus

[Andronicus]

The people who need to see this thread never will.

 

If you see a cache in bad shape, post NM or NA. If it's NA, and it gets archived without a peep from the owner, CITO it yourself.

 

Don't feel bad about someone "losing their spot" - if the spot mattered to them, they'd maintain their cache (yeah, I can be a little blunt).

A little blunt? Yes.

Correct? Also Yes.

 

I only pull out the NA if the CO has not logged on for a very long time, or there is an old unanswered NM log. What is 'a very long time'? Depends on my mood I think. 6 months, 1 year, something like that.

[+lachupa]

The answer is liberal use of the ignore feature. I generally skim the logs before I head out to look for a cache.

 

There a multi that is very near my parent's house that looked rather interesting until you read the logs. Someone placed it, someone else adopted it, the coordinates are wildly off (one stage is a monument that people found based on description and it nowhere near the coordinates), and now the final cache appears to be missing. It went on the ignore list.

[+dakboy]

The answer is liberal use of the ignore feature. I generally skim the logs before I head out to look for a cache.

 

There a multi that is very near my parent's house that looked rather interesting until you read the logs. Someone placed it, someone else adopted it, the coordinates are wildly off (one stage is a monument that people found based on description and it nowhere near the coordinates), and now the final cache appears to be missing. It went on the ignore list.

I would have flagged it as NA, or at least NM. If the cache has that many issues, at a minimum other cachers should be alerted to the situation. If it hasn't been rectified, then it should be archived.

[+OldLog]

When searching for caches I look at past logs. If a one star cache all of a sudden comes up with a lot DNF you can pretty much guess the owner doesn't care about it. Unfortunately yours is not the only area with a lot of caches that need maintenance. I think after a bit people just lose interest and walk away.

[+ObeyTheCorgi]

I DNF'd on a cache off a trail in Monterey, CA and then later learned that the CO had died. There are lots of legitimate reasons why a cache may lose its mom or dad, but I hate to see those unmaintained caches on my search list too.

 

A couple of times I've posted NM, then e-mailed the CO to see if they need any help, but I never know what to do if I don't hear back from them. I don't like to post NA.

 

Once a cache near my house, that I had already found, went missing. I knew what the missing cache had been, I'd posted a NM, e-mailed the CO and the CO didn't contact me, so I replaced it myself and now I have it on my watchlist so that I can maintain it - more like a foster parent, than an adopted parent. Since the CO doesn't seem to be around anymore, I wasn't sure how to go about adopting it. It was a cool hide and I didn't want to see it archived, but I'm not sure if it's OK for me to keep maintaining it in this way. There's another cache near me in the same situation. It used to be on an electrical box and frustrated cachers are tearing the thing apart. Again, I e-mailed the CO, posted NM and I'd like to replace the cache, but not sure if that's the proper etiquette.

 

Thoughts?

[+Sol seaker]

Around our area, we all replace messed up logsheets, and post better coordinates if they are bad.

No one takes offense to this type of help.

 

We do this in my area.

 

One cache was missing and it turned out the owner, who no one knew, had died.

 

Someone in the community who had found it, replaced it as a tribute to him. The community is keeping up his other caches (he had a link on his cache pages, which was his personal website, which his family members put a memorial on).

 

I figure I only find each cache one time so it's my job to be checking to see which ones need maintenance.

 

If they need maintenance I write a "needs maintenance" on them.

 

If it seems they are missing, I'll put a watch on it. If after a long time it keeps getting DNF's I write a note to the cache owner. If the cache owner is out of the game, and it's not of caching historical value, I write a "Needs Archiving".

 

I figure it's the job of the cachers to report these things.

 

Why would I get upset about it if it's my job?

[+Sol seaker]

I DNF'd on a cache off a trail in Monterey, CA and then later learned that the CO had died. There are lots of legitimate reasons why a cache may lose its mom or dad, but I hate to see those unmaintained caches on my search list too.

 

A couple of times I've posted NM, then e-mailed the CO to see if they need any help, but I never know what to do if I don't hear back from them. I don't like to post NA.

 

Once a cache near my house, that I had already found, went missing. I knew what the missing cache had been, I'd posted a NM, e-mailed the CO and the CO didn't contact me, so I replaced it myself and now I have it on my watchlist so that I can maintain it - more like a foster parent, than an adopted parent. Since the CO doesn't seem to be around anymore, I wasn't sure how to go about adopting it. It was a cool hide and I didn't want to see it archived, but I'm not sure if it's OK for me to keep maintaining it in this way. There's another cache near me in the same situation. It used to be on an electrical box and frustrated cachers are tearing the thing apart. Again, I e-mailed the CO, posted NM and I'd like to replace the cache, but not sure if that's the proper etiquette.

 

Thoughts?

 

I don't see anything wrong with asking the owner to adopt his cache. If he's not maintaining it, it may come as a relief to him.

 

If it's a really cool cache, there's no reason why you should not be able to maintain it.

 

Only the CO can adopt it out. It would be better if you can adopt it, but if that can't happen, then maintain it if you like.

 

I like the term, "Foster parent"

 

We've got some caches around here that are maintained by the community.

[+Wooden Cyclist]

There is a cacher in SW Michigan that is known for using leaky containers and not maintaining them. A few months ago he archived all his caches then re-listed them without even changing the logs. Many were still wet.

 

Mad more than a few people mad.

[+armadillogal]

What is making me mad lately is finding out that people are taking the cache containers. I had a new bison tube out on a chain with a split ring and you know it didn't break by itself especially when I was told the log was stuck in the split ring. Also people who steal ammo cans and leave the ziplocs just laying on the ground.

No ethics! I have done cache maintenance several times lately...and I wouldn't dream of stealing a container. I post DNF's. I have over 25 plants and 300 finds. I love this hobby but why do people have to be nasty? It takes the fun out of it getting notified your cache has been "broken".

[mtbikernate]

I posted my first NA log today. I was out in an area placing stages for my own new multi, and I had not yet found the caches in the area.

 

One I knew was a trouble cache. It had only been placed a couple months ago, but it was a new cacher (a boy scout, it seems) who put it out there. I suspect he did so without permission, because he placed it in an area that has been in active development (for a rec trails/gardens area) for about 1.5 yrs now. Work crews have been variously shredding the underbrush getting the area ready for the university horticulture people to do their magic.

 

This guy put a coffee container out as a cache in this active work zone (as described on the cache page). I cannot possibly imagine he was given permission to place one there considering the active work. Anyway, sure enough, the area where the cache was hidden got shredded. One cacher posted NM a few weeks ago and posted some pictures. I went out to check the place out. I am a volunteer for the trails in a different portion of this "park" and am privy to a little more info than most. I have an idea of what's planned for the area, and considering the slow pace of the work, I suspect the area will be under active work for the better part of the next year, too.

 

I got to GZ and anything that wasn't a leg-sized tree was mulch. There was NOTHING there. The cache container was nowhere to be seen. It probably got kicked out of the shredder and tossed who-knows-where. If I had a day and a handful of helpers, I might find the remnants buried under the mulch.

 

I posted a NA log on this, not only because of the cache's current condition, but also because the area will not be a stable site for a cache for some time.