+SeekerOfTheWay Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 Agreed. No one agrees with the OP so that says a fair amount on the subject. Closed. Ha. OP, get a BlackBerry and you'll get an instant email alert of new caches, be able to pull up the cache on the BlackBerry , and navigate right to it for your FTF...from wherever you happen to be. The app cost $19.99. i have no $300 GPSr and FTF aren't that hard to get. As a side note, as a hider, i love when my cache gets published and waiting for that FTF and the story! Quote Link to comment
+Ampresearch Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 (edited) Agreed. No one agrees with the OP so that says a fair amount on the subject. Closed. Ha. OP, get a BlackBerry and you'll get an instant email alert of new caches, be able to pull up the cache on the BlackBerry , and navigate right to it for your FTF...from wherever you happen to be. The app cost $19.99. i have no $300 GPSr and FTF aren't that hard to get. ditto on the above. I also use a blackberry tour and i use cache sense and Geocache Navagator. both work VERY well allow me to get infomation on a cache almost instantly. as long as your cell phone has TRUE GPS and not just cell tower assisted they work very very well, I was ready to run out and by a high end GPS and my wife convinced me to give this a shot first. I paid the 20 bucks to try it and have never felt the need for anything else yet. I get directed within 6-0 feet of the Cords every single time. Edited October 4, 2010 by Ampresearch Quote Link to comment
+tozainamboku Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 Was Lance Armstrong "rude" for "hogging" all those Tours de France? You are comparing being the first to lift a lamp skirt to winning the Tour De France? Wow. Just Wow. If one is going to see FTF as a competition then this is a good analogy. Lance Armstrong didn't decide "I've won the Tour De France enough times so I'll let someone else do it". Some people see the FTF as a competition or race. Fizzymagic probably remembers a time when FTF wasn't so much of a race. Cache owners might put an FTF prize in the cache to encourage a finder to come get it. There is nothing worse than putting out a cache an waiting weeks for someone to find it. My first cache sat unfound for three weeks. Back when there were fewer geocachers, FTF was a way to get a new cache noticed and found. It seems that nearly everyone gets some satisfaction finding a cache that hasn't been found before. Some of us actually like looking for more difficult caches that sit unfound for a while and try to be the first to find on those. For others, it's the competition with other caches that makes finding an LPC first exciting. My guess is that if you were the only FTF horder in your area, you would soon get bored. It becomes a game between the FTF hounds to see who will be first on each cache. And the is always the possibility that a geocacher who has no FTFs will get this one first. I have to admit I have a few FTFs on caches where I was just lucky and saw there was a new cache nearby as I was about to go out. The regular FTF hogs had to travel a bit further, so I was able to get the FTF. Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 The 'accomplishment' wasn't what was being compared. The concept of whether wanting to win in either activity should be considered greedy or inconsiderate was what was being compared. I'm seeing a trend here. Although there have been some that have implied that those that try to get every FTF opportunity are "greedy", "rude", or "inconsiderate". Please stop doing that. I'm not going to do that nor do I feel that someone that is really into the FTF game necessarily possesses any of those qualities. If I asked someone, "would you mind sharing the park bench you're sitting on?", that doesn't necessarily mean I'm accusing that person of being greedy or inconsiderate. There may be a good reason why they would rather sit alone. From what I've seen in this thread, there are some that are getting a bit defensive about how they play the FTF game. When someone asks you to be more considerate of others, that doesn't necessarily mean they're calling you inconsiderate. I'm not going to point any fingers, or make any derogatory accusations, but I'd like to reiterate something I posted earlier in the thread. For someone that likes to play the FTF game, would it kill you to stop trying to get a FTF on every single new caches placed in your area? If, because of your actions (or inaction in this case) you've brought a little joy into another geocachers (or their childs) day that, for whatever reason, might not "have the game" to compete in a FTF race, is that so bad? So you got 12 FTFs in a day instead of 14? As I see it, we're all part of a geocaching community. As a cache owner, I place geocaches for others to be found that hopefully help contribute to the enjoyment of others in the geocaching community. It doesn't seem to be a big stretch for me to try and find other ways to give back to the game, and that *has* included stopping geocaching for a bit to allow others to grab a FTF on some of the newly published caches in my area. Quote Link to comment
+Cedar Grove Seekers Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 (edited) To respond to the OP: Somewhere along the line you’ve heard about FTFs, realized they are important to certain cachers, and decided you would like one. You’ve since realized they can be difficult to get, and you will have to devote a lot more effort to getting one. You may not realize it, but you are probably only aware of them BECAUSE they are difficult to get and require a lot of effort and therefore have importance to certain cachers. Why are they important to you? Why do you want one? I would love to have an Olympic gold medal but certainly would not expect the athletes to take it easy on me so that I could have one. Before anyone suggests you can’t compare gold medals to FTFs, it’s merely an analogy. A small percentage of people are willing and able to do what it takes to get a gold medal – same for FTFs. You seem to suggest that there is nothing in it for the families who can’t get an FTF. If merely finding a cache is not enough, and the FTF is your reward, then I’d suggest that you truly are an FTF hound who is just lazy. If you want an FTF go and earn one. If you’re not willing to earn it then I don’t understand why they are important to you. As for enjoying each others’ company, having fun, helping each other out – my days as an FTF hound contributed far more to this than the non-FTF caches. I met more people chasing an FTF than not. The camaraderie was much stronger amongst the FTF chasers. The FTF crowd never saw ourselves as greedy – we saw ourselves as a group of people interested in adding an element of competition by racing for FTFs. If someone else wanted an FTF they would certainly be welcome to race for them. If they expected to be given the FTF, we would have viewed this as an infringement on our fun – especially considering that the main reason they wanted an FTF was because it was something that was important to us. Edited October 4, 2010 by Cedar Grove Seekers Quote Link to comment
+Lovejoy and Tinker Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 Thanks Cedar Grove Seekers, you saved me having to reply. No way could I put it better than you just have. And blimey I have tried throughout this thread Quote Link to comment
+John in Valley Forge Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 There are a couple FTF hounds in my area. I used to find it a little annoying but realized I was just jealous. It made my measly two FTFs all that more sweet though. They were FTF on my second cache, a mystery. They get in contact with each other and go out together, sometimes bringing other local cachers along. They also always write good long log entries describing their race. Way better than a log entry that reads "FTF...TFTC" I beat them to one today! There is a power trail along a "rails to trails" path from Valley Forge to Philadelphia . . . Today I took to the trail and met some other cachers and we rode together. We made one FTF which the other guys must have missed by accident. I wish those guys well on their hunts. I now find myself putting new cached on watchlist just to see how fast they get out to find them. John, I know of whom you speak, being from the NW Philly area. . .I also get new cache alerts just to see how quickly they log them. I figure, one day I'll get my first FTF, but for now, it's just a good time no matter how I find them. Heck, I was overjoyed to be the TTF (third to find) on a new cache. Unfortunately, I've never met other cachers while in the field. . .maybe I'll get out to the SRT, as that seems a good place to meet fellow cachers these days, besides a geo-event. Good, I was afraid I wasn't being blatant enough in my descriptions of them (actually, I really like those guys and their logs). I went out at lunch just now and nabbed a new LPC in the rain. That gives me five FTFs. I hereby declare myself to be an evil FTF Hound. I've got my fireproof suit on, let the flaming begin! Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 There are a couple FTF hounds in my area. I used to find it a little annoying but realized I was just jealous. It made my measly two FTFs all that more sweet though. They were FTF on my second cache, a mystery. They get in contact with each other and go out together, sometimes bringing other local cachers along. They also always write good long log entries describing their race. Way better than a log entry that reads "FTF...TFTC" I beat them to one today! There is a power trail along a "rails to trails" path from Valley Forge to Philadelphia . . . Today I took to the trail and met some other cachers and we rode together. We made one FTF which the other guys must have missed by accident. I wish those guys well on their hunts. I now find myself putting new cached on watchlist just to see how fast they get out to find them. John, I know of whom you speak, being from the NW Philly area. . .I also get new cache alerts just to see how quickly they log them. I figure, one day I'll get my first FTF, but for now, it's just a good time no matter how I find them. Heck, I was overjoyed to be the TTF (third to find) on a new cache. Unfortunately, I've never met other cachers while in the field. . .maybe I'll get out to the SRT, as that seems a good place to meet fellow cachers these days, besides a geo-event. Good, I was afraid I wasn't being blatant enough in my descriptions of them (actually, I really like those guys and their logs). I went out at lunch just now and nabbed a new LPC in the rain. That gives me five FTFs. I hereby declare myself to be an evil FTF Hound. I've got my fireproof suit on, let the flaming begin! OK here come the flames...... Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
+Team Dennis Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 To Cedar Grove Seekers: Spot on. To everyone else: What that guy said. Quote Link to comment
MisterEFQ Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 I never said it was inconsiderate to have a lot of FTF's. Go back and read what I wrote. Ummm..... Its not a matter of holding back but rather being considerate of fellow cachers. If you are not being considerate, you are being inconsiderate. But I dont need you to explain yourself anymore.....because its clear that you are incapable of doing so. Quote Link to comment
+Team Dennis Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 I never said it was inconsiderate to have a lot of FTF's. Go back and read what I wrote. Ummm..... Its not a matter of holding back but rather being considerate of fellow cachers. If you are not being considerate, you are being inconsiderate. But I dont need you to explain yourself anymore.....because its clear that you are incapable of doing so. Again, spot on. If you are hell bent on getting an FTF here is the formula: Pony up the money to become a premium member, get instant notifications to your cell phone (via email or text message) and wait. Soon enough a new one will pop up at a time that you are available to hunt it down. Bing bang boom you've got an FTF and you will be the envy of everyone in the neighborhood! There is another surefire way to bag an FTF but is against etiquette and if I told you how to do it I'd have to...well let's say I'd better not tell. Quote Link to comment
+Cuddlefish Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 I think some of you are taking the FTF sub-game way too seriously. Although Zapfrog may be experiencing a little FTF envy they also specifically mentioned families with small children. Would it really kill an FTF slave to refrain from going out at 3:00AM in search of a FTF on a cache if it meant providing a little extra joy to a four year old kid? My 5 year old wouldn't have the faintest idea if he was FTF or not on a cache. He just likes finding the caches. And he makes sure I give him full credit. I guess once he learns to read, I'll have to actually do that. Quote Link to comment
+Cuddlefish Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 To respond to the OP: Somewhere along the line you’ve heard about FTFs, realized they are important to certain cachers, and decided you would like one. You’ve since realized they can be difficult to get, and you will have to devote a lot more effort to getting one. You may not realize it, but you are probably only aware of them BECAUSE they are difficult to get and require a lot of effort and therefore have importance to certain cachers. Why are they important to you? Why do you want one? I would love to have an Olympic gold medal but certainly would not expect the athletes to take it easy on me so that I could have one. Before anyone suggests you can’t compare gold medals to FTFs, it’s merely an analogy. A small percentage of people are willing and able to do what it takes to get a gold medal – same for FTFs. You seem to suggest that there is nothing in it for the families who can’t get an FTF. If merely finding a cache is not enough, and the FTF is your reward, then I’d suggest that you truly are an FTF hound who is just lazy. If you want an FTF go and earn one. If you’re not willing to earn it then I don’t understand why they are important to you. As for enjoying each others’ company, having fun, helping each other out – my days as an FTF hound contributed far more to this than the non-FTF caches. I met more people chasing an FTF than not. The camaraderie was much stronger amongst the FTF chasers. The FTF crowd never saw ourselves as greedy – we saw ourselves as a group of people interested in adding an element of competition by racing for FTFs. If someone else wanted an FTF they would certainly be welcome to race for them. If they expected to be given the FTF, we would have viewed this as an infringement on our fun – especially considering that the main reason they wanted an FTF was because it was something that was important to us. Nicely said! Now who else wants to join me out in the forest at the crack of dawn in their pyjamas? I got 4 FTFs one morning that way. Quote Link to comment
+Cuddlefish Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 Was Lance Armstrong "rude" for "hogging" all those Tours de France? You are comparing being the first to lift a lamp skirt to winning the Tour De France? Wow. Just Wow. Second to lift the skirt. The cache owner was first. Quote Link to comment
+DanOCan Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 What is disturbing are those inconsiderate cachers who have found more caches than I have. They didn't wait but joined and started caching years before I did, claiming they do this for ‘enjoyment’. Why couldn’t they have consideration for the kids, some not born when they started caching, who will never be able to catch up with their number of finds and now can only find wet logbooks and used McDonald toys in the caches they have plundered. And how about those inconsiderate newbies who joined the hobby years after me and then go out and run up huge numbers in a metter of weeks thanks to all the park 'n grabs that exist now? Don't they know about the pecking order and showing respect for their elders? We took months or years to earn those smileys just to have some rookie blow past us. Back on the original topic: One year there were six new caches published along a local hiking loop. I bagged the FTF on four of them. It was winter and I had rushed out the door without being properly dressed (this was back when I could actually fake an interest in FTFs) and was getting cold. It was closer to return to the car the way I came so I left two of the caches unfound, rather than completeing the loop. Naturally someone else got the FTF on those. I often wondered if they somehow felt "cheated" by the fact that I "left" the FTF for them, or if they they even cared. After the first two caches I started leaving the FTF prize behind because I was feeling guilty about that. Personally, when I played the FTF "game", I wanted to "win" because I earned it, not because the local FTF hounds "let" me win. I figure it's a good chance to teach the kids a lesson -- if you want something you have to be prepared to work for it and earn it, which comes as a shock to the entitlement attitude so many young peple have today. (Wow, that just made me sound old!) Quote Link to comment
+pkupmn98 Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 Just wanted to add my .02 on the topic, seeing as how my wife and I just grabbed our first FTF last night, in the dark, with the baby! http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=261241 Quote Link to comment
+pkupmn98 Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 (edited) Double post. Whoops Edited October 5, 2010 by pkupmn98 Quote Link to comment
+bflentje Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 i find this to be a good place to say the following. I FOUND MY FIRST F2F TODAY !!! yay me and in the spirit of this thread i also got my second F2F this morning and i gladly rushed to both at 7 AM this morning and signed both logs. I was late to the office and had my whole staff waiting outside till i got there to let them in the building. not only did i take both F2F's but i did it with a smile on my face the whole time. that is all Good job on your 2 FTFs feels good don't it. Scubasonic Dang straight it feels good. And for the record, I have just over 130 FTF's. I also have a wife, three children, work a standard 40hr/week office job in IT, required to be on-call at night (24 hours/day for that matter), volunteer (on average) 20 hours/week as the technical dude at a local paraochial school, still have to do homework, clean the house, mow the lawn, the honey-do list. All of this and I still manage to find a way to be competitive. Wait.. did I say competitive? I've been 2nd, 3rd, or worse on over 10 times the amount of caches I was first on. I've just outright ignored 10 times the opportunities to be first. All this and no whining. Yep, I used the term wannabe above. Because if you like FTF's but complain about never getting them, and want others to change the game so you can get some, YOU ARE A WANNABE. If that insults you, then perhaps you should sit in front of a mirror and figure out what kind of a person you really are. Someone with drive and determination, or someone that wants life handed to you. Get over it. NOTE: Use of the term YOU above refers to the collective and not to Scubasonic, whom I suspect shares an opinion similar to my own. Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 i find this to be a good place to say the following. I FOUND MY FIRST F2F TODAY !!! yay me and in the spirit of this thread i also got my second F2F this morning and i gladly rushed to both at 7 AM this morning and signed both logs. I was late to the office and had my whole staff waiting outside till i got there to let them in the building. not only did i take both F2F's but i did it with a smile on my face the whole time. that is all Good job on your 2 FTFs feels good don't it. Scubasonic Dang straight it feels good. And for the record, I have just over 130 FTF's. I also have a wife, three children, work a standard 40hr/week office job in IT, required to be on-call at night (24 hours/day for that matter), volunteer (on average) 20 hours/week as the technical dude at a local paraochial school, still have to do homework, clean the house, mow the lawn, the honey-do list. All of this and I still manage to find a way to be competitive. Wait.. did I say competitive? I've been 2nd, 3rd, or worse on over 10 times the amount of caches I was first on. I've just outright ignored 10 times the opportunities to be first. All this and no whining. Yep, I used the term wannabe above. Because if you like FTF's but complain about never getting them, and want others to change the game so you can get some, YOU ARE A WANNABE. If that insults you, then perhaps you should sit in front of a mirror and figure out what kind of a person you really are. Someone with drive and determination, or someone that wants life handed to you. Get over it. NOTE: Use of the term YOU above refers to the collective and not to Scubasonic, whom I suspect shares an opinion similar to my own. With over 1120+ FTFs that's a "BIG 10/4 Good buddy" keep rollin like you are. Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
+roziecakes Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 Sooo... even though I don't have enough time to be an FTF hoarder, or even an FTF hoarder wannabe, can I be y'all's groupie? Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 Sooo... even though I don't have enough time to be an FTF hoarder, or even an FTF hoarder wannabe, can I be y'all's groupie? Junction City, Oregon that isn't all that far from Vancouver, Washington is it. Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
+FT Rummager Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 I logged my first FTF a few days ago. I really liked it! I looked in the forums here, there is an area for "regions", and it lists individual states. I click on my state, and it has new caches listed. Before I found this page, I was just cruising the caches closest to my house by scrolling through the pages of caches called up by my "hide and seek cache" request, looking for the word "New". So, you don't have to have a premium membership. (my daughter just treated me to a 3 month premium membership for only $10.00...she's a sweetie ). I suppose alerts to cell phones might be quicker...but it can be done without a cell phone. I also do not own a GPS device yet. I sure am looking at them a lot. I am geocaching based on descriptions and maps. I probably spend more time per cache than some folks, and I have a high DNF ratio. But, until I can get my hands on a GPS, I will continue to play the game. My daughter has an Android, and it works really well. It's fun when I get to go caching with her. I am antsy-pants, and can't wait for her to find GZ. Often, we are at the same spot at the same time. I'm not sure why I posted. I just read 5 pages of sturm und drang, and felt like singing I guess. My local group of cachers don't seem to speedy. My FTF sat for nearly a day, idle. I was watching, because I didn't know the protocol...kids first? do we have racers? was it placed for a particular individual to find? It just sat there, and once I decided to go for it, it was a heart pounding, anxiety ridden rush to see if I could get to it first. It was also silly to see myself all a twitter, over a race where I might be the only runner I do understand other communities are different. Other terrains are different. Other levels of opportunity are different. I have one FTF experience. This was it ...and I liked it! I hope to find more, and good luck to all who are out caching Quote Link to comment
+Ralfcoder Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Yes, I really do I understand your meaning. But what they're leaving is a findable cache with a signed log. It's fine and it's not "nothing". If you want FTF, you're going to have to hustle for it, like the folks who are currently getting them. That's my opinion. I couldn't have said it better. The cache is still there to be found. I assume you'll still have fun finding it. You'll have to scramble up the same hill, ford the same river, solve the same puzzle. If you want to do the FTF dance, you'll have to upgrade your membership to premium if you haven't done so, then set your profile to be notified of new caches in your area, and then be ready to drop everything and run out after new hides. It's what the others do, I assume. Unless someone drops a new cache in your lap or you watch someone hide it, you have to be ready to do what the big-time FTF hunters do. Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Yes, I really do I understand your meaning. But what they're leaving is a findable cache with a signed log. It's fine and it's not "nothing". If you want FTF, you're going to have to hustle for it, like the folks who are currently getting them. That's my opinion. I couldn't have said it better. The cache is still there to be found. I assume you'll still have fun finding it. You'll have to scramble up the same hill, ford the same river, solve the same puzzle. If you want to do the FTF dance, you'll have to upgrade your membership to premium if you haven't done so, then set your profile to be notified of new caches in your area, and then be ready to drop everything and run out after new hides. It's what the others do, I assume. Unless someone drops a new cache in your lap or you watch someone hide it, you have to be ready to do what the big-time FTF hunters do. I still don't understand why many here insist that there is "one true way" to play an aspect of the game considering the diversity of geocaching environments around the world. Scubasonic wrote that he got 11 new FTFs yesterday. On the same day, there was one new geocache published withing 50 miles of me and that one was a puzzle cache which requires solving (or have previously solved) 10 archived puzzle caches. A premium membership or instant notification and dropping everything to go out and find it would not be required to get a FTF on this one. I know for a fact that at least three of the most prolific geocachers in this area have solved all the prerequisite puzzles but so far nobody has logged a FTF. Bflentje writes that they "just over 130 FTF's. I also have a wife, three children, work a standard 40hr/week office job in IT". They also happen to live in an area with the worlds most prolific geocache hider. I suspect that when one lives in an area that may get 20 or more new caches published a day, how one plays the game can be vastly different then someone that lives in an area that might not get that many new caches within 20 miles over a six month period. There are many entire countries where there might be weeks, months or years between new cache placements (and quite a few countries that have no geocaches, period). You can't tell me (well you can, but I'm not going to believe you) that someone that want's to get a FTF in that area must do what the big-time FTF hunters do. Quote Link to comment
+DragonsWest Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 The one, true playfield leveler for FTF mania - evil hides. Quote Link to comment
+bflentje Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Yes, I really do I understand your meaning. But what they're leaving is a findable cache with a signed log. It's fine and it's not "nothing". If you want FTF, you're going to have to hustle for it, like the folks who are currently getting them. That's my opinion. I couldn't have said it better. The cache is still there to be found. I assume you'll still have fun finding it. You'll have to scramble up the same hill, ford the same river, solve the same puzzle. If you want to do the FTF dance, you'll have to upgrade your membership to premium if you haven't done so, then set your profile to be notified of new caches in your area, and then be ready to drop everything and run out after new hides. It's what the others do, I assume. Unless someone drops a new cache in your lap or you watch someone hide it, you have to be ready to do what the big-time FTF hunters do. I still don't understand why many here insist that there is "one true way" to play an aspect of the game considering the diversity of geocaching environments around the world. Scubasonic wrote that he got 11 new FTFs yesterday. On the same day, there was one new geocache published withing 50 miles of me and that one was a puzzle cache which requires solving (or have previously solved) 10 archived puzzle caches. A premium membership or instant notification and dropping everything to go out and find it would not be required to get a FTF on this one. I know for a fact that at least three of the most prolific geocachers in this area have solved all the prerequisite puzzles but so far nobody has logged a FTF. Bflentje writes that they "just over 130 FTF's. I also have a wife, three children, work a standard 40hr/week office job in IT". They also happen to live in an area with the worlds most prolific geocache hider. I suspect that when one lives in an area that may get 20 or more new caches published a day, how one plays the game can be vastly different then someone that lives in an area that might not get that many new caches within 20 miles over a six month period. There are many entire countries where there might be weeks, months or years between new cache placements (and quite a few countries that have no geocaches, period). You can't tell me (well you can, but I'm not going to believe you) that someone that want's to get a FTF in that area must do what the big-time FTF hunters do. Check the FTF's I have listed in my profile. Out of the nearly 140, I would guess there are perhaps one, two, MAYBE three, that are King Boreas hides. Being in the same area as a prolific hider has NOTHING to do with my FTF's. Quote Link to comment
+addisonbr Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 I still don't understand why many here insist that there is "one true way" to play I didn't get the impression that anyone was insisting there was "one true way" to play. In defense of some of the replies to the OP, the OP has repeatedly described his area as one where a few of the FTF hounds routinely "clean house" and pick up scads of FTFs without leaving any for the rest of the players. I think a lot of the self-professed FTF hounds who have replied have targeted their replies towards the OP's scenario, and ways in which he might be able to raise his chances of an FTF. In a situation where the only new cache within 50 miles is a complicated puzzle, one which multiple people have solved without bothering to retrieve the cache, is probably one in which you wouldn't have to make those same choices. I don't think anyone in this thread would disagree with that. It's just that the OP's situation sounds very different. Quote Link to comment
+SSO JOAT Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Pssst... here's a little secret.... The FTF on every cache is... The Cache Owner. The next one who shows up is actually... "second" ;-) Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Yes, I really do I understand your meaning. But what they're leaving is a findable cache with a signed log. It's fine and it's not "nothing". If you want FTF, you're going to have to hustle for it, like the folks who are currently getting them. That's my opinion. I couldn't have said it better. The cache is still there to be found. I assume you'll still have fun finding it. You'll have to scramble up the same hill, ford the same river, solve the same puzzle. If you want to do the FTF dance, you'll have to upgrade your membership to premium if you haven't done so, then set your profile to be notified of new caches in your area, and then be ready to drop everything and run out after new hides. It's what the others do, I assume. Unless someone drops a new cache in your lap or you watch someone hide it, you have to be ready to do what the big-time FTF hunters do. I still don't understand why many here insist that there is "one true way" to play an aspect of the game considering the diversity of geocaching environments around the world. Scubasonic wrote that he got 11 new FTFs yesterday. On the same day, there was one new geocache published withing 50 miles of me and that one was a puzzle cache which requires solving (or have previously solved) 10 archived puzzle caches. A premium membership or instant notification and dropping everything to go out and find it would not be required to get a FTF on this one. I know for a fact that at least three of the most prolific geocachers in this area have solved all the prerequisite puzzles but so far nobody has logged a FTF. Bflentje writes that they "just over 130 FTF's. I also have a wife, three children, work a standard 40hr/week office job in IT". They also happen to live in an area with the worlds most prolific geocache hider. I suspect that when one lives in an area that may get 20 or more new caches published a day, how one plays the game can be vastly different then someone that lives in an area that might not get that many new caches within 20 miles over a six month period. There are many entire countries where there might be weeks, months or years between new cache placements (and quite a few countries that have no geocaches, period). You can't tell me (well you can, but I'm not going to believe you) that someone that want's to get a FTF in that area must do what the big-time FTF hunters do. Check the FTF's I have listed in my profile. Out of the nearly 140, I would guess there are perhaps one, two, MAYBE three, that are King Boreas hides. Being in the same area as a prolific hider has NOTHING to do with my FTF's. I merely used you as an example. Whether you, personally, got your FTFs from a specific hider is not the issue. The fact remains, statements like "I have nearly 140 FTFs" is meaningless with considering the number of available FTF opportunities. Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Pssst... here's a little secret.... The FTF on every cache is... The Cache Owner. The next one who shows up is actually... "second" ;-) No they are not the FTF because the owner typically do not sign the Physical log. Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
+Bucephala Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 I guess it's just like other aspects of caching. Some people are in it to find caches, some are in it to solve puzzles, some are in it to place caches, some are in it to get FTFs. I'm not into FTFs (I only have 9 and I made an effort to get only 2 of them) but the local cachers that are into them seem to have fun competing with each other. Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 I guess it's just like other aspects of caching. Some people are in it to find caches, some are in it to solve puzzles, some are in it to place caches, some are in it to get FTFs. I'm not into FTFs (I only have 9 and I made an effort to get only 2 of them) but the local cachers that are into them seem to have fun competing with each other. I enjoy it !! Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
+goodguys101 Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 Well, frustrating as it may be, there's really not much that can be done about that given human nature. It's nice to get a FTF but it's not the only reason to geocache. Just finding the cache yourself and enjoying the hide, area, walk, and folks you might meet are some of the better reasons to cache. Some caches are set up to have FTF prizes for kids. Quote Link to comment
+goodguys101 Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 Its not a matter of holding back but rather being considerate of fellow cachers. But what is the difference? If you can't beat the champ you can't be the champ. The champ of what? The "game" is not about FTF's, it's about finding the cache. Quote Link to comment
+GeoGeeBee Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 Its not a matter of holding back but rather being considerate of fellow cachers. But what is the difference? If you can't beat the champ you can't be the champ. The champ of what? The "game" is not about FTF's, it's about finding the cache. If that was the OP's attitude, he wouldn't have come in here complaining that some people were hogging all the FTF's. If that is your attitude (and I commend it), then there is nothing in this thread that applies to you. There are many "games" within geocaching; this thread is about one of them. Quote Link to comment
+Lovejoy and Tinker Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 The champ of what? The "game" is not about FTF's, it's about finding the cache. If that were the case then this whole thread would never have started as there would have been no basis on which to write the original post Quote Link to comment
+zapfrog Posted October 7, 2010 Author Share Posted October 7, 2010 Somehow asking for opinions got skewed into me complaining. This seems like the debates I just did camera for. Aaahhhh let the madness stop! @Seekeroftheway Not to get off topic but I didn't realize the app for the Blackberry is more expensive than the iPhone. Hmmm I wonder why that is? 19.99 as opposed to 9.99. And yes with all the OT I'm working I'm hoping next week to join the premium membership ranks. Now to go back and run around with a camera shooting news Quote Link to comment
+SeekerOfTheWay Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 i posted this elsewhere too but...Geocache Navigator for BlackBerry is now on sale for $9.99 at BlackBerry App World! Grab it while you can! Quote Link to comment
+GeoGeeBee Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 i posted this elsewhere too but...Geocache Navigator for BlackBerry is now on sale for $9.99 at BlackBerry App World! Grab it while you can! $9.99 and then what? I mean, is that a discount from the normal $39.99 per year? And after a year, is it going to cost $39.99 to keep using it? Because the normal rate for Geocache Navigator is $5.99/month or $39.99/year. Which is absurd. I'm already paying $30/year for a premium membership, why should I have to pay again just because I'm using an app to access the data? I would gladly pay $9.99 for the app, if they didn't expect me to keep paying for it again and again. You can get nearly the same functionality with BlackStar, which is free. Quote Link to comment
+GeoGeeBee Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 i posted this elsewhere too but...Geocache Navigator for BlackBerry is now on sale for $9.99 at BlackBerry App World! Grab it while you can! I would gladly pay $9.99 for the app, if they didn't expect me to keep paying for it again and again. Hmmm... I know it's bad form to reply to myself. But this is interesting. It looks like if you purchase this program through Geocaching.com, or through the Sprint app store, or directly from Trimble, there's a monthly fee. But from the Blackberry App store, it's a one-time purchase! OK, I'm downloading it now! Thanks for the tip! Quote Link to comment
g_o_caching Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 I hid a few caches and sent them all in to be approved at the same time. I am not against someone getting the FTF on all of them if they put in the effort to be there first and make the finds. In the future I will send them in one at a time and spread them out by a few days or a week. I have been FTF on 2 caches, one was 4 blocks from my house, and the other was a long hike in hilly terrain 30 miles from home. I don't think being FTF has any more importance than being the 100th. They both put in the effort to get there, the time searching, and the brain power to find it. Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 I hid a few caches and sent them all in to be approved at the same time. I am not against someone getting the FTF on all of them if they put in the effort to be there first and make the finds. In the future I will send them in one at a time and spread them out by a few days or a week. I have been FTF on 2 caches, one was 4 blocks from my house, and the other was a long hike in hilly terrain 30 miles from home. I don't think being FTF has any more importance than being the 100th. They both put in the effort to get there, the time searching, and the brain power to find it. For me it about finding the cache just as the Cache owner had placed it, and meeting othr cachers at GZ that's why I like FTFs. Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
+zapfrog Posted October 8, 2010 Author Share Posted October 8, 2010 @GeoGeeBee I don't know what the difference is between the apps to warrant the price difference but its a one time 9.99 charge then 30 a year for premium membership. Quote Link to comment
+zapfrog Posted October 8, 2010 Author Share Posted October 8, 2010 Well, frustrating as it may be, there's really not much that can be done about that given human nature. It's nice to get a FTF but it's not the only reason to geocache. Just finding the cache yourself and enjoying the hide, area, walk, and folks you might meet are some of the better reasons to cache. Some caches are set up to have FTF prizes for kids. I agree with this 100%. My wife and I love the hike, scenery and meeting other fellow cachers. We always have those funny moments when we meet someone with a GPS and there's that knowing glance. Quote Link to comment
GOF and Bacall Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 I hid a few caches and sent them all in to be approved at the same time. I am not against someone getting the FTF on all of them if they put in the effort to be there first and make the finds. In the future I will send them in one at a time and spread them out by a few days or a week. I have been FTF on 2 caches, one was 4 blocks from my house, and the other was a long hike in hilly terrain 30 miles from home. I don't think being FTF has any more importance than being the 100th. They both put in the effort to get there, the time searching, and the brain power to find it. For me it about finding the cache just as the Cache owner had placed it, and meeting othr cachers at GZ that's why I like FTFs. Scubasonic Um..bragging rights don't figure in? If not then why the recent thread? Quote Link to comment
+Scooter Rider Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 Well I have nothing to add on hording. But as a new cache hider hats off to the FTFers. These wonderfully eccentric folks who have the tech and time. To go charging out at all hours and in all kinds of weather. Its from there comments and how long it takes to find or not . That's been a real help to me on how I will set up new caches. They keep me on my toes. And hopefully I can return the favor. Quote Link to comment
+briansnat Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 Agreed. No one agrees with the OP so that says a fair amount on the subject. Closed. Ha. OP, get a BlackBerry and you'll get an instant email alert of new caches, be able to pull up the cache on the BlackBerry , and navigate right to it for your FTF...from wherever you happen to be. The app cost $19.99. i have no $300 GPSr and FTF aren't that hard to get. ditto on the above. I also use a blackberry tour and i use cache sense and Geocache Navagator. both work VERY well allow me to get infomation on a cache almost instantly. as long as your cell phone has TRUE GPS and not just cell tower assisted they work very very well, I was ready to run out and by a high end GPS and my wife convinced me to give this a shot first. I paid the 20 bucks to try it and have never felt the need for anything else yet. I get directed within 6-0 feet of the Cords every single time. All good for finding a few caches around town, but if you ever get into the hiking caches, or spend a full day of caching when you are away from a power source you certainly will find your cell phone to be wanting. Quote Link to comment
+Scubasonic Posted October 9, 2010 Share Posted October 9, 2010 (edited) Agreed. No one agrees with the OP so that says a fair amount on the subject. Closed. Ha. OP, get a BlackBerry and you'll get an instant email alert of new caches, be able to pull up the cache on the BlackBerry , and navigate right to it for your FTF...from wherever you happen to be. The app cost $19.99. i have no $300 GPSr and FTF aren't that hard to get. ditto on the above. I also use a blackberry tour and i use cache sense and Geocache Navagator. both work VERY well allow me to get infomation on a cache almost instantly. as long as your cell phone has TRUE GPS and not just cell tower assisted they work very very well, I was ready to run out and by a high end GPS and my wife convinced me to give this a shot first. I paid the 20 bucks to try it and have never felt the need for anything else yet. I get directed within 6-0 feet of the Cords every single time. oh so true I have a iPhone wit AT&T and a Blacberry tour with Verizon use them to gather cache info but would not use to find a cache handhelds work best All good for finding a few caches around town, but if you ever get into the hiking caches, or spend a full day of caching when you are away from a power source you certainly will find your cell phone to be wanting. Oh yeah agree 100% I have a iPhone with AT & T and a Blackberry with Verizon while they are great to gather cache info would not use them to actually find a cage handhelds work best. Scubasonic Edited October 9, 2010 by Scubasonic Quote Link to comment
Andronicus Posted October 9, 2010 Share Posted October 9, 2010 All good for finding a few caches around town, but if you ever get into the hiking caches, or spend a full day of caching when you are away from a power source you certainly will find your cell phone to be wanting. Not so! A smart phone will work great as a back country GPSr. Like everything, you just need to prepare appropriatly. See link in my signature for tips! Quote Link to comment
+Fishheadjr Posted October 10, 2010 Share Posted October 10, 2010 (edited) FTF's are cool but I just like finding them period. Edited October 10, 2010 by Fishheadjr Quote Link to comment
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