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Micro Caches


mad007

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:blink: am not happy about the emergence of these pathetic mini caches - why bother at all.

For some, the pleasure of caching is the getting there and the location you end up at. What you find in terms of a physical container when you get there is of secondary, importance.

 

I don't care what we find and tend to switch off once the cache is in hand (unless it is a particularly cleverly constructed cache). I don't mind what it is or what's in it. I don't swap swag but will sometimes take a TB or coin if it looks interesting.

 

Not everyone plays the game the same way or is looking at getting the same out of it.

 

When you plan your caching trips just filter out the micros before deciding what you are going to search for. The facility is there to allow you to do that in Pocket Queries, plus the size of the container is shown at the top of every cache page. So unless the CO has entered the details correctly they are easily avoided if you don't want to find them :)

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:blink: am not happy about the emergence of these pathetic mini caches - why bother at all.

 

woow, you got one find in over 2 years and you're mad at micros?

 

 

 

When you plan your caching trips just filter out the micros before deciding what you are going to search for. The facility is there to allow you to do that in Pocket Queries, plus the size of the container is shown at the top of every cache page. So unless the CO has entered the details correctly they are easily avoided if you don't want to find them :)

 

not really, he/she is not a PM

Edited by t4e
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It's really quite simple. If you don't like them, don't bother with them.

 

The container size is listed near the top of the Geocache Detail page.

 

Back in February I pulled a query, I eliminated puzzles, micros and unknown or other sized caches.

I found 5 caches that day from that filtered query.

 

2 medicine bottles - listed as small, but definitely micros

1 soda preform - listed as small! ?

1 plastic egg - listed as regular

1 peanut butter jar - about 12 ounces, listed as regular.

 

4 micros, one small - had the caches been properly sized by their owners, I'd had hunted one of them, the small, dry PB jar cache.

 

To not hunt micros, you apparently need to filter to regulars only.

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Also, when is it appropriate to select unknown as container type?

I think that's for when you don't want to give too much away about the hide so folk don't know what they are looking for, hence making it too more difficult.

 

Or for when you place the hide then go home and fill in the form but forget what you have just hidden :blink:

 

Edit: Change 'too' to 'more'

Edited by Lovejoy and Tinker
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am not happy about the emergence of these pathetic mini caches - why bother at all.

I love the micros. They create the greatest challenge, which is what it's all about. There are so many more possibilities for placing a cache if they are small. I often use micros, usually small pill bottles (at my age, there are lots of those lying around), for all but the final stage in a multi. All one needs to put in the micro is the clue to the next stage.

 

Also, it's hard to get the difficulty rating up if the cache isn't small. After you have found a few easy ones, one looks for the harder ones to keep it interesting. My target audience when I hide a cache is often the experienced cachers, and to spark their interest it has to be a real challenge.

 

With experience, you will learn to like the micros.

 

SCWB

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I love the micros. They create the greatest challenge, which is what it's all about. . . . With experience, you will learn to like the micros.

 

SCWB

 

We all have different reasons for caching. While its easy to hide a micro to create a difficult hide, that is not what the game is about for me.

 

I don't filter micros. Many are appropriate to the location and I have placed a few of my own. It can be like signing the log at a summit register, a means of recording a visit to an area. Some make me wonder about why a cacher was inspired to place one. But its not a matter of experience.

Edited by mulvaney
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With experience, you will learn to like the micros.

 

Um, I'm not generally a fan and I have more than little experience.

Gotta side with GOF on this one. In my experience, (as a person with highly biased caching aesthetics), the term "Micro" is typically defined as a crappy container, placed in an uninspired location, with a thoughtless hide technique, and a cache page seemingly designed to elicit yawns, placed primarily for the sole purpose of increasing the find stats of those who prefer quantity over quality. Thankfully, pocket queries allow me, for the most part, to avoid these incredibly lame attempts at caching.

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With experience, you will learn to like the micros.

 

Um, I'm not generally a fan and I have more than little experience.

Gotta side with GOF on this one. In my experience, (as a person with highly biased caching aesthetics), the term "Micro" is typically defined as a crappy container, placed in an uninspired location, with a thoughtless hide technique, and a cache page seemingly designed to elicit yawns, placed primarily for the sole purpose of increasing the find stats of those who prefer quantity over quality. Thankfully, pocket queries allow me, for the most part, to avoid these incredibly lame attempts at caching.

Perhaps its a matter of the caching culture in one's area. I have some very nicely done caches around me. I've certainly seen the strings of dozens of poor quality hides in trees running every tenth of a mile along a dirt road in the woods. Great if you're into the numbers, but pretty boring after a while.

 

I just think micros offer the greatest possibilities for interesting hides, and for me its the search, not the cache that's important. Once I've found it, I don't really care what's in it, except for moving trackables along, or placing a nice one if I particularly like the hide.

 

SCWB

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It's a matter of personal taste, and it's easy enough to filter most of them out.

 

If you really hate them, inspire others in your community by coming up with ways to place larger caches.

 

There's a lot of monkey see, monkey do in geocaching, so something the best way to deal with undesirable caches is to be a leader.

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I just think micros offer the greatest possibilities for interesting hides, and for me its the search, not the cache that's important. Once I've found it, I don't really care what's in it, except for moving trackables along, or placing a nice one if I particularly like the hide.

SCWB

 

I couldn't agree more! As I've been reading through the forums I'm encountering a number of people who are expressing disappointment or even outright anger at the perceived lack of creativity of caches. I just enjoy the experience. . .possibly the only caches I avoid are cache & grabs, simply because I want some adventure. I like that geocaching is getting me outside, walking, enjoying nature and my neighborhood, and seeing things I might never have seen otherwise. For instance, just this week, I found a micro that led me to a nearby trail entrance I didn't know existed. Caching isn't just about finding the cache--it's about discovering the world!

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I just think micros offer the greatest possibilities for interesting hides, and for me its the search, not the cache that's important. Once I've found it, I don't really care what's in it, except for moving trackables along, or placing a nice one if I particularly like the hide.

SCWB

 

I couldn't agree more! As I've been reading through the forums I'm encountering a number of people who are expressing disappointment or even outright anger at the perceived lack of creativity of caches. I just enjoy the experience. . .possibly the only caches I avoid are cache & grabs, simply because I want some adventure. I like that geocaching is getting me outside, walking, enjoying nature and my neighborhood, and seeing things I might never have seen otherwise. For instance, just this week, I found a micro that led me to a nearby trail entrance I didn't know existed. Caching isn't just about finding the cache--it's about discovering the world!

 

I second this. Gotta love these forums. Get out and cache.

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There are many cases where a small/micro/nano cache is appropriate.

 

There are also many more cases where no cache is appropriate (as in NONE), but because 'there was no cache within 528 feet, this location was CRYING OUT FOR A CACHE!'. (Makes my skin crawl...bwwhhhuuhhwhuhhh*!)

 

I don't mind a tiny cache in a worthy location where no larger cache would likely survive.

 

*That's the sound you make when you get the HEEBIE-JEEBIES!

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Are they going to add a 'nano' sized container type anytime soon?

 

Also, when is it appropriate to select unknown as container type?

 

There is a nano size, it's micro which is defined as a 35mm film can and smaller.

 

As for selecting unknown, I've seen it used for uniquely camoed caches such as a film canister in a fake rock, flat magnetic caches with the logbook in a ziploc on the back, and otherwise unusual containers where the owner didn't want to give away the size.

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We love them all. We like micros b/c there is more of a challenge!!!

 

I find that most micros present very little challenge. They are either on the guard rail, in the street sign in the space between the sign and the post, in the knothole of the tree, or in the base of the lamp post. That accounts for roughly 92.7 percent of them.

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We love them all. We like micros b/c there is more of a challenge!!!

 

I find that most micros present very little challenge. They are either on the guard rail, in the street sign in the space between the sign and the post, in the knothole of the tree, or in the base of the lamp post. That accounts for roughly 92.7 percent of them.

 

You exaggerate sir! It can't possibly be more than 92.4 percent.

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Are they going to add a 'nano' sized container type anytime soon?

 

Also, when is it appropriate to select unknown as container type?

 

Whenever you feel like using the unknown cache size. You are the cache owner. Just up the diff. rating a little. <_<

 

"whenever you feel like it"? I'm not following you here, are you saying to purposely trick people? I'd disagree with that. I'd go with what BrianSnat said in his post instead of saying the same thing myself.

 

YES!!! According to whatever the new feedback site is called, Geocaching.com is indeed going to give us a nano size. They are working on it as we speak (I guess).

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I find that most micros present very little challenge. They are either on the guard rail, in the street sign in the space between the sign and the post, in the knothole of the tree, or in the base of the lamp post. That accounts for roughly 92.7 percent of them.

 

Don't forget the ones on utility boxes, which brings the total closer to 94 percent. Then there are the hanging bison tubes and fake rocks. 98 percent.

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We have found some marvelous micro caches; and what made them marvelous was the location they brought us to see. There are many scenic or historical sites/sights that cannot support a cache larger than a micro. What helps me the most in deciding whether or not to go after a micro is to simply read the cache description page; if it gives me an idea that there is something special about the cache, then we go for it. If you don't bother to do a bit of research before you go out caching you will have some disappointments!

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We have found some marvelous micro caches; and what made them marvelous was the location they brought us to see. There are many scenic or historical sites/sights that cannot support a cache larger than a micro. What helps me the most in deciding whether or not to go after a micro is to simply read the cache description page; if it gives me an idea that there is something special about the cache, then we go for it. If you don't bother to do a bit of research before you go out caching you will have some disappointments!

 

It's just too bad we have to wade through the quagmire of lame park-n-grabs, LPCs, and guardrail crap to get to the hand full of micro caches that take us to interesting locals.

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Are they going to add a 'nano' sized container type anytime soon?

 

Also, when is it appropriate to select unknown as container type?

 

There is a nano size, it's micro which is defined as a 35mm film can and smaller.

 

As for selecting unknown, I've seen it used for uniquely camoed caches such as a film canister in a fake rock, flat magnetic caches with the logbook in a ziploc on the back, and otherwise unusual containers where the owner didn't want to give away the size.

To answer Seeker's actual question, TPTB have stated that they are going to add a 'nano' size, but haven't given a specific date for it. Apparently, the delay is getting external software and hardware vendors on board.

Edited by sbell111
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<_< am not happy about the emergence of these pathetic mini caches - why bother at all.

 

GEEEZ you only have 1 find and you are already complaining, maybe you should look for a different hobby. The old rule applys here if you don't like them then don't go get them and complain about it. Move on.

 

Scubasonic

Not to mention that these caches 'emerged' something like seven years before he started playing the game.

Edited by sbell111
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We have found some marvelous micro caches; and what made them marvelous was the location they brought us to see. There are many scenic or historical sites/sights that cannot support a cache larger than a micro. What helps me the most in deciding whether or not to go after a micro is to simply read the cache description page; if it gives me an idea that there is something special about the cache, then we go for it. If you don't bother to do a bit of research before you go out caching you will have some disappointments!

I had one like that in Coffeyville Ks (Dalton's rest stop GC1VH2B). I had been there the ear before I found the cache, but decided to try for it. Great micro find that might disappoint some, but I'm not advanced yet, so it worked. I have had some that was larger & so easy I didn't need my gps. I'm trying to get a micro now that I can't find the exact location for. It depends on advanced you are & your personal tastes. <_<

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:) am not happy about the emergence of these pathetic mini caches - why bother at all.

 

some people (myself included) aren't all that crazy about trading trinkets and such when caching. All I like is a nice hike or bike through nice territory and a logbook to sign. Its all a matter of taste... not everything is for everybody... and the good part is no one HAS to do that type of cache if he doesn't want to :D

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some people aren't all that crazy about trading trinkets and such when caching.

That's kewl. The nice thing about caches bigger than the oh so crappy film can is they can satisfy both those folks who do like to paw through trinkets, trade travel bugs, etc, and those folks who don't like this aspect of the hobby. Those who don't can simply grab the logbook, scribble a kwick "TFTC", then move on, basking in their increased smiley count. Those who do like these things can paw to their heart's content. Micros don't offer both options. :)

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...and those folks who don't like this aspect of the hobby. Those who don't can simply grab the logbook, scribble a kwick "TFTC", then move on, basking in their increased smiley count. ...

I don't think that's a very fair statement (I know, life's not fair).

 

You are painting those of us who are not all that interested in swaps as some kind of slapdash, smiley hungry, number counting fools who are not getting the full pleasure from the game just because we don't enjoy an aspect that you enjoy.

 

I don't 'dislike' the swapping aspect of the game. It's just that I have never really come across much worth swapping, and I don't cache with kids who may have liked some of the stuff we find, so I have switched off from that part of the game.

Having said that, we do buy a few bits and bobs to keep in the bag and put in caches to try and make them better for the next visitors. And we keep our own caches topped up with goodies because I know some folk do like swapping.

 

But to imply that people who don't like the swaps part of the game are people who leave just a TFTC log (I have done probably one of those in my last 500 finds, and then for a reason) and get no proper pleasure from the game, which is what you are implying, is a false impression you have.

 

If you read my logs you will find very few (if any) where I have taken or left something, but you'll also probably see how much I get from the game apart from smileys and the numbers.

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Perhaps my language skills are lacking. I was not implying that everyone, (or even most folks), who are not into trading are number hounds who spew out acronyms, though, in reading what I wrote, I can see where it could be construed that way. I was actually trying to focus on the physical size of the logs in micro caches, which don't readily allow for more than a scribble. Some have only room for initials. Because I like writing, I often wax poetic, blabbing endlessly in the paper logs, and I also like to hunker down, reading the past logs of others in the physical log. I can't get my reading fix from a scrap of paper in a film can.

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Understood. And probably guilty as charged as I only generally put a few words on the paper log (however big the book) and save my missives for the online log. Only because my handwriting is awful (so most people wouldn't be able to read what I wrote) and is worse in the cold and damp, using the lid of a tupperware box as a writing desk :)

 

I do tend to write a full log in the book for FTF's.

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It's really quite simple. If you don't like them, don't bother with them.

 

The container size is listed near the top of the Geocache Detail page.

 

Back in February I pulled a query, I eliminated puzzles, micros and unknown or other sized caches.

I found 5 caches that day from that filtered query.

 

2 medicine bottles - listed as small, but definitely micros

1 soda preform - listed as small! ?

1 plastic egg - listed as regular

1 peanut butter jar - about 12 ounces, listed as regular.

 

4 micros, one small - had the caches been properly sized by their owners, I'd had hunted one of them, the small, dry PB jar cache.

 

To not hunt micros, you apparently need to filter to regulars only.

 

You can't cure stupid...

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It's really quite simple. If you don't like them, don't bother with them.

 

The container size is listed near the top of the Geocache Detail page.

 

Except when it's a nano, then there will be no size listed, even thought it's supposed to say micro. :)

 

Again, you can't cure stupid.

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Emergence is the key word, indicating mico's were not part of the original geocaching sport. Very well stated ! Further, the people who won't take the time to create a decent cache likely do not take

the time to get permission to place them. To me, micro's defeat the original idea of geocaching. If I really

disliked them that much, I would hunt them, then check with the property owner or manager to see if they have permission to be there. If not, post it. I'll bet 90 percent of them are placed without permission. About 40% of the caches returned in a query of my area were micro's and I know for a fact that some were placed without permission. It seems when someone is willing to invest some time and thought in a nice cache, they value it enough to get permission. Mico's are a quick and dirty solution for those who just want numbers or or are not willing to put a little thought and work into a cache. I have been logging some of them and have to say they are not much fun for me. Not having permission is a real issue when property owners and others see people messing about and don't know why they are there. I live in a rural area and when I see someone lurking about on my property and I don't know them or know why they are there, I put some extra magazines on my belt and turn on the video recorder. Few people know about geocaching and everyone is aware of the rising number of home invasions. At some point Geocaching.com and the community is going to have to step up to the bat and address this issue. In my opinion they should create and enforce strict guidelines (container size, type) for a cache and eliminate micros. This may cause a little slump in the bottom line, but the consequences of not doing it will be far worse in the long run.

Why eliminate micro's ? Because they promote and encourage the placement of caches without permission.

If you doubt this, do some research in your area... check for yourself. MOST micros are placed without

permission and FEW larger more traditional caches are placed without permission.

Edited by srondar
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Emergence is the key word, indicating mico's were not part of the original geocaching sport. Very well stated ! Further, the people who won't take the time to create a decent cache likely do not take the time to get permission to place them. To me, micro's defeat the original idea of geocaching.

The very first cache was placed close to a road, and I'm guessing permission was not given. Following the example of the original cache, all caches should be a short distance from a road.

 

Caching changes. Life changes. The only constant in life is change. As a bit of history the micro size was added before the small size.

 

I'm a believer in cachers placing and finding what they enjoy. If someone doesn't like micros, don't place or look for them. If someone enjoys long hikes for a hard multi, place and find those types. People will find what they like.

 

As far as getting permission, the guidelines state that adequate permission is needed, not explicit. There's a difference, and because of it many caches can be placed without the cache owner ever talking to anyone about it.

 

Edit for typo.

Edited by Skippermark
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Emergence is the key word, indicating mico's were not part of the original geocaching sport. Very well stated ! Further, the people who won't take the time to create a decent cache likely do not take

the time to get permission to place them. To me, micro's defeat the original idea of geocaching. If I really

disliked them that much, I would hunt them, then check with the property owner or manager to see if they have permission to be there. If not, post it. I'll bet 90 percent of them are placed without permission. About 40% of the caches returned in a query of my area were micro's and I know for a fact that some were placed without permission. It seems when someone is willing to invest some time and thought in a nice cache, they value it enough to get permission. Mico's are a quick and dirty solution for those who just want numbers or or are not willing to put a little thought and work into a cache. I have been logging some of them and have to say they are not much fun for me. Not having permission is a real issue when property owners and others see people messing about and don't know why they are there. I live in a rural area and when I see someone lurking about on my property and I don't know them or know why they are there, I put some extra magazines on my belt and turn on the video recorder. Few people know about geocaching and everyone is aware of the rising number of home invasions. At some point Geocaching.com and the community is going to have to step up to the bat and address this issue. In my opinion they should create and enforce strict guidelines (container size, type) for a cache and eliminate micros. This may cause a little slump in the bottom line, but the consequences of not doing it will be far worse in the long run.

Why eliminate micro's ? Because they promote and encourage the placement of caches without permission.

If you doubt this, do some research in your area... check for yourself. MOST micros are placed without

permission and FEW larger more traditional caches are placed without permission.

  1. You emphasize 'emergence' like it's something that happened recently, instead of something that happened close to a decade ago, long before you began geocaching.
  2. You don't appear to understand the 'permission' guideline.
  3. If you were to check to see if permission was received, how would you know that you've reaced the same person who gave permission, sometimes years prior?
  4. The bulk of your post has nothing to do with micros. While you've imagined some connection between caches placed without permission and micros, you haven't actually shown any. An argument could just as easily be made that few larger caches actually have explicit permission.

Edited by sbell111
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some people aren't all that crazy about trading trinkets and such when caching.

That's kewl. The nice thing about caches bigger than the oh so crappy film can is they can satisfy both those folks who do like to paw through trinkets, trade travel bugs, etc, and those folks who don't like this aspect of the hobby. Those who don't can simply grab the logbook, scribble a kwick "TFTC", then move on, basking in their increased smiley count. Those who do like these things can paw to their heart's content. Micros don't offer both options. :D

Of course for those that just want to sign the log an move on, an ammo can full of trinkets and log book can be a pain. You have to paw through all that stuff you don't want to paw through to find the log book, then flip thru the pages to find a blank one to sign, feel guilty about taking a whole page just sign your name, put everthing back, and then carefully replace the pile of rocks or sticks to cover up the cache. This can take as long and having wind up the log scroll so it will fit in a nano. :)

 

Emergence is the key word, indicating mico's were not part of the original geocaching sport. Very well stated ! Further, the people who won't take the time to create a decent cache likely do not take

the time to get permission to place them. To me, micro's defeat the original idea of geocaching. If I really

disliked them that much, I would hunt them, then check with the property owner or manager to see if they have permission to be there. If not, post it. I'll bet 90 percent of them are placed without permission. About 40% of the caches returned in a query of my area were micro's and I know for a fact that some were placed without permission. It seems when someone is willing to invest some time and thought in a nice cache, they value it enough to get permission. Mico's are a quick and dirty solution for those who just want numbers or or are not willing to put a little thought and work into a cache. I have been logging some of them and have to say they are not much fun for me. Not having permission is a real issue when property owners and others see people messing about and don't know why they are there. I live in a rural area and when I see someone lurking about on my property and I don't know them or know why they are there, I put some extra magazines on my belt and turn on the video recorder. Few people know about geocaching and everyone is aware of the rising number of home invasions. At some point Geocaching.com and the community is going to have to step up to the bat and address this issue. In my opinion they should create and enforce strict guidelines (container size, type) for a cache and eliminate micros. This may cause a little slump in the bottom line, but the consequences of not doing it will be far worse in the long run.

Why eliminate micro's ? Because they promote and encourage the placement of caches without permission.

If you doubt this, do some research in your area... check for yourself. MOST micros are placed without

permission and FEW larger more traditional caches are placed without permission.

Once againg a perception of micros as being equiventlant to cheap and careless hides. There are certainly some people who throw down caches in any old location just to put out another cache and some of these are placed without permission on private propery. I doubt the problem is as serious as it is made out to be, but is takes only one run in with an angry property owner to sour a geocacher on looking for these kinds of hides. I think however that many micros are hidden with adequate permission. Any size cache can be hidden in poor location. I've seen ammo cans in questionable locations and when these are found by muggles, they generally cause much more of a problem than a film can or a bison tube.

 

Micros are used more often in urban/suburban envirorments because they are somewhat easier to hide, and as mentioned above - a regular cache, especially something like an ammo can, can cause much more of a problem if found by a muggle in these areas. I'm suspecting srondar has an issue caching in high muggle areas when it isn't clear whether there was adequate permission and since these are likely to be urban/suburban ares the hides are more likely to be micros. It is not the size of the cache that causes these sorts of hides. If we didn't allow micros, people would hide small or regular caches (and we'd see even more bomb squad incidents). There have been some suggestions that the adequate permission guideline be tightened for caches that appear to be on private property with reviewers asking for the name of the person giving permission for such caches. If there is really a problem because of caches being placed without adequate permission this makes more sense than asking for a ban on a certain size cache.

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