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Do you TRADE for a bug?


Guest T-storm

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Guest T-storm

I wondered what thoughts others have on this topic. If you take a bug from a cache, do you trade items as an exchange for the bug? Or do you consider the bug a separate game and offer your tradestuffs only for a regular cache trinket? Similarly, if you visit a cache and deposit a travel bug in it, do you take item(s) from the cache in exchange for it or not?

 

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http://www.cordianet.com/geocaching

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Guest web-ling

I've always traded for a TB. Isn't that one of the major premises of this game: If you take something, leave something? I'd rather trade a TB than a golf ball or keychain any day...

 

Web-ling

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Guest glenn95630

I always trade for a TB, but I admit I can see both sides. A true hitchhiker would go-along-for-the-ride and not be part of a transaction.

 

My concern is what item to trade for a TB that has equal value? Since these are more-or-less unique items, anything I trade seems to degrade the cache. I've decided that from an overall standpoint it equals out, the cache I take the TB from gets degraded, the cache I leave the TB in gets upgraded.

 

Glenn95630

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Guest NE Cache Guy

I never trade an item for a bug, either placing or removing. I consider it a separate game. If I take an item other than the bug, then I put an item in its place.

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quote:
Originally posted by web-ling:

I've always traded for a TB. Isn't that one of the major premises of this game: If you take something, leave something? I'd rather trade a TB than a golf ball or keychain any day...

 

Web-ling


i agree with web-ling, take something, leave something, its how it works....

i know some ppl dont do this but, thats one of those "grey" areas with TB's you cant complain either way because its not "set in stone".

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Guest kablooey

I agree with glenn95630. The TB is a "valuable" item that many cachers are hunting. If I take a TB, I try to leave something good in its place. Ideally another TB (though that's usually not available). It's disappointing for a cacher to arrive at a site, hoping to find a TB, only to learn that somebody else got there first; so the least you can try to do is leave something worthwhile, no?

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Guest T-storm

Well now that I have a couple of responses, here's my thoughts on the subject. I don't trade for a TB, whether picking it up or dropping it off. I see the TB thing as an entirely separate game facilitated by the existance of caches. My contribution is to help move the TB toward its stated goal, to an interesting cache, or to a cache at some distance from where I found it. As I see it, when I trade for cache trinkets, they are mine to keep or pass along as I wish. So I have truly traded for them. I am not free to keep a TB, so I'm not interested in "trading" my caching bits for it. I always leave my signature piece in new finds. I may also choose to trade for something else in the cache, and I do sometimes choose to make that an "upgrade the cache" trade. But I never consider that I have traded for the TB. Likewise I never take anything from a cache if all I leave is a TB.

 

T-storm

 

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http://www.cordianet.com/geocaching

 

[This message has been edited by T-storm (edited 14 January 2002).]

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Interesting point. I have a bug out there for which I have no clue if the person who took it traded anything for it -- this isn't too much of an issue since I placed it in one of my caches that was already established, and has also been ugraded with a cache kit.

 

Were I to encounter a bug, I would leave something for it. I don't have a problem with this since many caches I now visit get a pack of firestarters even though I take nothing nothing -- ie. take nothing/leave something.

 

Yet were I to encounter said bug and be at the point of passing it along to another cache ... I'm not as sure. I seem to have a hangup about it. Given the distinct and parallel nature of the travel bug/hitchhiker to geocaching, were I to take something from a cache into which I put a bug, in a sense I'm devaluing a cache, especially since I know that the person who takes the bug may take the bug without putting something in with the opinion that "it's a seperate thing".

 

Most certainly given the idea of my leaving my signature item regardless of whether or not I take something, I'm able to leave something else besides the TB without it being a hardship. But you ask an interesting question to which I don't know the answer ... gotta come across a bug first to see what happens. And now that I've been appraised of this notion, who knows?

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Guest LindaLu

I have done both. When I plan on keeping the bug for a while, I trade something. If I plan on dropping it off in a nearby cache the same morning, then sometimes I don't trade anything for it.

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Guest T-storm

To push the discussion in a little different direction, I'd like to ask those who either trade for a bug or see it as an item of value to the cache, how do you determine what is an equitable trade for a bug? In the case of a bug I released a while back, I know folks aren't trading dollar value for it when they trade for it. It cost about $10-12 to put together, so that would be some steep trading! I've also picked up one of Web-ling's bugs (Nibco, The Morphing Travel Bug-- which I thought was a really cool idea, by the way) which I think would be hard for folks to place a value on. The idea is to attach a different oddball item to the logbook and tag before re-hiding it. It originally had an outdoor watertap on it. We switched that for a ceramic stopper from a Grolsch beer bottle, and another person put a miniature version of their sock-monkey alter-ego on it. That would be hard to value. So what criteria do you use? Just wondering...

 

T-storm

 

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http://www.cordianet.com/geocaching

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I always trade for a T.B. My thought is the amount of items in a Cache container should stay the same. You take something out, put something back in. I hate going to caches that are almost totally empty, so I always place something, even if I dont take anything. As far as value of a T.B. vs a cache item, I dont believe that matters either way. -C

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I never trade for a TB. I treat it as a seperate item that just happens to reside temporarily in a cache.

 

If I want to trade for something else in the cache, I treat that seperatly.

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Guest Rocknroll

I know it takes a little money to put these together but face it, the cost isn't a great expense compared to the GPS unit. Just like this whole game, have fun, If you want to take something then really really try to leave something (I think this is best and should be the only way) leave something. If you don't want to take something and you want to leave something thats okay. When I go to a cache I try to have more things with me than I am going to switch so when I go to some another sight and its kind of empty add two or three items and take one. I am going to be putting out some bugs soon, Will I trade? who knows read the signs as you go to the cache and make the whole game better.

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Guest SwampBuggy

For those of you who take a travel bug without trading, let me ask you a question.

Would you take another item without a trade?

If the answer is yes, than that's your choice since this is all supposed to be in fun anyway.

If your answer is no, then I'm genuinely curious as to how you came to the conclusion that this is a completely seperate activity?

Many people place item W in cache Y after retreiving item W from cache X. Why is this so different?

I'm not trying to judge anyone here, I don't really care if you trade for a bug but the rational I've heard so far seems a little on the weak side.

I mostly feel this way because I myself am more likely to hunt a cache if I've seen evidence that a travel bug could be inside.

To say these have no value strikes me as absurd.

You can do what you want, I have no right to beef since it's most likely a thousand miles from where I live anyway.

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Guest ErinsWeb

First off, I primarily Geocache to spend time with my child. Sometimes I wonder if she likes it 'cause she gets to spend time with Dad or it's the "thrill of the hunt"? I know she doesn't ever ask Mom to go (I ask just to cover the bases).

 

We will usually pack a bag with items that she has gone through and decided that she would like to place in a cache. When we find a cache, we always try to leave something even if we don't take anything.

 

I have always felt that the Bugs were a separate "part" of geocaching. We really haven't left anything intrade for the bug itself, even though we may leave something for the cache in general and not take anything else (like above).

 

Like others have said "how would you really trade for a bug?". You are in reality just giving it a ride.

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quote:
Originally posted by SwampBuggy:

For those of you who take a travel bug without trading, let me ask you a question.

Would you take another item without a trade?


No, I would not

quote:
If your answer is no, then I'm genuinely curious as to how you came to the conclusion that this is a completely seperate activity?
Because the TB has its own seperate cache page, with its own seperate ID number, and its own seperate record in the geocaching database.

 

And while the rules on the geocache pages explain that you should take an item, leave an item, no where are there similier rules on the TB instructions. The TB is not part of the cache it resides in, its simply visiting that container.

quote:
Originally posted by Mikel &ErinsWeb:

Like others have said "how would you really trade for a bug?". You are in reality just giving it a ride.


Exactly - When you do a normal cache, unrelated to a TB, you make a trade; the thing you are taking, you get to keep in exchange for the thing you left. However, you don't get to keep the TB, you have to drop it off somewhere.

 

[This message has been edited by arffer (edited 16 January 2002).]

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Guest NE Cache Guy

Right on, Arffer ...

 

I think the key to understanding this mindset it at the end, when we place the TB in a cache, or at the beginning, when the TB was originally placed in a cache. I don't take something out of the cache when I put a TB in it, I don't expect anyone to trade for it when they take it. I do expect them to move it to another cache. In a sense, that is the trade; you take, you move.

 

Good Trade.

 

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"Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level, then beat you with experience." -- Anonymous

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Guest Choberiba

Let me toss in my own two ¥.

 

I think Arffer made some very good points.

When I place my Travel Bug in a cache I consider this a seperate act.

When I place a cache, I don't trade with myself. That's what you'd be doing if you took something while placing your TB-cache.

 

I still might add something when I nab a TB, but I tend to add things anyway.

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Guest BlueDamsel

I like to watch the page and see where they go after I've had them.

 

I started trading for travel bugs because I felt cheap taking it without leaving anything behind. The only one I ever took without trading for it, was because it was in sad shape and I wanted to replace the container it was in so it wouldn't get damaged.

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quote:
Originally posted by BlueDamsel:

I started trading for travel bugs because I felt cheap taking it without leaving anything behind


 

Fine, if you felt guilty by not trading, by all means trade for a TB. But that doesn't mean its the correct procedure, it just means you feel better. That's what preference means.

 

For example, if we come across a cache that is very low on tradable items, then we will leave a few for the one we take. That doesn't mean our procedure is correct, nor would we ever think of imposing it on others. It just make us feel better.

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Guest st_richardson

I tend to treat it as a separate game.

I had someone not pick up my travel bug because he said that he didn't have anything to leave. As a result, the travel bug sat in my cache for much longer without moving on its goal. I would of preferred it to be picked up even without a trade.

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I agree with arffer too. You can use items for which you traded as items to trade at another cache, but you don't HAVE to. With a travel bug, you HAVE to leave it somewhere. That would be the point of the bug.

 

I find this thread pertinent right now because I am planning a trip (meaning a few hours' drive) southwest specifically to pick up a bug that wants to go east... I plan to place him in a cache I couldn't find this summer, if I can find it. But if I can't, I'll place her at one of mine that's east and check on my cache while I'm at it. But, I wouldn't trade at my cache, and I might want to at the cache I hope to find, just because it will be such an accomplishment for me terrain-wise that I'd kind of like to have something tangible to remember the trip.

 

Yep, to me, travel bugs are a separate game altogether : )

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Guest martinp13

Separate game. I don't trade items for bugs, retrieving or placing. I still make my "normal" trade (or not), but a bug present doesn't affect that.

 

I recently revisited a cache just to retrieve a bug before I took a trip. I just went to the cache, took the bug, and I might have signed the log... can't remember (I've slept since then).

 

Regardless of any of this, there are no hard and fast rules. If you want to trade items for bugs, go right ahead. There's certainly nothing wrong with that. If you don't trade items for bugs, that's cool too.

 

If you feel you *have* to trade for a bug, do you take an item for making your log entry? I mean, you ARE leaving something behind... something quite personal! icon_wink.gif

 

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> Martin

Magellan 330 (1.56/WAAS enabled!)

Don't have time to program and record your shows while geocaching? Get a TiVo !

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Guest martinp13

Separate game. I don't trade items for bugs, retrieving or placing. I still make my "normal" trade (or not), but a bug present doesn't affect that.

 

I recently revisited a cache just to retrieve a bug before I took a trip. I just went to the cache, took the bug, and I might have signed the log... can't remember (I've slept since then).

 

Regardless of any of this, there are no hard and fast rules. If you want to trade items for bugs, go right ahead. There's certainly nothing wrong with that. If you don't trade items for bugs, that's cool too.

 

If you feel you *have* to trade for a bug, do you take an item for making your log entry? I mean, you ARE leaving something behind... something quite personal! icon_wink.gif

 

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> Martin

Magellan 330 (1.56/WAAS enabled!)

Don't have time to program and record your shows while geocaching? Get a TiVo !

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Guest web-ling

I've always traded for TBs, and had assumed everybody did. I think that after reading this thread, I'm changing my practice. From now on, I'm only trading for a bug when I TAKE one. When placing, I'm not going to trade.

 

Why? By NOT trading when I place a bug, I'm adding to the total contents of the cache. I'm improving it. By trading when I take one, I either a) maintain the total 'value' of the cache (if the person who placed it also traded), or :( improving the 'value' of the cache (if the person who placed it DIDN'T trade.) Either way, the cache ends up the same or better than before I found it.

 

The more I play this game, and the more I read these forums, the more I learn and refine my thinking. I look back at some of my early logs, and think, 'I traded WHAT!!!?' eek.gif I'm also learning to be a bit more creative when planting new caches. I appreciate the input that all of you who post in these forums provide. Thanks!

 

Web-ling

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Guest T-storm

quote:
Originally posted by martinp13:

I recently revisited a cache just to retrieve a bug before I took a trip. I just went to the cache, took the bug, and I might have signed the log... can't remember


 

You signed the log! It's sitting here on my desk, as that cache was plundered about 10 days later. I've hidden it in a new spot with a new logbook and will scan this one in once I get my scanner working again. Though one other actual cacher found it after you and before it was scattered to the wind, several kids found it and "traded" stuff from it. You probably saved that bug's "life."

 

T-storm

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Guest SNIFTER

I have just placed my first TB and I would not expect anyone to trade for it. It is definately a seperate game. In Australia we have quite a few hitch hikers and I do not trade for them either. I trade for cache items and often leave more than I take.

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t was put in there by someone else not the original cache placer so removal wouldn't have "degraded" the cache, would it?(I found that out later when I read the cache posts). Anyway that's what I did. Oh also. When I got home I found the inside of the TB had a dollar and some coins. So I added some postage stamps and will probably place the TB in a cache in the next week or so. Anyway, I don't want to get too technical but it seems that what I'm doing is reasonable and fair. I mean it's not up there like robbing a bank is it? Aren't we getting a little bit too nuts about this?

 

Alan2

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And now to further confuse issues; I have just created a Cache that is a Travel Bug! You can place it as a cache for future cachers or you can move it to another state.

It is large enough for several items to fit inside (I am themeing it), Yet I have attached a travel tag to it so it can be placed IN a cache as a bug! I will give it a cache page as a cache & a travel bug page as a bug. Anyone finding it can log a "Found It". I am currently writing it up, so am soliciting input from fellow cachers before I place it. I did this with my cache:

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=12627

 

& got some really good feedback that helped me in the implementation. If any one would like to take a peek at what I have so far on this one please email me. I'd like to get some feedback before I finalize it!

 

[This message has been edited by crusso (edited 01 February 2002).]

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