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Opinions on a FTF situation


Scubasonic
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So here it is a cache gets published and several cachers run out to get the FTF. the cache owner however had not placed the cache in it's hidy spot before it was published which I will add is a most obvious spot, even a new cacher would have found within a minute or 2, but be that as it may a very good caching friend of mine was there fist on the scene within minutes looked and could not find it along with others that showed up after him, and it was quickly figured out that it had not been placed. So as the day wears on the cache owner finally posts a note apologizing and says that the cache is now in place so I went and got the FTF. My buddy showed up a few days later made the find and posted a normal post online but logged it on his profile as a FTF, when I talked to him he said it was because he looked exactly where the cache was, when it was published, and he is right so he is saying because if it was there he would have been FTF.......what's your call on it.

 

Scubasonic

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FTF is not really recognized by the site. Just by the individuals. I usually let other people do the FTF beta testing of a cache before I'll go out and do it because of situations like this.

 

That being said, maybe you and your buddy can find an agreement between first to beta test and second to beta test or something.

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Sorry he wasted a trip thanks to a negligent cache owner, but the fact is that you found it first and you signed the log first. Whether or not he would have found it is irrelevant. Since FTF doesn't mean anything, really, he can claim whatever he wants, or you can both claim it, or neither of you. Whatever happens, I wouldn't refrain from claiming it just because he wants to claim it.

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well, to me is the same as logging a find on a cache that is gone and saying "i would have found it if it was there", which BTW its a real situations

 

its different in a group, we go in groups here and we all share in the FTF but in this case i think its rightfully yours since you were the first to actually sign the log

 

with all that said, i wouldn't make too much fuss about it

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The first name in the log is the FTF, but you will never convince your friend of this. He can play the game any way he wants. If he really feels he earned the FTF, let him add it to his stats. But, since he didn't find it, how does he know he was the first one to not find it? How many other caches has he logged, but not found?Most cachers will agree that you earned it, so you can put it in your stats too. Groundspeack doesn't care.

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..what's your call on it.

 

Scubasonic

 

If my Auntie had wheels she'd be a bus. Fact is, you found it first, you signed the log first, it's yours for the claiming. Based on your friends logic, we could scour the land here for nice hiddey holes, then wait, and wait, and when a cacher puts a cache in there, we'll claim first to find as we actually spotted the hole in 1786!!!!

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If he wanted it that bad I would delete my find, go back out and resign the log, post a 'new' Found it. I know I would because I've done it. (And if I remember correctly that whole situation prompted some themed caches by a few others)

 

If I'm FTF on anything it certainly wasn't because I rushed out there. Any debate is not worth the angst, if they want it, they got it. I couldn't care less.

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Yeah. I wasted an hour on one of those 'cache published, but not hidden yet' fiascos. I might have found it if it had been there. But it wasn't there, so I didn't find it. That's a DNF. (And some rather unkind thoughts directed at the CO!) First to find the cache and sign the log is FTF. Your 'friend' might be FTDNF, but is definitely NOT FTF.

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Your buddy's fake FTF is in line with Generation ME logic. I woulda, shoulda, coulda, but didn't.

Though FTFS aren't officially recognized, he didn't sign the log first, therefore he is second or whereever he is in the log.

 

But again, these Generation ME players all say they play the game their way. So let him "cheat" his FTF and go on and about your day

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I just thought I would bring it to a discussion point, I do realize that Groundspeak does not recognize FTFs but within the small network that does FTFs I just wanted a consensus. Not he didn't post it online that he got the FTF just his profile Page. As I said he is a very good friend, guess everyone rolls differently.........

 

Scubasonic

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Sorry he wasted a trip thanks to a negligent cache owner.

 

With over 970+ FTFs this has happened to me many times (cache published without the physical cache being there) but I figure it goes with the territory when you go for FTFs.

 

Scubasonic

 

That's true, you never know what you're going to get...

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Many folks here will band together when they meet at the cache location and share FTF honors. I really don't know how many FTFs I have. I only know that I have found some and that's good enough for me. There are others around here who can tell you precisely how many they have found. More important for me is to beat the local FTF hound to the cache so that he finds me contentedly signing the log when he gets there. Nah...nah...nahnah...nah :oP

You're friends, you were first to find, he was first not to find- so share the FTF.

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I don't let people claim my caches unless they sign the logs. Not that i check up on them, but for example, one guy logged it as a find and said, "Found the spot, but i don't think the cache is there."

 

Turns out the cache was there and he just assumed it was the spot. Regardless, i deleted his log. If its not there, its a DNF. (Besides, how else is the CO supposed to know to disable it to fix it if you log it when its not there??)

 

Anyway, i agree i wouldn't make too big a fuss over it. I am an FTF hound and love them, but its not THAT big of a deal. If anything, agree to log Co-FTF.

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The first time we logged FTF was on a cache that had a virgin logsheet when we signed. We got home to discover that another cacher had claimed the FTF on it by virtue of having found the container, but they had been unable to open it to sign the log (it was a bison tube). We let the CO make the call on it, and he decided in our favor. We were hot for a FTF back then, but our interest lately has waned. The whole FTF race thing just gets so contentious sometimes, and we cache for fun.

We did, though, log FTF on one just yesterday, but that one had sat in the woods (in 90+ degree heat, at the end of a short hike) for two days unfound. We were actually surprised to find a blank logsheet.

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Locating the empty place where a cache is going to be is no different to locating the empty place where a cache once was. Neither of them are finds due to the small matter of the log not being signed. The last "F" in "FTF" does after all stand for "Find" and your buddy didn't get one.

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Personally, all FTF questions bore me, at best, but since you asked... who found the cache first? Not the hiding spot, but the cache? Who signed the log first? Isn't this a no-brainer? :D

 

Agree with this. But, I also wouldn't worry about publicly calling the guy out about it.

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The way I see it neither you nor your friend were at fault to log an FTF. The error was on the part of the cache owner. In order to get it in the queue for approval from the reviewers the owner must check a box stating that the cache is active. Now how can a cache be active if it is not there? The owner didn't have it there so share the FTF and go out and find some more.

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So here it is a cache gets published and several cachers run out to get the FTF. the cache owner however had not placed the cache in it's hidy spot before it was published which I will add is a most obvious spot, even a new cacher would have found within a minute or 2, but be that as it may a very good caching friend of mine was there fist on the scene within minutes looked and could not find it along with others that showed up after him, and it was quickly figured out that it had not been placed. So as the day wears on the cache owner finally posts a note apologizing and says that the cache is now in place so I went and got the FTF. My buddy showed up a few days later made the find and posted a normal post online but logged it on his profile as a FTF, when I talked to him he said it was because he looked exactly where the cache was, when it was published, and he is right so he is saying because if it was there he would have been FTF.......what's your call on it.

 

Scubasonic

I'd log it FTF and just predate your find one day before your friend so you're top of the list. Beyond that, I wouldn't worry about it as your friend will just end up whining or have animosity towards you. I do agree about the ME generation.. it is more prevalent than you think.

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At least the CO acknowledged that the cache had not been placed yet. You found it first. Don't worry about what your friend does in his profile. I was FTF on a couple of caches a couple of days before a group of people came through and grabbed a bunch of new caches. They were FTF on a few, but I noticed that one cacher claimed to be FTF on the ones I found before them. That's the beauty of the unofficialness of FTF.

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But again, these Generation ME players all say they play the game their way.

 

Ummm no. Stop generalizing, it proves nothing.

What are you saying? It is my opinion that people in the Generation ME play their way.

If you are offended, oh well.

 

What are you saying? It is my opinion that people who try to make points using baseless generalizations prove nothing.

 

If you are offended, oh well.

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At least the CO acknowledged that the cache had not been placed yet. You found it first. Don't worry about what your friend does in his profile. I was FTF on a couple of caches a couple of days before a group of people came through and grabbed a bunch of new caches. They were FTF on a few, but I noticed that one cacher claimed to be FTF on the ones I found before them. That's the beauty of the unofficialness of FTF.

 

I don't use the initials on any log, which simplifies matters a great deal, but I have to admit that I am tempted to start using them on every log that I write except for the ones that were blank because I happened to be the first one there, But the consequences of something like that could be too far reaching for me to risk, it could bring down caching itself by interjecting an undefineable element that subtly changes the entire game without anybody realizing it. (Those who have read the Illuminatti trilogy will recall what happened when the Midget left unobtrussive signs, asking people not to spit, in locations like elevators of large corporate buildings. It created chaos, which is not altogether a bad thing if you are a Discordian, but the same effect could happen here.)

 

So if someone wants to claim an FTF, even if four or five people want to claim an FTF, I have no problem with it. The more the merrier. But some thought should be given to the larger ramifications.

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You got the FTF, tell your friend he is wrong.

 

I had one recently where I would have gotten the FTF if the container had been placed, but since it wasn't I missed out on the FTF.

 

I would have gotten another if a homeless man wasn't sleeping at ground zero, but since I wasn't I missed out on the FTF.

 

You were the first to sign the log, so you were the FTF.

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I found a really cool place to hide a cache the other day. Now if someone will just put a cache there, I can claim FTF! :unsure:

 

FTF = Name of the guy who signed first in the log book. Period.

 

Yep.. that's the way it should be if it were official. But I break away and go one more step..

 

It should be the FIRST signature on the paper log ONCE the cache has been published. Beta-testers or tag-a-longs that sign FTF bug me. But not to the point where I'd start a thread over it. :unsure:

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