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Lately I have had quite a few online logs saying that the cacher didn't have a pen so didn't sign the log. I know it's easy to forget to take a pen or pencil but when I forget I always take a photo with my phone and send it to the cache owner to prove I have found the cache. I never rely on a pen being in the cache as there are so many micros and nanos now.

Am I being picky when I say it's too easy to say "Didn't sign the log, no pen"

I know it's just a game and everyone plays it in their own way.

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Lately I have had quite a few online logs saying that the cacher didn't have a pen so didn't sign the log. I know it's easy to forget to take a pen or pencil but when I forget I always take a photo with my phone and send it to the cache owner to prove I have found the cache. I never rely on a pen being in the cache as there are so many micros and nanos now.

Am I being picky when I say it's too easy to say "Didn't sign the log, no pen"

I know it's just a game and everyone plays it in their own way.

 

I think you may have just opened up a very old and ripe can of worms.

 

You are correct in stating that everyone plays the game in their own way. However, it is up to you to say whether it is a legitimate find as the cache owner. Most people subscribe to the notion that if the log isn't signed then it's not legitimate unless there is another way for the finder to prove they were there with a photo.

 

There are cache owners out there that are extremely zealous when deleting logs of this type. I suggest you speak to/email the finder and ask them about it. Don't just delete the log as this can cause a major headache.

 

I also refer you to the Getting Started page. See point 7 http://www.geocaching.com/about/default.aspx

 

It is very rare that a geocacher won't have a pen with them but on odd occasions where I don't have one, I've taken a pen from a nearby cache and returned it. I've heard of others using sticks as pens with mud as ink.

 

Hope this helps

 

Geohatter

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...

 

I've heard of others using sticks as pens with mud as ink.

 

 

Yep, done that. Also a stick and squished blackberry, elderberry or a burned match to leave a mark; also used a stick to poke a few holes into the log page as proof I was there. It's very very rare that it's not possible to leave some proof of a visit.

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Yes, this can be a bit of a can of worms, see This thread on the Geocaching Topics forum. Geohatter summed it up well.

 

Most people agree that logs should generally be signed. Where there is difference of opinion is regarding if exceptions are ever warranted or not. At one end of the scale, the actual log must be signed - no photos, no adding additional paper if the log is full, etc. Some even say no stickers or stamps. At the other end of the scale owners leave it up to the finder.

 

Personally of my ~800 physical finds, 2 times I claimed a find when I did not sign the log:

 

1. Was a simple case where I did not have a pen, and there was no pen in the cache. I did think about trying sign with mud, but I took a photo of the logbook instead. The owner was fine with this.

 

2. Was a case with a wasps nest in the hole where the cache was. As I attempted to remove the cache I was attacked and ran away. In this case the cache was the final stage in an elaborate puzzle, outside my normal area. I explained to the owner, gave them the coordinates (to show I solved the puzzle), and described the hide and container. They said "of course you can log it as a find".

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I think it's just been the once where I've had no pen. I went out on a walk to find just 1 cache with my Mum and sister, and forgot to take my pen. The cache owner was fine with the photo of me holding the cache, and even discussed it with him at a local meet a few weeks later. I also left a TB in the cache as further proof that I'd opened the cache.

 

Normally, if I'm out by myself with lots of visits, I take a bag of various items, including a few pens.

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On my very first cache find, I was very nervous about being spotted/seen as acting suspicious, so just picked up the object (it was a micro), looked to make sure it was what I thought it was, then replaced it where I found it.

 

I logged it on-line as a find, then a few days later, having gained more confidence (and finds), revisited the site to retrospectively enter a cache log, and edited the on-line log to that effect.

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Yes, this can be a bit of a can of worms, see This thread on the Geocaching Topics forum. Geohatter summed it up well.

....

As a complete newbie I am glad that I paid for my premium membership before looking at the forums. Threads like that one make me think that this is not the hobby for me. Yes I have seen dozens of friendly threads, but those rabid threads realy kill off the family friendly feel.

 

When I signed up for my account I found that most variations of my usual internet handle where taken, and chose Fenrir101, When I signed my first few cache log's I actualy used my normal handle out of habit, and frankly the thought that the cache owners could decide to disallow my finds because of that is not a happy one.

 

I know that once any forum will start picking up more extreme members as they grow, but the fact that within 7 hours of that thread starting someone honestly equated not signing the log with commiting murder and appears to be fully serious is just scary. And its not just that thread, I have been doing a lot of searching to find answers to some fairly common new guy questions and every single one that I have found has degenerated into similar levels of commentary.

 

Most of you folks seem fairly nice, but the weirdo's sure are loud around here :D

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I think you may have missed some of the ironic humour going on in that thread. I had a quick look and didn't see anything "rabid", although this is a worldwide pastime and sometimes "humor" doesn't travel so well! :D Or were you being ironic?

 

As this is meant to be only a game, the "rule" of the game is that you're supposed to sign the physical log to signify completion of the task. Only last week I had my hand on a cache but was unable to sign the log as I couldn't get the container into a position where I could open it. DNF recorded. It's only a game. However, this week I tried to sign one but couldn't make a legible mark as the paper was soaked. "Find" recorded anyway. I think that sums up the range of find/not found situations.

Edited by Happy Humphrey
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As a complete newbie I am glad that I paid for my premium membership before looking at the forums. Threads like that one make me think that this is not the hobby for me. Yes I have seen dozens of friendly threads, but those rabid threads realy kill off the family friendly feel.

 

When I signed up for my account I found that most variations of my usual internet handle where taken, and chose Fenrir101, When I signed my first few cache log's I actualy used my normal handle out of habit, and frankly the thought that the cache owners could decide to disallow my finds because of that is not a happy one.

 

I know that once any forum will start picking up more extreme members as they grow, but the fact that within 7 hours of that thread starting someone honestly equated not signing the log with commiting murder and appears to be fully serious is just scary. And its not just that thread, I have been doing a lot of searching to find answers to some fairly common new guy questions and every single one that I have found has degenerated into similar levels of commentary.

 

Most of you folks seem fairly nice, but the weirdo's sure are loud around here :D

 

Please don't be put off! The forums do sometimes get off track (I think the general ones more so than the UK one), but it doesn't spoil the fun of the game. And all the geocachers I've actually met are nice people. It's a vocal minority in some of the forums who put "newbies" off... There is even a thread in that "general" forum on being nicer when posting.... so it's a known issue.

 

Mark

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As a complete newbie I am glad that I paid for my premium membership before looking at the forums. Threads like that one make me think that this is not the hobby for me. Yes I have seen dozens of friendly threads, but those rabid threads realy kill off the family friendly feel.

 

When I signed up for my account I found that most variations of my usual internet handle where taken, and chose Fenrir101, When I signed my first few cache log's I actualy used my normal handle out of habit, and frankly the thought that the cache owners could decide to disallow my finds because of that is not a happy one.

 

I know that once any forum will start picking up more extreme members as they grow, but the fact that within 7 hours of that thread starting someone honestly equated not signing the log with commiting murder and appears to be fully serious is just scary. And its not just that thread, I have been doing a lot of searching to find answers to some fairly common new guy questions and every single one that I have found has degenerated into similar levels of commentary.

 

Most of you folks seem fairly nice, but the weirdo's sure are loud around here :D

 

Please don't be put off! The forums do sometimes get off track (I think the general ones more so than the UK one), but it doesn't spoil the fun of the game. And all the geocachers I've actually met are nice people. It's a vocal minority in some of the forums who put "newbies" off... There is even a thread in that "general" forum on being nicer when posting.... so it's a known issue.

 

Mark

Remember.

There's Geocaching.

And then there's the Geocaching Forums

 

Two different things. :D

 

Most are friendly (most of the time!)

A lot of it is a case of no face to face contact in the forums. Say it before thinking.

Things can, and do, get 'taken the wrong way' and get out of hand quickly.

(For example, the thread with a non-cacher asking how to get a cache removed from their allotment, went well over the top very quickly, with apologies all round afterwards. But the damage had already been done.)

 

Don't let the forums put you off caching! B)

A lot a cachers never visit the forums.

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I think you may have missed some of the ironic humour going on in that thread. I had a quick look and didn't see anything "rabid", although this is a worldwide pastime and sometimes "humor" doesn't travel so well! :D Or were you being ironic?

 

As this is meant to be only a game, the "rule" of the game is that you're supposed to sign the physical log to signify completion of the task. Only last week I had my hand on a cache but was unable to sign the log as I couldn't get the container into a position where I could open it. DNF recorded. It's only a game. However, this week I tried to sign one but couldn't make a legible mark as the paper was soaked. "Find" recorded anyway. I think that sums up the range of find/not found situations.

Oh I saw people using humour in the thread, but there are plenty of people in that thread and others who are deadly serious. There are a number of newbie related quesitons that don't seem to be answered in any official easy to find FAQ's that seem to polarise some of the posters here who then feel the need to leap into any thread about them and expound their point of view without giving any reasoning. As a newbie this is rather offputting.

 

Although there are many people on this forum who wouldnt blink at losing a few of their finds, for a newbie like me this would be a big dissapointment. My seven logs include one where I had to walk through fettid waste water and retreive the log from inside a sewer, the "water" had eaten the seal and so the log was damp. Previous finders had noted that the log was full so the combination of not wanting to destroy the log by trying to unroll it to try and find any blank space, and the stench coming off the sewer made me leave without signing it.

 

Many forum goers here would aparently consider that not finding the cache and would have no problem just moving on, but for me physicaly finding the cache under those circumstance and extracting the log roll is a significant acheivment, so if the cache owner where to decide that they where going to delete the log as I physicaly could not sign the roll, this would be a much bigger dissapointment to me than to someone with thousands of finds under their belt. But unfortunately I think some posters here have forgotten what it is like to be new at cacheing.

 

--Edited bit

Thanks to the people who replied whilst I was slowly typing the reply. I fully agree that most people here seem to be perfectly friendly, and I look forwards to my first confirmed real life meet, I have had a couple of people I suspected where also looking for the same chaches but never quite confirmed it :D

Edited by Fenrir101
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Lately I have had quite a few online logs saying that the cacher didn't have a pen so didn't sign the log. I know it's easy to forget to take a pen or pencil but when I forget I always take a photo with my phone and send it to the cache owner to prove I have found the cache. I never rely on a pen being in the cache as there are so many micros and nanos now.

Am I being picky when I say it's too easy to say "Didn't sign the log, no pen"

I know it's just a game and everyone plays it in their own way.

 

The way I decide whether something counts as a find (and this is just my own way of doing things) is to figure out whether I actually did what was required to locate and retrieve the cache.

 

If I located the cache and had it in my hand then it's a find, unless the cache page makes clear that opening the container is a part of the challenge and I failed to do so. That often means taking a picture of the cache and surroundings so the CO knows I did actually get to the cache. As far as possible I leave some evidence of my presence, which might be cutting the corners off a micro's log sheet, or leaving something in the container (even if it is just a crumpled leaf) or whatever. One time I found a micro the day after attending a wedding, so I cut a thin strip from the ribbon from our invite to put in the cache, on the basis it was all I had that would fit.

 

If I've sighted the cache but not retrieved it then I use common sense. If it's a 1/1 cache that's fallen somewhere out of reach I'll claim a find, if it's a 1/1 cache that I couldn't physically get to because of an infestation of muggles I'll claim a find. If the ratings are about 3 or higher because it's up a tree or in some obscure position then I don't claim it unless I physically retrieved it. I "found" one cache that was rated 3.5/3.5 in the sense I could see it, 20 feet up in the tree, but because the terrain and location makes clear you have to get to the cache rather than just sight it I just wrote a note.

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Lately I have had quite a few online logs saying that the cacher didn't have a pen so didn't sign the log. I know it's easy to forget to take a pen or pencil but when I forget I always take a photo with my phone and send it to the cache owner to prove I have found the cache. I never rely on a pen being in the cache as there are so many micros and nanos now.

Am I being picky when I say it's too easy to say "Didn't sign the log, no pen"

I know it's just a game and everyone plays it in their own way.

 

The way I decide whether something counts as a find (and this is just my own way of doing things) is to figure out whether I actually did what was required to locate and retrieve the cache.

 

If I located the cache and had it in my hand then it's a find, unless the cache page makes clear that opening the container is a part of the challenge and I failed to do so. That often means taking a picture of the cache and surroundings so the CO knows I did actually get to the cache. As far as possible I leave some evidence of my presence, which might be cutting the corners off a micro's log sheet, or leaving something in the container (even if it is just a crumpled leaf) or whatever. One time I found a micro the day after attending a wedding, so I cut a thin strip from the ribbon from our invite to put in the cache, on the basis it was all I had that would fit.

 

If I've sighted the cache but not retrieved it then I use common sense. If it's a 1/1 cache that's fallen somewhere out of reach I'll claim a find, if it's a 1/1 cache that I couldn't physically get to because of an infestation of muggles I'll claim a find. If the ratings are about 3 or higher because it's up a tree or in some obscure position then I don't claim it unless I physically retrieved it. I "found" one cache that was rated 3.5/3.5 in the sense I could see it, 20 feet up in the tree, but because the terrain and location makes clear you have to get to the cache rather than just sight it I just wrote a note.

 

And where exactly does your reasoning fit in with the publishing requirement that all physical caches require a log book :D

 

Its there for a reason, and if you don't append to it, you have not found the cache :D

 

We could all claim many more if we didn't walk away from those where muggles abound.

 

Your attitude is a disgrace. B)

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Lately I have had quite a few online logs saying that the cacher didn't have a pen so didn't sign the log. I know it's easy to forget to take a pen or pencil but when I forget I always take a photo with my phone and send it to the cache owner to prove I have found the cache. I never rely on a pen being in the cache as there are so many micros and nanos now.

Am I being picky when I say it's too easy to say "Didn't sign the log, no pen"

I know it's just a game and everyone plays it in their own way.

 

The way I decide whether something counts as a find (and this is just my own way of doing things) is to figure out whether I actually did what was required to locate and retrieve the cache.

 

If I located the cache and had it in my hand then it's a find, unless the cache page makes clear that opening the container is a part of the challenge and I failed to do so. That often means taking a picture of the cache and surroundings so the CO knows I did actually get to the cache. As far as possible I leave some evidence of my presence, which might be cutting the corners off a micro's log sheet, or leaving something in the container (even if it is just a crumpled leaf) or whatever. One time I found a micro the day after attending a wedding, so I cut a thin strip from the ribbon from our invite to put in the cache, on the basis it was all I had that would fit.

 

If I've sighted the cache but not retrieved it then I use common sense. If it's a 1/1 cache that's fallen somewhere out of reach I'll claim a find, if it's a 1/1 cache that I couldn't physically get to because of an infestation of muggles I'll claim a find. If the ratings are about 3 or higher because it's up a tree or in some obscure position then I don't claim it unless I physically retrieved it. I "found" one cache that was rated 3.5/3.5 in the sense I could see it, 20 feet up in the tree, but because the terrain and location makes clear you have to get to the cache rather than just sight it I just wrote a note.

 

And where exactly does your reasoning fit in with the publishing requirement that all physical caches require a log book :D

 

Its there for a reason, and if you don't append to it, you have not found the cache :D

 

We could all claim many more if we didn't walk away from those where muggles abound.

 

Your attitude is a disgrace. B)

 

Like I said, that's the way I do it on the basis it seems like common sense to me.

 

If you find it such a disgrace feel free to use your own way. So far none of the (few) times I've claimed a find without putting a mark on a book have caused any concern for the cache owner, so I guess they don't consider it such a disgrace.

 

If you want to use the term "disgrace" to mean "I disagree" then I'll return the compliment and say that I consider your attitude to be equally disgraceful :laughing:

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See, the can of worms is opened...

 

If you are true to your own conscience, and having fun, there is no disgrace. For me personally, of the items listed by team tisri, I agree with them all except the muggles one. I see muggles as an "expected hazard" - avoiding muggles is part of the game. When I've not been able to retrieve due to muggles I log a DNF. But I don't think less of anyone if they take a different view.

 

I would classify the cases where I personally think it is OK not to sign as:

 

1. Log related technicality: You have the cache in hand, but can't sign due to: log full, log wet, log missing, no pen, etc.

2. Unexpected Hazard: You find the cache, but before you can sign you are attacked by wasps, bulls, hit by lightening, etc, or some other unexpected event beyond your control.

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Can I ask, how many cache owners sit down with the log book from the cache and cross reference it with the online logs?

 

I must be honest and say I never have. If someone wishs to claim a find without logging then they are only cheating themselves.

 

Not having a pen, ok not a major problem. Seeing the cache 20ft up a tree and not been prepared to climb it, then that is a DNF in my book.

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There are a number of times I haven't signed a log. Cause it's too soggy, cause I don't have a pen, cause the log book is full. But if I found the cache in good faith I still log it. If the owner decides that's not enough - well that's their perogative as owner and I don't get upset if they delete my log.

 

If I can't sign the log, I usually try to be inventive as to other ways to log it - be that writing with a stick and mud, a photo, or a detailed description to the cache owner so they know I found it. I don't think anyone has ever turned down one of my 'alternative' means of logging a find.

 

The one exception is very hard puzzle caches. I know that owners of tricky puzzle caches can be very, very quick to check log books because they don't want people to cheat. So I would always sign the log book - even if that means a repeat visit.

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Seeing the cache 20ft up a tree and not been prepared to climb it, then that is a DNF in my book.

 

I wouldn't log a DNF for this, but neither would I log a find, rather I'd post a note saying what happened and leave it at that, I've done this on a few of occasions when muggles have prevented me getting at a cache. DNF means I looked properly and didn't find it, a find means I found it, had it in my grubby little mitts, opened it and left my mark (with one exception where the log was a lump of papier mache).

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Seeing the cache 20ft up a tree and not been prepared to climb it, then that is a DNF in my book.

 

I wouldn't log a DNF for this, but neither would I log a find, rather I'd post a note saying what happened and leave it at that, I've done this on a few of occasions when muggles have prevented me getting at a cache. DNF means I looked properly and didn't find it, a find means I found it, had it in my grubby little mitts, opened it and left my mark (with one exception where the log was a lump of papier mache).

 

Yep... the kind of note I leave says I found it in the sense of sighting it but not in the sense of retrieving it. If nothing else the Note rather than DNF makes clear the cache is still in place and I didn't retrieve it due to my own choices or limitations rather than because there's a problem with the cache.

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Yes, I wouldn't log a DNF for the unretrieved tree find because I DID find it; just I didn't reach it.

 

Luckily for me, I've had two such cases in the last couple of months and I went to considerable trouble to retrieve both and return the cache. Retrieving was easier than returning, and I'm really really glad no-one was around to watch what I did!!! (Yes, the trees ARE still standing!!!!!)

 

However, there've been a couple of finds I've made where I physically couldn't get to the caches because I wasn't tall enough. On both occasions I described the location/photographed the cache and the owners were kind enough to allow me to log a find.

 

There are others who wouldn't "own up" in that way, and that's up to them. As far as my own caching is concerned, I prefer to be open about what I could or couldn't do, but at the end of the day, you're only "cheating" yourself.

 

Oh, and for the poster who put "your attitude is a disgrace", I'm hoping the post is tongue-in-cheek. When you put it in the context of lots of people walking around trying to find little plastic boxes with little plastic things within, it really sounds a little too serious to be true!

 

:)

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I don't personally check all my physical logs against online logs so it's all trust.

 

if someone wants to cheat and say they found it, they're only kidding themselves.

 

As an example, have a look at the logs in May on this cache

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...77b06&log=y

 

Personally, if I was the owner, I would have probably removed it but only because they admitted they didn't find it!

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I don't personally check all my physical logs against online logs so it's all trust.

 

if someone wants to cheat and say they found it, they're only kidding themselves.

 

As an example, have a look at the logs in May on this cache

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...77b06&log=y

 

Personally, if I was the owner, I would have probably removed it but only because they admitted they didn't find it!

 

lol i don't get what's the point of logging a find like that

 

on a different note, someone definitely needs to post a NA log, CO hasn't logged in since march

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I don't personally check all my physical logs against online logs so it's all trust.

 

if someone wants to cheat and say they found it, they're only kidding themselves.

 

As an example, have a look at the logs in May on this cache

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...77b06&log=y

 

Personally, if I was the owner, I would have probably removed it but only because they admitted they didn't find it!

 

lol i don't get what's the point of logging a find like that

 

on a different note, someone definitely needs to post a NA log, CO hasn't logged in since march

 

... and lo, a small, blue man wanders onto the cache page... and does just that. :)

 

MrsB

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I don't personally check all my physical logs against online logs so it's all trust.

 

if someone wants to cheat and say they found it, they're only kidding themselves.

 

As an example, have a look at the logs in May on this cache

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...77b06&log=y

 

Personally, if I was the owner, I would have probably removed it but only because they admitted they didn't find it!

 

lol i don't get what's the point of logging a find like that

 

on a different note, someone definitely needs to post a NA log, CO hasn't logged in since march

 

... and lo, a small, blue man wanders onto the cache page... and does just that. :)

 

MrsB

smurf_228x2761.jpg

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I don't personally check all my physical logs against online logs so it's all trust.

 

if someone wants to cheat and say they found it, they're only kidding themselves.

 

As an example, have a look at the logs in May on this cache

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...77b06&log=y

 

Personally, if I was the owner, I would have probably removed it but only because they admitted they didn't find it!

 

lol i don't get what's the point of logging a find like that

 

on a different note, someone definitely needs to post a NA log, CO hasn't logged in since march

 

... and lo, a small, blue man wanders onto the cache page... and does just that. :)

 

MrsB

smurf_228x2761.jpg

 

 

Sorry for taking the thread off topic,

 

BUT, It anoys me when people KNOW that a cache need archiving and pussy foot about not wanting to offend anyone, if a cache is dead .. it's dead .. let it go

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I use so many different sigs in caches - depending on whether it's raining, if it's a nano, whether I'm alone or with another cacher, what colour pen I've got, whether I'm being followed :P , how mischievous I'm feeling, etc - that even I sometimes have trouble refinding my old logs :o;)

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When we were newbies we visited a few and expected pens to be in the caches. Now we would never be without a pen! I think it's probably quite forgiveable if a newbie doesn't sign the log as long as they admit it. Maybe just send them a nudge that they need to always carry a pen, as some owners may not be so forgiving and perhaps ask them to describe the cache location in detail just to prove they found? I signed a few caches with a stick and mud, but I did admit it! :o

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When we were newbies we visited a few and expected pens to be in the caches. Now we would never be without a pen! I think it's probably quite forgiveable if a newbie doesn't sign the log as long as they admit it. Maybe just send them a nudge that they need to always carry a pen, as some owners may not be so forgiving and perhaps ask them to describe the cache location in detail just to prove they found? I signed a few caches with a stick and mud, but I did admit it! :o

 

Even if you are not a newbie and know you should have a pen, it can be possible to find yourself without one. The one and only time I found I didn't have a pen, I am sure I put one in my pocket when I set out. It could have fallen out.

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When we were newbies we visited a few and expected pens to be in the caches. Now we would never be without a pen! I think it's probably quite forgiveable if a newbie doesn't sign the log as long as they admit it. Maybe just send them a nudge that they need to always carry a pen, as some owners may not be so forgiving and perhaps ask them to describe the cache location in detail just to prove they found? I signed a few caches with a stick and mud, but I did admit it! :P

 

Even if you are not a newbie and know you should have a pen, it can be possible to find yourself without one. The one and only time I found I didn't have a pen, I am sure I put one in my pocket when I set out. It could have fallen out.

 

Yep, with the best will in the world so much of these discussions lose sight of the underlying point of it all. Caching is supposed to be FUN. If it's not fun we might as well chuck our GPS units in the trash and forget about it. When I'm out caching I usually take a piece of paper and a pencil - the pencil won't dry up and the piece of paper is useful for recording clues from caches, noting what trackables I picked up and dropped off and so on. But sometimes I'm out and about and just wonder if there are any caches nearby. If I've got a recent PQ on my phone I might just load it up and have a look, in which case I may or may not have a pencil, or anything else to mark a log, or whatever. How does that mean I somehow didn't find the cache that I retrieved, held in my hands and opened looking for a pen?

 

Ultimately it's up to the cache owner whether to accept a Found log or not, but every single time I've recorded a Found without physically signing the log I've offered whatever evidence was available to the CO to demonstrate that I was at the right place and did find the cache. If in spite of all that the CO wants to delete my log because I didn't mark the paper, so be it.

 

If people want to figure that retrieving it, opening it but being unable to mark a piece of paper counts as not finding it then good luck to them. If that's you then log a DNF and go back another time. Just don't whinge and whine about others who want to play the game differently. It's not like there's a prize for finding more caches, so how one person plays the game really makes no difference to how the rest of us play the game.

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Looking at the original posting about not signing logs, (difficult if a nano and the strip is full)- photo and Message the owner. When We first started. she who must be obeyed made up a "Caching bag". This contains spare pens/pencils. Spare batteries for the GPS, set of gardening gloves for "feeling down 'oles", set of two way radios so she can sit down with elderly dog if terrain gets over 1 1/2 ! and shout orders Like "I'm getting very bored with this, haven't you found it yet" etc. Paper copies of cache instructions just in case and the pda for notes. This bag hangs on the coat pegs behind the front door with the dog leads etc., and so we are always prepared when the urge comes on ! Optional items are spare cache boxes, spare logs for cache maintenance and calling cards, travel bugs and Swapsies- We always put a little crystal heart and calling card in any caches we find that are big enough for them -Not forgetting the GPS !!!which I leave in the car usually downloaded with the latest PQ just in case I come into some quality time when I'm out in the car ! Once the habit has set in, its easy just grab the bag and go :P

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When we were newbies we visited a few and expected pens to be in the caches. Now we would never be without a pen! I think it's probably quite forgiveable if a newbie doesn't sign the log as long as they admit it. Maybe just send them a nudge that they need to always carry a pen, as some owners may not be so forgiving and perhaps ask them to describe the cache location in detail just to prove they found? I signed a few caches with a stick and mud, but I did admit it! :P

 

Even if you are not a newbie and know you should have a pen, it can be possible to find yourself without one. The one and only time I found I didn't have a pen, I am sure I put one in my pocket when I set out. It could have fallen out.

 

Hell over 800 finds later I still regularly find cache in hand and no pen... So easily doen or maybe its just me ;)

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Can I ask, how many cache owners sit down with the log book from the cache and cross reference it with the online logs?

 

Tried that once with one of my early geocaches in Bristol. It didn't go well, since it appears that most geocaches have been through the same writing course as all Doctors so it is pointless trying ot decipher the scrawl.

 

In the end my view is, if people want to claim finds they've not found, then that's fine. The only person they are cheating is themselves.

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Even if you are not a newbie and know you should have a pen, it can be possible to find yourself without one. The one and only time I found I didn't have a pen, I am sure I put one in my pocket when I set out. It could have fallen out.
When I did "The Beast 666", which entails abseiling down a cliff to a cache halfway down, I started off with a pen. But when I got to the cache it wasn't in my pocket any more; it must have taken the quick way down :blink: . Luckily there WAS a pencil in the cache :P:D:D .

 

Rgds, Andy

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I had one of my caches logged the other day from a newbie. Stated they had found it, but didn't have a pen but no matter. One polite email to them later, explaining the etiquette. A few hours later a polite email back describing the cache, container and colour of logbook. No problems, most times it is genuine.

Then of course you do get the people fooling themselves but no one else who log caches retrospectively, when they "did it" as part of another caching team. Now those logs I delete as a matter of course, especially when the retrospective logs amounted to more than 1000 in a day!!!!

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Then of course you do get the people fooling themselves but no one else who log caches retrospectively, when they "did it" as part of another caching team. Now those logs I delete as a matter of course, especially when the retrospective logs amounted to more than 1000 in a day!!!!

It's not unknown for a caching team to split up (e.g. husband and wife divorce). Then, one of them wants to continue caching but under a new ID (as the other hangs on to the original name). As part of the process (should they be interested in numbers) they retrospectively log all their 'found' caches. I can easily imagine that some would log 1000 in a day quite legitimately - although it sounds like a tedious operation.

 

As it's only a game "for fun", there's never been a requirement for people to only log caches that they found as an individual. Even though you could be a member of a team of 4 and have actually found no caches yourself, (relying on the others to hand you the box as you saunter up to the location) you count them as finds. So it seems valid for a person to split from a team then re-log all the finds.

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Then of course you do get the people fooling themselves but no one else who log caches retrospectively, when they "did it" as part of another caching team. Now those logs I delete as a matter of course, especially when the retrospective logs amounted to more than 1000 in a day!!!!

It's not unknown for a caching team to split up (e.g. husband and wife divorce). Then, one of them wants to continue caching but under a new ID (as the other hangs on to the original name). As part of the process (should they be interested in numbers) they retrospectively log all their 'found' caches. I can easily imagine that some would log 1000 in a day quite legitimately - although it sounds like a tedious operation.

 

As it's only a game "for fun", there's never been a requirement for people to only log caches that they found as an individual. Even though you could be a member of a team of 4 and have actually found no caches yourself, (relying on the others to hand you the box as you saunter up to the location) you count them as finds. So it seems valid for a person to split from a team then re-log all the finds.

 

I agree and I do let logs like that stand, however this was a cacher who is also still using their original name, known to a lot of cachers in this area for causing problems.

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I had one of my caches logged the other day from a newbie. Stated they had found it, but didn't have a pen but no matter. One polite email to them later, explaining the etiquette. A few hours later a polite email back describing the cache, container and colour of logbook. No problems, most times it is genuine.

Then of course you do get the people fooling themselves but no one else who log caches retrospectively, when they "did it" as part of another caching team. Now those logs I delete as a matter of course, especially when the retrospective logs amounted to more than 1000 in a day!!!!

 

One cache I found in the US went much like that - it was a fiendish hide so the owner asked me to describe the cache so they could confirm I had actually found it and wasn't just pretending. When I sent them the email describing the area and the cache in detail (the kind of detail you just couldn't get from Google Street View) they posted a note on the cache page confirming that they accepted my find based on my description.

 

Not only did it make clear to anyone else reading that I really had found it, it also made clear that they would check on anyone who did claim a find without signing the log book. The reason I hadn't signed the log book was because it was a stop-off on the way to the airport and anything not critical to the journey was in a suitcase somewhere.

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One cache I found in the US went much like that - it was a fiendish hide so the owner asked me to describe the cache so they could confirm I had actually found it and wasn't just pretending. When I sent them the email describing the area and the cache in detail (the kind of detail you just couldn't get from Google Street View) they posted a note on the cache page confirming that they accepted my find based on my description.

 

Not only did it make clear to anyone else reading that I really had found it, it also made clear that they would check on anyone who did claim a find without signing the log book. The reason I hadn't signed the log book was because it was a stop-off on the way to the airport and anything not critical to the journey was in a suitcase somewhere.

 

Good idea, I have now added similar to the cache page. Thanks for that.

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Yes, this can be a bit of a can of worms, see This thread on the Geocaching Topics forum. Geohatter summed it up well.

....

As a complete newbie I am glad that I paid for my premium membership before looking at the forums. Threads like that one make me think that this is not the hobby for me. Yes I have seen dozens of friendly threads, but those rabid threads realy kill off the family friendly feel.

 

When I signed up for my account I found that most variations of my usual internet handle where taken, and chose Fenrir101, When I signed my first few cache log's I actualy used my normal handle out of habit, and frankly the thought that the cache owners could decide to disallow my finds because of that is not a happy one.

 

I know that once any forum will start picking up more extreme members as they grow, but the fact that within 7 hours of that thread starting someone honestly equated not signing the log with commiting murder and appears to be fully serious is just scary. And its not just that thread, I have been doing a lot of searching to find answers to some fairly common new guy questions and every single one that I have found has degenerated into similar levels of commentary.

 

Most of you folks seem fairly nice, but the weirdo's sure are loud around here :D

 

As a newbie myself, I have been browsing the forums looking for tips and whatnot and have found some interesting posts myself where people acting downright ugly. I am from Ohio and I guess I am used to a mostly friendly response from people, but come on, some people can seriously lighten up! :) It's a game, have fun! :D

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Can I ask, how many cache owners sit down with the log book from the cache and cross reference it with the online logs?

 

I must be honest and say I never have. If someone wishs to claim a find without logging then they are only cheating themselves.

 

Not having a pen, ok not a major problem. Seeing the cache 20ft up a tree and not been prepared to climb it, then that is a DNF in my book.

 

I'll put my hand up and say I have here. Very sad and wouldn't normally but I had one cache that I got the impression was being used as an armchair cache. A quick review and a word of warning appears to have stopped that.

 

The same cache does get annotated as being found when they couldn't retrieve it (it's wedged in well but can be retrieved) or is densly populated by muggles. I disagree with both of these reasons for not signing. But while I disagree or condone I also don't let it bother me as that's how they want to play. I would of course prefer somebody to make their mark on the log in anyway they can; signature, stamp, sticker, mud, cutting and even blood. Ok maybe not blood on health and safety grounds but you get the gist.

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Can I ask, how many cache owners sit down with the log book from the cache and cross reference it with the online logs?.....

 

I'll put my hand up and say I have here. Very sad and wouldn't normally but I had one cache that I got the impression was being used as an armchair cache. A quick review and a word of warning appears to have stopped that.

.....

Um, me too, actually. It's just something I do having retrieved a log when I've replaced a log on a maintenance visit. I like the idea that if just some of us do it, then the armchair loggers can never be quite certain that it won't be checked. :yikes:

 

And it's not always about querying a suspicious log. What about when someone signs the paper log and forgets to log it on-line? That very scenario occurred with my last log check.

 

Having deciphered the signature by looking for other instances of them finding other local caches on the same day, I sent a polite message through the system asking them if they wanted to log it retrospectively with the right date n all so they didn't dip out. I got a very nice message back from his mum (also a geocacher in her own right) explaining that day's situation and how they had missed logging it on line and thanking me for my trouble. It can have positive benefits too :)

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Can I ask, how many cache owners sit down with the log book from the cache and cross reference it with the online logs?

 

I must be honest and say I never have. If someone wishs to claim a find without logging then they are only cheating themselves.

 

 

A CO would have to be pretty anal to sift through all finds on their cache and check for bogus logs, but sometimes an obvious fake log occurs. One of my caches was logged Found by a cacher from Maryland (I'm in Louisiana) who had signed up for an account the day before and logged finds in several states and countries the same day. Obviously that's going to throw up a red flag. I deleted that log (and even then I did go out and check the physical log to be ABSOLUTELY sure). However, that's an extreme case.

 

I usually check out the profiles of people who find my caches, just out of curiosity, to see where they're from, what other local caches they've found, stuff like that. The fact that this guy was from Maryland logging a cache in a very rural spot in Louisiana is what caught my attention. If a local cacher faked a find on one of my caches I probably wouldn't have noticed.

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