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A polite reminder to people to think before you post


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To those who dismiss out of hand the idea that these forums can be hostile the question must be asked, then why does this subject come up with such regularity?

 

I think because a lot of people mistake disagreement for flaming, mistake debate for strife, mistake bluntness for discourtesy and mistake brevity for rudeness.

 

Are all things peace and love here? Of course not. There are certain hot button topics that are bound to ignite spirited debate. When that happens a small portion of the participants can't resist making things personal and ratcheting up the acrimony. But in general people get along well here and newbies are nearly always welcomed as long as the don't enter the forums with both guns blazing.

Edited by briansnat
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Though I'm prone to get my dander up, once in a while, I usually avoid the negative threads.

 

I've started a number of threads on positive notes, encouraging posters to contribute their positives.

 

It's the bestest way I can think to stave off the Blue Meanies.

 

blue_meanie1.jpg

 

I'm more of a balance guy. I stand behind my posting record as being more positive than negative, but if I have to say something hard, I'll say it. Some times ya gotta keep it real. :)

 

I was once paid a great compliment @ GW3 as I stood in a large circle of mostly mods/reviewers (although I didn't know that at the time) when a cacher of high esteem told me that I was the one frequent poster that he hadn't wanted to strangle....yet. I took that to mean that my balance was working for me and it has always been in the back of my mind since when I post. B):)

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Though I'm prone to get my dander up, once in a while, I usually avoid the negative threads.

 

I've started a number of threads on positive notes, encouraging posters to contribute their positives.

 

It's the bestest way I can think to stave off the Blue Meanies.

 

blue_meanie1.jpg

 

I'm more of a balance guy. I stand behind my posting record as being more positive than negative, but if I have to say something hard, I'll say it. Some times ya gotta keep it real. :)

 

I was once paid a great compliment @ GW3 as I stood in a large circle of mostly mods/reviewers (although I didn't know that at the time) when a cacher of high esteem told me that I was the one frequent poster that he hadn't wanted to strangle....yet. I took that to mean that my balance was working for me and it has always been in the back of my mind since when I post. B):)

 

You're the absolute best, no doubt about that. :wub:

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Everyone who posts on here was a newbie once. I was a newbie not very long ago. I have NEVER been flamed in this forum.

I agree with this sentiment. The only time I see newcomers to the forum getting flamed in the forums is when they come with an attitude, deliberate or otherwise.

 

I've actually been flamed once, by someone who called me a newbie and don't know what I'm talking about. Ironically, this is after more than a year of posting here, and after he flamed someone else for his remark. Such posts are few and far in between, however. He apologized for it publicly in that thread after that. No, he's not the pirate guy. No need to identify the poster, that was ancient history.

 

This whole incident is pretty depressing to me. I don't think I'm the main cause of distress to the gardener lady. Though I have my doubts about her identity, I explained to her, early in the thread, why there might be some doubts as to her identity. Anyway, I don't really care at this point. I never attacked her, I tried to help, and if that is not good enough, there's nothing more I can do.

 

What disturbs me more is the reaction of a lot of the other posters, who are quick to jump up and figuratively stick another knife into a certain embarrassed individual. Yes, he should be embarrassed and apologetic. But this mob mentality and lynching behavior leaves an extremely bad taste in my mouth. It's happened before. No doubt it will happen again. And sure, it probably happens a lot less here than in other sites. I still don't like it.

 

I'm not suggesting anyone change their behavior. I know that is beyond me. What I can do is to spend less time here in the forums. I've been thinking about this for a couple of weeks now. I concluded that I spend way too much time here.

 

Initially, it was a great learning experience. I learned many new things about this fun hobby. Later on, I tried to give some of it back, by answering questions. I also enjoyed the fun bantering with many of the forum regulars here. I spend way more time here than I do geocaching. I think that by itself is fine - what's wrong with having fun chatting with others? But I think I spend more than a reasonable amount of time here, and it is time to cut back, way back.

 

I'm not most definitely not commiting geocide (I can't be bothered to fill out the form). I'm not even commiting foricide. I'm sure I'll be back once in a while. If nothing else, once a month to read OpinioNate's bug fixes / new features post.

 

Why do I bother posting this? Partly to point out the mob lynching behavior, and partly to make this more formal, so that if I can't help myself and come back and post, you can ridicule me. No, I'm egotistical enough to think that I'll be missed or that it will be a loss. Anything that I can contribute, a number of other people can. And they will. Maybe a few questions a month will have to wait 3 more minutes for an answer. No one will notice and in a week, no one will remember.

 

I'm happy with the fact that I have over 4000 posts and no warning emails or timeouts from any of the mods here. I hope that I have helped some with their questions regarding geocaching, particularly regarding technical stuff. I made a number of friends here. Some of these friends may feel bad for me leaving. Don't be. Think of this forum as my addiction, and that I'm trying to kick the habit.

 

It's going to be tough not coming back to check on this thread. But I think that is the most important part for me.

 

I wish all of you well. Even the embarrassed pirate guy. Take care.

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"I think because a lot of people mistake disagreement for flaming, mistake debate for strife, mistake bluntness for discourtesy and mistake brevity for rudeness."

 

Is it always a mistake? Sometimes yes and maybe sometimes no. There may also those who like to take pot shots & snipe at others and hide behind "debate", "bluntness" & "brevity".

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"I think because a lot of people mistake disagreement for flaming, mistake debate for strife, mistake bluntness for discourtesy and mistake brevity for rudeness."

 

Is it always a mistake? Sometimes yes and maybe sometimes no. There may also those who like to take pot shots & snipe at others and hide behind "debate", "bluntness" & "brevity".

 

Some of us don't really care which "side" of the discussion/arguement we are on.

Many of us are just as likely to switch sides mid-stream, if there are too many others piling on.

Feel free to bring up any controversial topic you want. :)

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"newbies are nearly always welcomed as long as the don't enter the forums with both guns blazing"

 

Curious as to what you meant by this.

 

What I meant are those who come here and their first posts have a combative, accusatory, or scolding tone. They are here with the intent of stirring the pot from the get go. These types often do not get the warmest of welcomes.

 

"I think because a lot of people mistake disagreement for flaming, mistake debate for strife, mistake bluntness for discourtesy and mistake brevity for rudeness."

 

Is it always a mistake? Sometimes yes and maybe sometimes no. There may also those who like to take pot shots & snipe at others and hide behind "debate", "bluntness" & "brevity".

 

I don't disagree with that, but I think far more often than not people mean well and their posts are misunderstood. For instance the whole idea of Markwelling. I used to do it a lot. Not so much anymore only because the forum search stinks these days. I had no idea that someone would see what I thought to be a helpful act as something rude or condescending.

Edited by briansnat
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"I think because a lot of people mistake disagreement for flaming, mistake debate for strife, mistake bluntness for discourtesy and mistake brevity for rudeness."

 

Is it always a mistake? Sometimes yes and maybe sometimes no. There may also those who like to take pot shots & snipe at others and hide behind "debate", "bluntness" & "brevity".

 

Some of us don't really care which "side" of the discussion/arguement we are on.

Many of us are just as likely to switch sides mid-stream, if there are too many others piling on.

Feel free to bring up any controversial topic you want. :)

 

Yeah that happens too.

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I never attacked her

I'm sorry, but I have to say this. No one attacked her. I made it clear that I did not believe her because her post sounded a lot like a troll we've had in the forums. I asked repeatedly for the GC code, even though she had already gone above and beyond what anyone in her position would reasonably do. But that was not an attack. I've reread that thread a LOT after reading this one. I still don't see where anyone was nasty to her.

 

No, I was not welcoming to her at all. I added nothing positive to that thread. I jumped to conclusions based on my obsession with ashnikes. I upset her and apparently, along with others who did not believe her, brought her to tears. For that I am truly sorry. Several of us could have been a LOT nicer than we were. But no one was outright mean to her. I have to say that had she not been elderly and disabled and generally not used to the dynamics of a forum in which people from all walks of life join in, that she would not have been as upset as she was.

 

Nonetheless, those were the circumstances. She was elderly. She was disabled. And she was sensitive. And my behavior was completely uncalled for.

 

I said I would do everything in my power to smooth things over and I have. She has forgiven me and I thank her for that. I only wish everyone was as kind and forgiving to others.

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There was the incident of the LEO posting on here about a found geocache which was in an area causing concern. The dog-pile on that thread was a bit depressing. I'm surprised the poster stuck through it. Quite well done that some cachers came forward to take care of the wayward cache and try to make amends.

 

Sometimes it really is necessary to treat visitors with an open mind, no matter we have some suspicions.

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I never attacked her

I'm sorry, but I have to say this. No one attacked her. I made it clear that I did not believe her because her post sounded a lot like a troll we've had in the forums. I asked repeatedly for the GC code, even though she had already gone above and beyond what anyone in her position would reasonably do. But that was not an attack. I've reread that thread a LOT after reading this one. I still don't see where anyone was nasty to her.

 

No, I was not welcoming to her at all. I added nothing positive to that thread. I jumped to conclusions based on my obsession with ashnikes. I upset her and apparently, along with others who did not believe her, brought her to tears. For that I am truly sorry. Several of us could have been a LOT nicer than we were. But no one was outright mean to her. I have to say that had she not been elderly and disabled and generally not used to the dynamics of a forum in which people from all walks of life join in, that she would not have been as upset as she was.

 

Nonetheless, those were the circumstances. She was elderly. She was disabled. And she was sensitive. And my behavior was completely uncalled for.

 

I said I would do everything in my power to smooth things over and I have. She has forgiven me and I thank her for that. I only wish everyone was as kind and forgiving to others.

 

You weren't alone in what happened there, nor were you an instigator of what was going on there. You are the only one to have stood up and said you were wrong not once but multiple times which was a very honorable thing to do. If everyone on this forum took the time to look at their own behavior it would be a much nicer place to be I think.

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Why do I bother posting this? Partly to point out the mob lynching behavior, and partly to make this more formal, so that if I can't help myself and come back and post, you can ridicule me. No, I'm egotistical enough to think that I'll be missed or that it will be a loss. Anything that I can contribute, a number of other people can. And they will. Maybe a few questions a month will have to wait 3 more minutes for an answer. No one will notice and in a week, no one will remember.

 

I'm happy with the fact that I have over 4000 posts and no warning emails or timeouts from any of the mods here. I hope that I have helped some with their questions regarding geocaching, particularly regarding technical stuff. I made a number of friends here. Some of these friends may feel bad for me leaving. Don't be. Think of this forum as my addiction, and that I'm trying to kick the habit.

 

It's going to be tough not coming back to check on this thread. But I think that is the most important part for me.

 

I wish all of you well. Even the embarrassed pirate guy. Take care.

 

*sigh* You'll be missed, too. The fun factor of the forums is falling very quickly. :ph34r:

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Why do I bother posting this? Partly to point out the mob lynching behavior, and partly to make this more formal, so that if I can't help myself and come back and post, you can ridicule me. No, I'm egotistical enough to think that I'll be missed or that it will be a loss. Anything that I can contribute, a number of other people can. And they will. Maybe a few questions a month will have to wait 3 more minutes for an answer. No one will notice and in a week, no one will remember.

 

I'm happy with the fact that I have over 4000 posts and no warning emails or timeouts from any of the mods here. I hope that I have helped some with their questions regarding geocaching, particularly regarding technical stuff. I made a number of friends here. Some of these friends may feel bad for me leaving. Don't be. Think of this forum as my addiction, and that I'm trying to kick the habit.

 

It's going to be tough not coming back to check on this thread. But I think that is the most important part for me.

 

I wish all of you well. Even the embarrassed pirate guy. Take care.

 

*sigh* You'll be missed, too. The fun factor of the forums is falling very quickly. :ph34r:

+1 million!
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Briansnat, I have to comment on your post above. Ever since I started reading the forums, your posts have stood out to me as being smart and helpful, with a touch of humor. I’ve always thought of you as being the cacher LEAST likely to offend anyone. Though I do remember an OP getting upset a while ago because of a joking response you posted to their thread. It really stuck in my brain because I thought it the perfect illustration of somebody getting offended when clearly no offense was intended.

BrianSnat, you is da man. thumbs.gif

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Why do I bother posting this? Partly to point out the mob lynching behavior, and partly to make this more formal, so that if I can't help myself and come back and post, you can ridicule me. No, I'm egotistical enough to think that I'll be missed or that it will be a loss. Anything that I can contribute, a number of other people can. And they will. Maybe a few questions a month will have to wait 3 more minutes for an answer. No one will notice and in a week, no one will remember.

 

I'm happy with the fact that I have over 4000 posts and no warning emails or timeouts from any of the mods here. I hope that I have helped some with their questions regarding geocaching, particularly regarding technical stuff. I made a number of friends here. Some of these friends may feel bad for me leaving. Don't be. Think of this forum as my addiction, and that I'm trying to kick the habit.

 

It's going to be tough not coming back to check on this thread. But I think that is the most important part for me.

 

I wish all of you well. Even the embarrassed pirate guy. Take care.

 

*sigh* You'll be missed, too. The fun factor of the forums is falling very quickly. :ph34r:

 

Also +1,000,000 I really enjoy your contributions for sure Chrysalides!

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What disturbs me more is the reaction of a lot of the other posters, who are quick to jump up and figuratively stick another knife into a certain embarrassed individual. Yes, he should be embarrassed and apologetic. But this mob mentality and lynching behavior leaves an extremely bad taste in my mouth. It's happened before. No doubt it will happen again. And sure, it probably happens a lot less here than in other sites. I still don't like it.

 

News flash for all the people piling on "non-newbies". We're people, too. We make mistakes. Most of us, like the person referenced above, admit to them and take the consequences. I'm getting a very definite "oh, those forum veterans are so nasty and evil, have at them!" vibe here.

 

News flash. They - we - aren't. If I count as a veteran, I've not been here near as long as many of them. Yeah, I post off topic a lot in threads, to try to lighten them up, and yes, I can get really sarcastic at times. Guess what... there's that whole "not perfect" again.

 

I'm guessing this won't stop people from continuing to pile on, but I hate to see people getting driven away from the forums like they are being now. Are the people doing it any better than what was done in that one thread? Ask yourselves if you are vindicated because it's "veteran forum posters" leaving? Would you have the courtesy to admit your mistake and make several very public apologies, or do you really prefer sticking knives in the back of people you DON'T EVEN KNOW?

 

I'm done now. This whole thing makes me sick. I may get my first warning, but I don't care. Just shut up and lay off the "non-newbie" posters already!!!

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I don't see a problem with the occasional, off topic witty comment. Geocaching is fun, there is no reason the forums have to be a staid place. It can get out of hand (I find the Monty Python wannabes sprinkling "Ni" in nearly every thread annoying), but I don't see anything wrong with a little levity.

 

 

So glad to see this.

 

The reason I've come to the forums in the past was for the humor.

 

some threads have had me laughing so loud it woke the neighbors.

 

Some threads with tension have only been broken up due to the humor.

 

We definitely need more humor in the world!!!

 

I haven't been around in a while, but not surprised to see the usual discussions about being polite and all that. I guess some things don't change.

 

Good to see your posts Briansnat!!! You've always had really great things to say!!!!!

Last I was on the forums you weren't posting much. So good to hear from you! Lots of wisdom!!

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I don't disagree with that, but I think far more often than not people mean well and their posts are misunderstood. For instance the whole idea of Markwelling. I used to do it a lot. Not so much anymore only because the forum search stinks these days. I had no idea that someone would see what I thought to be a helpful act as something rude or condescending.

 

I think it can depend on the question being asked. If it's a question with a definitive answer (I can't figure out Pocket Queries, help!), then just posting a link is obviously helpful. But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away." Prefacing those links with "Hey, these have a lot of good info, you might want to check them out!" can go a long way to making your intentions clear. Of course, some people are just sensitive, and will focus solely on the negative, no matter what positives are also said.

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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

Edited by knowschad
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What disturbs me more is the reaction of a lot of the other posters, who are quick to jump up and figuratively stick another knife into a certain embarrassed individual. Yes, he should be embarrassed and apologetic. But this mob mentality and lynching behavior leaves an extremely bad taste in my mouth. It's happened before. No doubt it will happen again. And sure, it probably happens a lot less here than in other sites. I still don't like it.

 

News flash for all the people piling on "non-newbies". We're people, too. We make mistakes. Most of us, like the person referenced above, admit to them and take the consequences. I'm getting a very definite "oh, those forum veterans are so nasty and evil, have at them!" vibe here.

 

News flash. They - we - aren't. If I count as a veteran, I've not been here near as long as many of them. Yeah, I post off topic a lot in threads, to try to lighten them up, and yes, I can get really sarcastic at times. Guess what... there's that whole "not perfect" again.

 

I'm guessing this won't stop people from continuing to pile on, but I hate to see people getting driven away from the forums like they are being now. Are the people doing it any better than what was done in that one thread? Ask yourselves if you are vindicated because it's "veteran forum posters" leaving? Would you have the courtesy to admit your mistake and make several very public apologies, or do you really prefer sticking knives in the back of people you DON'T EVEN KNOW?

 

I'm done now. This whole thing makes me sick. I may get my first warning, but I don't care. Just shut up and lay off the "non-newbie" posters already!!!

 

I've been following this thread all day (slow Facebook day), and I really am not seeing this mass-piling-on that you are seeing. I see a few criticisms, some more legitamate than others. I see people interpretting things different ways, and trying to explain why they are interpretting them the way they are. For the most part, posters have stayed away from mentioning specifically "the other thread", even though that's obviously why the topic was started. As far as veteran posters leaving--if they feel the need to step away, then so be it, but I don't think that they are being "driven" away. Of course there will be a few people that will take every opportunity to wag their fingers, but I'm mostly seeing a fair amount of forgiveness. But maybe that's just the way I interpret things! :ph34r: There's nothing wrong with a few newbies speaking up about how they see and interpret things. Maybe some veterans will think twice about what they say and how they say it. There's nothing wrong with veterans speaking up about why they say and do what they do. Maybe a few newbies will learn from their explanations.

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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

 

Good gravy, and you are still here?!?! :ph34r: Glenn's response is a good example of a response that is both helpful to the newbie, and yet entertaining to the veterans. If you were the sensative type, you probably would have still been offended, but at least educated in the process.

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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

 

I was young and impulsive.

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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

 

I was young and impulsive.

As opposed to old and impulsive? :ph34r:
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I don't disagree with that, but I think far more often than not people mean well and their posts are misunderstood.

 

Oh yeah, that is going to happen when you can only communicate with words and icons. I suppose my best suggestion would be if someone was one of the chronically misunderstood posters he or she may want to give some thought as to their phrasing or how they answer questions.

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Probably the best thing for can do when you want to post anything remotely controversial is to just write it out and save it on your computer. Come back to it the next day and look at it from the receiver's point of view. Edit it, as needed, and post it to the forum. I may even try doing that way myself some day.

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Probably the best thing for can do when you want to post anything remotely controversial is to just write it out and save it on your computer. Come back to it the next day and look at it from the receiver's point of view. Edit it, as needed, and post it to the forum. I may even try doing that way myself some day.
Very useful advice, particularly when posting to the Off-Topic forum, huh? :ph34r:
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Probably the best thing for can do when you want to post anything remotely controversial is to just write it out and save it on your computer. Come back to it the next day and look at it from the receiver's point of view. Edit it, as needed, and post it to the forum. I may even try doing that way myself some day.
Very useful advice, particularly when posting to the Off-Topic forum, huh? :D

I'm sorry, when I got to the forum, I took a left turn instead of a right so an inappropriate thread ended up in the Geocaching Topics section instead of the Off Topic section. :ph34r: Thank you Keystone for correcting my error.

Edited by Colonial Cats
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I don't see a problem with the occasional, off topic witty comment. Geocaching is fun, there is no reason the forums have to be a staid place. It can get out of hand (I find the Monty Python wannabes sprinkling "Ni" in nearly every thread annoying), but I don't see anything wrong with a little levity.

 

 

Last I was on the forums you weren't posting much.

Huh?

 

(please note that this apparently flip comment was an attempt at humor. I have over 30,000 posts and the idea that there was a time where I wasn't posting much on the forums is sort of funny. My simple "Huh" seemingly poked fum at the statement, but chief purpose was to poke fun at myself for my prolific posting.

 

Of course there will be some of you who will see this explanation as snide and condescending even though it is an attempt at humor. That's OK too)

Edited by briansnat
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Thanks for all the replies guys. I have enjoyed reading each and every response and there are far too many good ones for me to quote specifically.

 

I need to rephrase a couple things to clear some things up and also make some new statements which I have changed my mind about after reading these posts.

 

1) When I was talking about linking 9 other threads as "condescending", I should have been more specific. I think that linking those threads is SUPER helpful to whoever made the thread (and also to the mods), because it links someone to potential useful information. In one of my threads I was talking about gps math and someone linked me to http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=255237 I now have that thread bookmarked.

 

The issue I have is actually very specific... If someone ever uses the phrase "should have used the search option" or the like. All forums are NOTORIOUSLY bad about the search feature being a useful tool for finding such other threads. I saw one comment recently, where someone linked the "obvious" duplicate thread where the title of said thread had no discernible words which I would have thought to search for if I was looking for information on that topic. It has gotten so bad that I almost never search for threads before I make them unless the topic is very obvious to search for. So basically the issue I have is if someone links the list of duplicate threads and THEN basically implies that you are a failure for not typing in the perfect combination or words or synonyms to have discovered the same type of thread.

 

So continue linking the other threads, just don't be a <potty language removed> about it.

 

2) I retract my opinion about off-topic posts. I had forgotten how important these types of posts become to the enjoyment of forum regulars who have been on a forum for 2 plus years. Basically at my favorite forum to post in (I have 5000+ posts there and regrettably don't post there anymore due to all the time I was wasting there), this was prevalent, enjoyable, and necessary to keep old-timers coming back and enjoying their forum friendships they had made in their time on the forum.

 

3) GeoBain I hope my post didn't come off as a personal attack on you. You are a tall man for admitting the line you crossed and I commend you for apologizing over and over again since the event.

 

4) Chrysalides, I completely understand how much a forum can suck in your time. I wish the best of luck to you in fighting your addiction, but I'll see you when you come back. :ph34r:

 

5) I absolutely detest the phrase "thicker skin". Every time I ever hear anyone talk about potentially uncalled-for behavior, this phrase comes out. One cannot justify <potty language removed> actions by saying that the other person should have thicker skin. I don't know why people seem to think that is acceptable. People get offended, but hiding behind the internet and saying they are too easily offended is ignorant.

 

6) Seriously guys, thanks for all the really insightful posts. The nature of bad behavior is that it cancels out numerous good things that happen. This is just how human brain works. It is a lot easier to generalize about the bad things that happen and perceive them to be more prevalent than they really are. I think this is why newcomers are so quick to feel the hostility.

Edited by Motorcycle_Mama
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I'll start with ashnikes. You guys are ridiculous to focus so much attention on this guy. It has literally blinded you. It got to the point where some of you thought it fit to accuse someone who IMO was obviously NOT ashnikes to be a forum troll. Not only that... none of you have met the guy, yet you have such strong animosity towards him! The only thing I know about the guy is that he has ideas. I have seen him make a lot of constructive observations about the game and things that can be done by us to make it a higher quality overall. In addition, I have done a multi-cache that he created. It was well thought out and a lot of fun, and left me wondering why you all have such hatred towards him?

 

I agree. He really did not do anything too bad. He started a bunch of threads, so what? A few of the threads seemed like he was trying to intentionally stir up trouble, but you could not really tell for certain until he admitted it later. He then started a few threads which were mild, but people still jumped all over him anyway.

 

It's a bit lame to blame others for making everyone upset. Flying into a rage at a mild post is just as bad. When someone goes into hysterics over absolutely nothing, it's trolling also.

 

don't be a <potty language removed> about it.

<potty language removed> actions

 

I could be annoyed at the non family friendly terms used, but I'm not. :ph34r:

You have to remember

"Is this post inappropriate for a child to be reading"

:D Edited by Motorcycle_Mama
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<snip>

5) I absolutely detest the phrase "thicker skin". Every time I ever hear anyone talk about potentially uncalled-for behavior, this phrase comes out. One cannot justify <potty language removed> actions by saying that the other person should have thicker skin. I don't know why people seem to think that is acceptable. People get offended, but hiding behind the internet and saying they are too easily offended is ignorant.

 

 

All good points, particularly thicker skin, though I find it a little ironic.

 

If I may offer a different perspecitve - and I entirely expect to get flamed for this...

 

From experience I find it's the forum regulars who need the "thicker skin" - particularly the ones who are first to mention the phrase. They're the ones who have grown accustomed to a particular forum culture and get all their knickers in a twist when some newbie comes in and perhaps has a new idea or new challenges.

 

They act quickly to put the newbie straight and a newbie is left with incentive to either conform or GTFO.

 

It shows a very closed mind, lack of generosity and lack of intelectualism that a newbie may suggest something and is shot down, but a forum regular may suggest it a bit later in another thread and it's accepted or encouraged.

 

Sure newbies may need to work on their delivery or do a bit more research, but ultimately they are people with different life experiences, they may also be a little guarded with their first posts and as such will be more defensive - leading them to react worse than they would were they more integrated.

 

Most importantly some newbies are older, wiser, more experienced and maybe even more important than even YOU (plural) are in RL! We could be entertaining angels and we should always have that in the back of our minds.

 

Shame, there are some wise people and advice on this forum, I think they get drowned out by all the egos.

 

Snoogans is one regular I know I can say I've never found anything I didn't dislike in any of his posts - even the ones I disagree with silently.

 

What is sad is there are people here who's opinions I respected and admired but some of them have picked sides with a forum regular and flamed me - which has led me mark them down when I previously held them in higher esteem.

 

Then there's the passive aggressiveness which is just not necessary in this type of game.

 

Though perhaps I should be thankful for all this, it's got me to frequent the forums a lot less and geocache a lot more -- unfortunately for the moderate members here things will probably only get worse as more decent people stay away, leaving only the cliques and the flamers - and more innocent gardners are probably going to get hurt.

 

I say all this with no malicious intent, and not aimed at any one person in particular.

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I absolutely detest the phrase "thicker skin". Every time I ever hear anyone talk about potentially uncalled-for behavior, this phrase comes out. One cannot justify <potty language removed> actions by saying that the other person should have thicker skin. I don't know why people seem to think that is acceptable. People get offended, but hiding behind the internet and saying they are too easily offended is ignorant.

 

There are people who are far too easily offended, or who take offense where none was intended. I wish I could find the recent thread where a newbie asked a question, received half a dozen or so polite, thoughtful responses and he went on a rant about how he was treated rudely, simply because he didn't like the answers. That is someone who is too easily offended. Thin skinned people exist and some of them come to this forum.

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I remember a thread similar to that. There is a difference between needing a thicker skin and fishing for an answer that you aren't going to get. The thread I'm thinking of was someone fishing for an answer to validate what they were about to do. Then that person threw a tantrum when they didn't get the answer they wanted.

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Shame, there are some wise people and advice on this forum, I think they get drowned out by all the egos.

 

Snoogans is one regular I know I can say I've never found anything I didn't dislike in any of his posts - even the ones I disagree with silently.

 

I say all this with no malicious intent, and not aimed at any one person in particular.

 

I have ALWAYS had a huge ego. Geocaching just helps me polish it. :lol::lol::ph34r::D

 

I'm going to take your double negative as a positive by perceived intent even before I read your last line. :) My friggin' huge ego won't let me be abashed. :D:D:D:sad: Thanks. :)

 

BTW- I appreciate folks that disagree with me. Don't be silent.

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Shame, there are some wise people and advice on this forum, I think they get drowned out by all the egos.

 

Snoogans is one regular I know I can say I've never found anything I didn't dislike in any of his posts - even the ones I disagree with silently.

 

I say all this with no malicious intent, and not aimed at any one person in particular.

 

I have ALWAYS had a huge ego. Geocaching just helps me polish it. :lol::D:ph34r::D

 

I'm going to take your double negative as a positive by perceived intent even before I read your last line. :) My friggin' huge ego won't let me be abashed. :):D:D:sad: Thanks. :)

 

BTW- I appreciate folks that disagree with me. Don't be silent.

 

 

LOL I just realised what I did there, in fact the last 3 lines are all a mass contradiction!

 

FAIL

 

:lol:

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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

To be truthful, I didn't put much effort into crafting my response to your suggestion.

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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

To be truthful, I didn't put much effort into crafting my response to your suggestion.

 

You mean you guys tried to disenfranchise/scare off Dog w/Specks and it didn't work? Dang it dang it dang it!

 

Sorry Chad... I'm in an ornery mood this morning and just pokin' fun.

Edited by The Ravens
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But if the poster is perhaps trying to start a conversation, (Hey, I've got a great idea for a rating system! What do you all think?), just seeing 3 or 4 links to past threads can be interpretted as "shut up, we've already discussed that, go away."

One of my first (perhaps my very first) posting on here was a suggestion for a rating system, and man! did I get blasted for it!! (or, at least I felt that way at the time). I got links to previous discussions, I got "oh, geeze, here we go again", I got the works. Hmmmm... I should go back and find that thread and see if it was really as bad as I remember it, and who the participants were.

 

Edit: Here's the thread

To be truthful, I didn't put much effort into crafting my response to your suggestion.

ummm, no kidding. :ph34r:
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you know though...in defense of the geocaching folk the poster in question was a bit on the sensitive side

 

What I saw was someone who had an issue & created an account to post a question about it to an open forum. The first replies were very helpful and kind.

 

Then someone accused her of being he who shall not be named.

 

She took the attacks of this person as an attack on her.

 

that made no sense to me

 

I'm new **here** but not to the internet and certainly not to open forums. I know there is a pack mentality. If you want to see a really ugly and I do mean UGLY forum take a look at the general board of weight watchers - I know there is material in that statement but let it go.

 

These things can be a granfallon at times.

 

There was a creative writing site that I posted on for a long time that has been all but killed by a few trolls and people posting images that were not safe for work so the site has been blocked for a lot of regulars.

 

I'm rambling so off I go.

 

carry on

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There's a lot of great info on this site. It's just a hostile place towards new players. That's a shame, but oh well. i'd advise newbs to read the forums but not post if you don't want to get flamed.

 

I disagree completely. I have found this to be a very enjoyable forum, from day one. I'm not particularly thick-skinned, but I have never felt picked on or unwelcome. This isn't my first time on a forum, and it's one of the better ones I frequent.

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Like with most things, the issue isn't black and white. There are some newbies who come here and post with an attitude that rightfully spark some nasty replies but there are also some old-timers who are far too insensitive with people who come here genuinely looking for help.

 

The bottom line is that the forum regulars are - whether they like it or not - representing this hobby/game/sport and need to remember that in one fell swoop, they have the ability to turn newbies onto caching or turn them off to it completely.

 

I find the Golden Rule and The Silver Rule are always helpful in these situations. The nice thing is that they can apply to everyone - newbies and old-timers alike. :ph34r:

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I find the Golden Rule and The Silver Rule are always helpful in these situations. The nice thing is that they can apply to everyone - newbies and old-timers alike. :)

 

I saw this on Facebook just a bit ago and thought it could apply pretty well to any internet interactions:

"Attitudes are contagious, make sure yours are worth catching"

 

I must say though, I have seen some pretty darn hostile internet forums. I don't think the ones here are all that bad.

Edited by carleenp
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Like with most things, the issue isn't black and white. There are some newbies who come here and post with an attitude that rightfully spark some nasty replies but there are also some old-timers who are far too insensitive with people who come here genuinely looking for help.

 

I think people who are genuinely looking for help get treated pretty well, though sometimes they get conflicting opinions (that's okay). It's the people coming with suggestions to change or "improve" caching that get the worst of it.

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Like with most things, the issue isn't black and white. There are some newbies who come here and post with an attitude that rightfully spark some nasty replies but there are also some old-timers who are far too insensitive with people who come here genuinely looking for help.

 

I think people who are genuinely looking for help get treated pretty well, though sometimes they get conflicting opinions (that's okay). It's the people coming with suggestions to change or "improve" caching that get the worst of it.

 

I think for the most part you are right. But speaking from personal experience, it isn't always the case.

 

There tends to be some around here who seem to believe this forum is a psuedo-court room and treat those who pose questions as though they are on the stand ready for cross examination. I think that kind of attitude tends to put people off.

 

I know local cachers who wouldn't darken these forums for all the smiley faces on Earth and the reason they give me? They feel too intimidated to post after they read a few threads. And since this has been said to me by numerous people at various caching events, I have to believe there is a kernel of truth to it. People shoudn't need to feel they have to don kevlar jackets to enter the forums. And for some reason, many of them do. I think that is sad.

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I havent noticed any backlash for being a noob on this site. But then again I know how to handle myself on message boards. And so far this is probably the most sensitive board ive ever been on.

 

Thats not an insult, its just because of the wide variety of people who come here.

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