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Trackables Collections


Dr.MORO

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Domo!!!

 

As request by OpinioNate, I'm opening a new 'Can of Worms' here!

 

As of today 6/2/2010, GC.com has gone through some changes.

Release Notes 6/2/10

 

Among many of them, there is this.

Trackables Collection

Has the list of Trackables you are "holding" grown out of control? For those of you with a collection of geocoins or mileage-tracker bugs we have added a new virtual collection to your profile. More information can be found in the Trackables Collection knowledge book.

 

Please read all carefully, and let's debate!

 

Okay, here some from me to add to this fire.

 

"By Default", all TBs should be 'Status'-typed as 'NON-collectable', never 'Unknown'.

 

All for the better!

 

~ Dr.MORO

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Trackables Collection

 

Has the list of Trackables you are "holding" grown out of control? For those of you with a collection of geocoins or mileage-tracker bugs we have added a new virtual collection to your profile. More information can be found in the Trackables Collection knowledge book.

 

 

I have opened this topic to discuss the new Trackables collection. Please keep discussion on this feature confined to this thread and I'll be sure to follow along. Thanks!

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The new feature allows you to add any trackable in your inventory to your collection, whether you own it or not.

 

I just did this with a coin I don't own. The coin owner didn't have any opportunity to stop me or make a "not collectible" call on this. All coin owners who don't log in and edit their coins rather fast are liable to this. Surely the default should have been not collectible? especially given that coin and TB owners had no options?

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Yeah, I'm not understanding something. If I put a coin in my collection it is then "collectible" by someone else? How does that work and why? It looks like my collection will be staying in my super double-secret never-published cache.

 

FWIW - I agree. The status should default to non-collectible.

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I think the default should be "not collectible" and this should be an opt-in function for owners rather than an opt-out.

I agree!

 

Same here... make the default not collectible!

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My opinion falls on the side of most of those posting here, but I find some comfort in the fact that when you set a trackable to "not collectible", it forces the item out of the collection of anyone who has logged it as such and into their inventory.

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Trackables Collection

 

Has the list of Trackables you are "holding" grown out of control? For those of you with a collection of geocoins or mileage-tracker bugs we have added a new virtual collection to your profile. More information can be found in the Trackables Collection knowledge book.

 

 

I have opened this topic to discuss the new Trackables collection. Please keep discussion on this feature confined to this thread and I'll be sure to follow along. Thanks!

 

Wow!

The knowledge book text & chart has already changed!

 

BUT, still the 'Unknown' status is still there, and is 'Collectible' (These items can be collected by another player) by default!

Really?

 

WHY?!

 

ALL TBs before today, were 'known' to be "Non-Collectible".

You just could not 'collect' them, and everyone knows that as a fact.

Then today, why suddenly & automatically change their status to "Collectible", if 'unknown'?

Why not make the change simple AND easy for all TB AND owners out there, so they don't have to change every single TB Status BACK to 'Non-Collectible' one at a time?

As saying over and over, BY DEFAULT, ALL TBs, even though 'Unknown', SHOULD BE "NON-Collectable"!!!!!

New feature is a great idea, but still cannot understand the sudden status change.

 

Please explain, in detail, so that most all can understand why the 'default' status of all exciting TBs has been changed, and there has been a huge workload added to the user side, in order to 'revert' the status to what is was in the first place.

 

AND, which is it, Collectible or Collectable?!

 

Thanks,

 

~ Dr.MORO

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So after the fact of my putting their coin in collection, the owner can change its status to non-collectible, thus putting it back in my inventory. Okay.

 

I think that psychologically, this is backwards. I wanted to collect it, and the website let me. This makes the later move by the owner to put it back into inventory weak. Keeping coins is already a temptation for many.

 

I confess it never occurred to me that collectible status would apply to anything I didn't own.

 

______________________

 

Aside from that carping, I do really really like that I can now grab all my own coins, and "collect" them, so my inventory only shows those items that I need to move. Excellent, thank you.

Edited by palmetto
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I don't want anyone, anywhere, thinking that they can "collect" (i.e. permanently keep) any of my 100+ travel bugs and geocoins which are out travelling in the wild. Their existence is precarious enough as it is. :(

 

Please make the default "not collectible" ASAP.

 

Thanks.

 

MrsB

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I just poked around a tiny bit, here are some major concerns for me.

 

Why do I have the option to move other peoples trackables into my collection?

 

Why do I have to have an item in my inventory to make the move?

 

Why aren't item's classified as non collectible by default?

 

I'd like the ability to move my own items into my collection directly from the "Collection Cache" that they are listed in, rather than having to first move them into my inventory(by logging a grab).

 

As the owner of hundreds of trackables, I would like to see them all classified as noncollectible by default. I don't really want to have to deal with a lot of people moving my items into their collections. I just tested this on someone elses travel bug to see how it works. I was able to move it into my collection, and a note was posted on the bug page.

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Ok, I'm feeling incredibly stoopid, but WHERE is this Status that you can set to Collectible or Non-Collectible? I've looked all over my TB pages, read the threads here, read the Knowledge Book article, and can't find how to do this. (The KB article doesn't explain how to do it, only says you can do it.) I understand how to move TBs in and out of my Collection, but not how/where you change their status. Argh.

 

Oh - and I agree the default should be Non-Collectible. (And it is true that some geocoin owners, such as Moun10Bike, activate their coins but allow them to be collected by others.)

 

Edit: On the 4th pass through the Edit function, I finally saw the Is Collectible radio buttons. Doh! Still suggest clarifying the KB article by stating where this functionality is. Thanks, Blorenges, for posting to confirm.

Edited by hydnsek
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Ok, I'm feeling incredibly stoopid, but WHERE is this Status that you can set to Collectible or Non-Collectible? I've looked all over my TB pages, read the threads here, read the Knowledge Book article, and can't find how to do this. (The KB article doesn't explain how to do it, only says you can do it.) I understand how to move TBs in and out of my Collection, but not how/where you change their status. Argh.

 

Oh - and I agree the default should be Non-Collectible. (And it is true that some geocoin owners, such as Moun10Bike, activate their coins but allow them to be collected by others.)

 

You have to go to your trackable page and click "Edit this trackable item". It's just above the Mission box.

 

MrsB

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As a watcher of the trackable that I tested out, I did not even get notification of the move into/out of my collection. will the owner not get notification when a trackace is moved into the collection of another player?

 

I'm really afraid that this function had been screwed up BADLY. This makes it even easier for theives to steal coins. Do I have to sort through all the items I own to see who's collection they are in, will I even be able to see that on the status of the trackable, or do I have to view the trackables page to see? Please turn this off immediatly until it's written corrrectly.

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My opinion falls on the side of most of those posting here, but I find some comfort in the fact that when you set a trackable to "not collectible", it forces the item out of the collection of anyone who has logged it as such and into their inventory.

 

Hi Moun10Bike,

 

I understand the 'forcing' part.

But, the freedom must be on the TB owner's side, not the carrier/holder, I think.

 

The basic idea of this great new feature, I presume, is to ease(=shorten) the 'Inventory' list of 'self-owned' TB, and put them onto your 'collection' list. I still think this feature should be limited to self-owned TBs ONLY, not for those owned by others. That is, unless the TB owner 'opt-in" to have it 'collected'. I feel the 'Inventory' list serves as a 'necessary reminder' for the TB holder, not owner, to show they have certain TBs that are not theirs, to be 'moved along' whenever they can. Once taken 'off' the Inventory, and put onto the 'Collection' list, the possibility for the TB to be moved would become drastically minimized. Great for self-owned TBs, but not so good for other other-owned.

 

But, in all, 'collecting' others' TBs seem very misleading to the 'general' caching game rules.

 

Just my thought.

 

Thanks,

 

~ Dr.MORO

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Thanks for the feedback everyone.

 

After some discussion internally we agree that it is better to default the "Unknown" status to NOT collectible.

 

This will require a full release of the site, which will occur later this afternoon after a couple other unrelated fixes have been addressed. Toggling the default status for collectibles is itself a simple fix.

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Ok... I feel stupid now becasue I didn't understand!!!

 

If I do not do anything... the status will be as collectable or unknown... which allows an other geocacher to collect the coin from a cache and puts it in his collection???

 

Sorry... if that is the thing.... do you know how many coins will be lost for ever? Then we will be muggles!!! We will go and take other's coins from caches to enrich our collection!

 

I hope I understand wrong!!!

 

Anyway... at first I thought that this has only to do with the coins that we have activated only (coins that we are the owners) and just not to have them all the time in the list of trackables ..... the one when we retrieve a coin from a cache and then we go to drop it and log the drop.... well... we see a list witht he activated coins that we hold, including our coins... right?

 

so... if we only wanted to "clean" the list from the activated coins that we own and we will not let them travel, instead of puting them in a "fake" cache (sorry.. I do not know who these caches are called), to be able to place them as "in my collection" and will not show in the list! We can let others discover these coins we can take them in events but not let them travel! Of course if later we would like to make them travellers.... we can change their status!

 

Now to do that to other coins that are not ours... I do not get it....

 

I hope you will explain to me... if this is possible! :(

 

Oh... and how others will know if the coin is collectable or not? this will be shown in the coins page?? oh boy.... I am lost in traslation! :D

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Oh... sorry for posting again.....

 

something else....

 

If a coin's status is collectible, it means that if I find it in the cache I can keep it? Let's say yes..... ok?

 

If later the owner of the coin change its status.... how will I know that? I will look like a thief, a muggle...

If now the owner doesn't even know about this change.... I will aslo look like a thief! :(

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Thanks for the feedback everyone.

 

After some discussion internally we agree that it is better to default the "Unknown" status to NOT collectible.

 

This will require a full release of the site, which will occur later this afternoon after a couple other unrelated fixes have been addressed. Toggling the default status for collectibles is itself a simple fix.

It appears that the missing notifications is a larger issue. Neither the item's on my watchlist or owned by me are generating emails for any logs. I just logged a grab of an owned coin(under another account) and received no notification of the grab, or of the move into the collection of "Look Twice". Firstly we need to make sure that the logs are generating the proper email, and we also need to make sure that an item's owner is notified when it's moved into someone's collection.

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Just a couple things for future tweaks to the collection page.

 

I'd like to see...

1. The icons on the list next to the names.

2. Being able to see more than 10 at a time - or at least an option to.

 

Thanks for all the hard work Lackeys!

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I'm at loss to even understand WHY this came about.

 

As I understand it, and has been pretty clear since I started caching, Trackable items are privately owned items and "are NOT trade items". By this very definition, you should not be able to "collect" a coin or TB that you have not purchased.

 

All the "collections" that I've ever seen or heard about, are privately owned (purchased) and generally are not activated, except in the occasional situation that the owner wants to dip them in caches, such as with mascots.

 

Giveaways and FTF prizes are always done with non-activated items so the new owner can activate them in their own name.

 

My fear is that this whole thing could possibly be misunderstood, especially by new inexperienced cachers, and we may see an increase in TB and Coins being kept rather than moved on, with or without being added to a "collection" simply because of an implication by Groundspeak that this is acceptable.

 

I would advocate removing the entire idea and leaving it as it was. What is mine is mine and NO activated trackable can be kept/collected. At the very most, maybe there can be a system in place where I as the owner can transfer ownership of a trackable to someone else, at my own discretion.

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Thanks for the feedback everyone.

 

After some discussion internally we agree that it is better to default the "Unknown" status to NOT collectible.

 

This will require a full release of the site, which will occur later this afternoon after a couple other unrelated fixes have been addressed. Toggling the default status for collectibles is itself a simple fix.

 

Thanks a bunch for listening to us!

 

Look forward to the fix!

 

~ Dr.MORO

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I'm at loss to even understand WHY this came about.

 

As I understand it, and has been pretty clear since I started caching, Trackable items are privately owned items and "are NOT trade items". By this very definition, you should not be able to "collect" a coin or TB that you have not purchased.

 

All the "collections" that I've ever seen or heard about, are privately owned (purchased) and generally are not activated, except in the occasional situation that the owner wants to dip them in caches, such as with mascots.

 

Giveaways and FTF prizes are always done with non-activated items so the new owner can activate them in their own name.

 

My fear is that this whole thing could possibly be misunderstood, especially by new inexperienced cachers, and we may see an increase in TB and Coins being kept rather than moved on, with or without being added to a "collection" simply because of an implication by Groundspeak that this is acceptable.

 

I would advocate removing the entire idea and leaving it as it was. What is mine is mine and NO activated trackable can be kept/collected. At the very most, maybe there can be a system in place where I as the owner can transfer ownership of a trackable to someone else, at my own discretion.

 

I understand and partly agree with some of your concerns.

 

However, I and several folks I know DO activate their privately held collections. I do this to keep a list on gc.com and it lets me allow folks, oc occasion, to discover some or all of the coins in my collection.

 

I, too, am somewhat concerned about how 'collecting' a traveler will play out, especially in the hands of newbies that don't take time to learn the lingo and just make assumptions based on the readily visible terminology. I like the new feature, but I really don't know what, if anything, can be done about the potential misunderstandings.

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I understand and partly agree with some of your concerns.

 

However, I and several folks I know DO activate their privately held collections. I do this to keep a list on gc.com and it lets me allow folks, oc occasion, to discover some or all of the coins in my collection.

 

I, too, am somewhat concerned about how 'collecting' a traveler will play out, especially in the hands of newbies that don't take time to learn the lingo and just make assumptions based on the readily visible terminology. I like the new feature, but I really don't know what, if anything, can be done about the potential misunderstandings.

 

I see your point, and as I said, I have seen some collections activated for exactly that reason. So that when they are taken to events, other cachers can have the pleasure of discovering them. BUT in this case, the owner never lets the coins out into the wild where some unknown person could just decide to keep a coin, and lets face it, coins are at the most risk of this.

 

So perhaps a revision of this collection thing could be, that only the owner can place his/her own coins and TBs in his/her own collection. This list could be visible on the trackables tab of a cachers profile for the interest of other cachers. But the whole concept of being able to move a trackable that you don't own into your own collection should be abolished.

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I'm at loss to even understand WHY this came about.

 

This has come about at the request of the many people who collect Geocoins that they own, and have them actuivated to show on their list of items owned. There are many people who do this, and lots of them own thousands of trackable coins. I agree that it should not be an option on Trackables that have been sent traveling.

 

I guess we'll see how it works if I start getting a lot of emails of people moving my trackables into their collections. I hope people can figure this out, or there will be a lot of emails flying around. Some of them will probably not be nice.

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I have news for all the coin owners. Some people are going to collect your coins whether or not you get to mark them collectable or not collectable. The fact that Groundspeak lets them move the coin to a virtual "My Collection" has little to do with whether or not someone keeps a coin instead of moving it on.

 

Now, it may be true that if someone sees on the coin page that a coin is collectable they might think this means they can keep it and maybe if they see "not collectable" they will have second thoughts about holding on to it. So I agree that if you are going to have this feature many coin owners would prefer the default to be "not collectible". But I don't think this feature is going to have much impact one way or the other on coins being kept by someone who wants to do so.

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I have set my trackables that are out in the wild to non-collectable. The 2 mileage-tracker bugs I am holding (they belong to my kids) don't seem to be suited for a collection as you can not drop it into a cache from the collection.

 

I think this is a dangerous move by GS. I am worried that people will start to think that they can collect (keep) a trackable if they think it is cool. Seems to be counter to the rant everyone has about trackables going missing.

 

Edit to say: Maybe when logging a cache find there could be a "Collection" drop down list (just like the inventory list). By selecting a trackable in the list, the site would automaticaly "dip" the trackable. I COULD get behind that!!

Edited by Andronicus
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I understand and partly agree with some of your concerns.

 

However, I and several folks I know DO activate their privately held collections. I do this to keep a list on gc.com and it lets me allow folks, oc occasion, to discover some or all of the coins in my collection.

 

I, too, am somewhat concerned about how 'collecting' a traveler will play out, especially in the hands of newbies that don't take time to learn the lingo and just make assumptions based on the readily visible terminology. I like the new feature, but I really don't know what, if anything, can be done about the potential misunderstandings.

 

I see your point, and as I said, I have seen some collections activated for exactly that reason. So that when they are taken to events, other cachers can have the pleasure of discovering them. BUT in this case, the owner never lets the coins out into the wild where some unknown person could just decide to keep a coin, and lets face it, coins are at the most risk of this.

 

So perhaps a revision of this collection thing could be, that only the owner can place his/her own coins and TBs in his/her own collection. This list could be visible on the trackables tab of a cachers profile for the interest of other cachers. But the whole concept of being able to move a trackable that you don't own into your own collection should be abolished.

 

The only problem I see with your solution are those few cases, such as Moun10bike coins and a few others (even a TB or 2 I was given to keep - I know. Long story.). They are activated and owned by someone else but were given to me and are, in fact, in my collection.

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Thanks for the feedback everyone.

 

After some discussion internally we agree that it is better to default the "Unknown" status to NOT collectible.

 

This will require a full release of the site, which will occur later this afternoon after a couple other unrelated fixes have been addressed. Toggling the default status for collectibles is itself a simple fix.

 

While you're at it, can you also have the tracking number(s) automatically filled in for the convenience of trackable owners once again?

The site used to do this...not sure when it went away...or why.

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While you're at it, can you also have the tracking number(s) automatically filled in for the convenience of trackable owners once again?

The site used to do this...not sure when it went away...or why.

maybe you had a GM script that did that? the "gc add waypoint finder" script does that AFAIK.

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Just a couple things for future tweaks to the collection page.

 

I'd like to see...

1. The icons on the list next to the names.

2. Being able to see more than 10 at a time - or at least an option to.

 

Thanks for all the hard work Lackeys!

 

Yes, count me in for these! Both of them!

Thanks Semper Questio!

 

Now, looking at the still 'Evolving' Trackables Collections Knowledge Book, I even more strongly feel that 'Unknown' should go completely, just leaving 'Non-collectible' as default, and an option to change to 'Collectible' (or Collecable).

 

AND, I totally agree with those who fear the term "Collectible (or Collectable or whatever)".

VERY misleading!

It strongly dampens the entire concept of TBs.

Yet, I cannot think peacefully now, for another appropriate word to replace it.

 

Thanks again for the overall improvement!

Looking forward for more!

 

All for the better!

 

~ Dr.MORO

Edited by Dr.MORO
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You think if they called it "Hide trackable from my inventory" instead of "Move trackable to my collection" and let trackable owners indicate if the trackable was hideable with the default being hideable that there would have been this much outcry? :(

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You think if they called it "Hide trackable from my inventory" instead of "Move trackable to my collection" and let trackable owners indicate if the trackable was hideable with the default being hideable that there would have been this much outcry? :(

 

Probably not.

The verbiage does, however, seem to send an inappropriate signal that newbees could easily misinterpret.

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You have to go to your trackable page and click "Edit this trackable item". It's just above the Mission box.

 

Not picking on you Blorenges...just quoting you as a starting point for my comments to Groundspeak.

 

If I only got a handful of trackables, this is easy. :D

 

I'm sure there are folks with more than me...but I'm not looking forward to doing this on 40+ trackables. :D

 

If there was a way to BATCH the process of updating all your trackables, including the ability to move them in and out of your Inventory/Collection. Doing this one at a time is painful. I can't imagine what somebody with a few hundred trackables must be thinking right now. :(

 

Who's idea was it to have an Unknown status? :D They should have defaulted to NOT Collectible! :D

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Who's idea was it to have an Unknown status? :( They should have defaulted to NOT Collectible! :D

yes yes, they will do that shortly.

 

and tbh, after that i'm perfectly fine with the "collection" thing. if people can't move trackables into their collection which aren't meant to be, maybe it gives them a hint that they're not supposed to keep them.

Edited by dfx
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Now, looking at the still 'Evolving' Trackables Collections Knowledge Book, I even more strongly feel that 'Unknown' should go completely, just leaving 'Non-collectible' as default, and an option to change to 'Collectible' (or Collecable).

 

 

Yes, having Unknown as a status doesn't make as much sense now, but before we released we did have this text displayed on the Trackable details page. The idea was that if people saw that the coin was of "unknown" status they would know the owner had not stated one way or the other if it should be collected.

 

We will return that text to the page so finders will know if it should be collected or not, or in the case of "unknown" that the trackable owner has not made a decision yet which may encourage finders to at least inquire as to whether they can collect the Trackable or not.

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The only problem I see with your solution are those few cases, such as Moun10bike coins and a few others (even a TB or 2 I was given to keep - I know. Long story.). They are activated and owned by someone else but were given to me and are, in fact, in my collection.

 

This is where the ability to transfer ownership would come in :(

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