Is this cheating?

[+user13371]

Question: Whether to find a benchmark, or to prove it's not there -- is it fair play to ask a local?

 

Few days ago, I went looking for NE1706. Couldn't find it. The location appeared to be in the middle of a parking lot for some pretty new condominiums. I figured the benchmark had been taken away, or buried under the asphalt.

 

Still, I wasn't sure. So when I was in the area again today, I decided to go by and take a closer look.

 

I parked my car by the house nearest the spot -- this house is also noted in the datasheet as a landmark. A couple of folks were working in the yard, so I asked them if they knew about the benchmark.

 

"Oh, that's gone," the property owner said, "They ripped it out a couple of years ago when they built those condos."

 

Had a nice chat with these folks about geocaching, benchmark hunting, local property development, and the weather. They seemed interested, so I also gave them the geocaching web address :-)

 

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LDR.

[+embra]

This is pretty wide open; any information source you can glean is fair game IMO. For the hardest ones, getting some local information can be invaluable. And especially if you're trying to figure out the fate of one that seems to be gone, an informed explanation may be the ony way to get closure.

 

Max

Often wrong but seldom in doubt

[survey tech]

NGS crews do the same thing. I have seen many descriptions that refer to the knowledge of local individuals, as long as the person giving the information had specific personal knowledge of the marker before it was destroyed, rather than mere hearsay.

[Cholo]

quote:

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Originally posted by Lee David Rimar:

Question: _Whether to find a benchmark, or to prove it's not there -- is it fair play to ask a local?_

 

 

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_LDR._

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That's a two point deduction and you have to remove the batteries from your GPSr while hunting for the next bm.

[+Kewaneh & Shark]

While Geocaching, asking a nearby local for help and/or directions would be considered cheating, but I wouldn't think that to be the case in Benchmarking. The benchmarks were not placed with the intent of being hidden, like a cache. The surveyors who placed the marks put them where they felt they could be relatively protected, and remain in position for a long period of time, with the intent that they would be found again. That's what the descriptions are for. Asking a local landowner or resident is only adding to the description.

 

Surveyors commonly ask locals if they've seen surveying marks or property corners or whatever. Sometimes, that's all we've got to go on. Looking at it from a business perspective: I could spend all day traversing to a calculated point, swinging my metal detector, and digging holes, and hope to find what I'm looking for. Or, if it's possible, I could ask someone who might know, and save myself a whole lot of work. Surveyors call it 'Parole Evidence', and provided the person has first-hand knowledge of the monument in question, it can be used to determine the proper location of that monument.

 

With that in mind, I don't think asking is cheating at all. (And if you ask the right person, you won't even need your GPSr, whether it's got batteries or not.)

 

Keep on Caching!

- Kewaneh

[+user13371]

quote:

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Originally posted by Cholo:

...a two point deduction and you have to remove the batteries from your GPSr while hunting for the next bm.

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No problem. I usually find benchmarks without relying on the GPS. I just use the GPS to verify the general area, then pocket it. Once I find the benchmark I take the GPS out again, just to see how good the datasheet coords were.

 

Most benchmarks were placed before GPS existed, so it's not surprising the datasheets are wrtten to get you there without one.

 

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LDR.

[+emike]

QUOTE

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While Geocaching, asking a nearby local for help and/or directions would be considered cheating

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What about asking locals for help with landmarks or reference points to a cache but not the cache itself?

 

EMike