EDIT logs on own caches

[+t4e]

OK, i have had this issue a few times now

 

i do not like to delete people's logs if they post something that is a "spoiler", so i send them a message to remove the "spoilers" from their logs

 

well i don't know what email address do they have on their account, but most are not responsive

 

i have just had someone log a find, they posted a picture of the actual hide and said in their log that those that haven't found it no to look at the picture, but they encrypted the message

 

they are new cachers, only 5 finds, so i am being understanding and sent them a message politely asking to remove the picture and explaining that is not customary to post any spoilers, that even though they were considerate to warn people not to look at the picture, for one the log is encrypted and second, as soon as the next 5 finds are logged his own will be off the visible area, but the picture will remain in the gallery readily available to anyone

 

since i have had no reply nor action from this cacher i feel i have no other way but to delete his log, and i feel bad because he has only 5 finds in total and reducing it to 4 will confuse him/her, and most likely will think i am the "bad guy" in all this

 

what i am asking for is that CO, be allowed to EDIT the logs and be required to write a reason for doing so, and have a note at the bottom stating that CO edited the log with date and time stamp, same as it is in the forums

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

We would agree on being able to delete a spoiler photo w/o deleting that same cacher's log.

 

However... we feel that if someone is dense enough to write up a spoiler log (encrypted or no), and fails to edit it after an email (for whatever reason), then they can kiss the smiley goodbye! It comes down to responsibility on their part. No responsibility=no findy.

 

Perhaps it is a hard lesson, but something they should already know.

[+t4e]

at this time i still have no reply or the picture removed from the log

 

unfortunately i had to delete his log

Edited April 12, 2010 by t4e

[+Max and 99]

I wouldn't hesitate to delete the log if you didn't get a response from the cacher.

[+dakboy]

I would prefer that you delete my log entirely and email to tell me why. What I write in my log is my story, my words, my thoughts - sharing my experience of finding the cache. For someone else to edit my log takes that away from me, it's no longer my story.

[+Knight2000]

I would prefer that you delete my log entirely and email to tell me why.

I wish this was required. I have had a log deleted without cause and not explained. I finally realized they had a grudge against me.

Edited April 12, 2010 by Knight2000

[+dfx]

I wish this was required. I have had a log deleted without cause and not explained. I finally realized they had a grudge against me.

good point, i always found it strange that one isn't required to enter a reason for deleting a log (and even stranger that it's not even possible to give a reason).

 

i can has this as feature request?

[+t4e]

I would prefer that you delete my log entirely and email to tell me why. What I write in my log is my story, my words, my thoughts - sharing my experience of finding the cache. For someone else to edit my log takes that away from me, it's no longer my story.

 

please read my post again, you're missing my point, i don't want to edit anyone's experince...i said EDIT SPOILERS...

i rather do that than delete a log

besides, if there is a disagreement it can work the same as is it does in the forums when a post is edited, the MODS and Admins can see original post and and compare it against the edited version

 

i enjoy each and every log on my caches, whatever that may be, praise or criticism, to me its part of the cache history and maybe the criticism has a lesson to be learned

 

however i do not appreciate it when i put effort into making a unique hide only to have someone spill the beans and write a log that gives away the nature of the hide and spoils the surprise for everyone else that hasn't been there yet

Edited April 12, 2010 by t4e

[+ChileHead]

I wouldn't want a cache owner to be able to edit my words. I'd rather see them have the power to make my words hidden if either I gave away a spoiler, or they didn't like my log for some reason. If I edited my log I could then ask the cache owner to make it visible again.

[NeecesandNephews]

If you sent a polite email asking the logger to delete the spoiler image, or the wording (as you say you did) and they do not reply, I don't think it makes you look like a "bad guy" to delete the log.

 

Yes it will cost him a find, but if you send an email along with the delete action, telling him to feel free to re-log his find without the spoiler, then it is on him/her.

 

If the find is that important to him (and with only five, I bet it is) he will comply. I am sure he would at least appreciate the explanation of why his log was deleted, in case he didn't receive the first email.

 

I have hesitated to log NA's for the same reason, but I don't think I am doing cache owners or hunters any favors by hesitating. I want to be friendly to everyone, but sometimes you have to take a stand. It is your cache.

[+pppingme]

The proper way to handle this, and I'm continued to be amazed that gs doesn't support this (I have brought it up before) is for the cache owner to be able to "hide" (not encrypt) the log contents, or pics, that way the finder doesn't lose a find (as they shouldn't), the cache owner gets to prevent spoilers (as they should), and way fewer less hurt feelings, then the log owner (yes, I believe the log belongs to the log owner, not the cache owner, so no I don't support cache owner editing logs) can edit to everyone's happiness.

[+Chrysalides]

please read my post again, you're missing my point, i don't want to edit anyone's experince...i said EDIT SPOILERS...

Since it is impossible for the servers to distinguish between what's a spoiler and what's not, it comes down to enabling all COs to edit log entries on their caches. And there are some mighty strange COs out there.

[+dakboy]

I would prefer that you delete my log entirely and email to tell me why. What I write in my log is my story, my words, my thoughts - sharing my experience of finding the cache. For someone else to edit my log takes that away from me, it's no longer my story.

 

please read my post again, you're missing my point, i don't want to edit anyone's experince...i said EDIT SPOILERS...

Regardless of what you're asking for, what I wrote is what would be possible and would happen. My words are my words, period - which part you think is a spolier is irrelevant. And you're still changing MY words when you do it.

[+briansnat]

The proper way to handle this, and I'm continued to be amazed that gs doesn't support this (I have brought it up before) is for the cache owner to be able to "hide" (not encrypt) the log contents, or pics, that way the finder doesn't lose a find (as they shouldn't), the cache owner gets to prevent spoilers (as they should), and way fewer less hurt feelings, then the log owner (yes, I believe the log belongs to the log owner, not the cache owner, so no I don't support cache owner editing logs) can edit to everyone's happiness.

 

That is a very good idea. The log could appear in the page with the words "Hidden by cache owner"

Edited April 12, 2010 by briansnat

[+t4e]

 

Regardless of what you're asking for, what I wrote is what would be possible and would happen. My words are my words, period - which part you think is a spolier is irrelevant. And you're still changing MY words when you do it.

 

well than with all due respect, as an experienced cacher if you can't choose your words accordingly and use your judgment as to what a "spoiler"is, than it is very relevant what i think a spoiler is

 

i do like Potato Finder's suggestion too, as i said i don't like deleting people's logs and i always look at their profile and take into consideration the experience they have, new cachers are not aware of all the "proper" ways of playing this game and the messages i send in such cases are in the form of a polite "lesson"

 

the problem is though sometimes you come across "know it all" people that ignore your help

 

anyway, in the meantime, the person i was referring to in my OP has logged again early this morning and apologized for the original log

[+dakboy]

 

Regardless of what you're asking for, what I wrote is what would be possible and would happen. My words are my words, period - which part you think is a spolier is irrelevant. And you're still changing MY words when you do it.

 

well than with all due respect, as an experienced cacher if you can't choose your words accordingly and use your judgment as to what a "spoiler"is, than it is very relevant what i think a spoiler is

But that's not what I wrote.

 

What I consider to not be a spoiler, you might consider a spoiler. It's a matter of interpretation in some cases. And regardless of whether you think I've written a spoiler or not, you should not have the ability to change my words, period. If you change the part you think is a spoiler, you've altered my sharing of the experience, period.

[+t4e]

 

What I consider to not be a spoiler, you might consider a spoiler. It's a matter of interpretation in some cases. And regardless of whether you think I've written a spoiler or not, you should not have the ability to change my words, period. If you change the part you think is a spoiler, you've altered my sharing of the experience, period.

 

if you write "i looked under the boardwalk and there it was", or post a picture of the whole hide....that is not a matter of interpretation at all

 

if i delete your log, you have to change the sharing of your experience anyway

 

if a MOD edits your post here in the forums, do you argue with them that they changed your words, would you rather have them delete your whole post?

sure, you are the owner of your post, but if they find something that is not appropriate they have the power to change it, i should have the same since as a CO i have a whole lot of other responsibilities too, including the logs

 

but anyway, you really either don't get my point or just want to have the last word

 

here's one more reason why owners should be allowed to EDIT logs

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php...p;#entry4294179

[+dakboy]

if i delete your log, you have to change the sharing of your experience anyway

And that's perfectly fine with me - because I still get to write it my way, without someone else changing my words.

[BCProspectors]

Letting COs edit logs on their caches would open up too many opportunities for problems. We already get a lot of "CO DID [sOMETHING] WHAT DO I DO!?" topics containing crazy circumstances in the forums and COs being able to edit logs would create the possibility for a lot of crazier and more frustrating situations.

 

It is every user's responsibility to use a valid email address on geocaching.com. If they are using an email address they have abandoned or is otherwise invalid then it is their fault when they do not receive the email from the CO notifying them that they're log has been deleted and to re-log.

[cezanne]

 

if i delete your log, you have to change the sharing of your experience anyway

 

Not necessarily. If you delete a log of mine, I get a copy of it and can repost it in case I think that the log does not contain anything that warrants its deletion. In case you delete it again, I could contact Groundspeak. Even though I try to be very careful with not writing anything that could be considered as spoiler, it still may happen to me that a hider might wish that I rephrase my log. In such cases, I am of course willing to do my best. It appears that my efforts have been successful - up to now I did not get a log deleted for spoiler reasons. Logs of mine got, however, deleted for other reasons such as me writing that I did not enjoy the cache (in a non-insulting way), for writing English logs in non-English speaking countries and writing too long logs. Reposting the log and communicating that there was no reason to delete the log, normally worked out for me.

 

I strongly object against the possibility of cache owners to edit cache logs. Many would edit my logs to get them shorter and to remove some parts they do not like.

 

Do not misunderstand me. I am pretty sure that you would not use an edit option in an inacceptable way, but please take into account that many cachers act differently than you and that there are many cache hiders who react quite emotionally to logs.

 

if a MOD edits your post here in the forums, do you argue with them that they changed your words, would you rather have them delete your whole post?

 

First, MODs in this forum have some official responsibility - they cannot edit my posts just because they do not like for example my writing style as long as I do not violate the forum guidelines.

 

Second, typically MODs remove some parts of a posting and mark the removed part and do not simply edit through the text whereever they like to do so.

 

Third, in such cases edits are clearly marked (at least they should). If you would edit one of my logs, I have no chance to rephrase it again as I typically will not become aware of your editing and it would take me a lot of time to check which parts you changed.

 

So all in all, I feel that the possibility to delete logs is sufficient. In case someone posts a strong spoiler and does not respond quickly, feel free to delete the log and send an explanation to the author of the log. As the latter one gets a copy of what you deleted, it is not a big deal to come up with an improved version of the deleted log.

 

Cezanne

Edited April 26, 2010 by cezanne

[+Isonzo Karst]

If you delete a log of mine, I get a copy of it

 

no, you don't. If your log is deleted, you get an automated email. It tells the name of the person deleting and the name of the cache. URL to the cache and URL of the profile of the person deleting the log. Date and time of deletion. It does not include the log, or a link to the log.

 

The log is gone, neither you nor the cache owner can see it. It's gone from your profile page (logs) as well. I'd link to the Knowledge Book article on this, but I'm getting an error messagefor the Groundspeak URL this morning.

 

I totally agree with your point about NOT giving the cache owner the right to edit logs.

 

I wouldn't mind seeing one more hoop for cache owner's to jump through before being able to delete logs - perhaps checking a couple of Yes I have read and understood boxes, with links to the Logging of all Physical caches section of the listing guidelines, and the Log Deletion article in the Knowledge Books. Or maybe just the Log Deletion article - for boxless caches. Or all caches.

[AZcachemeister]

If you delete a log of mine, I get a copy of it

 

no, you don't.

 

Yes, you do. There is a link to the deleted log. Log one of my caches and I'll delete it to prove it to you.

 

1. The logs section on any cache page clearly states that spoilers may be encountered.

2. If I'm reading all the logs, I'm hoping to encounter a spoiler!

3. I would support the possibility for a cache owner to delete objectionable (for whatever reason) photos from their cache page. Editing the finder's text is certainly not a good idea. I do not care to put my words in other's mouths, nor do I care to have other's words put in mine.

4. In any case, the owner should feel no remorse in deleting a log after sending an explanation to the logger, assuming thy have a valid reason to do so. ( I realize that what constitutes a 'valid reason' will vary widely).

[cezanne]

no, you don't. If your log is deleted, you get an automated email. It tells the name of the person deleting and the name of the cache. URL to the cache and URL of the profile of the person deleting the log. Date and time of deletion. It does not include the log, or a link to the log.

 

Whenever it happened to me (the last time this year in February, the first time many years ago), I got a link to my log and could repost it.

 

Cezanne

[+Isonzo Karst]

HI AZcachemeister I posted a note to your GCGEZR.

 

Delete it! the acid test....Thanks IK

 

wow, that was fast. And here it is:

 

Subject:Log Deletion Notice

From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com >

Date: 8:08 am

To: xxxxx@address.com

 

Your log entry for the listing Arizona Falls (Traditional Cache) was deleted by AZcachemeister at 4/27/2010 5:08:49 AM

 

Visit this listing at the below address:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/log.aspx?LU...9e-fd2cc4c4ea11

 

Profile for AZcachemeister:

http://www.geocaching.com/profile/?guid=d1...b2-892ca8092496

 

The first link IS to the log! which I can see. I don't know if you can, (perhaps the cache owner can, I know a site admin can). I stand corrected.

Thanks for the demonstration, AZcachemeister

Edited April 27, 2010 by Isonzo Karst

[AZcachemeister]

HI AZcachemeister I posted a note to your GCGEZR.

 

Delete it! the acid test....Thanks IK

 

wow, that was fast. And here it is:

 

Subject:Log Deletion Notice

From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com >

Date: 8:08 am

To: xxxxx@address.com

 

Your log entry for the listing Arizona Falls (Traditional Cache) was deleted by AZcachemeister at 4/27/2010 5:08:49 AM

 

Visit this listing at the below address:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/log.aspx?LU...9e-fd2cc4c4ea11

 

Profile for AZcachemeister:

http://www.geocaching.com/profile/?guid=d1...b2-892ca8092496

 

The first link IS to the log! which I can see. I don't know if you can, (perhaps the cache owner can, I know a site admin can). I stand corrected.

Thanks for the demonstration, AZcachemeister

 

I presume you haven't had many logs deleted, so it's a new experience for you.

[+northernpenguin]

The big problem with a CO editing logs is when you get a CO and a cacher who learn to dislike each other. It's one thing to have a vindictive CO deleting your logs repeatedly. It's another thing altogether for a CO to decide to edit all the logs you've ever posted to his/her caches and replace the log with "I'm a moron!" or something else.

 

No, I don't want COs editing logs. As a CO I don't want people claiming I edited their logs. It would be nice to be able to selectively drop photos - particularly given how flaky the image upload servers can be (nothing like deleting an event log with 100 pics and making them re-upload those pics just because of one inappropriate one).

 

Delete+Why is a good idea --- the Waymarking.com site has that for the Rejection process. But you'll still get COs that simply type a "." in the box and hit delete.