GPSMAP 60CSx

[+herofish]

Hello, I am new to the forum and am looking for some assistance from 60CSX owners in understanding how many maps I can put on this device.

 

Some background:

I understand there is a 4GB max for the card, and the 2025 map segment limit.

 

I looked at the PN-40 as an alternative since its main drawbacks (from reviews) seem to be battery life, small screen and lesser road navigation abilities. One item I don't think gets very good coverage on this forum is the PN-40 according to delorme support will not create a route over 500 miles long. This makes it ineffective for my road trips (at least most of them).

 

I am looking for a device to do both BASIC on-road navigation as well as off-road driving navigation as I drive through a lot of BLM/national forest service roads in the Western US (from the Mississippi West).

 

I spend about 80% of my navigation time in the Jeep, and about 20% on foot (off trail/road). Initially what attracted me to the Delorme was the ability to store large datasets so I could have most of the topo maps of the US (or at least west of the Miss) stored on the device locally without having to switch cards or maps. But its inability to route is a major problem for me since I want a single device to do both even though I am willing to lose some features that others like the Nuvi provide.

 

So, I am back to the 60CSx to see if there is any way to get both the Navigate software and majority of the topo data (to cover the forest service roads and trails) onto a single SD card and access both the navigational data and topo information without having to switch cards or maps?

 

I have heard and seen that there are user maps available which may provide enough topo information so that I don't have to use the Garmin 24K maps which won't fit on the card (due to the limits with 4G + 2025 segments) - the gpsfiledepot maps.

 

Also, I am not sure if there is a way to reduce the # of segments for the topo maps which may help be able to store the data. Additionally, it seems that the topo maps from the gpsfiledepot dont' include navigational data, only the topo data, so I would like to hear if I can use both the navigate road map data simultaneously with the topo data...

[snowfleurys]

You might consider one ot the ORxxxt units. A few days ago there was a post (on gpsfiledepot ??) about a 't' unit for $5 more than the non 't' unit. The 't' unit had the topo mapset taking up 3Gb of the units 4Gb of internal memory (my OR300 only has 1Gb of built in memory). I believe you can still put a 4Gb storage card into the unit. If you removed the topo mapset (saved to hard drive or write a DVD), this would give you close to 8Gb for you own data. What would likely limit filling it up would be finding mapsets which were created with .img files averaging 2Mb.

 

The CO, OR, DK units have a 4000+ segment limit. These units also allow you to rename the gmapsupp.img file to anyname.img (i.e. NMtopo.img, COtopo.img, etc.). Once you had files built for the individual states, you could transfer them to the GPSr as you needed them within the 4000 segment/ 8Gb memory limits.

 

The mapset file sizes on gpsfiledepot are for the .exe file. When the .img files for the mapsets are 'unpacked', the mapset may be up to 20% larger.

Edited March 30, 2010 by snowfleurys

[+JBnW]

What I'm seeing on my 76CSx is that you can "show" both the City Navigator (routable) and gpsfiledepot (nonroutable) (and any others) simultaneously. I believe the actual display that you would see defers to the most detailed map product, which would be CN. In other words, you would see CN on the display, but not the Topos. FWIW, changing between the map products that are displayed is only a few buttons, most of the time needed to do so is consumed by the GPS needing to re-draw.

 

HTH

[+herofish]

So far based on all the various reviews, I have decided to stay away from the Oregon models as the daylight visibility of the screen seems to be a major issue. Living in Colorado, we have very intense sun and very few cloudy days. I want a strongly daylight readable screen as I can get, which is why I have focused on the GPSMAP 60CSX, and the PN-40 as the two possibilities.

 

I am strongly in favor of the Garmin, however the main issue holding me back is the limits placed on the number of maps I can have installed on the device without switching out cards or renaming maps. On the other hand, the Garmin has a reputation for durability, accuracy and long batter life not to mention that it has a strong daylight readable screen which is a bit larger than the PN-40.

 

I would like to go with the Garmin, however I haven't been able to determine if I can actually get trail and road routing with some sort of topo basemap for the Western States (Washington, Oregon, California, Nevada, Arizona, Utah, Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Colorado, New Mexico + half of Texas, North Dakota and South Dakota) -- all onto one 4GB card with less than 2025 map segments.

 

I would really like to hear if someone using tools like mkgmap, mapedit or others has been able to do something similar...

[ao318]

So far based on all the various reviews, I have decided to stay away from the Oregon models as the daylight visibility of the screen seems to be a major issue. Living in Colorado, we have very intense sun and very few cloudy days. I want a strongly daylight readable screen as I can get, which is why I have focused on the GPSMAP 60CSX, and the PN-40 as the two possibilities.

 

I am strongly in favor of the Garmin, however the main issue holding me back is the limits placed on the number of maps I can have installed on the device without switching out cards or renaming maps. On the other hand, the Garmin has a reputation for durability, accuracy and long batter life not to mention that it has a strong daylight readable screen which is a bit larger than the PN-40.

 

I would like to go with the Garmin, however I haven't been able to determine if I can actually get trail and road routing with some sort of topo basemap for the Western States (Washington, Oregon, California, Nevada, Arizona, Utah, Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Colorado, New Mexico + half of Texas, North Dakota and South Dakota) -- all onto one 4GB card with less than 2025 map segments.

 

I would really like to hear if someone using tools like mkgmap, mapedit or others has been able to do something similar...

Ok, I did what you asked. I have a 60CSX and have the Garmin Topo 2008 Software along with CN 2010. I also have California Topo from GPS file depot. I used mapsource to create my map selections for the area you requested. Here are my results:

 

CN 2010 - Mapsets 30 = 249.2 mb

Topo 2008 - Mapsets 2171 = 1332.5 mb

Totals - Mapsets 2201 = 1581.7

 

Comparison of Topo 2008 and California Topo (gpsfiledepot.com) maps for California only.

Topo 2008 - Mapsets Approx 289 = 115 mb

California Topo - Mapsets 417 = 1056.2

 

As you can see from the info I listed that you will have enough memory for the data but can't load all the maps because of the internal limit of 2025 map segments. I do not have the most current version of Garmins Topo so I cannot compare them to my older version of 2008 and what their mapets size will be. It looks like you wouldn't be able to load all of Topo onto one card because of the number of map segments.

 

Your only option that I can think of, for the 60CSX, is to plan your route and only load those segments that you will need for all of the states you are driving through. This would allow you to put both Topo and CN onto one card. Your other option, but you don't want one, is to purchase an Oregon with Topo already installed and then load CN onto a card to use.

 

I hope this has helped.

[+ecanderson]

So far based on all the various reviews, I have decided to stay away from the Oregon models as the daylight visibility of the screen seems to be a major issue. Living in Colorado, we have very intense sun and very few cloudy days.

Yeah - wasn't today glorious? Before you dismiss the Oregon entirely, it would be good to look at one of the newer x50 models of Oregon. They've done some good things with making it easier to read. I still prefer my Dakota 20 to even the Oregon 450 screen over here on the Front Range, though. Get the sunlight reflecting off of it just right, and it actually becomes easier to read. It's only a problem if you get the sun just wrong so as to bounce it directly back into your eyeballs -- a problem for any of these units.

 

You don't say where you are in the area, but it's possible to see both screen versions mentioned above at some combination of Dick's, REI, etc. Either the Dakota 10 or 20 screen will do for deciding what you think about the Dakota 20, and either the Oregon 450/450T/550/550T will work to see what you think of that screen.

[+ecanderson]

Poking around, it appears you're in Boulder. If so, drop me an email - click on the "ecanderson" for the link to the geocaching.com personal page - and I'd be glad to show you what a Dakota 20 looks like.

[+herofish]

Thanks everyone for all the replies -- especially ao318, that sounds great like I may be able to fit most everything on the card that I will need at this point.

 

I will take another look at the other series when I head down to REI tomorrow.

[GeoBobC]

For western states (WA, ID, OR, CA, WY, MT, CO, NM, UT, NV, and AZ)Topo 2008 I count 1809 segments.

[+iofdetiger]

Thanks everyone for all the replies -- especially ao318, that sounds great like I may be able to fit most everything on the card that I will need at this point.

 

I will take another look at the other series when I head down to REI tomorrow.

 

just as a heads up, i bought my 60csx two days ago and there was a 1gb card inside the device instead of the 64mb one. nice surprise.

[ao318]

For western states (WA, ID, OR, CA, WY, MT, CO, NM, UT, NV, and AZ)Topo 2008 I count 1809 segments.

Yes, but he also wanted North and South Dakota along with half of Texas.

[+herofish]

Well, I now have MapSource, Topo 2008 myself and an 8GB MicroSD so I am now on my way to trying to squeeze in as much as I can! Thanks again for all the help, everyone who chimed in should get a bonus from Garmin :-), but seriously thanks for letting me know it was at least close to possible to get most of the regions onto the card!

[Suscrofa]

I tried to load about 3.6GB 1700 map segments on a 4GB Kingston SDHC and it did not work although I could see the file via the USB connection !

Then I checked the file format and noticed the card came formated as FAT32. I reformated in simple FAT, 64k segment, reloaded the img file I had saved and IT WORKED !

 

By the way, always use a microSD adapter and the PC card reader otherwise using the USB GPS connection takes forever. Keep a copy of the img file too.

[+briansnat]

The base maps of the 60CSX handle autrouting. If you regularly take long trips you can load CN maps for your destination area and let it route along the basemap for the long stretch in between.

[+SparkyInCali]

There are ways to combine the Garmin Topo mapsets into larger segments.The old 100k topo was reduced from around 6000 tiles to 300 tiles or so.

[+Cacheoholic]

I’ve never seen anyone that could get that to work with Topo US 2008. Isn’t the 60C(S)x limited to a 4GB card?

[+coggins]

I’ve never seen anyone that could get that to work with Topo US 2008. Isn’t the 60C(S)x limited to a 4GB card?

That hack doesn't work with the new format containing DEM data... The GPSMAP 60CSx isn't limited to a 4GB card, it is limited by the FAT32 file system that will allow a 4GB file (in this case, the supplemental map), you can use up to a 32GB card but much of it would be a wasted unless you stored other data on it.

[Suscrofa]

The 60CX is limited to 4GB maps and requires FAT16 (in FAT32, I could see the files on my 60CX via the USB Mass storage but it would not load the maps), no point in using a bigger than 4GB SDHC and as these comes formated in FAT32, you have to format them in FAT16 with a cluster of 64K. This can be done on a Win7 PC (there are also tools to do it for XP users)

Besides this FAT format is claimed to be more efficient, speed wise, compared to FAT32. Could not test.

Note that 4GB is the absolute limit of the FAT16 format.

 

By the way, the same is true for my old Canon 510 that would not recognize the 4GB SDHC out of the box but OK once reformated FAT16.

 

Note that I have tried the above on my own equipment and it works. On forum, many people post answers they have heard somewhere and not experienced themselves.

Edited April 3, 2010 by Suscrofa

[+coggins]

Note that I have tried the above on my own equipment and it works. On forum, many people post answers they have heard somewhere and not experienced themselves.

I have a FAT32 formatted 8GB card in my GPS. It didn't need to be reformatted for FAT16. I didn't read this anywhere.

[Suscrofa]

Note that I have tried the above on my own equipment and it works. On forum, many people post answers they have heard somewhere and not experienced themselves.

I have a FAT32 formatted 8GB card in my GPS. It didn't need to be reformatted for FAT16. I didn't read this anywhere.

 

I am suprised as Google gave me a lot of references although I did found out what to do before doing a search !

I was lucky as you can screw up these SD cards with improper format. By chance Win7 has all the required options for formatting, not like XP.

 

Anyway the 60CX series was initially designed for SD card using FAT16 and limited to 2GB, latter firmware implemented support for bigger card than the max SD design, that is SDHC that uses FAT32. The fact is as I stated, my 60CX (firmware 4.00) refused to recognize the 3.6GB img file although I could see the file and other likes the gpx file.

I know that most 60CX and 4G SDHC work, mine didn't. But, formated in FAT16, with the same img, it worked !

 

Same with my Canon camera. My old PC card reader failed as may Palm TX but fine with my recent portable (quite normal !) with Win7 which I used to format, generate the img and load the SDHC card.

 

And for the performance, I have seen people stating that FAT16 lead to better performance, which makes sense as I doubt the 60CX uses a 32 bit architecture. I wasn't able to check anyway.

 

So my advise is for 4GB SDHC, if it doesn't work, format in FAT16 !

If it does work in FAT32, il will work in FAT16 and may be faster, so why not give a try.

 

I am not concerned with bigger card, by the time I explore all the maps I have loaded, I and my GPS will be worn out.

Edited April 3, 2010 by Suscrofa