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I am sure this will have been covered before, but couldnt find exactly what I wanted to know.

 

Firstly is it OK for a non premium member to go looking for a premium only cache. One has been placed near me and although I have no coordinates I think I could get close just from the cache title.

Assuming this is OK then I guess I could sign the log, but would not be able to log on-line.

 

Now since I cant see the page I have no idea if it has already been found so could I be FTF or is that the privilege of the first premium member to get it ?

Both logging it online or FTFs does not bother me at all, but I know it is important to some and I would have no way of warning them that it had already been found.

 

Finally what if there was a FTF prize in the cache ! should I take it or leave it ?

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Curious that you needed to make a sock puppet to post this question.

 

No, it is not OK for a basic member to hunt a PMO cache by themselves, in the manner you have described. There is a reason it is PMO. You need to either team up with a PM or contribute a few bucks back to Groundspeak and become a PM.

 

Many of us who put out a PMO cache have no problem with letting a PM bring along basic members and they can all log the cache. For instance, you might have a family that buys just 1 PM account, but each family member may have their own BM account so they can write their own logs. This is generally not a problem and there is an easy method to allow the BM to access the write log function for a PM cache, even though they can't actually see the cache page.

 

Also, some of us will initially publish a cache as PMO and wait for the FTF or some arbitrary length of time before we remove the PMO status and allow everyone to have full access. This is a way to reward those who give back to the geocaching community by supporting GS (who makes this all possible through the sales of memberships, trackables, and merchandise).

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hmmmmm not sure what a sock puppet is, but thanks for the answer.

I would still like to go and look for it, but if I dont even sign the log I cant see that this will do any harm and you folks that pay can still have your FTF.

For me this activity is all about a nice walk and a bit of a challenge. Numbers are not important which is why I have no plans to become a PM just yet.

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Curious that you needed to make a sock puppet to post this question.

 

No, it is not OK for a basic member to hunt a PMO cache by themselves, in the manner you have described. There is a reason it is PMO. You need to either team up with a PM or contribute a few bucks back to Groundspeak and become a PM.

 

Many of us who put out a PMO cache have no problem with letting a PM bring along basic members and they can all log the cache. For instance, you might have a family that buys just 1 PM account, but each family member may have their own BM account so they can write their own logs. This is generally not a problem and there is an easy method to allow the BM to access the write log function for a PM cache, even though they can't actually see the cache page.

 

Also, some of us will initially publish a cache as PMO and wait for the FTF or some arbitrary length of time before we remove the PMO status and allow everyone to have full access. This is a way to reward those who give back to the geocaching community by supporting GS (who makes this all possible through the sales of memberships, trackables, and merchandise).

 

To me this question/answer highlights the absurdity of PM caches. I was a premium and money contributing member of GC.com for a while, but never placed or hunted a restricted cache at all during this time. I believe the practice is divisive and high nosed and should never have been considered as a reward for donations to the site.

 

Of course anyone could just happen to stumble across a PM cache just the same as they could happen to stumble across and ordinary cache. Get my drift.

 

BTW Are you seriously saying that if a geocacher should 'genuinely' stumble across a PM cache in the wild, they are not allowed to write anything in the log book???.

Edited by The 2 Dogs
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Curious that you needed to make a sock puppet to post this question.

 

No, it is not OK for a basic member to hunt a PMO cache by themselves, in the manner you have described. There is a reason it is PMO. You need to either team up with a PM or contribute a few bucks back to Groundspeak and become a PM.

BZZZZT!!! Wrong answer.

 

A non-premium member can find and log a PMO cache regardless of whether or not he is accompanied by a premium member. The non-premium member is also free to log the cache online through the well-documented 'back door'.

Edited by sbell111
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hmmmmm not sure what a sock puppet is, but thanks for the answer.

I would still like to go and look for it, but if I dont even sign the log I cant see that this will do any harm and you folks that pay can still have your FTF.

For me this activity is all about a nice walk and a bit of a challenge. Numbers are not important which is why I have no plans to become a PM just yet.

Feel free to look for it. Once you find it, sign the logsheet and then log the cache as a find online.

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ahhhhhh just googled sock puppet and the reason is that my boss introduced me to this and knows my other name and I shouldnt be posting from work <_<

 

You know that creating a sock puppet just to post a controversial post can get both accounts banned?

 

Anyway, this has been covered fairly well in the last week or so. I see no reason to feed lint to the puppet.

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

 

As a fairly new PM member, I should have access to information and tools that other players do not. I have read how many PM members have gone above and beyond to create their caches and hides so other PM cachers, who generally are more respectful, but no need to argue that they are always, can have a better experience. There are many, many more regular caches out there, so I say leave the PM cache alone unless you actually become a PM.

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

 

As a fairly new PM member, I should have access to information and tools that other players do not. I have read how many PM members have gone above and beyond to create their caches and hides so other PM cachers, who generally are more respectful, but no need to argue that they are always, can have a better experience. There are many, many more regular caches out there, so I say leave the PM cache alone unless you actually become a PM.

 

I would be happy to explain if a sock puppet had not started this thread. But since I refuse to feed lint to the puppet, I can only suggest you look through the last couple of weeks worth of posts.

 

This has been covered and the reasons have already been given.

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/SIGH I actually agree with sbell. :)

 

Hmm odd so do I <_<;)

 

Yeppers. Same here.

 

Well me as well. But it's no surpise, as I found out years ago he's originally from Buffalo, and we agree about the Bills.

 

Geez, I hope "The Common Sock Puppet" is still around. :D Don't listen to the unusually high number of PMO cache elitists in this thread. Most people agree anyone can log an MOC, and there is well documented and purposely left open open back door method for you freeloaders to be able to log them.

 

Just kidding about the Freeloaders thing. :huh:

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

 

As a fairly new PM member, I should have access to information and tools that other players do not. I have read how many PM members have gone above and beyond to create their caches and hides so other PM cachers, who generally are more respectful, but no need to argue that they are always, can have a better experience. There are many, many more regular caches out there, so I say leave the PM cache alone unless you actually become a PM.

 

Sure, I can explain. I wasn't calling you a PMO elitist in the post above this, that entire post was meant to be comedic. MOC caches were created in 2002, if I'm not mistaken. And it was for one reason, and one reason only (stated, at least): To combat cache piracy. Someone would be less likely to steal or pillage caches if they had to pay $30/yr. to see the coordinates. Also that's the whole reason for the "audit log", which allows you to see who has viewed your cache page, how many times, and date and time of last visit.

 

The whole "rewarding people for being premium members" thing is just something many people have taken the ball and run with. And of course leads to perceived elitism. There are plenty of people who have come around here and argued that MOC's are elitist.

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

 

As a fairly new PM member, I should have access to information and tools that other players do not. I have read how many PM members have gone above and beyond to create their caches and hides so other PM cachers, who generally are more respectful, but no need to argue that they are always, can have a better experience. There are many, many more regular caches out there, so I say leave the PM cache alone unless you actually become a PM.

I actually started a post that I disagree with sbell. While he is correct that a basic member can search for a premium member cache (either by guessing or determining the coordinates by some ohter means) and can log the cache (using the well know backdoor), there is no guarantee that the cache owner won't delete this find. Some people have interpreted the no ALR guideline to mean that if a basic memeber has signed the log, the cache owner cannot delete it. But I have seen no statement from Groundspeak as to whether requiring someone to be a premium member in order to log a find online for a PMO cache is considered an ALR. I don't believe it is.

 

TPTB have indicated that they keep the backdoor open for the case when a basic memeber goes caching with a premium member who has the PMO cache in the GPS. It seem reasonable to allow the basic member to get to log a find for the cache. There could also be the case where a basic memeber happens upon a PMO cache while looking for places to hide a cache. I don't believe Grounspeak's intention was ever to promote a game for basic member to see if they could use the system to determine the location of PMO caches and log them.

 

If someone's motivation in hiding a PMO cache is to provide an extra cache for premium members as thank you for supporting the site, I can understand some frustration at finding that basic members might be able to find that cache. If I were to hide a PMO cache, it would likely be a puzzle to prevent basic members from figuring out the coordinates.

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I would like to add another possible p.o.v. to this discussion.

 

Not saying I necessarily believe this to be true, or trying to force it on anyone. I consider PMO caches as meeting the requirements to possibly fall under the umbrella of this Guideline.

 

 

4.10. Challenge Caches

A challenge cache requires that geocachers meet a geocaching-related qualification or series of tasks before the challenge cache can be logged (Waymarking and Wherigo qualify too, of course). The additional qualification or tasks are considered the basis of a challenge cache, rather than ALRs (Additional Logging Requirements).

 

Challenge caches vary in scope and format, but all challenge caches must be in the affirmative and require that something be accomplished.

Challenge cache owners must demonstrate that the challenge is attainable. Reviewers may ask the cache owner to demonstrate that they have previously met the challenge and/or that a substantial number of other geocachers would be able to do so.

 

Importantly, cache owners must consider how they will substantiate claims that the challenge has been met. The logging requirements on the cache page must reflect this consideration, and must be logistically viable. Challenge cache owners may also be asked to outline a long-term cache maintenance plan

Edited by NeecesandNephews
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And the regular members could well be the kids and other family members that found the cache because one of the family members has a premium membership. You can view that as a family membership and simply accept that the family members should be allowed the log the cache.

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I also can't remember TPTB ever directly stating that requiring all loggers of MOCs amounted to an ALR, but Jeremy did post that there is no direct link to the logging functionality for MOC except from the MOC page.

 

Given that, it is not a stretch to believe that a cache requirement that did not allow non-premium members to log their finds would be deemed to be an ALR. Of course, even if TPTB did not specifically state that it was an ALR, I bet that they would require the online logs to not be deleted.

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I also can't remember TPTB ever directly stating that requiring all loggers of MOCs amounted to an ALR, but Jeremy did post that there is no direct link to the logging functionality for MOC except from the MOC page.

 

Given that, it is not a stretch to believe that a cache requirement that did not allow non-premium members to log their finds would be deemed to be an ALR. Of course, even if TPTB did not specifically state that it was an ALR, I bet that they would require the online logs to not be deleted.

 

I seem to remember a thread where a guy in Minnesota was using MOC status as an ALR, with verbage on the cache page threatening to delete non-members logs. And he was forced to abandon it with the end of ALR's. I could be wrong though. Perhaps friend of Chad could verify. I haven't seen that Dog with glasses in a while though.

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I am sure this will have been covered before, but couldnt find exactly what I wanted to know.

 

Firstly is it OK for a non premium member to go looking for a premium only cache. One has been placed near me and although I have no coordinates I think I could get close just from the cache title....Finally what if there was a FTF prize in the cache ! should I take it or leave it ?

 

It's perfectly OK to find a cache, even a PMO cache. Thanks to the advent of no additional logging requirments you can find the cache and even log it. Even if the cache says "NO LOGGING BY NON PREMIMUM MEMBERS" You can log it by the rules of this site.

 

Your good to go.

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?...

 

The sole promise made by this site on PMO caches is that only PMs can read the cache page. I have found that to be true. That some folks can find it, and even log it if they do find it by creative methods is not something this site has made any promise about. There are a lot of reasons for that. For one thing being a PM and having your PM status lapse before you catch up on your logs. Tagging a long with a PM for a nice cache outing, and the ones who based on the title can find the cache. If a muggle finds the cache and wants to log it more power to them. The rules never really did apply to muggle finds.

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Firstly is it OK for a non premium member to go looking for a premium only cache.

Of course you can look for whatever you want.

Assuming this is OK then I guess I could sign the log, but would not be able to log on-line.
If you find it, and you sign the logbook you can log it. Of course it is possible to log PMO caches as a member as well. Just substitute "cache_details" with "log" in the url and you are on the log page. But, be aware, that there are owners, who just know better than Groundspeak and will delete the log.

Now since I cant see the page I have no idea if it has already been found so could I be FTF or is that the privilege of the first premium member to get it ?

Both logging it online or FTFs does not bother me at all, but I know it is important to some and I would have no way of warning them that it had already been found.

 

Finally what if there was a FTF prize in the cache ! should I take it or leave it ?

Another very good reason not to care about this FTF nonsense. Just go there, enjoy the trip and the time you have, it doesn't matter if you are the first or not.

 

GermanSailor

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

The question should always be: "Why should something be banned?" NOT "Why should it be allowed?"

 

To me contributing to the hobby of geocaching means hiding geocaches and therefore providing content. The number of founds made possible by my geocaches and events are far more important than a couple of units of a decaying currency paid.

 

I'm a PM, because it get very convenient features for the money. The ability to find PMO caches was never the reason.

 

GermanSailor

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

 

As a fairly new PM member, I should have access to information and tools that other players do not. I have read how many PM members have gone above and beyond to create their caches and hides so other PM cachers, who generally are more respectful, but no need to argue that they are always, can have a better experience. There are many, many more regular caches out there, so I say leave the PM cache alone unless you actually become a PM.

 

You do have access to special information. You have the coordinates, while he is searching an area based on a hunch. If he finds it good for him.. he deserves the find.

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ahhhhhh just googled sock puppet and the reason is that my boss introduced me to this and knows my other name and I shouldnt be posting from work <_<

 

You know that creating a sock puppet just to post a controversial post can get both accounts banned?

 

Anyway, this has been covered fairly well in the last week or so. I see no reason to feed lint to the puppet.

It's a good thing this shouldn't be controversial...unless some upity PMs make it that way.

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It's perfectly OK to find a cache, even a PMO cache. Thanks to the advent of no additional logging requirments you can find the cache and even log it. Even if the cache says "NO LOGGING BY NON PREMIMUM MEMBERS" You can log it by the rules of this site.

 

Your good to go.

 

To further this, I as a non-premium member wouldn't even be able to see that the cache page says "NO LOGGING BY NON PREMIUM MEMBERS" so it'd have been difficult to tell whether the CO was OK with me logging or not before ALR's were stripped...

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Will those of you who say yes that a non-PM member should be able to find and log a PM cache explain why you feel this way?

 

As a fairly new PM member, I should have access to information and tools that other players do not. I have read how many PM members have gone above and beyond to create their caches and hides so other PM cachers, who generally are more respectful, but no need to argue that they are always, can have a better experience. (a common misconception) There are many, many more regular caches out there, so I say leave the PM cache alone unless you actually become a PM.

 

Two words-Pocket Queries.

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I have an idea, just fork out the $10 and this thread is not needed. I feel the 'HAVE YOU SEEN THE ECOMOMY!!!!!!!' comming, but come on, i spend more on junk at wally world than i did on my PM. I do also realize that money is hard to come by, for some, but this is my 2¢

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And the regular members could well be the kids and other family members that found the cache because one of the family members has a premium membership. You can view that as a family membership and simply accept that the family members should be allowed the log the cache.

 

The only basic members that I cache with are grandsons. They only cache when they go with me. It would be silly to have a premium membership for kids 6 - 12 years of age who might log less than 10 PM caches a year.

 

I'd guess that very few PM adult cachers allow BM adult cachers to log using the backdoor. It's way too tedious for that. It's the kind of thing you'd only do for your kids or grandkids.

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To clarify my take a little more... I have zero problem with the BM signing the log in a PMO cache and then logging it online if they found it. It is not a very "tedious" thing to do at all. I do it for a number of BM accounts of family, friends, and even the dog when we go on a group caching trip. Yes, my dog has his own BM account and even owns a hide and a travel bug. I usually have to help him type his logs, but that's OK because I have to be there to access the "backdoor" to the log anyway.

 

My point was that it is not in the spirit of the reason for PMO caches for a BM to go out and try to deduce the location of PMO caches and find them without GPS or coordinates. This has nothing to do with ALR at all. But those who claim it does are conveniently overlooking the guideline that says that a GPS and set of published coordinates are required to hunt a cache. Pick and choose the rules you want to follow I guess.

 

As a cache owner, I would never delete the valid log of a BM on my PMO caches... as long as they found the cache. The only time I've had to delete BM logs is when a knucklehead was trying to make waves by posting false FTF logs on any newly published caches. As there was no signature in the cache, the logs were deleted. It was a special case.

 

In the end, you play the game how you want to. If going outside the lines is how you want to play, so be it. Just realize that in the process you'll probably be irritating all those who play by the rules. But it's just a game. Don't take it so seriously.

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........... But those who claim it does are conveniently overlooking the guideline that says that a GPS and set of published coordinates are required to hunt a cache. Pick and choose the rules you want to follow I guess.

 

........

 

Where'd this guideline come from? Do I need to have all my finds deleted? :rolleyes:

Edited by edscott
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<snip>

But those who claim it does are conveniently overlooking the guideline that says that a GPS and set of published coordinates are required to hunt a cache. Pick and choose the rules you want to follow I guess.

<snip>

 

A second for edscott's request.

 

From all that I have read, the use of a GPSr is required to hide a cache. I cannot find anything that says use of a GPSr is required to find a cache.

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OT: Being new to geocahing, I have been following this and other threads with interest. There are lots of acronyms used in geocaching and I have been trying to get up to speed on them. One I don't get is ALR. What does this mean? Also (even more off topic...) Is there a list of common acronyms listed somewhere? I had hoped one would be pinned in the "getting started" forum but could not find. Sorry about the OT post.

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OT: Being new to geocahing, I have been following this and other threads with interest. There are lots of acronyms used in geocaching and I have been trying to get up to speed on them. One I don't get is ALR. What does this mean? Also (even more off topic...) Is there a list of common acronyms listed somewhere? I had hoped one would be pinned in the "getting started" forum but could not find. Sorry about the OT post.

ALR- Additional Logging Requirement

 

i alos believe that there is a list of acronyms in the FAQ section on GC.com

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Firstly is it OK for a non premium member to go looking for a premium only cache. One has been placed near me and although I have no coordinates I think I could get close just from the cache title.

Well, that's assuming the cache is a traditional. You could get real close on only MOC by adjusting the Near Cache List to say "here" for its distance and direction. I can't remember but it'll get you to within either 20 or 50 feet before it switches to "here." Like I said, I can't remember.

 

Assuming this is OK then I guess I could sign the log, but would not be able to log on-line.

Others have mentioned a backdoor. I'm not sure what it is. It's been explained several times.

 

What I do know is you can click the link and in the URL change ".../seek/cache_details.aspx?guid..." to ".../seek/log.aspx?guid..." That will take you to the log page. If it will accept the log I don't know. I always log on our family account which is PM.

 

Now since I cant see the page I have no idea if it has already been found so could I be FTF or is that the privilege of the first premium member to get it ?

The First Find simply is. It doesn't matter their status. A muggle can be FTF.

 

Finally what if there was a FTF prize in the cache ! should I take it or leave it ?

That's up to you.

 

For a short time I was putting custom letterbox-style stamps in all of the our caches. I would make a custom key chain with a FF logo and the image of the stamp on it. I was disappointed that the FTF sometimes would not take the prize because they were the first to find and no one that came after could rightfully claim that honor.

 

Then again, some folks are so hung up on what is FTF--before publishing or after, PM or no--you're bound to come across someone who doesn't like the way you play. You pretty much have to make that decision for yourself. If it were me, if I liked the FTF prize I'd take it. If I didn't I wouldn't wouldn't. Much like any other time I find a cache.

 

See, the FTF prize is the object that the first person to find the cache had the option of taking. It's his choice. I learned that from the custom FTF prizes. I can't force someone to take something. The best thing as a cacher owner is simply put a really nice item or two for first finder if he wants it and then let those who come after have what's left.

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But those who claim it does are conveniently overlooking the guideline that says that a GPS and set of published coordinates are required to hunt a cache. Pick and choose the rules you want to follow I guess.
As others have pointed out, the guidelines require only "the option of using accurate GPS coordinates". And frankly, most of us who find caches without a GPSr are using accurate GPS coordinates to find GZ. We just aren't using a GPSr to find the location that corresponds to those accurate GPS coordinates.
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Interesting post.......somewhat had a question in this area. A friend of mine recently decided to join this geocaching hobby and knew I was into it. After his first one cache attempt resulting in a DNF we had the opp to go out and make some of his first finds together. I made the list of caches we would go after and it never even crossed my mind that he was a BM and most of our finds were PM's. As a result he only got to log one find out of 6. He did sign the paper logs but we did not know there was a way for him to log the finds. I see now that there must be a way. So the question remains for me/us......is it right to do so?

He has stated that he will eventually become a PM if he decides he likes this hobby and I believe he will do just that if he does.

I have some hides myself and they are open to all because in my opinion it is up to the individual to make the choice of PM or BM. I will also say that in my opinion it is well worth the small donation to allow us to enjoy this inexpensive membership.

GT

Pipeline Putters

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So the question remains for me/us......is it right to do so?

I say it is right. The cache owner may think differently.

 

Here's my best advise. Cache owners make cache MOC for various reasons. It will depend on what's more important to the cache owner. Is the control more important than an appreciative finder writing nice log? Show your buddy how to log the MOC and start the log with "I found this with my PM buddy..." If the cache owner complains and deletes the log, shrug and move on.

 

Right now, there is 0% chance of your buddy having a log on that cache. Try logging it and your buddy will have a much better chance of having an online log on that cache. In other words, you won't know until you try.

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I am another that has been watching this thread with interest after a couple of PMO caches were placed near me. One was a very easy find without coordinates and the second one I teamed up with with a PM to search for.

Initially I wasn't going to log them and didn't even know it was possible for a BM to do this, but the general opinion here seemed to be if you sign the physical log then it's fair game and definately OK if you are part of a team.

I made sure the PM with me was mentioned in the log and insisted that they took the FTF prize. I was polite in the logs and thanked the CO for the new caches, both of which had obviously taken some time to plan and construct. Both logs have now been deleted without any explanation and while I can possibly see there is a valid reason for my solo one to be removed should I take the team one any further? (I assume the CO cannot delete the PM's log for teaming up with me).

At the end of the day I had fun, met up with another cacher and am now exactly where I expected to be without logs before I read the above so no big deal, but I just wonder why someone would take this action.

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I made sure the PM with me was mentioned in the log and insisted that they took the FTF prize. I was polite in the logs and thanked the CO for the new caches, both of which had obviously taken some time to plan and construct. Both logs have now been deleted without any explanation and while I can possibly see there is a valid reason for my solo one to be removed should I take the team one any further? (I assume the CO cannot delete the PM's log for teaming up with me).

Hmmm... Curious as to what TPTB have to say about this. You could write to contact@Groundspeak.com (I think) and get a clarification. As has been mentioned, the back door it there for a reason. It could have been closed, but they didn't do that. The guidelines do specifically say that a legitimate log can not be deleted for artificial reasons like failure to met additional requirements. I mean, you weren't rude, abusive, used foul language, posted a spoiler or deleted illegal activity on your part, right? I can't think of any other reason at the moment that be proper to delete your logs.

 

It would be interesting to push this just a little bit more to see where it goes.

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I made sure the PM with me was mentioned in the log and insisted that they took the FTF prize. I was polite in the logs and thanked the CO for the new caches, both of which had obviously taken some time to plan and construct. Both logs have now been deleted without any explanation and while I can possibly see there is a valid reason for my solo one to be removed should I take the team one any further? (I assume the CO cannot delete the PM's log for teaming up with me).

Hmmm... Curious as to what TPTB have to say about this. You could write to contact@Groundspeak.com (I think) and get a clarification. As has been mentioned, the back door it there for a reason. It could have been closed, but they didn't do that. The guidelines do specifically say that a legitimate log can not be deleted for artificial reasons like failure to met additional requirements. I mean, you weren't rude, abusive, used foul language, posted a spoiler or deleted illegal activity on your part, right? I can't think of any other reason at the moment that be proper to delete your logs.

 

It would be interesting to push this just a little bit more to see where it goes.

 

I'm not curious at all. I think they will re-instate the logs. :wub: That is exactly what you have to do Stanolli, write to contact@Groundspeak.com

 

Might take a few days, they're generally pretty busy.

 

And I'd forget about all this solo or with a premium member stuff. If a non member can log MOC's, a non member can log MOC's.

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I made sure the PM with me was mentioned in the log and insisted that they took the FTF prize. I was polite in the logs and thanked the CO for the new caches, both of which had obviously taken some time to plan and construct. Both logs have now been deleted without any explanation and while I can possibly see there is a valid reason for my solo one to be removed should I take the team one any further? (I assume the CO cannot delete the PM's log for teaming up with me).

Hmmm... Curious as to what TPTB have to say about this. You could write to contact@Groundspeak.com (I think) and get a clarification. As has been mentioned, the back door it there for a reason. It could have been closed, but they didn't do that. The guidelines do specifically say that a legitimate log can not be deleted for artificial reasons like failure to met additional requirements. I mean, you weren't rude, abusive, used foul language, posted a spoiler or deleted illegal activity on your part, right? I can't think of any other reason at the moment that be proper to delete your logs.

 

It would be interesting to push this just a little bit more to see where it goes.

 

I'm not curious at all. I think they will re-instate the logs. :wub: That is exactly what you have to do Stanolli, write to contact@Groundspeak.com

 

Might take a few days, they're generally pretty busy.

 

And I'd forget about all this solo or with a premium member stuff. If a non member can log MOC's, a non member can log MOC's.

Agreed
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I made sure the PM with me was mentioned in the log and insisted that they took the FTF prize. I was polite in the logs and thanked the CO for the new caches, both of which had obviously taken some time to plan and construct. Both logs have now been deleted without any explanation and while I can possibly see there is a valid reason for my solo one to be removed should I take the team one any further? (I assume the CO cannot delete the PM's log for teaming up with me).

Hmmm... Curious as to what TPTB have to say about this. You could write to contact@Groundspeak.com (I think) and get a clarification. As has been mentioned, the back door it there for a reason. It could have been closed, but they didn't do that. The guidelines do specifically say that a legitimate log can not be deleted for artificial reasons like failure to met additional requirements. I mean, you weren't rude, abusive, used foul language, posted a spoiler or deleted illegal activity on your part, right? I can't think of any other reason at the moment that be proper to delete your logs.

 

It would be interesting to push this just a little bit more to see where it goes.

 

I'm not curious at all. I think they will re-instate the logs. :wub: That is exactly what you have to do Stanolli, write to contact@Groundspeak.com

 

Might take a few days, they're generally pretty busy.

 

And I'd forget about all this solo or with a premium member stuff. If a non member can log MOC's, a non member can log MOC's.

Agreed

 

I have to agree, I would like to see this pursued further. If not to clarify the 'backdoor" policy, at least to provide a "reference case".

 

I posted earlier in the thread, hypothesizing about the reasons CO's make their caches PM only, that if they really wanted logs from PM's only, they could make their cache a "challenge". But this would imply listing it as a Mystery/Puzzle and subject it to the "frequent filtering" of these in PQ's.

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