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Half burried 5 gallon bucket


Scuba4jews

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :P

Edited by Scuba4jews
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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinging is burring it about 2/3 of the way, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :P

 

The guidelines say that digging isn't allowed

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinging is burring it about 2/3 of the way, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :P

 

The guidelines say that digging isn't allowed

Bingo!

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While you are considering the placement of your cache, please, please be sure that you read and REALLY understand the Cache Listing Requirements/Guidelines.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx

Off-Limit (Physical) Caches

Caches may be quickly archived if we see the following (which is not exhaustive):

* Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate.

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :P

Comment:

 

Sometimes you just shouldn't ask. :lol::):D

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Funny... somebody else had the same idea once. Probably a good thing that it didn't continue, though. :P

 

 

 

: Dave (news2yousNOneSPAM@hotmail.com.invalid)

Subject: The Great American GPS Stash Hunt !

Newsgroups: sci.geo.satellite-nav

Date: 2000/05/03

 

--

The Great American GPS Stash Hunt !!

--

 

Now that SA is off we can start a worldwide Stash Game!! With

Non-SA accuracy it should be easy to find a stash from waypoint

information. Waypoints of secret stashes could be shared on the

Internet, people could navigate to the stashes and get some

stuff. The only rule for stashes is: Get some Stuff, Leave some

Stuff!! The more valuable the stuff the more stashes will be

started.

 

I'm thinking of half burying a five gallon plastic bucket with

lid at the stash point. Putting in some stuff. Adding a logbook

and pencil so visitors can record their find. The log should

contain: Date, Time, What you got, and What you put in. Scanning

the log book should give you a quick inventory of the stash.

 

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :P

Comment:

 

Sometimes you just shouldn't ask. :lol::):D

 

Or sometimes it wasn't the best idea, anyway. There are other ways to camouflage a big bucket. I think that coming up with a more creative solution would be much more fun for you and the finders.

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Funny... somebody else had the same idea once. Probably a good thing that it didn't continue, though. :P

 

 

 

: Dave (news2yousNOneSPAM@hotmail.com.invalid)

Subject: The Great American GPS Stash Hunt !

Newsgroups: sci.geo.satellite-nav

Date: 2000/05/03

 

--

The Great American GPS Stash Hunt !!

--

 

Now that SA is off we can start a worldwide Stash Game!! With

Non-SA accuracy it should be easy to find a stash from waypoint

information. Waypoints of secret stashes could be shared on the

Internet, people could navigate to the stashes and get some

stuff. The only rule for stashes is: Get some Stuff, Leave some

Stuff!! The more valuable the stuff the more stashes will be

started.

 

I'm thinking of half burying a five gallon plastic bucket with

lid at the stash point. Putting in some stuff. Adding a logbook

and pencil so visitors can record their find. The log should

contain: Date, Time, What you got, and What you put in. Scanning

the log book should give you a quick inventory of the stash.

 

 

And the times they are a changing.

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Since this came up as a duplicate post, I will add that i think you should become more of an experienced urban cacher prior to placing caches in NYC.

Heck, I have been caching for 3 years and still arouse suspicion whilst caching. Get some more finds under your belt, (3 to date) so you can learn the art of cache placement.

I say this in the kindest way possible as I saw at least one of your new hides coming under issue very quickly after publishing. It happened to me, too. Twice!

Rule of thumb for urban caches....keep it micro or small AND CLEARLY LABELED. Anything else will just raise suspicion.

Edited by buttaskotch
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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :P

Comment:

 

Sometimes you just shouldn't ask. :lol:B):D

 

Or sometimes it wasn't the best idea, anyway. There are other ways to camouflage a big bucket. I think that coming up with a more creative solution would be much more fun for you and the finders.

 

Yes, I suppose that you are correct. Good luck and let us know when you've gotten that puppy published. It's gonna be really interesting seeing the logs that are posted. :)

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Something that I have wondered about in the past.

 

What do you suppose is the reasoning behind the no digging with pointy things and related points? :P

 

"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."

 

Why not stop after the word, "buried"?

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Something that I have wondered about in the past.

What do you suppose is the reasoning behind the no digging with pointy things and related points? :P

"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."

Why not stop after the word, "buried"?

I'd guess to more clearly define the intent. A cache can be "buried" in leaves, for example. It can (from what I understand) be buried in, say, sand.
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Something that I have wondered about in the past.

What do you suppose is the reasoning behind the no digging with pointy things and related points? :P

"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."

Why not stop after the word, "buried"?

I'd guess to more clearly define the intent. A cache can be "buried" in leaves, for example. It can (from what I understand) be buried in, say, sand.

 

That is my understanding as well. If you place a cache in a pre-existing hole and cover it with leaves many would call it buried but it would still be allowed under the guidelines.

I found a five gallon bucket cache once convincingly camo'ed to look like a stump, had been in place a few years and you still had to grab it to tell it wasn't a real stump. May not work in Brooklyn but it was great in the Forest. Find a similar camo for your area.

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Something that I have wondered about in the past.

What do you suppose is the reasoning behind the no digging with pointy things and related points? :lol:

"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."

Why not stop after the word, "buried"?

I'd guess to more clearly define the intent. A cache can be "buried" in leaves, for example. It can (from what I understand) be buried in, say, sand.

 

Or snow :P

 

I would think the wording is just for cases such as this thread. Someone could reason that since the cache wasn't totally buried, it didn't violate the guidelines.

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I interpret the no burial guideline to mean, Leave No Trace.

To be its not disturbing the local environment. I feel we should always be careful of not disturbing the fauna off trails. Too many times you can see the tell tale signs of cachers scouring GZ areas, displaced rocks, pulled up or trampled vegetation.

By digging away we are hurting the environment. Turning the dirt through a root network, disturbing the insects nesting does disturb the micro environment. So I try whenever I can to practice miniminal bushwacking (not always easy) and "lift, look, replace" Sounds like a line from hiding LPCs but we should do the same in our parks.

I still think its a very bad idea to hide a cache of that size in NYC, unless explicit permission is attained, but even that may not have the police being called out to the cache. Hello MICROWAVE in the TREE HOLLOW incident! Geez, and that wasn't in a big city like this!

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache,

Any thought or comments?

 

Comments:

1. Why not run your plan by your reviewer, before you take it to the forum

2. Why not run it by your local club, there is a club in NYC, there is also LIGO

3. Why not listen to buttaskotch, who is a NYC Cacher with history, or someone like macatac , East village Familiy who have common sense by the 5 Gallon Bucket load.

4. And maybe consider that this plan or desire is not workable and move on to something that is.

Edited by Packanack
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Something that I have wondered about in the past.

What do you suppose is the reasoning behind the no digging with pointy things and related points? :P

"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."

Why not stop after the word, "buried"?

I'd guess to more clearly define the intent. A cache can be "buried" in leaves, for example. It can (from what I understand) be buried in, say, sand.

 

Oh, I see, "buried" is what we around these parts call, "covered." And as I have seen others proffer, you can dig a hole with your hands, then it is ok.

 

The few "buried" caches that I have encountered were neither "covered" by leaves nor did they appear to have been "dug" by hand. But of course, if a person were to be able to not bury a cache by digging a hole with a non-pointy device, then back fill the non-hole with the dirt that came from the non-hole and after a few rains, that geocache in that former non-hole would, in all likelihood, look exactly like a geocache buried in a real hole dug by a real pointy type digging device.

 

In my opinion, if it is really true that a hider can be within guideline by claiming that an otherwise pointy device created hole was in fact a result of digging with one's hands, then any given geocache that is buried, is within guideline.

 

Presumably those geocaches that are referred to in here that are "buried" in an already existing hole, are just sitting all neeked like, not back filled.

 

And just to be clear, I understand that the OP has focused on a 5 gallon bucket, this rant does not presume any particular size because the guideline does not seem to presume any particular size.

 

Are those little hand held boy scout type axes, are they considered to be pointy digging devices?

 

Am I the only one who sees the silliness of this?

Edited by Team Cotati
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I interpret the no burial guideline to mean, Leave No Trace.

To be its not disturbing the local environment. I feel we should always be careful of not disturbing the fauna off trails. Too many times you can see the tell tale signs of cachers scouring GZ areas, displaced rocks, pulled up or trampled vegetation.

By digging away we are hurting the environment. Turning the dirt through a root network, disturbing the insects nesting does disturb the micro environment. So I try whenever I can to practice miniminal bushwacking (not always easy) and "lift, look, replace" Sounds like a line from hiding LPCs but we should do the same in our parks.

I still think its a very bad idea to hide a cache of that size in NYC, unless explicit permission is attained, but even that may not have the police being called out to the cache. Hello MICROWAVE in the TREE HOLLOW incident! Geez, and that wasn't in a big city like this!

 

"Too many times you can see the tell tale signs of cachers scouring GZ areas, displaced rocks, pulled up or trampled vegetation."

 

Yes, we all see that. Unfortunately if you listen to the 'sages' in these forums, you'd have to have two video cameras, one infrared and one regular type, running 24/7 focused upon the cache area in order to be able to presume that what lots of us presume. That being that trampled vegetation and displaced rocks and off trail rompings, that "just happen" to lead to a geocache or its immediate surroundings, were in fact the result of human type geocachers causing negative impact.

Edited by Team Cotati
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Having seen a few (very few) caches that were apparently "buried" in pre-existing holes with no digging required, I always wondered if owners of such caches find themselves constantly defending the placement of their cache?

 

Never mind the fact that a land owner or official will only see something that was buried, and that is the impression they will walk away with.

 

That said, I once saw a cache made from a twelve gallon Rubbermaid container out in the woods. It wasn't buried, but it was, ahh, lets say concealed... I never thought I'd have to actually search for something that big.

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Something I've always wondered about is this: Would such a cache be allowed if it was on your own property? I understand that burying anything in a park or elsewhere is a rather invasive thing that could cause damage to property, which I would assume is the reason for that guideline, but what about on land that you personally own?

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This question was bound to surface sooner or later in this thread. Yes, you can hide it like that on your own property. Not that it is a good idea. People will find it, like it, and copy it. Then we see a "Why won't they publish my cache thread". The problem being that by the time we see that thread the damage is already done. There is a hole in dug a park with a cache in it.

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This question was bound to surface sooner or later in this thread. Yes, you can hide it like that on your own property. Not that it is a good idea. People will find it, like it, and copy it. Then we see a "Why won't they publish my cache thread". The problem being that by the time we see that thread the damage is already done. There is a hole in dug a park with a cache in it.

 

Yes I can see the whole `monkey see monkey do' angle there. I happen to have a cache on property I own, but it is not buried. Years ago though, long before I was a geocacher, I buried a cooler on my property. To be quite frank I used it to store beer before I was of legal drinking age, we had a little camp site back there when at the time my uncle owned the land (I own it now). It's buried up to the lid with leaves and such on top of it. I always though it wouldn't be a bad geocache (it's still there), but I wound up placing a cache in the corner of my property near a somewhat more interesting old foundation because the guidelines pretty much state no digging.

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Well, that takes out those fake sprinklers that are all half-buried, unless there's a convenient gopher hole to put it in.

 

While I would agree that those should fall into the buried cache category it has been stated that if you can "step" them into wet ground then they good to go.

 

I believe pushing something into the ground like a stake is not considered the be the same thing as digging.

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :)

 

It's better to beg forgiveness than ask for permission. :)

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Well, that takes out those fake sprinklers that are all half-buried, unless there's a convenient gopher hole to put it in.

 

While I would agree that those should fall into the buried cache category it has been stated that if you can "step" them into wet ground then they good to go.

 

I believe pushing something into the ground like a stake is not considered the be the same thing as digging.

 

Yes, I quite agree. Driving or 'pushing' a stake into the ground does not require that a hole exist prior to the push event. I can picture in my mind's eye, from waaaayyyyy back in my Boy Scout days watching guys put up tents using stakes driven into the ground and then seeing guys dig holes for reasons that modesty prevents me from mentioning. Thus I can confirm that digging and stake driving and or pushing are two vastly different things.

 

As a reminder, once you have managed to get those stakes into the ground, don't remove them unless you plan on filing in the hole that might result. Also, I don't recall there being a guideline that prevents the use of a hammer so it is probably ok to use one to get stakes into the ground.

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :)

 

It's better to beg forgiveness than ask for permission. :)

 

No, it's just easier and cowardly.

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Go to Lowes, buy a dozen bags of soil, a half dozen bags of river rock, and a box of grass seed.

Place bucket on the ground.

Surround with rocks.

Cover rocks with soil.

Spread grass seed on soil.

Water.

Soon you will have a hidden 5gal bucket without digging.

 

</sarcasm>

Edit: After what happened in Ohio, I better make sure to include my sarcasm tag.

Edited by bramasoleiowa
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Comments:

1. Why not run your plan by your reviewer, before you take it to the forum

 

 

Huh.

 

I would venture that putting it out for community discussion, before making one of the volunteer reviewers make the call makes sense, personally. Isn't that what discussion forums are usually for?

Edited by maggi101
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Go to Lowes, buy a dozen bags of soil, a half dozen bags of river rock, and a box of grass seed.

Place bucket on the ground.

Surround with rocks.

Cover rocks with soil.

Spread grass seed on soil.

Water.

Soon you will have a hidden 5gal bucket without digging.

 

</sarcasm>

Edit: After what happened in Ohio, I better make sure to include my sarcasm tag.

 

Better yet, drag several 55 gallon drums out to the area to collect rainwater. Wait several months until they are full. Construct a 5 foot long pointy cone preferably out of hardwood or steel and attach it to the bottom of the bucket. Empty all of the drums of water at ground zero and simply press the cache into the ground with the help of a local sumo wrestling team. Presto! :).

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the first few geocaches were done in this fashion, I'm confused how this wouldn't be allowed either. Hell, I've seen more than a few caches that are "dug" into the ground. I honestly think you would be fine, especially if you don't use a pointy object, use your hands and you would be fine :)

 

Excellent point no pointy object also instead of digging you could be scarping a depression. I think your fine assuming you have permission by the owner/land manager to actually "scrape a depression with a non-pointy item". With a third above ground it allows cachers easy access to the log and doesn't require any more excessive searching to the area than an ammo can.

 

Besdies how is this really different than covering a cache with rocks in a talus pile?

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Something that I have wondered about in the past.

What do you suppose is the reasoning behind the no digging with pointy things and related points? :)

"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."

Why not stop after the word, "buried"?

I'd guess to more clearly define the intent. A cache can be "buried" in leaves, for example. It can (from what I understand) be buried in, say, sand.

 

Oh, I see, "buried" is what we around these parts call, "covered." And as I have seen others proffer, you can dig a hole with your hands, then it is ok.

 

The few "buried" caches that I have encountered were neither "covered" by leaves nor did they appear to have been "dug" by hand. But of course, if a person were to be able to not bury a cache by digging a hole with a non-pointy device, then back fill the non-hole with the dirt that came from the non-hole and after a few rains, that geocache in that former non-hole would, in all likelihood, look exactly like a geocache buried in a real hole dug by a real pointy type digging device.

 

In my opinion, if it is really true that a hider can be within guideline by claiming that an otherwise pointy device created hole was in fact a result of digging with one's hands, then any given geocache that is buried, is within guideline.

 

Presumably those geocaches that are referred to in here that are "buried" in an already existing hole, are just sitting all neeked like, not back filled.

 

And just to be clear, I understand that the OP has focused on a 5 gallon bucket, this rant does not presume any particular size because the guideline does not seem to presume any particular size.

 

Are those little hand held boy scout type axes, are they considered to be pointy digging devices?

 

Am I the only one who sees the silliness of this?

 

Yes, I trust that you are the only one that sees the silliness of this. People HAVE asked before about "burying" caches in sand, or caches "buried" in the rotting wood of stumps or under leaves. That is why I said that. I didn't make those things up.

 

What "rant" are you referring to, btw? Your own? And what do YOU think about those Boy Scout shovels? Do you think that maybe they are shovels, and that the point on the end might be a pointy object? Good grief!

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :)

It's better to beg forgiveness than ask for permission. :)

No, it's just easier and cowardly.
And sometimes more practical.
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what if the land owner had dug the hole, left it and the cache placer accidently stumbled across it finding that it held the cache container upright (so it doesnt fall over) and is 50% visable till sticks and other resources are placed over it. just something this thread has made me wonder :)

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what if the land owner had dug the hole, left it and the cache placer accidently stumbled across it finding that it held the cache container upright (so it doesnt fall over) and is 50% visable till sticks and other resources are placed over it. just something this thread has made me wonder :)

 

There is nothing in the guidelines that prohibit using an existing hole to hide a cache.

 

What if you use a pressure washer to dig the hole? What if the cache owner doesn't dig the hole, but his non geocaching friend does it for him? What if I use a golf club to dig the hole, it isn't "pointy"? What if I scoop out the hole with my hands?

 

There are all kinds of "what ifs". They can easily be answered when you consider the reason for the rule. Most land managers don't want people digging up their parks. The perception that geocaches are buried made the sport a hard sell to many land managers in the early years. Geocachers have made an effort to educate land managers regarding this and it is part of the reason that geocaching has been gaining acceptance over the years.

 

The only "what if" you should ask is "What if the park superintendent visited this cache?"

Edited by briansnat
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There are all kinds of "what ifs". They can easily be answered when you consider the reason for the rule. Most land managers don't want people digging up their parks. The perception that geocaches are buried made the sport a had sell to many land managers in the early years. Geocachers have made an effort to educate land managers regarding this and it is part of the reason that geocaching has been gaining acceptance over the years.

 

The only "what if" you should ask is "What if the park superintendent visited this cache?"

Even for caches that might be buried with permission of the property owner, it's also good to consider the world beyond the cache in question. One issue is that if cachers (especially those just learning the game) learn that some containers may be buried, they may try digging for other caches (especially if the hide is tricky or the cache is missing).

 

An advantage to a system-wide policy against buried caches is that we can confidently tell new cachers that no matter where you are, who hid the cache or what you may or may not know about the land use policy - no matter what - the cache is *not* buried so *please* don't dig.

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I would like to set a 5 gallon bucket out as a cache, but it's size makes it to obviouse in the child friendly locationI have in mind, and anything smaller would not fit the swag I have in mind either. What I am thinking is having it2/3 of the way buried, leaving about 3 -4 inches uf it above ground. Any thought or comments? :)

 

It's better to beg forgiveness than ask for permission. :)

 

It is not better to mislead your reviewer if you hope to continue publishing new caches.

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Thank you all for your opinions and comments, this cache will be placed in conjunction with the rangers and park supervisor this spring. At that point we will decide on the final container choice, an ammo can or a bucket. We were thinking about the bucket because of the amount of swag it can hold based on our theme.. TBA. If we choose a bucket, we will just have to find a way to camo it well, unburied.

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