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are caches meant to be found?


va griz

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PLEASE, lets not let this thread drift over into a rehash of the "other" thread about a cache archived after years of DNFs.

 

My question is about caches that are so tough that they may take large numbers of cachers many attempts to find. Apparently (I'm going on info from local cachers on the other side of the country) some hiders make a nano NIH hide and even throw out washers to thwart metal detectors. I just don't get it. Is that really the object, to make an unfindable cache? To me it's not a cache if I can't have another cacher find it.

 

By the way, I'm not trying to get any policy changed or outlaw caches with more than X number of DNFs. I guess I'm just saying they aren't for me. What do you think?

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PLEASE, lets not let this thread drift over into a rehash of the "other" thread about a cache archived after years of DNFs.

 

My question is about caches that are so tough that they may take large numbers of cachers many attempts to find. Apparently (I'm going on info from local cachers on the other side of the country) some hiders make a nano NIH hide and even throw out washers to thwart metal detectors. I just don't get it. Is that really the object, to make an unfindable cache? To me it's not a cache if I can't have another cacher find it.

 

By the way, I'm not trying to get any policy changed or outlaw caches with more than X number of DNFs. I guess I'm just saying they aren't for me. What do you think?

 

Some caches are meant to be very easy and some are meant to be very hard. That is why the difficulty scale runs from 1 (found in 15 minutes or less) to 5 (may take many hours and several trips)

 

That being said sometimes when a hider can't think of a creative way to hide a 5 difficulty cache they stoop to using the needle in a haystack type hide. Nano caches are the easiest way to do this and IMHO one of the lamest hide types in existence. Now if you can hide a regular size cache that takes me many hours to find you have my appreciation.

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Some caches are meant to be very easy and some are meant to be very hard. That is why the difficulty scale runs from 1 (found in 15 minutes or less) to 5 (may take many hours and several trips)

 

That being said sometimes when a hider can't think of a creative way to hide a 5 difficulty cache they stoop to using the needle in a haystack type hide. Nano caches are the easiest way to do this and IMHO one of the lamest hide types in existence. Now if you can hide a regular size cache that takes me many hours to find you have my appreciation.

What he said.

 

All of my caches but three are ammo cans stocked mostly with kid-friendly stuff.

 

One is a keyholder way high on a leg of a billboard, the cacher has to McGyver a tool to reach up about 12' to slide it down. It gets a lot of DNF logs because people don't think about looking up that high.

 

One is a film can in a rock wall at a historical site. It's easy to find because the property owner likes cachers, if he sees that you aren't finding it he'll come out and give you hints.

 

The third is what I call an evil micro... in fact that's what I named it, Rambler's Evil Micro (still active since 2003 but I adopted it out). It's a film can inserted into the bottom of a piece of driftwood dropped at random on the ground under sticker bushes in the forest. It looks just like all the other roots and sticks lying on the forest floor. Evil. Wicked hard to find, then just as hard to retrieve without getting chewed up by thorns. I hid it that way on Christmas Day in 2003 for a certain finder, planning to take it down because it really isn't my kind of hide, but it's been so well-received and so many people have posted great logs about it (despite most folks DNFing it their first few attempts) that I have left it active. However, I hate DNFs, so the fact that it is an evil hide is made plain in the title and description and my phone number is in the description so if folks want a clue (or even a give-away) they can call me. Frustrating those who can't find it and don't want to look any longer would not be fun for me.

 

So yes, while I want most of my hides to be fairly easy for families to find, sometimes it is fun to hide an evil one that takes some serious hunting.

Edited by TheAlabamaRambler
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That being said sometimes when a hider can't think of a creative way to hide a 5 difficulty cache they stoop to using the needle in a haystack type hide. Nano caches are the easiest way to do this and IMHO one of the lamest hide types in existence. Now if you can hide a regular size cache that takes me many hours to find you have my appreciation.

 

I ran into this same thing and share your opinion about nanos. On one multi/mystery cache I was able to solve the hard "mental" part at the beginning and was stuck near the end when attempting find a nano in a large clump of bushes. Phooey.....just walked away and never looked back. Even after spending several hours wrapped up in the solutions and two trips to the cache.

 

The hider had done an excellent job building an interesting/fun cache and ruined it with the nano stage.

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As long as the cache is there it can be as difficult to find as the CO wants to make it.

 

Agree. But personally, it seems really easy to hide a nano that's very hard to find. It seems so easy to hide a cache like that I'm not sure what pleasure the CO gets from it (although obviously many do). If someone is going to hide a cache with the intent of making it hard to find, the use of a large cache seems more intriguing.

 

Bean

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Our very first hide (a 50 cal ammo can) is meant to be found. I even show a picture of the bush it's behind. Because the area nearby is a nice place to visit at certain times of the year, I want people to stop by and see it. It's also right off the freeway, not to far from the exit to the APE cache here in Washington State. So after a day of hiking this one is an easy park and grab.

 

We also have a couple of other hides (also ammo cans) that are camouflaged and are much harder to find. One of our other hides is a larger size hide-a-key and many have written us asking for hints since it's hidden in such a way that you will either find it right a way or it will take a long time to find.

 

We are working on a few other hides that if you know what you are looking for it should be no problem, otherwise you may never find it. One will be a bison and the other will be a 20 oz. lock-n-lock.

 

It takes time and work to make a good hide, and there are some cachers that just want to take the easy way out and go with the NIH (lame). Some think that if you can't find it, they win and they're smarter than you (very lame). With that being said, I've seen some nanos hidden so well and in a way that you might see it but not realize what you are looking at. They were not NIH but they looked like they should be there. And there is one that is hidden in the shadows, so unless you look very close you will pass right over it.

 

So to answer your question, yes some caches are meant to be found, others you will have to work and when you find them it will be very exciting and will want others to look for it also. But there are a few that are no fun to look for and there's very little joy when they are found and those are mostly NIH.

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Sometime a cache is hard to find by accident.

 

I have a gold-painted ammo can out (Trussville Civitan, the first cache in Alabama) that was a milestone award by my local caching association for my 2K find.

 

I meant for it to be an easy find so I didn't camo it or cover it with sticks.

 

I stuck it under some brush and logs but it's clearly visible if you are near ground zero. Because it is gold it matches the leaves and logs and a lot of people can't find it even though they are looking right at it! :D

 

I've literally had cachers call me from the site, describe where they are, and had to tell them "look down between your feet!" :laughing:

Edited by TheAlabamaRambler
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I can only speak for myself....my caches ARE meant to be found. I hope most all of mine are much more about the location than the cache itself.

 

You are also speaking here for me. I'm not into 'numbers' or knotches on my belt. I am into the experience and seeing the new places and meeting people. Anything more, is too oddly competative for a fun hobby like GCing in my disappearing valuable leisure-time.

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As long as the cache is there it can be as difficult to find as the CO wants to make it.

 

Agree. But personally, it seems really easy to hide a nano that's very hard to find. It seems so easy to hide a cache like that I'm not sure what pleasure the CO gets from it (although obviously many do). If someone is going to hide a cache with the intent of making it hard to find, the use of a large cache seems more intriguing.

 

Bean

 

I have no idea what the attraction is from either the hiders or finders point of view. It certainly isn't my idea of fun. Many do seem to enjoy them though so I guess they have there place.

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I'll use my "Where's the elevator" cache as an example. Simple hide, took us all of 5 minutes with getting the coords, but I've seen some really experienced cachers DNF, I've had to help more people on this one than most other hides! It's a regular sized L&L hidden almost in plain sight and you don't even have to leave the trail to make the find! I didn't even think it would be a hard one, I thought it might maybe fool some for a few seconds, but anyone could find it...boy was I wrong!

 

I hide my caches to be found, but not so easy that they are no fun. If you can't find any of mine, I am more than happy to give a clue or even meet you at the cache and walk you through it.

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I'll use my "Where's the elevator" cache as an example. Simple hide, took us all of 5 minutes with getting the coords, but I've seen some really experienced cachers DNF, I've had to help more people on this one than most other hides! It's a regular sized L&L hidden almost in plain sight and you don't even have to leave the trail to make the find! I didn't even think it would be a hard one, I thought it might maybe fool some for a few seconds, but anyone could find it...boy was I wrong!

 

I hide my caches to be found, but not so easy that they are no fun. If you can't find any of mine, I am more than happy to give a clue or even meet you at the cache and walk you through it.

[/quote

I also hide my caches with the view that they are to be found, but I also try to make them fun, especially the multis, and it can be a fine balancing act sometimes so that they don't fall into the hands of muggles. I don't give out extra clues for the FTF ers, they have to take their chances with everyone else. Sometimes it is hard to think of every possiblility when setting up multis, I recently had a FTFer shortcut one of mine by using the spoilers to miss out the first 2 wpts,I think he was running on a tight schedule and not prepared to spend long looking. A great pity as he missed out on some fun!

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It seems that the idea of hiding caches with intent of fooling geocachers is on the increase. Some cache owners apparently look at DNFs as some sort of badge of honor. Good for them.

 

My caches are meant to be found and when I see DNFs on them I feel like I screwed up somehow.

 

I also want my caches to be found and (with one exception) consider a dnf to be more my failure than the person who looked for it. My basic rule of thumb is that the longer the hike, the more the cache should be able to be found. However I do remember one of yours that I went in circles trying to find, only to get it after reading the description again and noticing that it was a micro. So I am glad I did not cause you grief.

 

In many ways it's easier to place a cache that would be hard to find, but I like caches that take to places where I would want to visit even without a cache. The journey is more important than the search. But some caches do not seem meant to be found and remain unfound to this day. Those are the easy ones. They go straight to my ignore list.

Edited by Erickson
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I like a challenge. I go for the occasional puzzle, but since many are far more devious than I can handle, some never get found.

 

But I do tend to go for the caches with higher difficulty/terrain ratings. I just don't enjoy the 1/1 enormous ammo boxes you don't even have to leave pavement for.

 

To be fair, I don't much care for NIH hides, so I ignore a great many micros and others. I found a tricky multi today with a pretty high difficulty/terrain. There was a good amount of hiking involved with this one, as well as tons of thorns, mosquitoes, and ticks. It was a challenge, and I like that.

 

Considering my own caching preferences, I always look to hide the sorts of caches I like to find! I'm planning one with two possible approaches...neither of which will be easy. I will expect DNF's to outnumber finds, since I expect the finders to visit more than once. I still want folks to be able to find it, but I want to offer them a solid challenge.

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Hate needle in a haystack types, with one exception. For some reason, a micro (not a nano) hidden somewhere in a metal object is fun for me. Challenging hides have their place and can be fun when you can find it with some effort, and it isnt just a matter of dumb luck.

 

All my hides are meant to be fun, whether they take you to fun places, or are set up to give you a laugh. Some succeed more than others, but I think our caches do fairly well at providing a worthwhile caching experience.

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Ok... imho... caches are meant to be found. If it's not found, then it's really not fun, is it? And doesn't it defeat the purpose of the game? If everyone hid impossible to find caches, then no one would find any. Simple as that.

 

It's hide and seek. When you hid, and couldn't be found, well, for me at least, it got really old after a while. You want to be found, you just want it to take a bit of searching. Same idea... right?

 

That does not mean I want to walk up to 100 lampskirts and pull 100 finds. That is not neccessarily fun either. There's a time and place for those easy ones (when my kids are caching with me, or when I just need a quick fix between harder ones.) However, we find that caching is more rewarding if you have to work for it. There is a series of caches in our neck of the woods that are infuriating. Multis, puzzles and just darn tricky... but when we finished the first one we felt extremely proud. They're findable... maybe less than 20 have put in the effort... but like I said, immensely rewarding.

 

We value the creativity of a hide most. Give us something unique and interesting even if it takes me multiple trips to get it... we may not be quick, but we are darn persistent! We plan to hide some soon... and want to go for the creative rather than the simple. Multi's or series where some of the first ones are easier hides is fine with me... because it still is part of something bigger and more challenging, hopefully. We find we like the challenge better. The challenging hides are the ones our group of cachers will still be talking about a year later.

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I can only speak for myself....my caches ARE meant to be found. I hope most all of mine are much more about the location than the cache itself.

 

You are also speaking here for me. I'm not into 'numbers' or knotches on my belt. I am into the experience and seeing the new places and meeting people. Anything more, is too oddly competative for a fun hobby like GCing in my disappearing valuable leisure-time.

You sound like you might enjoy Waymarking. Waymarking takes to to see new and interesting places and you don't have worry about finding something there or whether it has gone missing or muggled (at least in most cases). In general there are no logs to signed and all you need to do is to take a picture (and sometimes not even that). Now some people look at the Waymarking site and see categories for Starbucks and McDonalds and say "That isn't the kind of new and interesting place that I am interested in visiting". The cool thing about Waymarking is that you can select which categories you are interested in and just look for those waymarks.

 

Back on topic. Geocaches are meant to be found. But they are meant to be found by geocachers and not by muggles. So most geocaches are hidden or camouflaged to prevent muggles from finding them. But Geocachers have varied reasons to play the game. Some like the places that geocaches take them and prefer that the caches all be easy to find. Others care less about where the cache takes them and instead enjoy the hunt for the cache. In particular a clever hide that they haven't seen before will give them the aha! moment when they realize that there is the cache in plain sight. I'm am sure that there are even some who find a needle-in-the-haystack hide challenging. I've found some where I had to go back several times till I got lucky and picked the right fake rock. But the feeling of satisfaction make all the previous trips worth it.

 

What I don't comprehend are the hiders who take it as a challenge to hide a cache no one can find or a puzzle no one can solve. I've no object to making the hide or a puzzle extremely difficult. But when you see people are having trouble you've got to think about offering hints. If you are not hiding caches that are meant to be found I don't think you are contributing to anyone's enjoyment of the game. If you are hiding cache that are just very difficult, I suspect you will find plenty of geocachers that will enjoy this.

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Looks like I'm with the majority that doen't mind a difficult one if it's "good". Good seems to vary from one cacher to the next, but like several others I like one that is in plain sight but well hidden from muggles. I remember one micro in the woods that took me two trips. It was a piece of wood on a stump, but somehow wasn't a needle in a haystack. Just perfect camo in the most obvious spot at GZ.

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Yes needle/haystack hides drive me nuts too. But that said, I don't necessarily agree that the size of the container is the sole determining factor in the "quality" of a difficult hide.

 

If I go on a search for a 4-5 star hide and the end result is a nano that is constructed or camo'd in a high quality way (e.g. hidden in a stick with a piece of roughed up cork to hide the hole), I think that's perfectly acceptable and worthy of pursuit.

 

Would I want to look for that same stick in a thigh-high pile of sticks? Heck no. :unsure:

Edited by daschpeeg
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Yes. Sometimes that takes more effort and/or skills. If the seeker doesn't put forth the required effort relative to difficulty or doesn't have the skill-set, then them's the breaks.

 

Conversely, a CO should be conscious of the fact that harder caches may not receive as many visits as easier caches.

 

It seems that the idea of hiding caches with intent of fooling geocachers is on the increase. Some cache owners apparently look at DNFs as some sort of badge of honor. Good for them.

 

As long as the cache is rated appropriately, I don't really fault the hider.

Edited by Castle Mischief
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It would appear that they had better be found....

 

Did you not read the very first sentence? :unsure:

 

Just stated the facts as I see them, my friend.

 

You are very quickly losing the right to call me my friend. okay?

 

Let me see if I can find the right words.... :unsure::unsure::unsure: Nope those will have to suffice. Is this what happens when someone disagrees with you?

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What I don't comprehend are the hiders who take it as a challenge to hide a cache no one can find or a puzzle no one can solve.

We've debated that one a good bit on our local forum. Frodo13 creates EVIL puzzle caches that take solid work to solve and will not give clues. Some among us really hate that, others admire that he can defeat most of us with his puzzles, making it a real badge of honor to find them. When someone does find one it gets trumpeted in the forum and congratulations flow!

 

So I see both sides of it. I haven't found but one of his, and I've given up trying on the others (I even recruited my ham radio club, some pretty smart fellers, to help me with SpiderFish. (We DNFed it!)) but I appreciate his effort and admire those with the tenacity and brain-power to find them.

Edited by TheAlabamaRambler
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What I don't comprehend are the hiders who take it as a challenge to hide a cache no one can find or a puzzle no one can solve.

We've debated that one a good bit on our local forum. Frodo13 creates EVIL puzzle caches that take solid work to solve and will not give clues. Some among us really hate that, others admire that he can defeat most of us with his puzzles, making them a real bafge of honor to find them. When someone does find one it gets trumpeted in the forum and congratulations flow!

 

So I see both sides of it. I haven't found but one of his, and I've given up trying on the others (I even recruited my ham radio club, some pretty smart fellers, to help me with SpiderFish. (We DNFed it!)) but I appreciate his effort and admire those with the tenacity and brain-power to find them.

 

I have to hand it to anyone who can solve puzzles, my mind doesn't work like that (well, OK, the hard puzzles at least)...they go on my ignore list fast.

 

I love a physical challenge and tend to enjoy the tree climbing, mountain climbing and the sort. A kayak cache which has a tough hide is good too. Sometimes, just the spot is enough to make me happy, but most times, I hate getting to the end of a long walk and finding an obvious location...that really dampens my high spirits.

 

It's kind of like climbing a mountain and then finding a herd of people at the top, their tour bus sitting in a parking lot. Sure, I enjoyed the climb and did it my way, but the thrill of doing what many others is shot down the drain...

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It would appear that they had better be found....

 

Did you not read the very first sentence? :unsure:

 

Just stated the facts as I see them, my friend.

 

You are very quickly losing the right to call me my friend. okay?

 

Let me see if I can find the right words.... :unsure::unsure::unsure: Nope those will have to suffice. Is this what happens when someone disagrees with you?

 

Taking it to PM.

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It would appear that they had better be found....
Did you not read the very first sentence? :unsure:
Just stated the facts as I see them, my friend.
You are very quickly losing the right to call me my friend. okay?
Let me see if I can find the right words.... :unsure::unsure::unsure: Nope those will have to suffice. Is this what happens when someone disagrees with you?
Jeez Roddy, do you have to do this in EVERY thread?

 

On topic: I think caches were placed to be found in the beginning of the game, but as time went on and the game got more popular caches were "hidden" to be found instead of just "placed" to be found.

 

Eventually, of course, the hides became more devious and eventually caches were "hidden" in order to be "hard to find". So it doesn't surprise me at all that eventually we've gotten to the point that some caches are now hidden in hopes that they're never found.

 

And as long as they're rated properly, this is okay with me. I like seeing the diversity that grows out of this game!

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It would appear that they had better be found....
Did you not read the very first sentence? :unsure:
Just stated the facts as I see them, my friend.
You are very quickly losing the right to call me my friend. okay?
Let me see if I can find the right words.... :unsure::unsure::unsure: Nope those will have to suffice. Is this what happens when someone disagrees with you?
Jeez Roddy, do you have to do this in EVERY thread?

 

On topic: I think caches were placed to be found in the beginning of the game, but as time went on and the game got more popular caches were "hidden" to be found instead of just "placed" to be found.

 

Eventually, of course, the hides became more devious and eventually caches were "hidden" in order to be "hard to find". So it doesn't surprise me at all that eventually we've gotten to the point that some caches are now hidden in hopes that they're never found.

 

And as long as they're rated properly, this is okay with me. I like seeing the diversity that grows out of this game!

 

Be disagreed with? It happens.

 

I think some places MUST have a hard hide, if nothing more than to just keep the cache from being muggled. I also think that some people place a micro in the woods merely to make it hard to find...then play the fuzzy coords game in order to really make it hard. I would even bet those who do this (the fuzzy coords, not so much the micro in the woods) think they are being sneaky or such. I sometimes post better coords and sometimes, they get deleted...which backs my suspicion of them.

 

As for starting hard, I wasn't around back then, but how good were coords in the beginning? Without the help of a good GPS and clear coords, most probably HAD to make a hide somewhat obvious or it would never be found. As the coords and units progressed, the finds got easier and people felt the need to hide harder to find caches?? Just a thought...

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Because they way we play, some caches should be harder than others. A 1/1 LPC is super easy, so that means a 5/5 should hard super hard.

 

This is from the clayjar rating system:

 

Difficulty rating:

* Easy. In plain sight or can be found in a few minutes of searching.

** Average. The average cache hunter would be able to find this in less than 30 minutes of hunting.

*** Challenging. An experienced cache hunter will find this challenging, and it could take up a good portion of an afternoon.

**** Difficult. A real challenge for the experienced cache hunter - may require special skills or knowledge, or in-depth preparation to find. May require multiple days / trips to complete.

***** Extreme. A serious mental or physical challenge. Requires specialized knowledge, skills, or equipment to find cache.

 

Terrain rating:

* Handicapped accessible. (Terrain is likely to be paved, is relatively flat, and less than a 1/2 mile hike is required.)

** Suitable for small children. (Terrain is generally along marked trails, there are no steep elevation changes or heavy overgrowth. Less than a 2 mile hike required.)

*** Not suitable for small children. (The average adult or older child should be OK depending on physical condition. Terrain is likely off-trail. May have one or more of the following: some overgrowth, some steep elevation changes, or more than a 2 mile hike.)

**** Experienced outdoor enthusiasts only. (Terrain is probably off-trail. Will have one or more of the following: very heavy overgrowth, very steep elevation (requiring use of hands), or more than a 10 mile hike. May require an overnight stay.)

***** Requires specialized equipment and knowledge or experience, (boat, 4WD, rock climbing, SCUBA, etc) or is otherwise extremely difficult.

 

The only reason I posted this is so we are all on the same page.

 

No where in the ratings does it state the cache is impossible to get to or find. But at the higher levels it does state the cacher needs to have certain skills and knowledge. So if the cache is rated 2.5/2.5 or lower then it should findable with only a little effort. If it rated 3/3 and higher then it should be hard to get to. 4/4 to 5/5 most people will never get to or be able to find this hides unless they get help from someone else.

 

So getting back to the question: Are caches meant to be found?

The answer should be Yes, but only if you have the skill and knowledge that is needed.

 

My big complaint is that a lot of caches are not rated correctly. I agree with the people that say the clayjar system is flawed. In my mind it has a lot of gaps and should be redone, however it is the system that is in place. To "help" out other cachers we should put in our logs what we feel the correct ratings should be. The only exception should be on liar caches. These are made to be fun by being deliberately untruthful about the hide. For these caches it states that it is very hard to do but it is really very easy.

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My mind differentiates between 'nasty' caches and 'evil' caches. Evil is good! It is challenging. And rewarding when found. Nasty is ego inflating for the CO. Needle in a haystack is nasty. It has no redeeming value. Nano on a tank. Fake rock in a pile of rocks. No thanks. They are NOT fun!

Yes. I have a micro in the woods. It's a bison tube stuffed up the rump of a five-pound bronze rabbit, hidden in a tree stump. Most of the finders have found it, at least, humorous.

Yes. I have some rather evil mystery caches. Hee hee hee. Hopefully, they are not considered nasty ones. They can be rather esoteric. If you have fun solving them go for it! If not, ignore them.

I have worked ten months on a great mystery cache, and almost as long on an exellent multi cache. They were frustrating, but fun. And very rewarding finally to make the find! Needle in the haystack? Not fun. I ignore them.

Are my caches meant to be found? Certainly! But they are often not easy. If you want a two-mile hike with a few hundred feet of climb, to a great view, I've got some very nice ones! They don't get a lot of finds, but that's the cache hunter's problem, not mine. I like them! I also have easy micros, frequently with nice views. And I do have a number of mysery caches. If you don't want to be bothered solving them, that's your problem. Not mine.

Do I give hints? Seldom. And if then, usually very cryptic ones. Yes. They're meant to be found, but they are not all cache and dashes. Some things in life take effort.

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My one needle in the haystack cache, since archived and resurrected by another cacher. It seems to be a favorite though. The cache is somewhere on that thing in the photo, within reach of the sidewalk so no climbing is necessary.

 

35390083-dae7-44b3-9be6-3a66a4c500f3.jpg

 

Old Glory

 

Old Glory resurrected

Twin 3" 50 Rapid-fire mount. Cut my teeth on one of those many years back.

Edited by tirediron
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USS Edson DD946 - Three Guns No Waiting

 

5" 54 gettin' the job done on Yankee Station.

 

1.gif

 

She's in a Naval Museum today, I wonder if the ship's association would allow a cache on her?

 

A multi from the quarterdeck to bridge to engine room would be way cool!

 

300px-5-54-Mark-45-firing_edit.jpg

USS Roosevelt (DDG-80) Mark 45 5-inch/54-caliber lightweight gun

We didn't need a heavyweight!

 

Now there's one way to place a cache that'd be hard to find! :unsure:

Edited by TheAlabamaRambler
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I like this topic. Yes, I believe (and always have) that most caches are meant to be found. When you consider the old school ammo box in the woods type hiders, combined with the quick grab micro hiders, I think evil hiders are in the minority big time. Not saying many people don't have a mix of both, but with one type usually dominating.

 

Like me, I hid a few multis in 2005 or 2006 with some evil legs, and even an evil micro. But I've diverted back to hiding caches in the woods you're probably going to find when you get there. For example, I placed a 1/3 regular last weekend. I'm not expecting to ever receive a DNF on that one.

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I hide my caches to be found.

 

To me there are two types of caches.

-- Those designed to be hidden from muggles.

-- Those designed to be hidden from other cachers.

 

(I read that on the forums here a long time ago and still use it.)

 

I tend to not enjoy caches which are designed to be hidden from other cachers. That doesn't mean they have to be easy, some of the best caches I have done are ones where I, upon finding the cache, find myself exclaiming out loud: "That's brilliant! He/She is an evil one."

 

The "hide from other cachers" type usually find me exclaiming: "Well, that was just bloody stupid."

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OK, that last post was (hopefully) obviously in jest.

 

 

I think all of my caches, even the toughest, have been designed to be found, and they all have been, although some put my fellow cachers threw the wringer (right, bflentje?) As a friend of mine said about some of his truely evil hides, "I want you to find them so you can see how clever they are" (or something along those lines).

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I certainly want my caches to be found and found most of the time they are tried and I want to find every cache I look for. I'm not really interested in caches that require NIH searching especially when dumped in a muggle district, it's just not fun and way too easy to end up talking to the authorities.

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