Not one more $$ to GARMIN!

October 20, 2009

I've been a faithful garmin user for over 10 years now. I am also totaly legal and have bought all my maps, usualy directly with a new unit but also somtimes downloaded from garmin web site.

Presently have a 60CSX and a Nuvi, and use mapsource to move my maps/waypoints etc. Well my issue is that my SD chip on my 60CSX got lost and I needed to reload the maps. On my computer I launced mapsource but mapsource had an error with my windows registurity and crashed. Garmin support had me reload mapsource - but this reload removed my unlock codes for the maps I have purchased. For maps or map updates that I had downloaded and paid for -are lost and garmin will not let me unlock them.

The unlock process for the disks that I owned and still had the CD - the unlock process was beyound difficult, even with all the proper paperwork and ownership.

I guess I'm done being ligit with Garmin and will never spend money on maps from them again.

October 20, 2009

I am not trying to give you a scolding,but did you not have a paper copy with all your unlock codes written down?Its for this purpose that you need that stuff.Its kind of like trying to reload windows without the product code.I can understand your anger,but Garmin like all software providers is only trying to prevent illegal use of its products to ensure their survival as a company.Running system restore on your computer may have fixed your registry problem.

1.5k · October 20, 2009

.. you LOST your memory chip AND Mapsource crashed beyond repair on your computer, at-or-around the same time? Geez that's incredible bad luck better stay indoors during the next thunderstorm (lol)

Where the recent purchased maps on CD or where they downloads to SD chip? Both??

I don't know how another vendor would respond to this issue differently..

6.4k · October 20, 2009

The unlock codes should be with your CDs. If you had registered, you can have the codes emailed to you from Garmin.

October 20, 2009

One more thing,were all your prducts registered with Garmin? You can retrieve your unlock codes from MY GARMIN on their site with out your GPS connected provided that you registered everything their previously.Under My Garmin / Manage Maps.I have also seen my unlock codes in my Garmin folder on my hard drive ,but I currently cant seem to find it,I will tell you where to look if I find it later,good luck.

Edited October 20, 2009 by Forkeye

October 20, 2009

This doesn't sound like Garmin's fault to me.

October 20, 2009

I'm telling you this is what happened to me while on the phone with Garmin and the phone tech told me my maps are lost, as Garmin does not keep older purchased download versions/updates of maps. This is the same phone tech that had me DELETE the same maps from my system.

The only way to recoved the maps would be if I had saved the original files for the downloaded maps. Now I do have the option of going and finding the older maps on the 'net' and then contacting them my unlock codes will work. I can restore maps I have on CD's.

For me to stay legal now I have to go to 'illegal' sites to find my maps and then go back to Garmin to get my unlock codes again.

My point is I know Garmin is trying to protect their maps as it is a revenue source, but they are making it too difficult to stay legal. Hell I can't even share maps between my different garmin systems without paying them more money, or move forward older maps to newer units.

EAch their own opition - mine is to vote with my $$ - no more to garmin.

6.4k · October 20, 2009

There is nothing illegal about downloading the maps from somewhere. What would be illegal is running the unlock breaking programs, which you won't do.

In your original post, you did not say your CDs were dead as well..... If you lose your orignal CDs from any old, out of date software, you are SOL. This is not Garmin's fault.

October 20, 2009

Call Garmin again. It sounds to me like you got a new or incompetant employee the first time around. Any company with more that 100 employees has at least one of these.

On a side note, I thought the unlock codes were also stored on the device itself, that way you could pull it from the device to mapsource.

6.4k · October 20, 2009

..I thought the unlock codes were also stored on the device itself, that way you could pull it from the device to mapsource.

He killed the device.

He killed his computer.

He lost the CDs.

He wants Garmin to send him CDs for software that they no longer produce.

October 20, 2009

You are missing my point, granted I did not make it well - so let me be a little more clear.

As a little more color – I’m in the software business, and deal with legal issues surrounding software daily. Working for a software company my salary is paid by legal users of my software. I am sure our software is being used in this chain at some level even now. I also am a user of software, and familiar with different types and licenses of software.

No I did not loose my CD’s, and no I don’t expect replacement. The lost data is downloadable content (DLC), for map updates, but also the fact that it is difficult to reload legal products, even with the right backup materials (which I have). I’m just generally pissed off at the restrictive licenses, and the fact that Garmin technical issues caused by improper use of drive mappings in Mapsource cause this issue (a bug), AND Garmin technical support made matters worse.

I deal with other licensed content for many different applications, and feel Garmin’s methodology of copyright protection and their restrictive licenses is too difficult for the value. It reminds me of 1990’s methodology, not modern products.

IMHO Garmin needs to update (make easier) their licensed methodology as they are forcing too many people away from it. It’s now much easier to go illicit than stay legal.

6.4k · October 20, 2009

When you download an update, you should burn a copy of the download to CD.

As a person working for a software company, you should know better.

The licensing is set by the map data provider, not Garmin. There are lots of map products that Garmin sells that have no locking. It is all about the data provider...

4k · October 20, 2009

This is the same phone tech that had me DELETE the same maps from my system.

Did you know when you delete a file that it is still there? You can retrieve whatever files you deleted if they haven't been written over. If this happened recently then it is probably still on your computer.

http://www.piriform.com/recuva

4k · October 20, 2009

Something seems fishy here. Why don't you have the codes? I don't think any company will give you codes if you tell them that you lost the yours.

October 20, 2009

When you download an update, you should burn a copy of the download to CD.

As a person working for a software company, you should know better.

The licensing is set by the map data provider, not Garmin. There are lots of map products that Garmin sells that have no locking. It is all about the data provider...

And then burn another copy of the copy and then maybe one more just to be sure. I personally take all my unlock codes and CDs and store then in a bank safe deposit box .

Funny how 100% of the responsibility for management of the unlock codes should be placed on the consumer when it IS Garmins policy.

6.4k · October 20, 2009

Funny how 100% of the responsibility for management of the unlock codes should be placed on the consumer when it IS Garmins policy.

As stated earlier, if you register, you can get your unlock codes from Garmin at any time directly from their servers.

If you lose the CDs, the emails, the codes, and have not registered, how is Garmin supposed to know you actually own the software??

4k · October 20, 2009

I store my stuff like that in my Yahoo webmail. It's easy to search and chances are it will always be there. I don't know my GSAK, cachemate, iolo, mapsend, etc codes, but they are in my mailbox somewhere.

October 20, 2009

When you download an update, you should burn a copy of the download to CD.

As a person working for a software company, you should know better.

The licensing is set by the map data provider, not Garmin. There are lots of map products that Garmin sells that have no locking. It is all about the data provider...

Download an update burn a copy to CD -

yes perhaps I should if it was 1995, again the lost data is minor issue here.

Licensing is set by the map data provider, not Garmin.

That's misleading - and mostly false - Garmin sets the content rollout and maps data providers comform to Garmin policies, payment and licensing terms.

Are you having a bad day or you always just this negative? Most people involved with geocaching have been outstanding people, but all I can say to you is Cheer up a bit - perhaps try the decaf

As I said and I still hold to this believe this is 1990's methodolgy made worse with internet. You need your mygarmin account, your coupon codes, your unlock codes, your original data, your DLC, online internet, and then can only use content in a limited fasion. To me as the casual user of this content, not worth it - end of story.

1k · October 20, 2009

I am also confused about the saving of your downloaded software. I just downloaded an updated version of Navigator 2010 to my computer. I received an email with my activation code, that I printed and also stored to a particular folder within my email for future reference. I also have a 2.06 gb download on my desktop that I had backed up onto a DVD.

I do this with all of my downloaded software in case I have a problem with it or my system crashes. I am not a computer person and I do not know a lot about software, but I do know about backing my stuff up that I paid for.

4.8k · October 20, 2009

This situation is why some people feel that software piracy is OK.

You paid your money but can't use the product anymore?

This is also why I have had to have a very firm chat with the Microsoft Corporation. If I purchase an operating system and put it on one computer, I should be able to transfer the operating system every time I build myself a new computer. Microsoft tried denying my installation of XP because it had been registered on too many computers. I never had it on more than one computer at a time. They finally gave in.

I suspect that Garmin will relent, eventually. You can transfer the purchased map to as many units as you want as long as you only have it on one at any given time. Garmin would love to tell you otherwise but the law is the law. BTW, Magellan is even worse when it comes to maps.

2.1k · October 20, 2009

Your purchased unlock codes can be emailed automatically from garmin. the unlock process is not hard, try the unlock wizard rather than the online one if it's too hard for you.

Maps shoulda been backed up, worse case you can copy the cd/dvd from a fellow user..or download from various public sites (useless without unlock codes).

Garmin are actually stupidly good with allowing you to unlock on, say, replacement GPS units after you lost a GPS. Many people have been bailed out by them in the past, so people will come across as defensive here. Their support history is actually very good. I'd call again if the above is not-doable by you.

1.3k · October 20, 2009

Didn’t you register the maps when you unlocked them? I can go to my myGarmin account and look in myMaps to get the details on all 27 Garmin maps that I own. I can see unlock codes, product keys, date unlocked, etc. I can even “Download Again” maps and map updates that I previously downloaded.

4k · October 20, 2009

on all 27 Garmin maps that I own.

Holy crap. You are a Cacheoholic!

October 20, 2009

Didn’t you register the maps when you unlocked them? I can go to my myGarmin account and look in myMaps to get the details on all 27 Garmin maps that I own. I can see unlock codes, product keys, date unlocked, etc. I can even “Download Again” maps and map updates that I previously downloaded.

Like Knight said - Holy CRAP a cacheholic - you are one !!!

Yep you can download again map updates, but for a lot of the products especially the road mapping products if the update is not longer published you can't redownload it. Two of my map products the Garmin tech told me if I did not save the download file they will be lost even though I have the unlock keys. It's a minor issue for me as they way I use my Garmins units have changed over the years, and I don't use mapsource for much anything anymore. I did not press the subject as again it was not important, but got me thinking about this entire issue as I see other products that are easier to use, and so many of my friends just use pirate codes and laugh at me when I buy stuff like this.

Just ranting on the subject - thanks for all the good replys

Cheers,

-Poker

Edited October 20, 2009 by Pokerfart

October 20, 2009

I am also confused about the saving of your downloaded software. I just downloaded an updated version of Navigator 2010 to my computer. I received an email with my activation code, that I printed and also stored to a particular folder within my email for future reference. I also have a 2.06 gb download on my desktop that I had backed up onto a DVD.

I do this with all of my downloaded software in case I have a problem with it or my system crashes. I am not a computer person and I do not know a lot about software, but I do know about backing my stuff up that I paid for.

Yes I should have backed up the download files, but did not (my mistake). My drives are mirrored and I backup my computer, to an network drive, so I don't backup downloads. Issue is these download files never made it into my backup or I deleted sometime ago and I can't just restore the software. If I really wanted them I could go to an old archive backup reimage a 'puter and transfer - but not that important. Actualy this was what caused the bug in Mapsource to crash, as I run applications from different (non letter c) drives but Garmin want's to assume a default root C drive for most things and got confused when I took the new mapsource application update.

Bottom line if you download an update to a map - you have to save that download file, saving data in the application won't help. Typicaly I don't save update downloads as I run so many of them the old saved updated files are out of date if I ever need them again, and I'm not orginized well enough to save so many download files to know what they are anyway

6.4k · October 20, 2009

Actualy this was what caused the bug in Mapsource to crash, as I run applications from different (non letter c) drives but Garmin want's to assume a default root C drive for most things and got confused when I took the new mapsource application update.

All that you needed to do was a small fix in the registry. There are even programs that do this for you. You should have asked here first.

5.3k · October 21, 2009

... snip

Bottom line if you download an update to a map - you have to save that download file, saving data in the application won't help.

... snip

Yes, this is absolutely the case. Garmin even indicates on the my.garmin site that the download is only available for a limited (short) period of time. And if you don't save it, Garmin will not replace it. It's 100% the user's responsibility much as it is the user's responsibility to retain physical copies of the maps that are obtained via DVD or CD. It's the exact same thing. Garmin won't replace (and shouldn't be expected to replace) misplaced or lost disks or downloads. Sorry.

October 21, 2009

I feel your pain, always discouraging to get in a situation like that...... hindsight's always 20/20 right guys/gals?

October 21, 2009

...... hindsight's always 20/20 right guys/gals?

Only when you learn from it!

Norm

October 21, 2009

Ever heard about "backup" ?

How can Garmin be held responsible for a lack of proper user care and foresight ?

October 21, 2009

Funny how 100% of the responsibility for management of the unlock codes should be placed on the consumer when it IS Garmins policy.

As stated earlier, if you register, you can get your unlock codes from Garmin at any time directly from their servers.

If you lose the CDs, the emails, the codes, and have not registered, how is Garmin supposed to know you actually own the software??

Funny, my Verson 4 of MN Lakemaster software that was unlocked to my Etrex Legend C, is nowhere to be found under the list of my registered devices, neither is my emap, come to think of it neither is my 76s. What gives or do we need to keep re-registering them?

October 22, 2009

in response to the topic - not one more dollar to garmin - I just successfully uploaded opensource maps to my oregon for the first time. Why spend all that money on maps when I am only going to be in Paris for a week.

options:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Map...Garmin/Download

the one I used for France:

http://www.raumbezug.eu/ag/internet/osmGarmin.htm

I don't need routing yet, but when the time comes, I'll be seeing if there is a good routable openstreet that I can put on my Oregon.

kinda cool. I sent in some packets a while back. might get involved with contributing again. help make it better

October 22, 2009

In response to the topic - not one more dollar to garmin - I just successfully uploaded opensource maps to my oregon for the first time. Why spend all that money on maps when I am only going to be in Paris for a week.

options:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Map...Garmin/Download

the one I used for France:

http://www.raumbezug.eu/ag/internet/osmGarmin.htm

I don't need routing yet, but when the time comes, I'll be seeing if there is a good routable openstreet that I can put on my Oregon.

You can get routable openstreetmap based maps that work on your garmin here: http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php

I have been able to get the routing working, but nowhere near as well as Garmins City Navigator maps. Still nice to contribute to OSM and be able to make some custom maps for my garmin in the process. Really nice to use my old trail GPX tracklogs on OSM to draw in the trails, then when I download a map from the link above a few weeks later, I can see my trails on the gps map & not using up precious track log space.

October 22, 2009

In response to the topic - not one more dollar to garmin - I just successfully uploaded opensource maps to my oregon for the first time. Why spend all that money on maps when I am only going to be in Paris for a week.

options:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Map...Garmin/Download

the one I used for France:

http://www.raumbezug.eu/ag/internet/osmGarmin.htm

I don't need routing yet, but when the time comes, I'll be seeing if there is a good routable openstreet that I can put on my Oregon.

You can get routable openstreetmap based maps that work on your garmin here: http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php

I have been able to get the routing working, but nowhere near as well as Garmins City Navigator maps. Still nice to contribute to OSM and be able to make some custom maps for my garmin in the process. Really nice to use my old trail GPX tracklogs on OSM to draw in the trails, then when I download a map from the link above a few weeks later, I can see my trails on the gps map & not using up precious track log space.

that's great. My area of the woods could use a lot more trail updates.

BTW, this morning, while playing with my GPS and the OSM Paris map, I discovered that it is routable! cool. Of course I don't think I'll have a need for it over there since I won't be driving a car in Paris (got in an accident last time, not my fault!)

Has the OP ever used Open Source Maps?

9.2k · October 22, 2009

I've been a faithful garmin user for over 10 years now. I am also totaly legal and have bought all my maps, usualy directly with a new unit but also somtimes downloaded from garmin web site.

Presently have a 60CSX and a Nuvi, and use mapsource to move my maps/waypoints etc. Well my issue is that my SD chip on my 60CSX got lost and I needed to reload the maps. On my computer I launced mapsource but mapsource had an error with my windows registurity and crashed. Garmin support had me reload mapsource - but this reload removed my unlock codes for the maps I have purchased. For maps or map updates that I had downloaded and paid for -are lost and garmin will not let me unlock them.

The unlock process for the disks that I owned and still had the CD - the unlock process was beyound difficult, even with all the proper paperwork and ownership.

I guess I'm done being ligit with Garmin and will never spend money on maps from them again.

Don't blame Garmin for your own bad computer practices. Every piece of software I've bought on discs for the last 10 years is in a big CD notebook. If there's a license code, I print it on a laminated sticker, and put it right on the disc's label. Software I download gets saved in a special folder, along with a text file containing any license codes.

You can get a 250GB backup drive for about $70. They're the size of a cell phone, and are powered from the USB port. I run an incremental backup on one every couple of weeks.

3 weeks ago, my laptop also developed a registry problem, and I was forced to do a full format and OS reinstall. MapSource was one of the first things I re-installed. Had it up and running, with maps installed, within a half hour. Not a problem, since I had my registration codes. Also had my NuMaps codes, and was able to download the latest CN-NA (v2010.2) that evening.

I've reinstalled things as I've needed them, and don't anticipate there's anything that can't be reinstalled. The only thing actually lost was a few hours work on a Greasemonkey script.

Anyone who thinks they can get by without backups, will get what they deserve. Don't blame Garmin for not pulling you out of the hole you dug.

October 23, 2009

Anyone who thinks they can get by without backups, will get what they deserve.

So people deserve data loss if they don't back their stuff up? Must be an IT guy... :anicute:

9.2k · October 23, 2009

Anyone who thinks they can get by without backups, will get what they deserve.

So people deserve data loss if they don't back their stuff up? Must be an IT guy...

All drives will eventually fault. If you don't back up, then yes, you will deserve whatever data loss you experience.

October 23, 2009

Anyone who thinks they can get by without backups, will get what they deserve.

So people deserve data loss if they don't back their stuff up? Must be an IT guy...

Well, I'm an "IT guy". I don't say anyone deserves to have anything bad happen to them. However, it's predictable and I think that's probably what was meant.

Nobody expects their toaster or their TV to last forever, so it seems reasonable to expect eventual failure of a computer, too. Perhaps it's their surprising reliability that lulls people.

...ken...

Not one more $$ to GARMIN!

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