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avroair

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wow, I don't even know how to respond or start...

 

...guess I'll keep my opinions to myself from now on regardless if anyone asks for them.

 

Seems I should have learned my lesson from a few years back when I didn't follow the normal "ooohhh's and aaaahhhhh's".... "pretty coin" opinion it seems everyone looks for, yet they seem to get defensive when that's not what they receive...

 

 

I'll like to say I am sorry, but I just can't... I saw what I saw, had an opinion and stated it... like the artist in you not wanting to change your art for the sake of compremise, I'm not willing to change my opinion because of controversy.

 

I can't say I understand why you don't see what we are talking about. It's been explained as clearly as it can be. It's not that the artwork isn't good, it's just not the artwork we as investors want to pay for. We're just asking you to change the tire, not buy a new car... (bad cliche I know, but the best I can come up with at the moment) I also don't understand the stance you are taking of packing up your toys and going home and not playing anymore. I sincerly hope you don't, cause I happen to like most of your work.

 

But hey, that's another opinion and they don't seem to bode well with others unless they are "positive comments only"

 

If I don't have a positive opinion from now on I'll bite my tongue and not respond at all...... deal?

 

 

For what it's worth the bottm line here is the front was awesome and the back just needed some tweaking for everyone's liking (the folks investing in the project... not just the artist's liking)

 

Sigh. Not at you, but at the situation. I'm tremendously distressed that the impression I've given is that I only want positive comments. This is not true. I don't mind negative comments. I'll say that 'til I'm blue in the face. If you don't believe me, you don't believe me, but I don't mind negative comments. I'd prefer that they be constructive, but even purely negative feedback is useful feedback.

 

The issue is not that I'm being asked to change an element (and now I'm talking about the star). It's why I'm being asked to change the star. By now, I've come to the conclusion that the real root problem is this: there is concern that potential customers, upon learning that the star is inspired by Islamic art, will be turned off, because they object to Islam. Or that customers, upon hearing that the star is inspired by Islamic art, will immediately and irrevocably decide that the coin is religious.

 

If that is the case, then that's the case. If vendors don't want that element on the coin because their customers will object to it, and if those vendors don't want to buy the coin because they're concerned they'll be left with a bag of expensive, unsellable coins, then that's what's going on, and it is full well within the rights of the vendors to 1) say so and 2) not buy the coin for resale. They're in the business of making money, and raising money for events, and the coins are useless if they don't do that.

 

My statement about not doing the 10-10-10 coin, and not doing multi-event coins is not not not not not not because I demand praise and only praise, or am so thin-skinned that the moment that someone says "I don't like it" I'm going to get my underwear in a bunch. I asked for criticism; I expect criticism.

 

However, I find it appalling, as an artist, that I can't use Islamic art as an inspiration for art because, down the line, customers might find it offensive if and when they find out that that was its inspiration. And it's the idea that art inspired by Islamic art is, by its nature, offensive, that I find offensive. I can't help it, and neither can the vendors, if people find it offensive. And it's their right to find it offensive (and to vote with their wallets), just as it's my right to be offended, and to decide that I don't want to design for people who would be offended by it.

 

That's what I'm trying to say. My style of design for things like this is to be heavily laden with symbolism from all over the world, crammed with detail. It's what I like to do. I don't want to cut out the rich and amazing tradition of art of a collection of cultures from my toolbox because customers down the line can't (or won't) separate that tradition from other, incredibly deplorable aspects of that collection of cultures. So I just think that I'm not the appropriate artist for multi-event coins.

 

Edited to ask: okay, Mike's right: the thread needs to concentrate on some good ideas and I'm finding that I'm repeating myself, so it's time to stop. My apologies for dragging this on so long.

Edited by Jackalgirl
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Is there anyone else out there (other than myself) who is contemplating designing their own "special" coin for their event?

 

Yes, because this is frustrating! Can I buy 100 of yours!

 

No, you'll have to attend the Helena event to get one ;) I'm not sure I'm motivated enough yet to throw the event. Do you want to come up and co-host with me ;)

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wow, I don't even know how to respond or start...

 

...guess I'll keep my opinions to myself from now on regardless if anyone asks for them.

 

Seems I should have learned my lesson from a few years back when I didn't follow the normal "ooohhh's and aaaahhhhh's".... "pretty coin" opinion it seems everyone looks for, yet they seem to get defensive when that's not what they receive...

 

 

I'll like to say I am sorry, but I just can't... I saw what I saw, had an opinion and stated it... like the artist in you not wanting to change your art for the sake of compremise, I'm not willing to change my opinion because of controversy.

 

I can't say I understand why you don't see what we are talking about. It's been explained as clearly as it can be. It's not that the artwork isn't good, it's just not the artwork we as investors want to pay for. We're just asking you to change the tire, not buy a new car... (bad cliche I know, but the best I can come up with at the moment) I also don't understand the stance you are taking of packing up your toys and going home and not playing anymore. I sincerly hope you don't, cause I happen to like most of your work.

 

But hey, that's another opinion and they don't seem to bode well with others unless they are "positive comments only"

 

If I don't have a positive opinion from now on I'll bite my tongue and not respond at all...... deal?

 

 

For what it's worth the bottm line here is the front was awesome and the back just needed some tweaking for everyone's liking (the folks investing in the project... not just the artist's liking)

 

Sigh. Not at you, but at the situation. I'm tremendously distressed that the impression I've given is that I only want positive comments. This is not true. I don't mind negative comments. I'll say that 'til I'm blue in the face. If you don't believe me, you don't believe me, but I don't mind negative comments. I'd prefer that they be constructive, but even purely negative feedback is useful feedback.

 

The issue is not that I'm being asked to change an element (and now I'm talking about the star). It's why I'm being asked to change the star. By now, I've come to the conclusion that the real root problem is this: there is concern that potential customers, upon learning that the star is inspired by Islamic art, will be turned off, because they object to Islam. Or that customers, upon hearing that the star is inspired by Islamic art, will immediately and irrevocably decide that the coin is religious.

 

If that is the case, then that's the case. If vendors don't want that element on the coin because their customers will object to it, and if those vendors don't want to buy the coin because they're concerned they'll be left with a bag of expensive, unsellable coins, then that's what's going on, and it is full well within the rights of the vendors to 1) say so and 2) not buy the coin for resale. They're in the business of making money, and raising money for events, and the coins are useless if they don't do that.

 

My statement about not doing the 10-10-10 coin, and not doing multi-event coins is not not not not not not because I demand praise and only praise, or am so thin-skinned that the moment that someone says "I don't like it" I'm going to get my underwear in a bunch. I asked for criticism; I expect criticism.

 

However, I find it appalling, as an artist, that I can't use Islamic art as an inspiration for art because, down the line, customers might find it offensive if and when they find out that that was its inspiration. And it's the idea that art inspired by Islamic art is, by its nature, offensive, that I find offensive. I can't help it, and neither can the vendors, if people find it offensive. And it's their right to find it offensive (and to vote with their wallets), just as it's my right to be offended, and to decide that I don't want to design for people who would be offended by it.

 

That's what I'm trying to say. My style of design for things like this is to be heavily laden with symbolism from all over the world, crammed with detail. It's what I like to do. I don't want to cut out the rich and amazing tradition of art of a collection of cultures from my toolbox because customers down the line can't (or won't) separate that tradition from other, incredibly deplorable aspects of that collection of cultures. So I just think that I'm not the appropriate artist for multi-event coins.

 

Edited to ask: okay, Mike's right: the thread needs to concentrate on some good ideas and I'm finding that I'm repeating myself, so it's time to stop. My apologies for dragging this on so long.

 

OMG now I'm the one who is speechless. Well not exactly. I do not understand where you get the impressions that because your art was inspired by Islamic art that that is the root of the problem. No one but you have commented on the Islam aspect. We have just said that overall the feeling given by the back side was religious

 

 

Back to the theme at hand. I stated in an earlier post that I liked the way the coin for Geocoinfest 2007 was designed. Several people submitted their design and posted it in a thread. We voted on it and the winner's coin was minted. I'd like to see something like that done. Throwing out ideas and even combining the back of one design with the front of another. No one can please everyone but since it is a group coin I think that the group should have some say in the design of the coin.

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wow, I don't even know how to respond or start...

 

...guess I'll keep my opinions to myself from now on regardless if anyone asks for them.

 

Seems I should have learned my lesson from a few years back when I didn't follow the normal "ooohhh's and aaaahhhhh's".... "pretty coin" opinion it seems everyone looks for, yet they seem to get defensive when that's not what they receive...

 

 

I'll like to say I am sorry, but I just can't... I saw what I saw, had an opinion and stated it... like the artist in you not wanting to change your art for the sake of compremise, I'm not willing to change my opinion because of controversy.

 

I can't say I understand why you don't see what we are talking about. It's been explained as clearly as it can be. It's not that the artwork isn't good, it's just not the artwork we as investors want to pay for. We're just asking you to change the tire, not buy a new car... (bad cliche I know, but the best I can come up with at the moment) I also don't understand the stance you are taking of packing up your toys and going home and not playing anymore. I sincerly hope you don't, cause I happen to like most of your work.

 

But hey, that's another opinion and they don't seem to bode well with others unless they are "positive comments only"

 

If I don't have a positive opinion from now on I'll bite my tongue and not respond at all...... deal?

 

 

For what it's worth the bottm line here is the front was awesome and the back just needed some tweaking for everyone's liking (the folks investing in the project... not just the artist's liking)

 

Sigh. Not at you, but at the situation. I'm tremendously distressed that the impression I've given is that I only want positive comments. This is not true. I don't mind negative comments. I'll say that 'til I'm blue in the face. If you don't believe me, you don't believe me, but I don't mind negative comments. I'd prefer that they be constructive, but even purely negative feedback is useful feedback.

 

The issue is not that I'm being asked to change an element (and now I'm talking about the star). It's why I'm being asked to change the star. By now, I've come to the conclusion that the real root problem is this: there is concern that potential customers, upon learning that the star is inspired by Islamic art, will be turned off, because they object to Islam. Or that customers, upon hearing that the star is inspired by Islamic art, will immediately and irrevocably decide that the coin is religious.

 

If that is the case, then that's the case. If vendors don't want that element on the coin because their customers will object to it, and if those vendors don't want to buy the coin because they're concerned they'll be left with a bag of expensive, unsellable coins, then that's what's going on, and it is full well within the rights of the vendors to 1) say so and 2) not buy the coin for resale. They're in the business of making money, and raising money for events, and the coins are useless if they don't do that.

 

My statement about not doing the 10-10-10 coin, and not doing multi-event coins is not not not not not not because I demand praise and only praise, or am so thin-skinned that the moment that someone says "I don't like it" I'm going to get my underwear in a bunch. I asked for criticism; I expect criticism.

 

However, I find it appalling, as an artist, that I can't use Islamic art as an inspiration for art because, down the line, customers might find it offensive if and when they find out that that was its inspiration. And it's the idea that art inspired by Islamic art is, by its nature, offensive, that I find offensive. I can't help it, and neither can the vendors, if people find it offensive. And it's their right to find it offensive (and to vote with their wallets), just as it's my right to be offended, and to decide that I don't want to design for people who would be offended by it.

 

That's what I'm trying to say. My style of design for things like this is to be heavily laden with symbolism from all over the world, crammed with detail. It's what I like to do. I don't want to cut out the rich and amazing tradition of art of a collection of cultures from my toolbox because customers down the line can't (or won't) separate that tradition from other, incredibly deplorable aspects of that collection of cultures. So I just think that I'm not the appropriate artist for multi-event coins.

 

Edited to ask: okay, Mike's right: the thread needs to concentrate on some good ideas and I'm finding that I'm repeating myself, so it's time to stop. My apologies for dragging this on so long.

Okay, I've held off on the Islamic art comments. Quite frankly, when I made my original comment, I had no idea that you were inspired by Islamic art. I don't read three quarters of your posts because they are so darned long, I could settle in with a good book.

 

I saw the art, and gained my impression only from what I saw.

 

Post after post, we have had to hear how "deplorable" you find the fact that we don't get your art. We have been told over and over again how "disturbed" you are that you can't draw your inspiration from Islamic art, when you are the only person who has even mentioned it. We have told you quite frankly and clearly that we don't want a coin that is going to make people think of religion...Islamic or otherwise....

 

I know you are going to get the last word in, but please, quit trying to make us out to be bigots because we didn't like that side of the coin. It is not appreciated here!

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I am not sure what Islam and 10 - 10 - 10 have to do with each other... 12 - 12 - 12 and the Mayans is a different story... anyways, this thread was looking for ideas and a place for people who are interested in hosting events, please keep it that way. ;)

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I had a glimpse at the proposed design earlier today, & I really liked the front, but now it seems to have gone away... ;) .....I know I'm new here, but I do have an idea for the back, that might go along better with the originally proposed front. What about a design incorporating the 10 types of caches: Trad, Multi, Unknown, Earth, LB Hybrid, Event, Webcam, Virtual, Wherigo, & Project APE? Wouldn't that complement the front which was offered earlier, which (if I remember correctly) had 10 guidelines or ideals for geocachers, such as respect the environment, etc? As in, remember these correct actions (front) while pursuing these type caches (back)? What do y'all think? Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water! ;)

 

I do like this idea very much. I think we have lost the front of the coin that was shown, but I do like the idea of showing the individual cache types.

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I love the front, for a few different reasons the symbols, the numbers, etc.

 

The hands just really doesn't fit with that celebration of '10'....seems too big and dominates the whole backside of the coin.

 

I would LOVE to host a multi event this time around with getting a coin, but my area doesn't have a lot of coin buyers in the area, and I don't know if I'd be able to remake the cost to be able to get them in the first place.

 

You would be surprised who will buy a coin. In my area, most the people who buy the coins I offer at the events aren't coin collectors. They just want a souvenir for the event. I've sold out on the 999 and 10th anniversary coins.

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I never saw anything.

 

Me too, also, neither. :rolleyes:

 

How do you fit an entire Top 10 onto a geocoin without making it the size of a hubcap?

 

I'd probably be happy with a great big Roman X with various depictions of 10 in different languages around it.

 

Maybe a picture of Bo Derek on the back. ;)

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I had a glimpse at the proposed design earlier today, & I really liked the front, but now it seems to have gone away... ;) .....I know I'm new here, but I do have an idea for the back, that might go along better with the originally proposed front. What about a design incorporating the 10 types of caches: Trad, Multi, Unknown, Earth, LB Hybrid, Event, Webcam, Virtual, Wherigo, & Project APE? Wouldn't that complement the front which was offered earlier, which (if I remember correctly) had 10 guidelines or ideals for geocachers, such as respect the environment, etc? As in, remember these correct actions (front) while pursuing these type caches (back)? What do y'all think? Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water! :)

 

I do like this idea very much. I think we have lost the front of the coin that was shown, but I do like the idea of showing the individual cache types.

 

I like the 10 cache types idea... problem is at GW8 this year you can get 12 icons! :rolleyes: What would we drop?

trad

multi

cito

event

mega

puzzle

earth

lost and found

letterbox

A.P.E.

Wherigo

webcam

 

:anibad:

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I had a glimpse at the proposed design earlier today, & I really liked the front, but now it seems to have gone away... ;) .....I know I'm new here, but I do have an idea for the back, that might go along better with the originally proposed front. What about a design incorporating the 10 types of caches: Trad, Multi, Unknown, Earth, LB Hybrid, Event, Webcam, Virtual, Wherigo, & Project APE? Wouldn't that complement the front which was offered earlier, which (if I remember correctly) had 10 guidelines or ideals for geocachers, such as respect the environment, etc? As in, remember these correct actions (front) while pursuing these type caches (back)? What do y'all think? Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water! :)

 

I do like this idea very much. I think we have lost the front of the coin that was shown, but I do like the idea of showing the individual cache types.

 

I like the 10 cache types idea... problem is at GW8 this year you can get 12 icons! :rolleyes: What would we drop?

trad

multi

cito

event

mega

puzzle

earth

lost and found

letterbox

A.P.E.

Wherigo

webcam

 

:anibad:

 

maybe APE and Lost and found

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Earthcache.org will not allow the use of their icon on any coins. So that one is a natural to drop. You could also drop mega because there is already an event icon on the coin. They will likely be so small that you'll only see the little white bubble anyway.

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I wouls propose this list of 10:

 

1. trad

2. multi

3. puzzle

4. virtual

5. cito

6. event

7. letterbox

8. A.P.E.

9. Wherigo

10. webcam

 

Boy that would have been great for the 10 Years! coins. Directly related to geocaching whereas 10-10-10 really has nothing to do with caching other than the events planned. But then again 10 things of caching and the numbers of 10. I know I am wishy washy LOL

 

That said I guess I should think up things that have to do with the number 10....

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I wouls propose this list of 10:

 

1. trad

2. multi

3. puzzle

4. virtual

5. cito

6. event

7. letterbox

8. A.P.E.

9. Wherigo

10. webcam

 

Boy that would have been great for the 10 Years! coins. Directly related to geocaching whereas 10-10-10 really has nothing to do with caching other than the events planned. But then again 10 things of caching and the numbers of 10. I know I am wishy washy LOL

 

That said I guess I should think up things that have to do with the number 10....

 

The 1000000 geocoinproduced by the geocoinshop had that solution. Very nice also.

 

1219_0.jpg

 

Paulo

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The 1000000 geocoinproduced by the geocoinshop had that solution. Very nice also.

 

1219_0.jpg

Two questions come to mind... Do each of those spin? and if so why not hav the spin vertically more like a counter?

 

Of three questions...As someone mentioned, did they get approval to use the Earthcache Icon. I am working on a Earthcache coin and they said no at first. Need to pay a royalty.

 

Now back to the regularly scheduled discussion. I would drop Earthcache and Mega also. :)

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Boy that would have been great for the 10 Years! coins. Directly related to geocaching whereas 10-10-10 really has nothing to do with caching other than the events planned. But then again 10 things of caching and the numbers of 10. I know I am wishy washy LOL

 

That said I guess I should think up things that have to do with the number 10....

You said it...wishy washy...

 

previous post you wanted the coin to be related to caching not you don't. Difficult to make everyone happy especial when they don't know what they want. :):cry::):P

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The 1000000 geocoinproduced by the geocoinshop had that solution. Very nice also.

 

1219_0.jpg

Two questions come to mind... Do each of those spin? and if so why not hav the spin vertically more like a counter?

 

Of three questions...As someone mentioned, did they get approval to use the Earthcache Icon. I am working on a Earthcache coin and they said no at first. Need to pay a royalty.

 

Now back to the regularly scheduled discussion. I would drop Earthcache and Mega also. :cry:

 

Hi Mike,

 

I can answer two of those questions. The first ones :) .

They spin. Horizontally. But i agree with you that spinning vertically would give a better emphasis on the counting mood of the geocoin.

Regarding the third one i really don't know.

 

Paulo

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Hi Mike,

 

I can answer two of those questions. The first ones :) .

They spin. Horizontally. But i agree with you that spinning vertically would give a better emphasis on the counting mood of the geocoin.

Regarding the third one i really don't know.

 

Paulo

Thanks and I think it is a very nice coin.

Edited by CacheAddict.com
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Boy that would have been great for the 10 Years! coins. Directly related to geocaching whereas 10-10-10 really has nothing to do with caching other than the events planned. But then again 10 things of caching and the numbers of 10. I know I am wishy washy LOL

 

That said I guess I should think up things that have to do with the number 10....

You said it...wishy washy...

 

previous post you wanted the coin to be related to caching not you don't. Difficult to make everyone happy especial when they don't know what they want. :):cry::D:P

 

Yep I did say that I liked the one side of yours and JG's coin--the one with the ten elements of geocaching or something like that and I'm not changing that opinion at all. I said that side worked for me. What I meant in the post you quoted is that when I thought about it, it's too bad that wasn't used for the 10 Years coin as it seems to be better suited. Didn't say that I didn't want it to be used for this coin just that I thought it would have been better for the other coin in hindsight. Its a flip of a coin right? So one side ten things of geocaching and the other side directly related to stuff about the number ten. :)

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I had a glimpse at the proposed design earlier today, & I really liked the front, but now it seems to have gone away... :ph34r: .....I know I'm new here, but I do have an idea for the back, that might go along better with the originally proposed front. What about a design incorporating the 10 types of caches: Trad, Multi, Unknown, Earth, LB Hybrid, Event, Webcam, Virtual, Wherigo, & Project APE? Wouldn't that complement the front which was offered earlier, which (if I remember correctly) had 10 guidelines or ideals for geocachers, such as respect the environment, etc? As in, remember these correct actions (front) while pursuing these type caches (back)? What do y'all think? Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water! :P

 

I do like this idea very much. I think we have lost the front of the coin that was shown, but I do like the idea of showing the individual cache types.

 

I like the 10 cache types idea... problem is at GW8 this year you can get 12 icons! :rolleyes: What would we drop?

trad

multi

cito

event

mega

puzzle

earth

lost and found

letterbox

A.P.E.

Wherigo

webcam

 

:D

 

maybe APE and Lost and found

 

LOL! No way! I live 30 miles from the APE! :P

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1219_0.jpg

 

Paulo

 

Cool. But I would rather make something I can sell at my event. I think the appeal of 10 - 10 -10 outwieghs the appeal of caching icons.

 

Agree. And that's the spirit of all the previous geocoins on previous occasions: 8-8-8 and 9-9-9.

 

PL

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1219_0.jpg

 

Paulo

 

Cool. But I would rather make something I can sell at my event. I think the appeal of 10 - 10 -10 outwieghs the appeal of caching icons.

I think the caching icons would've been more suited to the 10 years event...since that celebrated the 10th anniversary of geocaching. This event is celebrating 10/10/10. I am not saying that it should not be geocaching related, but I think that the underlying theme should be 10/10/10. Also, it shouldn't the design reflect 10/10/10 (3 tens), not just 10 (a sigular 10)?

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1219_0.jpg

 

Paulo

 

Cool. But I would rather make something I can sell at my event. I think the appeal of 10 - 10 -10 outwieghs the appeal of caching icons.

I think the caching icons would've been more suited to the 10 years event...since that celebrated the 10th anniversary of geocaching. This event is celebrating 10/10/10. I am not saying that it should not be geocaching related, but I think that the underlying theme should be 10/10/10. Also, it shouldn't the design reflect 10/10/10 (3 tens), not just 10 (a sigular 10)?

 

I have to agree on that!

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1219_0.jpg

 

Paulo

 

Cool. But I would rather make something I can sell at my event. I think the appeal of 10 - 10 -10 outwieghs the appeal of caching icons.

I think the caching icons would've been more suited to the 10 years event...since that celebrated the 10th anniversary of geocaching. This event is celebrating 10/10/10. I am not saying that it should not be geocaching related, but I think that the underlying theme should be 10/10/10. Also, it shouldn't the design reflect 10/10/10 (3 tens), not just 10 (a sigular 10)?

 

I have to agree on that!

 

My feelings exactly.

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I am considering the idea of hosting a 10-10-10 event and take part in the project.

 

Besides, I'll turn 30 (10+10+10) 8 days after that date, so I might find something cool to do!

 

I won't turn 30 since I was born in '63 but it will be 8 days after the event as well :angry:

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