+Gobble42 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I have a new Colorado 400T and have a problem with the compass: it doesn't point in the correct direction. Since this is the essential purpose of the compass, this problem has been very frustrating. Sometimes it is off by as much as 90 degrees. I have calibrated after changing batteries and have even calibrated several times in a row and it is still off substantially. I saw a thread on this forum that suggested it worked better when turned OFF, but I think then you are no longer using the electronic compass and you have to be moving to get accurate directions. With my previous GPSr, I would get close to ground zero and see what direction and distance I was from actual GZ, then I would pace in that direction and was usually at GZ. With this unit I end up spinning around until the distance starts going down. Is this just a product failure or is there a way to fix it? Right now I am resigned to returning it. Quote Link to comment
flyjazz Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I'm sure you'll get lots of replies and suggestions so here's mine. Run the Garmin Webupdater to see if you're running the latest firmware 2.9 and software Beta 2.96. Your unit may also need a hard reset,not exactly sure how it's done but someone will chime in and let you know. Otherwise you may have a dud unit that's been recycled. There is some suspicion that some of early Colorado's had hardware problems. If you have tried the suggestions from the replies and have no resolution to your problem,best you just return it for an refund,exchange or another model. I've been pleased with mine,that's not to say there haven't been other's that have been frustrated with their's. For the most part it's a great GPS device. Let us know how it works out. Quote Link to comment
+Team Veverca Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Your unit may also need a hard reset,not exactly sure how it's done but someone will chime in and let you know. Warning: This procedure will delete information (waypoints, routes, tracks, etc) from your GPS and settings may be set back to factory defaults. 1. Power the unit OFF 2. Hold down the two Soft Keys for 2 seconds 3. While continuing to hold the 2 Soft Keys down, press and hold down the Power button for an additional 5 seconds 4. Release all buttons, and select YES to the prompt asking "if you want to clear all user data?" This form of reset does not seem to reset all of the settings to factory defaults, just a few of the basics like Time Zone and Language, the remainder of the settings are still taken from your existing profile files. Once you have completed a reset remember to place the Colorado outside in a stationary position for 20 minutes in plain view of the sky so that it can rebuild the almanac before using it again. Note: Holding down both soft keys and the select button in a similar fashion seems to do a similar reset to the Colorado. This may be a master reset that will also reset the profiles back to the default -- needs further testing. Quote Link to comment
+g-o-cashers Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I'll ask the obvious first: are you holding the unit flat? Are you stationary (speed = 0) when you observe this? Quote Link to comment
+Gobble42 Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 I am holding the unit flat (seems to be very sensitive the level, slight changes change the direction). I also am stationary. This condition happens even when I am not trying to "Find" something. If I just go to the compass, it points to North way off from what I know is North. Even after calibrating it can be off 10-15 degrees. One test I do is: hold unit flat and turn the unit in 90 degree increments. At each turn the "North" can be off the 10-15 degrees from the other turns. Quote Link to comment
+g-o-cashers Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Assuming you aren't near a large metal object you probably have a problem with the compass in your unit. I've heard of people reporting hardware issues like this -- probably time to talk with Garmin. Quote Link to comment
+Gushoneybun Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Have you calibrated it? If not: Into the compass screen, select options and then calibrate compass and follow the screen prompts. Mine is fine then every now and then it needs calibrating no logic to when it is needed. Quote Link to comment
+Red90 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 (edited) Wearing a watch on your hand? Edited September 1, 2009 by Red90 Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Funny, the compass on my OR did the same thing and I was told to turn it off. I feel for you. Red90, if it is a watch, then I would be returning the GPS. Shouldn't have to take off your jewelry so you can use your GPS! Quote Link to comment
+Gobble42 Posted September 2, 2009 Author Share Posted September 2, 2009 Okay, I calibrated the unit twice last night and turned off the unit. Then I went out to find a cache tonight. I used the red arrow on the compass and on the map screen to get close to GZ and they seemed to work good. When I got within about 10 or 12 feet of GZ it pointed to my right, my left, then to my right and stayed there. Alas, the cache was to my right about 2 feet from what the GPSr was saying was GZ. My conclusion is that it worked as expected. The switching of directions near GZ is just from the bounce of position. I expect a little of that. So, maybe I just need to re-calibrate when it starts acting up. I will test some more over the next couple of days to see if it continues to work properly. Thanks for the feedback/suggestions. Quote Link to comment
+bittsen Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 The Colorado Compass still fails to live up to the idea that it was suppoed to be. In order to keep my Colorado working at its best, I have to turn the compass off. Quote Link to comment
+Red90 Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Red90, if it is a watch, then I would be returning the GPS. Shouldn't have to take off your jewelry so you can use your GPS! All magnetic compasses are affected by a watch....... You should never use a compass in a hand with a watch on it. Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Red90, if it is a watch, then I would be returning the GPS. Shouldn't have to take off your jewelry so you can use your GPS! All magnetic compasses are affected by a watch....... You should never use a compass in a hand with a watch on it. Is the compass in question magnetic? I know my PN-40's compass isn't, but not sure about the OP's. btw...never seen this problem with my trusty PN-40! Now, my OR 300...OUCH! Quote Link to comment
+user13371 Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 (edited) Is the compass in question magnetic? I know my PN-40's compass isn't...Not sure where you got that idea. It isn't a spinning needle, but the PN-40 does have a magentic compass. More specifically, a set of sensors that detect magnetic field and direction. Many GPSRs don't have a magnetic compass and can only tell your direction based on movement (so they don't tell you anything unless you're moving). The PN-20 & PN-30 would be examples of that... Edited September 2, 2009 by lee_rimar Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Is the compass in question magnetic? I know my PN-40's compass isn't...Not sure where you got that idea. It isn't a spinning needle, but the PN-40 does have a magentic compass. More specifically, a set of sensors that detect magnetic field and direction. Many GPSRs don't have a magnetic compass and can only tell your direction based on movement (so they don't tell you anything unless you're moving). The PN-20 & PN-30 would be examples of that... Maybe I have electronic and magnetic confused. Either way, I have never had a problem with my PN-40 and jewelry!! I've also never had a problem like I had with my OR 300.... Quote Link to comment
+user13371 Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 ...Maybe I have electronic and magnetic confused...So do the folks who market these things As far as I'm concerned, saying a GPSR has an "electronic compass" is ALMOST meaningless -- because it could mean too many things. At the very least, it means no moving parts (e.g., no physical compass needle). But beyond that it only mean "it uses electronics to tell your direction..." If the GPSR guesses your direction by plotting your points when you move, it can simulate what a real compass does... without any kind of magnetic sensor. Some would call that an "electronic compass" and others wouldn't. Saying "magnetic compass" is a little better. This could be the swinging needle of yore, or it could be any variety of magnetometers. There's a fairly long article over on GPS World ... http://www.gpsworld.com/gps/the-magnetic-compass-and-gps-828 that discusses how they work - and it does refer to "Needle Compasses" and "Electronic Compasses" Whether or not your personal jewelry has affected your own GPSR's compass in any way that you notice, ANY magnetic compass (mechanical or electronic) will be affected by metal objects nearby. That's what calibration is for -- to adjust the device for its environment. Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 ...Maybe I have electronic and magnetic confused...So do the folks who market these things As far as I'm concerned, saying a GPSR has an "electronic compass" is ALMOST meaningless -- because it could mean too many things. At the very least, it means no moving parts (e.g., no physical compass needle). But beyond that it only mean "it uses electronics to tell your direction..." If the GPSR guesses your direction by plotting your points when you move, it can simulate what a real compass does... without any kind of magnetic sensor. Some would call that an "electronic compass" and others wouldn't. Saying "magnetic compass" is a little better. This could be the swinging needle of yore, or it could be any variety of magnetometers. There's a fairly long article over on GPS World ... http://www.gpsworld.com/gps/the-magnetic-compass-and-gps-828 that discusses how they work - and it does refer to "Needle Compasses" and "Electronic Compasses" Whether or not your personal jewelry has affected your own GPSR's compass in any way that you notice, ANY magnetic compass (mechanical or electronic) will be affected by metal objects nearby. That's what calibration is for -- to adjust the device for its environment. I remember a conversation about this recently actually, something about using a metal carbiner to hook your GPS to yourself? However, a watch or other jewelry messing with my compass...I'll pay closer attention and see.... Quote Link to comment
+Gobble42 Posted September 4, 2009 Author Share Posted September 4, 2009 Yesterday I powered up the Colorado 400t at lunch and it locked up. Had to pull the batteries. Then in the evening the same thing happened again. So I then packed it up in order to send it back for a refund. Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ...Maybe I have electronic and magnetic confused...So do the folks who market these things As far as I'm concerned, saying a GPSR has an "electronic compass" is ALMOST meaningless -- because it could mean too many things. At the very least, it means no moving parts (e.g., no physical compass needle). But beyond that it only mean "it uses electronics to tell your direction..." If the GPSR guesses your direction by plotting your points when you move, it can simulate what a real compass does... without any kind of magnetic sensor. Some would call that an "electronic compass" and others wouldn't. Saying "magnetic compass" is a little better. This could be the swinging needle of yore, or it could be any variety of magnetometers. There's a fairly long article over on GPS World ... http://www.gpsworld.com/gps/the-magnetic-compass-and-gps-828 that discusses how they work - and it does refer to "Needle Compasses" and "Electronic Compasses" Whether or not your personal jewelry has affected your own GPSR's compass in any way that you notice, ANY magnetic compass (mechanical or electronic) will be affected by metal objects nearby. That's what calibration is for -- to adjust the device for its environment. I remember a conversation about this recently actually, something about using a metal carbiner to hook your GPS to yourself? However, a watch or other jewelry messing with my compass...I'll pay closer attention and see.... OK, question time...if jewelty can mess with the compass, what would a motorcycle's gas tank do? I'll tell you my observation...stopped and moving, the compass was still stable and true. All day. Quote Link to comment
+user13371 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 (edited) ...if jewelty can mess with the compass, what would a motorcycle's gas tank do? I'll tell you my observation...stopped and moving, the compass was still stable and true. All day. Okay, I'll assume you mean the compass on your PN-40, and not a needle compass. 1) Moving at anything over very slow walking pace, the GPSR is showing your direction based on point-to-point movement. Magnetic affects have no influence on the compass reading in this case. The GPSR is smart enough to see that if you've moved north at 60MPH in the past second, you're probably pointed north. 2) When standing still, the GPSR will figure out direction from the magnetic sensors in it. Metal near the compass (whether jewelry or the mass of your bike) won't likely make the needle swing around. But if you didn't calibrate the compass once in a while for the conditions where you use it, it may not point in exactly the right direction. The difference could be minor or not, depending on the conditions. DeLorme even suggests calibrating the compass when you change the batteries. I don't know if the electronics on the bike, spark plugs, etc would influence the magnetic compass in a PN-40 oray other GPSR. I imagine they could, but would leave it to others to answer that one. Edited September 4, 2009 by lee_rimar Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Red90, if it is a watch, then I would be returning the GPS. Shouldn't have to take off your jewelry so you can use your GPS! All magnetic compasses are affected by a watch....... You should never use a compass in a hand with a watch on it. Then I guess I don't understand this comment... Quote Link to comment
+Searching_ut Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ...Maybe I have electronic and magnetic confused...So do the folks who market these things As far as I'm concerned, saying a GPSR has an "electronic compass" is ALMOST meaningless -- because it could mean too many things. At the very least, it means no moving parts (e.g., no physical compass needle). But beyond that it only mean "it uses electronics to tell your direction..." If the GPSR guesses your direction by plotting your points when you move, it can simulate what a real compass does... without any kind of magnetic sensor. Some would call that an "electronic compass" and others wouldn't. Saying "magnetic compass" is a little better. This could be the swinging needle of yore, or it could be any variety of magnetometers. There's a fairly long article over on GPS World ... http://www.gpsworld.com/gps/the-magnetic-compass-and-gps-828 that discusses how they work - and it does refer to "Needle Compasses" and "Electronic Compasses" Whether or not your personal jewelry has affected your own GPSR's compass in any way that you notice, ANY magnetic compass (mechanical or electronic) will be affected by metal objects nearby. That's what calibration is for -- to adjust the device for its environment. I remember a conversation about this recently actually, something about using a metal carbiner to hook your GPS to yourself? However, a watch or other jewelry messing with my compass...I'll pay closer attention and see.... OK, question time...if jewelty can mess with the compass, what would a motorcycle's gas tank do? I'll tell you my observation...stopped and moving, the compass was still stable and true. All day. Roddy, It looks like somehow, the orange glow from your PN-40 might be blinding your observation powers somewhat. Magnetic needle, flux valve, or any type of compass, the basics still apply. The compass simply detects magnetic fields. No matter how you compensate for the conditions as they exist when you do your calibration, the minute you change something, accuracy of the compass in regards to the earths magnetic fields will change. Electrical fields, magnetic metals etc all alter the magnetic field around them. As these items move closer, or farther away from your sensor, they're going to change your reading somewhat, with some changes being very slight, others being quite extreme. The neat thing about GPS units is that once you're moving, they don't have to rely on magnetic fields, and can instead do very accurate calculations of your direction of travel through other means. Knowing your location and direction of travel allows your unit to compute all the other "Compass" information quite accurately, and without interference from magnetic fields. Quote Link to comment
+Rockin Roddy Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ...Maybe I have electronic and magnetic confused...So do the folks who market these things As far as I'm concerned, saying a GPSR has an "electronic compass" is ALMOST meaningless -- because it could mean too many things. At the very least, it means no moving parts (e.g., no physical compass needle). But beyond that it only mean "it uses electronics to tell your direction..." If the GPSR guesses your direction by plotting your points when you move, it can simulate what a real compass does... without any kind of magnetic sensor. Some would call that an "electronic compass" and others wouldn't. Saying "magnetic compass" is a little better. This could be the swinging needle of yore, or it could be any variety of magnetometers. There's a fairly long article over on GPS World ... http://www.gpsworld.com/gps/the-magnetic-compass-and-gps-828 that discusses how they work - and it does refer to "Needle Compasses" and "Electronic Compasses" Whether or not your personal jewelry has affected your own GPSR's compass in any way that you notice, ANY magnetic compass (mechanical or electronic) will be affected by metal objects nearby. That's what calibration is for -- to adjust the device for its environment. I remember a conversation about this recently actually, something about using a metal carbiner to hook your GPS to yourself? However, a watch or other jewelry messing with my compass...I'll pay closer attention and see.... OK, question time...if jewelty can mess with the compass, what would a motorcycle's gas tank do? I'll tell you my observation...stopped and moving, the compass was still stable and true. All day. Roddy, It looks like somehow, the orange glow from your PN-40 might be blinding your observation powers somewhat. Magnetic needle, flux valve, or any type of compass, the basics still apply. The compass simply detects magnetic fields. No matter how you compensate for the conditions as they exist when you do your calibration, the minute you change something, accuracy of the compass in regards to the earths magnetic fields will change. Electrical fields, magnetic metals etc all alter the magnetic field around them. As these items move closer, or farther away from your sensor, they're going to change your reading somewhat, with some changes being very slight, others being quite extreme. The neat thing about GPS units is that once you're moving, they don't have to rely on magnetic fields, and can instead do very accurate calculations of your direction of travel through other means. Knowing your location and direction of travel allows your unit to compute all the other "Compass" information quite accurately, and without interference from magnetic fields. I guess the ORANGE isn't bothering me too much, I understood and knew this. Must be the change was extremely slight because I didn't see anything different when moving or sitting still as I stated above. Quote Link to comment
+bittsen Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Yesterday I powered up the Colorado 400t at lunch and it locked up. Had to pull the batteries. Then in the evening the same thing happened again. So I then packed it up in order to send it back for a refund. Why not just update the firmware? Quote Link to comment
+Gobble42 Posted September 6, 2009 Author Share Posted September 6, 2009 Yesterday I powered up the Colorado 400t at lunch and it locked up. Had to pull the batteries. Then in the evening the same thing happened again. So I then packed it up in order to send it back for a refund. Why not just update the firmware? I had the most recent firmware. Also, I spent $300 dollars on it and expect it to work without any major problems, just like my "old" one does. I just got fed up; maybe GArmin will get the message too. Quote Link to comment
+bittsen Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Yesterday I powered up the Colorado 400t at lunch and it locked up. Had to pull the batteries. Then in the evening the same thing happened again. So I then packed it up in order to send it back for a refund. Why not just update the firmware? I had the most recent firmware. Also, I spent $300 dollars on it and expect it to work without any major problems, just like my "old" one does. I just got fed up; maybe GArmin will get the message too. I understand. Garmin was in a hurry to make some money on the colorado and released bug filled units. They did it with the Oregon also. If Garmin doesn't wake up and start hiring better programmers, they are going to rapidly lose their market share. Quote Link to comment
+Red90 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 You not being on the road, just means the map is not accurate, not that the GPS is not accurate. The Topo USA maps don't have very accurate road data. Quote Link to comment
+twolpert Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 To reiterate g-o-cashers comment (since it's way up the thread and you aren't the OP), be sure you are standing still and holding the unit flat when you take a reading using the electronic compass. If you are moving at any speed at all, you are getting direction based on satellite information, not the compass. If you don't hold the unit flat, you will always get readings which are inaccurate. Reading back through this thread, I am reminded that I don't know for sure whether or not the heading reported by the compass is affected by the magnetic/true north setting on the unit. I rather suspect that it is. If so, then when the unit is set to true north, zero degrees will point to the geographic north pole. When the unit is set to magnetic north, zero degrees will actually point east or west of the geographic pole by an amount equal to the local declination. Since we don't know the OP's location or the setting on the unit, it is possible that the constant 15 degree offset is due to declination. OP would have to be pretty far north, though. Much as I would like to try this out, I can't since my local declination is too near zero. Anybody out there with a Colorado and a discernible local declination want to volunteer Quote Link to comment
sokolo0 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Reading back through this thread, I am reminded that I don't know for sure whether or not the heading reported by the compass is affected by the magnetic/true north setting on the unit. I rather suspect that it is. ...... Much as I would like to try this out, I can't since my local declination is too near zero. Anybody out there with a Colorado and a discernible local declination want to volunteer Garmin unit has some kind of "declination table" in memory. When we move to area with another value of magnetic deviation it changes automatically. Like before in b&wLegend, 60CS,... Christopher Quote Link to comment
+twolpert Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Reading back through this thread, I am reminded that I don't know for sure whether or not the heading reported by the compass is affected by the magnetic/true north setting on the unit. I rather suspect that it is. ...... Much as I would like to try this out, I can't since my local declination is too near zero. Anybody out there with a Colorado and a discernible local declination want to volunteer Garmin unit has some kind of "declination table" in memory. When we move to area with another value of magnetic deviation it changes automatically. Like before in b&wLegend, 60CS,... Christopher I know that. What I want to know is whether the compass always shows a true north heading, or whether it shows a magnetic heading if the unit is set to magnetic. Quote Link to comment
+Red90 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 If set to magnetic, it shows a magnetic heading. If set to "true" it shows a true heading. Quote Link to comment
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