GPS use on Commercial Aircraft

[+Frisco Finders]

As a pilot for American Airlines, I've never understood why we wouldn't let our passengers use their personal GPSr's on the airplane while other airlines were allowing this. After much discussion, I glad to announce that as of today, American Airlines has announced that you MAY use your personal GPSr while on board and in flight. This MUST be a stand alone unit and not the GPS feature of your cell phone. (FYI, those don't really work anyway). But once your about 10,000 feet and they make the announcement that you can use your devices, whip out your GPSr and follow along. MAKE SURE I'M NOT LOST!!

[+Rockin Roddy]

As a pilot for American Airlines, I've never understood why we wouldn't let our passengers use their personal GPSr's on the airplane while other airlines were allowing this. After much discussion, I glad to announce that as of today, American Airlines has announced that you MAY use your personal GPSr while on board and in flight. This MUST be a stand alone unit and not the GPS feature of your cell phone. (FYI, those don't really work anyway). But once your about 10,000 feet and they make the announcement that you can use your devices, whip out your GPSr and follow along. MAKE SURE I'M NOT LOST!!

 

Great!

 

It's fun to watch along with the GPS, kind of even helps time go by. Knowing where you are and how long until you land is great!

[+JBnW]

Cool deal, indeed! Just for clarification, should passengers still ask and make sure its OK? I ask 'cuz I've been on another airline that said the same thing, and was listed as allowing GPS use, but the flight attendant said "No" when asked...

[+Frisco Finders]

Cool deal, indeed! Just for clarification, should passengers still ask and make sure its OK? I ask 'cuz I've been on another airline that said the same thing, and was listed as allowing GPS use, but the flight attendant said "No" when asked...

 

Here is the email I received.

 

TO: ALL PILOTS ¶

 

RE: HAND HELD GPS DEVICES ¶

 

.¶

 

PASSENGERS ARE NOW ALLOWED TO USE HANDHELD GPS DEVICES IN ¶

 

FLIGHT. HOWEVER, USE OF THE GPS FUNCTION ON CELL PHONES IS ¶

 

STILL PROHIBITED.

.¶

 

HANDHELD NON-TRANSMITTING GPS DEVICES WILL BE ADDED TO THE ¶

 

LIST OF APPROVED PORTABLE ELECTRONIC DEVICES IN FM PT I, SEC ¶

 

13 WITH THE PUBLICATION OF REV 108. THE FLIGHT ATTENDANT ¶

 

MANUAL HAS ALREADY BEEN UPDATED, AND THE PROHIBITION AGAINST ¶

 

HANDHELD GPS USE IN FLIGHT FORMERLY INCLUDED IN THE AMERICAN ¶

 

WAY HAS BEEN REMOVED. THEY ARE IN THE PROCESS OF REMOVING THE¶

 

PROHIBITION FROM THE AA.COM WEBSITE. ¶

 

So if they question you,,,, just politely tell them that it is your understanding that this is a new change. You can pull out the American Way magazine and show them that it has been removed from prohibited devices.

 

Now all you have to do is get a window seat!

[+Y2KOTA]

Cool, I just made reservations on AA for in about a week from TPA to LAS. Yes, GPSr and a T/B will be in tow.

[+boda]

Good to see.

 

I flew American a couple of years ago. I checked online beforehand and missed any mention of their not being allowed. I asked the flight attendant as I boarded and she said to wait until the annoucement concerning electronic devices, then I could turn it on. It was fun for awhile. As I deplaned, the pilots were standing at the cockpit door and as I passed they asked how it worked.

 

MAKE SURE I'M NOT LOST!!

Don't worry, I always do. I will admit that I have never had to discuss the matter with the crew.

[+myotis]

FINALLY!!!!!!

 

I could never understand why and I complained many times.

[+DiamondDuo]

Is this change of policy related to this recent incident?

[NordicMan]

Is this change of policy related to this recent incident?

 

Geez that guy was an IDIOT for what he did.. he deserves the treatment he got.

[+Rockin Roddy]

Is this change of policy related to this recent incident?

 

Geez that guy was an IDIOT for what he did.. he deserves the treatment he got.

 

I disagree. He may have made a minor error by not asking permission to use the device, but that's minor compared to the WAY over-the-top reaction on the part of the airlines personnel. Having him arrested and removed from the plane, really? And why the "ambush" style attack...waiting for the man to go to the bathroom and then taking his devide. I don't get that at all, they took his phone, I'm sure they could have just as easily taken the device then as well.

 

Sure, bad judgement for not asking, but the actions of the airlines staff was uncalled for and then to be cuffed in NY?

[NordicMan]

Is this change of policy related to this recent incident?

 

Geez that guy was an IDIOT for what he did.. he deserves the treatment he got.

 

I disagree. He may have made a minor error by not asking permission to use the device, but that's minor compared to the WAY over-the-top reaction on the part of the airlines personnel. Having him arrested and removed from the plane, really? And why the "ambush" style attack...waiting for the man to go to the bathroom and then taking his devide. I don't get that at all, they took his phone, I'm sure they could have just as easily taken the device then as well.

 

Sure, bad judgement for not asking, but the actions of the airlines staff was uncalled for and then to be cuffed in NY?

 

..he took a really obscure unknown "prototype" device and attached it to the plane (via the putty) then left to go to the bathroom

[+splashy]

The feeling save sensation in an aircraft, is very wrong, because no way anybody knows what's in your carry on, like laptop, photocamera or any combination of all the gadgets we all have with us.

What happened here is the fear and staff being unreasonable and even worse, not thinking clear.

 

Actually I think Gps should not be allowed on a commercial flight, often you have a bad reading anyway, besides from sitting for hours with your arms up and not to mention the possible danger it might give, because you know exactly where you are.

[+Buddies-Buddies]

That flight is only one of many diverted flights that land at my airport - mostly due to our location being the first point of land after crossing the Atlantic Ocean.

 

Glad to hear that they are allowing people to use these passive devices on board now (sans cellphone apps)... obviously they do not interfere with the instruments or people would not be allowed to carry them onboard.

 

BTW have you ever heard the no cellphone use due to interference pre-flight speech? I always wondered why they say it could interfere with the instruments - obviously not true or no one would be allowed to have them onboard the flight.

 

Maybe it has more to do with the long explanation of cellphones working by line of site and you will lock onto ALOT of towers if you do use your phone at high altitude.

 

I would hate to see the roaming charges on that bill!

 

[+scorpio_dark]

I disagree. He may have made a minor error by not asking permission to use the device, but that's minor compared to the WAY over-the-top reaction on the part of the airlines personnel. Having him arrested and removed from the plane, really? And why the "ambush" style attack...waiting for the man to go to the bathroom and then taking his devide. I don't get that at all, they took his phone, I'm sure they could have just as easily taken the device then as well.

 

Sure, bad judgement for not asking, but the actions of the airlines staff was uncalled for and then to be cuffed in NY?

 

..he took a really obscure unknown "prototype" device and attached it to the plane (via the putty) then left to go to the bathroom

 

If the putty caused that much of a scare, then why did a staff member remove the device in the short time that the "offender" was in the bathroom? BOOM!!!!!!!!

 

And no, it doesn't look all that obscure either.

 

Yeah, this was a going through the motions reaction. Not reacting at all would have been irresponsible, but reacting this way was just lame.

[+Team Cotati]

Give the option, I'll never fly on American Airlines.

[+sbell111]

Cool deal, indeed! Just for clarification, should passengers still ask and make sure its OK? I ask 'cuz I've been on another airline that said the same thing, and was listed as allowing GPS use, but the flight attendant said "No" when asked...

If it's listed as OK, I never ask.

[+wimseyguy]

As a pilot for American Airlines, I've never understood why we wouldn't let our passengers use their personal GPSr's on the airplane while other airlines were allowing this. After much discussion, I glad to announce that as of today, American Airlines has announced that you MAY use your personal GPSr while on board and in flight. This MUST be a stand alone unit and not the GPS feature of your cell phone. (FYI, those don't really work anyway). But once your about 10,000 feet and they make the announcement that you can use your devices, whip out your GPSr and follow along. MAKE SURE I'M NOT LOST!!

 

Great!

 

It's fun to watch along with the GPS, kind of even helps time go by. Knowing where you are and how long until you land is great!

 

Agreed-it's always fun to know what you are looking at on the ant farm below. We caught a stiff tail wind on the trip to Italy a few years back and sped along at 680 mph for a while. I never cleared the trip computer page from my old 60C because of that. And one time I was a bad boy and didn't stow my GPS during landing in New Orleans. My GPS must have lost lock and kept calculating as the display showed us skidding off the runway and right into the terminal.

[+paleolith]

BTW have you ever heard the no cellphone use due to interference pre-flight speech? I always wondered why they say it could interfere with the instruments - obviously not true or no one would be allowed to have them onboard the flight.

The truly frightening thing is that the danger may very well be real, but not only are the airlines not trying to enforce it, but they actually want to put cells on planes. Why? Revenue -- if you're locked to their cell, they can charge you for using it.

 

There was an article in the March 2006 issue of IEEE Spectrum, written by four independent researchers who have studied these issues in detail, and they believe that the risks are very real, albeit small. On the average flight at least one cell phone is left on. The researchers were able to detect them, why not the airlines? Cost to monitor? Loss of future revenue from selling cell service? Loss of revenue from angry passengers if one airline gets serious and the others don't?

 

Most in the know say the real reason cell phones are prohibited on planes is that they are visible to so many cell towers and thus tie up a lot of channels.

 

Now, I'm still flying, even after reading that article. But I would certainly like to see aircraft designed to minimize the potential danger. The danger is obviously small (given an average of one cell phone per flight left on and no apparent increase in accidents), but laughing at that small danger doesn't make it go away.

 

Edward

[davnig]

Is this change of policy related to this recent incident?

 

Geez that guy was an IDIOT for what he did.. he deserves the treatment he got.

 

You must be trolling with that statement!

 

So a guy has a bit of unidentified mp3 player sized technology, sticks it on his seat with what is effectively blutak and he deserves to get fined $30000, get real.

 

This is just typical of the overreaction and stifling , unnecessary security on planes, hell - everywhere, nowadays. And this is where i switch into area 51 conspiracy mode - just scare tactics to make us all kowtow to unnecessary demands and intrusions on our personal space and private lives - cctv, id cards, email retention, browsing history retention. . .

 

Don't forget, 1984 was NOT an instruction manual!!!

 

Aaaaand breathe, there i feel better now, thank you for listening to this rant, lol

Edited September 5, 2009 by davnig

[+NYPaddleCacher]

That flight is only one of many diverted flights that land at my airport - mostly due to our location being the first point of land after crossing the Atlantic Ocean.

 

Glad to hear that they are allowing people to use these passive devices on board now (sans cellphone apps)... obviously they do not interfere with the instruments or people would not be allowed to carry them onboard.

 

BTW have you ever heard the no cellphone use due to interference pre-flight speech? I always wondered why they say it could interfere with the instruments - obviously not true or no one would be allowed to have them onboard the flight.

 

 

I think it was when I got a Motorola Razr that I noticed that if I let it sit near my computer I would occasionally hear a sound coming from my speakers that went "bup a dup bup a dup bup a dup". At first I had no idea that it was caused by the cell phone but one time I had it sitting under my monitor and it not caused audio interference but flickered the screen on my monitor as well. I've since had a blackberry and now an iPhone and both will produce audio from the computer speakers and my iphone produces interference with my car radio as well.

 

A cell phone is not a passive device. It's a receiver/transmitter. Any transmitter will transmit a signal on a specific frequency but it will also produce harmonics (on multiples of that frequency). Remember CB radio?Citizen Band radios received and transmitted on "channels" which started around 27 megahertz. Before there was cable televisions received their signals on an antenna and each TV channel used a specific frequency as well. Channel 2 was at 54 megahertz and channel 5 used 108 megahertz, both multiples of the frequency used by CB radio. It was not uncommon for someone watching tv on channels 2 or 5 to hear "Breaker Breaker channel 19, this is Rubber Duck...". I used to own a CB radio and built a large antenna. I once had a visit from someone a couple of blocks away complaining that they could hear me loud and clear on the TV.

[+Frisco Finders]

BTW have you ever heard the no cellphone use due to interference pre-flight speech? I always wondered why they say it could interfere with the instruments - obviously not true or no one would be allowed to have them onboard the flight.

The truly frightening thing is that the danger may very well be real, but not only are the airlines not trying to enforce it, but they actually want to put cells on planes. Why? Revenue -- if you're locked to their cell, they can charge you for using it.

 

There was an article in the March 2006 issue of IEEE Spectrum, written by four independent researchers who have studied these issues in detail, and they believe that the risks are very real, albeit small. On the average flight at least one cell phone is left on. The researchers were able to detect them, why not the airlines? Cost to monitor? Loss of future revenue from selling cell service? Loss of revenue from angry passengers if one airline gets serious and the others don't?

 

Most in the know say the real reason cell phones are prohibited on planes is that they are visible to so many cell towers and thus tie up a lot of channels.

 

Now, I'm still flying, even after reading that article. But I would certainly like to see aircraft designed to minimize the potential danger. The danger is obviously small (given an average of one cell phone per flight left on and no apparent increase in accidents), but laughing at that small danger doesn't make it go away.

 

Edward

 

Risks are NOT VERY REAL. If they were then you would be checking your cell phone in checked luggage or cell phone "jammers" installed to prevent inflight use,,,, which by the way will only work,,, on a good day,,, up to around 5,000' AGL. Lost revenue IS NO WAY part of the equation as there has been a nationwide capacity reduction of over 15% over the last 3 years. Hence, there isn't many other options for travels.

 

Theories discussed in meetings to which I've attended point to the fact that nobody wants to hear other people talking on their cell phone for 4 hours while on a plane. That is why the inflight internet systems block programs such as SKYPE, so that you can't talk on your phone.

 

The biggest danger you face is some yahoo hitting your car on the way to the airport because they're texting or talking on their phone while driving, not from some PED effecting the aircraft.

 

Just my thoughts,,,, I personally like sitting near the window and following along with my GPS. See near by cities and towns, and can check speed and ETA,,,,,, you know,,,geeky GPS fun stuff!!

[+DENelson83]

What airplanes need is a dedicated, electromagnetically isolated network of wiring emanating from a GPS antenna on the roof of the plane, which personal GPS receivers can be plugged into for an excellent fix.

[eaparks]

Northwest Plane overshoots Minneapolis Airport by 150 miles. http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-natio...port.Overflown/ It's ashame a passenger wasn't playing around with their GPS at the time and notified the Flight Attendant and said, "Excuse me, but according to my GPS we have passed Minneapolis and are getting further away, could you check on the captain please?" Surely a savings of 150 miles in jet fuel would warrant a big Thank You and maybe a free ticket.