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Is this a benchmark?


Pontoffel Pock

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If the image is already uploaded to another web site, then when you are writing a post on these forums you can click on the small icon above the text entry box that looks like a picture of a tree, and it will prompt you for the url of the image. If you haven't yet uploaded the image, you could do so somewhere on the geocaching site then use that link.

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I can see the image, and it looks like a survey mark of some importance. Whether it is a 'benchmark' depends on you definition, and the reason the mark was set in the first place.

Most folks want to know if they can log it at Geocaching.com or not.

This mark may or may not be listed in the database, but without the co-ordinates for it's location it's hard to tell. Since the stamping on the mark says 1991, there is a possibility that it is included, but by no means can anyone tell without knowing the location.

 

We need the co-ordinates.

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a picture of a tree, and it will prompt you for the url of the image.

Thought I had it, then I got "dynamic posts not allowed" error :D

The URL for the photo must end in a type of ".jpg", ".gif" or some other image type. It cannot end in .html or other web page types.

 

If you image is on a web page, you cannot use the URL of the page, you must use the URL of the image. To get that, in Firefox right-click on the image and click on "Copy Image Location" for Mozilla, or in IE right-click on the image, click on "Properties" and cut "URL".

Edited by Papa-Bear-NYC
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Sorry, I didn't mean for this to be a 'how do I post a pic' thread.

My 'right-click' does not give me an URL anything option. I know very little about computers and I am not to worried about it at the moment since you were able to see what I was talking about. Thanx for the suggestions.

 

I will try to get the co-ords of that marker.

 

Shawn.

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Those coords -

44 13 30 N 119 37 31.5 W is in the center of Oregon.

The Oregon version of the coords have no benchmarks in that area in the benchmarks database.

The search window to look with coords is here.

 

It looks like a USDA Forest Service triangulation station. It was apparently never submitted to the NGS which is why it isn't on the benchmark database here.

 

There are hundreds of thousands of marks not included in the database we use here. You can read about that here in the FAQ

Edited by Black Dog Trackers
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Wow, thats a lot of info.

So this disc appears do be a triagulation station? Should there be more numbers? Is the'1991' thats on the disc the year or altitude? If it is a tri' station, how can I locate the others around it?

 

sorry, more questions.

Shawn.

 

Edit; it's not the altitude, just mapped it. Those co-ords and the surrounding area are about 4500ft.

Edited by Pontoffel Pock
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Pontoffel Pock,

 

BDT mentioned that it was not listed as a station in the NGS database. I even searched ALL text for the state of Oregon portion of the NGS database (not just the station name) hoping I might find where Bronco was mentioned in passing as a reference object but I came up empty-handed.

Grant County has no online databases that I know of so there is no help there.

 

You could always go find this one and then log it on Waymarking.com (to get some recognition for the name “Bronco”!)

 

I really like the early Broncos. What a classic design.

 

Maybe we will see each other up in the Tillamook National Forest some day.

 

-The TillaMurphs

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Maybe we will see each other up in the Tillamook National Forest some day.

We are over there every couple of months playing in the Brown Camp OHV area. There are quite a few geocaches in them hills (though I have only done a few).

 

He mentioned that the marker was close to a Bronco reservoir {sp?} and a Bronco creek.

 

Shawn.

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So this disc appears do be a triagulation station? Should there be more numbers? Is the'1991' thats on the disc the year or altitude? If it is a tri' station, how can I locate the others around it?

 

Shawn.

 

Edit; it's not the altitude, just mapped it. Those co-ords and the surrounding area are about 4500ft.

 

IF it is a triangulation station, you would need the original documentation from the 1991 monumentation to tell you where the other reference objects are. However, since you don’t have that, you could always search in a 30 meter radius around the mark to see if you can find other disks. With a typical USC&GS triangulation station, that is where the reference marks are usually (but not always) contained.

 

However, since this is a USDA/USFS disk I don’t know if the same general rules apply. I don’t even know if this is a triangulation station. We once found a USDA/USFS disk (from 1936) that had a station type name but was not part of a triangulation station set of disks.

 

There is an EXCELLENT write-up about “Disks in the Vicinity of USC&GS Triangulation Stations” pinned to the top of the Benchmarking forum.

 

If you ever find out more about this – please let us know.

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Many Federal agencies perform surveys for either boundary or engineering purposes. In the course of that, particularly if GPS is involved, they may set control points to use as GPS RTK bases or other purposes. I would call them project control.

 

I suspect this is one such point. These are seldom submitted to NGS and would not usually have any RM's or Azimuth marks. You may be able to find information by contacting the USFS office in the area, or the Regional USFS office. They often have a regional surveyor who may keep records, and there are sometimes forest surveyors.

 

Similar monuments might exist for F&WS, BLM, NPS and COE, even Bureau of Reclamation at one time did a lot of surveying for projects. Besides Federal agencies you might expect to find monumented project control points for state agencies like DNR's or even on private surveys. State DOT's more often submit their work to NGS than other agencies but not always.

 

I did a lot of conventional control (pre GPS) by traverse in BLM, mostly for photo control and we set monuments all over the west. We even did a bit of control using a pre-GPS system called Transit Doppler which was only good to a meter or so at best.

 

I would not be surprised if records of many of the stations I set have been lost track of over the years since they are often kept with a particular office or project and eventually archived or disposed of.

 

That doesn't make me happy either.

 

- jlw

Edited by jwahl
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Being that it appears to be resting on ground and not incased in a concrete monument, rock or a very stable manmade structure, this point would not meet NGS or it's predecessors strict stability requirements. This mark is most likely a metal disc resting on top of a rebar that is driven into the ground. Points like these are often used by surveyors for project specific control. The Forest Service may use this point as primary control for boundary and topographical surveys within their land.

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