What should I do

[+uxorious]

WAY too much emphasis is placed by some on signing the log. It may be seen as some sort of "rule" to sign the log but in cases like this there is no doubt that he found the hidden container. Mission accomplished. Signing the log is secondary.

 

There is way too much emphasis on this being just a game, with no rules, just guidelines. If you feel just finding the container is "mission accomplished", that's fine for you and those that find your cache. However, don't expect all players to agree with you.

 

There is very few things I would delete a log for. On any cache I hide, it is between me and the person who finds it, as to what the rules are. I will not log a find on a cache where I cannot either sign the log or, if the log is gone, wet or otherwise not sign-able, prove I found it. (picture or description.)

 

If someone logs they found my cache but didn't sign the log, I might e-mail them and tell them why I think they should delete their found. If they don't I probably won't.

 

If you found the puzzle cache and could not open the lock, but logged it as a find anyway, I would feel you were wrong, but if it wasn't my cache, I wouldn't care.

 

I do firmly believe in this case just finding the cache, but not opening the lock, it is not a find.

[Clan Riffster]

Just to be clear, would it be OK if I walked out to a 5/5 kayak cache and, upon seeing there's a large body of water between me and the cache location, I just decide to log the find? I did try, I know the container is out there...somewhere. If you answer no, why not? It's just a G-A-M-E.

This is the attitude I was referring to when I mentioned this really isn't a religion. Really. It's not. Some folks get all worked up over what are really pretty minor issues. I reckon we could refer to these folks as The First Church of Cache My Way or Burn in Hades Forever. Brother Roddy, I gotta give you props. You certainly bring your passion for the game to the forums.

I'll pretend for just a moment that your's was a serious question: OK to who? Wouldn't that kind of question best be directed to the cache owner? Surely you've been here long enough to know you'll never reach a consensus on anything, so it's safe to assume you aren't asking the group for their thoughts on the matter. If the cache were mine, I would tell you "No", standing on shore, 5 miles away, staring at the cache page printout doesn't quite meet my definition of a find. Judging by your apparent ability to utilize complex tools such as keyboards, I must assume that you are bright enough to see the distinction between the two scenarios, and as such, you are only bringing it up in the hopes of generating an argument of some sort. If that's the case, I say "Bravo". I always applaud good work. In your aforementioned incredibly silly example, you mention that you know the cache is out there, somewhere. This is the only part of your nonsensical ravings that piqued my curiosity. How, exactly, do you know the cache is out there unless you go find it?

 

Finding the container is only half the battle, you need to sign the logbook too!

While I happen to agree with this ideal, for my own finds, I wouldn't dream of insisting that this was The One True Path To Righteous Geocaching and those who don't follow it are condemned as sinners. Obviously I'm not cut out to be an Elder in your Church. An Acolyte, maybe? I can light candles! I can sing in Latin! I look good in a robe! Pretty please?

 

that's NOT a find

Is this official Church Dogma, or just Roddy's thoughts on the matter?

 

Still, I supose that I'd be wrong for deleting a log like that to.

I keep refreshing the page, hoping the smiley faces would pop up after such a silly statement. Please tell me you weren't serious.

You're equating what is quite possibly a newbie mistake with destroying someone's cache?

 

I'm notorious for not signing logbooks

Yet, earlier, you stated that you need to sign the logbook in order for your find to have merit.

Brother? Have you sinned? Do you need to give Confession?

Say 5 Hail Signals & hide two ammo cans and your sins will be forgiven.

 

Yeah, its a game, and games have rules.

If there weren't rules then it wouldn't be a game.

That's probably true with most games. However, with this one, all we get are guidelines.

Incidently, signing the log as a requirement for claiming a find isn't in there.

 

I do firmly believe in this case just finding the cache, but not opening the lock, it is not a find.

Yeah, I agree. I wouldn't claim it as a find. But I'm not at the point where I'd break out the pitchforks & torches.

Edited June 1, 2009 by Clan Riffster

[GOF and Bacall]

"No", standing on shore, 5 miles away, staring at the cache page printout doesn't quite meet my definition of a find. Judging by your apparent ability to utilize complex tools such as keyboards, I must assume that you are bright enough to see the distinction between the two scenarios, and as such, you are only bringing it up in the hopes of generating an argument of some sort. If that's the case, I say "Bravo". I always applaud good work. In your aforementioned incredibly silly example, you mention that you know the cache is out there, somewhere. This is the only part of your nonsensical ravings that piqued my curiosity. How, exactly, do you know the cache is out there unless you go find it?

 

The point of the kayak cache was to reach the location. The point of the puzzle cache was to solve the puzzle. Situations seem very similar to me. We are, hypothetically speaking, taking the cache owners word for it. Are you saying that you didn't hypothetically hide that hypothetically cache? Hypothetically speaking.

[+Rockin Roddy]

Clan, my friend, do you read everything or are you skimming? I believe I posed that question about standing on shore to the person who was shouting out about this only being a G-A-M-E...did you miss that? It WAS a serious question, not to start an argument as you seem to believe, but to get that person (and others) to think about the situation a moment...I hope it worked!

 

Also, you may have missed where I said I wasn't one who believed every situation required a log signed and YES, I have sinned, my brother! I would also hope that, since you too have been around awhile, you'd know that any commnt I make is MY opinion and how I play. Of course, it's up to the owner of the cache and I believe the CO has voiced their agreement to some of what I have said (must be I'm not waaay off here??)!

 

I contend that my example is neither silly nor inflamatory, and is just one of three (or four, I can't recall and am too lazy to check) that I gave, each getting a bit closer to what the situation at hand is. I think the example of actually being able to see the container (the climbing one) is best and shows why opening the container (at the very least) is needed in order to know you actually did find the right container!

 

I see your comments as more inflamatory than any example I gave or, for that matter, most any post in this thread...is that what you were shooting for?? btw...pitchforks and torches? Is there never room for discussion, or is it always one extreme or another (it's only a G-A-M-E or pitchforks and torches)?

[+Rockin Roddy]

I would like to poin out that, when this activity started, I believe (and could be wrong here) that the requirements were you find the container, sign the log and make any trades? I think signing the log was one of the pure essentials of the original activity...has this changed somewhere?

[+Castle Mischief]

 

that's NOT a find

 

Is this official Church Dogma, or just Roddy's thoughts on the matter?

 

I'm hesitant to call Geocaching.com a church and even more reluctant to call the guidelines a "bible", but if you'll turn to Geocaching Home > Getting Started > Finding a Geocache, under "Step 4 – The Actual Find" and look at bulleted item #2:

 

Sign the logbook with your name, the date, and a few words about your experience.

 

The frog has spoken, hallelujah, etc., etc.

 

It's not like Roddy pulled the concept out of his helmet. I'm pretty sure the majority of cachers would expect to sign the log and the majority of cache hiders expect that you sign their log.

 

If they don't and if they do or don't get wrapped around an axle about it is another matter.

[+Userzero]

I think that people should be allowed to play the way they want to. People who do not want to write their name in the log could log a find anyway. And cache owners who do not accept that as a find could delete the log. And all within Groundspeak guidelines.

 

Puts on nomex underwear...

[+Castle Mischief]

I think that people should be allowed to play the way they want to. People who do not want to write their name in the log could log a find anyway. And cache owners who do not accept that as a find could delete the log. And all within Groundspeak guidelines.

 

Puts on nomex underwear...

 

It says in the guidelines that you can log on-line without signing the physical log? Really?

[+herrozerro]

I think that people should be allowed to play the way they want to. People who do not want to write their name in the log could log a find anyway. And cache owners who do not accept that as a find could delete the log. And all within Groundspeak guidelines.

 

Puts on nomex underwear...

 

It says in the guidelines that you can log on-line without signing the physical log? Really?

 

Easy Steps to Geocaching

 

1 Register for a free membership.

2 Click "Hide & Seek a Cache."

3 Enter your postal code and click "search."

4 Choose any geocache from the list and click on its name.

5 Enter the coordinates of the geocache into your GPS Device.

6 Use your GPS device to assist you in finding the hidden geocache.

7 Sign the logbook and return the geocache to its original location.

8 Share your geocaching stories and photos online.

 

I dont really see a "log your finds online" In all honesty the game itself is more about the physical caches then the online logging.

[+herrozerro]

too many post

Edited June 1, 2009 by herrozerro

[+herrozerro]

way too many post

Edited June 1, 2009 by herrozerro

[+flask]

 

Yes, I am an extremist. Because you said it was "arbitrary". That was the whole purpose of putting a lock on the cache so they would have to figure out the combo.

 

Yup, so a nice friendly outing with the kids is now turned into a PIA situation.

 

Real friendly game you want to play.

 

Oh well, there are a lot more "nice" people out there then there are a**es.

 

don't get out much, do you? what's alarming to me about your post is that you seem to think a puzzle cache is an aberration.

 

well, fine. don't do them. if you take your kids out to a puzzle cache and you can't sign the log because you didn't do your homework, it's your problem.

 

it is disturbing to me that you think people who make puzzle caches are asses and people who don't are nice people.

 

you don't appear to me to be a very nice person or a friendly one, and yet you don't sound like a designer of puzzles. hmmmm.

[+Rockin Roddy]

I think that people should be allowed to play the way they want to. People who do not want to write their name in the log could log a find anyway. And cache owners who do not accept that as a find could delete the log. And all within Groundspeak guidelines.

 

Puts on nomex underwear...

 

It says in the guidelines that you can log on-line without signing the physical log? Really?

 

Easy Steps to Geocaching

 

1 Register for a free membership.

2 Click "Hide & Seek a Cache."

3 Enter your postal code and click "search."

4 Choose any geocache from the list and click on its name.

5 Enter the coordinates of the geocache into your GPS Device.

6 Use your GPS device to assist you in finding the hidden geocache.

7 Sign the logbook and return the geocache to its original location.

8 Share your geocaching stories and photos online.

 

I dont really see a "log your finds online" In all honesty the game itself is more about the physical caches then the online logging.

 

Although that's not what CM said, I made clearer the part you must have missed!

[+herrozerro]

Although that's not what CM said, I made clearer the part you must have missed!

 

there is a differance between "Share your geocaching stories and photos online." and "Sign the virtual logbook on geocaching online."

 

You can easily do number 8 just by using the forums.

 

But 7 is pretty specific.

Edited June 1, 2009 by herrozerro

[+flask]

 

Yes, I am an extremist. Because you said it was "arbitrary". That was the whole purpose of putting a lock on the cache so they would have to figure out the combo.

 

Yup, so a nice friendly outing with the kids is now turned into a PIA situation.

 

Real friendly game you want to play.

 

Oh well, there are a lot more "nice" people out there then there are a**es.

 

don't get out much, do you? what's alarming to me about your post is that you seem to think a puzzle cache is an aberration.

 

well, fine. don't do them. if you take your kids out to a puzzle cache and you can't sign the log because you didn't do your homework, it's your problem.

 

it is disturbing to me that you think people who make puzzle caches are asses and people who don't are nice people.

 

you don't appear to me to be a very nice person or a friendly one, and yet you don't sound like a designer of puzzles. hmmmm.

[+Mule Ears]

Just checked the cache page, and there's no log matching the OP's description, so the problem's apparently solved. I'd be interested to know who deleted it, the cache owner or the (non) finder.

 

I see this particular cache as analogous to a multi. Finding the container is stage 1; getting inside is the final. The cache description makes the nature of the cache clear as day. I wouldn't accept a found log for a multi based on finding only the first stage, so I'd also disallow a find here. Since the (non) finder in question was a newbie, I'd drop an email first explaining that it's customary to sign the log in order to claim a find unless the cache owner allows otherwise.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Me thinks you should petition Groundspeak to rid Puzzle caches as they have with ALRs, since in your context he found the container.

Great idea!

 

I supported the demise of ALRs and believe that logic should extend to all geocaches.

 

I hereby petition and request that the perceived 'requirement' to complete ANY TASK other than navigating to given coordinates by use of a GPS, finding the correct cache and proving your find by signing the paper log OR otherwise furnishing adequate proof that the finder actually found the correct cache be eliminated from any real or perceived Guideline on cache signing and/or logging requirements.

 

I further petition that the phrase "Adequate Proof" of a find be adopted into the Guidelines. The word "adequate" has been found to be useful in the context of gaining permission; it is my belief that "adequate" can just as easily be applied to proving the find... a picture or clear verbal or written description of the cache container and its location emailed to the cache owner should be adequate to prove that the find was in fact made. We take the cache hider's word as proof that he considered and sought adequate permission for the hide, we should by natural extension allow finders the trust of providing something adequate besides a signature as proof of a find.

 

If, as I believe, finding the hidden container is the object and foundation of this game then anything beyond correctly identifying and adequately proving your having found the correct container (even if only one of a group together at the hide site touches it) is an Additional Logging Requirement.

 

The common language definition of the word "found" neither contains nor implies the word "signed"... that relationship has been wholly conceived in this game. Neither does the word "proof" limit itself to "signed". There are many ways to prove a find without signing the paper log. In reality if you can see, identify and describe the (final, not decoy) container but cannot touch it for whatever reason then you have indeed proved that you found the container. This is in fact already common in groups where one signs a team name but all present log the find.

 

Now, I have been at the center of this hornet's nest before, for finding the cache and signing the outside of the container, so I play the game as if signing the paper log were in fact required and don't claim a find on anything where I didn't sign the paper log (except when in a group). I accept that this is the way the community overall wants the game to be played AND agree that signing the paper log is and should be the normal and accepted best practice. Again, I believe that signing the paper log should continue to be the norm.

 

However, there are (and should be) exceptions to anything... If I am out with a group in which only one person has solved the puzzle and she takes us all to find the final then I will sign and log it, even though I did not (and will not, I hate 'em!) work the puzzle.

 

If, as in the OP case, I find the final cache and the owner agrees that I have indeed found the correct cache container then it is indisputably a find, regardless of how I found it or whether I can open it.

 

The puzzle should be an option... proving that I found the cache is the game.

 

Give cachers the final coordinates and let them decide if they want to do the other stuff... to solve the puzzle, find all of the stages, complete some challenge or just go find the cache... to do anything else is an Additional Logging Requirement over and above finding the cache using a GPS.

 

By the very logic with which ALRs were eliminated Challenges, Puzzles and Multis are in no way entitled to special treatment or exception, else we then have two distinct games... one of using a GPS to find hidden caches and quite another where cache owners direct and control cachers to complete additional tasks to log the find (ALRs). If we are to maintain the latter then eliminating ALRs made no sense at all.

Edited June 1, 2009 by TheAlabamaRambler

[+StarBrand]

Nonsense - delete the log - they didn't sign the log(sheet, book, paper) inside the cache.

[+Chrysalides]

I supported the demise of ALRs and believe that logic should extend to all geocaches.

 

I hereby petition and request that the perceived 'requirement' to complete ANY TASK other than navigating to given coordinates by use of a GPS, finding the correct cache and proving your find by signing the paper log OR otherwise furnishing adequate proof that the finder actually found the correct cache be eliminated from any real or perceived Guideline on cache signing and/or logging requirements.

Unfortunately for me it seems that someone already snapped up the domain puzzlecaching.com.

 

I completely oppose your idea and your reasoning behind it, but since I can't tell if you're being serious, and I don't think there is a good chance Groundspeak will eliminate mystery caches, I'm not going to bother with a rebuttal, but just registering my opposition to your idea.

 

You don't like them, don't hunt for them. Filter them out. End of story.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Nonsense - delete the log - they didn't sign the log(sheet, book, paper) inside the cache.

Correct, they did not sign the log.

 

They did, without argument from the cache owner, find the cache.

 

Is the game about finding the cache or signing the log?

[CoyoteRed]

Is the game about finding the cache or signing the log?

Well, I know even after all of this time and the education you received for past actions you really should kniw it about both. You find the cache and sign the log.

 

If you don't want to sign the log? Fine, don't claim the find. It's a pretty simple concept and has been explained to you in the past. Forcefully and comprehensively.

 

I also find it interesting that a lot of the posters who are against having to sign the log are newcomers.

[+Rockin Roddy]

Although that's not what CM said, I made clearer the part you must have missed!

 

there is a differance between "Share your geocaching stories and photos online." and "Sign the virtual logbook on geocaching online."

 

You can easily do number 8 just by using the forums.

 

But 7 is pretty specific.

I guess that could be one way to read it! I think MOST here realize that's not the case, I pretty much bet you do as well...or have you been doing that very thing? A simple look at your stats might say differently though?

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

I have a cache called Digits This cache is a puzzel cache the whole point of this cache is that you have to break a 3 digit combination lock to open it. Today some one loged this cache as a find there log read couldn't get combo. so my question is should I delete this log the thing is this is only there second find but if I'm not mistaken don't they have to sighn the log for it to count as a find. they may have found the contaniour but if they couldn't open it I don't see how they could of sighned the log. So what should I do.

You should read the replies in this thread and decide for yourself, based on the extreme range of advice, if you are comfortable granting an exception to someone who found but did not sign the cache!

 

As I stated above, I believe that there should be room for exceptions in just about everything, it's up to each cache owner to decide if a finder warrants one.

[+Mule Ears]

Nonsense - delete the log - they didn't sign the log(sheet, book, paper) inside the cache.

Correct, they did not sign the log.

 

They did, without argument from the cache owner, find the cache.

 

Is the game about finding the cache or signing the log?

 

There was argument from the cache owner, that's why he started this thread. He felt that they missed (or avoided) "the whole point of this cache." So in this particular case the game, as designed by the cache owner, is about signing the log.

 

My take on this discussion is that cache owners have free will and a delete button.

[+Casting Crowns]

This is GREAT news......so now I can log http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...=y&decrypt= without having to make the climb since it can be seen from the ground! AWESOME!

Edited June 1, 2009 by Casting Crowns

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

This is GREAT news......so now I can log http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...=y&decrypt= without having to make the climb since it can be seen from the ground! AWESOME!

Yes, if you can prove to the cache owner that you went to the cache site, saw (found) the cache but could not get to it to sign it then the owner has the latitude to decide if he wants to grant you an exception.

 

My take on this discussion is that cache owners have free will and a delete button.

Exactly! Owner's choice. Just as it should be finders free will choice to solve the puzzle!

Edited June 1, 2009 by TheAlabamaRambler

[+jasondulac]

Just checked the cache page, and there's no log matching the OP's description, so the problem's apparently solved. I'd be interested to know who deleted it, the cache owner or the (non) finder.

 

I see this particular cache as analogous to a multi. Finding the container is stage 1; getting inside is the final. The cache description makes the nature of the cache clear as day. I wouldn't accept a found log for a multi based on finding only the first stage, so I'd also disallow a find here. Since the (non) finder in question was a newbie, I'd drop an email first explaining that it's customary to sign the log in order to claim a find unless the cache owner allows otherwise.

Yes problem is solved I deleated there log and sent them a polite email explaing why I deleated there log and I also told them if they would like a hint so they could try the cache agin that they could send me an email

[+herrozerro]

Although that's not what CM said, I made clearer the part you must have missed!

 

there is a differance between "Share your geocaching stories and photos online." and "Sign the virtual logbook on geocaching online."

 

You can easily do number 8 just by using the forums.

 

But 7 is pretty specific.

I guess that could be one way to read it! I think MOST here realize that's not the case, I pretty much bet you do as well...or have you been doing that very thing? A simple look at your stats might say differently though?

 

I do practice logging the physical log first and formost, though i do log online later, sometimes i forget to log digitally.

 

My only point is that it is specific in logging the physical and not specific in logging the digital.

 

I do find it offensive that you have to drag my stats into this. That my dear sir is not apart of the game.

Edited June 2, 2009 by herrozerro

[+Rockin Roddy]

Although that's not what CM said, I made clearer the part you must have missed!

 

there is a differance between "Share your geocaching stories and photos online." and "Sign the virtual logbook on geocaching online."

 

You can easily do number 8 just by using the forums.

 

But 7 is pretty specific.

I guess that could be one way to read it! I think MOST here realize that's not the case, I pretty much bet you do as well...or have you been doing that very thing? A simple look at your stats might say differently though?

 

I do practice logging the physical log first and formost, though i do log online later, sometimes i forget to log digitally.

 

My only point is that it is specific in logging the physical and not specific in logging the digital.

 

I do find it offensive that you have to drag my stats into this. That my dear sir is not apart of the game.

 

You offend easily then, my friend, as no offense was meant nor was I trying to be rude. Furthermore, how were your stats "dragged" in here? I doubt everyone dropped everything to take a peak!? And if so, so what? What do you care how others see your stats should they decide to view them, they mean nothing as you pointed out!

 

My point is that we all know that logging the find is what is meant by the phrase you posted, whether we choose to or not is our matter. BUT, if you DO log it online, you might want to be able to prove your find to the owner should he/she require you to do so! I believe that is the jist of the conversation here.

 

Oh, and the key word to my last comment was "might"...as in, if I truly cared enough to look, which I didn't nor did I see a reason to as I would have bet my hind teeth you had at least 1 cache logged online!

[+jasondulac]

Good news the cacher went back today got the cache open and sighned the log this time he earned his smiley face

[+Mule Ears]

Good news the cacher went back today got the cache open and sighned the log this time he earned his smiley face

 

Excellent. Good work!

[+Chrysalides]

Good news the cacher went back today got the cache open and sighned the log this time he earned his smiley face

Nice, love a happy ending. Not that it would make any difference to the debate going on here...

[+B.Barker]

WELL, it seams to me that Its called a PUZZLE cache for a reason so if we wanted to be literate about things it should have some extra addition of difficulty other than to lift a lamp post skirt and BAM!!! I find the cache WOW are we really so greedy that we play the game just for numbers, well i know that i started playing because it was fun and healthy as well as the ultimate seek and find game, i know when i go for puzzle caches i know usually that i will most likely have to go above and beyond for the cache. Also really the cacher that has logged it just started playing maybe we should well guide him on how to be a good cacher even if that means telling him that he has to somehow unlock this cache. Oh yeah and to myself it seems foolish to be arguing about something as silly as this, really i did not know we were still in the high school hallways of he said she said bull corn. Geocaching, yes should have an aspect of fun but who says what fun truly is i know in my caching life it is way more fun in the end to have struggled with a cache and really have to dig in the who knows where of the forrests to find a nano magnet, but hey thats just me.

[+Crow-T-Robot]

Is the game about finding the cache or signing the log?

 

It's about finding the cache, of course. If you don't care about signing the log or logging the find online, then don't. It's part of the guidelines if you want to claim a smiley. You can certainly spend your entire geocaching life finding cache after cache without signing or logging anything and have just as much fun as I do. The only person this affects by not logging, albeit in a miniscule way, is the cache owner. The online logs are an invaluable tool to use to keep abreast of the status of a cache, if it has gone missing, needs repair, full logbook, etc.

 

So, my opinion is that if you want to claim the find on this site, you should sign the physical logbook in the cache.

 

Bruce

[Clan Riffster]

Easy Steps to Geocaching

 

1 Register for a free membership.

2 Click "Hide & Seek a Cache."

3 Enter your postal code and click "search."

4 Choose any geocache from the list and click on its name.

5 Enter the coordinates of the geocache into your GPS Device.

6 Use your GPS device to assist you in finding the hidden geocache.

7 Sign the logbook and return the geocache to its original location.

8 Share your geocaching stories and photos online.

I've long thought that this was one of the best descriptions of the game I've ever heard.

From about # 5 thru # 8 is how I play, and how I encourage those who ask my opinion regarding the ethos of caching.

However, I think this is more of a condensed version of how Groundspeak views the game than an actual part of the guidelines.

What I did find of interest was this quip, from the actual guidelines:

Logging of All Physical Caches

Geocaches can be logged online as Found once the physical log has been signed.

That seems pretty cut & dry to me. I don't remember that line from the last time I read them.

Maybe it was added when TPTB updated the ALR/Challenge Cache guidelines?

Either way, kudos to Groundspeak for drawing the line in the sand.

 

Post script: Roddy... Deep breaths, Brother. Deep breaths.

[+Rockin Roddy]

Easy Steps to Geocaching

 

1 Register for a free membership.

2 Click "Hide & Seek a Cache."

3 Enter your postal code and click "search."

4 Choose any geocache from the list and click on its name.

5 Enter the coordinates of the geocache into your GPS Device.

6 Use your GPS device to assist you in finding the hidden geocache.

7 Sign the logbook and return the geocache to its original location.

8 Share your geocaching stories and photos online.

I've long thought that this was one of the best descriptions of the game I've ever heard.

From about # 5 thru # 8 is how I play, and how I encourage those who ask my opinion regarding the ethos of caching.

However, I think this is more of a condensed version of how Groundspeak views the game than an actual part of the guidelines.

What I did find of interest was this quip, from the actual guidelines:

Logging of All Physical Caches

Geocaches can be logged online as Found once the physical log has been signed.

That seems pretty cut & dry to me. I don't remember that line from the last time I read them.

Maybe it was added when TPTB updated the ALR/Challenge Cache guidelines?

Either way, kudos to Groundspeak for drawing the line in the sand.

 

Post script: Roddy... Deep breaths, Brother. Deep breaths.

 

Not right now, KAboom just cut the cheese!

[+Avernar]

Good news the cacher went back today got the cache open and sighned the log this time he earned his smiley face

That's good. The whole point, and the fun part, of that cache was getting into it. Took me 2-3 minutes without reading the hint. Came back another time with another group of cachers and they got into it in less than 30 seconds with the hint.

 

The problem is that new cachers don't realize what a ? icon means. A friend of mine that I introduced to geocaching and went for his first find on a weekend got a DNF. On monday he said he couldn't find anything at the posted coordinates. When I asked him to pull up the cache page it was a puzzle cache. We had a good laugh about it when I explained what a puzzle cache was. His second attempt at a cache was a success.

 

This cache is an on site puzzle which means there is a container at the posted coordinates. New players will try to go for it without reading the description or realizing what a puzzle icon is. But if you don't point out their mistakes they'll keep making the same ones over and over again. As long as you're polite and give some friendly advice, I see no problem with deleting a mistaken find entry.

[GOF and Bacall]

Good news the cacher went back today got the cache open and sighned the log this time he earned his smiley face

That's good. The whole point, and the fun part, of that cache was getting into it. Took me 2-3 minutes without reading the hint. Came back another time with another group of cachers and they got into it in less than 30 seconds with the hint.

 

The problem is that new cachers don't realize what a ? icon means. A friend of mine that I introduced to geocaching and went for his first find on a weekend got a DNF. On monday he said he couldn't find anything at the posted coordinates. When I asked him to pull up the cache page it was a puzzle cache. We had a good laugh about it when I explained what a puzzle cache was. His second attempt at a cache was a success.

 

This cache is an on site puzzle which means there is a container at the posted coordinates. New players will try to go for it without reading the description or realizing what a puzzle icon is. But if you don't point out their mistakes they'll keep making the same ones over and over again. As long as you're polite and give some friendly advice, I see no problem with deleting a mistaken find entry.

 

Exactly!