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A Deleted Log


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I went out caching a few weeks ago and got about 35 caches that day in my general area. Then when I was finished I logged my finds, a few hours later I received a message from one of the cache owners that said that she had thought that her cache was missing as there were 3 or 4 DNFs on it and she herself had gone looking for it and couldn't find it. She asked me where it was. I tried as hard as I could to remember it but with all the caches I had gotten that day, for the life of me I could not remember this particular cache and explained that to her. I heard nothing but about a week after that I received a notification that she had deleted my log, and there was no reason given. So I sent her an email asking if she would please explain to me why my find on her cache was deleted, and I have no heard anything from her.....what would you do?

 

Not that losing 1 log is going to kill me, I was just curious as to what other cachers thoughts are on the matter.

 

Scubasonic

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Given the evidence (multiple DNFs, cache owner herself couldn't find it, you couldn't remember where it was), she no doubt thought you had logged a find falsely. To be honest, I would probably think the same thing.

 

What to do? Well, you could hire a hit man to take her out...or you could go on and find 35 more caches in one day and never give this particular one another thought as long as you live. More peaceful that way, don't you think?

 

Edit to add that, since a week went by before your log was deleted, she very likely went back out and still couldn't find the cache, strengthening her suspicion that you logged a find on something you didn't find. Still...forget about it and happily move on.

Edited by atmospherium
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Take a look at the cache from Google Earth and every other map you can find. Think about it hard. Find some detail about the cache or location or where you found it that will convince her it is legit. Revisit the spot if necessary.

 

I tend to agree with atmospherium's assesment.

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Given the evidence (multiple DNFs, cache owner herself couldn't find it, you couldn't remember where it was), she no doubt thought you had logged a find falsely. To be honest, I would probably think the same thing.

 

What to do? Well, you could hire a hit man to take her out...or you could go on and find 35 more caches in one day and never give this particular one another thought as long as you live. More peaceful that way, don't you think?

 

Edit to add that, since a week went by before your log was deleted, she very likely went back out and still couldn't find the cache, strengthening her suspicion that you logged a find on something you didn't find. Still...forget about it and happily move on.

 

Well with all do respect why wouldn't she have responded to my email asking why? and when I looked at the Cache there was no note, from the owner saying that she had gone out after she deleted my post giving any kind of update on the caches status.

 

Maybe she did think I made a False post, but if it was me, and it was my cache I would not delete the cachers post unless I could verify that they did not sign the log.

 

Scubasonic

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file a SBA on the cache and forget it.

 

Jim

 

What is a SBA?

Now known as a NA log - "Needs Archived", "Should be Archived"=SBA

 

However - I see absolutely no reason to log such a thing given that you found it. You just need some convincing evidence to prove that. While not usually necessary - seems it is needed in this case. I I really understand why.....

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I agree with StarBrand. Try really hard to remember something about the cache. Google maps help me with this. I have been contacted by a CO who wanted to know where I found her cache when I took out a Boy Scout troop since she herself looked for a long time and could not find it. It happens!

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Maybe she did think I made a False post, but if it was me, and it was my cache I would not delete the cachers post unless I could verify that they did not sign the log.

From what we can tell (i.e. from your own words), she did. She went out to look for it, didn't she? And she couldn't find her own cache, and you couldn't tell her anything about it. So she figured it's missing, therefore by definition you couldn't have signed the log.

 

I can't really fault her for not replying to your e-mail either. If I think you falsely logged one of my caches, I wouldn't want to have any exchange with you after deleting your log. These things usually degenerate into name calling and (sometimes) threats of physical harm.

 

If you want to clear your name, I'm afraid there's little you can do other than either recall something about the hide, or make the 90 mile round trip.

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Why not post a Note..."I found this cache on x/xx. The owner can't find it. Will the next finder please check the log and report if my signature appears?"

 

(But I would be pissed if I had a find deleted because the owner can't find the cache. I've been to more than one cache where the owner put out a replacement because he couldn't find the original...and I found the original.)

Edited by beejay&esskay
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Maybe she did think I made a False post, but if it was me, and it was my cache I would not delete the cachers post unless I could verify that they did not sign the log.

From what we can tell (i.e. from your own words), she did. She went out to look for it, didn't she? And she couldn't find her own cache, and you couldn't tell her anything about it. So she figured it's missing, therefore by definition you couldn't have signed the log.

 

I can't really fault her for not replying to your e-mail either. If I think you falsely logged one of my caches, I wouldn't want to have any exchange with you after deleting your log. These things usually degenerate into name calling and (sometimes) threats of physical harm.

 

If you want to clear your name, I'm afraid there's little you can do other than either recall something about the hide, or make the 90 mile round trip.

I would never consider deleting a log if I had any doubt whatsoever that the find was bogus. And I certainly wouldn't be afraid to respond to the cacher if they contacted after I chose to delete such a log. I would give a full and complete explanation of what I was planning to do and why. If the cacher responded I think I would find that to be some evidence that they were telling the truth.

 

That said, I have done 30+ caches in a day and have never had any problems remembering each cache. When in doubt take notes.

 

I would make the return trip and I would also take the opportunity to find a few more caches along the way.

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I think it is a SAD day for geocaching when some rude cache owner deletes a log just because they think it was ARM CHAIRED! <_<

 

I mean, where is the compassion any more in this game??? B):wacko:

 

Just because one of the caches I found was 300 miles away on the side of a 17,000 foot mountain doesn't mean I didn't find it!!!! I DID find it that day, along with 638 more caches. So........HRUMMMMPH! :lol:

 

Now, all you cachers start giving a poor Arm Chair cacher a break! I FOUND all those caches! :laughing:

 

Well........IT COULD HAPPEN!! :laughing:

 

And don't try to "make up" with me by leaving a BIG PILE OF STICKS!! It WON'T work! Not this time.

 

Well..........maybe it would! ;)

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I would make the return trip and I would also take the opportunity to find a few more caches along the way.

 

If I were in the area because of other caches, I might try to prove to the owner's satisfaction that I found the cache.

 

But I think I would be more likely to put an "ignore" on all her caches.

 

Boy, I hope I never have to make that decision.

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While it won't help for that particular endeavor, you could, in the future, stop hunting for caches which are so uninspired that you can't remember them later. B)

 

Gosh I hope I never have a day like that.

 

That is what I thought. I can't blame the owner for being suspicious, many previous DNFs, and a "finder" that can't remember anything about the cache. This is the first red flag. I would check the location, and verify the cache is indeed missing. I hate to admit, but I would probably delete the log also. It doesn't help that most of your logs are "cut & paste" jobs. :laughing:

 

Was out in Mollala with "VanWAMacer" grabbing some caches. Thanks for the hide efforts we really appriciated the hides we found as well as all the great Views of the valley, and wow the weather was great.

Scubasonic

 

Since you couldn't describe the cache (when asked), the owner couldn't find their cache, and none of your logs can accurately describe the cache or it's hiding spot, can you blame her?

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While it won't help for that particular endeavor, you could, in the future, stop hunting for caches which are so uninspired that you can't remember them later. B)

 

Gosh I hope I never have a day like that.

 

That is what I thought. I can't blame the owner for being suspicious, many previous DNFs, and a "finder" that can't remember anything about the cache. This is the first red flag. I would check the location, and verify the cache is indeed missing. I hate to admit, but I would probably delete the log also. It doesn't help that most of your logs are "cut & paste" jobs. :laughing:

 

Was out in Mollala with "VanWAMacer" grabbing some caches. Thanks for the hide efforts we really appriciated the hides we found as well as all the great Views of the valley, and wow the weather was great.

Scubasonic

 

Since you couldn't describe the cache (when asked), the owner couldn't find their cache, and none of your logs can accurately describe the cache or it's hiding spot, can you blame her?

I recently had someone do that - they did 3 word cut and paste logs on my caches dated back in December, and their profile said they lived in Ohio and my caches are in Texas - sure sounded like an armchair cacher! I sent them an email asking if they could describe any of the caches they found. They responded that they didn't remember any of them because it had been so long ago, but that they were ok with me deleting their logs. I checked a couple of the logbooks and they did sign them.

Edited by 9Key
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Still my favorite armchair cachers are those in Germany I found who do virtuals all over the world, in different states, in different countries in the same day.

 

I thought for sure they must be aliens flying around with their space ships to get the caches.

 

who cares? Maybe they're wheelchair bound.

they're having fun their own way I guess.

 

It would be hard for her to check if you signed the logbook if it's missing.

If you cached in three states in one day they had better be in a straight line! LOL

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Someone posted a DNF on one of my easiest caches, so I checked on it. I couldn't find it either, so I went home and disabled it until I could get a replacement container out the next weekend. Then someone finds it on Friday. I'm suspicious, so I email and ask where they found it.

 

Turns out someone had put it back on the wrong side of a boulder, which is why I couldn't find it on the first trip. But I liked the new place even better so I left it there.

 

And no, I didn't log a DNF the first time nor did I log a "Found it" when I finally did locate it.

Edited by J-Way
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While it won't help for that particular endeavor, you could, in the future, stop hunting for caches which are so uninspired that you can't remember them later. B)

 

Gosh I hope I never have a day like that.

 

That is what I thought. I can't blame the owner for being suspicious, many previous DNFs, and a "finder" that can't remember anything about the cache. This is the first red flag. I would check the location, and verify the cache is indeed missing. I hate to admit, but I would probably delete the log also. It doesn't help that most of your logs are "cut & paste" jobs. :laughing:

 

Was out in Mollala with "VanWAMacer" grabbing some caches. Thanks for the hide efforts we really appriciated the hides we found as well as all the great Views of the valley, and wow the weather was great.

Scubasonic

 

Since you couldn't describe the cache (when asked), the owner couldn't find their cache, and none of your logs can accurately describe the cache or it's hiding spot, can you blame her?

 

Kit,

 

Well yes I do Cut and Paste logs when I have days where I get 30 + in one day, is there anything wrong with that? I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

 

Scubasonic

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Cut/Paste - handy at times.....

 

However, I'm of the mind that any cache owner deserves better than that. Even the LPC hiders. I will cut/paste general info about the day's weather, etc., but then every cache gets customized with something about the search or other experience unique to that cache.

 

Very, very simple LPCs get a minimum log - but at least something. Better caches get more kudos.

 

That's why it takes some time to log a 30 cache day.

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Kit,

 

Well yes I do Cut and Paste logs when I have days where I get 30 + in one day, is there anything wrong with that? I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

 

Scubasonic

 

Well, now .. you just lost me as a supporter. but I suppose my opinion doesn't matter because I only have less than 400 finds in over a year and a half!

 

But I remember the caches I have done!

 

The numbers game is ok if that's what you want, but there are those of us who (1) live in a less than saturated caching area, (2) can't always go out as often as one would like for one reason or another, and (3) Like to pause and smell the roses (so to speak) as we go along. To dis someone because they have fewer caches than you in more time shows a lack of class, or immaturity, and if you are flying too fast to remember the caches you have done, then I have no sympathy for you.

Edited by BC & MsKitty
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I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

 

Now I can see why that one deleted smiley would bug you so much.

 

I wonder how many of those 2500 you even remember...since you can't remember details about some of the last 35 you did, I'm betting not many.

 

Bruce

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Kit,

 

Well yes I do Cut and Paste logs when I have days where I get 30 + in one day, is there anything wrong with that? I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

 

Scubasonic

 

Well, now .. you just lost me as a supporter. but I suppose my opinion doesn't matter because I only have less than 400 finds in over a year and a half!

 

But I remember the caches I have done!

 

The numbers game is ok if that's what you want, but there are those of us who (1) live in a less than saturated caching area, (2) can't always go out as often as one would like for one reason or another, and (3) Like to pause and smell the roses (so to speak) as we go along. To dis someone because they have fewer caches than you in more time shows a lack of class, or immaturity, and if you are flying too fast to remember the caches you have done, then I have no sympathy for you.

 

Well I just don't like being attacked about "Cut & Paste Logs" I don't think there is anything wrong with it when you are averaging 200+ finds a month that is a lot of logging. Everyone plays the game the way they want, their choice, no right or wrong way. When I log a few a day I do personalize it.

 

Scubasonic

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If you intend to be in the same area again to find some more caches, take along a digital camera and perhaps another cacher. File a new log saying "I found it again" along with a picture of the logsheet in the hand of the other cacher. Then have the other cacher write his/her log. If you have one, put a TB or geocoin into the cache in question. By all means, post the pictures with your log.

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I went out caching a few weeks ago and got about 35 caches that day in my general area. Then when I was finished I logged my finds, a few hours later I received a message from one of the cache owners that said that she had thought that her cache was missing as there were 3 or 4 DNFs on it and she herself had gone looking for it and couldn't find it. She asked me where it was. I tried as hard as I could to remember it but with all the caches I had gotten that day, for the life of me I could not remember this particular cache and explained that to her. I heard nothing but about a week after that I received a notification that she had deleted my log, and there was no reason given. So I sent her an email asking if she would please explain to me why my find on her cache was deleted, and I have no heard anything from her.....what would you do?

 

Not that losing 1 log is going to kill me, I was just curious as to what other cachers thoughts are on the matter.

 

Scubasonic

 

Don't worry about it. Maybe she simply doesn't like you! We have geocachers here who delete legit logs just because they don't like certain other geocachers. One deletion isn't bad. Heck I know a cacher who got hundreds of finds deleted by a certain group of self righteous cachers :laughing:

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Kit,

 

Well yes I do Cut and Paste logs when I have days where I get 30 + in one day, is there anything wrong with that? I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

 

Scubasonic

 

Looking at your profile stats,

41.8% - micros.

35.6% - 1.5 Difficulty.

47% - 1.5 Terrain.

 

I'm not knocking you, but trying to compare yourself to Kitfox is like trying to compare apples to orangutans.

 

You are playing two entirely different games.

 

Personally, if you can't remember anything about the last 30 caches you found, what the heck is the point of finding them? 2500 in a year is an impressive number. I'm closing in on 3000 after 4 years and I could probably describe the location, type of container, etc, on 90% of them.

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Well I just don't like being attacked about "Cut & Paste Logs" I don't think there is anything wrong with it when you are averaging 200+ finds a month that is a lot of logging. Everyone plays the game the way they want, their choice, no right or wrong way. When I log a few a day I do personalize it.

 

Scubasonic

 

Yeah .. that is a lot of logging, but keep in mind, the cache owner doesn't know how many you have done that day, and I have had cachers find several of my caches in the same day, and I get the same cut and paste log on each. Makes me think they didn't like the caches enough to write somethign for each.

 

Anyway, back OT

As has been said, if you can get back in the area (maybe to do some others) then go to it again and get some proof, like a photo, or description that the cache isn't actually missing as is suggested by the other DNF logs.

Not much else you can do if the owner thinks the cache is missing.

 

BC

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Kit,

 

Well yes I do Cut and Paste logs when I have days where I get 30 + in one day, is there anything wrong with that? I would not exspect you to understand ...

 

Well I just don't like being attacked about "Cut & Paste Logs" I don't think there is anything wrong with it when you are averaging 200+ finds a month that is a lot of logging. Everyone plays the game the way they want, their choice, no right or wrong way. Scubasonic

Yep, you nailed it. You are ALL about the numbers and others are about an actual experience. I think you could easily have been mistaken about finding the cache. Since there was no "experience" of the cache for you, how can you be sure you didn't accidentally check it off on your list? From your own statements I am already convinced your record keeping is as shoddy as your memory.

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I tried as hard as I could to remember it but with all the caches I had gotten that day, for the life of me I could not remember this particular cache and explained that to her.

 

You sure play this game a little different then I do. I've been caching for three years and only have a little over 600 finds. However, I could tell you a little something about each and every one of them.

 

I might not remember the exact spot of the hide, but I can remember the experience, enough that if a CO were to ask, I could answer.

 

If you like your version of the game, more power to you. But anyway you cut it, cut and paste logs are a little rude.

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I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

 

Scubasonic

 

And now we know...the rest...of the...story.

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I still don't think a cache owner should delete a find log just because she can't find the cache.

 

But I don't like cut and paste logs...have never done that myself.

 

And reading my log and looking at the cache description and maps I can recall nearly every cache hunt I've been on. (A few of the LPCs run together in my mind.)

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All I'm saying is that everyone plays the game differently, there is no right or wrong way to Geocache, as long as you are fair...... I do remember most of the caches I get some are more memorable then others that's all, and some are forgettable. I just don't think it was Kits place to criticize me for doing a "Cut & Paste" on large caching days that's all. There is one cacher in our area that has over 10,000 finds and his posts are short and sweet but a "Cut & Paste" all the same no biggie, I say play the game how you want as long as you are fair.

 

Scubasonic

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Well I just don't like being attacked about "Cut & Paste Logs" I don't think there is anything wrong with it when you are averaging 200+ finds a month that is a lot of logging.

Maybe that just means you are finding too many caches.

 

If you can't even be bothered to write a decent log for each one, then I don't see why the owner shouldn't delete your logs unless you can convince him that you actually found it. Numbers cachers like you seem to have a habit of going for the smiley at all costs, sometimes claiming finds they didn't actually make.

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I would not exspect you to understand since your first find was in May of 04' and you have only 1477 finds, I have only been finding caches since Jun 16 of 08 and have over 2500 so far and have not even reached my anniversary of my first year caching.

OMG I can't believe you said that! Are you actually proud of your numbers? Do you really think they make you better than everybody else?

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Numbers cachers like you seem to have a habit of going for the smiley at all costs, sometimes claiming finds they didn't actually make.

 

Oh so now your saying that just because cachers get high numbers they must be claiming finds they didn't actually make?????

 

what a idiot.

 

SS

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OMG I can't believe you said that! Are you actually proud of your numbers? Do you really think they make you better than everybody else?

 

well yes I am proud of my finds "SO WHAT" I earned everyone of them, and I did not say that because of my numbers that makes me better then everybody else.......those are your words. :laughing:B)<_<

 

SS

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Numbers cachers like you seem to have a habit of going for the smiley at all costs, sometimes claiming finds they didn't actually make.

 

Oh so now your saying that just because cachers get high numbers they must be claiming finds they didn't actually make?????

 

what a idiot.

Ooh, looks like we hit a nerve!

 

I didn't say all high numbers cachers claim finds they didn't make. Just a higher percentage than the general population. Not surprising, since high numbers cachers tend to value their find counts very highly, while normal people don't really care all that much.

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