+LSUFan Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 I was using GSAK to parse all of the benchmarks in the northeast part of my state, looking for some of the oldest ones......that might possibly still be around. I saw one that has a 1896 monument date, but it just doesn't seem right to me. It is showing set in a concrete culvert that runs under U.S. Hwy 80. I would have figured that they would have used newer culverts when US 80 was constructed, but I guess this possibly may have been some older road that was incorporated into US 80. This benchmark also shows a recovery from the NGS in 1968........which also made me think that there were some number transpositions that may have led to 1896 for a monumentation date. Here is a link to this benchmark CP1381 Even though I would love to find a benchmark from the last decade of the 1800's, I just don't think this one is that old. Can I ask the experts here in the forums, what their take on this one would be? I really would appreciate guidance on it. Thanks Quote
Papa-Bear-NYC Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 I was using GSAK to parse all of the benchmarks in the northeast part of my state, looking for some of the oldest ones......that might possibly still be around. I saw one that has a 1896 monument date, but it just doesn't seem right to me. It is showing set in a concrete culvert that runs under U.S. Hwy 80. I would have figured that they would have used newer culverts when US 80 was constructed, but I guess this possibly may have been some older road that was incorporated into US 80. This benchmark also shows a recovery from the NGS in 1968........which also made me think that there were some number transpositions that may have led to 1896 for a monumentation date. Here is a link to this benchmark CP1381 Even though I would love to find a benchmark from the last decade of the 1800's, I just don't think this one is that old. Can I ask the experts here in the forums, what their take on this one would be? I really would appreciate guidance on it. Thanks I think the date is bogus. If you look at the complete list for Madison County from the NGS website, you will see this group: |....|CP1317|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322011|W0910035|D...|A 1801 |....|CP0592|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322001|W0905952|D...|A 1803 |....|CP0593|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321948|W0905854|D...|A 1805 |....|CP0594|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321939|W0905824|D...|A 1806 |....|CP0590|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321925|W0905720|C...|A 1809 |....|CP0591|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321912|W0905621|D...|A 1811 |....|CP1365|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322611|W0911542|D...|A 1887 |....|CP1369|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322612|W0911616|D...|A 1888 |....|CP1379|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322543|W0911917|D...|A 1893 |....|CP1381|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322551|W0912109|D...|A 1896 |....|CP1362|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322550|W0911300|B...|A 255 It seems clear these are all related since the numbers form a range and the PIDs are in sequential groups. If you look at them, they all say monumented by "LAGS" with a date "UNK" (= unknown). LAGS must be Louisiana Geodetic Survey or something like that. I'm guessing they are all part of one level line. The dates are unknown, although certainly someone knows it - it just means the NGS didn't have the records when the stuff was put in the database. The date for this one was just transposed from the Designation. Just a data entry error. That's my theory. Quote
Papa-Bear-NYC Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 (edited) It seems clear these are all related since the numbers form a range and the PIDs are in sequential groups. If you look at them, they all say monumented by "LAGS" with a date "UNK" (= unknown). LAGS must be Louisiana Geodetic Survey or something like that. I'm guessing they are all part of one level line. The dates are unknown, although certainly someone knows it - it just means the NGS didn't have the records when the stuff was put in the database. The date for this one was just transposed from the Designation. Just a data entry error. That's my theory. Yes! They're all along I-80 and most are along a railroad. I bet they were originally long the Rail line and the interstate was built right next to it. Very strong probibility they were a single level line. 1896 is surely a bogus date. Track down "LAGS" if it still exists it's probably on the State web page - and see if anyone works there that can look these up for you. Tracking down an unknown date and turning it into a known date is (almost) as good as finding a late 19th century mark. Question: is there a date on the disk? That would solve the puzzle rather quickly. Edited February 13, 2009 by Papa-Bear-NYC Quote
+Klemmer Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I agree it is almost certainly bogus. Just an entry error. We had a similar one here in CA that was 1800 (when CA was still the Mexican territory of Alta California!). BTW: I like how Papa Bear quoted himself, and then agreed with himself. That's pretty slick! You go Papa Bear! [just kidding!] Quote
AZcachemeister Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I was using GSAK to parse all of the benchmarks in the northeast part of my state, looking for some of the oldest ones......that might possibly still be around. I saw one that has a 1896 monument date, but it just doesn't seem right to me. It is showing set in a concrete culvert that runs under U.S. Hwy 80. I would have figured that they would have used newer culverts when US 80 was constructed, but I guess this possibly may have been some older road that was incorporated into US 80. This benchmark also shows a recovery from the NGS in 1968........which also made me think that there were some number transpositions that may have led to 1896 for a monumentation date. Here is a link to this benchmark CP1381 Even though I would love to find a benchmark from the last decade of the 1800's, I just don't think this one is that old. Can I ask the experts here in the forums, what their take on this one would be? I really would appreciate guidance on it. Thanks I think the date is bogus. If you look at the complete list for Madison County from the NGS website, you will see this group: |....|CP1317|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322011|W0910035|D...|A 1801 |....|CP0592|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322001|W0905952|D...|A 1803 |....|CP0593|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321948|W0905854|D...|A 1805 |....|CP0594|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321939|W0905824|D...|A 1806 |....|CP0590|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321925|W0905720|C...|A 1809 |....|CP0591|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N321912|W0905621|D...|A 1811 |....|CP1365|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322611|W0911542|D...|A 1887 |....|CP1369|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322612|W0911616|D...|A 1888 |....|CP1379|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322543|W0911917|D...|A 1893 |....|CP1381|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322551|W0912109|D...|A 1896 |....|CP1362|. 1|88/ADJUSTED|N322550|W0911300|B...|A 255 It seems clear these are all related since the numbers form a range and the PIDs are in sequential groups. If you look at them, they all say monumented by "LAGS" with a date "UNK" (= unknown). LAGS must be Louisiana Geodetic Survey or something like that. I'm guessing they are all part of one level line. The dates are unknown, although certainly someone knows it - it just means the NGS didn't have the records when the stuff was put in the database. The date for this one was just transposed from the Designation. Just a data entry error. That's my theory. I concur with this theory. And you can consider myself quoted and agreed with as well! Quote
+LSUFan Posted February 13, 2009 Author Posted February 13, 2009 (edited) They're all along I-80 and most are along a railroad. I bet they were originally long the Rail line and the interstate was built right next to it. Very strong probibility they were a single level line. 1896 is surely a bogus date. Track down "LAGS" if it still exists it's probably on the State web page - and see if anyone works there that can look these up for you. Tracking down an unknown date and turning it into a known date is (almost) as good as finding a late 19th century mark. Question: is there a date on the disk? That would solve the puzzle rather quickly. I haven't attempted a search for it, so don't know if there is a date on it or not. However, I believe you have shown concrete proof, that it's definitely just an error, by showing all the other benchmarks in Madison Parish (we don't have counties in LA ). You also got me started off on another chase now. It appears the LAGS (Louisiana Geological Survey) that is listed as the monumenting agency for this benchmark has a website. It shows that they started off in 1934.(another sign it couldn't be 1896) Thanks for the guidance on it. I never would have thought to do that. http://www.lgs.lsu.edu/deploy/content/GINF...ntentpage12.php I really do appreciate everyone helping me with this, as they always do. I hope ya don't mind me asking these questions, so I can hopefully learn more. I know if I ask a question, I am always going to get great answers from everyone here in the forums. I guess I won't be getting an extra 10 points for a pre-1935 disk for UNK1's contest on this one. Edited February 13, 2009 by LSUFan Quote
NGS Surveyor Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 NGS has a State Advisor in Louisiana (and many other states). You could try asking him: STATE GEODETIC ADVISOR Louisiana Denis Riordan National Geodetic Survey c/o Louisiana State University Center for GeoInformatics South Stadium Drive Baton Rouge, LA 70803 Telephone: (225) 578-5260 Fax: (225) 578-4502 E-mail Louisiana Spatial Reference Center (LSRC) GeorgeL NGS Quote
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