Official Thread for Discussing the Minor Oh So Blue (GC15D) Controversy

[sdarken]

You can select all countries (click Afghanistan, shift-click Zimbabwe), select not-been-found, and choose placed-date between the beginning of time and, say, 2003. That'll give you a small handful to sift though.

 

Nice. Thanks for the information. I would never have figured that out.

 

Here's what I found. I haven't researched any of these:

 

21-Jun-01 Geocache by turco (GCD30) -- Bolivia

23-Jun-01 4.5lb Walleye by Jamie Matear (GCDFB) -- Ontario

10-Jul-01 Conch Shell Horn by Jeffrey Courrier (GC105E) -- Venezuela

28-Jul-01 Nikolay-Kam by Nikolay-Kam (GC14C3) -- Russia

12-Aug-01 Mount Temple by MCpl. Paul Franklin, MCpl. J. Pawsey (GC1607) -- Alberta

27-Oct-01 Pljesevica by Ivan Ramljak (GC255D) -- Bosnia and Herzegovina

[+Menehune2]

I think looking at the difficulty rating doesn't have to lower the prestige of login this cache. I think the terrain sounds pretty close to accurate considering you need a boat and good conditions to get there.

Even though you just have to ask for the cache you have to suss out the right day to make the attempt, so maybe that makes it a 1 or 2.

But wouldn't lowering the difficulty rating to the current scale make the long unfound status that more Epic? Can you imagine a 1/3 cache that wasn't logged for 6+ years these days?

The other compromise would be if someone else goes after it to contact the OC and offer to rehide it on the island and then update the cords.

My vote would be to rate it on the current scale if you were a mainland local. The history and low number of finds is a fitting tribute to the cache.

[Clan Riffster]

If I were consulted on such a trifling matter, I would vote to leave the D/T alone. It's rated where the CO wants it,

and the CO can justify that rating. Clayjar is not the undisputed holy deity of cache rating.

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

If I were consulted on such a trifling matter, I would vote to leave the D/T alone. It's rated where the CO wants it,

and the CO can justify that rating. Clayjar is not the undisputed holy deity of cache rating.

Yep. Yep again. And, as I have pointed out in the past, even the ClayJar rating system assigns a relatively high Difficulty rating to such a cache, and also to many of the other Terrain 5 caches which folks here in this thread have cited as examples.

[+Prime Suspect]

A difficulty rating higher than a 1, on a cache that someone hands you, is absurd.

[+hollora]

Whatever the debate here on ratings...........this tread started to discuss this an an unfound cache. It has now been found.

 

After reading many posts, I would comment the ratings are up to the cache owner. You can look at the journey to recover this cache in many ways, IMHO.

 

daterkitfox is a Geocaching friend and he told me he was going to "go for it" on his vacation. That he did and I am thrilled he achieved the find. A much deserved FTF for a great fellow!

 

So - now everyone knows it's there - this is free game for all. And, IMHO up to the cache owner if they want to change the ratings.

 

Cache on ~ cache Happy! Way to Go ~ Darterkitfox!

[sailor]

Everyone is a comedian. The new cache is now in place. I just spoke with Richardo. Too bad you'll never get down that way. It's a beautiful place.

So that means that there wasn't a cache to be found until now? Hmmmm...

 

Really? Please show me where I said that there wasn't a cache in place? I said that I thought there might not be one, given the conversation with Richardo, sent him another one, then talked to him again with him telling me that maybe the original was around. Hmmmm.....

[+hollora]

Well, the cache has been found. As a courtesy to a Geofriend (he has dial-up and can't post photos - I don't), I have posted his photos on the cache page.

 

As a courtesy to the cache owner, I did edit one photo.

 

darterkitfox was simply in the area on a vacation cruise. He is a cacher and pre-planned his trip. And well, I would say by the results.

 

He had told me his plan but I never thought he might pull it off. Very happy indeed that he did.

 

Well - there is surely another unfound treasure to pursue. Maybe the cache owner of this cache can take a much deserved break.

 

Cache on ~ cache happy all!

[+cook cachers]

I am so very happy for both sailor and darterkitfox for this happy resolution to what has been an interesting (non)scandal. The pics are evidince of a successful find, not just of the cache itself, but also of the island. I'm so ready to go back and add my name to the list. STF is mine!!!

[+Vanelle]

Just a week before I headed out to Belize and was working on a way to get out to this cache, this thread started and it looked like someone contacted Ricardo and confirmed the cache was gone. I'm curious how it appeared there recently and was found? Did a replacement cache go out?

[+WRASTRO]

Just a week before I headed out to Belize and was working on a way to get out to this cache, this thread started and it looked like someone contacted Ricardo and confirmed the cache was gone. I'm curious how it appeared there recently and was found? Did a replacement cache go out?

Read the thread and your question will be answered.

[+darterkitfox]

I wonder if anyone here would care to hear my opinions on this all. Enough of you personally emailed me and were very negative to me and many more of you put me down on these forums. First, I planned a whole cruise just to get to this cache. Someone wondered why a person who lived so far away from the cache cared. I didn't know you could only cache in your own area. Another person said that no one had ever looked for it. Well two people stayed there for two days waiting for the owner. That is looking for it. Just because they weren't big enough to call it a DNF and just posted a note doesn't make it a non DNF. That is why I posted to the owner to see if he could confirm it was there before I wasted time and money to try for it. My post was deleted. Since people had been there and not found it and the owner didn't seem interested in having it found, that is why I suggested it be archived until it was known if it was still there. I personally talked with Ricardo while on the island. He told me that the person that died that the original cache had been left with, buried it. To me, that says the cache has not been available for some time. To his credit, the owner did get the cache replaced. I can't speak for the rating. I was walked to the location and it was given me, but I went through many days of mental stress and language barriers to get to that point. If something had come up, I may not have been greeted by Ricardo and I would have gone home empty handed. That would have been a DNF and it's hard to imagine too many 1 ratings getting a DNF. I would give it more than a 1. If anyone can get here and not be on a time constraint, I would recommend that you all try. Pictures do not do it justice, and if you don't mind nearby crocodiles, snorkeling, fishing, and a day visiting Ricardo would be well worth your time. Oh, and there's a cache there too. I also chose the Obama button because of the argument on the thread. All and all, it was to all of you wishing me a failure that I succeeded. Thank you.

[Mr.Yuck]

Just a week before I headed out to Belize and was working on a way to get out to this cache, this thread started and it looked like someone contacted Ricardo and confirmed the cache was gone. I'm curious how it appeared there recently and was found? Did a replacement cache go out?

Read the thread and your question will be answered.

 

Well you could. But that would be at least an hour you'll never get back. Yes, there's a cache there, and all you have to do is ask for it. Are you visiting any Mayan ruins? (my dream vacation).

[+Vinny & Sue Team]

I wonder if anyone here would care to hear my opinions on this all. Enough of you personally emailed me and were very negative to me and many more of you put me down on these forums. First, I planned a whole cruise just to get to this cache. Someone wondered why a person who lived so far away from the cache cared. I didn't know you could only cache in your own area. Another person said that no one had ever looked for it. Well two people stayed there for two days waiting for the owner. That is looking for it. Just because they weren't big enough to call it a DNF and just posted a note doesn't make it a non DNF. That is why I posted to the owner to see if he could confirm it was there before I wasted time and money to try for it. My post was deleted. Since people had been there and not found it and the owner didn't seem interested in having it found, that is why I suggested it be archived until it was known if it was still there. I personally talked with Ricardo while on the island. He told me that the person that died that the original cache had been left with, buried it. To me, that says the cache has not been available for some time. To his credit, the owner did get the cache replaced. I can't speak for the rating. I was walked to the location and it was given me, but I went through many days of mental stress and language barriers to get to that point. If something had come up, I may not have been greeted by Ricardo and I would have gone home empty handed. That would have been a DNF and it's hard to imagine too many 1 ratings getting a DNF. I would give it more than a 1. If anyone can get here and not be on a time constraint, I would recommend that you all try. Pictures do not do it justice, and if you don't mind nearby crocodiles, snorkeling, fishing, and a day visiting Ricardo would be well worth your time. Oh, and there's a cache there too. I also chose the Obama button because of the argument on the thread. All and all, it was to all of you wishing me a failure that I succeeded. Thank you.

Darterkitfox, thanks for your note. Please understand that the self-appointed critics and the self-styled "haters" and sourpusses who may have expressed negative thoughts or feelings about your excellent and noteworthy find are only a very tiny minority of folks in the geo world and on this forum, and, in fact, I suspect that for most of them, it was largely a matter of sour grapes, that you found it whereas they did not/could not/would not do so.

 

My own feeling, as is likely obvious from my earlier posts on this thread, is sheer happiness and amazement over the fact that the owner was able to determine that the cache was likely missing in action (or at least lost after the death of the holder) and that the cache was replaced, and over your amazing find. Congratulations! You went to a lot of effort and spent a lot of time, energy and funds to accomplish this find, and you richly deserve the FTF on this one.

 

As far as the matter of whether the cache listing should have been archived pending its eventual replacement, much as I have stated before, I have never felt that the circumstances and facts surrounding this cache have warranted archival, nor even necessarily a temporary disabling, and rather, I feel that the way that the entire matter was handled (that is, the listing having been left active while the matter was researched and managed) by the owner was just fine.

[+legacypac]

I had several cachers from Europe attack one my caches in Kuwait with SBAs claiming it was unfair since it's located on a coalition base. These people are thousands of miles from the cache and have no intent to even search for it. Fortunately, the reviewer was not sympathetic to thier cause.

 

I hunted down the only cache in Kuwait not on a military base. I was sad that I could not get on the base to hunt the cache there (drove to the gates, but did not ask to go in), but not upset that I could not hunt it. I am just happy our troops can get some caching R&R.

[V!ncent]

Rats ... I was on Belize a few weeks ago. Wish I'd known about this cache then

[+sbell111]

I wonder if anyone here would care to hear my opinions on this all. Enough of you personally emailed me and were very negative to me and many more of you put me down on these forums. First, I planned a whole cruise just to get to this cache. Someone wondered why a person who lived so far away from the cache cared. I didn't know you could only cache in your own area. Another person said that no one had ever looked for it. Well two people stayed there for two days waiting for the owner. That is looking for it. Just because they weren't big enough to call it a DNF and just posted a note doesn't make it a non DNF. That is why I posted to the owner to see if he could confirm it was there before I wasted time and money to try for it. My post was deleted. Since people had been there and not found it and the owner didn't seem interested in having it found, that is why I suggested it be archived until it was known if it was still there. I personally talked with Ricardo while on the island. He told me that the person that died that the original cache had been left with, buried it. To me, that says the cache has not been available for some time. To his credit, the owner did get the cache replaced. I can't speak for the rating. I was walked to the location and it was given me, but I went through many days of mental stress and language barriers to get to that point. If something had come up, I may not have been greeted by Ricardo and I would have gone home empty handed. That would have been a DNF and it's hard to imagine too many 1 ratings getting a DNF. I would give it more than a 1. If anyone can get here and not be on a time constraint, I would recommend that you all try. Pictures do not do it justice, and if you don't mind nearby crocodiles, snorkeling, fishing, and a day visiting Ricardo would be well worth your time. Oh, and there's a cache there too. I also chose the Obama button because of the argument on the thread. All and all, it was to all of you wishing me a failure that I succeeded. Thank you.

Darterkitfox, thanks for your note. Please understand that the self-appointed critics and the self-styled "haters" and sourpusses who may have expressed negative thoughts or feelings about your excellent and noteworthy find are only a very tiny minority of folks in the geo world and on this forum, and, in fact, I suspect that for most of them, it was largely a matter of sour grapes, that you found it whereas they did not/could not/would not do so.

 

My own feeling, as is likely obvious from my earlier posts on this thread, is sheer happiness and amazement over the fact that the owner was able to determine that the cache was likely missing in action (or at least lost after the death of the holder) and that the cache was replaced, and over your amazing find. Congratulations! You went to a lot of effort and spent a lot of time, energy and funds to accomplish this find, and you richly deserve the FTF on this one.

 

As far as the matter of whether the cache listing should have been archived pending its eventual replacement, much as I have stated before, I have never felt that the circumstances and facts surrounding this cache have warranted archival, nor even necessarily a temporary disabling, and rather, I feel that the way that the entire matter was handled (that is, the listing having been left active while the matter was researched and managed) by the owner was just fine.

I'd rather that cache owners take their maintenance responsibilities seriously. That includes the necessity of temporarily disabling caches that are known to not be available for whatever reason. These responsibilities don't go away just because Vinny thinks it's a really cool cache concept.