2009 Great SA TB Race

2.3k · June 7, 2009

IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR ALL TB RACE OWNERS

The gc.com website does not always automatically update the km's travelled by the TB's. In order for us [myself as Game Master and DamhuisClam as Web Master] to accurately indicate the scores every month it is imperative that the TB's km's are correct. In order o do this you need to go to the Tb;s oage and then on the upper right hand side you need to select "Recalculate Distance" and then click GO in order for the km's to be updated.

The website has also been updated and there is a host of information on it for people to see and read.

Happy racing.

June 7, 2009

Taken rule 7 are the Urban Hunters doing pongo a favor or not?

2.3k · June 7, 2009

Taken rule 7 are the Urban Hunters doing pongo a favor or not?

Only the 1st cache will count when multiple moves or "dipping" occurs.

7. Any bugs "dipped" in and out of caches will forfeit those points. ie: NO dipping will be allowed at all. This also applies to multiple moves by any 1 cacher. A bug may only be moved ONCE by any cacher. An owner therefore may move his own bug, but only once.

The ONLY time that you may dip is in the case of a FTF - no other time.

June 7, 2009

IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR ALL TB RACE OWNERS

The gc.com website does not always automatically update the km's travelled by the TB's. In order for us [myself as Game Master and DamhuisClam as Web Master] to accurately indicate the scores every month it is imperative that the TB's km's are correct......

Hopefully my particular problem will not come up with any of the racers, but I have a bug which refuses to update the distance. I've done the "Recalculate Distance" thing several times over the last few days, but it just doesn't update on the page.

2.3k · June 8, 2009

IMPORTANT NOTICE FOR ALL TB RACE OWNERS

The gc.com website does not always automatically update the km's travelled by the TB's. In order for us [myself as Game Master and DamhuisClam as Web Master] to accurately indicate the scores every month it is imperative that the TB's km's are correct......

Hopefully my particular problem will not come up with any of the racers, but I have a bug which refuses to update the distance. I've done the "Recalculate Distance" thing several times over the last few days, but it just doesn't update on the page.

It seems as though there might be a wider problem on the gc.com server - see THIS LINK ON THE FORUMS

June 9, 2009

I don't agree with this rule 6 & 7

If the same cacher dips the TB in a lot of FTF's is still unfair!!

What does all the other Cachers think??

June 9, 2009

Taken rule 7 are the Urban Hunters doing pongo a favor or not?

Only the 1st cache will count when multiple moves or "dipping" occurs.

7. Any bugs "dipped" in and out of caches will forfeit those points. ie: NO dipping will be allowed at all. This also applies to multiple moves by any 1 cacher. A bug may only be moved ONCE by any cacher. An owner therefore may move his own bug, but only once.

The ONLY time that you may dip is in the case of a FTF - no other time.

may the same cacher make multiple Dips one after each other (4,5 6 times in a row)??

TB's in question:

TB2JG9E

TB2JG9F

TB2HE7G

..................A bug may only be moved ONCE by any cacher. An owner therefore may move his own bug, but only once.

The ONLY time that you may dip is in the case of a FTF - no other time.

Edited June 9, 2009 by W@lly

June 10, 2009

Playing within the rules, which applies to all, seems fair to us :grin:

We doubt it if our Race TB will get so lucky, if so cool, if not, it still remains fun

1.6k · June 11, 2009

Think the whole dip idea is OK on a FTF but only if the TB or coin cannot be left in the cache. If it is listed as a small and able to take coins or TB's then it should be left there....

OK I understand that some caches may be too small for TB's but coins can fit into most small caches and when you see a cache that it gets dipped into that already has a coin in.... makes you wonder.... why wasn't it left there.... Anyway this was a loophole that Urban Hunters found, let them run with it while they can. I see it only as a bonus to the cacher they are gaining points for. Which in turn is working against them in regards the position they have in the race.

Now would someone go and move The Love Bug please..... Thank you.

June 11, 2009

I am not a participant, but only a spectator (albeit an interested one), and maybe some of the participants will come my way during the race, and then the race and the rules would come into play so in anticipation of that I have the following comments:

1. The website looks very cool - well done.

2. I find that link to the race page and the rules are a little obscure. I knew where to find it as I have been following this thread, but a cacher less inclinded to trawl the forums than I might miss it. Maybe a link to the rules could be more prominent (maybe inserted in the first post of this thread)

2. Regarding the multiple dipping of FTF discussed in the previous posts. If I did not follow the forums and encountered a racing bug, I would hopefully get to the race page and find my way to the

official race rules (not sure why it is not called "Rules"). After reading points 6 and 7 I understand that (i) dipping is only allowed with FTF and (ii) "A bug may only be moved ONCE by any cacher." So as I understand it Urban Hunter is welcome to multi dip bugs in FTF, but the bugs will only receive points for the first FTF dip, all subsequent moves by the same cacher will not accrue points. I also interpret that the original idea of the race was to discourage multiple moves by the same cacher, so multiple FTF dipping goes against that idea as well, but I understand that technical loopholes are a design fault, not exploitation by a player. I just don't see a loophole. Could someone please explain?

On another note: If a bug moves from SA to the UK, how many border crossing points are accumulated?

June 11, 2009

Go the pooks!!

you said it so nicely!!

2.3k · June 11, 2009

I agree that the incentives to stay in SA should outweigh border crossing points obtained by going to, say, the UK. I propose upping the points awarded for visiting all SA provinces to something like 75 or 100. As Anton pointed out, a bug going to the UK can get 45 points in one hop, while obtaining the provinces bonus involves some time/effort, so I feel is should be at LEAST 50.

Whatever the case, I think we need to finalise these details soon - I want to attach a little info card to my Racer with the rules on it before I mail it to cincol, which will need to happen soonish.

OK - for fairness as well as ease of administration the following will apply to any TB that travels internationally - irrespective of where it goes. The TB will ONLY score the border / bounday points for the country to country move and NOT the "borders" crossed en route. In other words SA to Australia will score the SAME as SA to Germany or SA to Namibia or Italy to UK - 3 points. The 2 countries involved will be the ones that determine the points and not the borders crossed. This will only apply to international moves. This will assist with keeping the SA incentives high.

Hi there pooks

Thanks for the comments made. Perhaps it is time for me to come in here. Firstly, you have the best aviatur that I have ever come across - I just love that cat!!

I am sure that some of the participants will make their way to the south and will spend some quality time there as well languishing in the hospitality that one can expect in the Western Cape - braaiing snoek, sipping wine and enjoying the scenery in general.

1. The website is all thanks to the efforts of DamhuisClan who has and still is working tirelessly on it as the idea of a dedicated site came up shortly before the race got underway. Consequently there are a few teething problems that we have to sort out w.r.t user friendliness, practicality and design flaws. However, we are confident that these will be overcome soon as we can only spend quality time on these issues after hours. Thanks for the comments though - much appreciated.

2. I tend to agree, but as mentioned above we are working on things and hope to have them smoothed out soon. It is also our intention to ask GlobalRat to "pin" either this thread or a new one for the duration of the race as well.

3. Now to the crux of the matter. When I originally set out the rules I looked at 4 other races that had been run over the passed few years and based our rules on what we had researched. The idea was to keep the rules as simple as possible for both the participants [read owners] and the administrator(s). At the end of the day I am the one who has to interpret the moves and allocate the scores and I like things to be as simple as possible when it comes to how I do things.

Not in a hundreds years did I, or anybody else for that matter, think that somebody would be as astute as what Urban Hunters were and have found not 1 but 3 FTF's the day after the race started!! A current race in the US that has nearly 100 TB's involved [1 of mine is there too but has been muggled already] has not had an issue involving more than 1 FTF - but along comes the SA Race and Urban Hunters and here we have something that is unheard of! So, the rules say that the only time that a TB may be dipped is in the case of an FTF. They also say that a TB may only be moved once by a cacher, but obviously if there is a FTF involved then that must therefore allow the cacher to move it again as per the rules. Some may find this a bit ambiguous I agree, but I am not one that likes things such as ELV's [to quote rugby] and am against changing the goalposts after the game has started. Was there an indescretion involved? Was there any malice intended? I don't think so, but if the sentiments of the participants are of such a nature that the race is to be compromised then perhaps we might have to bring in the services of an independant arbitrator. Until then I am happy to make the final decisions on the scores each month as per the "power" that goes with being the "Game Master".

4. As for the international question asked, the post of April 17th quoted above hopefully covers that question. For example it would be extremely unfair for a TB travelling to the Middle East with a straight line over 9 or 10 African countries scores for each border crossed whereas a TB going to Australia or USA travels across the ocean and hence crosses no borders. The incentive is for TB's to stay in SA as a TB going from Gauteng to Western Cape might cross 3 boundaries en routs - straight line method.

Happy caching and competitive racing everybody.

June 11, 2009

It sounds ok. In the end it's only a game.

Now, what about EarthCaches? Any points for visiting an EC site. FTF on a EC? And will this also be "dipping"?

June 11, 2009

Also following the forum with interest.

I understood from Rule "7. Any bugs "dipped" in and out of caches will forfeit those points" that it will accumulate four points for the FTF, but because it is dipped, it will not get the one cache point.

That way, there's no umbiguity, and will still get the distance points too. Forfeiting the one point, and gaining four could still be well worth the effort.

It still leaves the Earth (and virtual) cache question open though.

Anyone taking notes for the next race? Caches also accumulating points for race bug visits would be a good incentive to start placing regulars...

June 11, 2009

I still don't see where is the loophole that allows multiple moves by the same cacher. FTF dips are allowed, but not multiple moves, be it FTF or not.

I would have thought for example SA-UAE should equal 1 border - besides if the bug goes by plane it does not go through all the other countries in between - likewise a human traveller would get one passport to enter UAE from SA, not passports for all the countries in between. Bit of an unusual rule, this borders - what was the thinking around it? I know that I should have put these queries forward during the planning phase but I did not look too closely as I had planned to remain observer in this race (I am still recovering from the previous race). Now I am jumping in and stirring the pot - my apologies.

2.3k · June 11, 2009

Double post

Edited June 11, 2009 by cincol

2.3k · June 11, 2009

It sounds ok. In the end it's only a game.

Now, what about EarthCaches? Any points for visiting an EC site. FTF on a EC? And will this also be "dipping"?

@Bouts777 - EarthCaches unfortunately cannot accept TB's. That means that a TB cannot be placed in the cache and therefore cannot be retrieved either so that means they are out of the equation. Virtual caches can accept a TB, but by placing a TB in a virtual you will have to retrieve it as well as there is o physical container to put it into and that will then be construed as dipping.

@the pooks - Borders and boundaries are clarified in that borders will only count for the end country or destination. Boundries refer to provincial/state boundaries and will be determined by straight line method as per gc.com's maps. That way there is an easy way to verify the "route" the TB took to get to its destination. This cmes from an American race and I think the reasoning is that in certain areas of the US you could drive through 3 states to get to a point in an adjoining state so by using the straight line method such potential arguments are avoided up front. The same could be said for SA where one could drive from Gauteng to KZN through Mpumalanga and the Free State, but the straight line method would only take you through 1 or the 2 rather than both. I hope this helps.

8.6k · June 11, 2009

Heck!

When I decided to enter my little Welsh TB into this race I had no idea that the whole "rules thing" could get so complicated!

Cincol - good luck with adjudicating on all these various considerations... I'm just happy to see the interesting new places that my TB visits over the next year.

Good luck to all the racers.

MrsB

1.1k · June 11, 2009

It is strange how things turn out just after each race starts. I hear something similar happened with last years race. But rather understand the rules correctly in the beginning, rather than at the end of the race.

All hail to Urban Hunters for taking (I think) 3 TBs and dipping them into and from the 3 FTFs, and they have a racer as well. They put themselves, race wise, in a little bit of a disadvantage, but well spirited in the game of geocaching and the race.

cincol is the Game Master, juricator, and final judge. He opted to host the game, and we all entered or racers under his rules, and as long as all TBs and coins have all the same rules applied to them all of the time, then it is fair to every race entrant.

A rule which might count against your racer now, might just be the rule which helps it later on.

We are the TB owners can mostly now just sit back and watch our TBs move along. It is up to the cachers out there to go and pick them up for us and move them on. I think Urban hunters have special way of enticing the cachers out there to move their TB. I am attempting something similar with one of my racers. Time will tell if it works or not.

I agree with the pooks that most people will not go to the web site to look at the rules, so I added it to my TB and to the web page, just as many other did.

I am also open to suggestions on how the make the race page more interactive, or more interesting to any cacher finding a race TB out there.

Far-Jar-Hug sent me a link to a PHP script with someone in Australia. And that opened up a huge way to make the race stats more interactive. The distance now gets updated on a daily basis. So keep the suggestions coming.

2.3k · June 16, 2009

The 2009 Great SA TB Race is now halfway through the 1st month and I am sure many are wondering how their racers are doing. Well, notwithstanding the bug that is in the Geocaching.com site with respect to the mileage calculatons, I have managed to get a very good indication of mileages via using Google Maps and other means. :laughing:

Below is a PROVISIONAL list of the current Top 10 Racers as of this morning [Qatar Time]. I think I will post the Top 10 every 2 weeks to help with the interest. There are no scores shown - only position at this stage. The scores will only be shown on a monthly basis. Looks quite interesting so far and I am keen to see how the mid-month positions will compare to the month end scores. :lol:

1. 2009 Great SA TB Race - Flags of the World Post Card - DamhuisClan

1. Leopardo - Sidecar Spotters

3. Worm's RoadRunner - Wormgeocache

3. DiePienaars N.Ireland Racing Coin - DiePienaars

5. Pongo the Racing Dalmatian - MeganZA

6. 2009 Great SA TB Race ~ SA World Cup - MnCo

7. Gluteus Maximus - Raslin

8. 2009 SA Bug Racer - The Capital TB - Carbon Hunter

9. Arwen's Bling-Bling Mini Cooper - Arwen_SA

10. Cacheachu - iNokia

4.2k · June 18, 2009

DiePienaars - how do you do it?????

I see likle last year you are out near the front again!!! We need to do something about that

Great to see the spread happening already - and to see 2 bugs offshore already. Wonderf which will be next?

June 18, 2009

CH we are just lucky.

We thought that DiePienaars coin will be a marked coin form the beginning of the race, and expect a kidnap sometime. (Shhhh don't give them ideas) One thing that we have learnt is that the year for the race is long, and that lots can happen.

1.1k · June 20, 2009

I have made an update to the TB Race pages.

The following updates were made:

1) Added an estimated 'Great Circle' calculation to display an estimated distance travelled.

2) Added a score page. This will be updated with actual scores and positions by the 7th of next month.

3) Participants page will now load much faster.

4) Updated various spelling mistakes (I am a programmer, not a linguist)

5) Added the prizes, and who is sponsoring them.

Race pages can be accessed at http://www.sageostats.co.za/tbrace

1.1k · June 20, 2009

The last few updates done for a while:

1) Removed the Pirates (TBs not belonging to a country)

2) The location of where the TB / GC is, which country info / flag, and nearby town

3) Displaying from least travelled TB to most travelled TB.

'Bug Locations' are still manually updated. This will hopefully be automated sometime.

Next Manual update will happen on Monday night (after any weekend changes).

Edited June 20, 2009 by DamhuisClan

4.2k · June 21, 2009

Looking good Anton - the new additions are good value

4.2k · June 21, 2009

This has got to be the picture of the month - well taken GreenJaM

Nomination formally submitted - now lets see some more nominations - and good photos on the pages.

4.2k · June 25, 2009

Another PotM nomination - this time for Bouts' Saturn coin.

Wazat dropping it off on the top of The Boot.

1.1k · June 25, 2009

I will be adding one more method of displaying the data.

It will be by country and then state / province. In Alpabetical order.

This way it will be much easier to see if there is a TB in the area.

Hopefully it will go live after the weekend.

2.3k · June 25, 2009

Another PotM nomination - this time for Bouts' Saturn coin.

Wazat dropping it off on the top of The Boot.

Should we actually allow self portraits of hill-billy hobo types? After all this is a family sport!

June 25, 2009

I had a look at that cache "The Boot" (GC1TP9R) and I must admit that it do look like a great place to visit. Preferably a sleepover. Now I really do hope that other cachers share my sentiment and, not to be put off by the 4* terrain grading, visit the cache very soon and get those 3 racing TBs of us on their way again.

June 25, 2009

Okay - we're a bit lost at the moment....what is up with this "Photo of the Month" story? We don't remember reading about it on the rules for the Race, nor do we remember seeing any updates on this Forum thread that there is a Photo of the Month up for grabs? Is this just a "fun" thing or does it earn points?

1.1k · June 25, 2009

Okay - we're a bit lost at the moment....what is up with this "Photo of the Month" story? We don't remember reading about it on the rules for the Race, nor do we remember seeing any updates on this Forum thread that there is a Photo of the Month up for grabs? Is this just a "fun" thing or does it earn points?

It can earn a racer an extra 10 points each month.

See http://www.sageostats.co.za/tbrace/potM.php

This is in the hope of getting some excellent / amazing photos, and some interaction of the people out there, rather then just waiting for the score each month.

June 25, 2009

Aaahh...yes. Our apologies...we didn't recall reading about it on the TB Race webpage But have seen it now and will need to think a little more creatively from now on!

Just another question. All the race standings seem to revolve around the distance that the TB has covered. It seems that the points from photos with animals, and rugby jerseys, etc. do not seem to make any difference at this stage. Just wondering if all our efforts with photographing TBs to gain extra points is worth while?

2.3k · June 25, 2009

Aaahh...yes. Our apologies...we didn't recall reading about it on the TB Race webpage But have seen it now and will need to think a little more creatively from now on!

Just another question. All the race standings seem to revolve around the distance that the TB has covered. It seems that the points from photos with animals, and rugby jerseys, etc. do not seem to make any difference at this stage. Just wondering if all our efforts with photographing TBs to gain extra points is worth while?

hehe - the bonus points from the photographs are making a HUGE difference to the points!! You will have to wait for the month end scores and then you will see what a difference they do in fact make. The webpage will show the score broken down into distance, caches and bonus points. With only 1 point per 50km travelled the bonusses will make a big difference. That is why I did not put too much emphasis on the distance. Yes, initially a TB travelling overseas will get a lot of distance points, but that is where it ends. very few bonus points are to be gained whilst overseas. The TB's in SA will have a bigger chance of scoring bonusses - especially the discretionary bonusses that will come up from time to time.

KEEP THOSE PHOTOS ROLLING IN!!!!

1.1k · June 25, 2009

Duplicate post

Edited June 25, 2009 by DamhuisClan

1.1k · June 25, 2009

Aaahh...yes. Our apologies...we didn't recall reading about it on the TB Race webpage But have seen it now and will need to think a little more creatively from now on!

Just another question. All the race standings seem to revolve around the distance that the TB has covered. It seems that the points from photos with animals, and rugby jerseys, etc. do not seem to make any difference at this stage. Just wondering if all our efforts with photographing TBs to gain extra points is worth while?

At this stage the only movement is on the mileage, and you are correct that is currently how the racers are seated. Once we have the scores for the first month, then they will be seated from least amount of points to most amount of points on the points page (http://www.sageostats.co.za/tbrace/index.php?type=Score)

Once the scores are up, I think we will all get a better understanding from cincol as to how the photos are working.

The race pages are all a work in progress. I tend to agree with more or less what you are implying (I think): to display the distances as a seating is not fair, but currently I am not sure how else to display the updates. I don't want to display it alphabetically , as then it gets boring, and the same TBs will always be at the front of the list. This is also why I opted to display the lesser movements first to give these TB's more "air time".

With theses comments / questions we can update change as we see fit, and as always comments and suggestions appreciated.

Now it is back to the soccer ... SA playing quite well. Half time and its 0 / 0.

Edited June 25, 2009 by DamhuisClan

1.6k · June 25, 2009

Another PotM nomination - this time for Bouts' Saturn coin.

Wazat dropping it off on the top of The Boot.

Should we actually allow self portraits of hill-billy hobo types? After all this is a family sport!

Hey it was cold and windy and I had FTF (Frozen Toes, Fingers). Hee hee... ooops is the coin in that cache still?

LoL. It is not really 4 stars... more like 2 stars... oh wait I forgot I am not put off by big mountains.... LOL.

Hee hee...

Lets see what this may bring...

This race is a funny game with lots of surprises.

2.3k · June 26, 2009

If you look at this link Photos of the Month Nominations you can see which photographs are in the running for 10 bonus points for the month of June.

Edited June 26, 2009 by cincol

June 26, 2009

Would it not be better to extract all the photos from each bug for the month and publish them all? That way we can get to see them all.

2.3k · June 26, 2009

Would it not be better to extract all the photos from each bug for the month and publish them all? That way we can get to see them all.

Only those that have been nominated are displayed. It would be a huge job to display all photos. It is for that reason that we ask for nominations. The judges will selected the winner from the nominees only

June 26, 2009

Please also clarify: In order to get the bonus points for having your bug photographed on a rugby jersey - does it also need to be in the nominated category?

June 26, 2009

Only those that have been nominated are displayed. It would be a huge job to display all photos. It is for that reason that we ask for nominations. The judges will selected the winner from the nominees only

Come on, Anton is a whizz at SQL. It should as easy to extract one as it is to extract them all.

It would also save the effort in having to trawl through all the logs for each bug to see if per chance there may be a photograph worth nominating.

Edited June 26, 2009 by BruceTP

2.3k · June 26, 2009

Hehe - I will leave that to Anton to answer!

2.3k · June 26, 2009

Please also clarify: In order to get the bonus points for having your bug photographed on a rugby jersey - does it also need to be in the nominated category?

Photo of the Month is seperate category completely unrelated to the rugby photos. If your bug photographed with a jersey AND wins Photo of the Month then it will score bonus points for both.

1.1k · June 26, 2009

Come on, Anton is a whizz at SQL. It should as easy to extract one as it is to extract them all.

It would also save the effort in having to trawl through all the logs for each bug to see if per chance there may be a photograph worth nominating.

To get a list of all photos on the race pages, I would need to scrape the GC.com web site, and this is a No-no as I hear from other people. At the moment, I do one or two KML file downloads for every racers per day. Hopefully this is not enough to anger GC.com. The KML file is then cached localy on the web server untill I do a manual refresh (which happens most mornings between 7 and 8 AM.

1.1k · June 26, 2009

The Bug Location map will now be updated once a day as well. The last update is displayed just below the map.

There seems to be a problem with the caching of the XML data on my firefox browser (Eager Beaver should be in the UK).

If anybody has a problem, please let me know. Maybe we can find a way to solve it.

June 27, 2009

http://img.geocaching.com/track/log/displa...fe4f7339be4.jpg

I would like to nominate this photograph for the June entries.

4.2k · June 28, 2009

Nice one Bruce

1.1k · June 28, 2009

The last entry on the race page, lists the combined kilometres travelled by all the TB/GCs, and also displays the amount of times it is around the earth, as well as the percentage travelled to the moon.

After almost 1 month of racing we are almost once around the earth.

Any guesses as to:

1) Will we make it to the moon? and

2) What will the final distance be with relation to the moon distance?

My prediction:

1) Yes

2) 1.4 times (To the moon, and 40% back.)

Edited June 28, 2009 by DamhuisClan

2.3k · June 29, 2009

DISCRETIONARY BONUS POINTS FOR THE MONTH OF JULY

10 points for any photos related to Lions Tour - Jersey, Test location, etc

5 points for any South African cache name containing Q, W or Y

10 points for any TB visiting an Eastern Cape cache

June saw bonus points for KZN. Every month a SA Province will feature for bonus points.

Happy racing everybody!

2009 Great SA TB Race

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