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Geo Police


power69

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If a cache is placed with proper permissions would not removing it be theft? Isn't the sign falsely alluding to having some official capacity? I would report these as crimes & have the dirt bag prosecuted if caught.

 

Personally, I'd beat the crap out of him if I caught him.

I'm pretty sure battery is a crime. Stealing a cache or putting up sticker that may seem to impersonate an official action might be crimes but I doubt they would be considered anywhere near a serious as assault or battery.

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If a cache is placed with proper permissions would not removing it be theft? Isn't the sign falsely alluding to having some official capacity? I would report these as crimes & have the dirt bag prosecuted if caught.

 

Personally, I'd beat the crap out of him if I caught him.

I'm pretty sure battery is a crime. Stealing a cache or putting up sticker that may seem to impersonate an official action might be crimes but I doubt they would be considered anywhere near a serious as assault or battery.

WHOA! Slow down, there, pardner! You have just uttered some pretty radical words there, guy! Since when is beating the crap out of a geomuggle or someone who bothers or disturbs a geocache a crime? What state do you live in? I have always assumed that such services are purely a public service, and it surprises me greatly to hear that there may be states or cities where that is illegal! Who would have guessed? Moreover, who could have known?

 

 

 

 

;)

 

 

:ph34r:

 

:D

 

:lol:

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If a cache is placed with proper permissions would not removing it be theft? Isn't the sign falsely alluding to having some official capacity? I would report these as crimes & have the dirt bag prosecuted if caught.

 

Personally, I'd beat the crap out of him if I caught him.

 

I doubt I would have the time to 'beat the crap out of him', since (s)(th)he(y) seem(s) to be quite full of it.

Physical punishment is so...temporary.

Let's just say the perp will be quite uncomfortable for a long time once caught.

The traps have been set, the sentries posted, and the notices distributed.

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Having spend 30 years in law enforcement it is clear that the sticker is not from a governmental agency. If if was it would refer you to the specific agency not "state or local." There would also generally be a phone number. Also they wouldn't have a sticker for just geocache. it would be a general littering sticker.

 

That being said it would not be a stretch for a public agency to consider any container left on public property as litter. The term litter can be interperted as anything left not approved by the agency.

 

Ditto. As an active-duty police veteran of 15 years, I can tell you we WOULDN'T place a stupid sticker like this anywhere. We'd probably just throw the cache away and that would be that. Also, the street-corner lawyer that made up this sticker obviously doesn't understand the laws he is quoting.

 

Cache Safe, Cache Strong!

Grigorii Rasputin

http://grigoriirasputin.wordpress.com

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If a cache is placed with proper permissions would not removing it be theft? Isn't the sign falsely alluding to having some official capacity? I would report these as crimes & have the dirt bag prosecuted if caught.

 

Personally, I'd beat the crap out of him if I caught him.

I'm pretty sure battery is a crime. Stealing a cache or putting up sticker that may seem to impersonate an official action might be crimes but I doubt they would be considered anywhere near a serious as assault or battery.

 

;):)

 

Yet another PC wimp. Sometimes an individual just needs the crap beat out of them & deservedly so. Society was a whole lot more polite when I was a kid. If you needed smacked around you usually got it. You thought twice about being an idiot back then.

 

Anyway, I do believe that I do have the legal right to protect property (here in KS anyway, YMMV) & that it would NOT be considered a crime. Besides, he swung first! :)

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Sticker for new geocache...

 

ATTENTION:

 

Placing a sticker and removing geochache containers has been linked to shrinking genitalia and permanent impotence.

 

But then again if you are doing such a thing it probably doesn't matter anyway. Please return to your parent's basement and continue dreaming about someday meeting a REAL girl.

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Sticker for new geocache...

 

ATTENTION:

 

Placing a sticker and removing geochache containers has been linked to shrinking genitalia and permanent impotence.

 

But then again if you are doing such a thing it probably doesn't matter anyway. Please return to your parent's basement and continue dreaming about someday meeting a REAL girl.

 

Does this also apply if the maggot is a girl?

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Sticker for new geocache...

 

ATTENTION:

 

Placing a sticker and removing geochache containers has been linked to shrinking genitalia and permanent impotence.

 

But then again if you are doing such a thing it probably doesn't matter anyway. Please return to your parent's basement and continue dreaming about someday meeting a REAL girl.

 

Does this also apply if the maggot is a girl?

 

Don't ask, don't tell. :)

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Dont touch the sticker, the finger prints of the wannabe might be on it. :)

 

Not to mention the DNA. Just in case someone decides to enforce ARS 13-1602 [prohibiting defacing property. as defined in section 1601, "by any means, or any act of putting up, affixing, fastening, printing or painting any notice on any structure, without permission from the owner"].

 

When I replaced a missing cache that had been stickered, I might be tempted to sticker the sticker to this effect, but that probably would just escalate the stickering. So I probably would put a warning on the cache that replacing this container with a sticker violates section 13-1602 (its more of my style than bringing genetilia, impotence, and other factors into the mix).

Edited by mulvaney
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Hi, I'm the Cache owner for "It's a duck's Life"... as far as I'm concerned, you can log this as a find if you want. I will try to get to it and replace it soon.

As a hider, I don't care if someone signs the log, etc. Hiding the cache is for my enjoyment and for the purpose of bringing cachers to the cache. After that, it's beyond me. I've never been too concerned about a cachers log on one of my caches. If they want to log the find, so be it.

 

I'm even thinking about putting out a challenge cache that requires you to have only previously found a cache. I get tired head sometimes with the 'you must create a public bookmark' or "you must email me your list' or 'you must send a screenshot of whatever.'

Edited by TerraViators
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Hi, I'm the Cache owner for "It's a duck's Life"... as far as I'm concerned, you can log this as a find if you want. I will try to get to it and replace it soon.

As a hider, I don't care if someone signs the log, etc. Hiding the cache is for my enjoyment and for the purpose of bringing cachers to the cache. After that, it's beyond me. I've never been too concerned about a cachers log on one of my caches. If they want to log the find, so be it.

 

I'm even thinking about putting out a challenge cache that requires you to have only previously found a cache. I get tired head sometimes with the 'you must create a public bookmark' or "you must email me your list' or 'you must send a screenshot of whatever.'

 

I have hidden a challenge cache. You are supposed to find a cache in each of the eight counties that make up Western New York. No place on the page does it say make a bookmark list, photoshop anything, or even make any attempt to contact me. I have no desire to inspect anyone's record.

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I see your misdemeanor code violation of 13-1603 (littering) and i raise your a code violation 13-1802. Felony (theft)

 

The person that posted that sticker isn't just guilty of the same crime but also a more serious crime aswell. He/She knows that the Geocache has an owner but makes no attempt to return the property to its owner. :anicute:

 

A. A person commits theft if, without lawful authority, the person knowingly:

1. Controls property of another with the intent to deprive the other person of such property; or

2. Converts for an unauthorized term or use services or property of another entrusted to the defendant or placed in the defendant's possession for a limited, authorized term or use; or

3. Obtains services or property of another by means of any material misrepresentation with intent to deprive the other person of such property or services; or

4. Comes into control of lost, mislaid or misdelivered property of another under circumstances providing means of inquiry as to the true owner and appropriates such property to the person's own or another's use without reasonable efforts to notify the true owner; or

5. Controls property of another knowing or having reason to know that the property was stolen; or

6. Obtains services known to the defendant to be available only for compensation without paying or an agreement to pay the compensation or diverts another's services to the person's own or another's benefit without authority to do so.

B. A person commits theft if, without lawful authority, the person knowingly takes control, title, use or management of a vulnerable adult's property while acting in a position of trust and confidence and with the intent to deprive the vulnerable adult of the property. Proof that a person took control, title, use or management of a vulnerable adult's property without adequate consideration to the vulnerable adult may give rise to an inference that the person intended to deprive the vulnerable adult of the property.

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I see your misdemeanor code violation of 13-1603 (littering) and i raise your a code violation 13-1802. Felony (theft)

 

The person that posted that sticker isn't just guilty of the same crime but also a more serious crime aswell. He/She knows that the Geocache has an owner but makes no attempt to return the property to its owner. :anicute:

 

A. A person commits theft if, without lawful authority, the person knowingly:

1. Controls property of another with the intent to deprive the other person of such property; or

2. Converts for an unauthorized term or use services or property of another entrusted to the defendant or placed in the defendant's possession for a limited, authorized term or use; or

3. Obtains services or property of another by means of any material misrepresentation with intent to deprive the other person of such property or services; or

4. Comes into control of lost, mislaid or misdelivered property of another under circumstances providing means of inquiry as to the true owner and appropriates such property to the person's own or another's use without reasonable efforts to notify the true owner; or

5. Controls property of another knowing or having reason to know that the property was stolen; or

6. Obtains services known to the defendant to be available only for compensation without paying or an agreement to pay the compensation or diverts another's services to the person's own or another's benefit without authority to do so.

B. A person commits theft if, without lawful authority, the person knowingly takes control, title, use or management of a vulnerable adult's property while acting in a position of trust and confidence and with the intent to deprive the vulnerable adult of the property. Proof that a person took control, title, use or management of a vulnerable adult's property without adequate consideration to the vulnerable adult may give rise to an inference that the person intended to deprive the vulnerable adult of the property.

Keep reading. Generally, it's not a felony unless the stolen item was worth over $1000.
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I was geocaching in AZ last week for the first time and found one of those stickers at "It's a Duck's Life' (GCGDM3).

 

I logged it as "Needs maintenance" and included a photo of the sticker, photos of the site, and the text of the code referenced on the sticker. It didn't look very official to me.

 

I also logged it as a "Found" because in my thinking, I found the location of the coords, which were marked by the sticker. It seemed fair to me, since I did find the exact spot.

 

Today, a week after I logged the find, I was surprised to get email from another geocacher (not the cache owner by the way), which said:

 

You need to remove your find on It's a Duck's Life. You can't claim a find if the cache isn't there. Sorry. Thanks for reporting the sticker.

So, are there geocache user "police" that read random caches and pass judgement on how entries are logged?

 

The email caught me off guard and I'll admit, I thought it was a bit rude and presumptuous - almosts takes the fun out of geocaching.

 

I wonder what others think. Am I in the weeds on this and need an attitude adjustment? I'm always willing/eager to learn and grow and welcome constructive thoughts.

 

Thanks!

Joe (DEZINR from Columbus, OH)

 

Yeah, I just logged a DNF yesterday on a missing cache (construction of a town drainage ditch in the area). The thread referenced by WRASTRO is in fact long-running, and will probably never die off. I'll even admit to being a contributor to it. :anicute: Account names are never used, and cache pages are never linked to.

 

I'd say what you did is often frowned upon, but maybe I'm just some zany Puritan. Ultimately, I suppose it's up to the cache owner to decide what's a find, and what isn't.

 

And yes, emailing someone when it's not your cache is totally whacked, in my opinion.

 

Not a comment on the applicability of the find or not, but that smells fishy to me. Someone other than the cache owner sent you an email...sounds like it might have been from the dweeb who placed the sticker. Just sayin'. When it looks like a fish and smells like a fish, sometimes it is a fish. I can't imagine someone else doing it.

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Somewhere there's a story here, but so far all we have are snippets and kibble of information.

 

Yes, but it's so fun to speculate. :P I vote for anti-geocaching vigilante/ticked off cacher.

 

Sounds like the anti-WheresGeorge folk who in the found comments write things like "currently in FBI crime lab awaiting supena to arrest you for defacement of currency" LOL!

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Well the child is getting the attention he wants in this forum.

Some people can't stand the thought of somebody else having fun.

 

I had an issue with graffiti on a wall near my home years ago. And I adopted the idea that

I can buy more concrete grey paint then the taggers can afford...and cover their work faster

with an 8 inch roller.

The problem was solved in less than 2 months and cost me less than a $12 gallon of paint.

 

So replace the caches quickly and often and ignore his stickers.

 

There are thousands of us and probably only one of them.

 

They will tire of this soon enough and go back to prank calls.

 

Cache on, fellow seekers !

 

Thats exactly correct. Graffitti that is removed quickly on a regular basis (within 24 hours) usually stops.

 

Tolerance of graffitti is often linked to violent crimes in areas, and a indicator. There was a study done where a bicycle was left unattended in a certain spot to see if someone would take it. (but watched) Later the researchers added (temporary) graffitti to the walls around it. It showed that the simple presence of graffitti was more likely to encourage someone to try and take the bicycle. The same goes for litter. There are not just "litterbugs", but people who actually base their decision to toss garbage by how much garbage is already there. Very few people will litter all the time. However, once a little bit of litter appears, it accumulates very quickly.

 

 

The best thing to do is to replace the caches quickly, and quietly, and let this thread drop off the page without any more attention to them..

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Someone just made me aware of this thread after I posted my $0.02 HERE

 

Here's what I said in my post:

Hello all,

 

Today we encountered yet another of these little orange stickers:

933ec920-34c1-4253-95cd-061fdaf21791.jpg

at GC210AB.

 

Here's another:

5c54c67d-554e-4d2c-af8d-31a6a22af484.jpg

at GC22JQ8

 

And then a couple of days ago, this happened to one of our caches:

3c5d0a30-3c76-45a1-b01a-30714f2e9061.jpg

at GC2AFQ8

 

It is very frustrating as a cache owner who has done all of the right things in placing their cache to have some butthead seek it out, destroy it in the name of protecting from littering, and then litter the CZ with an orange sticker proclaiming their deed and that a legal cache is "Geotrash". Meanwhile, they bypass trash and graffiti to do so. This is not noble, and it is certainly not doing anything to protect the environment from litter. The law they are trying to cite as being violated at two of the sites regards these as acts of "Criminal Littering" while they themselves are guilty of doing exactly that! Someone is attempting to hide under this law while they commit their cowardly acts of theft, vandalism, and trying to make other folks unhappy as obviously they are.

 

I know caches get muggled everyday, but it appears as if these acts are being done with an agenda (however misdirected it is) in mind. On the first two above, it is obvious that the culprit wants to see what people think of their cowardice as they are "watching" those caches. I know that in an effort to thwart this from happening to us in the future, we will be making all of our hides "Premium Only" and they will be multi-stage caches.

 

My question is: Is this a common occurrence nowadays, or are is my caching team just happening to stumble upon these by coincidence? Is this now just part of geocaching? Is it possible for a moderator to see if the person who is watching these muggled caches is the same guy? If it is, is it possible to see which other caches are being watched by them as well so that the cache owner can be made aware that their cache may or may not be compromised?

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My question is: Is this a common occurrence nowadays, or are is my caching team just happening to stumble upon these by coincidence? Is this now just part of geocaching? Is it possible for a moderator to see if the person who is watching these muggled caches is the same guy? If it is, is it possible to see which other caches are being watched by them as well so that the cache owner can be made aware that their cache may or may not be compromised?

 

It seems as if your area (the gilbert / mesa area) was hit very hard this time

 

As far as we know, there were a few that were "removed" starting in the central phoenix area, then moving along gilbert, and then out along to queen creek area. This is not the first time this has happened here, and last happened was in 2008, and appears to be in the winter timeframe.

 

Here is also additional info on the subject -

 

http://www.calgarycachers.net/azcachers/vi...p?f=3&t=675

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I also have another theory, for any cache of mine that gets muggled with sticker, I will replace it, and place two new ones :D

 

I'm down with that. We could make an entire "Mitosis Series"

:laughing:

 

Although if is is a magnetic container, I suppose you should make sure you have permission lest you deface an object as defined by ARS 13-1601(2). For that matter, permission might also be a good idea with any cache to avoid littering by leaving an object or foreign substance of whatever kind or description, regardless of whether it has value under ARS 13-1601(3).

Edited by mulvaney
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I was geocaching in AZ last week for the first time and found one of those stickers at "It's a Duck's Life' (GCGDM3).

 

I logged it as "Needs maintenance" and included a photo of the sticker, photos of the site, and the text of the code referenced on the sticker. It didn't look very official to me.

 

I also logged it as a "Found" because in my thinking, I found the location of the coords, which were marked by the sticker. It seemed fair to me, since I did find the exact spot.

 

Today, a week after I logged the find, I was surprised to get email from another geocacher (not the cache owner by the way), which said:

 

You need to remove your find on It's a Duck's Life. You can't claim a find if the cache isn't there. Sorry. Thanks for reporting the sticker.

So, are there geocache user "police" that read random caches and pass judgement on how entries are logged?

 

The email caught me off guard and I'll admit, I thought it was a bit rude and presumptuous - almosts takes the fun out of geocaching.

 

I wonder what others think. Am I in the weeds on this and need an attitude adjustment? I'm always willing/eager to learn and grow and welcome constructive thoughts.

 

Thanks!

Joe (DEZINR from Columbus, OH)

Only speaking on my own behalf...I would have logged a DNF.

 

There are very few rules in geocaching, and one of them is you have to log the find at the cache.

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Our numbers are many, their numbers are just one, two or maybe three. Certainly not four or more. Any way the point is, instead of talking about it on here which is probably giving this sicko a hard on, we need to work together. If you find one of these stickers, remove it and either replace the cache your self or log a DNF and contact the owner so they can get it replaced. If we are vigilant, and we don't give them the sanctification they are looking for they will eventually stop.

Edited by releasethedogs
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Somewhere there are a couple of acne riddled kids, filled with misaligned teen angst, armed with smartphones and a laser printer thinking they are the coolest guys on the planet.

 

They probably have half a bedroom filled with stolen cache containers.

 

What I don't understand is what they would do with them. If they tried to sell them, a cacher would certainly "bust" them at some point. What honest cacher would want to buy a known stolen cache? Steal them to throw them away?

 

Fools.

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If this moves up to Canada... I'm installing cameras. :ph34r:

 

I was going to suggest this to some of the COs in the area that is being "serviced" by this Geo-Thief...

 

And it's sad that someone out there has such a sad and pitiful excuse for a life as to ruin the fun of other people because they feel they need to "protect" the world from geocaches.

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The perp(s) appear to be operating as 'Quality Control Agents', with their own concept of 'quality' as the guideline.

 

They seem to only operate here in the cooler months (snowbird season), therefore we can presume them to be an older, retired couple (or individual).

 

I don't think there is an easy way to catch them, but if they keep it up they will eventually be caught.

 

I think the best way to deal with this is to simply replace the cache(s) without comment (Or, in some cases, take their attention to heart and realize it wasn't really a good cache after all, and archive it.).

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Has anyone done any further investigating?

 

Other caches in the same areas not touched that always seem to be by the same person or few people? (removing other's caches for revenge)

 

Many of these caches watched by the same person/people?

 

Anyone checked any "competing" geocaching sites to see if any kiddies have stepped up or reported this?

 

Is there any common current or past premium users that logged a find before the first stickers were found?

 

Do any of the users on the watchlist match or similar in name to those on the banlist for the forums?

 

Any logs on the official site from unique users within a few days before the stickers were found but after the last legitimate find/log that may also coincide with banned IP addresses or names on the forums?

 

Any names that only seem to login and appear on the site and/or forum during the months when these stickers are found?

 

There are others but this should be a good start...

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The perp(s) appear to be operating as 'Quality Control Agents', with their own concept of 'quality' as the guideline.

 

They seem to only operate here in the cooler months (snowbird season), therefore we can presume them to be an older, retired couple (or individual).

 

I don't think there is an easy way to catch them, but if they keep it up they will eventually be caught.

 

I think the best way to deal with this is to simply replace the cache(s) without comment (Or, in some cases, take their attention to heart and realize it wasn't really a good cache after all, and archive it.).

It appears that these new stickers have been appearing recently, in the hot months of August and September, and during early October with daytime highs still well over 100°F. I have seen two identical stickers this week that declared the geocache to be "geotrash" and has been removed. One cache was in northeast Phoenix and the other was in north Mesa. Here is my log entry for GC2A6T3 in northeast Phoenix with a picture of the sticker. ;) (The cache was attached to a support beam for covered parking spots in an office complex parking lot). I found this same sticker at the site of GC188K8 in north Mesa two days later; :D my smartphone's battery power was too low to take a picture.

 

Mesa resident Team Evil Fish apparently has had many of his caches stolen this week, including the large cache Still Friends, :ph34r: located unsecured behind a bush in the parking lot of a scuba diving shop.

 

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) :blink:

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