What if you just can't find it?

[Jaybeee]

What about the geocache you simply cannot find? We have looked for GC18ZW9 several times. It is a three-stage geocache. We can find stage 1, we think we solved the location of stage 2, but that's as far as we get. I emailed the cache owner, but she said someone else created it and then transferred it into her name, so she doesn't know how to find it. I emailed the most recent person to find it, but haven't heard back.

 

Any suggestions? We are new to geocaching, and thoroughly enjoying it, but this one cache has us stumped!

 

Jaybeee

[+Gob-ler]

The cache owner in the cache listing has access to all of the stages to the multi-cache and that includes the coordinates. It appears from reading the logs that there are two or more possible numbers to use at the first stage to work the puzzle. If your not finding stage two with your numbers you might try and redo the first stage using the other number that folks are talking about.

 

Good luck with your hunt!

 

 

What about the geocache you simply cannot find? We have looked for GC18ZW9 several times. It is a three-stage geocache. We can find stage 1, we think we solved the location of stage 2, but that's as far as we get. I emailed the cache owner, but she said someone else created it and then transferred it into her name, so she doesn't know how to find it. I emailed the most recent person to find it, but haven't heard back.

 

Any suggestions? We are new to geocaching, and thoroughly enjoying it, but this one cache has us stumped!

 

Jaybeee

[+WRASTRO]

Keep trying and be patient. You could try contacting previous finders to see if you are searching at the correct location. Kinda lame if the current owner doesn't know how to find it.

[+Walts Hunting]

That's why there is a "ignore listing" to click on.

[+ventura_kids]

I believe there are now over 625,000 geocaches hidden.

Don't stress over a Did Not Find (DNF).

It may be your first....but hopefully not your last DNF.

 

You have run into the reason we hate multi-caches.

Unless they are done well, each waypoint can have problems.

[Jaybeee]

The problem with the first stage is that there are several numbers to choose from. This location is a disc golf course, so there are numbers on the baskets (several of which are visible from that spot) and the tee signs (two of which are visible). Also on the tee signs are the phone numbers of the businesses that sponsor each hole. We've tried using just the numbers on the baskets, just the numbers on the tee signs, with and without the sponsor's phone number, and so on... I love a challenge, but this is pissing me off! It was designed for a geocaching course for beginners, and it is supposed to be an easy find. If this was my first attempt at geocaching, I think I would throw out my GPS and find another sport!

[+WRASTRO]

The problem with the first stage is that there are several numbers to choose from. This location is a disc golf course, so there are numbers on the baskets (several of which are visible from that spot) and the tee signs (two of which are visible). Also on the tee signs are the phone numbers of the businesses that sponsor each hole. We've tried using just the numbers on the baskets, just the numbers on the tee signs, with and without the sponsor's phone number, and so on... I love a challenge, but this is pissing me off! It was designed for a geocaching course for beginners, and it is supposed to be an easy find. If this was my first attempt at geocaching, I think I would throw out my GPS and find another sport!

Try emailing prior finders and asking for clarification. This is supposed to be fun so if you are finding that you are not having fun then you might need to think about revising your approach for this cache. The prior finders should be happy to provide info since this is supposed to be an instructional cache. If it is that hard to understand it might need a bit of refining. The new owner needs to understand what is required to find this cache.

Edited October 29, 2008 by WRASTRO

[+Lord Stirling]

Give up and move on. There are plenty more out there.

 

I recall one where I had 6 DNFs over several months. I wasted quite a few hours on that one before the owner archived it.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I believe there are now over 625,000 geocaches hidden.

 

 

And sometimes it seems that nearly half of them are in California.

 

IMHO, how one deals with caches that can't be found is often dependent upon cache density. When there several other caches within a 3-4 block radius it's much easier to just ignore one that might be hard to find or is of a type that one might not be interested in. However, a DNF on a cache when there may only be a handful of unfound caches within a 10-15 mile radius might take on a little more significance.

[Skippermark]

You could give up and move on if the cache doesn't mean that much to you, but after investing that much time already (and you said you're having fun, which is the most important thing), you could email the owner.

 

Let them know what you came up with for coords, and assuming you logged your DNFs (I haven't checked the cache), they will most likely help you out and let you know what went wrong or suggest something that will help you figure out what went wrong.

 

I find that most owners want people to find their caches, and have no problem offering some help to get you pointed in the right direction.

[+Proud Soccer Mom]

There was this one cache that was so fun. It had creative decoys everywhere. The description dropped a lot of clues. We over analysed comments made by people who'd found the thing for accurate clues. We went through eBay and numerous geocaching sales sites to look at creative containers for ideas on where this thing could be hidden. We checked every nail in every parking spot block. We were sure it was in this one spot, where the coordinates took you, but we'd gone over it a thousand times and it wasn't there. Besides... that's too easy... being exactly where the coordinates took you.

 

With so many people finding it... with decoys disappearing as the restaurant across the way came back into business (this was their overflow parking lot)... we still came up empty-handed.

 

It was finally archived. We'd searched for a year. I messaged the hiders and asked where it was.

 

It was exactly where we were sure it was, had gone over a thousand times and NEVER saw.

 

Sometimes you just gotta let some things go.

 

- Elle

Edited October 29, 2008 by HauntHunters

[Jaybeee]

I emailed the owner - someone else set it up and transferred ownership to her, and she doesn't know how to find it.

 

I emailed the person who set it up - haven't heard back.

 

I emailed the most recent finder - haven't heard back.

 

I once had a sudoku puzzle that I could not solve, no matter how long I worked on it. I finally ripped the puzzle out of the book and shredded it. Maybe that's what we need to do with this particiular geocache!

 

I appreciate everyone's help.

[Mushtang]

Kinda lame if the current owner doesn't know how to find it.

I agree. It makes me wonder how the current owner would do any maintenance if needed.

[+Buggheart]

I emailed the owner - someone else set it up and transferred ownership to her, and she doesn't know how to find it.

 

I emailed the person who set it up - haven't heard back.

 

I emailed the most recent finder - haven't heard back.

 

I once had a sudoku puzzle that I could not solve, no matter how long I worked on it. I finally ripped the puzzle out of the book and shredded it. Maybe that's what we need to do with this particiular geocache!

 

I appreciate everyone's help.

 

Not trying to rain on your parade or anything, but you may not hear back from some of the people you emailed. Again, not trying to be a jerk, just being practical and speaking from experience. I cache with my mom and we have both emailed cache owners, recent finders, etc and hear back from only a fraction of them for some reason. They may have lost interest, are out of town, don't have notifications turned on, or any number of reasons for not getting back in touch so we've just gotten to the point where we're happy for a response and if no response is given we just move on. Last week I contacted a cache owner with regard to a travelling cache that was within 400 of my house but didn't quite understand. I haven't heard back from him which irritates me a little but there's not a whole lot I can do about it so I've moved on.

 

Oh, and I agree that it's totally lame that the person to whom the cache was transferred doesn't have a clue as to where to find it. Maybe it should be archived or something.

[+JBnW]

If you're reasonably sure the cache still actually exists and has not gone AWOL, there's no shame in posting a DNF log with additional commentary to the CO (and yourself): "Dear CO, today you were better at hiding than I was at finding. Congratulations to you! I'm going to re-think my strategy at finding your cache, and return to solve your little puzzle and claim my smiley! Until then, Cheers". There are still finds (and great happieness) after DNFs.

[+SimbaJamey]

I hate to be the person that brings up numbers...but...

 

From the looks of it, most of the people who have found that one have at least 3 digit find totals.

I'm not one to care about what anyones find count is but mine...But in your case I will say this:

I would put that cache on the back burner for a while. There's a huge difference in 'geosense' after 50 as opposed to after 10. And again after 100, etc.

There were caches I spent HOURS looking for to no avail before I'd found 10...went back a month or two later and they were pretty easy grabs. One of the things that changes is recognizing typical hiding places and containers. My first 'blinkey' (magnetic nano) took me about 6 hours and required a hint from the CO. Now that I've seen one of them, they've become pretty easy to spot.

 

Have you emailed the person that found it after your DNFs?

If they're one of the non-responders, I'd just wait a month or two before trying this one again. Go look for some other ones and get used to seeing the things that look out of place. "Think like a Geocacher" was my mantra early on, I'd say it over and over when I got to GZ as I looked around for likely hiding places. It's a steep but fun learning curve, I'm pretty new too and even though I still have caches that take me several tries usually at an hour or two each, one of the biggest lessons I've learned is that if I don't get it on the second try I'll wait a month or so before I go back again. Seems like it's better to spend the 2 hours I probably would have wasted looking again out finding other caches both for the experience and to change my mindset from DNF to Found.

 

Good luck and Happy Caching!

 

[+Stargazer22]

I can understand your frustration.

Here's something you can try and it might be helpful.

Gather all your evidence, clues, and numbers. Take everything home and sit down in front of your computer and look at Google Earth.

Make up a list of the combinations of numbers that you think might be viable solutions for the stage you are looking for. Start putting them in Google Earth to see where they are.

You may find that several of the possible solutions either fall on private land, in a lake, in the middle of a road, or totally outside of the park you expect the stage to be hidden in. You may be able to eliminate those solutions as not possible hiding places. If you can do that, you may be able to greatly narrow down the possible hiding places to a few viable spots that you can go back and look at.

I solved one multi that we were missing some numbers for this way.

One stage had been burned up in a forest fire.

When I was putting in possible coordinates, I noticed that if I used a specific digit in the Lat. coodinates that the remaining possible solutions for the Long. coordinates all fell along a trail in the area.

That left me 6 possible hiding spots along the trail inside the area (assuming my guess was correct on the other digits).

Looking at those 6 spots, I picked what I considered to be the most likely and said to my wife that I thought that is where it would be. When we hiked the trail, the most likely spot turned out to be at the far end, so we checked the other 5 spots on the way there. One happened to be in a pond, that was a quick dismissal. A couple of others seemed to be in not very good hiding places but we looked anyway.

It turned out to be where I had thought it was, of course in the last one on the trail.

It was some work, but the reward was worth it.

 

As others have stated, the cache owner (even on an adopted one) should be able to access the coordinates of all the stages including the final stage, unless the adoption was an 'informal' one.

 

Good luck!

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

I emailed the cache owner, but she said someone else created it and then transferred it into her name, so she doesn't know how to find it.

Excellent reason that we need the Needs Archived log type. I would post one.

 

If the owner can't find it then they can't maintain it, a requirement for caches listed on this site.

[+J-Way]

As others have stated, the cache owner (even on an adopted one) should be able to access the coordinates of all the stages including the final stage, unless the adoption was an 'informal' one.

They can if the additional waypoint coordinates were entered into the cache description as "Stages of a Multicache". Some hiders don't do this even though they're supposed to. Even if they were entered correctly, "Muffin's Mom" may not know how to view them.

 

This situation appears as if someone (muffin?) hid a cache while home visiting family, then transferred ownership to "Muffin's Mom" when the vacation was over. Since you've established contact with the current official cache owner you could ask her for the trailname of the original hider. Maybe contacting that person would help.

 

Contacting previous finders also sometimes works.

 

If you view all previous logs you can see two earlier posts that have pictures of the final cache container and location. Does that area look familiar? If so, maybe you can find it without the coordinates. Another post indicates that it is a long walk, so it could be quite a distance away.

 

Finally, as stated earlier, you appear to have just started this game and don't have many finds. You may just have to put this cache on your "ToDo" list and come back to it after finding a few dozen other caches.

[+chuckwagon101]

The solution here is sooooooo easy!

 

Just keep looking for that little rascal and log a DNF each and every time that you look!

 

Think of all the "recognition" you will be getting by posting those DNFs!

 

People will think you are sooooo persistent.....even if you can't find the cache!

 

Now.....get out there and log those DNFs on that cache! I promise not to snicker or call you a rube or anything like that! ........maybe!

 

(You would never have this problem if you "specialized" in Big Pile Of Stick caches!

[Skippermark]

I emailed the cache owner, but she said someone else created it and then transferred it into her name, so she doesn't know how to find it.

I think I need new glasses, I somehow totally missed this sentence.

 

If the owner can't find it, and previous finders aren't able or willing to show how it's hidden, then the cache is pretty much junk and should be archived.

[+StarBrand]

Log your DNF because you looked and "Did Not Find" the cache.

 

Keep looking for it and log more DNFs or Move on to another cache.

[+nashuan]

I would echo some of the comments made previously. The new owner should have access to all the coordinates if the cache was legitimately transferred over to them, so even if they have not seen each stage in person, they would have access to the hidden waypoints through their account. Secondly, I would contact several of the previous finders. I myself keep a logbook with lots of information in case I have to go back some time in the future, or to help someone out in a situation such as yourself. On a side note, wouldn't it be nice if the new owner actually walked the cache they own? One last point on DNFs; several people have said you should hang it up and move onto other caches. Frankly, it's not bad advise and will allow you to enjoy your time in the field instead of heaping more frustration onto your day, but if you DO stick with this one and eventually find it, it will bring great satisfaction. I had one that I returned to six time (give or take a trip), before finding it. It was really frustrating when I came up empty but was really sweet when I finally spotted the elusive (expletive deleted) out of the corner of my eye. That was one smiley I REALLY earned.

[+TeamAtlas]

A log by someone named Earthquake' says they helped place it then transferred ownership. I think you should be contacting him.

[+DanOCan]

As long as you are having fun searching for it, keep on working on it.

As soon as the fun goes out of it walk away and put it on your Ignore list.

[+Harry Dolphin]

As long as you are having fun searching for it, keep on working on it.

As soon as the fun goes out of it walk away and put it on your Ignore list.

 

Dang. So much better than my thought of: Burn, rape and pillage. Oh, well.

Of course, obstinancy does come into play with some cachers. There was an evil mystery caches I worked on for ten months, until I was hit by that bolt of lightning... Duh!

The cache does seem to have been found recently, so it is still there.

Yup. If you're not having fun, go on to something else. If you're obstinant, come back and try it again another time.

[+39chevy]

Even if the current owner has the location of all the stages and the final she didn't create the cache and may not know how to solve the puzzle.

She knows where it is but not how to find it.

[+sportside]

What about the geocache you simply cannot find?

Speaking for myself, I move on. At the moment I only cache in areas that I can walk my dog, so I'm killing two birds with one stone These are usually parks with multiples caches (although no multis yet). If I fail to find, I move on. Some I may never look for again, others I might. If a new cache is placed in the same park, there is a better chance I will be back.

 

I wouldn't stress on it too much, there are plenty of caches to be found

[Jaybeee]

A log by someone named Earthquake' says they helped place it then transferred ownership. I think you should be contacting him.

 

I did - I haven't heard back.

[Jaybeee]

Our problem is not with the actual cache - although we are new at this, we are reasonably competent. The problem is that there are so many number possibilities at stage one that we can't be sure we are finding the right spot for stage 2. We have tried many possibilities, all of which take us out of the disc golf park to areas with no obvious numbers to solve stage 3. I'm sure if we could get to stage 3, we would be able to find the cache.

 

I hate to be the person that brings up numbers...but...

 

From the looks of it, most of the people who have found that one have at least 3 digit find totals.

I'm not one to care about what anyones find count is but mine...But in your case I will say this:

I would put that cache on the back burner for a while. There's a huge difference in 'geosense' after 50 as opposed to after 10. And again after 100, etc.

[POWRcacher]

If you never DNF you aren't caching hard enough. I've had sessions where my DNF's were more than my finds.

[+Wild Thing 73]

I wish you lots of luck on this multi cache....As I say I wish you luck, but, I think multi's are the biggest waste of time in geocaching...You sign 2-3 or 4 logs in some type of container and your journey is over many miles probably or if lucky just a mile and you just get ONE smiley Multi's are not cost effective now with such high fuel prices. Why not just do your multi, but, submit 2-3-or 4 containers with logs, which are "traditional caches"...you cover the same distance, but you can log 2-3 or 4 smileys. This is what I do and the cacher is rewarded with smiley's, which make us all happy....Happy caching and good luck.

[+Kohavis]

...I think multi's are the biggest waste of time in geocaching...You sign 2-3 or 4 logs in some type of container and your journey is over many miles probably or if lucky just a mile and you just get ONE smiley .... Why not just do your multi, but, submit 2-3-or 4 containers with logs, which are "traditional caches"...you cover the same distance, but you can log 2-3 or 4 smileys.

If you're in geocaching just for the numbers, then yes, multis aren't very time-effective.

 

If you're in it for the hunt and the enjoyment, then multis are fun and a nice break from traditionals.

[+WebChimp]

 

Any suggestions? We are new to geocaching, and thoroughly enjoying it, but this one cache has us stumped!

 

 

When you are just getting started, there will be several that will be hard to find. Maybe log them as a DNF (Did Not Find), and come back to those after you've found a few more. Sometimes extra experience will cause the "Oh, I get it" light bulb to come on. Then you can log it the second time as a smiley.

 

Another approach it to hook up with a more experienced cacher, and spend a few afternoons looking for caches with them. You can learn a lot from hunting with an old hand.

[Jaybeee]

I'm happy to report that today we found it. Turns out the first set of published coordinates is wrong. The original owner told us where to find the clues for stage 1. Thanks to everyone for their advice. Perhaps it was because of our "lack of experience" that we believed the published coordinates would actually be correct.

[+doingitoldschool]

I'm happy to report that today we found it. Turns out the first set of published coordinates is wrong. The original owner told us where to find the clues for stage 1. Thanks to everyone for their advice. Perhaps it was because of our "lack of experience" that we believed the published coordinates would actually be correct.

 

Hurray! I was just going to say that every so often each cacher gets a nemesis cache, no matter how many you have found before. I have watched people with over 1800 finds not see a nano in a tree stump, and we've taken over a day to finish one multi. It always helps to to just pull back when the blood starts to boil and re-visit it later or just swallow the pride and log the DNF.

[+Team GeoBlast]

I wish you lots of luck on this multi cache....As I say I wish you luck, but, I think multi's are the biggest waste of time in geocaching...You sign 2-3 or 4 logs in some type of container and your journey is over many miles probably or if lucky just a mile and you just get ONE smiley Multi's are not cost effective now with such high fuel prices. Why not just do your multi, but, submit 2-3-or 4 containers with logs, which are "traditional caches"...you cover the same distance, but you can log 2-3 or 4 smileys. This is what I do and the cacher is rewarded with smiley's, which make us all happy....Happy caching and good luck.

 

Perhaps, the smiley per gallon ratio is not as high on some priority lists?

[+Kohavis]

My last cache run I went after 11. At the end I had found 8 and DNF-ed 2 with one cache to look for. I searched all over and didn't find it.

 

In the past my first instinct is that it's gone, but time and time again when I add comments to that effect in the log, someone comes along after me and logs "Quick find" As usual, it was just me. So on this one I logged:

 

Couldn't find this one. I had put in 5.5 miles on foot by this point and my feet were sore, so my patience wasn't the greatest. DNF

 

Two days later the cache owner visited the hide and it was gone. Some kids had built a fort out of tree branches close to GZ and apparently muggled the cache. The CO archived it since it was a unique container

[+Glenn]

This is geocaching not Pokemon you don't "gotta catch them all". Log a DNF and move on to finding other caches. If you still can't get past the fact that you can't find the cache then add it to your ignore list.

Edited November 2, 2008 by Glenn