My new "xTF" Rules

September 10, 2008

Discussions with other cache hiders over the past week have prompted me to establish the following new set of "rules" for my cache hides. No, it's not something that would be forced upon anyone else who is hiding, but for those who would hunt my cache placements, it is no longer about the FTF as the "prize" may, and most likely will, be awarded to someone other than the FTF through random lottery methods. I'm sharing this concept here just in case someone might like the idea and wish to steal it or any part of it for their own use. The following is now posted to my profile and is also being posted to our local area forums:

THE CENTRAL KENAI PENINSULA CACHE STASHERS' NEW GAME RULES

All new caches placed in the Central Kenai Area will be tagged under one or more of the following "winner" configurations:

1- A First To Find (FTF) prize included in the cache for the first cacher who finds it.

2- A First To Log (FTL) prize for the first person who logs a valid find in the online cache log. Find will be verified against the physical cache logbook, then the FTL will receive instructions via email to the location of the FTL prize, which will typically be hidden separately from the cache but in the same general area and up to 500' away from the cache.

3- A Lottery Drawing prize for a randomly selected cacher from the first group of cachers who log both the physical cache and the online log. The number of players included in this drawing will be predetermined (may or may not be published on the cache listing) and once that number of finds is logged, the Cache Owner will conduct the random drawing and notify the winner of where to locate the prize, which will typically be hidden separately from the cache but in the same general area and up to 500' away from the cache. The prize may not be physically placed until the actual time of the drawing to protect it from being muggled while waiting for the correct number of players to find the target cache.

4- A predetermined random find number prize for the cacher who finds the cache at a certain point in the log order. The specific number will not be posted so as to prevent cachers from waiting and logging the cache at the correct position. This log may be based on either the physical logbook order or the online log order at the Cache Owner's discretion. Once a cacher logs at this predetermined spot in the log, they will be notified and given directions on where to find the prize, again located somewhere close to the cache. The cache listing will usually indicate that this prize is available, but will not disclose what point in the log order the prize position is located.

5- There may be no special prize associated with the cache at all. Your ability to locate the final cache may be the only reward, in which case it doesn't matter if you were first, fifth, or last as each find holds the exact same value. And that value is equal to what you put into your efforts and the ethical nature by which you choose to play this game.

I hope you enjoy my cache placements. Happy Caching!!!

Note: Even though I've titled this as "rules", no one has any obligation to hide caches this way, but I certainly encourage others to consider playing along with these concepts and even adding your own unique twists. It's time to shake things up and buck the establishment!

2.8k · September 10, 2008

Sounds like a lot of work, but they're your caches.

Good luck.

6.7k · September 10, 2008

THE CENTRAL KENAI PENINSULA CACHE STASHERS' NEW GAME RULES

All OF MY new caches placed in the Central Kenai Area will be tagged under one or more of the following "winner" configurations:

There, fixed it for ya :laughing:

Note: Even though I've titled this as "rules", no one has any obligation to hide caches this way, but I certainly encourage others to consider playing along with these concepts and even adding your own unique twists. It's time to shake things up and buck the establishment!

Certainly your prerogative as cache owner, but it sounds like you have WAY too much time on your hands! :laughing:

September 10, 2008

Do you think this will help resolve your local issues?

- Elle

September 10, 2008

given directions on where to find the prize, again located somewhere close to the cache.

Interesting idea, but I have one problem. I only get to the Kenai area once every... well, only once, and that was 26 years ago... I'm going to have to make two trips for each of your caches. :laughing:

OK, maybe I won't be getting the smilies or the prizes.

Have fun with it. :laughing:

3.3k · September 10, 2008

I go geocaching to get outdoors, and to take my mind off of life's stresses. Cachers shouldn't need to be "baited into" finding your caches, with the promise of rewards. That isn't geocaching.

Skip the silly "door prizes" idea.

3.3k · September 10, 2008

I go geocaching to get outdoors, and to take my mind off of life's stresses. Cachers shouldn't need to be "baited into" finding your caches, with the promise of rewards. That isn't geocaching.

Skip the silly "door prizes" idea.

September 10, 2008

Do you think this will help resolve your local issues?

- Elle

Maybe it will help, maybe not. Doesn't really matter. This is what myself and the couple other active hiders have come up with over the last few days. I won't be the only one using this method for drawing interest in a cache. So, with most of the new cache placements (as the key placers are all involved) using this method, the whole FTF concept just kinda goes right out the window as the gold may go to any one of the first dozen or so finders.

You can't wait to log your find as that might be the prize, and while the FTF race may still be there, just because someone was already FTF doesn't mean the race is finished as maybe the prize will actually be going to the 5th person to find, or maybe there will be a drawing between the first 12 people to find it. You may not know the exact details of the prize until after it is awarded.

I don't see where it will be any more work than normal cache maintenance. While placing the cache, a zip bag with a prize is placed separately and just far enough away as to not be accidentally found during the cache hunt. Whoever wins the contest is notified by email of the coords for the prize with a detailed description of where it is hidden (so they don't need to search for it). Then we just ask them to post a follow up note on the cache page after they've picked up the prize so everyone knows who got it, etc. It adds like 5 minutes to my duties as a cache owner. For those caches being placed in remote locations, the prize may actually be placed next to an existing cache back in town so the cacher doesn't have to return to a remote site to get it.

Oh, and as for the TB issues raised in my post the other day, that is being dealt with via some other methods by a couple other cache hiders. I am assisting in that effort a bit, but can't post details as to alert the root of the problems should he happen to be sock puppeting these forums. Rest assured, TB's traveling this area will have much more secure options in the future.

September 10, 2008

Um, isn't the little yellow smiley guy online prize enough? :laughing:

And maybe also the thrill of the hunt, the fun of seeing a new place, reading other people's log for caches we've found, the view, the chance to spend time together as a family, the exercise, the feeling of satisfaction one gets upon first spotting the container, the chance of running into another cacher on the trail, looking through the logbook and reading what others wrote, maybe finding some nifty swag, possibly spotting some wildlife or nice flowers or a cool gravestone or whatever, having something to do besides sitting in front of the TV or computer...

Yeah, FTF prizes are nice, but if there isn't one, who gives a rat's patoot? Caching is about caches, not prizes!

September 10, 2008

That isn't geocaching.

You've got that right. It would be great if we didn't have to resort to this stuff just because of that one bad apple causing all the problems. It would be really cool to just go hide a neat traditional, but no. We have to hide everything behind puzzles to keep them safe and come up with these "silly prizes" to negate the whole FTF concept.

3.9k · September 10, 2008

THE CENTRAL KENAI PENINSULA CACHE STASHERS' NEW GAME RULES

All OF MY new caches placed in the Central Kenai Area will be tagged under one or more of the following "winner" configurations:

There, fixed it for ya

Note: Even though I've titled this as "rules", no one has any obligation to hide caches this way, but I certainly encourage others to consider playing along with these concepts and even adding your own unique twists. It's time to shake things up and buck the establishment!

Certainly your prerogative as cache owner, but it sounds like you have WAY too much time on your hands!

I agree strongly wtit AR's comments, particularly the correction of the text language, but even more importantly:

I got very tired and bored even trying to read the whole proclamation by the OP, and, between major yawns, my biggest response was "Who cares?" along with "...sounds like a lot of work and a lot of a need to control everything!"

20.7k · September 10, 2008

Discussions with other cache hiders over the past week have prompted me to establish the following new set of "rules" for my cache hides. No, it's not something that would be forced upon anyone else who is hiding, but for those who would hunt my cache placements, it is no longer about the FTF as the "prize" may, and most likely will, be awarded to someone other than the FTF through random lottery methods. ...

Clearly, I misunderstood what a FTF is. Over the last seven years I had thought that I got a pretty good handle on it, but clearly I am mistaken.

I was under the impression that an FTF was a 'First To Find', in other words, the first person to find the cache after it was listed on GC.com was the FTF. I was also suffering from the wrong-headed beliefe that this was not something that was 'awarded' by the cache owner. If I were teh first person to find your cache after it was listed, I would be the FTF. If someone asked me how many FTFs I had, I would include that cache in the count.

Thanks for clearing this up for me.

September 10, 2008

I'm going to say BRAVO to these concepts.

I think they are a creative and perfectly honest way to address at least some of the issues your area has been having.

And if somebody doesn't want or can't claim the prize, they just have to let the CO know and another winner can be drawn.

20.7k · September 10, 2008

... I got very tired and bored even trying to read the whole proclamation by the OP, ...

When Vinny gets bored reading a post, you know it's long.

September 10, 2008

Glad we have the same definition of FTF. It is the FTF concept that is causing problems locally. Therefore, the invention of the "other" to find categories was deemed necessary to decrease the perceived value of the FTF.

3.3k · September 10, 2008

That isn't geocaching.

You've got that right. It would be great if we didn't have to resort to this stuff just because of that one bad apple causing all the problems. It would be really cool to just go hide a neat traditional, but no. We have to hide everything behind puzzles to keep them safe and come up with these "silly prizes" to negate the whole FTF concept.

Why don't you quietly invite all the other local cachers for a "secret meeting." At the meeting discuss creating super obtuse puzzles, unsolvable by the "Zebra cacher" that nobody likes. Be sure to share the solution amongst the group, but not with the offender.

This way, you guys can enjoy finding caches without the area troublemaker.

September 10, 2008

Good luck on all that.

I think you are going to WAY too much effort for this and you may find that you don't get enough juice from this lemon to make it worth squeezing.

But to each his own, I guess.

Why not just eliminate any prizes at all, or randomly draw for them at your next event gathering?

Make it a CITO and give a ticket for each bag of trash collected, good in the drawing at the end of the event.

That way you can feel that you are giving the prize to someone who actually 'earned' it.

You can decide who gets a prize for finding your cache. You can't decide who is the FTF. That would be the first person to find it after listing, as SBell111 pointed out. Saying you are giving the 'FTF prize' to the sixth person to find the cache seems kind of silly to me. Eliminate the FTF reference and it might make more sense, however, I have to agree with others who have stated before me that giving prizes isn't geocaching.

I would also point out that if you are going to all this trouble over one 'bad apple' that craves attention, then you are giving him just what he wants. To use a Snooganism, he will 'own' you.

Good luck with your lemonade!

September 10, 2008

Seems like a lot of work to me also.

I would simply not play the FTF game with your caches and local cachers.

Do not put a FTF prize out, and do not recognize the FTF person on your cache page. You are not obligated to do any of this.

Let the annoying folks play the game the way the want, and you put your cache out as a cache instead of a FTF contest. Keep is relaxing for yourself. Enjoy the cache as a cache.

September 10, 2008

If I knew I was going out to find a new cache and get a prize for being first to log, I would log my find before leaving the house. :laughing: If I couldn't find the cache, I'd either delete the log of edit it to a DNF log.

3.5k · September 10, 2008

I go geocaching to get outdoors, and to take my mind off of life's stresses. Cachers shouldn't need to be "baited into" finding your caches, with the promise of rewards. That isn't geocaching.

Skip the silly "door prizes" idea.

Ditto. When did caching become about the prizes? I think you're overthinking this game.

9.5k · September 10, 2008

Burnout is closer than it appears.

September 11, 2008

Not sure why folks are "overthinking" such simple concepts. But I guess you'd have to be an Alaskan to understand how important door prizes are to nearly every social function up here.

There was no mention of changing what a FTF prize is. I thought my follow up made that pretty clear, even though it's pretty clear in the OP. FTF is FTF is FTF, but we just are not going to be providing anything other than your sig on the first line of the log for being the one who was lucky enough to get there first. The all-so-typical dollar bill FTF in the cache is history. A byline in the listing honoring the FTF will be replaced by an announcement of who won the other prize and by what method.

So, instead of a buck, now the cache might have 5 or 10 bucks in a ziploc bag stuffed behind the loose bark of dead tree 300' from the cache. I rolled a couple dice and have determined that whoever is the 8th to log gets that prize. Or I wait until a dozen have logged, then I roll the dice to determine which one "wins" the prize. It's not a FTF prize, it's a totally different prize. There is no mention of how this prize is awarded on the cache listing, so there is no way to cheat it. If it is a FTL prize, then obviosly there can't be any mention of it on the cache listing. Whoever I determine is the winner I contact to let them know they nailed it. If they happen to have been a traveler and moved on, I'll mail the prize to them. Heck I'll paypal it to you. Not a big deal. It's just money. The stuff grows in cotton fields. Sarah just handed me 3,269 of those little notes just for living here. That's almost a whole extra paycheck! Might as well give a bunch of it away in our urban & suburban caches to folks who might need it more.

For the concerns that this is playing into our 1 bad cacher's hand, this couldn't be further from the truth. As his only goal in life is to claim "the prize" for FTF, when there are no more FTF prizes and any prize that I decide to put in a cache will be randomly given to someone OTHER than the FTF, then the singular purpose of his game is lost. Now, all the local folks with day jobs and kids in school who have to plan well ahead to go caching all have just as much chance of getting recognition for winning a "prize". Now they get to boast about winning the lotto for cache X when they were FTL or found it 4th or were selected from the first dozen, etc. His game is over. He gets no recognition and the rest of us are having great fun awarding things and winning things. He lost control of the game. We win.

Edited September 11, 2008 by SSO JOAT

3.3k · September 11, 2008

Another way to beat this person at the FTF game (every time) is by giving others the coords before the caches get published. :laughing:

Heck you can even come up with a fake cache name and pre-sign your own logs. Imagine the FTF hounds dissapointment when this "new guy" keeps beating him to FTF. :laughing:

September 11, 2008

Heck I'll paypal it to you. Not a big deal. It's just money. The stuff grows in cotton fields. Sarah just handed me 3,269 of those little notes just for living here. That's almost a whole extra paycheck! Might as well give a bunch of it away in our urban & suburban caches to folks who might need it more.

well dang if you have so much laying around why not send some down here.

24.7k · September 11, 2008

Not sure why folks are "overthinking" such simple concepts. But I guess you'd have to be an Alaskan to understand how important door prizes are to nearly every social function up here. ...

You could also place caches with no FTF prizes at all. OR just leave empty ones with nary an item but the log book. Or you could give the cache away as the door prize and say "you place the freaking thing".

There really is no end to the creativity you can apply. Of course you could also just use a lottery and some random cacher will get lucky with your cache raffle prize.

10.2k · September 11, 2008

I go geocaching to get outdoors, and to take my mind off of life's stresses. Cachers shouldn't need to be "baited into" finding your caches, with the promise of rewards. That isn't geocaching.

Skip the silly "door prizes" idea.

Ditto. When did caching become about the prizes? I think you're overthinking this game.

I agree! This is what happens when any aspect of a supposedly "non-competitive game" becomes competitive. But I, as a forum regular, can see the reaction to a known troublemaking knucklehead who has been banned from these forums. :laughing:

Just totally forget about the FTF prize thing. I don't regularly give away any FTF prizes (may have once or twice years ago), nor acknowledged such esteemed "accomplishments" of being FTF on my cache pages. And no one has ever cared. Unless they're all talking about me behind my back. :laughing:

1.5k · September 11, 2008

For the concerns that this is playing into our 1 bad cacher's hand, this couldn't be further from the truth. As his only goal in life is to claim "the prize" for FTF, when there are no more FTF prizes and any prize that I decide to put in a cache will be randomly given to someone OTHER than the FTF, then the singular purpose of his game is lost. Now, all the local folks with day jobs and kids in school who have to plan well ahead to go caching all have just as much chance of getting recognition for winning a "prize". Now they get to boast about winning the lotto for cache X when they were FTL or found it 4th or were selected from the first dozen, etc. His game is over. He gets no recognition and the rest of us are having great fun awarding things and winning things. He lost control of the game. We win.

I wouldn't let his competitive nature bother you all down on the peninsula. There is at least one cacher in Anchorage who probably has more first to finds than he has total finds. He also tends to stick to the easy pickings given that these caches that are within an hour (or so) drive of your area are still awaiting a find:

It's The Wrong Cache!!

When The Wind Blows by ilovetug (GC185NZ)

The Mean Ol' MTboy Cache by Ridgeseeker and Geo, with Dano, Tuula, and George (GC1619H)

4 Bears by Troop 243 (GC1FAV8)

Billy Goat Groff by Troop 243 (GC1FATW)

Resurrection Bonzai by MTboy (GC1A9BV)

Edited September 11, 2008 by Ladybug Kids

September 11, 2008

THE CENTRAL KENAI PENINSULA CACHE STASHERS' NEW

GAME RULE-

5 1 - There may will be no special prize associated with the cache at all. Your ability to locate the final cache may will be the only reward, in which case it doesn't matter if you were first, fifth, or last as each find holds the exact same value. And that value is equal to what you put into your efforts and the ethical nature by which you choose to play this game.

FIFY.

~*

September 12, 2008

If I knew I was going out to find a new cache and get a prize for being first to log, I would log my find before leaving the house. If I couldn't find the cache, I'd either delete the log of edit it to a DNF log.

Ditto, Log it as soon as it comes on line, what then, FTL with maybe a chance at FTF still. It all sounds nuts to me. But that’s just me.

But I think I have missed something here. What is the deal with some cacher getting most of the FTF's in your area. Do all your caches there get published the same time each day? (if so talk to the reviewer about mixing them up maybe.) . I know here I have seen them at all hours and areas, and the last I checked, most of us have jobs, kids and so on. But even so I get a few FTF's now and then.

Most caches around here don't even have a prize. It's all about the

This so called problem cacher, that has you creating all these rules, can't be every where. Easy fix, like a few others have said is to skip any prize on traditional caches. He will leave them alone if all he wants is the prize. To me though it sound like several of you just cant stand to be beat. O well if you are. I have been beat to FTF and average of 10 to 1. That’s life and part of what makes caching fun. At least for me, then again. Most I have gotten have been for nothing more then the and the claim of FTF.

Good luck with it all.

1.4k · September 12, 2008

If I hide a cache out in the mountains and it takes sometime to get to, I will usually add a FTF prize. I figure on local caches, being FTF is prize enough for those that are into that part of the game.

The purpose of the prize, to me, is to encourage someone to get out to a remote cache, and log it. I really like getting the first couple logs. They let me know the cache is OK, and hopefully the logs will let me know if it is a fun cache. Or if I may have to tweak it a bit.

If I didn't want the FTF to get the gold, I wouldn't bother with that part at all. I sure don't see the need to give it to the second or fifth or eighth to find.

There are a number of people around here that are into the FTF race, and one or two seem to get most of them. My question is, what is wrong with that?

September 12, 2008

For the concerns that this is playing into our 1 bad cacher's hand, this couldn't be further from the truth. As his only goal in life is to claim "the prize" for FTF, when there are no more FTF prizes and any prize that I decide to put in a cache will be randomly given to someone OTHER than the FTF, then the singular purpose of his game is lost. Now, all the local folks with day jobs and kids in school who have to plan well ahead to go caching all have just as much chance of getting recognition for winning a "prize". Now they get to boast about winning the lotto for cache X when they were FTL or found it 4th or were selected from the first dozen, etc. His game is over. He gets no recognition and the rest of us are having great fun awarding things and winning things. He lost control of the game. We win.

I wouldn't let his competitive nature bother you all down on the peninsula. There is at least one cacher in Anchorage who probably has more first to finds than he has total finds. He also tends to stick to the easy pickings given that these caches that are within an hour (or so) drive of your area are still awaiting a find:

It's The Wrong Cache!!

When The Wind Blows by ilovetug (GC185NZ)

The Mean Ol' MTboy Cache by Ridgeseeker and Geo, with Dano, Tuula, and George (GC1619H)

4 Bears by Troop 243 (GC1FAV8)

Billy Goat Groff by Troop 243 (GC1FATW)

Resurrection Bonzai by MTboy (GC1A9BV)

Not only those caches still waiting. After taking a look at your hides, you have 13. with2 people claiming co- FTF on 5 caches, anothe cacher with 2 FTF's One with 3 FTF's and two other cachers with one each. Thats five diferent caches out of 13 hides. Thats about the same ratio in our area. So whats the big deal? I think you are stressing to much. Go out and grab those still waiting and get yourself 6 FTF's in one day. :blink:

Here are 2 more in your area still waiting for a FTF to be claimed.

GC1F1T8 Doolittle's Revenge!

GC15CMZ Bushwhackers' Sekret Kash

Edited September 12, 2008 by Clarkbowman

September 12, 2008

Here are 2 more in your area still waiting for a FTF to be claimed.
GC1F1T8 Doolittle's Revenge!

GC15CMZ Bushwhackers' Sekret Kash

I've been working on these 2 puzzles since the day they were published. I've consumed a legal pad and probably 50 sheets of printer paper trying to decode these. Lost track of the number of hours invested. So, if it were just a matter of "going and getting the FTF" I would have them already. Note that another puzzle in our area hasn't been found yet either. I solved it last week and posted a note the day I solved it. I won't have a chance to go search for the cache until next week. If it is still unfound at that time, then I guess I'll be FTF. But, I'm not an FTF chaser, so it really doesn't matter to me.

I have 1 FTF to my name. It was another puzzle that I solved pretty quickly. Still didn't go hunting for it until the next day. It has yet to be logged by anyone else. The puzzle was so simple that I would give it a wild guess that perhaps others stopped working on it after my FTF log. I can see no other obvious reason why it hasn't been logged with a second find yet. I've been in touch with other cache owner's of some local puzzles and according to the audit logs, there are only 2 folks besides me with current and repeated views of the listings (including the Doolittle & Bushwacker mentioned above). By my own logic, having an FTF for a puzzle makes sense as it shows the cacher was able to actually do something first.

The 2 easy puzzles I put out, both of which really only require basic math to solve, have only been logged once or twice. The audit logs for them simply died after the FTF was logged. So, one of them I dumped the PMO status (along with most of my traditional caches) to see if there were basic members around that might chase them. Still nothing. Apparently even an easy puzzle is only going to be chased by a small minority of cachers. For this, I'm having second thoughts about putting out a bunch of puzzle caches, even though I've designed 3 more at this point.

Back on topic, I really, really, don't care about FTF or those who engage in the FTF race. Let them do it and have fun with the competition. All I'm doing is adding some additional twists to my caches in the form of a lottery to keep the race and the interest alive beyond the FTF. In my view, FTF on any urban traditional cache is nothing more than the luck of the draw anyway. You happen to be free to run out at the moment the cache is published and find it. Since many folks can't run out and do that, I'm adding another "luck of the draw" so that anyone who logs the find within the first days or even weeks all have an equal chance at some booty. The FTF log is always going to be there and will be claimed by whoever signs first. It's a really simple concept, so there is no need for everyone to get all wrapped up in thinking that I'm "changing the FTF". This is a whole separate contest that expands the race to include more people. And, if I'm understanding the root of this game correctly, more people out there hunting and having fun is the central theme. I think these ideas enhance that. Time will tell.

Finally, I see the posted concerns and have edited the name of my cache listing "rules" as follows:

SSO JOAT's CACHE BONUS PRIZES

All new caches placed in the Central Kenai Peninsula Area will be linked to one or more of the following "winner" configurations:

1- A First To Find (FTF) prize included in the cache for the first cacher who finds it.

2- A First To Log (FTL) prize for the first person who logs a valid find in the online cache log. Find will be verified against the physical cache logbook, then the FTL will receive instructions via email to the location of the FTL prize, which will typically be hidden separately from the cache but in the same general area and up to 500' away from the cache.

3- A Lottery Drawing prize for a randomly selected cacher from the first group of cachers who log both the physical cache and the online log. The number of players included in this drawing will be predetermined (may or may not be published on the cache listing) and once that number of finds is logged, the Cache Owner will conduct the random drawing and notify the winner of where to locate the prize, which will typically be hidden separately from the cache but in the same general area and up to 500' away from the cache. The prize may not be physically placed until the actual time of the drawing to protect it from being muggled while waiting for the correct number of players to find the target cache.

4- A predetermined random find number prize for the cacher who finds the cache at a certain point in the log order. The specific number will not be posted so as to prevent cachers from waiting and logging the cache at the correct position. This log may be based on either the physical logbook order or the online log order at the Cache Owner's discretion. Once a cacher logs at this predetermined spot in the log, they will be notified and given directions on where to find the prize, again located somewhere close to the cache. The cache listing will usually indicate that this prize is available, but will not disclose what point in the log order the prize position is located.

5- There may be no special prize associated with the cache at all. Your ability to locate the final cache may be the only reward, in which case it doesn't matter if you were first, fifth, or last as each find holds the exact same value. And that value is equal to what you put into your efforts and the ethical nature by which you choose to play this game.

I hope you enjoy my cache placements. Happy Caching!!!

September 12, 2008

sounds like another control freak with issues. if you are the FTF person why should you have to be in a lottery with other people who weren't the FTF person? sounds like a way to only let people you approve of look for and or find caces in your area. if you are the "real FTF person" a lottery doesn't change that fact. geocaching is supposed to be fun for all not just just for the condecending elitist and their suck ups. are your caches so lame that you need prizes to get people to find them? the thrill of finding a cache should be enough, FTF or not :blink:

2.3k · September 12, 2008

Just stop putting FTF prizes in your caches. If people don't come find your caches, then maybe geocaching is just not something the Central Kenai Area really needs.

Sounds more like y'all need some excuse other than nature to get outdoors.

September 13, 2008

Sounds like a lotta work. But hey, if you enjoy doing it... Go For It! I thought recently that it might be fun to go out and leave a special prize for the 50th finder of my first cache, but never got around to it. Maybe next time!

DCC

4.7k · September 13, 2008

you won't find any FTF prizes in caches hidden by me.

i love prizes, though. i like to leave random prizes for random players who come after me at other people's caches.

i know one guy who leaves a very nice prize in caches at which HE is the FTF. being second on those caches beats first, most any day.

i also like to leave mystery items; things wrapped and sealed and carrying instructions not to unwrap them unless you take them in trade. people for the most part respect that. sometimes it's a cheap trinket, and sometimes it's valuable. people like the mystery and i don't worry about the wrapping.

so. under these scenarios you get all of the fun of prizes with none of the control issues.

September 13, 2008

i also like to leave mystery items; things wrapped and sealed and carrying instructions not to unwrap them unless you take them in trade. people for the most part respect that. sometimes it's a cheap trinket, and sometimes it's valuable. people like the mystery and i don't worry about the wrapping.

This sounds like a fun idea for a cache: a mystery grab-bag type cache where you can only trade one wrapped item for one wrapped item, then you have to post in your log what the thing you took turned out to be. I might use this idea in the near future. We don't have anything like this in our area at all, so I think people would enjoy the novelty of it.

September 13, 2008

are we talking bingo or caching?

i like the mistery gift idea.

i dont leave prizes for FTF, they get first pick form the swag and the virgin log.

the first 3 will come quickly, dont worry.

September 14, 2008

My prefrence is that FTF and/or FTL means nothing. Not sure about other areas, but far too many times here I've seen FTF go to family members or close friends (even though they swear they haven't been tipped off as to the exact location of a cache). And there are those that wait by the computer or cell phone, waiting for a cache to open up, and they dash there breaking whatever laws necessary, just to say I found it first. I for one think FTF and FTL means absolutely nothing. My trivial number of FTF's were accidents, and are of no significance to me, nor should they be to anyone else.

September 15, 2008

I like the Idea! Just to spice things up a bit! Depending on where I hide a new cache pretty much tells me who will get FTF. So with your new ideas the wealth can be spread around! So one guy gets the FTF another gets the prize. I am all for creativity. Heck if you see someone else beat you there you can still hope to be the lucky one!

38.2k · September 15, 2008

Back on topic, I really, really, don't care about FTF or those who engage in the FTF race. Let them do it and have fun with the competition. All I'm doing is adding some additional twists to my caches in the form of a lottery to keep the race and the interest alive beyond the FTF.

Sounds like a solution in search of a problem. Just hide interesting caches and the interest in the cache will stay alive beyond the FTF.

Edited September 15, 2008 by briansnat

September 30, 2008

This does seem to be way to much work to thwart someone who likes to get FTF prizes. As most have said the easiest solution would be to stop putting FTF prizes in them. I do not even waste time putting a FTF prize in a cache. It is not what is in the cache that is important, but what I am taking you too. Now if someone is going to keep putting caches in my area than they should expect that my name might be the first. Looking at the poster's caches I noticed that they have more finds in less time then mine, and I have some placed in well visited places. If you also feel so bad about someone getting the FTF prize and you still want to have a prize just go back after the FTF and put a prize in the cache. Much easier then worrying about doing some lottery thing, but they are your caches. :laughing:

My new "xTF" Rules

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