stealing geocoins

[+garynlyssa]

I just spent about 60.00 on geocoins and they are so cool, i was just wondering if people end up keeping these. I don't want to put them in caches and have people steal them.

[Keystone]

I am moving this thread from the Geocaching Topics forum to the Geocoin Discussions forum.

[+MountainRacer]

It depends. A lot of people collect them as opposed to releasing them (EDIT to clarify: I mean the people that originally bought them) for just the reason you described, though most coins have tracking numbers and were originally intended to be travellers. Whatever makes you happy. They're your property once you buy them, to do with as you wish.

 

But yes, some people do steal them out of caches and the owners never see them again.

Edited August 23, 2008 by MountainRacer

[AZcachemeister]

Yes, unquestionably they do get stolen (i.e. taken with no intention of ever placing them in another cache).

What the thieves get out of this is still unclear.

They can't share their booty with anyone (excepting other thieves perhaps), lest their thievery be discovered.

 

Someone will drop a coin in a cache, log their visit (dutifully dropping the coin), and the next visitor will mention the coin was nowhere to be seen, with no intervening (online or in-cache) visits logged.

 

Apparently a lot of people out there are excessively identifying themselves with Smeagol/Gollum from The Lord Of The Rings.

[+wapahani]

Yes they get stolen as much if not more then Bugs do.

I've noticed of late many more caches in my area are becoming void of recently dropped coins with no resolution (placed) moving on.

 

2 weeks ago I landed on a Micro Evil coin and we grabbed it and moved it on to a MOC, so hopefully it will last, but its also a EVIL hide and no one has found it since I placed it.

[+Bad_CRC]

if you put your new coins in caches, they will be stolen.

 

period.

 

 

people are jerks.

[avroair]

all the time... it's as common as taking swag out of a cache and not trading fairly for it...

[+BlueDeuce]

Wow, surely it can't be that bad.

[+oddiseus]

That is sooooo messed up. Im new to the hobby and finally found a few coins myself. Though they are VERY pretty I just snap a pic and move them along. I just bought the mario brothers mystery coin and debating whether or not to cache it.

[+traildad]

I moved a very cool coin and put it in a cache of mine. This cache is way out in a National Forest. Very Very unlikely to have any muggles around. Very unlikely that anyone would go there with evil intent. A few people logged the cache after I put the coin in with no mention of the coin. I was worried right away. When I went back a while later the coin was missing. I emailed the people that had found the cache and some of them responded and others did not. I felt bad about it too. Here is the coin.

http://www.geocaching.com/track/details.aspx?id=948994

Edited August 23, 2008 by traildad

[+infiniteMPG]

I just spent about 60.00 on geocoins and they are so cool, i was just wondering if people end up keeping these. I don't want to put them in caches and have people steal them.

The latest FGA (Florida Geocaching Association) geocoin is called "The Logwalker" and it's a picture of me walking across a felled tree to get a cache. I was honored and bought several. First I put in the wild I had in a popular TB hotel at a rest stop and ran by again a couple days later to place a TB and saw the coin was gone!!! I checked with everyone who logged a find and no one said they saw a thing but my nice new coin was gone.

 

Yeah, it happens.

[+LadyBee4T]

Yes there are people who are known to be coin thieves. Around here some who used to drop unactivated coins in caches no longer do or don't put in their online log that they have dropped the coin knowing that these cachers will follow them around and grab them. I've had one of mine go missing even though I drilled three holes in it. Really now who would want that coin?

[xboxcrazy33]

I have been to several caches in my area where there were supposed to be some geocoins, but there is nothing. I'm a newbie and it has discouraged me from releasing a coin to travel.

[jholly]

I just spent about 60.00 on geocoins and they are so cool, i was just wondering if people end up keeping these. I don't want to put them in caches and have people steal them.

 

They will go MIA somewhere along the line. I have decided that I'm going to make proxies for my coins and put the proxies out. If your not happy with a laminated card and the icon, well tough nuggies. Bet the laminated card won't get stolen, and if it does I just put another one out.

 

Jim

[+Butterfly_lady]

if you put your new coins in caches, they will be stolen.

 

period.

 

people are jerks.

 

Not will be - rather MAY be...

 

I have lots in the wild - less that 10% missing - some with caches that get sweep away in floods, some that get muggled by no cachers, and a VERY FEW that disappear, possibly stolen, possibly just taken as swag by a new cacher that has yet to discover trackables...

 

Have faith....

[+Butterfly_lady]

 

They will go MIA somewhere along the line. I have decided that I'm going to make proxies for my coins and put the proxies out. If your not happy with a laminated card and the icon, well tough nuggies. Bet the laminated card won't get stolen, and if it does I just put another one out.

 

Jim

 

Laminated cards are fine, but can easily be overlooked by a genuine cacher who will see them among all those visiting cards.

As a trackable redistributer, I have almost missed those type of geocoins, so they don't get moved as quickly - possibly ending up in one cache for months.

 

PS..... several of my geocoins have travelled, and I have come across them in a cache - what a BUZZ!

[+Bad_CRC]

 

Not will be - rather MAY be...

 

I have lots in the wild - less that 10% missing - some with caches that get sweep away in floods, some that get muggled by no cachers, and a VERY FEW that disappear, possibly stolen, possibly just taken as swag by a new cacher that has yet to discover trackables...

 

Have faith....

 

you are fortunate that people in your area are more honorable.

 

I dont understand how people can steal things such as coins, but around here, its unfortunately a given that they will disappear fairly quickly.

[+Geo.Error]

yes, geocoins get stolen.

 

i have 6 geocoins stolen in 1 1/2 year but i have 34 coins traveling.

 

it is a risk but the logs , the photo's and the reaction from geocachers are a lot worth.

 

So put them in your dressior or set them free , it is your choice.

 

Btw i love also to find geocoins from other geocachers.

 

and if you want i set a geocoin free for you in the netherlands.

 

Btw put always a sheet with your coin , so geocachers know how to log your coin.

[+IBcrashen]

Out of roughly 200 coins I have released over 1/2 of them are MIA. I attach a tag explaining what they are and what to do with them, I drill a couple of holes in them and attach a lock through one of the holes or aircraft cable.

[+larry739]

Geocoins do get lost. Some lose more than others, but I am not sure why that is. Experience has shown that the majority are lost due to factos like muggled caches, newbies who do not know how to log them, oldies who forget they have them, slipped into the cushions, lost on the cluttered desktop, etc. Then there are a few theives, very few, who actually make a habit of stealing them for the pleasure of doing evil. But despite the fact that they are dispicable cads, they are not doing anything illegal. So you will see some of your coins go missing. You have to decide if it is worth it to put them out there and enjoy them while you can, knowing that eventually all things must die including geocoins and travel bugs and caches. It is the law of entropy and it is inescapeable. Whether to release a copy or a laminated card is up to you. I did that at first but not anymore. Matter of fact I now release more unactivated coins than activated ones. I get enough emails every day already everytime someone grabs a coin or travel bug. I guess I need to create a sockpuppet and adopt my coins to it to stop the flow. My mailbox gets full. But you will find that if you do put them out that the joy they bring is worth the heartache. At least it is for me.

[+Tschakko]

if you put your new coins in caches, they will be stolen.

 

period.

 

people are jerks.

 

Not will be - rather MAY be...

 

I have lots in the wild - less that 10% missing - some with caches that get sweep away in floods, some that get muggled by no cachers, and a VERY FEW that disappear, possibly stolen, possibly just taken as swag by a new cacher that has yet to discover trackables...

 

Have faith....

 

Well, I agree to the part "They will be stolen: period"

 

Almost all the coins that I released are missing by now, the onlyones left probably won´t last much longer either Haven´t marked all mising yet,but I probably have to sometime soon

[+Star*Hopper]

You better Hong Kong bereive they'll get glomed!

 

I noticed a couple of things right quickly soon after I started caching -- both at events. One, a lady I was talking to was so endlessly distracted that her side in the "conversation" was practically rudeishness. I finally asked her what she kept looking away for....and she said she was keeping an eye on her geocoin collection she'd brought for others to 'discover', and she'd lost coins at every event she had shown them. "Got to watch 'em like a hawk, & they'll still get taken" -- her words.

 

The other 'thing', I've seen at 2 other events -- the meeting starts breaking up & someone's asking loudly, the "would whoever has my ### geocoin please return it" kinda thing.

 

The icing on the cake is....the last occurrance was at a special 1K commemorative cook-out where only supposedly "close friends" were in attendance! (Saw her later - she never got it back.)

 

I'm constantly hearing/reading where people talk about "all the wonderful people they get to meet thru geocaching". Color me cynical but, IMNSHO it's got just as big a share of First Class A-Holes as any other segment of society.

 

I was (and still am) truly astonished by the sheer quality, beauty & originality that went into a large percentage of the coins I've come across. I wanted & seriously considered designing one for myself & having a mint run. Then my sis (who's been at the game much longer than I) mentioned she didn't do it because "I'm not going to put out that much money for something that'll just get stolen." Made me back off & have 2nd thoughts.

 

It didn't take me long to come to the conclusion that that's one part of the "game" I want nothing to do with! I've dropped off the few I've found, to move....and don't really intend to ever pick up another'n. Besides - in the long run it's a lot less 'paperwork' to have to deal with.

 

YMMV - but that's my view, & I'm stickin' with it!

~*

[+fairyhoney]

As for drilling holes, I wish that were the ticket. Some put little locks through the holes - I've come across a couple of them. At GWVI, I picked up a couple of ICE CREAM MAN's coins. They were very nicely done and thick lamenated. about 4x6 in size so they wouldn't be confused with plain cards.

 

Ieven had a cacher how wrote in his/her log that the hole drilled in my coin didn't bother them ( I don't think it moved after that)

 

Not all coins that appear stollen are. Just recently, one of my coins from Shilo's last year race, show up just last week when I marked it as stolen. Someone wrote to me and told me that it wasn't stolen and that they found it in the bottom of a bag ( it had been there since September of 2007!)

 

So, some Do actually get sent to the bottom of a seat, chair, couch, or bag.

 

But, YES, coins get stolen.

[+maldar]

Thanks FairyHoney, I think that I have a coin in my bag. I have been planning to cache, but with the whole minting a coin thing I have not had a time that would work.

 

maldar

[AZcachemeister]

They will go MIA somewhere along the line. I have decided that I'm going to make proxies for my coins and put the proxies out. If your not happy with a laminated card and the icon, well tough nuggies. Bet the laminated card won't get stolen, and if it does I just put another one out.

 

Jim

 

I have seen a few like this.

I understand why the proxies are made, and I don't disrespect those who do them.

 

BUT, isn't logging one about like kissing your sister/brother?

 

I'll discover them, but danged if I'll move them.

Why not just publish the list with the codes right on your account page and be done with it.

[+K7CJS]

Use a Proxy Coin. I just found one and was a bit disappointed at first but also completely understand why the owner is using a proxy. The proxy is a laminated card about the size of a business card with a photo of the coin and a very brief explanation that too many coins are stolen so he is using this proxy card and assures you that he has the coin in his possession.

[+Butterfly_lady]

 

Not will be - rather MAY be...

 

I have lots in the wild - less that 10% missing - some with caches that get sweep away in floods, some that get muggled by no cachers, and a VERY FEW that disappear, possibly stolen, possibly just taken as swag by a new cacher that has yet to discover trackables...

 

Have faith....

 

you are fortunate that people in your area are more honorable.

 

I dont understand how people can steal things such as coins, but around here, its unfortunately a given that they will disappear fairly quickly.

 

Not quite - just my area - I have trackables, both TBs and geocoins travelling internationally. Few stay in NZ... most make their way offshore eventually. I just had a TB, a beautiful monarch butterfly, turn up months after being reported lost in a muggled cache. Appears the cache was not as missing as the owner thought, and someone found the old cache, rather than it's replacement, and there was my TB and another.

 

When I go on a caching trip, I tend to take about 10 new coins to release into that area. And then the reports stay flowing in. I get lots of "Ah, You're Butterfly Lady, we found your coin....." moments at events or when meeting others at caches. Particularly comments from the junior cachers.

I find those moments more rewarding and positive.

So, I loss a few, but the friends I make are many....

[+Silfron Mandotheneset]

But despite the fact that they are dispicable cads, they are not doing anything illegal.

 

Really? Taking someone else's property without permission and no intent to return it isn't stealing anymore? Wow. Sure... they may have permission to have it, but only upon the stipulation that they MOVE it, not KEEP it.

 

Is there anything you can do about it? Of course not... but in my book, still illegal.

 

my $.02

[+Butterfly_lady]

But despite the fact that they are dispicable cads, they are not doing anything illegal.

 

Really? Taking someone else's property without permission and no intent to return it isn't stealing anymore? Wow. Sure... they may have permission to have it, but only upon the stipulation that they MOVE it, not KEEP it.

 

Is there anything you can do about it? Of course not... but in my book, still illegal.

 

my $.02

 

I guess it's a bit like geocaching.

Once you place a cache, it becomes PUBLIC property, even though you take responsibility for it.

 

When you release a coin, it becomes a public item. Able to be access by all.....

[+Geo.Error]

But despite the fact that they are dispicable cads, they are not doing anything illegal.

 

Really? Taking someone else's property without permission and no intent to return it isn't stealing anymore? Wow. Sure... they may have permission to have it, but only upon the stipulation that they MOVE it, not KEEP it.

 

Is there anything you can do about it? Of course not... but in my book, still illegal.

 

my $.02

 

I guess it's a bit like geocaching.

Once you place a cache, it becomes PUBLIC property, even though you take responsibility for it.

 

When you release a coin, it becomes a public item. Able to be access by all.....

 

That is true, if you set a geocoin free probely you never see it again.

It is traveling true the world or taken by a geocacher, or muggled.

 

When it is traveling true the world you get nice reactions and beautiful pictures from around the world.

[+Kischme]

I have a similar issue. I noticed that Wisconsin, particularly south central Wisconsin seems to be a death trap for coins. There is a "group" of cachers that take people's coins and then basically trade them amongst each other. They "claim" to put them in caches, then a friend of theirs takes it out, they put it back in the same cache and the previous "finder" picks it up again. This process repeats over and over again with MANY different coins. I have even gone to these caches and the coins aren't there. They are most likely in the hands of these people (or more likely in a collection book) I have several coins that I haven't placed because I fear this group will get ahold of them and all I will get to see is them bouncing them back and forth between their friends and the caches they own. Wish I knew a way to call these people out........

 

PS The worst part is they own over 30 coins and not one of them is for trading. You are only allowed to "discover" them when they go to events.

 

I just spent about 60.00 on geocoins and they are so cool, i was just wondering if people end up keeping these. I don't want to put them in caches and have people steal them.

Edited August 25, 2008 by kischme

[+Butterfly_lady]

I have a similar issue. I noticed that Wisconsin, particularly south central Wisconsin seems to be a death trap for coins. There is a "group" of cachers that take people's coins and then basically trade them amongst each other. They "claim" to put them in caches, then a friend of theirs takes it out, they put it back in the same cache and the previous "finder" picks it up again. This process repeats over and over again with MANY different coins. I have even gone to these caches and the coins aren't there. They are most likely in the hands of these people (or more likely in a collection book) I have several coins that I haven't placed because I fear this group will get ahold of them and all I will get to see is them bouncing them back and forth between their friends and the caches they own. Wish I knew a way to call these people out........

 

 

Not quite a name & shame.... but it would be good to know the GC# of the cache....

Then we can watchlist it.........

[+Droo]

I've been on a tear against coin thieves for that past couple of years and go out of my way to contact people whose logs say they've picked up a coin but their tracking actions fail to show that. A large numbers of noobs are attracted by the shiny things (name one coiner who couldn't relate) but are overwhelmed by the Geocaching.com website.

Also we've seen a huge number of foreign tourists come the US to visit these last few years and many are geocachers who can't log their finds or their grabs until they get home. So dropping a valuable shiny game piece in the woods takes a fair amount of patience and wisdom. If you can't stand to lose 'em get a binder or a coin book and hoard them..... ha aha ha ha,... all to yourself!

[+HarleyLowRider]

My wife and I just started geocaching. We have made special trips to caches that post geocoins and TB just for the thrill of getting to log this type of cache. All of the post of coins and TB were just days old. When we got there nothing. The last entry in the log was the one which the person left the geocoin or TB. What a shame that people have to resort to stealing to collect treasures. Our society seems to think that stealing is ok if you don't hurt anyone. WELL IT'S NOT OK. Stealing is stealing no matter how you rationalize it. Well that's my two cents worth. We will keep looking and we WILL pass along any geocoins and TB we may find. It would really be great if everyone would.

[+zazth]

I rarely even activate my coins. I turned one loose for a race and it moved very slowly. We activated one of my son's Geojellies for a local "Jumping Bean" game between the two halves of our area. The coin disappeared from a cache shortly after the begining of round two. Both groups that visisted after the coin was dropped denied even seeing it in the cache.

[+swfirefly]

I just spent about 60.00 on geocoins and they are so cool, i was just wondering if people end up keeping these. I don't want to put them in caches and have people steal them.

 

They will go MIA somewhere along the line. I have decided that I'm going to make proxies for my coins and put the proxies out. If your not happy with a laminated card and the icon, well tough nuggies. Bet the laminated card won't get stolen, and if it does I just put another one out.

 

Jim

That is a great idea! How sad that you should have to do this. I am new to geocaching and just released 2 coins. Wish me luck!

[+HarleyLowRider]

I just spent about 60.00 on geocoins and they are so cool, i was just wondering if people end up keeping these. I don't want to put them in caches and have people steal them.

 

They will go MIA somewhere along the line. I have decided that I'm going to make proxies for my coins and put the proxies out. If your not happy with a laminated card and the icon, well tough nuggies. Bet the laminated card won't get stolen, and if it does I just put another one out.

 

Jim

That is a great idea! How sad that you should have to do this. I am new to geocaching and just released 2 coins. Wish me luck!

 

Let us know how long they last.

[+Camping Mumma]

We've had several stolen immediately after being dropped off by us. My husband now drills a hole into our coins with an attached plastic engraved tag that reads "Please keep this coin movin for all geocachers to enjoy".

[+Lledier]

I am new to Geocaching. So far, in eight days I have discovered 8 caches, moved two geocoins, and currently have in my possession a TB that I will be moving along within the next week.

 

I don't see the point of keeping a geocoin. It's more fun for me to log it and check back and see where it's gone...

 

I've been considering designing my own to release.

 

For the moment, I'm substituting with 5 pfennig coins (I have a few from when I was in Germany years ago).

 

I'm kinda wondering if there wasn't some way for me to get those incorporated into Geocoins somehow..

[+EScout]

We've had several stolen immediately after being dropped off by us. My husband now drills a hole into our coins with an attached plastic engraved tag that reads "Please keep this coin movin for all geocachers to enjoy".

Drill hole, engrave name on coin, attach tag.

 

I believe that the 20% missing per year rule is about right for coins from what I have seen with my own and others. After 1 year, 80% remain, after 2 years, 64% remain, after 3 years, 51% remain, and so on until none are left. If you do not drill and attach a tag, your numbers will be worse.

 

[+FunnyNose]

Use a Proxy Coin. I just found one and was a bit disappointed at first but also completely understand why the owner is using a proxy. The proxy is a laminated card about the size of a business card with a photo of the coin and a very brief explanation that too many coins are stolen so he is using this proxy card and assures you that he has the coin in his possession.

 

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

 

Don't put out proxies or copies, if you can't afford to lose some don't play the game..

 

Next thing you know people will be claiming a find on a cache they didn't find.

[+Butterfly_lady]

My latest tag to coins reads....

 

This is NOT yours to keep. It is owned by Butterfly Lady, a geocacher in New Zealand and travels from cache to cache. If retrieving it from a cache, please log your find on www.geocaching.com. Keep this travelling to reach it's mission goal.

[+Speaknoevil]

My latest tag to coins reads....

 

This is NOT yours to keep. It is owned by Butterfly Lady, a geocacher in New Zealand and travels from cache to cache. If retrieving it from a cache, please log your find on www.geocaching.com. Keep this travelling to reach it's mission goal.

 

Does this work? There has to be some way to play this game and enjoy sending out and retreiving coins and bugs/slugs without having them picked up by some "A Hole"

 

I know that sometimes its hard to find a good place to release them once I've got them and It may take a while to log so patients is a major factor.

But I'm really tired of trying to find these items just to find out there Hijacked

[+tractordude]

It is a sad fact of geocaching life these days that geocoins get stolen. There is little we can do about thieves other than putting out "virtual" versions that have laminated pics of the coins with the numbers present so people can log them and get a semblance of what the coin was like, but as the sport/hobby/game becomes more popular, so the percentage of lost and stolen coins and TBs climbs due to not only the thoughtless, selfish and highly dishonest actions of a lawless few, but also because of the rising numbers of cachers who just don't care about the etiquette of geocoin "finding", "discovering" and logging/placing. The biggest problem with a "virtual" coin is that the finders never get the tactile experience of these sometimes exquisitely beautiful coins in their hands.

 

I wrote an article for FTF Geocacher magazine recently ("Geocoins: Cache and Carry?") on the subject hoping that some of the uninitiated might understand more what they mean to owners and the value of allowing them to go on and do what they were meant do do. Perhaps it will enlighten some who just don't take them seriously and stop some of this activity, but, really, if you have geocoins and want to put them into circulation without losing them, though reviewers and geocaching.com frown on it and will delete "virtual" coins they find out about them, it is an option. You can always put out another, or put out the actual coin.

 

One must understand the angst the officials must deal with when addressing such things and why they feel it necessary to disallow such "coins" in caches (ask a reviewer, they will tell you why they don't want to allow it), but then anyone who does embrace the concept and is responsible about their geocoin finds and DOES have some coins out there might see that they seem to be trying to have a "look the other way" attitude on some of this activity simply because there is not much they can do to rectify the situation and surely it frustrates them as well.

 

Seeing people say things like "they will be stolen, period" shows a lack of faith, certainly, but it is not unrealistic to expect them to be stolen. I wish I had a better response than just to say "educate, persevere and focus on making your geocoins less likely to be misappropriated by adding laminated directions to your coins", but I'm afraid that would be my response, at least for now.

 

I have many expensive geocoins, most of which are not activated or in circulation for this very reason. However, I do include them sometimes as FTF gifts in caches, just to spread the joy of geocoins around a bit.

 

I have found that Europe is a better place for them to survive, if that helps. Geocaching can still be an activity whereby socially curious and responsible folks can share such things without the fear of them being ripped off by loathsome thieves, but it takes a concerted effort of placement and follow-up on the owners' part to make sure they are giving the coins the best chance to survive in the wilds with such things as laminated directions asking that they be placed in safe, premium member caches (something I have found helps, when it is adhered to by finders) and a friendly approach to prodding those who have logged a find on your coin but have not put it back in a cache. I, too, like to believe in people, and geocachers, by and large, are good people. Faith might be a naive approach, but I think it works better than negative attitude.

 

If nothing else, collect your coins and when you're done holding on to them, sell them on eBay. They don't really go down in value if you're diligent and prudent in you purchasing.

[+Eartha]

It is a sad fact of geocaching life these days that geocoins get stolen. There is little we can do about thieves other than putting out "virtual" versions that have laminated pics of the coins with the numbers present so people can log them and get a semblance of what the coin was like, but as the sport/hobby/game becomes more popular, so the percentage of lost and stolen coins and TBs climbs due to not only the thoughtless, selfish and highly dishonest actions of a lawless few, but also because of the rising numbers of cachers who just don't care about the etiquette of geocoin "finding", "discovering" and logging/placing. The biggest problem with a "virtual" coin is that the finders never get the tactile experience of these sometimes exquisitely beautiful coins in their hands.

 

I wrote an article for FTF Geocacher magazine recently ("Geocoins: Cache and Carry?") on the subject hoping that some of the uninitiated might understand more what they mean to owners and the value of allowing them to go on and do what they were meant do do. Perhaps it will enlighten some who just don't take them seriously and stop some of this activity, but, really, if you have geocoins and want to put them into circulation without losing them, though reviewers and geocaching.com frown on it and will delete "virtual" coins they find out about them, it is an option. You can always put out another, or put out the actual coin.

 

One must understand the angst the officials must deal with when addressing such things and why they feel it necessary to disallow such "coins" in caches (ask a reviewer, they will tell you why they don't want to allow it), but then anyone who does embrace the concept and is responsible about their geocoin finds and DOES have some coins out there might see that they seem to be trying to have a "look the other way" attitude on some of this activity simply because there is not much they can do to rectify the situation and surely it frustrates them as well.

 

Seeing people say things like "they will be stolen, period" shows a lack of faith, certainly, but it is not unrealistic to expect them to be stolen. I wish I had a better response than just to say "educate, persevere and focus on making your geocoins less likely to be misappropriated by adding laminated directions to your coins", but I'm afraid that would be my response, at least for now.

 

I have many expensive geocoins, most of which are not activated or in circulation for this very reason. However, I do include them sometimes as FTF gifts in caches, just to spread the joy of geocoins around a bit.

 

I have found that Europe is a better place for them to survive, if that helps. Geocaching can still be an activity whereby socially curious and responsible folks can share such things without the fear of them being ripped off by loathsome thieves, but it takes a concerted effort of placement and follow-up on the owners' part to make sure they are giving the coins the best chance to survive in the wilds with such things as laminated directions asking that they be placed in safe, premium member caches (something I have found helps, when it is adhered to by finders) and a friendly approach to prodding those who have logged a find on your coin but have not put it back in a cache. I, too, like to believe in people, and geocachers, by and large, are good people. Faith might be a naive approach, but I think it works better than negative attitude.

 

If nothing else, collect your coins and when you're done holding on to them, sell them on eBay. They don't really go down in value if you're diligent and prudent in you purchasing.

 

You have one thing incorrect. Groundspeak does not frown on "proxy" coins. Those are allowed. Some people like them, to get the icon, others couldn't be bothered with a proxy, because it's not the real thing. This is not a "virtual" geocoin.

Groundspeak does frown on "virtual logging", which is allowing people to log your trackable, even if they never see it in person. They get the number from lists that are passed out at event (why do people do this? I don't know, they think they are sharing I guess), or from an online photo, or from posting the tracking number in a public place for people to use. This act can result in a trackable being locked for good if Groundspeak feels the system is being abused. This happens when it is allowed to happen, deliberately. It is not the same thing as a Proxy coin, which is what you are calling a "Virtual Coin" Different animals.

[+railroader921]

I am new to the sport but understand that anything that I put into a cache is gone for good. If I can track it it's entertaining, and I can ask the current holder to follow my wishes in regard to the item, but they are in no way required to obey them. Getting upset about it is simply stupid.

Sending out a trackable is much like skipping rocks. You throw it and hope it skips a bunch of times and then find another one somewhere to throw.

If you wish to safeguard your investment I would say only trade your geocoin for another geocoin that you find of equal value, either at an event or in a cache or online or however. Start by purchasing ten coins and then trade them when you find others that impress you. I do always log it when I pick one up, and that lets the "owner" know I have it. It may take me a few months or even longer to find an equal value coin to trade for it, but if it is in my possession it is really mine, until I choose to move it along. Considering that I traded fairly for it I believe that "fair is fair".