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Delays, Delays, Delays


rsfish1

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Again I'll comment on this subject.

I personally haven't had the "delays" that some are having. When I place an order it has the same turn around time as orders placed months ago.

I strongly think it is that same old thing as I have mentioned before. These pre-orders are people who either do not have the money up front to pay for the minting and need you to fund it or are not willing to make a commitment to a certain number of coins and want less risk.

Both reasons are not GOOD BUSINESS in my book. If I pay I want it sent and I want to know the quality of the final product (Not Just a SAMPLE). If when you walk into a store to get something advertised and were told it has been delayed or we can pre-order you one, would you be pleased? NO you wouldn't! But, so many people are still supporting this trend of SAFETY. Lemme ask this then. Where is the BUSINESS risk? Hmmmm, I'd be nervous about this.

 

I did a pre-sale on my Isle Royale National Park Geocoin (started May 20 I believe)...........I had samples in hand and order had been placed (and paid for) 1 week before I made the pre-sale offer. I had an expected delivery date of June 23.

 

I posted all of this on a web page that I directed pre-sale buyer too, and I kept it updated on a daily basis--I kept my buyers informed. Yes, I had the $$$ to pay, and I had made a committment.

 

I made sure all was well with the mint. I was notified by the minting company that the coins had been mailed on June 1 and expected delivery was June 5--I posted that information. I was then notified that customs was holding a shipment that contained my coins, but that should only be a 3-day delay. I received the coins on June 7 (maybe the 8th). My wife and I went over every single coin and found 5 "errors". I notified the producer (and had replacements with in 17 days). I shipped out ALL of my pre-orders on the next day (and posted such on my web page).

 

I asked a reduced price for pre-orders, and sold about 40% of my coins via this pre-sale--at near my cost (PayPal made sure of that)

 

TOTAL cost (excluding only postage and PayPal fees) for this coin was a few bucks under $2200 for 251 coins. My goal (yup, it was still a labor of love to make these coins) was to break even and make $200-$300 to pay the die/sample fee for my next coin. I broke even on the cost just yesterday (I have kept detailed records of all $$--shipping too--taken in and ALL expenses: tape, mailers, printer ink, paper, die fees, coin minting fees, icon fees, tracking fees, sample fees, shipping fees, artwork fee for coin, artwork fee for icon, ect). It was a learning experience, and most who have never minted a coin will have no idea what the total cost will be. There is more to it than just the $3.85 charge per coin minted.

 

Most of my coins have been sold via my e-store, and the 1 of a kind samples and some of the RE/LE/XLE coins were sold on eBay. They brought premium prices.....what's wrong with that? I have over a year in planning and minting this 2 inch coin. One basic principle of this country is capitalism--supply and demand. Why should I sell my coin to you for $9, only to have you turn around and sell it on eBay for 3-5 times as much? I deserve to get any profit from my idea and work........

 

I digress..........anyhow, I have about 20% of my coins left for sale at the going prices. Don't like the price, then don't buy it--your choice, but don't chastize me for making a buck. I feel my first coin was a success--so far only 1 non-delivery, which I replaced. Any pre-order that thought the wait was too long, I would have freely refunded there money--no questions asked (no takers on this option though).

 

Now, I plan on donating some complete sets for auction with all proceeds to go to that cause--I do this because I want to. I will be keeping abouot 10% of the coins for trades, and I have retained 3 complete sets: 1 to keep forever, and 2 to offer for sale 2-3 years down the road.

 

I don't think this makes me greedy. There are others out there that do coins commercially--that is they way they make their living--nothing wrong with that.

 

Steve

 

Edited To Add: I had to pay upfront to order my coins from the vendor and wait 3-4 weeks for my product. What's wrong with me doing the same? I'd love to find a vendor that will ship me my coins, bill me, and wait 30 days for my payment!

Edited by hitechman
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It was a learning experience, and most who have never minted a coin will have no idea what the total cost will be. There is more to it than just the $3.85 charge per coin minted.

 

Most of my coins have been sold via my e-store, and the 1 of a kind samples and some of the RE/LE/XLE coins were sold on eBay. They brought premium prices.....what's wrong with that? I have over a year in planning and minting this 2 inch coin. One basic principle of this country is capitalism--supply and demand. Why should I sell my coin to you for $9, only to have you turn around and sell it on eBay for 3-5 times as much? I deserve to get any profit from my idea and work........

 

[snip]

 

I don't think this makes me greedy. There are others out there that do coins commercially--that is they way they make their living--nothing wrong with that.

 

Steve

 

Steve~

 

Thank you for posting this. You perfectly stated my POV about the process as well, and I agree with everything you've stated, especially the part about minting a coin being a learning experience.

 

I found the "greedy" comment on the other thread to be very hurtful, even though it may not have been directed at me personally. I see some people making a killing on eBay for a coin that can be purchased directly from the vendor for much less. Certainly 'buyer beware' is applicable here. But funny how the "greedy" comment doesn't seem to apply when the seller there is making several times the cost of the coin in that type of sale. I just don't get that. Maybe I'm just dense. :unsure:

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This topic has been on my mind for quite some time. The length of time it's taking on some of these preorders is freaking rediculous.

 

Here are the worst offenders:

Cat Got Your Cache - Paid April 8th

Caching Time - Paid April 23rd

Dragonfly 2008 - Paid May 27th

 

All the rest of my preorder purchases are in June/July, with some having been shipped or slated for shipping next week.

 

Interesting, I was wondering. I originally paid for Cat Got Your Cache back in April too. It still has not showed up. Oh well, patience I guess. :unsure:

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I feel stuck in middle here because I see and feel both sides of this.

 

As a customer I have had times when oney was out waiting for pre-sales, yes some took much longer than I had hoped. It is frustrating when that happens and there are many reaasons why. On this end, I feel it is my job to decide who/what vendors I trust to get the coins and in what time frame.

 

Second hand, as a vendor, I pay for artwork(whenn needed), sample fees, die costs, shipping for samples, etc. well before pre-sales come up. Trying to make sure that things are progressing well.

When all is good and I am happy with the product I have gotten, then I will place a pre-sale. This allows for a few things, 1) it helps decide how many to order in the beginning of pre-sale, if pre-sale lasts for a few weeks, the coins are normally ordered the first week of it. Our mint is taking between 18-2? days now and has been fairly close to estimate on times. 2) helps us as the little guys to order the few extras to have on hand for the smaller events we plan on going to and to leave a few available for those after sale. Normally these are the RE's so pre-sales get first grab at LE's not made again.

 

I am hoping that if anyone feels they have not gotten responses from us about anything that they feel comfortable letting me know. ( Issues around Christmas to Valentine's time this year, I hope most people here understand and that I by myself are trying to make sure those don't happen now.) Except times like the next three days(at Cub Scout camp with quick_at_em) I try and return any e-mails within two days, normally same day.

 

We have a coin that was due around the 10th. I had a delay of a few days here, due to family medical issue, but got back on track quickly and coins should be here while I am gone and will ship Thurs/Fri. so a week behind. Again, if those are ones upsetting anyone I am sorry and have sent notices to all on our newletter lists.

 

Anyway,,, sorry for the rant,,, If it helps, we have not been able to do much ordering but the one I really wanted is on a delay too.

T"n"T-I have never heard anything bad about any of your delays and personally think you are one of the best at communicating any delays that happen. And it is sellers like you that I hope everyone knows that they can trust to do a presale through and if there are delays, they will be notified.

 

Tsun-I am crossing my fingers that I never have to go through what you did. My goodness what a horrible experience. I knew it happened, but never had a clue of all the stupid hoops you had to jump through. And I checked flights to China to see if I could go and talk to them personally about the delays. I don't think it is worth the $1700-$3300 for the airfare. But thanks for the suggestion! :unsure:

 

I think several of us after sharing experiences here are getting the same idea of which vendors to watch out for. And the 44 day rule is starting to sound very tempting. But I would NEVER use it if I was kept up to date on any delays and how long those delays were expected to take.

 

I also find it very interesting that none of the sellers who have been mentioned here have stepped forward with more information or dates. I did receive my Claddagh geocoins yesterday and they look great.

 

Thanks for all the sellers who have stepped forward with their stories. I really appreciate it.

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............I also find it very interesting that none of the sellers who have been mentioned here have stepped forward with more information or dates...........

 

I requested a refund directly from one of the sellers mentioned earlier (not complaining to PayPal), and promptly received it--no questions asked. I just simply stated to them that I was not willing to wait any longer, and I wanted my money back.

 

I'd always do this first before complaining to PayPal.

 

Steve

Edited by hitechman
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Every vendor runs the risk of having delays from the mint. The mint screws something up, customs snares a couple packages, or your postman drops your heavy box on his toe...it's all the same. Delays happen, and we're an impatient society that likes to complain about things like that.

 

This isn't a matter of greed, PayPal, or the smog in China...it's a matter of trust.

 

Take a deep breath and consider who you're buying from: This dude from Denver, this woman from Washington, this couple from Poughkeepsie. We're not buying geocoins from Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon/Mobil here, so stop expecting them to act like Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon. Vendors here are not "BIG" business entities, despite any grudges that like to claim otherwise.

 

And it's really kind of shallow to even bring up the matter of who has/who doesn't have the money to front a project. C'mon...really? We are NOT corporate here.

 

Here's your solution once and for all, so please jot this down:

 

Caveat Emptor.

 

Latin, english, or esperanto, it means do your homework. Buyer Beware. Watch your wallet. Go with your gut. FOLKS!!! Don't hit "SEND MONEY" until your mouse finger stops shaking!!!

 

Unless one of these vendors shows a consistent habit of NOT coming through, then don't lump them all together and claim that asking for money upfront is evil. They are not corporate America. They're small business America.

 

PS: Something to think about the next time you drive up to the first window at McDonalds...

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Tsun -- > I also think part of your issue was that your paypal account was relatively new at the time of your problem if I remember correctly when you emailed us about it.

 

Nope, I've had paypal for as long as I've been on ebay since 98/99. One business, one personal account, both listed under my personal name and never one complaint against me. People are free to make any judgements they want about why that happened but either way, you take your chances on presales and when or if a 'locked account' does happen to someone else here; be prepared to perform in the paypal circus.

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I will say that paypal is a necessary evil we have to deal with.

 

One thing to remember, paypal does't consider any of us 'the hand that feeds'. When you think of the probably millions if not billions of dollars they transfer in a year they could probably really care less about if any of us tried to say how much money we make for them in a year.

 

If you are going to use paypal I would highly suggest you don't do pre-sales via paypal. Just my opinion. As you can see by what happened to Tsun no matter how much you keep customers informed if an unforeseen delay happens you can have 1999 people that understand, but all it takes is that 1 person to tell paypal that you didn't meet paypals legal obligations and you are locked.

 

While I haven't had my account locked, I have had reports filed against me. This was instances of say the wrong coins being shippped or a coin missing from the order. When these mistakes happen if the customer reports you to paypal before contacting you first to get the matter resolved be ready to have your invoices, shipping dates, order details, etc, etc all ready.

 

When dealing with paypal I will just suggest you make sure you stay on top of everything you do.

 

Malder:

 

Just a bit of advice, take it for what it's worth. I think Tsun will agree. It doesn't matter what their site may say as far as when you have to deliver. All that matters is if someone reports you and paypal THINKS you are breaking their terms. Paypal is more buyer friendly than vendor friendly.

 

Especially if you haven't done pre-sales before and buyers may not be comfortable with you yet. If an unforeseen delay happens you will probably get reported to paypal by some of those customers.

Edited by Eric K
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Every vendor runs the risk of having delays from the mint. The mint screws something up, customs snares a couple packages, or your postman drops your heavy box on his toe...it's all the same. Delays happen, and we're an impatient society that likes to complain about things like that.

 

This isn't a matter of greed, PayPal, or the smog in China...it's a matter of trust.

 

Take a deep breath and consider who you're buying from: This dude from Denver, this woman from Washington, this couple from Poughkeepsie. We're not buying geocoins from Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon/Mobil here, so stop expecting them to act like Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon. Vendors here are not "BIG" business entities, despite any grudges that like to claim otherwise.

 

And it's really kind of shallow to even bring up the matter of who has/who doesn't have the money to front a project. C'mon...really? We are NOT corporate here.

 

Here's your solution once and for all, so please jot this down:

 

Caveat Emptor.

 

Latin, english, or esperanto, it means do your homework. Buyer Beware. Watch your wallet. Go with your gut. FOLKS!!! Don't hit "SEND MONEY" until your mouse finger stops shaking!!!

 

Unless one of these vendors shows a consistent habit of NOT coming through, then don't lump them all together and claim that asking for money upfront is evil. They are not corporate America. They're small business America.

 

PS: Something to think about the next time you drive up to the first window at McDonalds...

 

Nicely put.

 

One thing as a seller I'd like to add:

 

Caveat Venditor (seller beware)

 

There is always somebody out there trying to rip off the seller as well.....especially claiming non-delivery. As a seller I do not think I should be responsible once my item has been mailed, but that is not the way it is!

 

1--I alway use delivery confirmation in the U.S., and keep a postmarked copy of of the customs form (only proves it was mailed).

2--I keep impeckable records to the smallest of details.

3--I keep a record of the GC.com tracking numbers on the coins (with a photo of that individual coin) I ship (and delete them when delivery is confirmed)...in case of a non-delivery claim, I have the numbers to check to see if those coins are ever activated.

 

Believe it or not, I had one case (about 14 months ago) where a guy filed a non-delivery. I activated that coin, and 2 days later he had the guts to ask me why I activated HIS coin, and would I please let him adopt it.

 

So, you see, not only does the buyer have to trust the seller, but the seller has to trust the buyer.

 

Steve

Edited by hitechman
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Malder:

 

Just a bit of advice, take it for what it's worth. I think Tsun will agree. It doesn't matter what their site may say as far as when you have to deliver. All that matters is if someone reports you and paypal THINKS you are breaking their terms. Paypal is more buyer friendly than vendor friendly.

 

Especially if you haven't done pre-sales before and buyers may not be comfortable with you yet. If an unforeseen delay happens you will probably get reported to paypal by some of those customers.

 

Thanks Eric, while I already understood that, it is nice that you mentioned it as I didn't think to include it. While it states it in their policy, why should they have to follow it also.

 

While I have not done pre-sales before, I would ask everyone to look at my eBay feedback. Only shows a rating of 98, but I have 181 recorded feedback. Then take into account that we all know that not everyone leaves feedback, you can see that as I have left 266 feedback. I have not always left feedback as I got in the stupid mode of only doing for them as they did for me; I don't do that anymore.

 

If for some reason you do look at my feedback there you will see one negative for me as a seller. This one really Ps me off as I listed some items on Half.com and my internet went down for a few days. At Half.com the seller has to confirm the buyer's order within 2 day of it being placed. I was unable to confirm the order so Half.com's system canceled the order automatically. The guy went right off and gave me a negative feedback, didn't try to email me or nothing. I did email him and explained what happened, but he never contacted me back. Since he left me Negative feedback one would expect me to do the same. NOPE, I left him a neutral feedback explaining what happened. Since I never got a response from him and I received that negative I decided to remove all items listed under Half.com. I was really mad that someone could give you a negative like that and had no interest in having that happen in the future.

 

That being said, if someone does not want to buy from me during a pre-sale do to what I wrote above, that is fine. Just remember you will be paying more once I sell any when they are on-hand. I believe in helping those that will be helping me get these coins minted.

 

Sorry that I strayed off the topic, but I wanted to defend my good name. I know Eric didn't attack it, but some might think to question it.

 

I'm shut up now,

 

maldar

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Tsun -- > I also think part of your issue was that your paypal account was relatively new at the time of your problem if I remember correctly when you emailed us about it.

 

Nope, I've had paypal for as long as I've been on ebay since 98/99. One business, one personal account, both listed under my personal name and never one complaint against me. People are free to make any judgements they want about why that happened but either way, you take your chances on presales and when or if a 'locked account' does happen to someone else here; be prepared to perform in the paypal circus.

 

I guess I am thinking of someone else then.

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On the buying side, we have ordered and have a couple still due in some time soonish, always makes for a surprise package at the post office. Recently as buyers we had the other locking problem with pay pal, and although wanted to order Earth Turtles and a couple of others direct, low and behold we can't, because of the locked account.. where does pay pal get off telling us what we can and can't buy??? So we miss out on some pretty neat new coins. We can travel the world on that darn card, but pay pal says.. sorry you can't use it!! We have had a couple of designs for tags done, but can't do any more, or work on a coin design, because we can't pay via the accepted method. So the Flipper's are going to travel and sort out the coins when we get back, wanted to order some 08.08.08 ones too.. (our wedding day) but will miss them too. So it's not just sellers that can get screwed over ... buyers can get put in a bad position, especially when you have made a promise to buy!!!

cheers from oz

Gayle & Mark

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On the buying side, we have ordered and have a couple still due in some time soonish, always makes for a surprise package at the post office. Recently as buyers we had the other locking problem with pay pal, and although wanted to order Earth Turtles and a couple of others direct, low and behold we can't, because of the locked account.. where does pay pal get off telling us what we can and can't buy??? So we miss out on some pretty neat new coins. We can travel the world on that darn card, but pay pal says.. sorry you can't use it!! We have had a couple of designs for tags done, but can't do any more, or work on a coin design, because we can't pay via the accepted method. So the Flipper's are going to travel and sort out the coins when we get back, wanted to order some 08.08.08 ones too.. (our wedding day) but will miss them too. So it's not just sellers that can get screwed over ... buyers can get put in a bad position, especially when you have made a promise to buy!!!

cheers from oz

Gayle & Mark

 

While I can't speak for those vendors I think the vast majority of vendors if you explain to them your situation will probably hold a coin or two for you until you get your paypal account fixed.

 

Once again, this is just a guess as I can't speak for them. Most people here are pretty understanding.

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While I can't speak for those vendors I think the vast majority of vendors if you explain to them your situation will probably hold a coin or two for you until you get your paypal account fixed.

 

Once again, this is just a guess as I can't speak for them. Most people here are pretty understanding.

 

As a seller, it is something I would be willing to do for someone. I understand that things happen, it has to me; luckily it has not been a locked account.

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While I can't speak for those vendors I think the vast majority of vendors if you explain to them your situation will probably hold a coin or two for you until you get your paypal account fixed.

 

Once again, this is just a guess as I can't speak for them. Most people here are pretty understanding.

 

As a seller, it is something I would be willing to do for someone. I understand that things happen, it has to me; luckily it has not been a locked account.

 

I would do the same also. There is also the "give me your address" and "I'll send you a check/MO" as well.

 

Steve

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Every vendor runs the risk of having delays from the mint. The mint screws something up, customs snares a couple packages, or your postman drops your heavy box on his toe...it's all the same. Delays happen, and we're an impatient society that likes to complain about things like that.

 

This isn't a matter of greed, PayPal, or the smog in China...it's a matter of trust.

 

Take a deep breath and consider who you're buying from: This dude from Denver, this woman from Washington, this couple from Poughkeepsie. We're not buying geocoins from Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon/Mobil here, so stop expecting them to act like Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon. Vendors here are not "BIG" business entities, despite any grudges that like to claim otherwise.

 

And it's really kind of shallow to even bring up the matter of who has/who doesn't have the money to front a project. C'mon...really? We are NOT corporate here.

 

 

Well, put!

My thoughts on this topic run the gamut, I have experience on both sides of this 'coin' and am family of one of the vendors being called out here. Please know that all of my thoughts are general comments and certainly not directed at anyone- these are just my random two cents on the problem in general and some detail on one problem specificly.

 

First- as a society we are sure becoming quick to threaten and cause problems when sometimes all we need to do is ask. I've had a customer email me threatening to go to Paypal and even postal authorities to claim mail fraud for coins they had not received.

Four days after ordering.

On an international shipment.

Come on! All she needed was to email and ask where her coins were and I could have told her exactly where the package was (thank you delivery confirmation!) and let her know it takes more than four days for an international shipment to arrive. Why make things nasty if you don't need to? Save the threats for a last resort. A poster earlier mentioned contacting a vendor and getting a prompt refund when he was no longer willing to wait. Give people a chance to solve the problem before you start going off on them and they usually will.

 

Second- Delays REALLY do happen! I know it is cold comfort when you've handed over your hard earned money and are eagerly awaiting your goodies, but they can and do occur. Many have stated that they are getting their coins from mint with no delays- some have said that the mint told them there are no delays. That may be true in general, or for your specific coin, but it is a generalization not an absolute. One of the coins being discussed on here is having very specific plating issues. The two tone is not adhereing to the metal because of how intricate the design is. The mint said "yep, we can make this coin." the coin maker forks out a big chunk of money and starts pre-sales, then the mint comes back and says "hey we're having issues and can't get this coin to work right." They are trying all kinds of things to fix the issue and have posted that they are willing to offer refunds to anyone who can't wait for the issues to be resolved, but still we are discussing the coin here.

 

IMHO, it seems like there are two main parts to the frustration with this particular coin- the communication (hmmm where have we heard that before? :blink: ) which I can't speak to, I don't know who they have or have not communicated with, they will have to answer that directly and I do not think this particular vendor spends much/any time on these forums so you would have to contact them directly. Second is that people really want this coin, and don't want to have to cancel their order. But if the vendor offers refunds because excessive delays that are out of their control, and you choose to not accept the offer of a refund then in theory, you really should not be complaining. There is a problem (excessive delay), the merchant offered the only solution currently available to resolve the problem (refund for those who did not want to wait), you declined the solution (did not take them up on the refund offer), you are in essence agreeing to wait out the problem (keep waiting for the mint to fix the coin issue).

 

Going back to the quote above, we are not corporate America. Most coin makers are Mom-n-Pop and are doing this as a way to either fund a hobby that they love, create something tangible to share with others and/or maybe make a little something extra on the side. The in-stock vs. pre-sale issue will be discussed over and over as long as people are creating and selling coins on a smaller scale. It won't be solved here today and I really don't see it going away anytime soon. As a number of people have said, you have to decide for yourself if you are willing to do a pre-sale and who you are willing to buy from. If you decide to purchase a pre-sale there is a small risk that the person you are buying from may not be legit. IMHO, I do not see that risk being any higher than purchasing an 'in-stock' coin. Either way you are giving someone money and waiting for them to mail you a coin- the main difference is the amount of time you will be waiting for that coin to arrive. The vendor should be upfront with timelines.

 

I try to update my site everytime I get a revised timeline from the mint and usually send out a newsletter once we have some fairly concrete dates, still I get a couple emails a week from people wanting to know the status which I am happy to reply to. Not all vendors respond the same way, not all vendors have the spare time to sit infront of their computers :( , that doesn't make me good and them bad, we just have different ways of running a business. The flip side to this is that I get complaints from customers because of this flow of info. I generally post updates in the forum everytime I get more info on a coin, it's delivery status or sales status and have had people grumble that I'm just trying to keep my posts on top of the forums by posting every week or so, I have people delete their newsletter subscription because we send them too often (the most frequent so far has been twice a month) there is no way I can make everyone happy so I strive for a middle ground and hope it is enough without being too much.

 

Most of the people producing coins right now are individuals or small companies- that is a good thing! It allows us to have the beautiful diversity of coin designs and the relatively small price points for a limited, custom product. Yes there are risks, and a few not-very-nice people who will try to abuse the generally trusting nature of this small community, but they really are the minority! I worry that we are becoming so jaded and impatient that we view everyone as a dead-beat instead of doing our homework and deciding who we want to do business with. If we start laying down absolutes (no pre-sales, no new companies) then we risk losing all of the small companies that make the new, fresh designs!

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Every vendor runs the risk of having delays from the mint. The mint screws something up, customs snares a couple packages, or your postman drops your heavy box on his toe...it's all the same. Delays happen, and we're an impatient society that likes to complain about things like that.

 

Take a deep breath and consider who you're buying from: This dude from Denver, this woman from Washington, this couple from Poughkeepsie. We're not buying geocoins from Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon/Mobil here, so stop expecting them to act like Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon.

 

I think you are missing the point. Yes, delays happen. But a vendor should inform the buyers when it does. A simple post in the forum thread. Hiding under a rock or just ignoring the issue only makes it worse. I should hope the dude in Denver has the business smarts to inform the customer there is a delay... unlike Walmart or Exxon would...

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Every vendor runs the risk of having delays from the mint. The mint screws something up, customs snares a couple packages, or your postman drops your heavy box on his toe...it's all the same. Delays happen, and we're an impatient society that likes to complain about things like that.

 

This isn't a matter of greed, PayPal, or the smog in China...it's a matter of trust.

 

Take a deep breath and consider who you're buying from: This dude from Denver, this woman from Washington, this couple from Poughkeepsie. We're not buying geocoins from Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon/Mobil here, so stop expecting them to act like Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon. Vendors here are not "BIG" business entities, despite any grudges that like to claim otherwise.

 

And it's really kind of shallow to even bring up the matter of who has/who doesn't have the money to front a project. C'mon...really? We are NOT corporate here.

 

 

Well, put!

My thoughts on this topic run the gamut, I have experience on both sides of this 'coin' and am family of one of the vendors being called out here. Please know that all of my thoughts are general comments and certainly not directed at anyone- these are just my random two cents on the problem in general and some detail on one problem specificly.

 

First- as a society we are sure becoming quick to threaten and cause problems when sometimes all we need to do is ask. I've had a customer email me threatening to go to Paypal and even postal authorities to claim mail fraud for coins they had not received.

Four days after ordering.

On an international shipment.

Come on! All she needed was to email and ask where her coins were and I could have told her exactly where the package was (thank you delivery confirmation!) and let her know it takes more than four days for an international shipment to arrive. Why make things nasty if you don't need to? Save the threats for a last resort. A poster earlier mentioned contacting a vendor and getting a prompt refund when he was no longer willing to wait. Give people a chance to solve the problem before you start going off on them and they usually will.

 

Second- Delays REALLY do happen! I know it is cold comfort when you've handed over your hard earned money and are eagerly awaiting your goodies, but they can and do occur. Many have stated that they are getting their coins from mint with no delays- some have said that the mint told them there are no delays. That may be true in general, or for your specific coin, but it is a generalization not an absolute. One of the coins being discussed on here is having very specific plating issues. The two tone is not adhereing to the metal because of how intricate the design is. The mint said "yep, we can make this coin." the coin maker forks out a big chunk of money and starts pre-sales, then the mint comes back and says "hey we're having issues and can't get this coin to work right." They are trying all kinds of things to fix the issue and have posted that they are willing to offer refunds to anyone who can't wait for the issues to be resolved, but still we are discussing the coin here.

 

IMHO, it seems like there are two main parts to the frustration with this particular coin- the communication (hmmm where have we heard that before? :huh: ) which I can't speak to, I don't know who they have or have not communicated with, they will have to answer that directly and I do not think this particular vendor spends much/any time on these forums so you would have to contact them directly. Second is that people really want this coin, and don't want to have to cancel their order. But if the vendor offers refunds because excessive delays that are out of their control, and you choose to not accept the offer of a refund then in theory, you really should not be complaining. There is a problem (excessive delay), the merchant offered the only solution currently available to resolve the problem (refund for those who did not want to wait), you declined the solution (did not take them up on the refund offer), you are in essence agreeing to wait out the problem (keep waiting for the mint to fix the coin issue).

 

Going back to the quote above, we are not corporate America. Most coin makers are Mom-n-Pop and are doing this as a way to either fund a hobby that they love, create something tangible to share with others and/or maybe make a little something extra on the side. The in-stock vs. pre-sale issue will be discussed over and over as long as people are creating and selling coins on a smaller scale. It won't be solved here today and I really don't see it going away anytime soon. As a number of people have said, you have to decide for yourself if you are willing to do a pre-sale and who you are willing to buy from. If you decide to purchase a pre-sale there is a small risk that the person you are buying from may not be legit. IMHO, I do not see that risk being any higher than purchasing an 'in-stock' coin. Either way you are giving someone money and waiting for them to mail you a coin- the main difference is the amount of time you will be waiting for that coin to arrive. The vendor should be upfront with timelines.

 

I try to update my site everytime I get a revised timeline from the mint and usually send out a newsletter once we have some fairly concrete dates, still I get a couple emails a week from people wanting to know the status which I am happy to reply to. Not all vendors respond the same way, not all vendors have the spare time to sit infront of their computers :) , that doesn't make me good and them bad, we just have different ways of running a business. The flip side to this is that I get complaints from customers because of this flow of info. I generally post updates in the forum everytime I get more info on a coin, it's delivery status or sales status and have had people grumble that I'm just trying to keep my posts on top of the forums by posting every week or so, I have people delete their newsletter subscription because we send them too often (the most frequent so far has been twice a month) there is no way I can make everyone happy so I strive for a middle ground and hope it is enough without being too much.

 

Most of the people producing coins right now are individuals or small companies- that is a good thing! It allows us to have the beautiful diversity of coin designs and the relatively small price points for a limited, custom product. Yes there are risks, and a few not-very-nice people who will try to abuse the generally trusting nature of this small community, but they really are the minority! I worry that we are becoming so jaded and impatient that we view everyone as a dead-beat instead of doing our homework and deciding who we want to do business with. If we start laying down absolutes (no pre-sales, no new companies) then we risk losing all of the small companies that make the new, fresh designs!

 

I had a small problem with one of your coins and you responded to my question in a MOST timely manner and resolved the issue without any fuss or muss! I felt that you were concerened about your product and, more importantly, your Customer!! This vendor, on the other hand, has not responded to ANY of my emails and only updated their web page yesterday! The last offer of a refund that I saw was probably over a month ago ( I may be wrong on this and missed one) and, at that time, the coin wasn't THAT overdue and was expected "any day"

 

I truly DO want the set I ordered and am willing to wait if necessary- I just can't stand being ignored! Failure to respond to emails sent within THEIR Web Page shows total indifference to their Customers, perhaps they SHOULD visit these forums more often, it's a great way to contact a large number of their Customers at once! (but they already know that, don't they)

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Thanks for the notes guys, very much appreciated. We are working on plan B to get around the *ay *al thing. Hope to have it sorted before we are dashing off to the airport to jump on the plane :huh: Still a few delay coins due in before we go, hopefully they will come along soon. On a bright note I wanted to say a big thank you for the wonderfull coins we have been able to add to our collection via the Forums.

Cheers

Gayle & Mark

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Every vendor runs the risk of having delays from the mint. The mint screws something up, customs snares a couple packages, or your postman drops your heavy box on his toe...it's all the same. Delays happen, and we're an impatient society that likes to complain about things like that.

 

Take a deep breath and consider who you're buying from: This dude from Denver, this woman from Washington, this couple from Poughkeepsie. We're not buying geocoins from Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon/Mobil here, so stop expecting them to act like Amazon.com, WalMart, or Exxon.

 

I think you are missing the point. Yes, delays happen. But a vendor should inform the buyers when it does. A simple post in the forum thread. Hiding under a rock or just ignoring the issue only makes it worse. I should hope the dude in Denver has the business smarts to inform the customer there is a delay... unlike Walmart or Exxon would...

 

Nah, I know what you're saying Mark, and I agree. Well, almost.* :huh: Any vendor that wishes to step up and be a business, needs to act like a business. If they take your money and get hung up with a product, they need to go out of their way to communicate information...no matter how big or small they are.

 

What I'm saying that it's kinda silly for us to expect superior customer service if we already know we're dealing with small time. We really shouldn't be surprised when things don't go smoothly, considering that many of the vendors here are just fellow geocoin enthusiasts who decided to go directly to the mint. Some have good experience dealing with delays, and some don't. You have to consider that from the get-go.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending anything but common sense. This all starts with your decision. Do you want that coin so bad that you're willing to trust the seller? Just be smart about your purchases, and who you purchase from.

 

*Here's the "almost" part -- Many people falsely assume this forum is the fountain of all geocoin media. It's not. If the vendor didn't promote their coin here, then you can't expect an update here. On the other hand, if they brought their wares here to hock, then they're open for speculation here. Live by the forums, die by the forums.

 

Edit for bad html.

Edited by YemonYime
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Well today is the 15th. I seem to remember the Cat coins were due around now.

 

Good afternoon to all -

 

Since this coin was address specifically, I will give you the story on these.

 

There were 228 coins reminted in this set. Then we added a special multi-glitter edition for the artist. At first, the mint argued with us that the swirled enamels and multiple glitters could not be done. I argued that it wasn't that it couldn't be done, it was that they (the mint's production factory) didn't WANT to do what we had asked. Now, the multiple glitter coins, being the AE, were never offered for sale.

 

We had never done samples before and didn't feel the need to do them here as we had always been provided with a sharp, clean and flawless coin from them in the past. Well, guess what - we received these coins and they were HORRID in quality. I know I wouldn't pay $10 for one of them, and I wouldn't expect any of our customers to pay for a sub-standard coin either. SO - I SENT THEM ALL BACK.

 

I had them re produce the entire production run. I don't know if any other vendor had ever done that before - but I was pretty livid. Even the special coins we had produced for the person who provided us the idea for these coins were bad - and there was NO ENAMEL on those! The platings were horrible.

 

Having said that, I would rather explain a delay than poor quality coins. The Claddagh geocoins that I ordered AFTER the Cat got your Cache coins have arrived and were already shipped on 7/10. The word I received from the mint was that I was to expect the Cat coins on 7/15 (today), but I have not received the tracking number as of yet from them.

 

If anyone has a question about these coins, feel free to email me through the Geocoin Design website and I would be happy to respond to you.

 

Regards,

Jim

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Many people falsely assume this forum is the fountain of all geocoin media. It's not. If the vendor didn't promote their coin here, then you can't expect an update here. On the other hand, if they brought their wares here to hock, then they're open for speculation here. Live by the forums, die by the forums.

 

True.

 

I have seen plenty of people come into these forums with the attitude 'i can make a quick buck' ~ disregarding ethics for money. Whereas, what I just said is different than delays... it still falls under the category of 'disclosing the truth' ~ quite a few people have taken our trust over the years and made off with it.

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What is the longest some of you are willing to wait? Just curious.

I will jump in on this one. I am willing to wait 3, 4 or possibly more months with the one or more of the following caveats.

A. I am told up front it is going to be X number of months before this coin is delivered.

B. I am told of delays and it is a seller I feel I can trust to be telling me the truth.

C. Unforseen medical/family problems happen to the seller and the coin is delayed.

 

If it is communcated correctly and it is a coin I want, I will wait.

Edited by rsfish1
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Well I suppose i'll vent my frustrations as well as everyone else has. I am not pointing fingers at any one person specifically. I paid for coins that were part of a group project on 3/30. Half of the group has gotten their order, traded their order and I still sit waiting to receive mine. I was one of the unfortunate few to have a set of error coins. Of course I was given the option to accept them as they were, spend a couple extra dollars to keep them plus get a new set or wait 3 weeks (which has turned in to almost 5 weeks) to get a new set.

 

Just the other day I received an email asking to trade my personalized coin. How frustrating it is to have to reply that I STILL do not have my coin and that as soon as they come in i'd be more than happy to trade.

 

Today I emailed about an update only to find out i've got about 2 more weeks to go before I can even expect my coins to be in hand.

 

I'm sure there are plenty of excuses, reasons, acts of nature that have gotten in the way. Fact is, 4 months of waiting, SOMETHING is wrong SOMEWHERE!!

 

Is it the mint? Is it the person we ordered from? Is it just that this coin was something so difficult that it takes this long to remint? Communication can help calm the storms brewing for sure but for how long is one person suppose to be patient, pleasant and understanding?

 

Well, I suppose I could keep going and going but why beat a dead horse? I'm no less frustrated than anyone else it just seems this is a problem and something (but I don't know what) should be done.

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My 2008 Personal Coins have been a nightmare! I decided to use a relatively new vendor/minter because they were friends of mine. I paid for 300 coins in January. I had done my own art, so all I needed was to approve blueprints, I did want to see samples, and then the coins could go into production. Starting the project I figured the coins would be done in about a month and a half, 2 months at the most.

 

It turns out that I didn't even see the sample coins until March. And the mint had not done what I requested, and the samples had to be remade, because I was not going to order coins if the mint was not able to make them look the way I wanted them to look. Thankfully the second set of samples, which were ready only a few weeks later, looked beautiful.

 

In April, twice as long as I thought the coins would take, I finally received my delivery of 300 coins. And when I checked through them, I found that almost 40 coins had minting errors that needed to be remade by the mint. Within a couple days of receiving the coins, I photographed, described, and counted my error coins for the vendor. I expected that it wouldn't be more than 3 weeks to have replacement coins delivered.

 

Almost a month after informing my vendor of the error coins, I received an email from them. I expected it to say that the replacement coins were finished, but instead it said that the mint had not even started the remints yet because the mint had not responded to any of the 3 emails the vendor sent. If I was the vendor I would have been emailing the mint on a daily basis! It was also right around this time that I asked the vendor if they needed the tracking numbers to be reused for the reminted coins. I think this was something that they should have requested right from the very beginning when they knew there was a problem, since the codes had been paid for and would need to be reused on the new coins.

 

Two and a half weeks after sending the tracking codes, I got an email from the vendor saying they still had no news from the mint. A week after that (now the middle of June), I got an email saying that the mint STILL had not started the remints.

 

Finally, I got an email from the vendor saying that the coins had a shipping date of June 25th. That was the last email I got from the vendor. I emailed the vendor a few times after the 25th asking if the coins had been shipped and if there was a tracking number for the package. I got no response from them. I was on vacation from the 28th until about the 7th of July, and since I heard nothing from the vendor, I assumed that the package would be delivered while I was away and that it might need to be signed for. So my aunt had to go to my house every day while I was on vacation to check and see if a package had tried to be delivered.

 

Once I got back from vacation, I FINALLY got a response from the vendor saying that the coins were finished since June, but the hold up was that the vendor refused to pay a $25 shipping fee to the mint. On July 7th, I sent the vendor money to pay for shipping, and they returned it to me, saying that I would get my coins for the original price I paid for them, and they would take care of it.

 

I waited a week to see if any coins would arrive or if I would get a tracking number, and nothing. I finally emailed the mint myself to see what the hold up was, and it turns out that the vendor STILL had not bothered to pay the shipping fee. I decided to take over from the vendor and within 2 days, I had made the payment to the mint, my coins had left China, and I had a tracking number. My coins were delivered to me this morning.

 

I found the mint to be very responsive to my emails and very helpful, so I do not understand why the vendor had such difficulty communicating with them, and why these coins took 6 and a half months to mint.

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My 2008 Personal Coins have been a nightmare! I decided to use a relatively new vendor/minter because they were friends of mine. I paid for 300 coins in January. I had done my own art, so all I needed was to approve blueprints, I did want to see samples, and then the coins could go into production. Starting the project I figured the coins would be done in about a month and a half, 2 months at the most.

 

It turns out that I didn't even see the sample coins until March. And the mint had not done what I requested, and the samples had to be remade, because I was not going to order coins if the mint was not able to make them look the way I wanted them to look. Thankfully the second set of samples, which were ready only a few weeks later, looked beautiful.

 

In April, twice as long as I thought the coins would take, I finally received my delivery of 300 coins. And when I checked through them, I found that almost 40 coins had minting errors that needed to be remade by the mint. Within a couple days of receiving the coins, I photographed, described, and counted my error coins for the vendor. I expected that it wouldn't be more than 3 weeks to have replacement coins delivered.

 

Almost a month after informing my vendor of the error coins, I received an email from them. I expected it to say that the replacement coins were finished, but instead it said that the mint had not even started the remints yet because the mint had not responded to any of the 3 emails the vendor sent. If I was the vendor I would have been emailing the mint on a daily basis! It was also right around this time that I asked the vendor if they needed the tracking numbers to be reused for the reminted coins. I think this was something that they should have requested right from the very beginning when they knew there was a problem, since the codes had been paid for and would need to be reused on the new coins.

 

Two and a half weeks after sending the tracking codes, I got an email from the vendor saying they still had no news from the mint. A week after that (now the middle of June), I got an email saying that the mint STILL had not started the remints.

 

Finally, I got an email from the vendor saying that the coins had a shipping date of June 25th. That was the last email I got from the vendor. I emailed the vendor a few times after the 25th asking if the coins had been shipped and if there was a tracking number for the package. I got no response from them. I was on vacation from the 28th until about the 7th of July, and since I heard nothing from the vendor, I assumed that the package would be delivered while I was away and that it might need to be signed for. So my aunt had to go to my house every day while I was on vacation to check and see if a package had tried to be delivered.

 

Once I got back from vacation, I FINALLY got a response from the vendor saying that the coins were finished since June, but the hold up was that the vendor refused to pay a $25 shipping fee to the mint. On July 7th, I sent the vendor money to pay for shipping, and they returned it to me, saying that I would get my coins for the original price I paid for them, and they would take care of it.

 

I waited a week to see if any coins would arrive or if I would get a tracking number, and nothing. I finally emailed the mint myself to see what the hold up was, and it turns out that the vendor STILL had not bothered to pay the shipping fee. I decided to take over from the vendor and within 2 days, I had made the payment to the mint, my coins had left China, and I had a tracking number. My coins were delivered to me this morning.

 

I found the mint to be very responsive to my emails and very helpful, so I do not understand why the vendor had such difficulty communicating with them, and why these coins took 6 and a half months to mint.

Wow....Definitely sounds like a mint problem to me! :rolleyes: The more I hear from people and read on here, it sounds like the coin business has got too big for some of these vendors and they have bit off more then they think they can handle. Or they lose interest in the project and maybe are not as attentive as expectations from this side expects.

 

Sorry to hear about your experience. What should be a fun and axciting project for you, and many others, sounds like it turns in to pure frustration. I really want to get a coin going that I have in mind. But I see for sure I need to really look in to all the angles before going forward and choose wisely.

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My 2008 Personal Coins have been a nightmare! I decided to use a relatively new vendor/minter because they were friends of mine. I paid for 300 coins in January. I had done my own art, so all I needed was to approve blueprints, I did want to see samples, and then the coins could go into production. Starting the project I figured the coins would be done in about a month and a half, 2 months at the most.

 

It turns out that I didn't even see the sample coins until March. And the mint had not done what I requested, and the samples had to be remade, because I was not going to order coins if the mint was not able to make them look the way I wanted them to look. Thankfully the second set of samples, which were ready only a few weeks later, looked beautiful.

 

In April, twice as long as I thought the coins would take, I finally received my delivery of 300 coins. And when I checked through them, I found that almost 40 coins had minting errors that needed to be remade by the mint. Within a couple days of receiving the coins, I photographed, described, and counted my error coins for the vendor. I expected that it wouldn't be more than 3 weeks to have replacement coins delivered.

 

Almost a month after informing my vendor of the error coins, I received an email from them. I expected it to say that the replacement coins were finished, but instead it said that the mint had not even started the remints yet because the mint had not responded to any of the 3 emails the vendor sent. If I was the vendor I would have been emailing the mint on a daily basis! It was also right around this time that I asked the vendor if they needed the tracking numbers to be reused for the reminted coins. I think this was something that they should have requested right from the very beginning when they knew there was a problem, since the codes had been paid for and would need to be reused on the new coins.

 

Two and a half weeks after sending the tracking codes, I got an email from the vendor saying they still had no news from the mint. A week after that (now the middle of June), I got an email saying that the mint STILL had not started the remints.

 

Finally, I got an email from the vendor saying that the coins had a shipping date of June 25th. That was the last email I got from the vendor. I emailed the vendor a few times after the 25th asking if the coins had been shipped and if there was a tracking number for the package. I got no response from them. I was on vacation from the 28th until about the 7th of July, and since I heard nothing from the vendor, I assumed that the package would be delivered while I was away and that it might need to be signed for. So my aunt had to go to my house every day while I was on vacation to check and see if a package had tried to be delivered.

 

Once I got back from vacation, I FINALLY got a response from the vendor saying that the coins were finished since June, but the hold up was that the vendor refused to pay a $25 shipping fee to the mint. On July 7th, I sent the vendor money to pay for shipping, and they returned it to me, saying that I would get my coins for the original price I paid for them, and they would take care of it.

 

I waited a week to see if any coins would arrive or if I would get a tracking number, and nothing. I finally emailed the mint myself to see what the hold up was, and it turns out that the vendor STILL had not bothered to pay the shipping fee. I decided to take over from the vendor and within 2 days, I had made the payment to the mint, my coins had left China, and I had a tracking number. My coins were delivered to me this morning.

 

I found the mint to be very responsive to my emails and very helpful, so I do not understand why the vendor had such difficulty communicating with them, and why these coins took 6 and a half months to mint.

 

Better start on your 2009 version now before it's too late <_<

Seriously though, that is a real shame. If I was jerked around like that I would have been livid.

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My 2008 Personal Coins have been a nightmare! I decided to use a relatively new vendor/minter because they were friends of mine. I paid for 300 coins in January. I had done my own art, so all I needed was to approve blueprints, I did want to see samples, and then the coins could go into production. Starting the project I figured the coins would be done in about a month and a half, 2 months at the most.

 

It turns out that I didn't even see the sample coins until March. And the mint had not done what I requested, and the samples had to be remade, because I was not going to order coins if the mint was not able to make them look the way I wanted them to look. Thankfully the second set of samples, which were ready only a few weeks later, looked beautiful.

 

In April, twice as long as I thought the coins would take, I finally received my delivery of 300 coins. And when I checked through them, I found that almost 40 coins had minting errors that needed to be remade by the mint. Within a couple days of receiving the coins, I photographed, described, and counted my error coins for the vendor. I expected that it wouldn't be more than 3 weeks to have replacement coins delivered.

 

Almost a month after informing my vendor of the error coins, I received an email from them. I expected it to say that the replacement coins were finished, but instead it said that the mint had not even started the remints yet because the mint had not responded to any of the 3 emails the vendor sent. If I was the vendor I would have been emailing the mint on a daily basis! It was also right around this time that I asked the vendor if they needed the tracking numbers to be reused for the reminted coins. I think this was something that they should have requested right from the very beginning when they knew there was a problem, since the codes had been paid for and would need to be reused on the new coins.

 

Two and a half weeks after sending the tracking codes, I got an email from the vendor saying they still had no news from the mint. A week after that (now the middle of June), I got an email saying that the mint STILL had not started the remints.

 

Finally, I got an email from the vendor saying that the coins had a shipping date of June 25th. That was the last email I got from the vendor. I emailed the vendor a few times after the 25th asking if the coins had been shipped and if there was a tracking number for the package. I got no response from them. I was on vacation from the 28th until about the 7th of July, and since I heard nothing from the vendor, I assumed that the package would be delivered while I was away and that it might need to be signed for. So my aunt had to go to my house every day while I was on vacation to check and see if a package had tried to be delivered.

 

Once I got back from vacation, I FINALLY got a response from the vendor saying that the coins were finished since June, but the hold up was that the vendor refused to pay a $25 shipping fee to the mint. On July 7th, I sent the vendor money to pay for shipping, and they returned it to me, saying that I would get my coins for the original price I paid for them, and they would take care of it.

 

I waited a week to see if any coins would arrive or if I would get a tracking number, and nothing. I finally emailed the mint myself to see what the hold up was, and it turns out that the vendor STILL had not bothered to pay the shipping fee. I decided to take over from the vendor and within 2 days, I had made the payment to the mint, my coins had left China, and I had a tracking number. My coins were delivered to me this morning.

 

I found the mint to be very responsive to my emails and very helpful, so I do not understand why the vendor had such difficulty communicating with them, and why these coins took 6 and a half months to mint.

 

That sounds like quite a fiasco and a real headache for you. I'm glad you could contact the mint directly and bypass that vendor who obviously wasn't doing anything for you.

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Wonder if the Cat coins have shipped yet and what the delay is now.

 

Funny that I get a snooty PM answer to this question from the vendor in question rather than them providing real customer service and posting a response here. Maybe I should cut and paste it so everyone can see who they're dealing with. Then again with all the terrible stories I've read lately, everyone should already know.

 

Some people shouldn't try to run a business since they so obviously can't handle the responsibility that goes along with it.

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Wonder if the Cat coins have shipped yet and what the delay is now.

 

Funny that I get a snooty PM answer to this question from the vendor in question rather than them providing real customer service and posting a response here. Maybe I should cut and paste it so everyone can see who they're dealing with. Then again with all the terrible stories I've read lately, everyone should already know.

 

Some people shouldn't try to run a business since they so obviously can't handle the responsibility that goes along with it.

 

gosh, i wonder who that could be. i wonder why their name is still on the list of GS recommended folks. are there no consequences?

 

this is NOT O.T.

 

rsg

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Some people shouldn't try to run a business since they so obviously can't handle the responsibility that goes along with it.

 

I think AtlantaGal sums the problem up very nicely. However, it's not just vendors, big or small, that can't handle the responsibility. It's individuals that think they can handle large orders and then perhaps become overwhelmed or bite off more than they can chew. Funny how AtlantaGal got a snooty reply to a simple question of concern. You aren't the only one that has received them. It seems that these "vendors" sure are taking the defense to something that is supposedly out of their control.

 

Tadpole, thank you for posting your story. I have often wondered (while I STILL wait for my coins) if the problem is with the vendor and not so much the mint. I've seen coins come and go that were ordered after mine and those coins were a heck of a lot more detailed than the one i've ordered. If I knew how to contact the mint responsible for these coins, i'd gladly contact them myself just to get an understanding of why it is taking so long to remint a coin that has already been released more than a month ago.

 

If the problem is with the minting companies, what does this hold for the future of geocoins? For sure it won't take long before we get tired of the run around over and over again and stop using these mints. If the problem is with specific vendors, you can bet it won't take long for people to catch on and stop using them as well.

 

Anyways, just my two cents. I will continue to sit here and wait (soon going on 5 months) for my coins to arrive. This has been a learning experience and will not soon be forgotten.

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Some people shouldn't try to run a business since they so obviously can't handle the responsibility that goes along with it.

 

I think AtlantaGal sums the problem up very nicely. However, it's not just vendors, big or small, that can't handle the responsibility. It's individuals that think they can handle large orders and then perhaps become overwhelmed or bite off more than they can chew. Funny how AtlantaGal got a snooty reply to a simple question of concern. You aren't the only one that has received them. It seems that these "vendors" sure are taking the defense to something that is supposedly out of their control.

 

Tadpole, thank you for posting your story. I have often wondered (while I STILL wait for my coins) if the problem is with the vendor and not so much the mint. I've seen coins come and go that were ordered after mine and those coins were a heck of a lot more detailed than the one i've ordered. If I knew how to contact the mint responsible for these coins, i'd gladly contact them myself just to get an understanding of why it is taking so long to remint a coin that has already been released more than a month ago.

 

If the problem is with the minting companies, what does this hold for the future of geocoins? For sure it won't take long before we get tired of the run around over and over again and stop using these mints. If the problem is with specific vendors, you can bet it won't take long for people to catch on and stop using them as well.

 

Anyways, just my two cents. I will continue to sit here and wait (soon going on 5 months) for my coins to arrive. This has been a learning experience and will not soon be forgotten.

I was going to stay out of this thread till I saw your post. Your coins are slightly different than just a normal run of coins. You paint a picture of doom and gloom and are tossing blame, or at least accusations of blame, around without knwoing the full details behind the coin. the coin you are referring to is the Big Bean, just so we can get everything on the table.

 

The date you paid for your coins is not the date the coin order was submitted. Payments were due by April 5th, and naturally some people were late paying for the project. The order was submitted shortly after that, once I had all the databases entered correctly. The date the order was palced was the date given to us to ensure we would have all the coins for the GeoWoodstock Event. 3 weeks into the minting we got a call about an issue with multiple glitter isses and had to make changes to orders. This is nothing that was forseen, nor anything on this end that could have been addressed prior. This set the coins back a couple weeks. Why they didn't tell us when we placed the order is beyond me. When we received the first batch of coins, since we didn't want to wait for a complete order and have people waiting, we had a few coins with typos and errors. These coins were sent back to the mint to be redone. The mint was told to do a better job double checking their coins PRIOR to sending them to us. They did these and found more errors on the coins they were about to ship. Your coin personally they missed the spelling error on and it shipped to us. We in turn had to send it back to them to fix the issue. Why they are taking this long to remint all the coins is beyond me, but please don't making guesses as to where the pronlem lays. We all know the problem is with the mint on this coin.

 

Folks might not understand that a group project is not like a simple coin. You are using the same die, but that is it. Each coin is like doing a eperate coin. In this case we are trying to get over 50 different coins minted and shipped in a couple weeks. Along the way there are going to be issues. For some reason or another, no one is perfect, and sadly the Chinese mints aren't striving for perfection. they will also tell you what you want to hear today just to retell it to you tomorrow. We had our first shipment of coins at the dock for 3 days before it shipped. Someone want to explain why that happened becausse I have no clue.

 

However, it's not just vendors, big or small, that can't handle the responsibility. It's individuals that think they can handle large orders and then perhaps become overwhelmed or bite off more than they can chew.

If this was directed at me, which I can only assume, then I take great offense to this and you don't have your facts straight. This is the fourth run of the beans. The first three were rather painless. A couple small color errors and maybe a week or two too long, but there were far fewer errors and everyone was happy. This run has been a nightmare dealing with the mint from erros to delays to lack of factual info from them. Your suggestion that it is I that can not handle the project is way off base and I will chalk it up to frustartion that you are just needed a target for. Since I am the figure head of the project, it is easiest to make it be me. With well ove 8,000 of these coins done, I seriously doubt it more than I can chew, but you are entitled to your opinion.

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Well, first of all Jim, don't assume I am placing blame on you as I did not specify a specific person or a specific coin. The Geojellies are not the only coin I have ordered over the past few months and it is not the only coin I am STILL waiting to receive. Albeit, they have taken the longest.

 

As I have told you in reply to the emails, I do not blame you as I am well aware this is out of your control. You are not the only individual who has ordered large amounts of coins. I would assume that you would know how to handle a large order as this is not your first run. However, that is not the case for everyone. Being that you are the group leader and not the actual vendor, I don't see where you would even take offense. (No, my mention of an individual was not directed towards you so don't get so defensive. However, being the group leader of such a large project, you should be prepared to take the heat if anything goes wrong just as you would take the praise if everything went smooth.)

 

To stay on topic: I will be the first to admit that I am frustrated in the delays and even more delays on the geojellies. But I am more frustrated in the delays of multiple coins (and projects) I have ordered over the past few months. It would appear from this thread, I am not the only frustrated person.

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To stay on topic: I will be the first to admit that I am frustrated in the delays and even more delays on the geojellies. But I am more frustrated in the delays of multiple coins (and projects) I have ordered over the past few months. It would appear from this thread, I am not the only frustrated person.

 

Well it would seem that at least one vendor learned from this process and will no longer be preselling coins. Wish they all would adopt that model of not taking cash till the coins are in hand.

Edited by AtlantaGal
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To stay on topic: I will be the first to admit that I am frustrated in the delays and even more delays on the geojellies. But I am more frustrated in the delays of multiple coins (and projects) I have ordered over the past few months. It would appear from this thread, I am not the only frustrated person.

 

Well it would seem that at least one vendor learned from this process and will no longer be preselling coins. Wish they all would adopt that model of not taking cash till the coins are in hand.

 

I know this is probably not what you are talking about, but group projects really need to be pre-paid.

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To stay on topic: I will be the first to admit that I am frustrated in the delays and even more delays on the geojellies. But I am more frustrated in the delays of multiple coins (and projects) I have ordered over the past few months. It would appear from this thread, I am not the only frustrated person.

 

Well it would seem that at least one vendor learned from this process and will no longer be preselling coins. Wish they all would adopt that model of not taking cash till the coins are in hand.

 

I know this is probably not what you are talking about, but group projects really need to be pre-paid.

 

It's not.

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I totally agree that group projects need to be pre-paid. I for one wouldn't want to be stuck with coins that someone personalized and ordered and then didn't pay for. My post wasn't in regards to payments it was more on topic with the delays we have all seen in the past few months with various coins, not just group projects. :lol:

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I'd like to see some sort of ranking system employed for coin makers. It would certainly take the guess work out of whom one would work with and purchase from. I know in the past there have been issues with people getting burned on different coin mintings like the Babushka Coin of ChunkyNL fame. Perhaps a rating system similar to the pathtags or even eBay with a Groundspeak approved or backed listing would keep the first time interested coin buyer aware of the choices. I know from experience more than several sellers and makers I'd give a big thumbs up too for a job well done. Maybe the same with the mints could be done as well for those that wish to have coins made if that would even be possible. It would send a loud and clear message for certain that people are watching and using others experiences to help make their decisions and perhaps improvements would be made on their ends.

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And the bottom line for us, after reading through all of this angst, is that I am really glad that we had a Pathtag and a couple of GeoJellies made, rather than trying to do our own independent geocoin :anitongue: No way do we have the patience for all the hoops one appears to need to hop through, no matter how one does things. And we certainly can't afford to front the total cost on our own!

 

All that aside, I guess we've been darned lucky to have never been stiffed by anyone on any of the pre-sales we've bought :laughing:

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