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National Trust planning new cache series in Surrey

National Trust Wey Navigations
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National Trust Wey Navigations

National Trust Wey Navigations

Posted
Posted

Dear Geocachers

 

I am contacting you from Dapdune Wharf in Guildford, Surrey, which is the main National Trust base for the River Wey and Godalming Navigations. As part of the ongoing development of the visitor experience along the Wey we are considering setting up a series of caches to help interpret the navigations, designed to be both fun and informative in equal parts. Ideally this would take the format of several caches along a stretch of the Wey, with a clue in each to help lead to the next one along the route.

 

We are still in the very early stages of discussing this idea, so I really just wanted to put some feelers out amongst the geocaching community to find out what floats your boat (if you excuse the awful water related pun!). The main issue we see is that having a series of caches along the towpath will make a very linear route and could potentially be very boring. I have also noticed that there are already several caches placed alongside the Wey, and we would not want to conflict with caches already placed (hopefully with permission!) by the geocaching community. I also wondered how geocachers would feel about allowing NT visitors to have a go at finding the caches by hiring GPS units from us here at Dapdune. Obviously we want to try and make this activity accessible to the widest possible audience, not just geocachers, but it does mean that potentially you could have 'muggles' with no previous experience of geocaching attempting to find the caches! Would this be an issue for seasoned geocachers? Or would it negate the idea of this being a covert activity for those 'in the know'? However, it could be useful in raising awareness to geocaching, and opening it up to new audiences.....

 

Any advice would be much appreciated

 

Caroline Wilks

Learning Officer, Dapdune Wharf

caroline.wilks@nationaltrust.org.uk

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The Blorenges

+The Blorenges

Posted
Posted (edited)

Did you know that the National Trust at Tyntesfield, just west of Bristol, have already done this and have set up a series of caches on their land there. We haven't done them yet but, reading the logs, they seem to have been well received.

 

As for having "non-geocachers" searching for the caches, I wouldn't have any problem with that. Hopefully any instructions they were given would explain something of the "dos and don'ts" of Geocaching and you, as the owners of the caches, would ensure that they were all regularly maintained. :laughing:

 

MrsB

Edited by The Blorenges
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Jonovich

+Jonovich

Posted
Posted

Sounds a pretty cool idea, my only concern would be if non geocachers are finding these, then there is the chance that Travel bugs & Coins could be mistaken for trade items and taken. Have you approached Groundspeak themselves to get their input on the project? Maybe a special type of cache category could be created for National Trust caches?

 

Jon

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minstrelcat

+minstrelcat

Posted
Posted

I think it is really great that (non profit) organisations such as yourselves are putting out caches on your own land and I hope more do the same! A linear series along the towpath isn't likely to be boring - in fact a series of caches that visitors can walk between is likely to prove very popular. I agree with the previous posters that having 'non-geocachers' doing them would be OK as long as they are properly brief about stuff like travel bugs and things that shouldn't be put in caches. Someone from GAGB (www.gagb.org.uk) might be able to help with putting together an instruction leaflet for 'non-cachers'.

 

Also - people generally seem to find larger caches (big enough for swaps) more popular than micros (film-canister types) if there is the room for a larger cache.

 

Lisa

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purple_pineapple

+purple_pineapple

Posted
Posted

Sounds an excellent idea - I'm sure details can be thrashed out to get it to fruition - maybe this could encourage other NT areas to do a similar thing!

 

I'm fairly local to the area, ish, although I do know a number of even more local cachers - if you'd like to e-mail me through my profile, I'll put tou in touch with a number of the most active cachers in that area, who don't necessarily frequent the forums!

 

Dave

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Alboy

+Alboy

Posted
Posted

Caroline

 

Great idea.

 

I am the son-in-law of one of your boat driving volunteers at Dapdune Wharf (Jim Burr). Please feel free to get in touch either via him or this forum.

 

If you want help placing caches etc then please let me know, I'd be happy to help.

 

Alistair

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vw_k

+vw_k

Posted
Posted

Caroline. I think this is a great idea. I'm local (ish) to Guildford and have spent many years walking and cycling the Wey Navigation. I also like the suggestion of approaching Groundspeak about a cache category for caches on NT property. (Maybe even historically themed virtual caches set by the NT or other organisations? Similar to the Geological Society of Americas "Earth caches".)

 

If you could come along to the event near the Wey in Send next week, as mentioned by "4 Badgers" it would be a good way to meet local cachers. Or perhaps a meeting with interested local cachers could be arranged.

 

I look forward to hearing how this project progresses.

 

Dave

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The Wombles

+The Wombles

Posted
Posted

Caroline, this is an excellent initiative and I hope you get lots of local support. I've visited the caches at Tyntesfield which were an excellent way to be led round the less visited areas of the estate. Despite being an NT member for 20 years, I hadn't visited Tyntesfield before the caches were placed :)

 

I am also part of the committee for the Geocaching Association of GB and would be happy to help, albeit remotely, with any advice or support you may need.

 

Well done.

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Brambler

+Brambler

Posted
Posted

There has been a very positive response to Caroline’s note, both here on the thread and on other emails I have seen with local cachers. All local cachers share the enthusiasm to help NT in a way that suits them and meets with gc.com guidelines. The offers of support from GAGB are also good to have, as are the experiences from other NT initiatives.

 

Caroline is away now until 30th June, so she will not be able to get to the Send meet, and this thread may sink a little until the beginning of July.

 

For those who have never been along the Wey valley, it is a River/Navigation that runs for at least 20 miles from the Thames at Weybridge to Godalming and is almost 100% NT controlled. The river upstream of Godalming is neither navigable nor NT controlled. The whole length is attractive, well maintained and accessible by good footpaths throughout. Cycling is permitted along the length. It’s varied too, with locks, bits that look like rivers, bits that look like canals, plenty of wildlife & river traffic. Small amounts run through towns and most is in unspoilt countryside and flood plain. There have even been otters spotted recently after many years of apparent absence.

 

Looking forward to see something great, involving as many local cachers as possible, emerging from Caroline’s approach, which will promote The Wey, the NT and this fun caching-thing we do.

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tteggod trackers

+tteggod trackers

Posted
Posted

Great idea!

 

The Wey is on my doorstep,and to coincide with some recently hidden caches of mine i was hoping to add some along my nearest stretch of the Wey to form a circular walk.

 

As far as linear walks are concerned what i usually do is do every other one on the way up and remainder on the way back,plus any failed finds!

 

I would also reiterate that the Wey is great for cycling along and is mostly in the countryside.

 

I'm sure that the boat house at Byfleet would be interested in helping. You can hire rowing boats very reasonably.

 

Good luck and I'd be more than happy to attend a meeting specifically arranged to discus cache placement so we don't place any too close etc. I'm unable to attend the Send meet where I'm sure this will be topic of the night!

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Happy Humphrey

+Happy Humphrey

Posted
Posted (edited)

I recently (last month, as well as crossing Canada overland AND being at work!) walked the Wey Navigation (approaching from the Thames ferry and going as far as Guildford - the walk was about 15 miles), and I must say that there's plenty of scope for caches along the route. If they're placed at points of interest it would be a great series.

 

There are quite a few nearby caches, but I didn't log many as I think that most of them were not actually on the path (and I didn't have much time).

 

The usual "series plus bonus" would seem to be the obvious format. Perhaps a set heading south, and another overlapping set going north, with bonus caches at each end? National Trust standard-issue (dark green) decon-kit containers discreetly hanging behind pathside trees would be nice.

 

(Darn - I'll have to walk it all again).

Edited by Happy Humphrey
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National Trust

National Trust

Posted
Posted

Hi Caroline,

 

I'm Matthew Tyler-Jones, MSDM for the South East Region, just checking whether you've also been in touch with Jonathan Sargent, at Knole, and Zoe Fairman at Petworth, who are also working on Geocaches on those sites. Do also, appraise Michelle Cleverly at Regional Office of your plans. With at least three properties planning caching activities she can do a co-ordinated push on marketing and publicity.

 

I'm assuming you have also got the useful notes that Tyntesfield produced on their caches?

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National Trust Wey Navigations

National Trust Wey Navigations

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hi Guys

 

I'm sorry I've gone quiet on all of you over the last few weeks, you are never far from my thoughts though I promise!

 

Its been a bit hectic here at the Wharf and on the Wey as we are now slap bang in the middle of the season. My job is primarily to organise events so over the last month or so I have had several events to co-ordinate which has taken up a large amount of my time, so I have had to put the geocaching to one side temporarily whilst we get the main seasonal events out of the way. This is also complicated further by the fact that I only work two days a week!

 

I can't wait to get started on this again though, so please don't think you have been forgotten! Once we're into August things should settle down a bit more for me and I'll be able to give this the attention it deserves, so if you can all be patient with me for another week or so I would be eternally grateful.

 

Hope to be back in touch with you all again soon and thanks to all those who have already responded to my initial enquiry.

 

Best wishes

 

Caroline Wilks

Learning Officer

 

Dapdune Wharf and the River Wey Navigations

caroline.wilks@nationaltrust.org.uk

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The Roos

+The Roos

Posted
Posted

What a great idea!! I work only 5 minutes from Dapdune in Guildford and live just outside Godalming so if I can help at all please let me know. I suspect Bosniabob and Dogmattix (who had a boat at Dapdune until a short while ago) would also like to assist wherever they could.

Mr Roo

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big_bob

big_bob

Posted
Posted

it is lovely to see an organisation like the NT getting into caching.

 

Good luck - hope it goes well, and I await news of the caches being published!

I agree, I see Geocaching an the National Trust as being natural partners in developing ways to explore our beautiful countryside.

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T.R.a.M.P.

+T.R.a.M.P.

Posted
Posted (edited)

Agreed. I'm in discussions with NT HQ and will post on GAGB here when I have reached the next step.

 

Dave (Caching as The Wombles)

 

Dave, I tried your link, but it wouldn't work for me :D and before you ask, yes I'm logged in to GAGB forums......

I think that might have been a temporary hiccup - the link's working for me. :D

 

I cannot get to the page either - it says I don't have the necessary privileges. I would guess that ONLY you can see it ! :D:D:D

 

Edit to add that if I copy the link location then log on to GAGB and paste the link it all works - but I cannot just click the link here... :D

Edited by T.R.a.M.P.
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National Trust Wey Navigations

National Trust Wey Navigations

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hello there Geocachers

 

Firstly, thank you all for your continuing patience with this project, I can assure you that although my presence on the forum has been infrequent, I have been doing some 'behind the scenes' work on this so it hasn't been forgotten!

 

There are several other NT properties also trying to get their heads around geocaching, so amongst ourselves we have formed a very informal geocaching committee and I will be feeding back to them any issues and ideas that come out of this forum. I am also planning for one of us to attend the 'Send 'em Caching Again' meet on 23rd September (thanks to tteggod trackers for sending this in my direction) so that we can run some initial ideas past you.

 

I would really appreciate some help/clarification/ideas on the following points which have come out of the various discussions I have had with NT staff, local geocachers, and some of the responses on this forum :-

 

- I am very aware that geocaching is supposed to be an un-commercial exercise, however the contents of the caches we would set would be branded with the NT logo. There is no financial imperative to this, it would simply be to let people know that it is a cache series set by the National Trust. We wouldn't include any marketing literature or anything that promotes us, all it means is that if we've got any typed information in there to do with the cache series, it would have the logo on it - would the geochaching community take issue with this?

 

- One geocacher suggested a 'series plus bonus' layout but I am unsure of exactly what this means!? Can someone clarify for me please! On the same topic, there are a couple of ideas we have considered - we could either hide several caches that could be independent of each other, and viewed separately, and post all coordinates on the internet, or we could model it on a trail, whereby we only post the coordinates of the first cache, and then as part of the treasure included in that cache we place the coordinates for the second box, and then in the second box place the coordinates for the third and so on, so that the next cache in the sequence has to be found to keep going - in your experience, which works better? Is there a preference? What would be the ideal number of caches and how far apart would you recommend they are set?

 

- I understand from my various discussions with geocachers that it is against the rules to set a cache in an area which you would need to pay for to gain entry to. One of our objectives for this is to not only open up the River Wey to a new audience but also to help to link Dapdune Wharf to the rest of the Wey and unify the property. With this in mind I was hoping to have the final cache on the wharf but as you have to pay for entry to the wharf (unless you are an NT member) it seems that this idea is out - has anyone got a creative solution to this problem?

 

- Finally, the content of the caches. As mentioned before, the decision to set a geocaching series is not driven by financial reasons, which is why the responsibility for getting it up and running has been delegated to the Learning team rather than Visitor Services. The idea is that it will be an opportunity for visitors to the Wey to learn something new in a unique environment, and a chance for us to interpret parts of the Wey that currently lack any sort of visitor information. With this in mind, what sort of cache contents do geocachers find particularly stimulating? The cache series at Tyntesfield contains several activities which require the geocacher to explore the surrounding area and its wildlife - is this something that appeals? Or would you rather just log your find, read some info about the area and be on your way? Perhaps you could advise

 

Sorry for the ramble, if you've read down this far you deserve a medal!

 

Look forward to receiving your responses and any other useful information you feel like sending in my direction.

 

Many thanks

 

Caroline Wilks

Learning Officer

 

Dapdune Wharf and the River Wey Navigations

caroline.wilks@nationaltrust.org.uk

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Happy Humphrey

+Happy Humphrey

Posted
Posted (edited)

- One geocacher suggested a 'series plus bonus' layout but I am unsure of exactly what this means!? Can someone clarify for me please! On the same topic, there are a couple of ideas we have considered - we could either hide several caches that could be independent of each other, and viewed separately, and post all coordinates on the internet, or we could model it on a trail, whereby we only post the coordinates of the first cache, and then as part of the treasure included in that cache we place the coordinates for the second box, and then in the second box place the coordinates for the third and so on, so that the next cache in the sequence has to be found to keep going - in your experience, which works better? Is there a preference? What would be the ideal number of caches and how far apart would you recommend they are set?

A 'series plus bonus' is usually a set of separate caches, each of which may be a traditional cache (i.e. the published coordinates are the location of the cache and there's no puzzle to solve or cache trail to follow). To encourage people to collect the whole set, an additional cache is hidden. This one does not have the actual coordinates published, but typically those of a nearby parking area or access point (termed "Mystery" or "Unknown" cache).

To obtain the real coordinates, you have to collect a code or number from each of the caches in the series (for instance, painted inside the lid of the container or printed on a laminated card).

The other option is (as you mention) a single multicache. These tend to be less popular as people like to collect several cache "smilies" for the same effort.

 

As far as guiding and interpreting, I would concentrate more on the planning of cache positions and writing good cache descriptions rather than the cache contents (which will quickly get swapped out anyway). A concise but informative pararaph of text in the description would be more effective than any amount of educational material at the cache site (many people just sign the log and go to the next one).

 

There could be one or two short multicaches or mystery caches in the series which would force the cacher to read your notes.

 

Make sure you take an experienced cache setter along when placing them: I'm sure that there will be volunteers.

 

Hope that helps.

Edited by Happy Humphrey
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Chananda

+Chananda

Posted
Posted

- I understand from my various discussions with geocachers that it is against the rules to set a cache in an area which you would need to pay for to gain entry to. One of our objectives for this is to not only open up the River Wey to a new audience but also to help to link Dapdune Wharf to the rest of the Wey and unify the property. With this in mind I was hoping to have the final cache on the wharf but as you have to pay for entry to the wharf (unless you are an NT member) it seems that this idea is out - has anyone got a creative solution to this problem?

 

Hi Caroline,

 

there is no rule against setting up a cache in an area where you have to pay to gain entry. In fact, one of the icons available when you are setting up a cache is an icon that tells the cacher they have to pay to gain entry. When setting up the description for this cache, it is helpful to note in the description that you have to pay and exactly how much. People do tend to steer clear of this type of cache however if you're going to be visiting the place anyway, you'd take the opportunity to do the cache there as well!

 

HTH,

Valerie

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Edgemaster

Edgemaster

Posted
Posted (edited)
there is no rule against setting up a cache in an area where you have to pay to gain entry. In fact, one of the icons available when you are setting up a cache is an icon that tells the cacher they have to pay to gain entry.

If the cache can be considered 'commercial', then it will not be allowed. (see above for discussion on the caches themselves)

 

Interesting point, are there times when paid entry to a location does not clash with the commercial cache rule?

Edited by Edgemaster
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