What we ( the GAGB) are attempting to achieve

[+Happy Humphrey]

Looks like a "result" to me, having had a quick read through.

 

I'm sure that it's possible to quibble over a few details, but the broad thrust seems to be in the direction I was hoping it would be: so I'm not going to be the one to start picking holes in the wording.

 

On the "pub" issue which has caused some confusion for UK geocachers, it appears that there is no real change to policy, except that the guideline has been re-worded to reduce the chance of mis-interpretation. It also looks like I was right and Groundspeak have no intention of banning the slightest mention of commercial premises.

 

So I could include a line in the description of my cache that says

 

"Use the car park of the 'Royal Standard' rather than parking at the side of the busy road".

 

or

 

"There is a pub nearby (the Royal Standard) which does food".

 

As long as this is the only mention of the pub and I haven't included a link to the pub web site, the reviewer should allow this sentence to stand. (N.B. I could waymark the pub so that people have more details available should they try a Nearest Waymark search).

 

The cache is clearly not set up with the "principal or substantial intent of soliciting customers or generating commercial gain" as the business was merely mentioned for the convenience of the cacher. But if I worded it

 

"Why not try the nearby Royal Standard after finding this cache. They do the best food in the area and are open all day"

 

...there's likely to be a perception of overtones of advertising or promotion in the way I've worded this and it would have to be changed before approval is granted.

 

wrong log on

That's odd: I thought he'd resigned and had his account disabled...

[+Team Sieni]

Or even

"Don't go to the Loyal Lanyard after finding this cache. They are evil and will try to poison you

[+martlakes]

From Miss Jenn's main announcement:

"The global geocaching community reaches across many countries and cultures. It continues to grow. We recognize that, occasionally, cache reviewers and forum moderators will need to use their discretion to determine the best course of action. Groundspeak has entrusted these volunteers to do what is best for the global community, including regional communities, when appropriate. When issues arise, Groundspeak will continue to approach them with a desire to best support the geocaching community and the activity of geocaching."

 

I don't have a problem with the new guidelines, although some of the further explanation could usefully be included. To be honest I'm not entirely sure exactly what has changed except the move towards slightly more legal language. I guess you can't have 'walmart' in your cache title now. Everything else seems much as before. So, panic over - we can still mention the nearby pub!

 

Only one small issue, we've lost two of our three wonderful reviewers over this incident. So somewhere along the line it was very badly handled, and not a lot of trust shown by Groundspeak.

 

No doubt the people involved are the only ones who know exactly what happened and why two experienced volunteers felt they had to resign. So while the guideline changes appear to be fine, it's certainly not a happy ending. Maybe Groundspeak need to reflect on the events and how they implement the quoted paragraph above to try to ensure it doesn't come to such a crises again.

[+purple_pineapple]

another voice added to say that all appears to be well, and its business as before (but without the aid of Mr Lacto and Mr Ecky unless they can be persuaded to rejoin! )

 

I'd like to say at this point a big thanks to mtn-man for his continued contributions to the debate! At least we could feel that someone over there was listening, and it appears they were!

 

Is it all over now?!

[+muttoneer]

I'd very much like Trigpoints to be on the site Benchmarks are, Trigpoints should be too.

 

I am 100% in favour of this proposal, though I think a separate thread / online petition might be a good idea.

[+Happy Humphrey]

Or even

"Don't go to the Loyal Lanyard after finding this cache. They are evil and will try to poison you

I think I had lunch there a couple of years ago...

 

I'd very much like Trigpoints to be on the site Benchmarks are, Trigpoints should be too.

I am 100% in favour of this proposal, though I think a separate thread / online petition might be a good idea.

Forget it! You'll be wasting your time.

Perhaps when "Project Phoenix" arrives you'll be able to access the Groundspeak UK trigpointing category with more ease. US Benchmarks have a category too, so I wouldn't be surprised to see those move out of geocaching before too long: perhaps that will solve the problem.

[+currykev]

another voice added to say that all appears to be well, and its business as before (but without the aid of Mr Lacto and Mr Ecky unless they can be persuaded to rejoin! )

 

I'd like to say at this point a big thanks to mtn-man for his continued contributions to the debate! At least we could feel that someone over there was listening, and it appears they were!

 

Is it all over now?!

 

I will second that!

[+keehotee]

another voice added to say that all appears to be well, and its business as before (but without the aid of Mr Lacto and Mr Ecky unless they can be persuaded to rejoin! )

 

I'd like to say at this point a big thanks to mtn-man for his continued contributions to the debate! At least we could feel that someone over there was listening, and it appears they were!

 

 

Excellent news......

[+Jan and the Percey Boys]

another voice added to say that all appears to be well, and its business as before (but without the aid of Mr Lacto and Mr Ecky unless they can be persuaded to rejoin! )

 

I'd like to say at this point a big thanks to mtn-man for his continued contributions to the debate! At least we could feel that someone over there was listening, and it appears they were!

 

Is it all over now?!

 

I will second that!

 

I also think Greg did a great Job - but also think that Miss Jenn helped out and deserves credit.

 

Bob

[+PopUpPirate]

Happy Days!

 

Ta Mtn-man / Miss Jen - all good! Especially "...however we are willing to provide for more latitude in the regional and/or international forums for discussing topics that geocachers would find useful or interesting as a closer-knit community." which I believe allows for a bit of off-topic, ie the pub quiz is now "legal"

 

I'd very much like Trigpoints to be on the site Benchmarks are, Trigpoints should be too.

 

I am 100% in favour of this proposal, though I think a separate thread / online petition might be a good idea.

 

Fingers crossed for parity! I posted here because I know TPTB are reading

 

If Lacto and Ecky are to return - whuppee! I bet they're enjoying the break tho tbh!!

[Karl Asriel]

No doubt the discussions will continue, but I just want to say well done to all the cachers who have been engaging in the discussions about these issues of cache listings and forum topics. As can be seen all over the internet, it can be difficult sometimes to remain calm and patient with others, it's so easy for accidental misunderstandings and conflicts to arise.

 

I'd like to single out the UK reviewers, the GAGB and mtn-man in particular for special thanks for keeping matters focused. Cheers!

[+Alibags]

 

"US cabal". Amazing what some people will say.

 

Yes, hard work continues at Signal's Ninja Cabal Empire Headquarters.

World domination plans continue with earnest.

 

Oi watch it! The word Cabal was invented in 17th Century England, as as such is subject to UK Guidelines... (which I will scurry away and invent presently) is that enough smilies? oh hang on, I have an idea.....

 

WARNING, JOKE :

Oi watch it! The word Cabal was invented in 17th Century England, as as such is subject to UK Guidelines... (which I will scurry away and invent presently) /END OF JOKE

 

perhaps it's the way I tell them?...

[+keehotee]

 

Oi watch it! The word Cabal was invented in 17th Century England, as as such is subject to UK Guidelines... (which I will scurry away and invent presently) is that enough smilies? oh hang on, I have an idea.....

 

perhaps it's the way I tell them?...

 

Ummmmmm - wasn't a big lump of the US one of our colonies in the 17th C? Perhaps "Cabal"'s been grandfathered in.........

Edited May 8, 2008 by keehotee

[+mtn-man]

From Miss Jenn's main announcement:

"The global geocaching community reaches across many countries and cultures. It continues to grow. We recognize that, occasionally, cache reviewers and forum moderators will need to use their discretion to determine the best course of action. Groundspeak has entrusted these volunteers to do what is best for the global community, including regional communities, when appropriate. When issues arise, Groundspeak will continue to approach them with a desire to best support the geocaching community and the activity of geocaching."

 

I don't have a problem with the new guidelines, although some of the further explanation could usefully be included. To be honest I'm not entirely sure exactly what has changed except the move towards slightly more legal language. I guess you can't have 'walmart' in your cache title now. Everything else seems much as before. So, panic over - we can still mention the nearby pub!

In a way, you are somewhat right. Keep in mind that the rest of the world could not mention any commercial content. The UK had been allowed to mention pubs though. What happened was something to the effect of "leveling the playing field" so others could do that too. Maybe now, some of my posts will make more sense since I sort of knew this was coming, though not totally in what form. The discussion has been going on for some time, sort of starting with the issues with the event caches in Southern California and then these issues. This is why I mentioned the global aspects of things repeatedly.

 

They are a bit looser now, so you could go somewhat beyond pubs too. You see that the charity aspects of the forums have been loosened a bit, which is why Mandy's calendars were allowed last week. Groundspeak was already moving in that direction, so why not go ahead and be proactive with her. Still, the Commando Challenge may not be allowed. It is something you would have to clear with Groundspeak since it is sort of borderline from where I sit.

 

I'd like to say at this point a big thanks to mtn-man for his continued contributions to the debate! At least we could feel that someone over there was listening, and it appears they were!

 

Is it all over now?!

 

I will second that!

 

I also think Greg did a great Job - but also think that Miss Jenn helped out and deserves credit.

 

Bob

My sincere thanks to you all. I know it was tough to wait. I want to say that MissJenn and Rothstafari deserves a HUGE amount of credit. Input from the reviewers over the past couple of months coupled with some of the recent forum debates here and in the GC.com Web Site Forum in addition to general overall rethinking by several Groundspeak personnel about the commercial and charity guidelines have brought us to where we are today. I was never sure, but I had a feeling things would go the way they did based on some of these lines of thinking from MissJenn and Rothstafari. I think your recent issues just pushed the decision to fruition faster.

 

Give them a toast this weekend if you are out at a pub.

[nobby.nobbs]

Thank you to MTN Man and Miss jenn ( and of course all those behind the scenes) who have had to withstand a large amount of flak here.

 

It is good to see that adaptation is possible and that voices are listened to.

It is great news I can only add my little voice in saying that it would be great if two blokes were able to rethink a decision but it would be totally understandable if they felt that it was time for a rest, they are getting on a bit after all!!!

 

and the weather is wonderful so get out there caching.

[+purple_pineapple]

Having posted my thanks and relief, I would like to say that I do think its a real shame we have lost two excellent reviewers over all this, especially as the principals (or whatever you wish to call them) that they were sticking to appear to be almost identical to those now laid down in the guidelines! Without speaking for them (obviously) I believe that if they knew these guidelines were due to be put in place, I suspect we would still have three UK reviewers! I am open to correction of course!

 

Oh well, I'm going caching! Thanks again for the sensible response from Groundspeak.

[+Happy Humphrey]

Give them a toast this weekend if you are out at a pub.

I'll do that tonight, at the local pub (which is also a Waymark , and where I've been to two events ). Perhaps I'll bump into a couple of "TPTB" in person in a month's time too!

[+sTeamTraen]

The cache is clearly not set up with the "principal or substantial intent of soliciting customers or generating commercial gain" as the business was merely mentioned for the convenience of the cacher. But if I worded it

 

"Why not try the nearby Royal Standard after finding this cache. They do the best food in the area and are open all day"

 

...there's likely to be a perception of overtones of advertising or promotion in the way I've worded this and it would have to be changed before approval is granted.

 

Having had some input to the precise wording of the bits which I've italicised, I'm pleased that you've picked them out . The previous guidelines didn't allow even "unintentional" commercial references, which made it, at least in theory, hard to call a cache "Smith's Cache" even if it was your name because it could have been the crisps or the book shop. An early draft of the new version just said "with the intent of", but let's face it, if you tell people there's a nice pub nearby, you're not just talking about admiring the thatched roof from a safe distance. So "principal or substantial" was added, which leaves, I guess, "passing mention", which gives you and the reviewer the "wiggle room" you want.

 

Similarly, "overtones of advertising, marketing, or promotion" would, at least in my opinion, actually allow you to say something like "the salads are particularly nice", but not, for example "try the delicious hand-picked rocket and fallujah salad drizzled with light sweet crude oil". If it sounds spontaneous, sincere, and not like your brother runs the place, and you can convince the reviewer, then it should be OK. If it looks and quacks like an advert, it probably won't.

[+Happy Humphrey]

...hand-picked rocket and fallujah salad drizzled with light sweet crude oil...

My favourite salad!

If it looks and quacks like an advert, it probably won't.

None of my caches quacks, but one of them chirps and hoots...

 

Seriously, I'm glad that the changes to wording were made, they seem to work much better.

Edited May 8, 2008 by Happy Humphrey

[+FollowMeChaps]

.....................They are a bit looser now, so you could go somewhat beyond pubs too. You see that the charity aspects of the forums have been loosened a bit, which is why Mandy's calendars were allowed last week. Groundspeak was already moving in that direction, so why not go ahead and be proactive with her. Still, the Commando Challenge may not be allowed. It is something you would have to clear with Groundspeak since it is sort of borderline from where I sit..............

 

 

Fantastic to see that we are moving in the right direction and that Groundspeak can listen and learn though I still fail to see why the Commando Challenge has been singled out.

 

Basically there are 2 geocaching events, one for spectators and another post-challenge event in the evening both open to all - no requirement to take part in the charity challenge at all (neither event can be published due to the 3 month rule). Also several geocachers will be doing the challenge whilst searcing for the series of geocaches based around this event - I take it that there is no ban on naming geocaches on nearby annual happenings? Under these circumstances I would have thought that there was no problem with discussing this all on the UK forum.

 

There was never any intention in any of the threads to solicit funds for the Royal Marines chosen charities, rather it was for geocachers to have some fun getting muddy which is something many obviously enjoy - see the excellent video here. What's the harm?

 

Rant over now, let's get back to caching!

[+Birdman-of-liskatraz]

Hey you lot - brush off your caching boots - the sun is shining - let's go caching

 

I would... but the office needs me...

 

 

..... I know what you mean I am sat at the back of my ICT suite at school waiting for the Year 9's who aren't involved with the SATs to come in

 

Is sat in the ICT Technicians room, waiting for some teacher to call and moan that something isn't working... or more likely some Year 9 has forgotten their password yet again....

[+uktim]

.....................They are a bit looser now, so you could go somewhat beyond pubs too. You see that the charity aspects of the forums have been loosened a bit, which is why Mandy's calendars were allowed last week. Groundspeak was already moving in that direction, so why not go ahead and be proactive with her. Still, the Commando Challenge may not be allowed. It is something you would have to clear with Groundspeak since it is sort of borderline from where I sit..............

 

 

Fantastic to see that we are moving in the right direction and that Groundspeak can listen and learn though I still fail to see why the Commando Challenge has been singled out.

 

Basically there are 2 geocaching events, one for spectators and another post-challenge event in the evening both open to all - no requirement to take part in the charity challenge at all (neither event can be published due to the 3 month rule). Also several geocachers will be doing the challenge whilst searcing for the series of geocaches based around this event - I take it that there is no ban on naming geocaches on nearby annual happenings? Under these circumstances I would have thought that there was no problem with discussing this all on the UK forum.

 

There was never any intention in any of the threads to solicit funds for the Royal Marines chosen charities, rather it was for geocachers to have some fun getting muddy which is something many obviously enjoy - see the excellent video here. What's the harm?

 

Rant over now, let's get back to caching!

 

I think it's an issue of keeping geocaching events and the forums relevant to caching.

 

Do we really want to go down the line of having folks creating Geocaching events based around any random sporting or charitable event that they choose or should geocaching events be about geocaching?

 

If this is acceptable then the moderatyors would have to allow anyone to create an event around any of their other interests. Would this wind up with events for spectators at minor league football games just because they may do a few caches on the way home or would they wind up getting rejected and then crying foul because the Commando Challenge events were allowed?

[+keehotee]

If this is acceptable then the moderatyors would have to allow anyone to create an event around any of their other interests

 

What? Like camping? Or beer? Or food? Or CITO? Or just getting 500 people in one place at one time?

 

Sorry - I'm missing your point - the fact is that the CC event is taking place partly to support several teams of GEOCACHERS from around the UK who've volunteered to do this and get incredibly muddy and wet because it's fun; and also because there are rather a lot of caches in the immediate area (including one rather spiffy one that takes up most of the course itself!)

As such, it probably has a lot more relevance to caching than some random pre-arranged meeting in a field ......

Edited May 9, 2008 by keehotee

[+uktim]

If this is acceptable then the moderatyors would have to allow anyone to create an event around any of their other interests

 

What? Like camping? Or beer? Or food? Or CITO? Or just getting 500 people in one place at one time?

 

Sorry - I'm missing your point - the fact is that the CC event is taking place partly to support several teams of GEOCACHERS from around the UK who've volunteered to do this and get incredibly muddy and wet because it's fun; and also because there are rather a lot of caches in the immediate area (including one rather spiffy one that takes up most of the course itself!)

As such, it probably has a lot more relevance to caching than some random pre-arranged meeting in a field ......

 

My aim was to highlight the fact that there probably needs to be a line somewhere and different people will have different ideas on where it should be. For me it would be at the more rigid/demarcated end of the scale.

 

Camping is something you do to provide accomodation whilst carrying out other activities (maybe even geocaching), to camp for the sake of it would be rather boring. If I want a beer or a pub meal I go to a pub, if I want to go with friends I contact them and ask. Creating a geocaching event around any of these activities seems a rather convulated way of setting such things up when we have phones and email or even just meet up doing other things.

 

500 geocachers caching together sounds like heaven or hell, depending on how it was set up

 

As for the opinion that getting muddy and wet is fun, I'd tend to disagree try having it as a regular feature of your job and the novelty soon wears off

[+Mad H@ter]

uktim, please don't take me the wrong way as I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I believe you have got completely the wrong end of the stick regarding the purpose of an Event Cache. An Event Cache is intended to be a social gathering of Geocachers, it is not intended (and likely to be refused) as an opportunity to go out as a group to find a load of caches!

[+keehotee]

If this is acceptable then the moderatyors would have to allow anyone to create an event around any of their other interests

 

What? Like camping? Or beer? Or food? Or CITO? Or just getting 500 people in one place at one time?

 

Sorry - I'm missing your point - the fact is that the CC event is taking place partly to support several teams of GEOCACHERS from around the UK who've volunteered to do this and get incredibly muddy and wet because it's fun; and also because there are rather a lot of caches in the immediate area (including one rather spiffy one that takes up most of the course itself!)

As such, it probably has a lot more relevance to caching than some random pre-arranged meeting in a field ......

 

My aim was to highlight the fact that there probably needs to be a line somewhere and different people will have different ideas on where it should be. For me it would be at the more rigid/demarcated end of the scale.

 

Camping is something you do to provide accomodation whilst carrying out other activities (maybe even geocaching), to camp for the sake of it would be rather boring. If I want a beer or a pub meal I go to a pub, if I want to go with friends I contact them and ask. Creating a geocaching event around any of these activities seems a rather convulated way of setting such things up when we have phones and email or even just meet up doing other things.

 

500 geocachers caching together sounds like heaven or hell, depending on how it was set up

 

As for the opinion that getting muddy and wet is fun, I'd tend to disagree try having it as a regular feature of your job and the novelty soon wears off

 

But if you take the outside interests away, all you're left with is meeting in a field - and to quote the guidelines...

In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches. Such group hunts are best organized using the forums or an email distribution list.

.... so you're left with standing around talking about caching. To be honest, if that was the only reason to be there, I wouldn't - I'd be out caching instead.

[+Stuey]

there are rather a lot of caches in the immediate area (including one rather spiffy one that takes up most of the course itself!)

 

yeah, tell me about it, lol. For those of you who don't have the Going Commando geocache on your watchlist, I'm up to six visits to various parts of the course and I'm still several stages of the multi-cache short.

 

The idea of anyone being able to do this multi properly while doing the 3 mile official event is unrealistic, other than someone saying "there's a tag over there, in here, up there, down there, under this, on top of that, there's the final... anyone got a pen?". It would also take a lot longer to complete the course than the 45 minutes that should be achievable. I'm probably well into my third hour on this cache by now. It would be easier being shown the stages though ;o)

 

Spiffy? I can think of other words, hehe.

 

Great cache though Tim, in one way or another!

[+keehotee]

It would also take a lot longer to complete the course than the 45 minutes that should be achievable.

But if you do the Challenge you get to log the cache as well (precedent was set last year). If that's not enough to tempt you onto the team, I don't know what is.....

[+mongoose39uk]

It would also take a lot longer to complete the course than the 45 minutes that should be achievable.

But if you do the Challenge you get to log the cache as well (precedent was set last year). If that's not enough to tempt you onto the team, I don't know what is.....

 

Free beer?

[+uktim]

uktim, please don't take me the wrong way as I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I believe you have got completely the wrong end of the stick regarding the purpose of an Event Cache. An Event Cache is intended to be a social gathering of Geocachers, it is not intended (and likely to be refused) as an opportunity to go out as a group to find a load of caches!

 

That probably explains why I have trouble finding events that appeal to my rather literal interpretation of an event cache

[+Jan and the Percey Boys]

uktim, please don't take me the wrong way as I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I believe you have got completely the wrong end of the stick regarding the purpose of an Event Cache. An Event Cache is intended to be a social gathering of Geocachers, it is not intended (and likely to be refused) as an opportunity to go out as a group to find a load of caches!

 

That probably explains why I have trouble finding events that appeal to my rather literal interpretation of an event cache

 

Or caches looking at your stats!

[+Alibags]

Or caches looking at your stats!

 

Oooh, saucer of milk for that cacher!

[+uktim]

 

Or caches looking at your stats!

 

That one's sailed clean over my head

 

Care to explain?

 

If it's a reference to the numbers game, some of us have 7 day a week work commitments and other hobbies

[+Us 4 and Jess]

 

That probably explains why I have trouble finding events that appeal to my rather literal interpretation of an event cache

 

It sounds to me like you have taken up the wrong hobby/game/pastime Geocaching is meant to be fun and events are a good way to meet other like minded folks and get together for a laugh and some geocaching/food/drink ect.

 

We who do attend meets obviously dont appeal to your way of thinking (as you stated above) try a meet you might shock yourself and actually enjoy it but you cant knock it till you've tried it.

 

M

Edited May 9, 2008 by Us 4 and Jess

[+uktim]

 

That probably explains why I have trouble finding events that appeal to my rather literal interpretation of an event cache

 

It sounds to me like you have taken up the wrong hobby/game/pastime Geocaching is meant to be fun and events are a good way to meet other like minded folks and get together for a laugh and some geocaching/food/drink ect.

 

We who do attend meets obviously dont appeal to your way of thinking (as you stated above) try a meet you might shock yourself and actually enjoy it but you cant knock it till you've tried it.

 

M

 

Geocaching is great fun even without meeting other cachers

 

When it comes to "meet other like minded folks and get together for a laugh and some geocaching/food/drink etc" it's not necessary to travel miles to an event cache for the food, drink or laugh, so it's only the caching element that would encourage me to travel any distance. If an event had a strong caching element over and above socialising which can be done with friends closer to home I'd be there like a shot.

 

I do hope to get to an event and I am actively looking for one that is close enough, on a spare date in a pretty full diary and has that strong caching element. I even have a pocket query set up to alert me to any within a 50 mile radius, sadly it's not yielded a result that fits yet

[+HazelS]

Maybe I'm just a camping event addict, but they have a strong caching element to them... caching all day and socialising, eating, swapping caching stories etc at night...

 

You needn't go miles from home for them either, my nearest one this year is about 20 miles away. AND in order to attend, you don't need to camp either.. you can tip up in the morning, cache all day with other folks and then go off to milk the cows or tend your flock...

 

I appreciate that it's really difficult for farmers to get away, but it IS possible.

[+perth pathfinders]

Have you thought of hosting your own event, suiting your working hours.

 

Ask help of local cachers to set a few boxes!

 

All you need to do is arrange a venue and do a quick event page! (a spare field for a 'bring your own' BBQ?)

 

That way people can come to you instead?

 

Sorted!!

[+Us 4 and Jess]

If an event had a strong caching element over and above socialising

 

But that is the whole point..........you can go caching in your own town/village/city anytime, an event is to meet folks and to socialise yes folks do go caching at events but the main idea of an event is to meet other cachers

 

M

[+uktim]

Have you thought of hosting your own event, suiting your working hours.

 

Ask help of local cachers to set a few boxes!

 

All you need to do is arrange a venue and do a quick event page! (a spare field for a 'bring your own' BBQ?)

 

That way people can come to you instead?

 

Sorted!!

 

It most certainly has. I was thinking of the sort of event that I'd love to attend, sort of cachienteering, plenty of caches in a tight area (maybe unpublished caches just for the event itself) and an element of friendly/fun competition

[+mtn-man]

But if you take the outside interests away, all you're left with is meeting in a field - and to quote the guidelines...

In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches. Such group hunts are best organized using the forums or an email distribution list.

.... so you're left with standing around talking about caching. To be honest, if that was the only reason to be there, I wouldn't - I'd be out caching instead.

You did not quote the important part of the guidelines right before the line quoted above.

Event caches are gatherings that are open to all geocachers and which are organized by geocachers. While a music concert, a garage sale, an organized sporting event, a ham radio field day or a town’s fireworks display might be of interest to a large percentage of geocachers, such events are not suitable for submission as event caches because the organizers and the primary attendees are not geocachers.

Let me explain my earlier post. The Commando event is not organized by geocachers. The primary attendees are not geocachers. Last year, according to the web site, the number of participants was capped at 4,000 with 2,000 being turned away. With 4,000 participants, the number of people coming to watch is probably much higher than that. In 2004, there were 54 All Female Teams, 170 all Male Teams and 277 Mixed Teams. How many geocacher teams are there going to be this year? Last year it was one, right? While it really looks like fun and I would probably be on the lookout to see if it is on one of my HD channels (high definition mud!), it isn't a geocaching event. But, you could always ask Groundspeak to see what they say.

 

To give an example of a geocaching related "sporting event", our GGA group is holding a "Geocaching Olympics" event in June to celebrate the 7th Anniversary of the very first geocaching event (yes, by the GGA in Georgia in the US ). We will have geocachers participating in several events, including the "ammo can toss" (see who can throw an ammo can the furthest, ever want to do that after finding a mean, evil cache?), "nano log rolling" (who can roll up a flat nano log and get it into the cache and closed the fastest) and "GPS figure Skating" (creating a picture with a tracklog, will be downloaded and printed at the event, then voted on by attendees) and so forth. These are geocaching events created by geocachers and that relate directly to geocaching.

[+uktim]

If an event had a strong caching element over and above socialising

 

But that is the whole point..........you can go caching in your own town/village/city anytime, an event is to meet folks and to socialise yes folks do go caching at events but the main idea of an event is to meet other cachers

 

M

 

If thats what floats your boat that's great

 

It's also perfectly possible to partake in the pastime of caching without it and do your social life with friends around your home area or maybe even people that you've met through other hobbies or organisations. I guess it's the nature of farming that I tend to socialise around home and like events and pastimes away from home to be short and to the point so that I don't have to find and pay for relief cover to allow us to stop overnight or be away from dawn 'til dusk! We have enough other events, family holidays and activities that need that without adding caching to the list

[+Jan and the Percey Boys]

 

 

It most certainly has. I was thinking of the sort of event that I'd love to attend, sort of cachienteering, plenty of caches in a tight area (maybe unpublished caches just for the event itself) and an element of friendly/fun competition

 

In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches.

 

this is why we dont tend to do this!

 

I am not an event Junky but the odd pint on a thursday night at a localish hostelry is fine. Gives us a chance to engage in discussions such as - has HazelS managed to get permissions from her local council (I am waiing for the series to be published!!), Has Marzipan run out of nanos etc etc. So often we see caches by people it is sometimes nice to get together and share a pint. Sorry if that doesn't float your boat but hey farming doesn't do it for me - so each to their own.

 

Bob

 

PS anybody fancy giving me a lift back to Saltney from Shhh you know where on thursday would be appreciated

[+uktim]

 

In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches.

 

this is why we dont tend to do this!

 

I can understand why this could cause problems in some areas. I would have thought if I as the landowner set up caches on my own property for an event it ought to be OK?

[+Simply Paul]

Some words from my head:

 

My comment about trig-points has been taken to heart by some- I was being a bit facetious and wasn't really calling for trigs to be loggable here. In truth, a trig isn't a cache and probably shouldn't be on geoCACHING.com. Mind, a benchmark isn't a cache either, so...

 

Thanks to everyone who came up with some thoughtful and thought-stirring posts on this thread. I thought The Other Stu, PUP, Team Sieni, mtn-man (The moderator most likely to bite own tongue off) and The Hornet (killer use of sarcasm there Pete) were particularly eye-catching. I enjoyed (either by agreeing with them, or on sheer entertainment value of a good row) many others, so if your name’s not on my mercifully short list, please don’t feel bad

 

Reading what MissJenn posted (I also have a big stick, but modesty stops me banging on about it ) I think I still spot an issue. Caches can't solicit customers, according to MissJenn’s post: “In effect, the changes that I link to above mean that if you want to mention a pub casually in a cache listing without soliciting customers or generating commercial gain, it can happen. It can happen in London, and in La Paz, and in Seattle and in anywhere else.” But an event in a pub or another location where you’d reasonably be expected to make a purchase… yada yada yada. I hope she/GSP did just mean Physical (or Earth, I suppose) caches rather than Event caches.

 

In case they didn’t, here’s a good reason to allow pub names (‘Five Horseshoes and a Cache’) or other venues in event names or listings: A newbie without a GPS reads there’s a local event and wants to attend to learn all about this crazy sport. They don’t think to click the Streetmap or GoogleMaps link and look at the page, wondering how to work out where the event is. I’m sure no one wants to exclude newbies like this.

 

I'm adding my vote for the return of the terrible twosome. If that doesn't happen, I'd like to see a public Thank You from some GSP top brass for their many years of unpaid service. Would only be right.

 

Lastly, for anyone worried about my Big Archive plan, it’s been put on indefinite hold. But I'll be watching. The price of freedom is constant vigilance...

 

Edited for clarity. I took some out

Edited May 9, 2008 by Simply Paul

[dodgydaved]

 

In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches.

 

this is why we dont tend to do this!

 

I can understand why this could cause problems in some areas. I would have thought if I as the landowner set up caches on my own property for an event it ought to be OK?

 

 

....as a completely amateur reader of the current guidelines I feel that if you set up an event and set caches on your land and - without publishing them on gc.com - provided atendees with printouts of the caches it would cause no problem.

 

If you then chose, after the event, to publish them, and they met the current guidelines........................

[+Jan and the Percey Boys]

 

In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches.

 

this is why we dont tend to do this!

 

I can understand why this could cause problems in some areas. I would have thought if I as the landowner set up caches on my own property for an event it ought to be OK?

 

 

....as a completely amateur reader of the current guidelines I feel that if you set up an event and set caches on your land and - without publishing them on gc.com - provided atendees with printouts of the caches it would cause no problem.

 

If you then chose, after the event, to publish them, and they met the current guidelines........................

 

Hey if you are the complete amateur where does that put the rest of us

 

If you have a cache event just to find caches that are not GC.com caches do you think: -

 

a) it will be published

 

b)will people turn up

 

I am not sure - but there have been events which I see that I wouldn't bother with. Why not try it and see.

 

if you have a field for people from away to camp on, the "Addicts" will probably attend!!!!!

[+Mad H@ter]

if you have a field for people from away to camp on, the "Addicts" will probably attend!!!!!

There's no probably about it, they will turn up

 

BTW, we are not addicted, we could give it up at anytime if we wanted to