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3rd International math trade starting now!


kdv
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Posting about no regrouping is not obligatory, but should every one make their intentions clear before tonight's deadline of 6PM EST, than we would be able to move ahead with the next phase (the really fun part, creating want lists) sooner. At this deadline I will assume there is no regrouping for the people that haven't made their intentions clear specifically (there are still a few of those).

 

Katja

 

No regrouping for me. I dont have a clue what Im doing so lets see how it goes

I'm following him in case we are supposed to post here that im not regrouping ie even more clueless B) than jnpb this is fun hope my computer doesn't fry again!

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the really fun part, creating want lists

 

Katja

 

 

Being new to this math trade, a question for the veterans: with so many coins on the list, my tentative plan is to make a personal copy of the spreadsheet, sort it out by coin name and then start paring it down to the coins I'm interested in. Once that's done, I'l match them up against the coins I have to trade. Am I on the right track here for how to manage this?

Edited by southpawaz
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Sounds like a good plan. To facilitate this process, I am planning to add a sheet with the coin list sorted by coin name. I will do this as soon as regrouping is completed. You can then use either or both lists to compose your want lists (I will post instructions for this at said deadline). Of course you can also copy or export the list yourself and manipulate it as you want in an external application (e.g. MS Excel).

 

Katja

 

the really fun part, creating want lists

 

Katja

 

 

Being new to this math trade, a question for the veterans: with so many coins on the list, my tentative plan is to make a personal copy of the spreadsheet, sort it out by coin name and then start paring it down to the coins I'm interested in. Once that's done, I'l match them up against the coins I have to trade. Am I on the right track here for how to manage this?

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Stage 3: Wantlist Period

 

Copied mostly from the first two Math Trades (thanks, guys!)

 

A step-by-step guide to create want lists

 

This explanation is quite technical, but if you skip ahead and look at hte example, I think things will be rather self-explanatory.

 

First of all, take a closer look into the final coin offer list: you will see that every single coin is listed in a seperate row, each having an entry in the corresponding columns for ID, Owner, Coin Name, Remark, and Country. (The spreadsheet now contains two sheets with coins: the contents is the same, but one is sorted by ID and one by coin name, to make your life easier when chosing the coins you'd like to include in your want list).

 

The entries for ID and Coin Name are the most important for the trade. Of course it's nice to see who's owning this coin, which remarks are given or where the coin is located - but this can be ignored for the creation of your want list.

 

In the whole coin offer list the ID colum has unique entries, whereas in the Coin Name column the same name of a coin may appear if offered by different participants (in different rows, of course ). So the entry in the ID field for each coin can (and will) be used as an unique and exact identifier for each coin.

 

The general idea for a want list is to define, which own coin can be traded against which other offered coin. To define this, the following syntax used:

 

CODE

 

Own_Coin_ID : Want_Coin_ID_1 Want Coin_ID_2 Want_Coin_ID_3 ... Want_Coin_ID_N

 

(a ':' is used as a seperator between the Own_Coin_ID and the choosen wanted coins; the wanted coins are seperated with a " " [blank] ).

 

As you can see, you have to specify a single "Own_Coin_ID" and to list the possible IDs of all coins that you would accept as a trade for this coin (as specified by "Own_Coin_ID). You are free to choose from all other coins. Furthermore, your are not limited to a single coin - you can append all coins (via their respective coin ID's) that you are accepting as a trade. And if you would append the IDs of all other coins this would be okay!

 

The appearance of the IDs of the wanted coins if of importance as it represents the "order" of the coins that you are accepting as a trade for your coin. In the first position the "most wanted" coin should appear, in the last position the "least acceptable" coin.

 

If there is only one coin that you would trade your own coin for, there will be only one Want_Coin_ID. If there is no coin that you find acceptable as a trade, you put no Want_Coin_ID behind your Own_Coin_ID ...

 

As you might have read between the lines, you are asked to fill out a single line according to the syntax above for each of your own coins.

 

It's quite logical that you will accept the same coin from others as a trade for several of your coins. Simply add this coin ID to the lines for each of your coins. Want lists for different coins can quite easily be completely identical (see my example below).

 

Let's end the theory and come to a real life example: I will present my own (hypothetical!!!) want list ...

 

With a short look to the final coin offer list, I own the coins with the IDs 375 to 390 (as I am listed with the nick 'kdv') so my trade list is 16 lines long (one line for each coin).

 

Here are my thoughts and how I realize them in my want list:

 

- Let's for the sake of things say that I consider my First Italian geocoin (ID: 375) to be very special, and I want to trade it only against a coin that I consider to be equally special. The coins with the IDs 291 and 437 caught my attention ( the "geocachingdragon personal 2006 Le gold with silver dragon" and the "Geocoinfest Bridge Coin-LE Silver Two Tone" coin), as well as the set of 3 Da Vinci Challenge coins (ID: 307) and I would favor the "Da Vinci coins" over the "geocachingdragon" followed by the Geocoin fest". So my entry for my "First Italian" would look like this:

 

CODE

 

375 : 307 291 437

 

I also offered a bunch of other coins that I have some feelings about, that I really like, that I regard as "nice to have" for others, or whatever. They are important to me and I would like to get in return only some coins that are really on my personal seeking list. My coins have the IDs from 2 to 12. I look into the coin offer list and find a few suitable coins - but only 10 of them. I can list the 10 wanted coin ID for each of my coins - but this will mean that I will not trade all of my coins: 12 offered but only 10 specified as wants - even if I receive all the 10 wanted coins I will only trade away 10 of mine ...

 

For those 12 coins I choose the coins with the IDs 150 to 160 and that's also the priority I choose for the wanted coins. So I include them in my want list. This list looks now like this:

 

CODE

 

375 : 307 291 437

376 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

377 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

378 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

379 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

380 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

381 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

382 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

383 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

384 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

385 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

386 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

387 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

388 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

 

Let's go on with the example. For some reason I do not want to trade away my coin with the ID 389 (it's the "GeoNerd kdv Translucent Orange"). Maybe I simply wont give it away or maybe in the meantime I have traded it away for another coin outside of the math trade... So this is a simple one: Either I don't list my coin with the ID 389 in my want list or I decide to put an empty line for the wanted coins. I will take the latter approach. So I add the following line to my want list:

 

CODE

 

389 :

 

Last but not least, there is the last coin I offered: the coin with ID 390 ("GeoNerd kdv Translucent Orange"). Honestly said (theoretically!!! this is only an example!!!) I am quite happy if I could trade away this coin for anything else on the list. So I can put every other coin ID as a want for this coin - and I will do so! (Okay, I'll save some characters here in this example - please forgive me, but you know what I mean).

 

So my last line would look like:

 

CODE

 

390 : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 ...... 374 375 391 392 393 ..... 710 711

(in your real want list, you'll have to fill in the dots with the specific numbers, not abbreviations possible)

 

Well, now I have my want list for this trade completed! For the convenience of my host, I will add my nick in parantheses in front of each line ...

 

The whole list looks like this (except for the last line, which will contain the full list of all numbers, except the ones referring to my own coins):

 

CODE

 

(kdv) 375 : 307 291 437

(kdv) 376 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 377 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 378 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 379 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 380 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 381 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 382 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 383 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 384 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 385 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 386 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 387 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 388 : 150 151 152 153 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160

(kdv) 389 :

(kdv) 390 : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 ...... 374 375 391 392 393 ..... 710 711

 

Now I can send the list as a PM or in a mail to the host of this Math Trade (myself: kdv) ...

 

By the way, grouped coins (e.g. 21A and 21B) count as one single coin offer, and should be referred to as a whole. The owner of the two coins will make 1 want list for the two coins together, and anyone wanting these two coins can include the ID 21 in their want list. The letters A and B are not meant to be used, their only function now is to indicate what the offer ID 21 now consists of.

 

There is one issue that I haven't discussed here yet: how to prevent receiving the same coin more than once. For those of you who don't know yet how this works, tomorrow I'll add another post explaining how to do this (it's 3.30 am here, I need to get some sleep :)

Edited by kdv
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How many months do I have to figure this last part out? Oh man, I've got a headache. :P

:P Ooh! Ditto this, Sis! :)

 

I think I understand but it will take me a while to compile a proper list.... How long do we have to send out "Wants" in? :mad:

 

CF30

 

I believe we have until May 11th sometime. It sure seems daunting, but hopefully the sort on the coin name will help with this process.

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Sorry guys, I forgot to regroup two coins. If you've already started creating want lists (one person even has already submitted them to me!) please note that coin 349 and 350 now are grouped together as 349A and 349B.

 

The want lists indeed should be submitted by May 11th (6pm EST). It's really quite simple, just the coin number followed by all the coins that you'd consider an acceptable trade for it, in order of preference. And that repeated for each of your coins.

 

Katja

 

Explanation of handling duplicates will follow tonight (unless someone else feels like explaining it before then). I'm off geocaching..it's a public holiday here.

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Ok, as promised:

 

What if a coin you want is listed multiple times and you don't want to risk receiving 2 or more of the same coins?

 

Say you have listed coin ID 1 and coin ID 3 up for trade.

You'd like to get two of the following coins for them:

"Lord of the Caches - Earth" (ID 695, 443, 654, and 244

"Anthus Laptop" (ID 634 and 635)

"Cache Aid Kit" (ID 207)

 

So you could make the following want list:

 

1 : 695 443 654 244 634 635 207

2 : 695 443 654 244 634 635 207

 

However, this way you'd 'risk', for example, receiving coin 695 for your coin 1, and coin 443 for your coin 2. This way you end up with 2 "Lord of the Caches - Earth" coins, while you'd much have received two different coins.

You can avoid this very easily by defining 'variables'.

You define a coin group to make sure you only get at most 1 coin from that group. Here is how you do that:

Pick a random name for your group, preceded by a % sign, and indicate what coins the group consists of, like this:

 

%lord : 695 443 654 244

%laptop : 634 635

 

Now you simply include these names in your want list, instead of the actual coin numbers. Your list would then change from the above example to the following:

 

1 : %lord %laptop 207

2 : %lord %laptop 207

 

This way, if coin 1 gets traded for a coin from the "%lord" group, this will not be the case for coin 2, and vice versa.

 

To use this system, you need to include the variables you define at the top of the want list that you send to me, starting every line with your nick in parenteses, like this:

 

(kdv) %lord : 695 443 654 244

(kdv) %laptop : 634 635

(kdv) 1 : %lord %laptop 207

(kdv) 2 : %lord %laptop 207

 

That's it! Please don't hesitate to ask for more clarification if I haven't explained things well enough.

 

Katja

Edited by kdv
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I don't know either how many people would want to trade a coin for any other coin (however my guess would be 'nobody'), but ALL coins would also include your own coins, and I am pretty sure you wouldn't want to trade for those (although you'd save on postage!).

 

I don't know how many people have a coin that they would trade for any other coin, but could you maybe create an %ALL variable, just so that we don't have to type them all out ourselves :)

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Ok, as promised:

 

What if a coin you want is listed multiple times and you don't want to risk receiving 2 or more of the same coins?

 

Say you have listed coin ID 1 and coin ID 3 up for trade.

You'd like to get two of the following coins for them:

"Lord of the Caches - Earth" (ID 695, 443, 654, and 244

"Anthus Laptop" (ID 634 and 635)

"Cache Aid Kit" (ID 207)

 

So you could make the following want list:

 

1 : 695 443 654 244 634 635 207

2 : 695 443 654 244 634 635 207

 

However, this way you'd 'risk', for example, receiving coin 695 for your coin 1, and coin 443 for your coin 2. This way you end up with 2 "Lord of the Caches - Earth" coins, while you'd much have received two different coins.

You can avoid this very easily by defining 'variables'.

You define a coin group to make sure you only get at most 1 coin from that group. Here is how you do that:

Pick a random name for your group, preceded by a % sign, and indicate what coins the group consists of, like this:

 

%lord : 695 443 654 244

%laptop : 634 635

 

Now you simply include these names in your want list, instead of the actual coin numbers. Your list would then change from the above example to the following:

 

1 : %lord %laptop 207

2 : %lord %laptop 207

 

This way, if coin 1 gets traded for a coin from the "%lord" group, this will not be the case for coin 2, and vice versa.

 

To use this system, you need to include the variables you define at the top of the want list that you send to me, starting every line with your nick in parenteses, like this:

 

(kdv) %lord : 695 443 654 244

(kdv) %laptop : 634 635

(kdv) 1 : %lord %laptop 207

(kdv) 2 : %lord %laptop 207

 

That's it! Please don't hesitate to ask for more clarification if I haven't explained things well enough.

 

Katja

 

You've explained it beautifully and I suspect you should save the 'explain posts' on a webapge somewhere so others can run the math trade as a regular calendar event.

 

Having said that I think i will have to pass the actual trading to HiQ feral to arrange for me :)

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No such mailing list exists yet, but it might be a good idea to set up one.

 

This looks like an AWESOME trading opportunity. I am so disappointed that I found it too late. If you have a mailing list of people to notify when another math trade starts, please add me to that list.

 

Thanks!

Model Citizen - Zero Discipline

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I don't know either how many people would want to trade a coin for any other coin (however my guess would be 'nobody'), but ALL coins would also include your own coins, and I am pretty sure you wouldn't want to trade for those (although you'd save on postage!).

 

I don't know how many people have a coin that they would trade for any other coin, but could you maybe create an %ALL variable, just so that we don't have to type them all out ourselves :)

 

Now you tell me, would have only rearranged 27 times with that info! :)

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That sure took a while! It's a good thing our oldest GeoKid (the biggest geocoin addict in the family) had the day off school today so that he could have lots of input. E-mail with our want list has been sent and now we can just sit back and wait.

 

Look forward to seeing how this all turns out.

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I'e noticed so far that many people sent in very short want lists (consisting often of less than 10 coins for each coin). If we all only list the coins we covet soooo much, I think chances are, with a total of 711 coins in the math trade, very few trades will actualy go through.

Let me remind you all that the coins in your want list are in order of preference. If you include 5 coins in your want list for a coin, the first one in the list will be tried for hardest. But if for none of the 5 coins a trade can be worked out, your coin will not be traded. So make sure your want lists include all the coins that you'd rather have than the coin you have in your hands now. Of course, if you rather keep on to your coin if you can't get any of the, say, 5 coins in your want list, by all means don't add any coins to it :D

 

Good luck everyone and thanks to everyone who has already sent in their want list.

 

Katja

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