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Colorado do not keep time whene turned off


Carignan

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The new update is really a major step forward

...But....

I think my unit have an Hardware problem.... because it do not keep time when the unit is turned off

Tell me about your experience.

 

the tricky part to tests adequately because as soon your colorado get a Satellites lock, the Date Time is updated , so you can't tell if your unit Keep time or not.

 

Step to replicate

1 - Turn on the Colorado

2 - Wait until good Satellites lock

3 - Look at you Time and Date. Write it Down!

4 - Turn off the Colorado

5 - Wait 30 minutes

6 - Place the colorado where you should not get Satellites lock (basement or your office .... ect )

7 - Turn it on, then look at the Date Time.

 

Case #1) IF your unit have no Satellites lock and the Time is right you are OK.... Lucky You! ;)

Case #2) IF your unit have no Satellites lock and the Time is wrong your are not Ok and it's my case :D

Case #3) IF your unit have a Satellites lock, you can't tell cause your date time of you device has already been updated!! So don't bother to post and retry harder :D

 

Case #2 Result : In fact the time will be more or less the same time as it was the last time you turned off your device.

it's seems that the Internal clock Stop working when the unit if Off.

 

So am i alone?

Is this an hardware problem or it's the way it should be?

Edited by Carignan
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Colorado 400t with the new update as of this morning, the problem is that my GPS unit's clock does not update at all. Turned it on and it had yesterdays time, and at 10:46 am I turned it off, then on again 8 minutes later, and it was still 10:46 on it's clock.

 

Yesterday before the update, I could not get the alarm feature to work at all, so I'm wondering if the clock chip on the circuit board is just bad.

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Here's a test for you (and I don't know if this would normally succeed or fail on one of the bad units):

 

Go to the alarm clock, set it for a time 10 minutes from now, turn the alarm on, the GPS should now ask you if you want to turn off the GPS. Answer yes. If your GPS doesn't wake up in 10 minutes and beep at you, take it back because it's not working properly.

 

--Marky

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Here's a test for you (and I don't know if this would normally succeed or fail on one of the bad units):

 

Go to the alarm clock, set it for a time 10 minutes from now, turn the alarm on, the GPS should now ask you if you want to turn off the GPS. Answer yes. If your GPS doesn't wake up in 10 minutes and beep at you, take it back because it's not working properly.

 

--Marky

Flunked that test yesterday

 

This GPS Has functions in it that I dreamed about, with great software and a big screen, but the case design is not something I liked. Hopefully Garmin improves the case design for quicker access of batteries and more waterproof.

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Here's a test for you (and I don't know if this would normally succeed or fail on one of the bad units):

 

Go to the alarm clock, set it for a time 10 minutes from now, turn the alarm on, the GPS should now ask you if you want to turn off the GPS. Answer yes. If your GPS doesn't wake up in 10 minutes and beep at you, take it back because it's not working properly.

 

--Marky

Flunked that test yesterday

 

This GPS Has functions in it that I dreamed about, with great software and a big screen, but the case design is not something I liked. Hopefully Garmin improves the case design for quicker access of batteries and more waterproof.

Sounds like you have a defective unit and should return it. As far as hardware design changes, those generally take quite a bit longer than firmware changes. I'm not a big fan of the battery compartment or the provided caribeener clip. She can't remove the clip, nor can she remove the battery door. They both require way too much effort to remove. She's just going to have to rely on me to do that for her. :D

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Going to do that now. And I took the SD card out of it.

 

Serial #18Z001716

This 400t does not update it's clock, and Alarm clock never worked, also Door very tight, so back it goes to REI

 

The 15 minutes alarm Test works for me..... Strange :D

 

now ill do a 2 hours alarm test.

 

 

i wonder if it's the High capacitor that should keep the clock running that getting depleted too fast! i mean, it able to keep the clock running for 10 minutes but not for 2 hours.... we will see.

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I now think that the clock is not getting power in the off state, so the pressure readings also will be a flat line also, so the pressure readings can't be had in the off state.

 

I can only attempt to read your mind here, but I think you are saying that your pressure chart would look like this:

 

___________________________________________

 

That will not be the case if your clock is not working. It will be flat, but it will be a Vertically flat line, not horizontal. I'd be interested in having you look and report back what you are seeing. - Pat

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the case design is not something I liked. Hopefully Garmin improves the case design for quicker access of batteries and more waterproof.

I had the same problem when I got my 300 in January. It was almost impossible to slide the back off the device. That was easily resolved by getting some silicon grease and lightly putting the grease on both the case and removable back where they both touched. In addition, I put some silicon grease on the o-rings that protect for water intrusion.

 

It's all good.

Edited by Barrikady
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Those who have units, where the clock comes back up with the same time as was current when you turned the unit off, have you set logging of air pressure to be maintained with the unit off?

 

If not, do that, and check if it makes any difference at all, to the alarm clock and what time it displays when you turn it back on again.

 

You can also check if it actually does record any air pressure samples.

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I have posted before on this and have also emailed Garmin (but no response yet)...

 

My 400t when turned off for more that a few hours, did not display correct time when turned back on, but the last time it was turned off with a sat lock. It then would also take "forever" to reacquire a sat lock even though I was in same area. It would stay in "acquiring sats" on top of sats menu and eventuaqlly ask me if I wanted to continue acquiring. A work around was to use the "auto locate" feature and then it would go quickly about its process of acquiring sats and would display "locating satelite" at top of sat menu.

 

Since the 2.4 firmware upgrade, after my unit has been off for a few hours, it still has the previous time it was turned off, but it seems to go into auto locate mode with "locating sats" on top of sat menu. And acquires lock in a very reasonable amount of time. Also, I used the alarm clock over night and even though the time was off when I checked it late last night (aqnd before it could acquire a lock as I was inside house) by hours since I had turned it off, the alarm went off at the correct time. I do not have the pressure feature on either.

 

So, I believe that the internal clock seems to be working (unless this was a random event), and sat lock is much faster with the 2.4 firmware after being off for awhile... by the way, my unit has an early serial number 18Z0003xx, but it did download the "m" chipset patch and had the "m" style files under the Garmin memory storage area.

 

I will continue to test alarm and track time on/off with/without lock events... Has anybody looked at some of the previous models like 60cx and see when turned on after a few days of being off that the time is current or at last off before it locks to a sat?

 

BTW, I am reeally liking this unit and the shaded maps for hiking and mtn biking.... soon into cahing. My next efforts will be into uploading 24K map contours for my favorite areas which I have never tried before to a gps, but my line of work for the last 15 years was GIS and internet map making, so I ubderstand the technology behind it and have accessability to lots of data and software.

 

Happy Trails! :-)

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With 2.3 my 400t would lose time if powered off for more then 3 hrs. But with pressure trending on it would keep time overnight. It was a good workaround for me.

 

Yesterday I upgraded to 2.4 and turned off pressure trending and left it powered off all night. The clock was correct this morning. I'll take a look again tomorrow but at first look it seems that my clock problem is gone.

 

Greg

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Follow up post... I also had an emailinto Garmin about my 400t/clock issues and they just responded with this. They are saying firmware 2.4 "should help" the issue...

 

Dear Ray Peterson,

 

Thank you for contacting Garmin International.

 

We released a software update last night that should help that issue. You can download it at https://buy.garmin.com/shop/store/downloads...5&pID=11022.

 

With Best Regards,

 

Damon A

Product Support Specialist

Outdoor/Fitness Team

Garmin International

913-397-8200

00-800-1020

913-397-8282 (fax) Att: Damon A

www.garmin.com

 

Original Message Follows: ------------------------

 

Form Message

Knowledge Job Ticket: {ea7469f0-de75-11dc-7803-000000000000}

KnowledgeBase: garmin

Subject: colorado 400t internal clock/acquiring sats

Message Body: Purcahsed my 400t around Jan 17th. When the unit is turned off after acquiring sats and using awhile, and then turned back on, many times it cannot re-acquire sats even though I am in the same location area and the time is "off".... hours behind. After waiting 3-5 minutes, I have to go to "auto location" feature to re-acquire sats. Is this the "time drift"issue I have been reading about on the forums? In any case, having to "auto locate" to reacquire sats all the time is unacceptable. This is one of the "early" units according to the serialnumber. Is their a software upgrade (I am at the latest versions now) that will fix this or do you need to send me a new unit? Thnak You in advance...

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Here's a test for you (and I don't know if this would normally succeed or fail on one of the bad units):

 

Go to the alarm clock, set it for a time 10 minutes from now, turn the alarm on, the GPS should now ask you if you want to turn off the GPS. Answer yes. If your GPS doesn't wake up in 10 minutes and beep at you, take it back because it's not working properly.

 

--Marky

Flunked that test yesterday

 

This GPS Has functions in it that I dreamed about, with great software and a big screen, but the case design is not something I liked. Hopefully Garmin improves the case design for quicker access of batteries and more waterproof.

 

use a touch of silcone grease on the o-rings. There is a thread on how to, in the forums.

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Going to do that now. And I took the SD card out of it.

 

Serial #18Z001716

This 400t does not update it's clock, and Alarm clock never worked, also Door very tight, so back it goes to REI

 

The 15 minutes alarm Test works for me..... Strange :rolleyes:

 

now ill do a 2 hours alarm test.

 

i wonder if it's the High capacitor that should keep the clock running that getting depleted too fast! i mean, it able to keep the clock running for 10 minutes but not for 2 hours.... we will see.

 

Well, i.m puzzled!!! the 15 alarms test works well, the 1 hour test as wellé and everything went well,

this afternoon i was turning my unit off and on, from time to time to check if the unit was keeping time when tuned off, and it DID!!!!!

 

Now tonight i do the same kind of manipulation and the my unit always show the last turn off time!!!!

 

My Last test for the night will be

set the alarm to 6 oclock AM and see if my unit will wake me up? :ph34r:

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I had this issue and tis is what the tech help person had me do and it worked like a charm.

1. Power unit on.

2. Push shortcuts button and use wheel to get to "Others"

3. Scroll to "Satellite" and push center button of wheel.

4. Push"Options" button.

5. Highlight "Use With GPS Off" and push center button of wheel.

6. Unit will go into demo mode.

7. Push "Options" button.

8. Highlight "use With GPS On" and push center button of wheel.

Unit will acquire satellites and problem should be fixed. It work on mine.

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Try to give the unit 20 minutes of a clear view to the sky to update its almanach.

 

My Colorado lost the time when switching it off when it was new and after each update.

But after using it a while outside, the time problems disappeared and did not come back.

 

I personally don't believe that it is a hardware issue, but it needs a clear almanach-database from monitoring the satellites for a while. Once this is built-on it works fine.

Edited by tanooga
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But only for that single occasion, right? The next time you have the same problem back, don't you?

 

You only have to do it once and it takes care of the problem. I turned mine on his morning after being off all night and it tarted right up and had correct date and time. Hesaid you mayhave to do it after a software update but I updated last night and did not have to do it again.

Edited by minnesotabrad
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Going to do that now. And I took the SD card out of it.

 

Serial #18Z001716

This 400t does not update it's clock, and Alarm clock never worked, also Door very tight, so back it goes to REI

 

The 15 minutes alarm Test works for me..... Strange :rolleyes:

 

now ill do a 2 hours alarm test.

 

i wonder if it's the High capacitor that should keep the clock running that getting depleted too fast! i mean, it able to keep the clock running for 10 minutes but not for 2 hours.... we will see.

 

Well, i.m puzzled!!! the 15 alarms test works well, the 1 hour test as wellé and everything went well,

this afternoon i was turning my unit off and on, from time to time to check if the unit was keeping time when tuned off, and it DID!!!!!

 

Now tonight i do the same kind of manipulation and the my unit always show the last turn off time!!!!

 

My Last test for the night will be

set the alarm to 6 oclock AM and see if my unit will wake me up? :ph34r:

 

Follow up

 

I woke up this morning at 6:30AM with the sweet sound of my colorado alarm. i was happy to know that my unit keep the time right all the night. I turned my unit off! ... remember it was 6:30 when i turned off the unit.

 

At 8:30 i decided to look at my unit time, just for fun.... i was in Montreal Ville Marie basement, so no sats lock.... Horror the colorado Showed 8:15 !!!!!!!!!!!, why 8:15 instead of 8:30..... I don't have a clue....

 

So..... My unit keep time when off only when the alarm is active???? and sometime it stop keeping time for what reason, i don't know .... definitively not an Hardware problem.....

 

PS: The barometric tracking is always On

 

it's now 9:15Am, i will turn on my unit right now....... No sats lock.... the unit tell me .... 9:00AM ?????

15 minutes OFF.... god dadgum....

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Well, my guess here is that the barometric plot is updated every 15 minutes. There's a chip inside that actually does keep track of the time. That chip initiates a wake-up, when it's time to record the pressure. At each such occasion, no pressure is actually recorded (on my unit, at least), but the Colorado's idea of the current time is advanced by 15 minutes.

 

Not recording is a bug, of course, but turning on four times per hour would then imply that the clock isn't more off than that.

 

I'll have to try the GPS off/on trick as well.

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Going to do that now. And I took the SD card out of it.

 

Serial #18Z001716

This 400t does not update it's clock, and Alarm clock never worked, also Door very tight, so back it goes to REI

 

The 15 minutes alarm Test works for me..... Strange :rolleyes:

 

now ill do a 2 hours alarm test.

 

i wonder if it's the High capacitor that should keep the clock running that getting depleted too fast! i mean, it able to keep the clock running for 10 minutes but not for 2 hours.... we will see.

 

Well, i.m puzzled!!! the 15 alarms test works well, the 1 hour test as wellé and everything went well,

this afternoon i was turning my unit off and on, from time to time to check if the unit was keeping time when tuned off, and it DID!!!!!

 

Now tonight i do the same kind of manipulation and the my unit always show the last turn off time!!!!

 

My Last test for the night will be

set the alarm to 6 oclock AM and see if my unit will wake me up? :ph34r:

 

Follow up

 

I woke up this morning at 6:30AM with the sweet sound of my colorado alarm. i was happy to know that my unit keep the time right all the night. I turned my unit off! ... remember it was 6:30 when i turned off the unit.

 

At 8:30 i decided to look at my unit time, just for fun.... i was in Montreal Ville Marie basement, so no sats lock.... Horror the colorado Showed 8:15 !!!!!!!!!!!, why 8:15 instead of 8:30..... I don't have a clue....

 

So..... My unit keep time when off only when the alarm is active???? and sometime it stop keeping time for what reason, i don't know .... definitively not an Hardware problem.....

 

PS: The barometric tracking is always On

 

it's now 9:15Am, i will turn on my unit right now....... No sats lock.... the unit tell me .... 9:00AM ?????

15 minutes OFF.... god dadgum....

 

Second Follow Up, just to let you know folks

it's now 11:00Am, i will turn on my unit to see the current time of my colorado..... .... 9:00AM ! No sats lock

 

So, since the last time i turned on my device it was 9:00 and stay the same, the internal clock stopped to update when the unit is turned off, this is confirm.

 

now why the strange behavior !!!???

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I'm a little confused by all this. Here's why:

 

Your GPS unit functions by communicating with multiple satellites and in doing so KNOWS the exact time. If your unit properly fuctions with the alarm feature and properly displays the time after a satellite lock has been established, everything is in order.

 

You guys repeatedly ask what time shows at startup, and I feel this is not a valid question. Here's why:

 

Let's say (and we know this) that there are two groups of Colorado users: Those whose clock reads current time on startup and those whose clock does not read current time on startup.

 

Let's say that there are also two groups of Colorado users: Those whose units start up in 19 seconds (I'm in this group) and those whose units start up in 17.5 seconds (no data here -- just illustrating a point.) At 18.8 seconds these units establish their first read of satellite data and reset their clocks with the correct time. REMEMBER that our GPS units are always seeking the proper time +/- some very small time increment. So, the units that haven't yet comfirmed the time are starting up sooner than those that have, and functioning better than other units (which incidentally read the correct time.) Another possibility is that this displayed time is one of the last things the GPS unit changes on power-up. In a similar way, some units may be powering up faster than others and displaying a non-updated display time (having nothing to do with the time the unit thinks it is.)

 

The whole point: Unless your alarm isn't functioning properly (this is the only relative time feature of this unit), what matters is what time the unit displays AFTER a satellite lock has been established, and not before. Your unit is not a clock, but ironically, its entire purpose for being forms around knowing the EXACT time. Since this is critical for the GPS to function at all, much less accurately, the unit knows and will indicate if this basic function/need is not met.

 

Back to what Marky has said numerous times before: If the unit fails the alarm test, take the unit back.

 

I will add: If after a satellite lock the unit fails to either function at all or fails to display the appropriate time, take the unit back.

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I had this issue and tis is what the tech help person had me do and it worked like a charm.

1. Power unit on.

2. Push shortcuts button and use wheel to get to "Others"

3. Scroll to "Satellite" and push center button of wheel.

4. Push"Options" button.

5. Highlight "Use With GPS Off" and push center button of wheel.

6. Unit will go into demo mode.

7. Push "Options" button.

8. Highlight "use With GPS On" and push center button of wheel.

Unit will acquire satellites and problem should be fixed. It work on mine.

 

This post alone backs up what I was getting at: Your supposed clock issues really aren't issues. Its the unit displaying the time BEFORE it updates the time ... and again "Who cares?" This is like saying that the second horse to cross the finish line actually won because you happened to write down its time first. What matters here is the functionality of the unit itself, not what it happens to read at the exact moment of power-up.

 

For you guys with issues: What does the unit display for the current time on other screens? I display the current time on a couple different screeen so I know what time it is while I'm searching for/found a cache. If this time is correct while you are using the unit, and it will be if you have a satellite lock, there is no issue.

 

If, on the other hand, your unit fails repeatedly to achieve a satellite lock, you definitely have a problem. An incorrect current time is one symptom of this very problem. - Pat

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the case design is not something I liked. Hopefully Garmin improves the case design for quicker access of batteries and more waterproof.

I had the same problem when I got my 300 in January. It was almost impossible to slide the back off the device. That was easily resolved by getting some silicon grease and lightly putting the grease on both the case and removable back where they both touched. In addition, I put some silicon grease on the o-rings that protect for water intrusion.

 

It's all good.

 

Silicon greese on the O-rings I can see, but not on the case.

 

Do you WANT the case to slide off easily? I DO NOT. That's part of the argument about the waterproof nature of this design. If that back doesn't seat properly, the seals will also not seat properly. If the case is too prone to movement it could back away from the unit and unseat the seals.

 

I won't be putting grease on the case to make my cover more easily removed.

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I had this issue and tis is what the tech help person had me do and it worked like a charm.

1. Power unit on.

2. Push shortcuts button and use wheel to get to "Others"

3. Scroll to "Satellite" and push center button of wheel.

4. Push"Options" button.

5. Highlight "Use With GPS Off" and push center button of wheel.

6. Unit will go into demo mode.

7. Push "Options" button.

8. Highlight "use With GPS On" and push center button of wheel.

Unit will acquire satellites and problem should be fixed. It work on mine.

 

This post alone backs up what I was getting at: Your supposed clock issues really aren't issues. Its the unit displaying the time BEFORE it updates the time ... and again "Who cares?" This is like saying that the second horse to cross the finish line actually won because you happened to write down its time first. What matters here is the functionality of the unit itself, not what it happens to read at the exact moment of power-up.

 

For you guys with issues: What does the unit display for the current time on other screens? I display the current time on a couple different screeen so I know what time it is while I'm searching for/found a cache. If this time is correct while you are using the unit, and it will be if you have a satellite lock, there is no issue.

 

If, on the other hand, your unit fails repeatedly to achieve a satellite lock, you definitely have a problem. An incorrect current time is one symptom of this very problem. - Pat

 

LifeOnEdge! you missed the point:

"This post alone backs up what I was getting at: Your supposed clock issues really aren't issues. Its the unit displaying the time BEFORE it updates the time ... and again "Who cares?" What matters here is the functionality of the unit itself,"

 

If you buy Brand new car, and the clock of you cd player is not keeping time... would you say, who care it's a car, it's not suppose to keep time?

 

First of all, you assume that the unit is not a clock. this claim is false. The unit MUST have a precise clock when turned off, for at least 3 things

 

1) It can wake you up on time, if you set the alarm.

2) It can monitor precisely the barometric data over time

3) When turned one, it can very fast give you a position, because it know exactly where in the sky the sats are. ( now with the 2.4 it can lock stats very fast even when the time or the position is off, Tks Garmin ) )

 

but never the less, point 1 and 2 are important...

 

The question IS........ Is this an Hardware or a Software problem????

 

If Garmin is willing to answer this will help all of us ... even Garmin because

If it's a Software problem we will ALL be agree to wait for the next Patch and Garmin will not have a Tones false defective Unit on the arms, but Garmin will also have tones of happy customers

 

if it's an Hardware problem Garmin will have on the Arms a tones of true defective unit, and also a Tones of Happy costumers who now trust Even more Garmin because it take it's responsibility.

Edited by Carignan
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Okay. Here's a follow-up on your "clock issues."

 

I'm sitting here shaking my head about all this and decided to try the little power-on test myself, just to see what the unit does. (I realize this isn't a valid test, but want to do it anyway.) I reach down and instead of seeing the Colorado 400t, I see my GPSmap 60 CSx. I power on with the antenna tightly covered by my hand:

 

6:59:52 pm 24-SEP-05

 

There we have it! My fully-functioning, tried and true GPS unit that I've had for 2 years now HAS AN INTERNAL CLOCK PROBLEM!!!

 

Drama ... Drumbroll ensues (intentional typo there for effect!)

 

Guys, as I have said and as you already know from understanding how a GPS unit works, there is no problem here. This is how a GPS works. Display of current time on start-up may be incorrect until an adequate satellite lock is achieved.

 

Oh. I almost forgot! Current time displayed by the unit: 12:03:48 21-FEB-08

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First of all, you assume that the unit is not a clock. this claim is false. The unit MUST have a precise clock when turned off, for at least 3 things

 

1) It can wake you up on time, if you set the alarm.

2) It can monitor precisely the barometric data over time

3) When turned one, it can very fast give you a position, because it know exactly where in the sky the sats are. ( now with the 2.4 it can lock stats very fast even when the time or the position is off, Tks Garmin ) )

 

but never the less, point 1 and 2 are important...

 

The question IS........ Is this an Hardware or a Software problem????

 

If Garmin is willing to answer this will help all of us ... even Garmin because

If it's a Software problem we will ALL be agree to wait for the next Patch and Garmin will not have a Tones false defective Unit on the arms, but Garmin will also have tones of happy customers

 

if it's an Hardware problem Garmin will have on the Arms a tones of true defective unit, and also a Tones of Happy costumers

 

Dude, you're NOT READING what I write. See all my posts.

 

I didn't say that the GPS doesn't have clock features. By its VERY NATURE the unit has to know exactly what time it is to function.

 

What I said was: The unit is not a clock. It is not. Did you buy yourself a $600 clock that has GPS features? No. You bought a GPS unit.

 

You're being SILLY. If your unit doesn't work properly, TAKE IT BACK.

 

But then don't try to tell me that every single GPS in the world that functions like this isn't working. This just isn't how the GPS functions.

 

USER ERROR!

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An interesting side-note...

 

Chip-scale atomic clocks are being developed to improve the performance of GPS. Goal is 1 hr. average freq. stability of 1e-11 and <30 mW power consumption. Advantages with acquisition/reacquisition, 3-sat. fixes, etc. Current prototypes are approaching these goals.

 

See the interesting (but long) article at gpsworld.com

 

http://uc.gpsworld.com/gpsuc/article/artic...p;sk=&date=

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First of all, you assume that the unit is not a clock. this claim is false. The unit MUST have a precise clock when turned off, for at least 3 things

 

1) It can wake you up on time, if you set the alarm.

2) It can monitor precisely the barometric data over time

3) When turned one, it can very fast give you a position, because it know exactly where in the sky the sats are. ( now with the 2.4 it can lock stats very fast even when the time or the position is off, Tks Garmin ) )

 

but never the less, point 1 and 2 are important...

 

The question IS........ Is this an Hardware or a Software problem????

 

If Garmin is willing to answer this will help all of us ... even Garmin because

If it's a Software problem we will ALL be agree to wait for the next Patch and Garmin will not have a Tones false defective Unit on the arms, but Garmin will also have tones of happy customers

 

if it's an Hardware problem Garmin will have on the Arms a tones of true defective unit, and also a Tones of Happy costumers

 

Dude, you're NOT READING what I write. See all my posts.

 

I didn't say that the GPS doesn't have clock features. By its VERY NATURE the unit has to know exactly what time it is to function.

 

What I said was: The unit is not a clock. It is not. Did you buy yourself a $600 clock that has GPS features? No. You bought a GPS unit.

 

You're being SILLY. If your unit doesn't work properly, TAKE IT BACK.

 

But then don't try to tell me that every single GPS in the world that functions like this isn't working. This just isn't how the GPS functions.

 

USER ERROR!

 

Question to you LifeOnEdge

 

Is your GsMap 60Scx can monitor and store barometric Data Over time when Off?

 

Here a comment from an other post

"Two things that you will loose by going to the 60CSx from the 60CS, the alarm clock, and the passive barometric tracking. Apparently, the new 60CSx no longer has a sleep mode so that these two things will not continue to work if you turn OFF the unit. The 60CS had a sleep mode so that the altimeter would still record your barometric after the unit was turned off and wake up to sound the alarm clock but not with the new 60CSx."

 

Dude, you're NOT READING what I write. See all my posts.

 

I didn't say that the GPS doesn't have clock features. By its VERY NATURE the unit has to know exactly what time it is to function.

 

What I said was: The unit is not a clock. It is not. Did you buy yourself a $600 clock that has GPS features? No. You bought a GPS unit.

 

You're being SILLY. If your unit doesn't work properly, TAKE IT BACK. "

 

Your the one who are not reading, i'll say it again in other words,

It's USELESS to return the Unit If the issue is Software Side. it's a waste of money and energy for all of us, Garmin included.

 

so again: Is the problem Software Side or Hardware.

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Is there a possibility that to conserve power the internal clock is only running when needed? For example if you have an alarm set, the unit keeps time while powered off to sound the alarm at the correct time. But if you don't have the alarm or pressure monitoring setup, then the unit doesn't run the real time clock? I'm not sure that the RTC can keep accurate enough time to decrease satellite acquisition time on startup. I've used RTC chips in my designs, and they are not extremely accurate.

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Is there a possibility that to conserve power the internal clock is only running when needed? For example if you have an alarm set, the unit keeps time while powered off to sound the alarm at the correct time. But if you don't have the alarm or pressure monitoring setup, then the unit doesn't run the real time clock? I'm not sure that the RTC can keep accurate enough time to decrease satellite acquisition time on startup. I've used RTC chips in my designs, and they are not extremely accurate.

 

Yes that make sens, but Only Garmin can confirm this.

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Carignan, have you called Garmin and talked to them about this?

 

I am guessing that you probably need this:

 

Garmin Customer Support - 800.800.1020

 

Ask them about the current time display and when this is valid.

 

My GPS (Colorado 400t) purchased on January 23, 2008 with the 2.40 version software has never had a clock problem. I don't see that this is universally either hardware or software issues. You either have a defective unit OR you're expectations are based on misinformation. As I demonstrated, my GPSmap 60 CSx, when tested with the faulty test suggested in this thread, it too appears to have a "clock problem." It does not. It functions perfectly.

 

You are having a problem with your unit, but have you called Garmin? Have you returned it? Have you tested other units at your local distributors? You have three positions to take here and you're choosing to do C) sit and wonder.

 

I'll leave you with a poem and give you bonus points if you know (not look up) who wrote it:

 

I wonder why.

I wonder why.

I wonder why.

I wonder.

 

I wonder why I wonder why.

I wonder why I wonder.

 

- Pat

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Okay. Here's a follow-up on your "clock issues."

 

I'm sitting here shaking my head about all this and decided to try the little power-on test myself, just to see what the unit does. (I realize this isn't a valid test, but want to do it anyway.) I reach down and instead of seeing the Colorado 400t, I see my GPSmap 60 CSx. I power on with the antenna tightly covered by my hand:

 

6:59:52 pm 24-SEP-05

 

There we have it! My fully-functioning, tried and true GPS unit that I've had for 2 years now HAS AN INTERNAL CLOCK PROBLEM!!!

 

Drama ... Drumbroll ensues (intentional typo there for effect!)

 

Guys, as I have said and as you already know from understanding how a GPS unit works, there is no problem here. This is how a GPS works. Display of current time on start-up may be incorrect until an adequate satellite lock is achieved.

 

Oh. I almost forgot! Current time displayed by the unit: 12:03:48 21-FEB-08

 

My gps v in right next to my 400t. My five year old V has the correct time at power on, my 400t says 1:29., the time I walked into my office.

 

My old etrex vista that hasn't been turned on for quite a while, also in the same bag as my 400t and V has the correct time.

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Carignan, have you called Garmin and talked to them about this?

 

I am guessing that you probably need this:

 

Garmin Customer Support - 800.800.1020

 

Ask them about the current time display and when this is valid.

 

My GPS (Colorado 400t) purchased on January 23, 2008 with the 2.40 version software has never had a clock problem. I don't see that this is universally either hardware or software issues. You either have a defective unit OR you're expectations are based on misinformation. As I demonstrated, my GPSmap 60 CSx, when tested with the faulty test suggested in this thread, it too appears to have a "clock problem." It does not. It functions perfectly.

 

You are having a problem with your unit, but have you called Garmin? Have you returned it? Have you tested other units at your local distributors? You have three positions to take here and you're choosing to do C) sit and wonder.

 

I'll leave you with a poem and give you bonus points if you know (not look up) who wrote it:

 

I wonder why.

I wonder why.

I wonder why.

I wonder.

 

I wonder why I wonder why.

I wonder why I wonder.

 

- Pat

 

LifeOnEdge! you don't agree with , fine we all well know by now! thank you for your point of view. Now let others share the information and their experiences.

Edited by Carignan
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I contacted Garmin many times about this issue and they keep telling me (always the same agent: Chris L. the

Product Support Specialist , 2nd Shift Outdoor/Fitness Team ) that it's a software Issue. Unfortunately, this is not consistent with other threads.

 

 

Garmin Colorado 300 Version Soft 2.40 Avr 37 Gps 2.60

 

Dear Carignan,

 

Thank you for contacting Garmin International.

 

I am happy to help you with this. The Colorado time issue is indeed a

software issue that will be resolved in the next update. I apologize

for the inconvenience.

 

With Best Regards,

 

Chris L.

Product Support Specialist

2nd Shift Outdoor/Fitness Team

Garmin International

www.garmin.com

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If you don't think it's wrong, then you are wrong.

 

These GPS units for sure use the time they can calculate from the satellite information, once a position has been established. This is all included in the PVT calculations (Position - Velocity - Time).

 

However, to facilitate quick startup, they also keep an ordinary quartz-controlled clock running when powered down. This clock is powered by the normal batteries in your GPS. If you remove them, the clock is powered by a backup energy source. In the case of the Colorado, this is a so called supercap.

 

There is no doubt whatsoever that the Colorado should be able to display the correct time and date, when you turn it on, even if you don't have any position calculated yet.

 

The difference between the 60 CS and the 60 CSx is not that the clock isn't running when the later is off, it's that the clock chip used can't issue the proper interrupt required to make the GPS power itself on, after a certain interval.

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If you don't think it's wrong, then you are wrong.

 

These GPS units for sure use the time they can calculate from the satellite information, once a position has been established. This is all included in the PVT calculations (Position - Velocity - Time).

 

However, to facilitate quick startup, they also keep an ordinary quartz-controlled clock running when powered down. This clock is powered by the normal batteries in your GPS. If you remove them, the clock is powered by a backup energy source. In the case of the Colorado, this is a so called supercap.

 

There is no doubt whatsoever that the Colorado should be able to display the correct time and date, when you turn it on, even if you don't have any position calculated yet.

 

The difference between the 60 CS and the 60 CSx is not that the clock isn't running when the later is off, it's that the clock chip used can't issue the proper interrupt required to make the GPS power itself on, after a certain interval.

 

THANK YOU Anders for adding your more than qualified view on the issue.!! Your insight, expertise, and experience is greatly appreciated even though a few of the self proclaimed "uber intelligent" might have an unqualified opinion in opposition to you. I wonder why?

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Makes two of us.

 

In this particular case, I've had quite a detailed discussion with a technician at Garmin about this problem, so I know a bit more than most of you about it. That's why I'm counteracting at least some of the large amount of misinformation that's floating around here.

 

I tried yesterday evening to set an alarm in the morning. I kept air pressure logging off, so not to have the possible effect of that to make things different.

Then I waited for the alarm in the morning. I had it set so it should go off five minutes after my regular alarm clock, as not to miss it.

It turned out that 19 minutes after the set time, the alarm triggered. Looking at the clock in the Colorado, it was then 19 (no wonder) minutes behind.

I selected the "snooze" option, which advances the alarm time by ten minutes. Ten minutes later, nothing was heard from the Colorado. Checking again, it turned out that it had received enough satellites to compute a position, and thus also advanced the time by the missing 19 minutes. As the snooze was ten minutes away, and when the position was established probably even less, the clock just passed by that time, without triggering the alarm.

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Is there a possibility that to conserve power the internal clock is only running when needed? For example if you have an alarm set, the unit keeps time while powered off to sound the alarm at the correct time. But if you don't have the alarm or pressure monitoring setup, then the unit doesn't run the real time clock? I'm not sure that the RTC can keep accurate enough time to decrease satellite acquisition time on startup. I've used RTC chips in my designs, and they are not extremely accurate.

 

Yes that make sens, but Only Garmin can confirm this.

I don't think so at all.

If the clock fails to keep accurate time, and you're not specifically looking for this problem as your primary concern when you switch the unit on, what you'll first observe is, that it's not picking up satts, and failing to locate. Obviously, this is because the almanac is wrong and it's looking for the wrong satts in the first place! This is what I observed, and I believe, posted the first mention of the issue on the Colorado's here several weeks ago. The clock is supposed to work all the time, period. I've sold Garmin GPS units for 15 years and all the previous models I've dealt with did, although I must admit, I've noticed some rather inaccurate timekeeping here and there from occasional units. By this I just mean a few seconds drift over a couple of days, not flat out stopping entirely, or losing big blocks of time like the many Colorados are doing on a regular basis!

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Makes two of us.

 

In this particular case, I've had quite a detailed discussion with a technician at Garmin about this problem, so I know a bit more than most of you about it. That's why I'm counteracting at least some of the large amount of misinformation that's floating around here.

 

I tried yesterday evening to set an alarm in the morning. I kept air pressure logging off, so not to have the possible effect of that to make things different.

Then I waited for the alarm in the morning. I had it set so it should go off five minutes after my regular alarm clock, as not to miss it.

It turned out that 19 minutes after the set time, the alarm triggered. Looking at the clock in the Colorado, it was then 19 (no wonder) minutes behind.

I selected the "snooze" option, which advances the alarm time by ten minutes. Ten minutes later, nothing was heard from the Colorado. Checking again, it turned out that it had received enough satellites to compute a position, and thus also advanced the time by the missing 19 minutes. As the snooze was ten minutes away, and when the position was established probably even less, the clock just passed by that time, without triggering the alarm.

 

i had the exactly the same experience. but the drift was 16 minutes instead of 19....

 

It seems that the problem is more generalize than we think. but most people don't bother and/or do not test well. that's maybe why the problem seem marginal.

Edited by Carignan
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I did a test on my 300, and it does have time problems.

 

Turned it on, and let it get a good fix. (on for half an hour)

Then I turned it off.

After 4 hour, turned on again. The time was the same as when I turned it off.

4 hours late...

 

Hopefylly Garmin fix this.

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I did a test on my 300, and it does have time problems.

 

Turned it on, and let it get a good fix. (on for half an hour)

Then I turned it off.

After 4 hour, turned on again. The time was the same as when I turned it off.

4 hours late...

 

Hopefylly Garmin fix this.

I have been quietly reading this post so far. I think there is more to it than Software alone. My 300 (bought on Wednesday) keeps the time 100% accurate. I have tested a couple of times (out of curiosity) with 2.4 and every time (even after a whole night) the time was exactly what it was supposed to be (before acquiring satellites) and sat lock was very fast... My S/N starts with 1690044xx - in case anyone is keeping track...

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I haven't powered up my GPS in a couple of days, so I figure this would be a good test. No alarm set. I powered on, purposely obscuring the antenna with metal so it wouldn't be able to get a lock. The clock was correct. I'm a bit mystified how some units work and some units don't, if this is a software issue. Of course, it's really hard to know if all the settings are the same. For example, I have Pressure Trending set to Save when on, not Save always. Also, I had good batteries in the unit. I don't think I've ever tested it turned off, without batteries.

 

--Marky

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I haven't powered up my GPS in a couple of days, so I figure this would be a good test. No alarm set. I powered on, purposely obscuring the antenna with metal so it wouldn't be able to get a lock. The clock was correct. I'm a bit mystified how some units work and some units don't, if this is a software issue. Of course, it's really hard to know if all the settings are the same. For example, I have Pressure Trending set to Save when on, not Save always. Also, I had good batteries in the unit. I don't think I've ever tested it turned off, without batteries.

 

--Marky

 

I have a Colorado 300 and have the issue of not keeping time. I have already replaced the unit once before the new update came out and received my new unit a couple days before the update. It had the same issue with the time and was told about the update, Well updated my unit and have been in talks with Garmin and it is looking like they will be replacing the unit again. But according to them this is the first they are hearing of this since the update was supposed to fix this issue. So if you are still having the time not working after applying the patch PLEASE notify Garmin so that they can get that info to the programmers so they can look at it more in depth.

 

Awaiting a phone call back Garmin to see what they will be doing since my unit still will not keep the time once powered off. And if I cannt get a sat. lock in the 1st 15 seconds I have to wait the 5 mins to get the error of having problems accuring sat. and once I tell it yes to continue I get a lock in 10 secs every time.

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I'm a bit mystified about this issue too. I thought 2.4 solved it for me but now I'm not too sure. I set an alarm for this morning and it was exactly right, but then took awhile to get sat. lock. Yesterday morning when I checked the time in the morning it was 6 minutes late. Today after work I checked and the time was about 9 hours off (it was the time I had turned it off this morning) but I was able to get sat. lock very fast. So twice it was right, once it was close, and once it was way off. Very weird.

 

Greg

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I also have the same problem - the Colorado 400t not keeping time when turned off when using version 2.4 of the software. I called Garmin technical support and after the usual diagnostics they said it was still a software issue, and that they are working on it.

 

I've also noticed that the satellite page says "Locating Satellites" after turning the unit on. In the previous version of the software it said "Acquiring Satellites" - almost as though the unit knows it has a clock error and is immediately doing an "Autolocate Position" (which I seem to remember used to make the satellite page say "Locating Satellites").

 

John

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