multi or puzzle?

[+Discombob]

Hey all

 

there is some dispute in the latest race as to whether this cache is a multi or puzzle:

 

Ambleside Military Cemetary

 

Please can you all post replies saying if you think this cache is a puzzle, or is really just a multi.

 

Also, could anyone let me know if they think Amanzimtoti and Ambleside can be considered to be a town

[+tomtwogates]

definition from Groundspeak :

 

An offset cache (where you go to a location and get hints to the actual cache) is considered a multi-cache.

 

Mystery or puzzle caches

The “catch-all” of cache types, this form of cache can involve complicated puzzles you will first need to solve to determine the coordinates. The only commonality of this cache type is that the coordinates listed are not of the actual cache location but a general reference point, such as a nearby parking location. Due to the increasing creativity of geocaching this becomes the staging ground for new and unique challenges.

 

from this I would say the cache is a multi as there is no puzzle to solve

 

good luck Dbob - guess you are going to have many of these decisions in the months to come!

[+the pooks]

The definition of a multi, puzzle or unkwown cache is probably worth a posting to the general forums, or the input from a moderator as it is indeed confusing and worth clarification. A perusal of the site and forums did not offer much clarification.

 

One interpretation would be to go by what is written at the top of the listing. In this case it is called an "unknown cache" - so then that is what is is for the purpose of racing bug rules. Interestingly Harry Potter and the Philosophers cache is also an "Unknown" http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...fc-54e70522e62a

 

From the SA Road map I have Amanzimtoti is a town. Ambleside is not shown.

[+Wazat]

Ah I have stirred some thought. Quick definition. A Multi I see as a cache in which you are sent from one place to another eithe getting details from a location be it co-ords for the next waypoint. at the next waypoint you will then pick up another and so one to be led to the final location. Now a puzzle you go to one location and pick up clues which then have to be all mixed up, added, subracted and then thrown in a jar, shook around vigorously and emptied for the dog to chew on before removing the soddy remains of a scrap of paper where upon you may or may not find the clue. The cache is not too far away, most probably under the rock you were sitting on to work out this whole jumble of numbers. Granted you are going from memorial to memorial looking for names and numbers etc. but you still need to do some math to get the final co-ordinates. Believe me I was puzzled after all that just to get it right. Just make it simple give the same score for both. Otherwise it is ok with me. I will bite the bullet.

 

Oh and Ambleside is a town elsewhere. This is a farm outside Colenso. So no points on that one.

Edited February 20, 2008 by Wazat

[+GlobalRat]

By definition a puzzle is a "catch-all", so it could be a mixture of a multi and a puzzle and may overlap what folks traditionally as a multi.

 

To make your and everyone's life simple. The cache owner has probably gone through some inner debate on what to classify the cache as. Why should we debate it further. Accept what they have defined it as, allocate the score and move on. If you are going to debate each and every classification, you are going to have an interesting time as there will be a long list of caches which should rather have defined as a puzzle than a multi, and vice versa.

[+the pooks]

Just some extracts from the guidelines (same section referred to by tomtwogates)

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx

 

Multi-cache

"Another popular variant is a series of multiple waypoints, each of which provide partial coordinates for the final cache’s position"

 

Puzzle cache

"the puzzle should be solvable from the information provided on the cache page."

 

Mystery cache

"Caches with mandatory requirements in addition to signing the logbook should be listed as mystery caches."

 

Sounds like a multi to me.

[+cincol]

To make your and everyone's life simple. The cache owner has probably gone through some inner debate on what to classify the cache as. Why should we debate it further. Accept what they have defined it as, allocate the score and move on. If you are going to debate each and every classification, you are going to have an interesting time as there will be a long list of caches which should rather have defined as a puzzle than a multi, and vice versa.

 

I would agree with this - probably the easiest way to call it. The reviewers were also involved in the process so it is not really one-sided.

 

Amamzintoti = town

Ableside = not town (?)

 

My 2 dirhams worth.

 

cincol

[+Wazat]

Hee hee, I think I will place a traditional multi puzzle cache next. Oh boy.

 

The puzzle should be solvable from the information provided on the cache page.

 

Is that before going to the site. I can throw in a whole lot of numbers and let you all solve it.... Hee hee. Like I said the points on this one don't bother me. I thought of this one as a Puzzle as you need to do a bit of calculations to get it. But each to his own. I really didn't think of the points when I placed this anyway. Was just a cache that I wanted to leave in a out of the way memorial....

[+erik88l-r]

......I would agree with this - probably the easiest way to call it. The reviewers were also involved in the process so it is not really one-sided.

 

If I had known so many would have an opinion I would have insisted that it be listed as an event cache.

 

All the best,

~erik~

[+Wazat]

......I would agree with this - probably the easiest way to call it. The reviewers were also involved in the process so it is not really one-sided.

 

If I had known so many would have an opinion I would have insisted that it be listed as an event cache.

 

All the best,

~erik~

 

Spits out the bullet and waves hand in the air..... Can I log my visit and get a smiley? How many points for an event cache..........

[+Discombob]

ooohh, based on the quotes from pooks and tomtwogates, it looks like official categorization should be a multi, as there is no puzzle to solve - It is essentially, an offset multi.

 

interestingly, even though there seem to be 2 separate definitions of mytery and puzzle caches, they are classed as the same thing when publishing a cache.

 

Globalrat, i see your point, and i was not planning to analyse every single cache for legitimacy. I just thought i'd better check this one, as the TB owner hid the cache to place the TB in and you never can tell what sort of shenanigans some people get up to

 

Besides, its fun gettng deeply involved in the race like this otherwise it would just be dull number crunching !

look at the lively debate we have provoked already!

[+Wazat]

OK.... me up to some senanigans? That's it. I am now gonna change the status of the cache as an event cache. Bring your own wepons this is on a battle field remember..... LOL.

 

Discombob, really I am not all that worried. I am not going to miss them points unless I miss first place by 9 points. But even so this is only a game so it is ok. Now will someone get out there and solve the darn thing and move my TB on please.... Eish! LOL.

Edited February 21, 2008 by Wazat

[+Wazat]

OK seeing that I cannot edit this cache and change the type and seeing that the debate is on over it been either or. I have now changed it to an either or. There is a code to work out. But to be fair on this I will not take any extra points for the TB race. I will stay with the multi points as allocated. This is now I believe a Puzzle cache.

[+Discombob]

Fairs Fair, it seems there is now a puzzle element to the cache, and as the TB is still there, i can upgrade you the 10 Points!

I can't figure out the puzzle thougfh - it could all be a big scam

 

It also seems that Diepienaars coin needs and extra 25 points for Amanzimtoti being a town name!