Geocaching events piggybacking on non-geocaching events?

[+Cache Liberation Front]

Hi all,

 

A couple of years ago my wife and I wanted to invite some local geocachers along on the American Heart Association 5k we run/walk for charity. We figured since we're running it, we might as well invite fellow cachers and make an event out of it. We never mentioned a word about "money" or "fund raising" or anything commercial (though are "charity" and non-profit orgs considered "commercial"?), yet we were denied the event since it was piggybacking on a pre-existing, non-geocaching event. Apparently by our creating said caching event, we'd of been indirectly associating geocaching with an outside enterprise (in this case the AHA), and thereby indirectly promoting an agenda. Oh well, I understood the explanation, though I thought it was a petty excuse.

 

We tried again to create a geocaching event around the non-profit org's "Keep Riverside Clean" clean-up (run by the actual city, itself), and again we were denied.

 

Well just the other day there was a CITO event in the California desert. Read the description at:

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...3b-7cccaa08eef6

 

and you can clearly see this was a geocaching event piggybacking on a pre-existing, non-geocaching event.

 

So what's up with the double standard? Is this another case of Groundspeak saying "Do as I say and not as I do" (like their Garmin Colorado promotion event in the Bay Area recently, a clearly commercial event if there ever was one)?

 

Mr. Wisearse.

[Keystone]

Geocaching events must be organized BY geocachers and FOR geocachers. A simple way of testing for this is to ask, "if no geocachers showed up, would the event still take place?' In the OP's example, the answer is "yes." Also, the OP's event example promotes an agenda, so special permission is needed. It is up to Groundspeak to decide which political, charitable, social, religious and other causes can be promoted on its website.

 

In contrast, CITO is the one agenda which Groundspeak has chosen to support as its "official cause." All other causes require special approval from Groundspeak. Some reviewers are also a bit more lenient for CITO Events done in conjunction with larger community cleanup projects. So long as the geocachers have a separate area to clean up and a separate meeting place, it's a geocaching CITO event.

 

Groundspeak occasionally sponsors or co-sponsors events where attendees can meet some of the Lackeys, ask questions and see demonstrations of new products and services. The Wherigo/Garmin Colorado demo events are an example of this. Yes, there is commercialism associated with that type of event. But the same is true for other events, whose organizers have obtained permission from Groundspeak. It is up to Groundspeak to decide which commercial products and services can be promoted on its website.

 

No two caches or events are presented on exactly the same facts and at the exact same point in time. That is why the listing guidelines say that the publication of any one cache does not serve as precedent for any later cache.

[+Haffy]

I think it might be the case of who the reviewer is doing the reviewing. As a former cacher in Maine I can attest to a couple of CITO events we had that piggybacked on a much larger event happening in the Bangor -Brewer area for the last 3 years or so. Our reviewer had no trouble with us using it for our CITO event. Keep trying is about all I can say. This is their ball field we are playing on.

[+StarBrand]

Groundspeak can sanction any of the above at thier sole discretion. Did you try to seek permission from them??

[Motorcycle_Mama]

You might also want to read over the guidelines.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx

 

Event Caches

 

Event caches are gatherings that are open to all geocachers and which are organized by geocachers. While a music concert, a garage sale, an organized sporting event, a ham radio field day or a town’s fireworks display might be of interest to a large percentage of geocachers, such events are not suitable for submission as event caches because the organizers and the primary attendees are not geocachers. In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches. Such group hunts are best organized using the forums or an email distribution list.

[+MrFRjr]

You might also want to read over the guidelines.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx

 

Event Caches

 

Event caches are gatherings that are open to all geocachers and which are organized by geocachers. ............................................ are not suitable for submission as event caches because the organizers and the primary attendees are not geocachers.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...3b-7cccaa08eef6

?????????

It seems funny that this was ok'd but Mr W's was not.

Groundspeak seems a little flip-floppy at times.

Perhaps they are mad at you?

[+MrFRjr]

Oops, try this link ....

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...3b-7cccaa08eef6

[+Too Tall John]

It seems funny that this was ok'd but Mr W's was not.

Groundspeak seems a little flip-floppy at times.

Perhaps they are mad at you?

All caches are reviewed by volunteer reviewers. I would suspect that some reviewers have interpreted the guidelines differently. In this case, sounds like the reviewer who refused the OP's event interpreted the guidelines the same way I would if I were a reviewer. The events like this that have been approved, either the reviewer read it differently, overlooked the guidelines, or redirected the organizer to Groundspeak, who made a exception.

 

From the guidelines:

First and foremost please be advised there is no precedent for placing caches. This means that the past listing of a similar cache in and of itself is not a valid justification for the listing of a new cache.(Emphasis not mine!)

[+Cache Liberation Front]

You might also want to read over the guidelines.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/about/guidelines.aspx

 

Event Caches

 

Event caches are gatherings that are open to all geocachers and which are organized by geocachers. While a music concert, a garage sale, an organized sporting event, a ham radio field day or a town’s fireworks display might be of interest to a large percentage of geocachers, such events are not suitable for submission as event caches because the organizers and the primary attendees are not geocachers. In addition, an event cache should not be set up for the sole purpose of drawing together cachers for an organized hunt of another cache or caches. Such group hunts are best organized using the forums or an email distribution list.

 

I read the guidelines. Did you not read my post? I'm asking how is it that I'M held to the guidelines in not being able to create events on the tails of other organizations' events, and yet other cachers are not (even IF one was a local city clean-up aka CITO, which even the PTB that posted in this thread admits is an "official cause"...by the way, can I get a list of those "official causes," or do they also come and go as the Powers please?)? It's clearly a double-standard which needs addressing.

 

And the only PTB that have addressed it here have said, "Sorry, we make the rules, and we can break the rules. Do as I say, not as I do." I find that a very shady business model.

 

MrW.