Upset about a complaint about my cache.

[+PhxChem]

The thread title indicates that you are upset about this incident, yet throughout this thread you have resisted any suggestion that you change it, instead using the thread to call the offender an idiot and refusing to look at it from any viewpoint but your own.

 

But even if you look at it from another viewpoint, since when is trespassing ok? Because your GPS tells you to? What other POV makes their actions reasonable?

 

There is no possible way to take into account EVERYTHING that stupid people are going to do. If there were, there wouldn't be geocaching. "HHHMMM....maybe I shouldn't put it near a tree, what if someone cuts down tree looking for geocache?" "HHHMMM...maybe I shouldn't put it in a forest, someone might burn down the forest looking for it."

 

Sound ridiculous? Well, what the cachers did was equally ridiculous!!

 

And I'd bet if she doesn't change the page it's going to happen again for the reasons listed earlier.

 

There are ALWAYS caches "near" someones home.....that's where a lot of public parks happen to be. Should I assume that without guidance, every cacher is going to go through some one's living room to get to the cache? That's unreasonable. Could it happen? Sure.

 

To the OP: Don't listen to the cache police...you did nothing wrong. If it is on public property (and not actually on private property)...you followed the rules. You don't have to hold every ones' hand to tell then how to get to your cache. I wouldn't have thought it reasonable to assume that, if not told, cachers would just go right trough back yards to get to caches. Now I know a new level of stupidity to take into account.

 

I think the changes you made are more than adequate. You can't stupid-proof everything. Like I said, if you could, Geocaching wouldn't exist.

 

To those who don't like to cache near peoples' houses....well...then....umm.....don't. It doesn't mean they can't be placed where you don't like them. Some people actually don't mind going to caches near houses.

 

There IS a map on this here website. Look at it!!

 

Caveat: If there is UNFENCED PRIVARE property in the area that may be confused with public property, that IS an issue you would need to deal with. My response assumes that private property is demarcated with fences as to be obvious. If not.......

 

But you ARE the one that hasn't done anything to prevent it from happening again...

 

Yeah, like....did you install a mote around you and your neighbors house? Razor wire? A mine field? "Lazers?" Well, obviously you're not doing your due diligence.........

Edited January 28, 2008 by PhxChem

[+Cedar Grove Seekers]

To those who don't like to cache near peoples' houses....well...then....umm.....don't. It doesn't mean they can't be placed where you don't like them. Some people actually don't mind going to caches near houses.

 

For me it's not so much that I don't like going near peoples' houses, but rather the negative light it puts on geocaching.

 

I've heard of, and experienced first hand, residents who get very upset that so many people are skulking around near their back-yards. I'm sure the OP's neighbour is one such resident.

 

Surely there are better places to place a cache?

[+Cedar Grove Seekers]

edit - double post

Edited January 28, 2008 by Cedar Grove Seekers

[+briansnat]

The thread title indicates that you are upset about this incident, yet throughout this thread you have resisted any suggestion that you change it, instead using the thread to call the offender an idiot and refusing to look at it from any viewpoint but your own.

 

12 of the 51 previous logs express some level of concern, to which you respond

As for my cache....I am not sure what to do. I like it where it is....my neighbor calmed down....I of course would never call the cops....but I did go a grab the coin....hehehee

 

Pot, meet Kettle?

 

Lets see. They park in a private driveway of a private home, open and enter through a latched gate, walk past a sign that says "private, do not enter", cross a wheelchair ramp and walk through the backyard and some of you guys are blaming the cache owner?

 

Thankfully the overwhelming majority of geocachers have a lot more sense and respect for private property than these Bozos.

[+swizzle]

Make something idiot proof they will come up with a better idiot......

 

[+johnsquad]

Yikes, okay, I give. Common sense says don't go on private property to geocache, sightsee, to picnic or any other activity one might enjoy.

 

I think plenty of people have found my cache just fine and this was the only "bad incident" that I am aware of.

 

For all of you that offered kind advice and could relate...I thank you.

 

I have updated my cache as well as I could without drawing a map to the area...the parking is right on top of the cache for the most part. I don't want to give it all away. As I said, it is rated a 1/1 it doesn't get much easier!!!!

 

And I am glad I went "running" to the forum, there seem to be a lot of great people on here, some great info and lots to learn. So thanks!

[+candum]

WOW! I can't believe all this. I'm the idiot or numbnuts or what ever names you guys have come up with. I'm glad Kit Fox had the decency to inform me that there was a thread a mile long bashing me for something that isn't even true. I don't know why Johnsquad made this up about us, except that maybe the neighbor exaggerated it to them. When I got the nasty harassing email Johnsquad sent me before they started this thread i thought they were kidding at first. I got upset when I realized they were serious. HOW DARE they slander us like this on here... and how dare most of you jump right in with the personal insults.

 

We did not cross or see any private property signs. We did not cross any chains. We did not cross any wheelchair ramps. If we did, we would have been idiots - but we didn't. I wonder how many of the people who have been ripping on us on this thread have been to this cache location or have read it before the hider updated the listing. It said nothing about private property at all.

 

Here is an honest description of finding this cache. We arrived at about noon and we parked in front of some cottages for rent. It doesn't look like a house, it is a business, like a hotel. We walked to the back between two of the cottages for rent. Now we were behind one of the cottages next to a bunch of blackberries about 45 feet from the cache. There was a geotrail going through the blackberries to the park. Dogs were barking like crazy but we ignored them because the cache description said we should. We started across the trail through the blackberries toward the park and the neighbor lady opened her window and told us the cache was in the park and we were on private property. We felt embarrassed and we apologized and left. Then we found the route to drive around to the park and found the cache.

 

I said "whoops, oh well" in my hide description because I didn't think it was a big deal, especially because this looks like a hotel and has a sign out front and everything. If it appeared to be a residence it would have been different.

 

I was really surprised as I read through this thread to see how many people resorted to personal insults about me. Some one even made fun of my status as a military police officer. Wow. You'd think an MP would know better than to do all the things Johnsquad accused me of and you would be right.

 

Thank you to the few people who read this complaint and then read the cache description and the past logs and realized I probably wasn't in the wrong. It's amazing how fast people will judge some one.

[+briansnat]

WOW! I can't believe all this. I'm the idiot or numbnuts or what ever names you guys have come up with. I'm glad Kit Fox had the decency to inform me that there was a thread a mile long bashing me for something that isn't even true. I don't know why Johnsquad made this up about us, except that maybe the neighbor exaggerated it to them. When I got the nasty harassing email Johnsquad sent me before they started this thread i thought they were kidding at first. I got upset when I realized they were serious. HOW DARE they slander us like this on here... and how dare most of you jump right in with the personal insults.

 

We did not cross or see any private property signs. We did not cross any chains. We did not cross any wheelchair ramps. If we did, we would have been idiots - but we didn't. I wonder how many of the people who have been ripping on us on this thread have been to this cache location or have read it before the hider updated the listing. It said nothing about private property at all.

 

Here is an honest description of finding this cache. We arrived at about noon and we parked in front of some cottages for rent. It doesn't look like a house, it is a business, like a hotel. We walked to the back between two of the cottages for rent. Now we were behind one of the cottages next to a bunch of blackberries about 45 feet from the cache. There was a geotrail going through the blackberries to the park. Dogs were barking like crazy but we ignored them because the cache description said we should. We started across the trail through the blackberries toward the park and the neighbor lady opened her window and told us the cache was in the park and we were on private property. We felt embarrassed and we apologized and left. Then we found the route to drive around to the park and found the cache.

 

I said "whoops, oh well" in my hide description because I didn't think it was a big deal, especially because this looks like a hotel and has a sign out front and everything. If it appeared to be a residence it would have been different.

 

I was really surprised as I read through this thread to see how many people resorted to personal insults about me. Some one even made fun of my status as a military police officer. Wow. You'd think an MP would know better than to do all the things Johnsquad accused me of and you would be right.

 

Thank you to the few people who read this complaint and then read the cache description and the past logs and realized I probably wasn't in the wrong. It's amazing how fast people will judge some one.

 

OK, now we have two sides. If there was no house, no gate, no driveway and no sign then a lot of us should eat some crow. I'll start. Yuk...I prefer chicken.

[+salmondan]

WOW! I can't believe all this. I'm the idiot or numbnuts or what ever names you guys have come up with. I'm glad Kit Fox had the decency to inform me that there was a thread a mile long bashing me for something that isn't even true. I don't know why Johnsquad made this up about us, except that maybe the neighbor exaggerated it to them. When I got the nasty harassing email Johnsquad sent me before they started this thread i thought they were kidding at first. I got upset when I realized they were serious. HOW DARE they slander us like this on here... and how dare most of you jump right in with the personal insults.

 

We did not cross or see any private property signs. We did not cross any chains. We did not cross any wheelchair ramps. If we did, we would have been idiots - but we didn't. I wonder how many of the people who have been ripping on us on this thread have been to this cache location or have read it before the hider updated the listing. It said nothing about private property at all.

 

Here is an honest description of finding this cache. We arrived at about noon and we parked in front of some cottages for rent. It doesn't look like a house, it is a business, like a hotel. We walked to the back between two of the cottages for rent. Now we were behind one of the cottages next to a bunch of blackberries about 45 feet from the cache. There was a geotrail going through the blackberries to the park. Dogs were barking like crazy but we ignored them because the cache description said we should. We started across the trail through the blackberries toward the park and the neighbor lady opened her window and told us the cache was in the park and we were on private property. We felt embarrassed and we apologized and left. Then we found the route to drive around to the park and found the cache.

 

I said "whoops, oh well" in my hide description because I didn't think it was a big deal, especially because this looks like a hotel and has a sign out front and everything. If it appeared to be a residence it would have been different.

 

I was really surprised as I read through this thread to see how many people resorted to personal insults about me. Some one even made fun of my status as a military police officer. Wow. You'd think an MP would know better than to do all the things Johnsquad accused me of and you would be right.

 

Thank you to the few people who read this complaint and then read the cache description and the past logs and realized I probably wasn't in the wrong. It's amazing how fast people will judge some one.

 

This whole fiasco points to the responsibility of the cache owner in maintaining their caches- not just coming up with a seemingly clever spot, but monitoring the logs carefully and adjusting the cache as necessary in response to the activity. Many of us use caching to explore unfamiliar areas- *invited* by the cache owners so to speak to visit an area perhaps we would never have seen. We need to have some trust in the cache owner- that they placed the cache responsibly, and hopefully that they placed the cache in a spot worth visiting.

[+PhxChem]

HOW DARE they slander us like this on here... and how dare most of you jump right in with the personal insults.

 

Actually, we were responding to actions that we THOUGHT had happened. Since we don't know you personally, we really weren't insulting you. It turns out that maybe the neighbor gave a delightfully EXAGGERATED story. Maybe she freaks out when people look at her property. I've seen people like that. Then again, maybe the neighbor will come back and say you're making stuff up!!!

So, we were reacting to the ACTIONS that allegedly happened.

 

You will notice my caveat in my post:

 

Caveat: If there is UNFENCED PRIVARE property in the area that may be confused with public property, that IS an issue you would need to deal with. My response assumes that private property is demarcated with fences as to be obvious. If not.......

 

So that my insurance policy. No need to eat anything. Well, I don't want to starve.

 

So, you know.....maybe we can be friends and hangout and not destroy bushes and stuff.....

 

Thank you to the few people who read this complaint and then read the cache description and the past logs and realized I probably wasn't in the wrong.

 

Well, I mean, we assumed that what the neighbor told the OP was true. It turns out that may not be so. So, that changes our opinion. We had incomplete information to work with here. Nothing personal...

 

At the same time, I'm not going to rail at the OP.....especially if the story told here was exactly as the neighbor described. Although the OP DOES know the location better than anyone else.

 

If there is a lack of fencing and signage....then that WOULD be confusing and someone could easily wonder onto private property. Something needs to be clarified on the cache page or in cache location.

Edited January 29, 2008 by PhxChem

[+Beaverbeliever]

I am sticking up for Candum on this one, and not because we are in the same Geocaching group...

 

Candum has hid a number of nice caches around here, and in my opinion, are fun and easy park and grabs. Now, I know he, nor any other sane cacher, would venture across chained fences, wheelchair ramps, or try to get through (what seems like) unpassable blackberry bushes to get a cache, unless that is clearly written in the description.

 

I personally think the cache owner should either archive the cache, or clearly change the data on the cache page for the right way to go, including topo and clear directions. You never when your GPSr auto-nav will take you to a wrong place, but might actually be the closest street to the cache.

 

This situation will be in my thoughts the next time I arrive at a location like this.

[+Renegade Knight]

...We did not cross or see any private property signs. We did not cross any chains. We did not cross any wheelchair ramps. If we did, we would have been idiots - but we didn't....Here is an honest description of finding this cache. We arrived at about noon and we parked in front of some cottages for rent. It doesn't look like a house, it is a business, like a hotel. We walked to the back between two of the cottages for rent. Now we were behind one of the cottages next to a bunch of blackberries about 45 feet from the cache. There was a geotrail going through the blackberries to the park. Dogs were barking like crazy but we ignored them because the cache description said we should. We started across the trail through the blackberries toward the park and the neighbor lady opened her window and told us the cache was in the park and we were on private property. We felt embarrassed and we apologized and left. Then we found the route to drive around to the park and found the cache....

 

Better information always leads to better decisions.

 

Can I get my crow cooked and wash it down with beer?

 

It looks like the "real problem" is that the neighbor exagerated events to better effect the result she wanted.

 

The cache owner is stuck with a cache near a neighbor who's going to be prone to ongoing exagerations. If the cache is in a park, it's fine. However the neighbor is still going to keep on complaining. The owner has a tough choice.

Edited January 29, 2008 by Renegade Knight

[+MarshMonsters]

My Mom and I wanted to put a micro in her pine tree that is along a public sidewalk. We decided against it after thinking of all the possble situations: People not reading and coming up into their yard, distrubing the neighbors, parking in a neighbor's driveway, neighbors thinking that cachers are casing my parent's home or another neigbor's home, late night caching, the police thinking there is drug running, and etc... We tried to think of how to word the fact that cachers need not leave the sidewalk. After working with the public I learned that there is a small group of people who don't take the time to read (not saying that the cachers in question didn't read I am sure they did.) ; which is sad because it ruins the fun for everyone else.

My parents neighborhood does not have any caches and it is a nice place to go into and visit. There are many wildlife areas that cannot have caches but would be nice to visit and include as waypoints!

 

Hopefully this situation can be fixed so everyone can enjoy this spot!

Edited January 29, 2008 by MarshMonsters

[+johnsquad]

You know....I am finding that this was one huge mistake on my part. I was just looking for advice, not a personal bashing.

 

Candum, you are lying and you know it!!!! There are rental cottages and then a home all on the same property, the only way to get between the buildings was to go through the chain and then up and over the wheelchair ramp.

 

There is no "geotrail"!!!!!!!!!!! My 12 year old outdoorsman cannot even cross over from the park to my neighbors house and the neighbor is my MOM!!! And she is not a liar!!!!!!!!!!!

 

ONCE AGAIN, THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO WAS NICE AND DIDN'T POINT FINGERS!!!! I thought being that we were all geocachers we were understanding fun people and I thought maybe I could get to know a few....but I guess all activities take all sorts of people.

 

I didn't want to get to personal in this and thanks to all of you who did, my cache is now removed!!!!

[+The Jester]

I personally think the cache owner should either archive the cache, or clearly change the data on the cache page for the right way to go, including topo and clear directions. You never when your GPSr auto-nav will take you to a wrong place, but might actually be the closest street to the cache.

I'm sorry, but I don't buy the arguement that the auto-nav takes you to the "wrong" spot. Blindly following the GPSr without the brain engaged is wrong. This can lead to all sorts of problems - people driving off ferry docks, turning onto & getting stuck on RR tracks, crossing private property (whether residentail or business) to get to a public park, or crossing a busy street in the middle of the block because the arrow didn't point to the crosswalk 100' feet away. No excuse for not using the grey matter you've been given.

 

There is a number caches around here that "honor" this type of nav error - the HARMONY caches: How Auto Routing May Only Nutify You.

Edited January 29, 2008 by The Jester

[+PhxChem]

Candum, you are lying and you know it!!!!

 

Now who to believe? Guess we'll all have to take a road trip to figure this one out.

[beachduo]

Hello everyone! I have remained quiet, since this is NOT my cache, but since Candum chimed in here and has decided to lie about the situation....here I am.

 

I AM THE NEIGHBOR I am the private property you came over, and hopefully everyone will get a picture of HOW you came through my property to try to get to a cache that is completely on another street from my property.

 

THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE, I might add! Everyone else has found the cache just fine since it is clearly in a park on a street over from us.

 

My property: It's located on the Highway, there are two buildings in front. One is a vacation rental with a sign out in front of IT. The other building is a pole building. BEHIND the vacation rental and the pole building, and behind our private parking sits our HOME and our guest house, side by side. Once you walk to the back part of our property where the home and guesthouse are located, there is a porch leading up to our door. Right beside that porch there is a narrow sidewalk with a chain across it. The chain is attached from one building to the other. The only way to go further is to unhook the chain or go under it. This leads to the 6 foot wide area between our house and our guesthouse, which is a wheelchair ramp that goes to the backdoor of the guesthouse, and also to the backyard. There is NO WAY TO WALK AROUND IT! You HAVE to use the ramp, that's how narrow the area is. Once in the backyard and skirting the little fenced dog yard, you eventually get to the backyard.

 

I was sick that day, and in my PJ's. All the blinds of the MANY windows I have were open. This is clearly a home that someone lives in. I happened to see you pull up in front of the vacation rental, and three guys got out of their car. You looked confused at first...which you were. Normally I would have been right out to see what you wanted....but I again, I was sick and in my PJ's. You first headed towards the north, then turned around and looked this way, then proceeded to walk towards my house. I decided I was not going to answer my door......BUT you did not come to my door. That one side of my house has no windows, and I actually got a little scared wondering where you had gone and what you were doing! The ONLY other way you had was unhooking the chain or going under it. That's what you did.

 

I came back through my house, with phone in hand......and FINALLY spotted you in my back yard. Luckily I noticed you were looking down at something, and one of you were looking through the 30 FEET of thick blackberry bushes (that my dog can't even get through!!!).....and I realized you must have trying to find the cache. I did not want to come out the glass double door, (again in my PJ's), so I opened a window and told you you were trespassing, and if you were looking for the cache you needed to drive around the block to the park. You did do that eventually.

 

Our property is 100 ft to the back of it.....I can understand your walking the first 30 feet of it.......but clearly the next 70 feet is completely private and clearly trespassing.

 

So, what you told people here is a lie, and out and out lie. You were CLEARLY on private property, there CLEARLY is no "geo trail" through the blackberries. We have owned this property for MANY, many years and to everyone else, even guests in our vacation rental......no one has EVER come through the chain and walked the 35 foot ramp mistakenly. There are also private property/no parking signs all along the front.

 

I hope this clears it up for everyone. I am sorry that this cache will not be available anymore........it was a nice one for people, located in a nice little park and well taken care of. All of us enjoyed seeing the geocaching visitors to the park.

[+DrAwKwArD]

 

There is no "geotrail"!!!!!!!!!!! My 12 year old outdoorsman cannot even cross over from the park to my neighbors house and the neighbor is my MOM!!!

 

 

Why is your son not allowed on your Mom's property?

[beachduo]

 

There is no "geotrail"!!!!!!!!!!! My 12 year old outdoorsman cannot even cross over from the park to my neighbors house and the neighbor is my MOM!!!

 

 

Why is your son not allowed on your Mom's property?

 

He is! But you CAN'T get through the blackberries!!

[+johnsquad]

 

There is no "geotrail"!!!!!!!!!!! My 12 year old outdoorsman cannot even cross over from the park to my neighbors house and the neighbor is my MOM!!!

 

 

Why is your son not allowed on your Mom's property?

 

roflmao....my son can get to my moms yard via our connecting walkway and gate....I meant that I have a mega outdoor boy who builds treehouses and all that good stuff and he can't even get through the thick blackberries! hahaha

[+ReadyOrNot]

This entire thread is a great example of why these types of caches are NOT A GOOD IDEA. There are too many unknowns.

 

The possiblity of getting a shotgun pointed at me is reason enough to not even attempt these types of caches.

[+DrAwKwArD]

It looks like the "real problem" is that the neighbor exagerated events to better effect the result she wanted.

 

The cache owner is stuck with a cache near a neighbor who's going to be prone to ongoing exagerations. If the cache is in a park, it's fine. However the neighbor is still going to keep on complaining. The owner has a tough choice.

Except the neighbor appears to be the "MOM" in which case the cache-owner is justifiably going to be a bit biased.

 

This is an unfortunate set of events that led to a perfectly good cache being archived. May this be a lesson to all of us who at times want a shortcut after seeking a poorly-executed path to the cache.

[+DrAwKwArD]

roflmao....my son can get to my moms yard via our connecting walkway and gate....I meant that I have a mega outdoor boy who builds treehouses and all that good stuff and he can't even get through the thick blackberries! hahaha

Sorry, couldn't resist

Edited January 30, 2008 by cache-n-dash

[+johnsquad]

I posted cause I needed to vent. My Mom was upset, she was scared at first until she figured that these guys were just geocaching. However, let's all keep in mind, geocacher or not, strange people in your yard can be quite unnerving and I highly doubt my Mom has my cache on her mind every second of the day.

 

So, I got my advice, some good, some bad....that is okay. The cache is archived and now I wish that I had never had it there in the first place.

 

To Candum: I did email you....you never emailed back...so don't say this was a surprise. So you screwed up, it is what it is...it was the "whoops, oh well" that I had an issue with. I am just glad that my Mom got you stopped before you made it to my backyard and my "other" dog, with whom I am sure you saw that made you think twice! By the way....this dog has no access or view of the cache so he is safe in regard to the park, but not safe when trespassers enter the back way!!!

 

Okay...so I have went from being perplexed, to satisfied, to angry then on to defensive and all from posting this one forum. Now I am just down right giddy from it. What a response to one post!!!

 

So here are my final thoughts. A GPS can only get you so far....then common sense must kick in....you stare at a GPS while walking and never look up...well come on....sooner or later you are gonna hit something. Here is what common sense would tell me.

 

Okay, you are driving down the coast hwy looking for a cache....we will call it the "bay ocean spit treasure" rated a 1/1 and doable anytime of the year. A kid friendly cache. So the GPS shows that it is a tenth of a mile west....now it is down to 400ft. west...then drops to 300ft.west and I tell my husband to stop, we are close...we get out of the car and we look around...the only thing between us and that cache is the frickin bay.... so what do I do? Well what do you think? We jump in the water, 12 year old and 1 yr. old in tow and swim 300 ft across in the 45 degree water!!!!!

 

hahaha NO!!! We realize that there must be another way around! Aha...common sense.

 

So here you go...you have a cache in a park, with a lake, with a garden and the GPS shows it is 200 ft east from your car which is on the hwy...So you pull up to a residence you get out of the car and that little bubble called common sense should pop up and say, wow this isn't a park, there isn't a picnic table and a garden, hmmmmmmm and this little so called geotrail....sure Candum..if you can make it through a raccoon trail, be my guest or maybe you should have thought...hmmm I need to go at this another way.

 

I have thought about going out and taking a video of my Moms property and walking around to show you all what this guy did, but I need to let this go. This turned into this whole huge she said he said and now I have felt that I had to archive my cache because of it. Isn't that how it goes???? Everything in our world that used to be fun is ruined or now illegal due to the irresponsible acts of a select few.

[+Kealia]

Great - everybody had thier say. Now where is that lock button....?

 

Sounds like a good time to take further discussions offline to me.

[+OienLabs]

Good story!

Is johnsquad a famous novellist?

Upset neighbor turns out to be MOM.

MOM joined GC very short time after johnsquad (no finds though) and now sounds as a seasoned Groundspeak member.

 

Many took the bait and I think johnsquad is sitting home laughing.

 

 

Edit: Too many typos - may be more.

Edited January 29, 2008 by baø

[+Peconic Bay Sailors]

This entire thread is a great example of why these types of caches are NOT A GOOD IDEA. There are too many unknowns.

The possiblity of getting a shotgun pointed at me is reason enough to not even attempt these types of caches.

 

From what I have read... there is nothing wrong with "this type of cache"...

There are litterally hundreds like this in NJ...

300' walk thru Private Property...

or .0.25 mi. walk thru the park...

 

GPS driving directions will bring you to the closest point...

It's common sense that there MUST be another way in,

unless it is "specifically stated on the cache page" that the private property owners permission has been given to traverse the property...

 

Rental homes do NOT constitute PUBLIC ACCESS...

[+OienLabs]

Is Ringbone out riding again?

[+Renegade Knight]

...Rental homes do NOT constitute PUBLIC ACCESS...

Depends on the location. Most rental communities have large common areas and large parking areas that are not gated .I'd not think twice about walking my dog, playing frisbee or cutting a corner to get to the quickie mart.

 

I'll have to get with the accused and see which cache this is. He says I found it but I can't recall it by looking a a list of common finds.

[+Peconic Bay Sailors]

...Rental homes do NOT constitute PUBLIC ACCESS...

Depends on the location. Most rental communities have large common areas and large parking areas that are not gated .I'd not think twice about walking my dog, playing frisbee or cutting a corner to get to the quickie mart.

 

I'll have to get with the accused and see which cache this is. He says I found it but I can't recall it by looking a a list of common finds.

 

They did state the property was posted... "No Trespassing"...

Irregardless... Rental properties, unless owned by municipality or state, and posted as PUBLIC USAGE...

Should always be assumed as being PRIVATE PROPERTY, and treated accordingly...

I don't care where it is located...

If there is any doubt... look for another access route...

Edited January 29, 2008 by Peconic Bay Sailors

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

I stand by my original answer. There was no reason to walk between two house and walk through the briars to try to reach the cache. Common sense should tell you that the cache hider would not walk through a briar thicket to hide it so there must be an easier way in, drive on around and find it.

The problem here is not the cache or the hider or even the neighbor, the trouble is cache seekers who don't think or can't be bothered to look a little harder for the right way in. There's no doubt in MY mind the seekers knew that wasn't the right way in but they decided to gamble that nobody was home and they could dash past the house, grab the find and begone without anyone knowing. And I'm willing to bet they've found plenty of others the same way and got away with it.

 

Personally I think alot of folks here owe the cache placer and her neighbor an apology.

[beachduo]

Folks, we LIKE geocachers...I figure at this juncture, a picture is worth a thousand words, so here they are. This is where they came through. The yellow building on the right is the front building which is a vacation rental, then as you walk back this is what you see, and this is where they went. The picture of the "brush" are the blackberry bushes. Beyond those is where the park is...located on another road and completely open from that other road.

 

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

That's what I loved about Oregon when I visted in January of 2000, the grass was green and lush, unlike here where it's brown and sometimes white in January.

That is a very tight fit through there, those guyus wern't expecting a briarthicket to slow down their cache and dash. At least Briars are tough, around here you can mow them down to the ground and they'll come right back up thicker then ever. Sorry they bothered you, but I really hope and think most geocachers would find a better way in.

[+Googling Hrpty Hrrs]

WOW! I can't believe all this. I'm the idiot or numbnuts or what ever names you guys have come up with. I'm glad Kit Fox had the decency to inform me that there was a thread a mile long bashing me for something that isn't even true. I don't know why Johnsquad made this up about us, except that maybe the neighbor exaggerated it to them. When I got the nasty harassing email Johnsquad sent me before they started this thread i thought they were kidding at first. I got upset when I realized they were serious. HOW DARE they slander us like this on here... and how dare most of you jump right in with the personal insults.

 

We did not cross or see any private property signs. We did not cross any chains. We did not cross any wheelchair ramps. If we did, we would have been idiots - but we didn't. I wonder how many of the people who have been ripping on us on this thread have been to this cache location or have read it before the hider updated the listing. It said nothing about private property at all.

 

Here is an honest description of finding this cache. We arrived at about noon and we parked in front of some cottages for rent. It doesn't look like a house, it is a business, like a hotel. We walked to the back between two of the cottages for rent. Now we were behind one of the cottages next to a bunch of blackberries about 45 feet from the cache. There was a geotrail going through the blackberries to the park. Dogs were barking like crazy but we ignored them because the cache description said we should. We started across the trail through the blackberries toward the park and the neighbor lady opened her window and told us the cache was in the park and we were on private property. We felt embarrassed and we apologized and left. Then we found the route to drive around to the park and found the cache.

 

I said "whoops, oh well" in my hide description because I didn't think it was a big deal, especially because this looks like a hotel and has a sign out front and everything. If it appeared to be a residence it would have been different.

 

I was really surprised as I read through this thread to see how many people resorted to personal insults about me. Some one even made fun of my status as a military police officer. Wow. You'd think an MP would know better than to do all the things Johnsquad accused me of and you would be right.

 

Thank you to the few people who read this complaint and then read the cache description and the past logs and realized I probably wasn't in the wrong. It's amazing how fast people will judge some one.

 

OK, now we have two sides. If there was no house, no gate, no driveway and no sign then a lot of us should eat some crow. I'll start. Yuk...I prefer chicken.

 

"If" being the key word. I think the property owner sounds more credible. I mean, how can one look at those pictures and think this isn't private property?

 

Even without parking cords I wouldn't find any fault with this cache owner.

 

If someone drives to within a few feet of a cache, but the "real" route is a park entrance 2 miles away, then a 2 mile hike, if you are sitting there with a basic GPS that tells you nothing other than the cache is right there, what are your realistic options?

 

go home, or walk towards the cache.

 

I put the logical answer in bold.

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

I liked the part where they said HOW DARE they slander us like this on here

I mean really, like there's really anything people wouldn't dare to say on the Internet.

[+Mr. & Mrs. Kensquach]

Jounsquad,

I see that you have found 60 and hidden 2 caches. Over time with this game you find caches in people yards. This is commonly done at a cachers reidences so when cords apear to be on or near PP, cachers will generaly go for it! With the use of pocket queries people, myself included may not read the write up until the cache is logged on the web. Often times I will only look at the write up on site if I need a hint. Early on this would would have bugged me to but over time I have come to except that this is a game, for fun, and does not deserve this much attention.

The cacher in question is a friend of mine and an honerable guy to boot and I don't feel that he deserves this kind of bashing here in the forums.

Ken

[+Peconic Bay Sailors]

Looking at the pictures...

It's a no brainer...

look for another access route...

DUH!!!

Edited January 30, 2008 by Peconic Bay Sailors

[+DrAwKwArD]

Folks, we LIKE geocachers...I figure at this juncture, a picture is worth a thousand words, so here they are. This is where they came through. The yellow building on the right is the front building which is a vacation rental, then as you walk back this is what you see, and this is where they went. The picture of the "brush" are the blackberry bushes. Beyond those is where the park is...located on another road and completely open from that other road.

 

What part of private property did they not understand??

 

Perhaps you need to paint your rental a brighter shade of yellow?

[+DrAwKwArD]

This is commonly done at a cachers reidences so when cords apear to be on or near PP, cachers will generaly go for it!

Ken,

 

This is exactly the kind of thing that will get geocaching banned. Bad news, bro.

[+johnsquad]

Jounsquad,

I see that you have found 60 and hidden 2 caches. Over time with this game you find caches in people yards. This is commonly done at a cachers reidences so when cords apear to be on or near PP, cachers will generaly go for it! With the use of pocket queries people, myself included may not read the write up until the cache is logged on the web. Often times I will only look at the write up on site if I need a hint. Early on this would would have bugged me to but over time I have come to except that this is a game, for fun, and does not deserve this much attention.

The cacher in question is a friend of mine and an honerable guy to boot and I don't feel that he deserves this kind of bashing here in the forums.

Ken

 

Then why are you giving it any of your attention Mr Kensquach??? Maybe you should reread what just my posts said. I don't believe I was bashing, it was my topic and I am stating the facts that occured and have the pictures as the proof to back it up. Anyone who caches on private property are taking chances that I don't care to take and don't participate in!!!

[+ReadyOrNot]

From what I have read... there is nothing wrong with "this type of cache"...

 

I didn't say I thought any type of cache should not be allowed... But common sense is required from both sides, the hider and the finder. I recently found a cache that was in a park, but we looked for 20 minutes and could not find any way into the park (undeveloped), except going through someone's yard to retrieve the cache. I was on a cache machine at the time. I personally did not go through the person's yard, but I'm sure 50 others did. Both the hider and the seekers should take equal responsibility for it.

[+Mr. & Mrs. Kensquach]

This is commonly done at a cachers reidences so when cords apear to be on or near PP, cachers will generaly go for it!

Ken,

 

This is exactly the kind of thing that will get geocaching banned. Bad news, bro.

 

This is why I don't have a cache in my yard much to Mrs. K's disgust. I am starting to think of this thread as a wonderful work of fiction!

[+zoltig]

Folks, we LIKE geocachers...I figure at this juncture, a picture is worth a thousand words, so here they are. This is where they came through. The yellow building on the right is the front building which is a vacation rental, then as you walk back this is what you see, and this is where they went. The picture of the "brush" are the blackberry bushes. Beyond those is where the park is...located on another road and completely open from that other road.

 

Great job posting pictures in the forums, beachduo! I know a lot of "seasoned" cachers who get flustered trying to get pictures to appear in the threads!

[+DrAwKwArD]

This is why I don't have a cache in my yard much to Mrs. K's disgust. I am starting to think of this thread as a wonderful work of fiction!

I see.

 

You raise a valid point about caches placed on private property with permission from the owner. Since this type of cache DOES exist, then yes, it sounds logical to think that a cache pointing to someone's yard would conceivably be this type. But simply reading the cache description would reveal if it was a cacher's property or something else entirely. In this case words such as "public parking" and "bring your family and your pets" in the cache description would seal the deal.

[+salmondan]

YOU miss the point. This is where YOU think they came through. THEY said they did not cross a chain. Likely they came in another way. YOU clearly state you did not see them come in and were surprised by their arrival. I have no reason to believe they are lying (why the heck would they?) I have no reason to believe you are lying (same rhetorical question). YOU think it was plain as day which way they should have come in, and that they were knowingly cutting corners attempting to cross private property. THEY think they were entering in the manner they had been invited to. Private property caches happen all the time, all those dang lamppost micros in parking lots are example of caches on private property.

Drop it. Both of you. And all the rest of us. It is a misunderstanding. All parties are at fault, none are at fault. As Mr. K said, it's a game- both parties offended each other in a way that neither intended and is not in the spirit of our game.

Let's all be more careful in the future. When caching. And placing.

 

Folks, we LIKE geocachers...I figure at this juncture, a picture is worth a thousand words, so here they are. This is where they came through. The yellow building on the right is the front building which is a vacation rental, then as you walk back this is what you see, and this is where they went. The picture of the "brush" are the blackberry bushes. Beyond those is where the park is...located on another road and completely open from that other road.

 

[beachduo]

YOU miss the point. This is where YOU think they came through. THEY said they did not cross a chain. Likely they came in another way. YOU clearly state you did not see them come in and were surprised by their arrival. I have no reason to believe they are lying (why the heck would they?) I have no reason to believe

 

No, you need to go read my first post where I stated that I saw their car, saw them get out, saw them approach...was not going to answer my door..but they did not come to my door.....I watched out front...knew they had went between the buildings.....then finally saw them in my back yard. I doubt they CLIMBED the guesthouse.....so that leaves the ramp. NO WAY around the chain except opening, over or under. They DID lie, out and out. I know what I saw...as I was watching it all.

 

I don't understand what part of this some of you don't GET!!!!! I am SO through with this. Next time I won't be so nice as to tell them where they need to be, next time.....well, take a guess what will happen NEXT time!! You can call us what you want.....it won't change what WAS.

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Next time I won't be so nice as to tell them where they need to be, next time.....well, take a guess what will happen NEXT time!!

WOW! So what you got out of all this is that you should threaten future finders who don't approach the way you want them to?

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

Folks, we LIKE geocachers...I figure at this juncture, a picture is worth a thousand words, so here they are. This is where they came through. The yellow building on the right is the front building which is a vacation rental, then as you walk back this is what you see, and this is where they went. The picture of the "brush" are the blackberry bushes. Beyond those is where the park is...located on another road and completely open from that other road.

 

Great job posting pictures in the forums, beachduo! I know a lot of "seasoned" cachers who get flustered trying to get pictures to appear in the threads!

 

Which means what? I had no problem at all posting pictures here when I started because this is not the first Forum I've frequented, after ten years on the net you do learn a few things you can carry from one site to the next.

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

YOU miss the point. This is where YOU think they came through. THEY said they did not cross a chain. Likely they came in another way. YOU clearly state you did not see them come in and were surprised by their arrival. I have no reason to believe they are lying (why the heck would they?) I have no reason to believe you are lying (same rhetorical question). YOU think it was plain as day which way they should have come in, and that they were knowingly cutting corners attempting to cross private property. THEY think they were entering in the manner they had been invited to. Private property caches happen all the time, all those dang lamppost micros in parking lots are example of caches on private property.

Drop it. Both of you. And all the rest of us. It is a misunderstanding. All parties are at fault, none are at fault. As Mr. K said, it's a game- both parties offended each other in a way that neither intended and is not in the spirit of our game.

Let's all be more careful in the future. When caching. And placing.

 

 

As the person who witnessed it her opinion carries considerable weight, yours does not.

Lots of fine decent people do dumb things, those with integrity ask what they can do to correct the mistake, the rest claim it wasn't their fault, it was no big deal, you are over reacting, etc.

They were wrong plain and simple, there is no excuse or justification for it. It doesn't matter how many private property caches there are, this was obviously not one of them. Failure to read the cache page before looking does not grant you special immunity for tresspassing, and they should be here thanking her for not calling the cops on them instead of asking their friends to stick up for them.

[+Cpt.Blackbeard]

Next time I won't be so nice as to tell them where they need to be, next time.....well, take a guess what will happen NEXT time!!

WOW! So what you got out of all this is that you should threaten future finders who don't approach the way you want them to?

 

Come on Rambler, you know better. She was well within her rights to call the cops on them and if they had trampled the briars she may even have managed to get them for damages. A home owner doesn't have to make threats while the phone still works.