I've waited long enough

[+SnoWake]

 

I tried the POI method, using a GSAK macro that Red90 pointed me to that splits out a GSAK db into CSV files, one for each cache type. With corresponding bitmap images for the cache types, I loaded them up in my 400t and they showed up nicely on the screen ...

 

 

I'm having trouble finding that specific macro - as well as understanding how you're sending POIs from GSAK?

 

But, staying on topic to this thread - I'll leave the other for the GSAK forums -

 

What bitmap images are you using - and how? I've also got the 'custom icons' (sent to the unit with xImage, and also installed/configured in GSAK). Are you talking about the same images/configuration? Again, the only way I can "talk" to the device seems to be with MapSource. When it's attached via USB, and goes into mass storage mode - GSAK doesn't seem to recognize it?

 

I'm off to install the Garmin Custom POI Loader - though it seems unlikely this is how you loaded your POIs?

 

Thanks!

 

EDIT: Disregard! I found the macro, AND the icons, AND the POI loader... I just pushed over 21K custom POIs to the unit. So - now I've got caches as geocaches, waypoints, AND Points of Interest!

Edited January 19, 2008 by SnoWake

[+nicolo]

 

I tried the POI method, using a GSAK macro that Red90 pointed me to that splits out a GSAK db into CSV files, one for each cache type. With corresponding bitmap images for the cache types, I loaded them up in my 400t and they showed up nicely on the screen ...

 

 

I'm having trouble finding that specific macro - as well as understanding how you're sending POIs from GSAK?

 

But, staying on topic to this thread - I'll leave the other for the GSAK forums -

 

What bitmap images are you using - and how? I've also got the 'custom icons' (sent to the unit with xImage, and also installed/configured in GSAK). Are you talking about the same images/configuration? Again, the only way I can "talk" to the device seems to be with MapSource. When it's attached via USB, and goes into mass storage mode - GSAK doesn't seem to recognize it?

 

I'm off to install the Garmin Custom POI Loader - though it seems unlikely this is how you loaded your POIs?

 

Thanks!

 

EDIT: Disregard! I found the macro, AND the icons, AND the POI loader... I just pushed over 21K custom POIs to the unit. So - now I've got caches as geocaches, waypoints, AND Points of Interest!

Good to see you found it. Yes, POI loader is how I loaded my POIs.

 

GSAK thread

Edited January 19, 2008 by nicolo

[+nicolo]

...

Waypoints and POIs are the same to me since I've been using an eXplorist for the last year. Anyway, I loaded the GPX file into mapsource and sent them to the unit that way. I just downloaded the custom POI loader from Garmin's site so maybe I'll make my own icons.

Just use the GSAK macro that I've mentioned in post #52, it has the icons that you need and, for now, seem to be THE way to see caches on your Colorado. As a nice feature, when you hover over a "POI geocache" you get the caching name, type, difficulty, terrain, and GC code :

 

 

Garmin's website seems very behind on the Colorado...I tried to register my unit but the site said the serial number was invalid. The Colorado is not listed in any of their categories for support questions either.

Yeah, I tried that as well earlier this evening, no joy. Those boys are definitely behind.

 

BTW, where is the serial # on these units, I can only seem to get the Unit id.

Edited January 19, 2008 by nicolo

[+Cacheoholic]

From Garmin website, Colorado 300 - "Built-in memory: 384 MB"

[QuigleyJones]

BTW, where is the serial # on these units, I can only seem to get the Unit id.

It right there

[+Team GPSaxophone]

So, I've dumped GPX files onto the unit (I pushed my entire GSAK NotFound database from the Bay Area <-> Tahoe: ~11K caches) - and the unit continued to function, albeit... S-L-O-W-L-Y.

 

So, I pared it down to just a "close" filter - e.g., < 1000 caches, similar to the waypoint dataset size I would typically push to my 60CSx. The unit seems a bit more responsive, but still sluggish. Of course, caches show up under "Geocaching", but not as waypoints, on the map.

 

The only way I've been able to get waypoints to the unit is using Garmin's MapSource - but this has limitations. For starters, the caches are named by their GC waypoint ID, rather than the 'SmartName'. Also, as noted, I'm having trouble getting them (the waypoints) to show on various zoom levels (e.g. all).

 

Despite these troubles - so far, so good!

I read somewhere that if you set the device to display waypoints at 500 miles (or less) rather than auto, it will display the waypoints on your map. Still no cure for the geocaches in gpx files though.

[+benh57]

 

Whoa--the 400t has more than 1GB of internal memory??

 

The Garmin site still just says "yes" on the "Internal memory" line of the specs. Very helpful. :-)

 

 

It has 4GB and just under 3GB is used by the topo maps - so a little over 1GB internal memory free.

 

That's not 'internal memory'. That is your memory card. Colorado has 384MB of internal memory, and a memory card slot which you have a 4GB card in.

 

-Ben

[+g-o-cashers]

\

That's not 'internal memory'. That is your memory card. Colorado has 384MB of internal memory, and a memory card slot which you have a 4GB card in.

 

-Ben

 

The 400t has 4GB of internal memory with no SD card installed. With topo maps preinstalled there is about 1GB of free memory. An SD card would provide additional removable storage beyond this. Not sure about the 300 but I wish some one would post that information as well.

 

GO$Rs

[+IndyJpr]

...........

Edited January 19, 2008 by IndyJpr

[+IndyJpr]

That's not 'internal memory'. That is your memory card. Colorado has 384MB of internal memory, and a memory card slot which you have a 4GB card in.

 

Well, I wish I had a 4GB card.... actually I have NO card in the unit.

 

As I - and others - have noted, the 400t has 4GB internal, most of which is taken up by the topo maps.

[+nicolo]

BTW, where is the serial # on these units, I can only seem to get the Unit id.

It right there

 

Yeah, I tried that number when trying to register my 400t - the Garmin utility said that it was invalid. Have you tried registering it or loading keyed maps on the unit?

[+apersson850]

It has been said many times on this forum already, but here we go again:

 

The internal flash memory drive in the 300 isn't as large as in the 400 versions, as the 300 doesn't have any pre-loaded map.

But the 300 has about 384 MB available to the user, for maps, track archives, geocache files etc.

Then you can add an SD-card for further memory expansion.

[moonpup]

It has been said many times on this forum already, but here we go again:

 

The internal flash memory drive in the 300 isn't as large as in the 400 versions, as the 300 doesn't have any pre-loaded map.

But the 300 has about 384 MB available to the user, for maps, track archives, geocache files etc.

Then you can add an SD-card for further memory expansion.

 

Can someone answer me this?? If the pre-loaded topo maps on the 400T are from the Topo 2008 DVD(same maps), then why on my 60CSx do I have the complete Topo 2008 DVD loaded for all of the United States and even all of CityNavNT 2008 for all of the United states and my mapset in Mapsource shows a total of 550 map segments and about 1.4GB in space for both topo and citynavnt???

 

So how do the pre-loaded maps on the 400T take almost 3GB?? Am I missing something here if I can fit all of this on my 2GB card in my 60CSx??? Something doesn't sound right. Did the person who posted the screenshot add a large amount of data to the gps after the fact? Does the large size come from the shading effects?

Edited January 20, 2008 by moonpup

[+Team GPSaxophone]

It has been said many times on this forum already, but here we go again:

 

The internal flash memory drive in the 300 isn't as large as in the 400 versions, as the 300 doesn't have any pre-loaded map.

But the 300 has about 384 MB available to the user, for maps, track archives, geocache files etc.

Then you can add an SD-card for further memory expansion.

 

Can someone answer me this?? If the pre-loaded topo maps on the 400T are from the Topo 2008 DVD(same maps), then why on my 60CSx do I have the complete Topo 2008 DVD loaded for all of the United States and even all of CityNavNT 2008 for all of the United states and my mapset in Mapsource shows a total of 550 map segments and about 1.4GB in space for both topo and citynavnt???

 

So how do the pre-loaded maps on the 400T take almost 3GB?? Am I missing something here if I can fit all of this on my 2GB card in my 60CSx??? Something doesn't sound right. Did the person who posted the screenshot add a large amount of data to the gps after the fact? Does the large size come from the shading effects?

The 400t out of the box has about 1GB of free space out of a total of nearly 4GB. That means it has nearly 3GB of maps and other stuff loaded on it at the factory. Perhaps 2GB of that are the maps and the other ~1GB other OS files and features.

[+Marky]

Can someone answer me this?? If the pre-loaded topo maps on the 400T are from the Topo 2008 DVD(same maps), then why on my 60CSx do I have the complete Topo 2008 DVD loaded for all of the United States and even all of CityNavNT 2008 for all of the United states and my mapset in Mapsource shows a total of 550 map segments and about 1.4GB in space for both topo and citynavnt???

I don't have a good answer, except that the Topo 2008 in the 400T has the DEM information, which probably wouldn't get put into the 60CSx. This is a total guess on my part.

 

--Marky

[+Klatch]

It has been said many times on this forum already, but here we go again:

 

The internal flash memory drive in the 300 isn't as large as in the 400 versions, as the 300 doesn't have any pre-loaded map.

But the 300 has about 384 MB available to the user, for maps, track archives, geocache files etc.

Then you can add an SD-card for further memory expansion.

 

Can someone answer me this?? If the pre-loaded topo maps on the 400T are from the Topo 2008 DVD(same maps), then why on my 60CSx do I have the complete Topo 2008 DVD loaded for all of the United States and even all of CityNavNT 2008 for all of the United states and my mapset in Mapsource shows a total of 550 map segments and about 1.4GB in space for both topo and citynavnt???

 

So how do the pre-loaded maps on the 400T take almost 3GB?? Am I missing something here if I can fit all of this on my 2GB card in my 60CSx??? Something doesn't sound right. Did the person who posted the screenshot add a large amount of data to the gps after the fact? Does the large size come from the shading effects?

Are you sure you have all the Topo 2008 for the United States loaded? I am showing 5164 map segments just for the continental U.S.

Edit to add: (and a little over 3.1 GB just for Topo 2008.)

Edited January 20, 2008 by Klatch

[moonpup]

Are you sure you have all the Topo 2008 for the United States loaded? I am showing 5164 map segments just for the continental U.S.

Edit to add: (and a little over 3.1 GB just for Topo 2008.)

 

That's interesting, after hooking up my 60CSx and loading the mapset to Mapsource it showed the continental US topo map segments selected. At that point, I dragged my mouse across the US again selecting all the map segments, this time Mapsource showed over the 5000 segments as you have stated. I wonder what I missed the first time around??

[+SnoWake]

On a similar, related note:

 

The biggest limitation I encountered, map-wise, on the 60CSx was not that of storage SIZE - but rather, number of map files. I don't remember the exact limitation off the top of my head - but with and earlier version of City Navigator (not NT) and the old Garmin Topo maps - I ran into the FILE limitation (I believe it was a little over 2000 - but not a nice, round 2048?) before I hit the space constraints of my microSD card.

 

I don't know how many specific files comprise the built-in Topo2008 maps - but between that, and the big chunk of CN2008 that I've got loaded - I'm guessing they've worked around that. Being an old-school UNIX guy, when I experienced the first limit, I couldn't help but think:

 

They need to up the file descriptors (fdlimit) :-)

 

Another tangent:

 

Has anyone noticed, or NOT noticed - any direct correlation to the amount of data loaded (e.g. City Navigator) and the response time of related functions (e.g. "Find -> Food and Drink" or "Address search", etc)? I seemed to experience this problem in the 60CSx when having a HUGE dataset loaded - which led me to the practice (as described by someone in another thread) of "just loading my home turf" by default ('home turf' being defined as CA, NV, OR, WA - both CN2008 and Topo) - and then loading specific mapsets when I travel out of state/country.

Edited January 20, 2008 by SnoWake

[+SnoWake]

 

Yeah, I tried that as well earlier this evening, no joy. Those boys are definitely behind.

 

BTW, where is the serial # on these units, I can only seem to get the Unit id.

 

Interesting: I registered, using that number, without incident. Well -- or so I thought!

 

I just logged into "MyGarmin" - and while the new Colorado is shown on the right under "Registered Products" - suddenly, all of my previous units are gone. Hmmm... ?

[Barrikady]

 

I don't know how many specific files comprise the built-in Topo2008 maps - but between that, and the big chunk of CN2008 that I've got loaded - I'm guessing they've worked around that.

 

Here is info regarding the Topo 2008 DVD:

 

The Topo 2008 DVD contains 6,633 mapsets. The average map size 0.6 MB. The DVD contains 3,995 MB of data. The lower 48 states and Hawaii are 5,213 mapsets at 3,148 MB's; Alaska is 1,420 mapsets at 847 MB's.

[jcc123]

Another question I have concerning the internal vs external is how fast is it to load maps into the 4GB internal memory of the 400t? Is it slow like the 60CSx???

 

If it's still slow like the 60CSx then I rather get the 300 and use the money saved to buy an external 4GB card. This way I can use the card in a card reader for some fast transfer of maps to memory.

 

Finally, does it help to get an expensive and fast SD card? Even if I get one, will it be as fast as having the internal memory like the 400t?

Edited January 20, 2008 by jcc123

[+Team GPSaxophone]

When I turn on the unit, the longest part of the boot sequence is "loading maps". I think it is exceptionally slow and has at times locked up on me (or it took so long that I thought it locked up). The only cure was to remove and reinstall the batteries and try booting again.

 

I don't think the unit should load those maps before it allows you to look at the menus on the unit. What if I didn't turn it on to navigate somewhere but to read a cache page or change the settings? The maps should load in the background so you can still use the device. I'm sure the compass doesn't take that long to load, so why not allow you to use the compass when you first turn it on and when the maps are loaded let you go from there? On older units (the Legend) you could turn it on and go right to any screen you wanted after just a few seconds. You couldn't navigate until it had satellite lock, but at least you could access the menus until it did.

[+SnoWake]

When I turn on the unit, the longest part of the boot sequence is "loading maps". I think it is exceptionally slow and has at times locked up on me (or it took so long that I thought it locked up). The only cure was to remove and reinstall the batteries and try booting again.

 

I don't think the unit should load those maps before it allows you to look at the menus on the unit. What if I didn't turn it on to navigate somewhere but to read a cache page or change the settings? The maps should load in the background so you can still use the device. I'm sure the compass doesn't take that long to load, so why not allow you to use the compass when you first turn it on and when the maps are loaded let you go from there? On older units (the Legend) you could turn it on and go right to any screen you wanted after just a few seconds. You couldn't navigate until it had satellite lock, but at least you could access the menus until it did.

 

I couldn't agree with you more - but I'll add the following observations/perspectives.

 

Not to defend the current behavior, but its likely a by-product of when, given the current architecture, the maps NEED to load (at startup time). Your point and suggestions are well-founded, and we've wrestled with the same problems at work, sometimes:

 

Can't we display the basic portal application to our customers, once they've logged in - while we're off fetching their specific usage and payment information? Why make them wait - while displaying "Accessing your personal information - please standby". If designed correctly (assuming user experience is your top priority - which, clearly, in not always the case) - You would provide the basic user interface, and continue loading maps/waypoints/etc in the background - only causing the user to wait if they tried to immediately go to one of those functions/displays.

 

Problem is - things are often built for optimal machine efficiency: E.G. "Well, of course they have to wait - because we need to initialize all the maps BEFORE we start acquiring satellites, all before the user can actually navigate somewhere".

 

So - we provide our feedback to Garmin, and let them know what is important to us. With regards to the L-O-N-G overall startup time, it's already been said by others, but...

 

I'm willing to live with this, and consider other fixes a priority. The good news is - you only suffer this penalty occasionally - perhaps as infrequently as only once, at the beginning of a caching session or navigation to a location. I, too, want a shorter startup time - but, IMHO, this is less critical on a device like a GPSr (perhaps just need to establish a routine where I turn on the GPSr, THEN fasten my seat belt, start the car, and... by the time I'm at the end of the street, I should be good to go). Conversely, on devices like a digital camera, where timing can be critical - I consider this a purchase-influencing factor.

 

It sure would be nice if, for example, you have a BUNCH of maps loaded (because you CAN) - but the unit would only 'index' / load (whatever is causing the time penalty at startup) the map sets that you have selected as active. I've already confirmed (by deselecting all maps) that this is NOT currently the case.

[+Team GPSaxophone]

IMHO, startup should give you immediate access to menus. The maps should be broken down into smaller files if that's what's keeping them from loading faster. The older units had no problems showing your last known position until you got satellite lock.

 

I'm still not able to navigate using routes, it tells me there are no roads near my starting location even if the cursor is directly on a road, and it doesn't matter if I'm using the Automotive profile or geocaching.

[+apersson850]

The older units didn't do near as much whilst booting as they do now.

 

You can't use autorouting unless you have maps like City Navigator.

[+Barefoot One & Wench]

I have a question about loading additional map sets on top of the already installed Topo maps in the 400t. Can you load your own selected county maps from your your state or adjoining states into the 400t with the topo maps already installed as the base map? I'm using Map Source City Select in my PC now and thats the map sets I have selected to use in my Garmin GPS V. I hope I've explained myself correctly .

Any advice will be greatly appreciated,

Barefoot One & Wench

[+IndyJpr]

I have a question about loading additional map sets on top of the already installed Topo maps in the 400t. Can you load your own selected county maps from your your state or adjoining states into the 400t with the topo maps already installed as the base map? I'm using Map Source City Select in my PC now and thats the map sets I have selected to use in my Garmin GPS V. I hope I've explained myself correctly .

Any advice will be greatly appreciated,

Barefoot One & Wench

 

If you're asking whether the Topos will overlay nicely on your City Select maps so that you will now have contours, etc. ON your City Select maps - the answer is no.

 

One will be on top of - and block the view - of the other. You would have to use the "Select Maps" menu to turn off the top one to see the other.

 

Hope that helps.

[Source_GPS]

Sno,

 

Not to deviate from the topic, however you can accomplish the background loading by compartmentalizing the application over a distributed architecture. The easiest and most primative example of this is using frames within a browser - each frame loads a separate page, which in turn is processing data from a different location but all displayed in a central location. Using java or flash could also empower one to provide similar results.

 

I think what we'll see over the next 12 months is a refinement of these bugs (or "undocumented features") based on user feedback. Like new cars, they're trying to push the latest and greatest to the market first without ample time to properly refine them. Some say never buy the first model anything (or anything built on Monday or Friday). I say, I don't mind being the Beta tester.

Edited January 20, 2008 by Source_GPS

[+Cacheoholic]

Many are complaining about the boot up time of the Colorado. Since this is identical to the nuvi (I measured about 38 seconds on one of mine) I’m convinced the operating systems are very similar. The nuvi series has been released for awhile and gone through some firmware updates but still exhibits the same issue. I’m making my prediction that this is an unsolvable issue without a hardware renovation. So what I’m saying is, “Get used to it.” Here’s something to try. A nuvi can take 2 – 3 minutes to search through all 6 or 7 million points of interest for a specific point of interest. If anyone has all of CNNANT (City Navigator North America NT) 2008 loaded on a Colorado try searching through all POI’s for a specific POI by spelling. I’m willing to bet you’ll see the same behavior as the nuvi. Welcome to the next generation of Garmin GPSr’s.

[+Team GPSaxophone]

The older units didn't do near as much whilst booting as they do now.

 

You can't use autorouting unless you have maps like City Navigator.

What about DeLorme maps? Is there a list somewhere of which maps I can load on the Colorado? I didn't realize I'd have to buy something else to use autorouting.

[Barrikady]

The older units didn't do near as much whilst booting as they do now.

 

You can't use autorouting unless you have maps like City Navigator.

What about DeLorme maps? Is there a list somewhere of which maps I can load on the Colorado? I didn't realize I'd have to buy something else to use autorouting.

You are limited to certain maps made by Garmin.

 

If you are interested in routable road maps of North America, you would want to consider Garmin Mapsource City Navigator NT. It can be had for around $120. Here is info provided by GPSNow

[+nicolo]

The older units didn't do near as much whilst booting as they do now.

 

You can't use autorouting unless you have maps like City Navigator.

What about DeLorme maps? Is there a list somewhere of which maps I can load on the Colorado? I didn't realize I'd have to buy something else to use autorouting.

You are limited to certain maps made by Garmin.

 

If you are interested in routable road maps of North America, you would want to consider Garmin Mapsource City Navigator NT. It can be had for around $120. Here is info provided by GPSNow

Topo Canada should also work as well. It's routable on the 60xxx GPSrs.

[+Barefoot One & Wench]

I have a question about loading additional map sets on top of the already installed Topo maps in the 400t. Can you load your own selected county maps from your your state or adjoining states into the 400t with the topo maps already installed as the base map? I'm using Map Source City Select in my PC now and thats the map sets I have selected to use in my Garmin GPS V. I hope I've explained myself correctly .

Any advice will be greatly appreciated,

Barefoot One & Wench

 

If you're asking whether the Topos will overlay nicely on your City Select maps so that you will now have contours, etc. ON your City Select maps - the answer is no.

 

One will be on top of - and block the view - of the other. You would have to use the "Select Maps" menu to turn off the top one to see the other.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Thanks IndyJpr,

Your explanation makes sense, but what I wanted to say and did not state properly is the following. The way I have my old Garmin GPS V set-up is with the county's that I cache in loaded into the V and these are county's selected from my City Select maps. I misstated what I want to do when I get the 400t. I was thinking that with the county's I have set-up with the City Select I could overlay this onto the TOPO in the 400t and still retain my current selection of county's that are in my GPS V. Tell me if I'm thinking correctly, I would already have all the county's on the TOPO map set that is already installed in the 400t and then when I import my Waypoints(Caches) they would be on the maps. I guess my confusion is with the fact I have always used City Select maps for caching and have never used TOPO maps in my GPS V. Another question, will the TOPO map set do me as well as the City Select maps for caching especially when I'm Caching in urban or near urban areas for street locations? I'm just trying to get my mind wrapped around the 400t to see what I need it to do for me.

Lastly with all the chatter about the 400t's short falls and lacking necessary firmware updates at this point in time it may be awhile till I purchase one to give Garmin a chance to catch up. The one crazy thing that I see is that no Geocache icons appear on the map, you have to POI them, strange that Garmin would overlook this basic option.

I hope this jumble makes sense so someone can put me straight .

Thanks,

Barefoot One & Wench

[+SnoWake]

 

Thanks IndyJpr,

Your explanation makes sense, but what I wanted to say and did not state properly is the following. The way I have my old Garmin GPS V set-up is with the county's that I cache in loaded into the V and these are county's selected from my City Select maps. I misstated what I want to do when I get the 400t. I was thinking that with the county's I have set-up with the City Select I could overlay this onto the TOPO in the 400t and still retain my current selection of county's that are in my GPS V. Tell me if I'm thinking correctly, I would already have all the county's on the TOPO map set that is already installed in the 400t and then when I import my Waypoints(Caches) they would be on the maps. I guess my confusion is with the fact I have always used City Select maps for caching and have never used TOPO maps in my GPS V. Another question, will the TOPO map set do me as well as the City Select maps for caching especially when I'm Caching in urban or near urban areas for street locations? I'm just trying to get my mind wrapped around the 400t to see what I need it to do for me.

 

I'm still not QUITE sure I exactly follow - but, if I'm understanding you, I think the answer is "yes":

 

The 400t will have the entire US topo maps, pre-loaded. So - if you added your City Select maps into the unit, as well - you would have both available to you, and be able to switch between them, depending on your purposes.

 

To your second question: I definitely use the City Navigator maps most often, but it's not at all unusual for me to toggle over to look at to Topo map if I'm out on a hike, and terrain may be relevant. This was even with the old Topo maps, prior to the DEM shading - which, as I've noted elsewhere, I think makes a HUGE difference on the usability / information conveyed by the map. So - you might still use your City Select maps for most of your caching - but (at least with a 400t), you'll always have those topo maps available. This may be a pro, or a con, depending on your perspective and use cases.

 

Lastly with all the chatter about the 400t's short falls and lacking necessary firmware updates at this point in time it may be awhile till I purchase one to give Garmin a chance to catch up. The one crazy thing that I see is that no Geocache icons appear on the map, you have to POI them, strange that Garmin would overlook this basic option.

I hope this jumble makes sense so someone can put me straight .

Thanks,

Barefoot One & Wench

 

Well, I am convinced, at this point, that Garmin will release multiple firmware updates in the not-distant future - just based on past experience. However - if you're in no hurry to get a new unit, you can certainly just "wait and see" what happens. I was perfectly content with my 60CSx - but couldn't WAIT to get my hands on this new unit, and put it through its paces.

 

One final point: There IS a workaround that allows geocaches to be seen on the map - at least when they're sent as waypoints. No need to do the POI thing - though I've definitely been experimenting with every possible way to send data to the unit.

 

That is - until I encounter somebody else holding one, and finally try the "wireless transfer" bit.

 

I'm learning more by the minute.

[+Barefoot One & Wench]

 

Thanks IndyJpr,

Your explanation makes sense, but what I wanted to say and did not state properly is the following. The way I have my old Garmin GPS V set-up is with the county's that I cache in loaded into the V and these are county's selected from my City Select maps. I misstated what I want to do when I get the 400t. I was thinking that with the county's I have set-up with the City Select I could overlay this onto the TOPO in the 400t and still retain my current selection of county's that are in my GPS V. Tell me if I'm thinking correctly, I would already have all the county's on the TOPO map set that is already installed in the 400t and then when I import my Waypoints(Caches) they would be on the maps. I guess my confusion is with the fact I have always used City Select maps for caching and have never used TOPO maps in my GPS V. Another question, will the TOPO map set do me as well as the City Select maps for caching especially when I'm Caching in urban or near urban areas for street locations? I'm just trying to get my mind wrapped around the 400t to see what I need it to do for me.

 

I'm still not QUITE sure I exactly follow - but, if I'm understanding you, I think the answer is "yes":

 

The 400t will have the entire US topo maps, pre-loaded. So - if you added your City Select maps into the unit, as well - you would have both available to you, and be able to switch between them, depending on your purposes.

 

To your second question: I definitely use the City Navigator maps most often, but it's not at all unusual for me to toggle over to look at to Topo map if I'm out on a hike, and terrain may be relevant. This was even with the old Topo maps, prior to the DEM shading - which, as I've noted elsewhere, I think makes a HUGE difference on the usability / information conveyed by the map. So - you might still use your City Select maps for most of your caching - but (at least with a 400t), you'll always have those topo maps available. This may be a pro, or a con, depending on your perspective and use cases.

 

Lastly with all the chatter about the 400t's short falls and lacking necessary firmware updates at this point in time it may be awhile till I purchase one to give Garmin a chance to catch up. The one crazy thing that I see is that no Geocache icons appear on the map, you have to POI them, strange that Garmin would overlook this basic option.

I hope this jumble makes sense so someone can put me straight .

Thanks,

Barefoot One & Wench

 

Well, I am convinced, at this point, that Garmin will release multiple firmware updates in the not-distant future - just based on past experience. However - if you're in no hurry to get a new unit, you can certainly just "wait and see" what happens. I was perfectly content with my 60CSx - but couldn't WAIT to get my hands on this new unit, and put it through its paces.

 

One final point: There IS a workaround that allows geocaches to be seen on the map - at least when they're sent as waypoints. No need to do the POI thing - though I've definitely been experimenting with every possible way to send data to the unit.

 

That is - until I encounter somebody else holding one, and finally try the "wireless transfer" bit.

 

I'm learning more by the minute.

 

SnoWake,

I think the light is seeping in, thank you. So the 400t will hold both types of map sets TOPO and City Select and you can just switch them back and forth to which one you want to use. I suppose this would eat up most of the internal memory and I wonder how much memory would be left for Waypoints and Cache pages. Although if you put an SD card in you would be able to regain a lot of memory, if I'm understanding how the memory works.

I suppose by the time I'm ready to buy the 400t with all this education from people like you I might be able to operate it.

Thanks to SnoWake and IndyJpr for their help .

Barefoot One & Wench

[+Team GPSaxophone]

The older units didn't do near as much whilst booting as they do now.

 

You can't use autorouting unless you have maps like City Navigator.

What about DeLorme maps? Is there a list somewhere of which maps I can load on the Colorado? I didn't realize I'd have to buy something else to use autorouting.

You are limited to certain maps made by Garmin.

 

If you are interested in routable road maps of North America, you would want to consider Garmin Mapsource City Navigator NT. It can be had for around $120. Here is info provided by GPSNow

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

[Barrikady]

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

Quick answer: Yes, CN is more accurate as you zoom into the map. CN is accurate down to 300 feet. Topo 2008 is accurate down to 800 feet.

 

What you must do is look to see if the Topo 2008 map is zoomed in farther than 800 feet. In the case of CN, keep the maximum zoom to 300 feet.

Edited January 21, 2008 by Barrikady

[yogazoo]

Note:

 

Any maps, City Nav 2008, costom maps, inland lakes, NP topo, that do not have DEM information in them will be overlayed onto the TOPO2008 DEM! You must have TOPO2008 AND any other map selected at the same time. When you do, the DEM is used for all other maps! SWEET! My GPS is the Colorado 300.

 

Check out the Elk background!

http://lampropeltis.googlepages.com/918.bm...-full;init:.bmp

[+IndyJpr]

Note:

 

Any maps, City Nav 2008, costom maps, inland lakes, NP topo, that do not have DEM information in them will be overlayed onto the TOPO2008 DEM! You must have TOPO2008 AND any other map selected at the same time. When you do, the DEM is used for all other maps! SWEET! My GPS is the Colorado 300.

 

Check out the Elk background!

http://lampropeltis.googlepages.com/918.bm...-full;init:.bmp

 

Wow, you're correct - how did I miss this... Here is a screenshot:

 

[+Team GPSaxophone]

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

Quick answer: Yes, CN is more accurate as you zoom into the map. CN is accurate down to 300 feet. Topo 2008 is accurate down to 800 feet.

 

What you must do is look to see if the Topo 2008 map is zoomed in farther than 800 feet. In the case of CN, keep the maximum zoom to 300 feet.

What I mean is this:

 

(sorry, don't know how to take a screenshot from the unit, I had to use my camera to photograph the screen)

 

The tracklog, even when zoomed to 800 feet, does not match up with the roads on the basemap. This is especially true with the loop road on the right that goes by the school. You can tell I've driven the same stretch of the E-W road several times and all tracks are well north of where they should be.

Edited January 22, 2008 by Team GPSaxophone

[+4America]

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

Quick answer: Yes, CN is more accurate as you zoom into the map. CN is accurate down to 300 feet. Topo 2008 is accurate down to 800 feet.

 

What you must do is look to see if the Topo 2008 map is zoomed in farther than 800 feet. In the case of CN, keep the maximum zoom to 300 feet.

 

what? this is strange... 800 ft and topo doens't work right? Is this just for garmin, or do all GPSs have this shortcoming?

[Barrikady]

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

Quick answer: Yes, CN is more accurate as you zoom into the map. CN is accurate down to 300 feet. Topo 2008 is accurate down to 800 feet.

 

What you must do is look to see if the Topo 2008 map is zoomed in farther than 800 feet. In the case of CN, keep the maximum zoom to 300 feet.

What I mean is this:

 

(sorry, don't know how to take a screenshot from the unit, I had to use my camera to photograph the screen)

 

The tracklog, even when zoomed to 800 feet, does not match up with the roads on the basemap. This is especially true with the loop road on the right that goes by the school. You can tell I've driven the same stretch of the E-W road several times and all tracks are well north of where they should be.

I don't have an explanation for you. I will be receiving my Colorado 300 on Wednesday, at that time I will install that portion of Topo 2008 that covers the terrain where I live. I will get back to this forum on what I notice.

[+hogrod]

Garmins topo maps sometimes don't show roads in the correct locations, I believe this is due to the source they use for this data(though I'm not sure who they use for street data with the topo maps).

 

If you buy city navigator 2008(street maps) these will show the roads 99% more correct locations, Garmin does use very current Navteq data for the city Navigator 2008 maps(same as google maps).

 

I'm just happy that topo 2008 has street names, the last version(topo US 3.02) listed most road names as just "road".

[+apersson850]

The Swedish topo map Friluftskartan suffers from the same issue. But it does support lock on road, so when driving with Friluftskartan enabled and displayed, the icon, as well as the track log, matches the roads on that map.

The same goes for City Navigator. It supports lock on road, so the GPS will fake its position to show you on the road, even if there's some discrepancy.

 

The difference becomes obvious if I've used both maps while following the same road. Then the track logs aren't in the same position, as they are faked to fit first one, then the other map.

 

As CN is a map that's purposedly made for driving, not running between the creeks, it's reasonable that the priority is with accurate road placement. I've seen Navteq stating a max error of 10 meters for the map data such maps are built upon.

[+HAB214]

The Swedish topo map Friluftskartan suffers from the same issue. But it does support lock on road, so when driving with Friluftskartan enabled and displayed, the icon, as well as the track log, matches the roads on that map.

The same goes for City Navigator. It supports lock on road, so the GPS will fake its position to show you on the road, even if there's some discrepancy.

 

The difference becomes obvious if I've used both maps while following the same road. Then the track logs aren't in the same position, as they are faked to fit first one, then the other map.

 

As CN is a map that's purposedly made for driving, not running between the creeks, it's reasonable that the priority is with accurate road placement. I've seen Navteq stating a max error of 10 meters for the map data such maps are built upon.

 

how do you enable the lock on road feature?

[+apersson850]

Maps used must support it, speed must be, or have been, above 16 km/h and you must have it enabled in the map setup.

[+Team GPSaxophone]

The Swedish topo map Friluftskartan suffers from the same issue. But it does support lock on road, so when driving with Friluftskartan enabled and displayed, the icon, as well as the track log, matches the roads on that map.

The same goes for City Navigator. It supports lock on road, so the GPS will fake its position to show you on the road, even if there's some discrepancy.

 

The difference becomes obvious if I've used both maps while following the same road. Then the track logs aren't in the same position, as they are faked to fit first one, then the other map.

 

As CN is a map that's purposedly made for driving, not running between the creeks, it's reasonable that the priority is with accurate road placement. I've seen Navteq stating a max error of 10 meters for the map data such maps are built upon.

I've never used the lock on road feature, even when I was using a Legend. I don't care much to have a "faked" position. If the GPSr is accurate to 3 meters, that should carry through to the maps as well. Maps aren't accurate? Why the heck not?! Garmin's a location company, they should be able to make or get accurate enough maps. Maybe I could get a job there driving around and giving them accurate coords for their maps.

 

I noticed earlier in this thread or in another that someone is able to boot their Colorado in under 40 seconds. That would be nice. It takes approx 2 minutes for mine to go from power on to displaying the map screen. The longest load time is for "loading maps", everything else seems to load in the "normal" amount of time that others have reported.

[+jtrump]

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

Quick answer: Yes, CN is more accurate as you zoom into the map. CN is accurate down to 300 feet. Topo 2008 is accurate down to 800 feet.

 

What you must do is look to see if the Topo 2008 map is zoomed in farther than 800 feet. In the case of CN, keep the maximum zoom to 300 feet.

What I mean is this:

 

(sorry, don't know how to take a screenshot from the unit, I had to use my camera to photograph the screen)

 

The tracklog, even when zoomed to 800 feet, does not match up with the roads on the basemap. This is especially true with the loop road on the right that goes by the school. You can tell I've driven the same stretch of the E-W road several times and all tracks are well north of where they should be.

 

Press and hold the Shortcuts button on the Colorado to take a screenshot. A .bmp file will be created in the /Garmin/scrn/ directory on the device.

[+Team GPSaxophone]

Ok, next question...is CN more accurate than the included topo map? It seems the streets aren't in the right places (at least in my neighborhood). If the streets are off, I'm wondering if the contour lines are off too.

Quick answer: Yes, CN is more accurate as you zoom into the map. CN is accurate down to 300 feet. Topo 2008 is accurate down to 800 feet.

 

What you must do is look to see if the Topo 2008 map is zoomed in farther than 800 feet. In the case of CN, keep the maximum zoom to 300 feet.

What I mean is this:

 

(sorry, don't know how to take a screenshot from the unit, I had to use my camera to photograph the screen)

 

The tracklog, even when zoomed to 800 feet, does not match up with the roads on the basemap. This is especially true with the loop road on the right that goes by the school. You can tell I've driven the same stretch of the E-W road several times and all tracks are well north of where they should be.

 

Press and hold the Shortcuts button on the Colorado to take a screenshot. A .bmp file will be created in the /Garmin/scrn/ directory on the device.

Excellent! Thank you.

[+g-o-cashers]

I noticed earlier in this thread or in another that someone is able to boot their Colorado in under 40 seconds. That would be nice. It takes approx 2 minutes for mine to go from power on to displaying the map screen. The longest load time is for "loading maps", everything else seems to load in the "normal" amount of time that others have reported. [/color]

 

I just figured out that "loading maps" also seems to include the time to load your geocaches. If you have a large gpx file full of geocaches in E:\garmin\gpx try removing it and booting up. You should get to 40 seconds. I haven't characterized it exactly but the rough rule of thumb seems to be for each 1MB of gpx file you'll add about 10 seconds of startup time over and above the 40 seconds. I had a 6MB file of around 1000 caches w/5 logs each and it added about 1 minute of startup time. My guess is you have about 2000 caches loaded.

 

GO$Rs