DNF or just rude?

[+KBI]

Hi Rixart! Hi Atlantagal!

 

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I have personally met both of these people, and I have a high opinion of both of them. They are nice folks.

 

The trouble with communicating in any text-only format is that it’s very easy to misinterpret tone, emotion, and other critical shades of meaning. When you can’t hear the voice or see the face, any given set of words can be taken (or mistaken) in a variety of completely different ways.

 

I hope nobody here has any regrets; in my humble opinion this thread has served a valuable purpose. It allowed two of my friends to eliminate a misunderstanding, one that might have otherwise festered and caused unnecessary future hard feelings had it not been discussed.

 

I’m guessing Atlantagal is happy she had the opportunity to clarify the meaning of her note, and has learned that her choice of words, while not inaccurate, were more subject to misinterpretation than she’d realized.

 

I’m guessing Rixart is happy to have made Atlantagal aware of his annoyance, and is even happier to learn that she didn’t mean her comments to sound at all the way he heard them. I’m also guessing he has learned to be more willing to allow reasonable critiques of his caches to remain in the logs for the benefit of future seekers.

 

I’m guessing both of them will better allow for text-only ambiguity in the future, will be more careful in choosing their own words, and will be more liberal in giving other folks’ words the benefit of the doubt.

 

As for me, I have learned (or been reminded of) all of the above. I have made the very same mistakes more often than I care to admit. These are lessons I seem to need to be reminded of again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

[+rixart]

Well put KBI, and quite correct. Nuff said!

[+bflentje]

I did not delete the cache note. Here is the e-mail I sent this VERY experienced cacher.

 

-- Copy of email sent to A******** --

 

"First:Given that you went to the location, parked, and attempted to find the way to the cache, I think it qualifies as a DNF.

 

Second: The cache is clearly marked as a 3.5 star terrain, so I don't know what you expected.

 

Third: IMHO posting a note on the cache page that it's not worth the smiley is rude.

 

Please change your log to a DNF or delete it."

 

 

The cacher finally deleted it themseves, I just wanted opinions.

Well, my opinion is your email was way ruder then their cache note. That note sounds like it was a factual account of their caching experience, like it or not. Asking them to erase part of their caching history because you have a thin skin is rude, and whoever they are sounds like they handled it with as much class as possible by just deleting it and refraining from comment.

 

Sorry, I agree. I'd of left it the way it was.

[+2BEZ]

I tried to do a more difficult cache a couple of years ago. More than any of my others combined, that cache has received more complaints. Some say it was rated to high (to easy)… some say it was rated to low (to hard)… some complain that there was a snake at the cache and on and on. The absolute worst was someone complaining because they walked so far and the cache didn’t have anything worth trading for ! ! ! ! Actually suggested I go put something of higher value in the box ! ! ! !

 

I have enjoyed this game since I took it up two years ago. A year after starting I started feeling guilty for only “taking” so I placed a few caches to repay those who put caches out there for me to find. What I seem to get in return is a bunch of whiney complaints. Someone did not rehide it, left it out in the open, it got muggled, and I said to heck with it and archived it.

 

I have NEVER posted a log that in ANY way could be defined as a “complaint”. In my opinion one way to clear up any confusion and get back to the original spirit of this sport/game one should ALWAYS end their log with TFTC. I appreciate everyone who hides and takes the time to maintain caches throughout the world.

 

If this trend continues many people will say to heck with it and we won’t have as many caches. Could also be a reason that while attempting to get our families “outdoors” we find ourselves in Wal-Mart parking lots instead of on National park hiking trails. I havent found it or even looked for it however... rixart... THANKS FOR THE CACHE ! ! ! ! !

 

( I received a comment today I didn’t like… can ya tell?)

[+fox-and-the-hound]

 

What exactly constitutes a DNF? How close must one be to the cache, to cross the line from "didn't look for it" to DNF? Halfway from the car? 50 feet from the cache? 10 feet? 5 feet?

Or does the act of leaving the parking area with a GPS define the the begining of the search?

 

If you're looking for a technical answer I would say you must reach ground zero to look. Everything up 'til that is just going for a walk. If you go to GZ, look and don't find it then that would constitute a DNF. The note wasn't rude at all. I didn't see anything unseemly there. It's what I would hope to receive for someone looking for one my caches. It tells me the recent conditions, a personal opinion of the terrain rating and how many people are at least taking a look. What more could you ask for? Besides, how would their deciding to post a Note or a DNF for their personal record affect you as long as you know someone stopped by?

Edited January 7, 2008 by fox-and-the-hound

[+wimseyguy]

I did not delete the cache note. Here is the e-mail I sent this VERY experienced cacher.

 

-- Copy of email sent to A******** --

 

"First:Given that you went to the location, parked, and attempted to find the way to the cache, I think it qualifies as a DNF.

 

Second: The cache is clearly marked as a 3.5 star terrain, so I don't know what you expected.

 

Third: IMHO posting a note on the cache page that it's not worth the smiley is rude.

 

Please change your log to a DNF or delete it."

 

 

The cacher finally deleted it themseves, I just wanted opinions.

Well, my opinion is your email was way ruder then their cache note. That note sounds like it was a factual account of their caching experience, like it or not. Asking them to erase part of their caching history because you have a thin skin is rude, and whoever they are sounds like they handled it with as much class as possible by just deleting it and refraining from comment.

I'll concur with the man with a Hemi.

You can only be offended by this note if you let yourself. The whole situation should have been handled offline after the initial note was posted.

[+baloo&bd]

It was a DNF, however a note would not be a problem either. An attempt was made and it was not found due to a physical feature.

 

The log was written in a rude manner. Saying "it is not worth a smiley" is entirely different from saying "getting a find is just not worth that much effort to me".

 

Having said that, the email was equally as rude and could have been worded much differently. Even a thinly veiled jab like "I am sorry you did not see the difficulty rating prior to searching" would have been better.

 

I would let notes like that pass. If you have been in caching for any amount of time, you will get these on occasion. Most just ignore and life goes on..

[+Renegade Knight]

...What exactly constitutes a DNF? How close must one be to the cache, to cross the line from "didn't look for it" to DNF? Halfway from the car? 50 feet from the cache? 10 feet? 5 feet?

Or does the act of leaving the parking area with a GPS define the the begining of the search?...

 

A DNF is a bit subjective. I have to give up looking having exausted every idea on where to look before I log a DNF. I log notes when I look but something kept me from looking in every last place. Others if they look at all it's always a DNF. Neither is really right or wrong, just different.

 

In my book a note may have been in order to let you know that every way in was wet and muddy.

 

As for the rest of the note 'not worth the smilie' it's clear they are fair weather cachers of the champaigne and sunshine variety. That's their perogative, the whining though is optional. Chalk it up to a good whine.

[+Ed & Julie]

It's very rude for ANYONE to say something like "Just not worth the smiley". People work hard to create and hide these caches so others can have fun going out to find them. Not to be criticized because the conditions weren't to there liking. It was rude in my opinion.

 

Not everyone works hard to create memoriable caches...some are medicore caches placed only to boost find/hide counts (and are not worth the smilie to find).

[+sbell111]

It's very rude for ANYONE to say something like "Just not worth the smiley". People work hard to create and hide these caches so others can have fun going out to find them. Not to be criticized because the conditions weren't to there liking. It was rude in my opinion.

Not everyone works hard to create memoriable caches...some are medicore caches placed only to boost find/hide counts (and are not worth the smilie to find).

... and some of them are perfectly good caches, but aren't caches that are enjoyed by some cachers, who like to refer to them as being placed only to boost find/hide counts and bring them up in nearly every thread that they post in.

[+kyk96]

just my $.02, for what little it's worth..... I understand getting annoyed with a perceived 'slam' to my cache. Even if it wasn't meant that way - which, apparently in this case it wasn't mean as a slam. I would never ever ever publicly state that any cache was on my ignore list. if someone put mine on their ignore list and told the world about it, i would be insulted. if someone put mine on their ignore list and simply went on their merry way, i wouldn't care because i wouldn't know about it. if it was on someone's ignore list because there was a problem with the cache - then i would want to know about it. otherwise, why risk hurting someone else's feelings?

 

this was NOT a DNF, but probably shouldn't have been logged at all. But the cacher shouldn't have been made to delete it, either. Here in MI, if a cache is listed as a 3.5 terrain, we would assume that it's not going to be a casual hike and we will likely get dirty and/or wet. I would simply choose to not do the cache or wait until it's more dry. I haven't read the cache page for this one, but I hope and assume (oops, sorry Rod!) that any required crossing of a body of water would be noted somewhere in the description.

[+The Jester]

A note was the proper entry in this case, NOT a DNF. You have to LOOK in order to NOT FIND. There was no search here.

But there was! A search for the way to the cache.

[+The Jester]

The log was written in a rude manner. Saying "it is not worth a smiley" is entirely different from saying "getting a find is just not worth that much effort to me".

I flunked English twelve years in a row, but I still can see the difference between "it is not worth a smiley" and "it is not worth the smiley" (as written in the log). The first would be a comment about the cache, the second is a comment about the cache hunter.

[+simpjkee]

I was totally ready to post my thoughts about this topic in this thread, but it looks like this thread is done. Sorry OP, it's just not worth the typing.

[+sunburykids]

What does it really matter? Everyone has their own opinion as to what qualifies as a DNF and you should respect that. Who really cares if it was posted as a note or a DNF, they logged their journey and that is what is most important. It beats no post at all!