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Extreme/Harder Caches


Banjo Billy

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If they take longer than 15 minutes then probably more than 50% of cachers will leave them alone.

 

Fact of life I'm afraid.

 

a.

 

That's no problem is it? Better to give 20 cachers a great cache than 100 cachers one unmemorable cache to tick off the list and add to the numbers. Slightly off-topic, I just found today that my longest attempted cache, which I spent around 4 hours on and walked 5 miles (it had 12 stages) has been permanently archived, due to the final cache stage (which I reported) being muggled :blink:

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I'd say go for it! Yes, alot of cachers will leave it alone because it's more than a walk in the park. But for those who do do it it will be alot more memorable, The caches I always remember are the ones that are more of a challenge, this makes them more fun. I'd rather remember a cache that was a challenge than do 20 drive by micros and then forget them.

 

As long as you make it clear on the cache page what special equipment will be needed, and give any safety warnings that may be necessary.

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Just a suggestion but if your extreme geocache has potential dangers you would be advised to make it a 'members only' cache - ie only available to premium members.

 

This is not cache snobbery, rather protection for you and geocaching,com. Always remember that geocaches can be read by anyone and you'd be surprised how non-geocachers who surf the web can come across our listings. There is nothing to prevent younger children reading about an extreme cache and thinking "that sounds fun" and giving it a go. I fear that it is perfectly foreseeable that they could well ignore any warnings you may have put on the page.

 

I have what I term an extreme cache which takes the cacher into a potentially dangerous situation if the warnings are ignored. Because I didn't want to open myself up to litigation I felt I had no alternative but to make it members only. As well as any liabilities there is no way I could live with myself if it turned out that kids were hurt or worse doing one of my caches and I had not done all in my power to prevent casual browsers attempting it.

 

I know that premium membership won't stop all non-serious cachers accessing the cache as anyone can pay the fee but at least I know that I have done all in my power to prevent it and that by making it members only the listing can only be read by paid up cachers - better b safe than sorry!

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Dont be put off, I have 2 caches that were set 5 months ago by our Scouts in the wilds of Northumberland, before anyone attempted them. Neither is a drive by (except by quad, he knows who he is B) ) even then one of the attempts was abandoned because of the location and the weather. I have to say that that was the sensible option. However if he had carried on then that is his option. Caches are placed for all sorts of reasons and then it is up to the individual to attempt them.

 

We have a cache in the North East that needs specialist climbing ladders or the ability to hang upside down over a river, its your choice if you go for it with the wrong gear.

 

We need more than just caches hidden in easy to reach places, I dont have a canoe any longer and even if i did I dont think I would fit in to one these days. I can still climb rocks though and still do (OK small ones that wont give me a cardiac arrest) However if i could fit in a canoe and I felt able to do the climb I would certainly give it a go.

 

So go on do it. Just make sure you tell folk what they will need to attempt the cache and that you will not be held responsible for their foolishness if they get into trouble.

 

As an after thought one of the caches was found by 2 folk on the same day, wait 5 months then its rush hour and up there two people counts as rush hour. :)

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I am planning to set up a cache in 2008 that will require a lot more than a walk. What are peoples opinions on Extreme caches. This one will require climbing and canoeing. :)

 

What do YOU want the cache to be?

 

Do you want it found or to go down in history as the most "unvisited" cache?

 

Alex hit the nail on the head when he quoted 15 mins as the max hunting time - ask The Hornet!!

 

Marmite springs to mind.............

Edited by Lost in Space
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I'd have to disagree with the suggestion that you make it a premium members only cache. Members have to log in to see the co-ords, so the 'general public' won't be tempted to try the cache. You have no more protection in law by making it a PMO cache over a standard one. And keen 'extreme cachers' who don't happen to be PMs, such as myself, wouldn't only be put off doing it - they'd (generally) be unable to do it, or log it.

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I've set an extreme cache, and to be honest I don't think I would bother doing it again. In 18 months or so its had 8 logged finds, but most were team efforts so only actually about 5 separate visits. The last was in April 2007.

 

The logs are rewarding and the feedback I've had from the people who have done it has been great but when I consider the effort which I put into setting it then I don't really consider the trade off to have been worth it. You will get an initial rush from your local hardcore cachers to find it but then the visits will dry up.

 

It doesn't matter how good your cache is, if no-one is doing it then its wasted.

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As an after thought one of the caches was found by 2 folk on the same day, wait 5 months then its rush hour and up there two people counts as rush hour. :unsure:

 

Wot are you refering to Mr Wolfshead!!

 

And Clennell Street was like Oxford street on a saturday afternoon. And I got stopped by a group who asked where they were.. mind boggles.

 

Back to the plot!! Go for the cache, I don't rock climb or canoe bit of a problem with my over enthusiastic cuddle factor. But there is always some some out there to do them.

 

Just make sure you spell it out in very plain english.

 

And good luck

 

Moss T

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<snip>

We have a cache in the North East that needs specialist climbing ladders or the ability to hang upside down over a river, its your choice if you go for it with the wrong gear.

<snip>

Except I'll delete the log if I think peeps have been hanging upside down! :) So going for it with the wrong gear is actively discouraged. :) Assistance may be available on request/bribes. :P

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I am planning to set up a cache in 2008 that will require a lot more than a walk. What are peoples opinions on Extreme caches. This one will require climbing and canoeing. B)

 

We love caches which involve adventure & involving our 7 & 4 year old in it

Our best cache to date was Jonah's Journey (GCJA3V) which requires descending a chimney (narrow gap in the rocks) to find the cache box. I took both my kids down there. What fun!

We've also canoed to many caches in the Lake District with the kids & these were fantastic days out.

 

You won't have many people visiting your caches but those who do will rate them highly.

 

I live close to several crags & regularly muse how to push the boundaries & put out a cache which is located half way up a rockface.

I'm sure plenty of people would complain about how dangerous it was ;) , but on the flip side there will be those who would rave about how adventurous it was. B)

 

When you put out your cache, let us know & we'll come & do it when we're next down your way

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I live close to several crags & regularly muse how to push the boundaries & put out a cache which is located half way up a rockface.

I'm sure plenty of people would complain about how dangerous it was B) , but on the flip side there will be those who would rave about how adventurous it was. ;)

 

 

As long as the listing clearly and explicitly states that the cache requires climbing skill/experience and equipment, and that a lack of these will result in injury,death or (Gulp!) worse, I don't see why/how people would have a basis to complain.

 

There appear to be loads of these 'true' 5* caches in the US...

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OK its sad but as this about hard caches i have "tried" to analyse the UK 5/5 caches (including archived ones) and have the following data.

 

Note its a about a month old

 

876 Cachers have (had) found 5/5 rated caches in the UK the total number of finds on these caches is(was) 1655.

 

They break down roughly as follows.

 

Rank Name No Of finds

1 MBFace 15

2 duncscott 14

2 fellsmanhiker 14

4 T-girls 13

5 Crag Rat 11

5 Tashington 11

5 The Hancock Clan 11

8 bsh92673 10

8 davy boy 10

8 happytrekker 10

8 Pengy&Tigger 10

8 The Great Redmondo 10

8 Wadders 10

 

If you like these challenges this forum may be of interest.

 

http://extremecachers.freeforums.org/

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As previously stated I also believe its a great idea to set some more difficult caches so that everybody has something to suit their needs. Even if you don't like to do them yourselves the logs can be interesting to read! I have also just seen this cache page for one in America that I think takes things a little too far. Even "Cache U Nutter" might shy away from this one!!! GCT0SE (sorry but I don't know how to do the linky thing)

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As previously stated I also believe its a great idea to set some more difficult caches so that everybody has something to suit their needs. Even if you don't like to do them yourselves the logs can be interesting to read! I have also just seen this cache page for one in America that I think takes things a little too far. Even "Cache U Nutter" might shy away from this one!!! GCT0SE (sorry but I don't know how to do the linky thing)

 

are you sure the code is correct?

i don't know how to do the linky thing either ;)

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As previously stated I also believe its a great idea to set some more difficult caches so that everybody has something to suit their needs. Even if you don't like to do them yourselves the logs can be interesting to read! I have also just seen this cache page for one in America that I think takes things a little too far. Even "Cache U Nutter" might shy away from this one!!! GCT0SE (sorry but I don't know how to do the linky thing)

 

How to link in a forum post or on a cache page.

 

The cahce you mention above is a 1/1 ?????

 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?wp=gct0se

 

what about this one though

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876 Cachers have (had) found 5/5 rated caches in the UK the total number of finds on these caches is(was) 1655.

 

They break down roughly as follows.

 

Rank Name No Of finds

1 MBFace 15

 

It's very flattering to find ourselves at the top of the list but being equally sad we've just done our own quick analysis. 14 of our finds are currently rated 5/5 but we would only consider using this for a couple namely Tooey's Adventure No 1 and Rakers of the Lost Ark.

 

As has been said many times before it's all subjective even before international variations come into play. A new local(ish) cache on a wooded slope recently started off with the same terrain rating as one on the summit of Great Gable!

 

In reply to the OP - go ahead and set it with appropriate warnings on the cache page.

 

MBF

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I've been musing :P

 

I've also been looking with relish at

Extreme cache bookmark list

Awesome. I've got to do some of these. Now these are a REAL challenge.

And its got me inspired to also put out an Extreme cache.

 

We do a lot of Adventure Racing (events combining running, orienteering, Mountain Biking, canoeing, climbing etc)

So I'm planning an Adventure Race style multicache in the Lake District which will have 4/5 stages & a final: walking/scrambling, easyish rockclimbing, mountain biking, canoeing, swimming. I may even have a stage which can only be found at night!

It'll take until the summer to put it all out.

 

I'm sure MBFace will be FTF :P

 

Sorry if I've stolen the thunder of the OP, but the thread has stimulated lots of good ideas!

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So I'm planning an Adventure Race style multicache in the Lake District which will have 4/5 stages & a final: walking/scrambling, easyish rockclimbing, mountain biking, canoeing, swimming. I may even have a stage which can only be found at night!

 

So how can you ensure that people run, bike, canoe or swim? Surely the most you can do is put the cache out in an area that lends itself to these, but then it's up to the cachers how they choose to find it (won't catch me running after a cache! :P ) If it's in a lake I could swim, canoe, row-boat, inflatable whale, lilo, or whatever to get there. The only thing I can think of is having rather specific logging requirements which seems unnecessarily authoritarian and a bit limiting.

 

Only if it's half way up a rock climb or needs scuba gear is it naturally only going to be found by people doing it a certain way. Not complaining, just interested how you think it would work. :P

 

Ps. Stick a puzzle in somewhere and MBFace will most likely be there first!! They hold the record for being the only team to solve all the Mardale Madness series of conundrums at the first attempt! Smart dudes! :unsure:

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So I'm planning an Adventure Race style multicache in the Lake District which will have 4/5 stages & a final: walking/scrambling, easyish rockclimbing, mountain biking, canoeing, swimming. I may even have a stage which can only be found at night!

 

So how can you ensure that people run, bike, canoe or swim? Surely the most you can do is put the cache out in an area that lends itself to these, but then it's up to the cachers how they choose to find it (won't catch me running after a cache! :P ) If it's in a lake I could swim, canoe, row-boat, inflatable whale, lilo, or whatever to get there. The only thing I can think of is having rather specific logging requirements which seems unnecessarily authoritarian and a bit limiting.

 

Only if it's half way up a rock climb or needs scuba gear is it naturally only going to be found by people doing it a certain way. Not complaining, just interested how you think it would work. :unsure:

 

Ps. Stick a puzzle in somewhere and MBFace will most likely be there first!! They hold the record for being the only team to solve all the Mardale Madness series of conundrums at the first attempt! Smart dudes! :yikes:

 

Agree. I'd put the stages of a cache in places which would lend themselves more to a particular activity but can be done in alternative ways. I'd merely advise the most suitable form of travel.

eg

A stage half way up a V.Diff rockclimb can be climbed as a scramble if confident but more likely will be done roped

A stage on an island half a mile off the lakeshore can be swam to but better to canoe or similar

A 15 mile multipart stage around forestry tracks can be walked to but better to bike it

 

I'm up in the Lakes next weekend so Jane & I will start checking out possible stage locations :P

Whilst there, we need to retrieve our TB from the cache on Scafell Pike & set it on a new journey.

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As previously stated I also believe its a great idea to set some more difficult caches so that everybody has something to suit their needs. Even if you don't like to do them yourselves the logs can be interesting to read! I have also just seen this cache page for one in America that I think takes things a little too far. Even "Cache U Nutter" might shy away from this one!!! GCT0SE (sorry but I don't know how to do the linky thing)

 

RE : GCTA5E [not GCT0SE as stated]

I would certainly shy away from writing out the ridiculously long cache notes, I usually opt to leave these on a stage of the multi. As for the challenge, if you actually read what is required / read through all the crap, the actual challenge only involves a 10ft ab down a shaft to collect the cache. The fact that you have to wear all that gear makes all the other safety threats minimal.

 

Extreme cache placement and extraction is all about risk assessment and management of your capabilities. Nothing more/nothing less and this is certainly a challenge that I would relish !!

Oh by the way have spent time in these suits at Dungeness nuclear power station and very comfortable they were too!

Only problem with this cache is its location,not somewhere I am likely to visit in a less than desirable tourist areas of the otherwise fantastic country.

 

If you really want to try some serious abseils, then try 'THE BEAST 666' GC11KM7 or BEASTLEY TOO GC11M36

Remember, no cache is worth dying for!!!

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I've set an extreme cache, and to be honest I don't think I would bother doing it again. In 18 months or so its had 8 logged finds, but most were team efforts so only actually about 5 separate visits. The last was in April 2007.

 

The logs are rewarding and the feedback I've had from the people who have done it has been great but when I consider the effort which I put into setting it then I don't really consider the trade off to have been worth it. You will get an initial rush from your local hardcore cachers to find it but then the visits will dry up.

 

It doesn't matter how good your cache is, if no-one is doing it then its wasted.

 

Hang on guys, it is worth it!! and your is on my list!!

I get satisfaction from putting them out as well and intend to add a few more this year.

So far I have not really seen a single really hard cache out there [including my own on that list] and I intend to make ammends. Get your bags packed Bashfull !!! :rolleyes:

Bring em on I say, yet to do many of them myself however as have mobility problems [finding an excuse to justify to my wife why I should burn gas to risk my life!

did a few last month but they did not justify their grading.

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Want risk assement, try this bad boy that we recently did in Cyprus. Difficult to get to and then you're treated to a nice unexploded mortar shell next to the cache lol

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...32-ac4e86683f1d

 

My point precisely, a drive in a comfy air conditioned vehicle to a cache which you dont even have to climb or abseil to. Don't touch the UXB as indicated and hey boy this is a walk in the woods [actually that could be more challenging!!]

Seriously though it does highlight my comments that by assessing the risk and overcoming any problems then any challenge is within your reach.

And yes this does sound a good challenge but hardly extreme. :rolleyes:

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Want risk assement, try this bad boy that we recently did in Cyprus. Difficult to get to and then you're treated to a nice unexploded mortar shell next to the cache lol

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...32-ac4e86683f1d

 

My point precisely, a drive in a comfy air conditioned vehicle to a cache which you dont even have to climb or abseil to. Don't touch the UXB as indicated and hey boy this is a walk in the woods [actually that could be more challenging!!]

Seriously though it does highlight my comments that by assessing the risk and overcoming any problems then any challenge is within your reach.

And yes this does sound a good challenge but hardly extreme. :(

 

Depends on your definition of extreme I suppose, i'd rather abseil/canoe/hike/bike/crawl naked over glass than navigate a minefield to be honest! :(

We thought it was pretty bad, at least a 5 hour walk back to civilisation if the car broke down, definately not something you want to do in 100+ degree temps in summer, unexploded mines, mortars and god knows what else and then there's the snakes, oh yes the snakes, oh and the "hunters" taking pot shots at you whilst you recover the cache in question! :rolleyes:

 

A quick edit/ I guess if you placed a cache in the middle of an area containing unexploded munitions in the UK i would imagine (read hope) it would be archived el pronto!

Edited by Realmofchaos
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Want risk assement, try this bad boy that we recently did in Cyprus. Difficult to get to and then you're treated to a nice unexploded mortar shell next to the cache lol

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_detai...32-ac4e86683f1d

 

My point precisely, a drive in a comfy air conditioned vehicle to a cache which you dont even have to climb or abseil to. Don't touch the UXB as indicated and hey boy this is a walk in the woods [actually that could be more challenging!!]

Seriously though it does highlight my comments that by assessing the risk and overcoming any problems then any challenge is within your reach.

And yes this does sound a good challenge but hardly extreme. :(

 

Depends on your definition of extreme I suppose, i'd rather abseil/canoe/hike/bike/crawl naked over glass than navigate a minefield to be honest! :(

We thought it was pretty bad, at least a 5 hour walk back to civilisation if the car broke down, definately not something you want to do in 100+ degree temps in summer, unexploded mines, mortars and god knows what else and then there's the snakes, oh yes the snakes, oh and the "hunters" taking pot shots at you whilst you recover the cache in question! :rolleyes:

 

A quick edit/ I guess if you placed a cache in the middle of an area containing unexploded munitions in the UK i would imagine (read hope) it would be archived el pronto!

 

Falling from a 150 high cliff / getting destroyed by a UXB same result I suggest. You

must have gone off route as the cache notes suggest if you came across these obstacles and would suggest that 5M away from a UX mortar at the cache site[where you actually have to dig it out and strike the nose cone detonator for it to be a risk even if it was not a dud]. Everything hunky dory unless you GET LOST!!

Would suggest that crawling naked through broken glass really is dangerous though !!!

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You guys are giving me such good ideas for REALLY beefing up my Extreme Lake District cache

Jane & I keep taking in all these ideas & cranking up the seriousness factor.

The climbing stage of my proposed cache has now scaled up from V.Diff to E1 (V.Diff you can scramble up, E1 needs skill & lycra)

 

Jane then said "do you expect anyone to complete this cache"

My answer was "only the most committed" (to a mental institution)

 

Power trails are for softies! - hey maybe this should be our signature :rolleyes:

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You guys are giving me such good ideas for REALLY beefing up my Extreme Lake District cache

Jane & I keep taking in all these ideas & cranking up the seriousness factor.

The climbing stage of my proposed cache has now scaled up from V.Diff to E1 (V.Diff you can scramble up, E1 needs skill & lycra)

 

Jane then said "do you expect anyone to complete this cache"

My answer was "only the most committed" (to a mental institution)

 

Power trails are for softies! - hey maybe this should be our signature :rolleyes:

 

Go for it guys, @ E1 it would truly be the most difficult around in the U.K [Assuming that no aid avail or under an overhang]

getting chalked up already for the challenge but put it on a well protected route please!!

Not sure that I could get a FTF as not going up to the lakes this year!

Jealous that you guys are 'up North' :(:(:D

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WAIT!

I have a great idea for an extreme cache! Hows about this?;

 

1) You have to locate a map in an attic, tie a young man down (Deceangi) then proceed to a location on childrens bikes whilst listening to Cyndi Lauper

2) Check the co-ordinates against 2 islands at sea to get the co-ordinates for a taverna on the cliffs

3) Enjoy a fish "surprise" at the taverna whilst querying the taverna owner for the next set of co-ords

4) Abseil down a hole in the floor where you will meet a previous cacher named "Chester Copperpot", in his hands are the co-ords for the next location

5) After negotiating several tumbling boulders end up in a well where the next set of co-ordinates are handed down via a bucket

6) Navigate through a hole full of bats to a room where you have to play the right notes to get the next location

7) Slide down a multitude of water tubes into a main cave whereby the final location is revealed

8) Locate the final cache and make sure you get out in time, before the cave collapses, clasping the log book (and a set of gold geocoins) to return to your mom & pa with the sheer jubilation that you just completed the world most extreme cache (and possibly saved the goon docks too!)

 

Now, a plan to put that into practice!

 

/Realmofchaos rubs chin

Edited by Realmofchaos
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You guys are giving me such good ideas for REALLY beefing up my Extreme Lake District cache

Jane & I keep taking in all these ideas & cranking up the seriousness factor.

The climbing stage of my proposed cache has now scaled up from V.Diff to E1 (V.Diff you can scramble up, E1 needs skill & lycra)

 

Jane then said "do you expect anyone to complete this cache"

My answer was "only the most committed" (to a mental institution)

 

Power trails are for softies! - hey maybe this should be our signature :rolleyes:

 

Go for it guys, @ E1 it would truly be the most difficult around in the U.K [Assuming that no aid avail or under an overhang]

getting chalked up already for the challenge but put it on a well protected route please!!

Not sure that I could get a FTF as not going up to the lakes this year!

Jealous that you guys are 'up North' :D:D:(

 

Only problem is I've only ever climbed to HVS :(

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You guys are giving me such good ideas for REALLY beefing up my Extreme Lake District cache

Jane & I keep taking in all these ideas & cranking up the seriousness factor.

The climbing stage of my proposed cache has now scaled up from V.Diff to E1 (V.Diff you can scramble up, E1 needs skill & lycra)

 

Jane then said "do you expect anyone to complete this cache"

My answer was "only the most committed" (to a mental institution)

 

Power trails are for softies! - hey maybe this should be our signature :o

 

Go for it guys, @ E1 it would truly be the most difficult around in the U.K [Assuming that no aid avail or under an overhang]

getting chalked up already for the challenge but put it on a well protected route please!!

Not sure that I could get a FTF as not going up to the lakes this year!

Jealous that you guys are 'up North' :D:laughing::anicute:

 

Only problem is I've only ever climbed to HVS B)

 

Ditto but ive abseiled an E8 :D

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Following a few requests for a google map of the bookmark list of all UK ireland, guernsey, jersey and Isle of Man caches rated Difficulty 4 and Terrain 4 and above we have added a map link to the bookmark list.

 

For those who wish to go straight to the map use this link.

 

Let me know if this any use please after you have scrolled U 110 of the map that is!!

 

Great to have a map, I was one of those who suggested it may be a good idea but have no I.T skills to put one together.

I would like to say WELL DONE ! :anicute: but for some reason the link is taking me to an urban area Google map near Washington D.C !!!

Have I done something wrong here? :P:P:blink:

Had a look at the 5/5 cache listed but was all at sea with it. ;)

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Following a few requests for a google map of the bookmark list of all UK ireland, guernsey, jersey and Isle of Man caches rated Difficulty 4 and Terrain 4 and above we have added a map link to the bookmark list.

 

For those who wish to go straight to the map use this link.

 

Let me know if this any use please after you have scrolled U 110 of the map that is!!

 

Great to have a map, I was one of those who suggested it may be a good idea but have no I.T skills to put one together.

I would like to say WELL DONE ! :anicute: but for some reason the link is taking me to an urban area Google map near Washington D.C !!!

Have I done something wrong here? :P:P:blink:

Had a look at the 5/5 cache listed but was all at sea with it. ;)

 

Give the map a few moments to load it always starts in America and then resets to the UK.

 

It was easy to set up i just have to give up a pocket query to it and the site does the rest.

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Following a few requests for a google map of the bookmark list of all UK ireland, guernsey, jersey and Isle of Man caches rated Difficulty 4 and Terrain 4 and above we have added a map link to the bookmark list.

 

For those who wish to go straight to the map use this link.

 

Let me know if this any use please after you have scrolled U 110 of the map that is!!

 

Great to have a map, I was one of those who suggested it may be a good idea but have no I.T skills to put one together.

I would like to say WELL DONE ! :D but for some reason the link is taking me to an urban area Google map near Washington D.C !!!

Have I done something wrong here? :D:D:D

Had a look at the 5/5 cache listed but was all at sea with it. :D

 

Give the map a few moments to load it always starts in America and then resets to the UK.

 

It was easy to set up i just have to give up a pocket query to it and the site does the rest.

 

Alkl working now

Brilliant!!!

A lot easier to plan my caching now using work as an excuse!!!

 

WELL DONE a million times !!!!!!!! :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

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